When I discovered this just a few years ago following a long break from playing, it was transformative. The physical flexibiity it permitted was increased exponentially and my viola likes it. I am old, with some arthritis difficulties and the feel of the instrument is altogether more intimate, as though it too has gained freedom. Your explanation is extremely clear and helpful in the detail. Much appreciated.

Thank you for discussing this extremely misunderstood and needlessly maligned topic. Players need to be open to this idea, and talking about it by a respected players will help. Bravo!

2nd time I watch this video in two years. It makes so much sense. Thank you !

Thank you. This is extremely detailed and helpful!

Great video... top bloke.

I would add to put all the chin possible over the instrument and face to the scroll. I've played for some time abusing the "scoop" of the chinrest to feel safe, but that made my ear point to the instrument which is too loud. I used to always practice with ear protection because of this, and now having more chin over the tailpiece helps me hear the actual sound that is already produced and not that much of the one coming directly from the strings. Also having the chin too "down" (or too "high" with shoulder rest) is detrimental to your cervical and hurt arm strenght and flexibility (I play cello too and playing on A was hard just because of my default neck posture lol)

Scott, I noticed that you play with a slightly higher thumb--the contact point is not on the pad of your thumb but slightly below it. I've found that having the contact point between the first and second knuckle allows for a smoother shift. It feels like that part of the thumb is less "grippy" and enables the hand to more easily move into different positions. Any thoughts on this? Does a higher thumb complement playing without a shoulder rest?

@scottslapin

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Chuck, you may be on to something! I think there are different thumb heights for different things. I agree with you about the smoother shift being between the two "knuckles", especially for a long one back from a high position to first. For other things I'd need to lower the thumb again, like for bigger stretches. So it does a lot of repositioning. My impression is that with a shoulder rest, there's a lot less choreography of the thumb needed, and I've seen some great technicians who keep the thumb mostly in the same place---- and below the level of the fingerboard--- nearly the entire time. I don't think that would be possible without a rest/shoulder contact. Best, Scott

With regard to letting the shoulder still touch the instrument as one transitions from shoulder rest to none, would you agree that raising the scroll end a bit higher than the chin rest end would allow for less need to rely on the shoulder for stability- maybe especially in descending shifts as one gets used to the thumb contact?

@Violaduo

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, a higher scroll will bring the center of gravity toward the player. Also tilting the fiddle (so it's not flat), will have it lean more on the left index finger so it is less reliant on the thumb.

Scott, thank you for this. However, I don't recall you mentioning that playing without shoulder contact assumes that THE CHIN REST MUST BE ONE THAT IS HIGH ENOUGH. The distance between my collarbone and my jawbone is around 9 cm (3.5 inches). The viola is about 4 cm thick, and the typical chin rest is no more than 2.5 cm (1 inch) high, leaving a gap of 2.5 cm. For years I was made to feel guilty that I used a shoulder rest, and I resented the insistence of short-necked players that using a shoulder rest was "wrong." Only recently, after more than half a century of playing viola, did I find a chin rest of sufficient height (50 mm!) for my needs, and after some personal modifications it is the most comfortable chin rest I've ever had. With this chin rest I can play without shoulder rest or shoulder contact, with no detriment to shifting or vibrato (perhaps because I've always let the viola rest against the base joint of my index finger, so this is nothing new). Any time we talk about "correct" technique, whether it relates to left hand position, bow hold, or instrument hold, we ABSOLUTELY MUST take individual differences into account, otherwise we risk doing harm!

@Violaduo

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, and thank you for that addition! Absolutely. I'm sure I've left out a few other things, too, so I'm glad people are adding to the list. (My own neck isn't so long so it's not something so much on my radar, but I remember quite a while ago seeing Arnold Steinhardt with a high chinrest, and it seemed to solve the problem for him, too.)

Tried this, it is impossible to grip it with the neck, jaw, collar bone whatever. The gripping surfaces are FAR too small and there is no point where it balances anywhere, it just slips or slides if not supported elsewhere. Even attempting it is enormously painful. No. Need to play it a different way! Having it to the side ALWAYS makes it just slide towards the middle, but having it in the middle is stable...

@Violaduo

4 жыл бұрын

It can be tough at first, because if just one thing is off, it's enough to make it not work. (Conversely, with a shoulder rest, a few things can be really not so precise, yet it works well enough.) Not having seen your attempt, I can only guess at what went wrong by what you wrote; the collarbone/jaw is only half of the equation and most of the time quite a bit less than half--- the left hand really does most of the "holding", although it's mostly gravity that keeps the instrument in place. If you're interested in working on it, I'd contact a teacher who plays that way so you can get feedback based on what you're doing. If you're interested in a few lessons on the topic, please send me a message. I would say there's too much to go wrong to try it in isolation without feedback from someone who knows the ins and outs of playing without a shoulder rest.

@MiserableLittleDoomGoblin

3 жыл бұрын

Aloonwolf it can be done if the left hand is utilized to hold up the instrument. It's going to be different than using a shoulder rest, where you can take your left hand away and the instrument will remain in position. It requires the left hand to take on more responsibility. On the plus side, doing so allows you to rotate the instrument on its axis when needed so that it can be angled to get better bowing on the lower strings.