Lots of people suggesting we wait 3 years to do these and after the exercise I agree. Will get on that schedule next year I think.

@EasyEthan

2 ай бұрын

Another thought I had is revisiting these after their rookie contracts. See who truly has stuck around and who hasn’t

@cogema97

2 ай бұрын

Yeah definitely 3 years minimum. Maybe even 4/5 to really give players a chance to establish their level and impact

@justinshapiro1122

2 ай бұрын

Three is probably the perfect amount, I think any longer your giving so much time for outside factors to influence development where it’s hard to say a draft grade is even all that wrong if the player was good then sucks after his third year or the inverse I don’t think that’s something anyone can really predict, even those big project players show enough by the end of year three to have a good enough idea to know where they may be headed and if they do somehow make that switch up in ability either way, I’d still say it’s too far removed for a draft analysis to be expected to predict that

@thogro99

2 ай бұрын

Could also revisit after 5 years again, just to see what happens to the prospects over a longer time...

@robe2504

2 ай бұрын

I agree. Players can easily have their development interrupted by injuries or coaching, but can emerge after 2 seasons, but I can't think of anyone who has turned it around after 3 seasons. Lewis Cine, Jameson Williams are really good examples of guys that could turn things around year 3.

One step closer to summer deep dives

@Eric-jz1cv

2 ай бұрын

Can’t wait to see my panthers at 32

@JB-743

2 ай бұрын

@@Eric-jz1cv I’m a Panthers fan too and I honestly don’t think we’re 32. It might be Pats or Commanders

@Eric-jz1cv

2 ай бұрын

@@JB-743 there’s just no way he can ignore the bad play of Bryce last year. He’ll be a 69 with an up arrow. Plus all the new weapons will be 70s with ups. Besides Johnson. We also have a very mid defensive line group. With no pass rush. Are one likely horn injury away from the worst corner group in the league. I just don’t see a way in which we aren’t last. We’ve earned it. I hope we do well. But you’ve got to grade the players on the way they’ve produced.

@MarchOnRome

2 ай бұрын

I’m excited to start the early process for 2025 this summer! Weak offensive class for the most part but a LOADED defensive class. RB is way better too next year

@JB-743

2 ай бұрын

@@Eric-jz1cv Marcus is a Bryce Young guy so I don’t think he’ll have him that low. He’s defended Bryce on Twitter a lot bc of the surrounding cast and coaching he had last year. I understand if we are the 32 ranked team. I’m js it’s a possibility that Pats or Commanders could be last. He fell off the hype train of Jayden Daniels and their Defense is similar level to ours and Oline is worse IMO

I remember the Purdy take and thinking it was odd hyping up a player that had such a small chance to see the field. 2 years later here we are 😂

@edgarramirez747

2 ай бұрын

Real ones stuck with Purdy after his 1st round hype died his junior year

@pascho1057

2 ай бұрын

@@edgarramirez747before Zach Wilson popped off I wanted him or purdy to the saints in the second

Man that Ravens draft was so good. Hamilton has quickly become my favourite player. The only player I've seen singlehandedly force a 3 and out by making 3 completely different plays. He can blow up a screen on 1st down, break up a pass over the middle on 2nd down and get a sack on third down. Guy is insane.

@radaf4429

2 ай бұрын

Cries in Minnesota Vikings

Bears 2:02 Lions 4:34 Packers 6:12 Vikings 11:54 Cowboys 14:00 Giants 16:34 Eagles 19:51 Commanders 22:37 Buffalo Bills 25:16 Dolphins 26:33 Patriots 27:20 Jets 31:35 Ravens 33:15 Browns 36:44 Bengals 38:56 Steelers 42:03 Falcons 45:38 Panthers 50:08 Saints 53:18 Bucs 55:27 Texans 58:31 Colts 1:00:03 Jags 1:02:04 Titans 1:05:31 Cards 1:07:13 Rams 1:09:00 49ers 1:10:13 Seahawks 1:12:38 Broncos 1:14:21 Chiefs 1:15:43 Raiders 1:18:29 Chargers 1:19:06 Go Bucs✌

@saucy1020

2 ай бұрын

tysm for the timestamps my guy. you're a beast

@drewwilson6639

2 ай бұрын

Appreciate it

@caidthackeray8896

2 ай бұрын

Go Bucs! Best Draft Class!

@kepppnews34

2 ай бұрын

Thank you 🙏🏿

@MikeyCoinSnatch

2 ай бұрын

Goat human. Thank you

Waited two years for the Tariq Woolen redemption arc 😂

Love these videos. Just an idea- what if in addition to this 2 year video, you also looked back 5-6 years later to really see how guys turned out long term and really get a blast from the past lol. Just a thought, excited for the summer deep dives!

@AaronAfre-bp7ve

2 ай бұрын

Thad b cool sure

@jesuschristhimself.

2 ай бұрын

As a lions fan, that sounds like a terrible idea and we should stick to the past 3 years or so🫣

@kooligan500

2 ай бұрын

@@jesuschristhimself.Wym? Jeff okudah went beastmode on that injury report

Re: the Packers decision not to wait on WR. The top 100 WRs drafted after Watson? Wandale Robinson, John Metchie, Tyquan Thronton, Skyy Moore, George Pickens, Velus Jones, Jalen Tolbert, David Bell. The depth in this WR class was greatly exaggerated.

Brock Purdy saved that SF draft

@NK-qn6pq

2 ай бұрын

And John Lynch's job after...THAT...pick.

I can't believe the deep dives will be starting soon! You make our lives better, Marcus!

Im suffering from post draft withdraw, i need my medicine(summer deep dives) to listen as i go to work(do chores at home)

I think your take that that quay walker had been more of a bad player then good one is incredibly wrong he was probably a top 4-5 defensive player for the packers last year

Love that you revisit this stuff and refine your process. That being said I feel like doing 3 years and looking back is way better just because it really gives you a way better idea of the project players. Especially those day 2 guys who sometimes need that extra year to see are you good. Fine. Or trash and replaced.

@PlaySA

2 ай бұрын

I feel like he'll do the 2021 draft as well. If I were him I'd do all of them for the last 3 or 4 years.

@Eric-jz1cv

2 ай бұрын

@@PlaySA he did 21 last year. I remember because I’m a panthers fan. And he said terrace was a fine puck. And terrace is on his way out the door here.

Quay walker pick makes a lot more sense when you consider that they weren’t drafting to help rodgers, they were drafting to help Love.

Really funny that you gave the chiefs class an A+, yet were somehow still too low on them

You should add in a Meh category for the ones that fall in between a Hit and a Miss

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

Will do!

6 starters in 1 draft is an A+ regardless of Quay lol

Love these types of videos TFG. A little feedback that I think would improve them (on top of waiting 3 years which I think is good advice too) - I find that your review of your draft grades / analysis is a little bit nebulous and unstructured. One way to fix that would be to provide a “revised 3 year grade” for each pick (example: you initially gave a C+ grade to a draft pick, but re-grading it today you’d give it a B+). And maybe a revised overall grade at the end of each team’s draft class as well - in fact, if regrading each pick would be too much work, redoing ONLY the overall draft grade would be acceptable too. That way, instead of doing the whole “accurate / not accurate” notepad thing, which seemed to trip you up a lot, you can just compare your old draft grade(s) and overall grade to the grade you’d CURRENTLY give each pick/draft. I find it’s hard to keep track of your criteria for evaluating whether or not you believe your grades / analysis were accurate. A good example of what I mean is the Daxton Hill pick, where you said “I don’t think this one was a miss” - but I think (based on the analysis you gave) we’d agree that an “A” grade was probably a bit too high given how he’s actually performed. Another example is the Kenny Pickett pick - you gave a reasonable take which was basically “he’s been a fine fringe starter/backup QB” - but a B- for taking a player like that at 20 overall is sort of generous. There are many other examples where you’re clearly trying to say “I don’t think my analysis was too bad here”, but the grade is way off from how you proceed to evaluate that player/draft pick. I just feel like it’s hard for the audience (and you, probably) to keep track of whether you think you were right / wrong about a draft when we don’t have a clear view of what you think about the player compared to how you graded them back then. A good example of how to fix this is what you did for the Giants pick of Wan’Dale - you basically said “I was right that this was too high, but it’s been more of a C+ / B- pick”. That helps give us some insight into how you’re coming to the conclusion of whether you “hit or missed” on a draft grade, and drafts as a whole. Hope this helps!

@kylebrandt8344

2 ай бұрын

This is a great piece of constructive feedback. I'd also like to add - you could crop your video of yourself and cut out the 1/3 - 1/2 of unused space that fills up the right side of the frame. That way you can tuck yourself further in the corner and still be able to see all the grades without having to edit in post and put grades overtop of the video. And you wouldn't have to move yourself to bottom left of screen either on those big draft classes. I think this would end up being less work for you in editing, as well as clearer visuals for the audience.

How Quay Walker and F🤣🤣 All rookie in 2022 and was had better year 2023 despite missing games due to injury

@XtremeVanman

Ай бұрын

Bro said he “still more bad than good and at best gonna be average”…. Bias def had nothing to do with it….

Ones you were right on “damn I nailed that!” Ones you were wrong on “ well we’ll see what happens in year 3 “ 😝

ive been low key binging these recently, and from the 2020 one I think it would make sense to do another review 4 years after because its the end of their contracts and some of the takes would be much different now then they would be 2 years ago, players have been traded, broken out, etc. Just a suggestion, keep up the good work man

4:30 Seeing Marcus get those terrible youtube ads is both hilarious and comforting that im not the only one

I think the issue with how people evaluate the Jordan Davis pick is what they want him to be. Jordan Davis was drafted to be a space eater who draws double teams and stops the run. He has elite physical traits which is why the hope was/is he develops into a great path rusher as well. He hasn't quite done the latter yet but he's one of the best in the league at the former. He's so good at it, when he got injured his rookie year we had to go out and sign Ndamukong Suh and Linval Joseph because our run defense took such a nosedive.

*Gives Jameson Williams an A+* "Hard to argue with one" Really? Like even if you want to give Jamo another year, he is clearly not going to be an A+. Depending on how he does this year, he is probably falling in the D-B range.

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

That's fair. I guess I'm giving him unfair benefit of the doubt due to time missed.

@ajpierre

2 ай бұрын

THANK YOU!! Thats what i just told him. i Then he sticks by his Quay Walker F grade but maintains his Jamo A+ grade. When he’s clearly will never live up to a A+ grade.

@nautgamingnautgaming9949

2 ай бұрын

​@@ajpierrehe either mixed up the quay walker n Wyatt analysis by accident (we all have done this error) or he really screwed up that process Wyatt was so bad we drafted 2 guys the very next year with high picks at the SAME POSITION It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out why a team does that

@ajpierre

2 ай бұрын

@@nautgamingnautgaming9949 You sound like a REAL packers fan unlike this fraud. Im a UGA fan so i follow most of our players. And you’re 100% correct. If he said Wyatt was an F. I wouldn’t necessarily argue but every time i watch GB.. Quay stands out. So for him to give him an F and then keep that grade 2 years later is a joke. But no he’s dead serious. He even said LBs shouldn’t be 1st rd picks.

@kylegabriel5794

2 ай бұрын

@@ajpierre just cuz he makes a splash play and " stood out" to you doesn't mean he's not bad, he watches tape and you don't so it's not like u know more

You have some of the best football content. Love your insights! Keep Grinding!

I really like how you actually think these through and don't just base it off stats or perception. Some are easy to call a bust or success but a lot are more complicated than that. Definitely subscribing

I would probably wait two years until you revisit the 2023 draft. I feel like you should give them at least three years. Some positions especially (especially linebackers and O linemen) that need more time. Also there are players like Josh Allen who didn't break out until year 3.

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

That's the plan!!

Deep Dives are amazing man I really appreciate you for those man

As a Packer’s fan, you doubling down against the Quay Walker stans made my day. I just don’t get what half the fan base sees in him? Not a useless player, but he’s shown more bad than good so far

@philipevary8470

2 ай бұрын

An F is crazy

@Kowbanator

2 ай бұрын

Thank you! These comments are crazy! He is developing and boy is he strong and fast but especially the year/packers situation and the general 1.17? Pick used for him is at best a D

PROPS for going back like this. Everyone’s quick to throw out their opinions, but nobody wants to go back and see where they went wrong.

Correct Final Grade on the Ravens but it is literally like you hand-picked all of the busts (Travis Jones has been good tbf) to give A+'s to and gave B's to the actual elite players lmao

Great analysis as always Marcus! 🙌

loved the KZread ad cuts lmao

The Saints trade(s) up for Olave and Penning are even more gross when you consider the picks they traded directly turned into... A.J. Brown, Jalen Carter, 1/2 of Cooper DeJean, and a third next draft lol

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

Wow lol

@bryant9543

2 ай бұрын

Even more gross when you consider Penning has been a major disappointment as a player to date. If both those guys had hit, it would at least have been a tolerable trade. The deal never made any sense. Saints have never valued draft capital like other teams do.

Well done man. Good hit rate. I’d agree with pretty much all of what you said

Good video, and nice idea to do this. Gutsy and honest to go back through your team draft boards like this publicly.

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

Thanks for noticing!

"who puts ads in a youtube video, this piece of sh.. anyway" hahahaha ive never laughed so hard at one of your videos lmao

Summer deep dives got me into this channel while you where still using madden! I’m so excited for this summers deep dive!

Love these videos

best football channel on KZread, thanks for the content, keeps the offseason interesting.

50:05 I was so confused for a second LOL 🤣

ELITE video 🐐

Hell yeah! I love draft grades from years later!

One of my favorite annual videos!

Man the Eagles crushed my soul this draft, passing up on Kyle Hamilton for the massively (pun intended) overvalued Jordan Davis was such a stupid move. AJ Brown, Jurgens make the draft a solid B+, but Davis and Dean have been disappointing bordering on busts.

@bryant9543

2 ай бұрын

Dean has been really disappointing given how high the draft media was on him. In 2 years I think he's logged less then 300 total snaps. Great college player and fast as hell, but his size will always limit him I think.

This is one of my favorite videos you do every year

It's always a good day when you post brotha

Really excited to see you revisit the Lions 2023 draft. I completely understand where you were coming from with your grading, I'm just so glad that you were wrong for the sake of my Lions.

Vikes - Vederian Lowe was traded in the 2023 pre-season to the Pats for a 6th round pick and started for the Pats. Nick Muse is still on the team - scored a 22yd TD vs the Lions on the only offensive snap he's played Ingram was the second highest graded guard in that draft class per PFF behind Zion Johnson, graded slightly better than Zion in 2023, so in the context of the class 2nd round was reasonable.

I also was super high on Perrion Winfrey but his off field issues have hindered him

Great video! Do you have older draft projections to do more videos like this?

These are my favorite videos from you

Super excited for the deep dives, but I am gonna HATE having to wait for you to talk about my Texans. 3 straight years of being awful really spoiled me

So glad you do these types of videos

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

Its not my favorite to do cause its impossible to do this without coming off like an ass but I think its a really important learning process to look back at our thoughts and how to improve how we think about the Draft

@Arman_Peters

2 ай бұрын

@@ThatFranchiseGuy makes total sense. Every process needs refinement

I've been waiting for the Seahawks draft grade review ever since you graded them haha

I think it would be interesting when you do these if you would do more scout yourself on what you got wrong and how you can apply it going forward. You talked about missing on Cam Taylor-Britt, but what specifically did you miss on. I think it would make these lookbacks even better if you could make them more about specifically what you missed/got correct and how it can help you get better at evaluating players going forward.

@bryant9543

2 ай бұрын

Agree. I think there is a little to much patting yourself on the back for the stuff you got right (some of which, Jacksonville's draft in particular, your analysis needs improvement IMO) and not enough analysis on what it is you are missing on. Draft grades in general are so arbitrary it might help to focus more on understanding the the nuances of why exactly you were so high or low on a prospect.

@ThatFranchiseGuy

2 ай бұрын

That's a big part of the whole exercise I feel I hit on quite a lot ! Just maybe didn't get into the weeds on every guy cause sometimes I was just simply wrong

Kenny picket is about to have a Jimmy G type career if gets the opportunity in Philly I’d guess

Totally agree the Deep Dives are my fav offseason football content

Geez. The Texans are a great example as to why you should grade after 3 years. These players have only gotten competent coaching for 1 season. I still think most of those players have promise

been waiting on this one since the post draft lull in content

I think your Jets grade was more accurate than the Pats. Swap your H and M with those ones

I think maybe you should have a hits, misses, and meh grouping. There are a lot where it’s not really fair to go either way on so it makes most sense to have a meh grade as well

Random tfg post just made my day

As a Bucs fan Carmada and White have been amazing for us.

If you flipped your corral analysis for Purdy, you'd be the a prophet 😂😂😂😂

Got here in the first couple minutes perfect timing on the upload 😂

You were definitely a little hard on yourself😂especially the jets one and all your good running backs grades have come true

7:00 this take is literally what the eagles did this year with Jalyx Hunt in the 3rd round

I like these retrospectives. Jake Ferguson was nasty especially after his senior bowl, I'm happy w bellinger though. I think u were right about Leo chenel and Zyon McCollum as good value, I learned about those players through this channel.

That's 2x SB Champion Chris Oladokun to you, Marcus 😉

The Deep Dives are my favorite thing on the channel.

Bernard is more than a starter lmao, bro is a star in the making He and Milano is about to COOK

@ryerob4815

2 ай бұрын

Thanks about to add him in my Dynasty league. 11v11 offense and defense 12 teams. Need anyone I can find.

@RM-56

2 ай бұрын

Bernard, Milano, Williams, and Spector is a sneaky good LB core. Kinda wish they kept Dodson though, he was all over the field last year

@tonysoprallen

2 ай бұрын

@@RM-56 don't forget Ulofoshio, my favourite LB in the draft i think Ede and Dorian will be enough to replace Dodson, especially with Babich now overseeing the defense

my favourite video every year🙏

Patriots gotta be #32 - can’t wait for the deep dives!!

2x Super Bowl champion and Steelers legend Chris Oladokun

I feel like you should do a two and four year review of every draft class grades. Its fun after two years, but there will still be some guys who don't hit their groove until year 3 or 4 and there will be some guys who hit the ground running, but never take the step.

@bryant9543

2 ай бұрын

Agree. Year 3 is such a big year for guys. Many don't find their grove until then.

I feel like any KZreadr with a silver plaque deserves KZread premium 😂 you having ads is wild

TFG uploaded an hour and a half video, I know what I’m doing this evening!

You do seem to nail these a lot more often than not. I don't know why but I remember watching years ago when you were talking non-stop about a guy named Blake Cashman. I never heard of him, and he was injured for the early part of his career but went on to be a very good player when on the field and got a big contract. It seems like teams that draft off-ball linebackers early based on their traits seem to bust a ton. It's a tough position to excel in.

Would the jets be an A+ on regrade since every pick is at or higher than your initial grade?

100% +1 ON THE FALCONS PICK, YOU ABSOLUTLEY NAILED THE FALCONS

Love the video would be cool if there was a meh pick instead of hit or miss for drafts like the falcons when there’s a couple misses but a couple hits too

Cole Turner had such great chemistry with Howell but they just never used him after preseason. Wish they played Turner more, but he will prob but a cut this year...

Thanks for the video. Interesting to see how many players do not make it.

Oof, I forgot about that Giants 2022 draft. Two top-ten picks and whiffs on both of them. You have to wonder where they could have been now if those two had been hits.

Bro Perrion Winfrey isn’t even in the league anymore and he was horrendous in his one year with the Browns.

Would be cool next year if you get someone else in to grade with you I think! Maybe you grade theirs too

Justice for the Jets. You deserved a hit there

as an unbiased fan, quay has been injured but also our most surefire tackler on our team. obviously things can be said about his coverage being subpar, but for how bad our 2nd level run d was at the time, quay has really improved it. if the packers had gone wyatt, watson, walker for those first picks, no one wouldve complained

The Steelers may have had the worst oc at the time but that wasn’t the reason KP was missing routine throws and doing his ballerina spin to the left directly into a sack move

On Evan Neal. I think he’s a case of he just simply moves better at LT. some guys move better on the right side. Some left. Some it doesn’t matter. Evan was never some Trent Williams level athlete but he was definitely athletic and that athleticism hasn’t been there at RT in the pro’s. Someone like the Chiefs(which would be ironic after taking Toney off of their hands) should hit up NY and ask what the price is for Neal. Can’t be anything crazy after what he’s shown. Probably a Day 3 pick.

There’s a lot of luck involved and information you don’t have access to except the tape so it’s hard to be accurate every year. However one thing is for sure I appreciate the hard work you put in to give us this A+ content, thanks!

Thanks for keeping it 💯dude. This was the time I started watching all of your content, and your deep research and takes helped me win my 32-man dynasty IDP league this year!

I know you’re busy with deep dives (very excited btw). But at some point it’d be interesting to do a sort of study on how badly the Panthers have handled the QB position since Cam left. Paid Teddy a ton of money, traded for Darnold, picked up Baker, traded up for Corrall, and then gave up the house for Young. It’s been an absolute disaster that would be fun to see the cost vs what they’ve received.

Matt Corral is underrated even in the ufl. Great touch thrower and he’s a dawg throwing slants, in addition to showing some great athleticism. Unfortunately he’s on a team with the UFL mvp right now in Martinez. Seems to be the story of his career thus far. Dealt with injuries that held him back from getting any looks in his rookie year, got dumped for Bryce Young, then you have this really weird stint with the Pats.

Grading Tyquan as a B grade shows you have no idea what you're talking about. Not only was Tyquan a major reach, but he's the 2020s version of John Ross

Vikings fan here, I remember hating this draft other than Booth and kind of Chandler. But, fyi, Nick Muse is still on the team and could be a quality backup this season

This guy doesn't watch packer games

If you can get 3 true starters out of a draft without a first round pick I don’t think a C+ plus grade can hold up based pm principal alone. Ofc Fields’ lack of infrastructure was a real thing, however I think it’s at least a B draft.

Love these! But also for some teams you'll say you were wrong some were better than your predictions some worse but compare it to the overall rank (which usually i agree with) but if you were off in one direction for a couple picks and also the other direction it may "average" out to the same grade but may mean you're the least correct about it