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@90lancaster

2 жыл бұрын

Batman has a picked pool of source Material Problem in the same way Star Trek Movies have a problem with remaking The Wrath of Khan. I'd personally like a 1970's Batman on screen... that was an interesting period for Bruce Wayne especially.

@daviddyster4145

2 жыл бұрын

@@90lancaster that would be interesting, a Batman set in a deferent time period in live action.

@tomcruisenukedmyaccount5388

2 жыл бұрын

Except Robin is lame.

@90lancaster

2 жыл бұрын

@@tomcruisenukedmyaccount5388 He's still better than Damien Wayne.

@tomcruisenukedmyaccount5388

2 жыл бұрын

@@90lancaster Damien is a whack character.

I think folks that don't like Robin have this image in their head that hasn't changed since Adam West and Robot Chicken after that. Him being a ridiculous character is a meme from those, but Robin in DC lore is a very deep and interesting character. Watching how the various Robin's grow up with their relationship to Batman has produced some of the best Batman and Robin stories. It's a little sad they don't know what a complex and interesting character the Robins can be.

@chrisheimva4857

2 жыл бұрын

Batman & Robin sadly did a lot of damage to the public perception of Robin. It seems like in recent times this has softened considerably thanks to a growing awareness of how deep and interesting the character can be (Ex. Teen Titans). I too am hoping that Robin will FINALLY be brought back into the live-action film canon with this Reeve's series.

@YggdrasilAudio

2 жыл бұрын

Also Teen Titans GO!

@boobah5643

2 жыл бұрын

Tell a good Robin story and nobody will care about the hokey silver age stories.

@esecallum

2 жыл бұрын

he stuck out klike a sore thumb...the actor

@CharlieD.706

2 жыл бұрын

I think the animated films got robin right. Not so much the animated series though. I also feel like Robin in the Schumacher films was pretty close to accurate, even though the films aren’t great.

I agree with this. We’ve already seen gritty realistic Batman. I don’t understand why that makes it better? It limits what you can do in the long run because a lot of Batman’s enemies are totally unrealistic.

@aic8801

2 жыл бұрын

Facts they can’t use villains like killer croc and poison ivy because they’re unrealistic.

@doger6531

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly this is what I’ve been saying to people who always use the excuse batman is realistic that’s why he’s so good how can he be realistic when his enemy’s aren’t

@youtubeistryingtocensorme

2 жыл бұрын

@@doger6531 He’s good at everything humanly possible and he knows everything, and he has all the money in the world. How is that in any way realistic. The guy is the living breathing definition of a mary sue, or a gary stu

@matija1549

2 жыл бұрын

Joker, Two Face, Penguin, and Riddler are realistic

@doger6531

2 жыл бұрын

@@youtubeistryingtocensorme at least he trained for his power rey from Star Wars is the perfect example of a Mary Sue she got everything without training in the slightest

What’s funny to me is when the studios say they’re making a realistic Batman again the fans always get amnesia like this is the first “realistic” take on the character ☠️

@igit_7296

2 жыл бұрын

There is no such thing as a realistic take on Batman - the premise is ridiculous. All you have is versions with differing degrees of humor. None are actually realistic.

@UnleashthePhury

2 жыл бұрын

@@igit_7296 “realistic” Batman - every criminal case Batman ever gets involved with is thrown out of court because of his interference.

@igit_7296

2 жыл бұрын

@@UnleashthePhury realistic Batman is where your butler Alfred taught you how to be an expert at hand to hand combat. Goofy movie. Chris Nolan’s version was miles better than this slog of a movie.

@adam346

Жыл бұрын

It's Film-Noir Batman. I don't think there are enough people that kind of get that so saying it is a bit pointless and instead go with "realistic"

@sammypercy388

Жыл бұрын

@@adam346 no dude, film-noir is way more interesting than "the batman". They made a very boring movie, and an even more boring "film-noir" movie. The Animated series did film-noir properly: it didnt suffer from the plainness of this movie.

I think what most people forget about The Dark Knight Returns is that the story isn't just dark and gritty but also deliberately over-the-top and operatic. For instance, the image of Batman and Robin riding into Gotham on HORSES after the EMP has taken out the city's power is as absurd as anything Adam West and Burt Ward did in 'the 66 Batman series. And as youtuber Patrick WIllems pointed out in his own video essay on Batman, without Robin, Batman has no opportunity for growth as a character, he remains a brooding weirdo dressed up as a bat to fight crime out of some overdeveloped need for vengeance. With Robin and the other members of the Bat family, he grows past a simple need for vengeance and becomes a mentor guiding the next generation of costumed heroes so that they're more than just brooding walking tragedies. To paraphrase Patrick WIllems, because of Batman's mentoring, Dick Grayson as Nightwing is essentially a better adjusted Batman.

@SeasideDetective2

2 жыл бұрын

That's something I've noticed too. Frank Miller's work is not just dark, but also grotesque; you can definitely see the seeds of Tim Burton's freak-show version of Gotham City sown throughout. Whether it's the cyberpunk "Mutants," the bug-eyed guy on the street holding up a sign saying "WE ARE ALL DOOMED," or Batman disguising himself as an impossibly ugly old woman as he chases down a half-naked neo-Nazi girl, Miller manages to treat us to a setting that is unforgettably surreal without being goofy. Nothing like that had ever been seen in the Batman comics before; the elements had been either only slightly stylized or made so campy they became trite, without ever hitting that intriguing twilight zone between them. I even appreciate the cameo appearances by Ronald Reagan and (a fictionalized) David Letterman, even though those appearances now date the comic; they give the illusion that Gotham exists in our own world, but without ever sacrificing the fantasy elements.

@n.b.l.5709

2 жыл бұрын

there was more camp or original batman corny ish in that 60s show than just batman n robin ridin horses

@tomcruisenukedmyaccount5388

2 жыл бұрын

The DKnR is metal.

@Ubernerd3000

2 жыл бұрын

The “best” of Batman is when he is shown in his ‘Caped Crusader’ aspect...when he is just as much a symbol of Hope and Justice as Superman, but ‘darker’, not because he’s all grim and moody, but because he literally strikes fear into the hearts of criminals by being the toughest, smartest, most relentless guy in Gotham... he doesn’t have to be a jerk to everyone to be seen as a serious threat... to criminals...

@Mister_Domm

8 ай бұрын

What Patrick Willems video are you quoting?

If we're going to have a Dark Batman again, I want it to be a Gothic, Melodramatic one. Something with a Tone like Gargoyles.

@SoundboxMischke

2 жыл бұрын

That would actually be fucking awesome.

@Carabas72

2 жыл бұрын

Isn't that what we just got?

@Ayyyoooo16

2 жыл бұрын

@@Carabas72 lmao just what I was thinking too. Weird take

@eamonndeane587

2 жыл бұрын

@@Carabas72 I feel the one we got feels more industrial and gritty. When I think of Gargoyles, it's Gothic, Melodramatic but also Fantastical.

@michaelmurphy8278

2 жыл бұрын

This movie has all of that

Finally, someone who shares my gripe. I've had enough with the "grounded, realistic" Batman. They keep milking Batman's ip more than other DC heroes but they keep going to the more realistic, more, More.!!! I want to see a Batman from the comics, who do absurd things, with an over-the-top and bat-like Batmobile and ridiculous gadgets. Batman who can punch walls, kick someone flying to the other side of the rooms. He's a comic book character, a "superhero". Let's go crazy!!!!

@iamedmund1374

2 жыл бұрын

So true man😭

@TimothyMorigeau

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed. People want to see the stuff from the cartoons including the Justice League stuff.

@Triple_Aces

2 жыл бұрын

I’m hoping the next depiction is closer to the Batman we got in the Arkham games. At this point a traditional Batman would be more original on the big screen.

@iamedmund1374

2 жыл бұрын

@@Triple_Aces crazy to say but you’re absolutely right. It’s like they’re scared to let Batman be Batman lol

@bebophippie1781

2 жыл бұрын

Dark knight was great. Quit trying to remake it.

The Arkham game series does a pretty good job of melding the two takes imo

@kinga.t.242

2 жыл бұрын

well its game off course it will be unrealistic

@RichO1701e

Жыл бұрын

It actually reminded me of the games. Visually at the very least.

Where I think a lot of people get wrong when making “realistic” batman stories is that they miss that the world of Batman is steeped in Gothic Fantasy, not edgy realism. The Tim Burton films lean into this a bit, but not enough, and the Schumacher films squander it. It’s a missed opportunity that has never been forfilled.

@apex2000

2 жыл бұрын

Good point. Batman is part of and created from an abnormal city. Otherwise in real life more orphans would be batman.

@adam346

Жыл бұрын

to me it reads like Batman as Film-Noir... and I kind of love it for it.

@ManiacMayhem7256

Жыл бұрын

What's a series or movie that gets it the closest? The 2004 series? Beyond? Animated series?

@okdude8215

Жыл бұрын

True I found those movies entertaining just cause of the style they had. 😊

@DeAngryDan

8 ай бұрын

Iv always said Tim Burton but a tiny bit more fantasy, enough for a proper clay face because if we get a clay face in the New movie's he will just be a Man with scars and a bit of makeup.. they are holding themselves back

I can see your point. It needs a balance between realistic Batman and justice league animated Batman.

@leandroantelo7154

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, we are just asking the directors to let pattinson speak more than 3 lines in 2 hours and a half, that’s all

@AncestorEmpire1

2 жыл бұрын

Plus a better Catwoman that doesn’t play fast and loose with continuity. Replace her with Huntress and my complaint is null and void.

This feels like a third entry into the “Robin should be introduced in the next Batman movie” trilogy by you, Steve Shives, and Patrick H. Willems. And I honestly can’t agree more with that sentiment, now, this is only coming from a guy who hasn’t read the comics, but I feel like while it could be hard to pull off (at least with the red, yellow, and green costume) Robin in the sequel, the end of The Batman felt like the perfect set-up for Bruce mentoring Robin, especially considering how The Batman is pretty much about the consequences a dark, edgy vigilante like “realistic” Batmen have on Gotham. I also think that considering Matt Reeves has admitted to loving the campier side of Batman, up to taking inspiration from the 1966 Batmobile, that I would be much more surprised if they DIDN’T include Robin.

@gabbar51ngh

2 жыл бұрын

To be fair they can still introduce Richard Grayson in a different way & let him become Nightwing if they want to avoid the Robin phase. It's still possible within a grittier Darker story. Instead of circus he could be a young gymnast whose parents gets killed. But still studios are afraid to introduce Richard. Most likely not wanting Batman to grow old. Maintaining the status quo.

@blkjedi

2 жыл бұрын

Robin custome in the current comics isn't that bright colored suit anymore.

@tomcruisenukedmyaccount5388

2 жыл бұрын

Robin is lame though, especially Grayson. If they do Robin, they need to go with Tim Drake who was independent from Batman. I much prefer Casdandra Cain as Batgirl or Black Bat.

I think you are right that what made TAS so good was that Batman had heart and empathy as well as rage, and so did the villains. They also recognized the difference between funny and campy. Episodes like “Almost Got Him” show off Batman’s detective skills while slyly poking fun at some of the more outrageous aspects of his rogues gallery. It would be a refreshing change to see sympathetic villains Baby Doll or a Poison Ivy/Harley Quinn team up that still had the “buddy comedy” vibe of their team ups in TAS.

I think Batman The Animated Series tows the line between realistic and fantasy. There are episodes where Batman gripples with his fears and he also punches a werewolf. The best episode to many is Heart of Ice which tells the story of a husband who would do anything to avenge his fallen wife but he is also in a space suit and shoots ice beams from a gun.

@geekarchivistpearce828

27 күн бұрын

That werewolf episode creeped me out as a kid, but I love Heart of Ice.

100% agreed. For me, when Batman stories are truly at their best is not just when everything's all dark and gritty and hopeless - it's when there's CONTRAST. That's the key - contrast between darkness and tragedy and realism on the one hand, and colorful, eccentric zaniness on the other. They should be fun, but with darkness and depth - and far too many fans decry the former and over-praise the latter.

The Funny thing is, mist of those comics that serve as inspiration for the more "realistic" are what you wished for. Sure Year one had a realistic touch when Batman showed up and Gotham was about Mobsters and corrupt cops. But in The long Halloween after Batman was established, the freaks took over and the style was more eerie and fantastic. The dark Knight returns had Mutants and Superman. And a Robin was a central part of that story.

For what it’s worth (and if anyone cares), I really lament that we never got a solo Batfleck movie. I thought he was great, and his moments in BvS were the standout cinematic Batman for me.

@apex2000

2 жыл бұрын

He was wasted. And clearly was disinterested by the mess of the batman films he was in.

@bonnefetebaby8234

8 ай бұрын

Nah he really looked like a parody of Batman everytime he showed up he was goofy asl excluding that one scene where he swung a box at that guy

@CronksNewBrothel

4 ай бұрын

Such 🧢, Batfleck is the 🐐 and y’all know this, stay mad that he has the best onscreen Batman fight scene in history 🎤 **drops**

"realistic" batman would be lobbying the government more then fucking punching each petty criminals.

I think this Batman would be great if they leaned into absurdity that is inherent to the Batman rogues gallery. For example the next movie with a series of crimes that seem humanly impossible but it turns out to be clayface. The humor can from a relatively normal human dealing with a monster. Also I do hope they keep Batman as a symbol of hope like he was becoming at the end of the movie. Since being the candle in the dark is much more interesting than I am vengeance and darkness.

@kevingriffith6011

2 жыл бұрын

If it weren't for potential issues with a certain marvel character, I'd 100% be for pairing Dr. Hugo Strange with Clayface. Clayface is potentially a very tragic character, and him being manipulated by Strange dangling a cure over his head like a carrot on a stick would be good motivation. Strange also offers something Clayface doesn't: an intellectual equal to batman. This gives us an opportunity in clayface for batman to have an opponent that the bat can't beat, instead that he has to win over with his humanity... essentially, by embracing the "Man". Admittedly, this would probably deny us the ever so popular third act punch-up, the big dramatic action sequence to end it all on, but I think it would be a better story... and clayface has been known to work with batman from time to time in the comics.

@ternative

Жыл бұрын

@@kevingriffith6011 that would actually work really well as most poeple think batman is just some dark and serious guy when he has a heart.

And I thought I was losing my mind with all the Batman reviews lol totally agree with your take. I'd love to see a swash buckling batman sword fight Ra's Al Ghul in a castle 🤣

I agree with your point. I think that's why a good amount of people want Freeze as the next villain and even introduce Robin

The heart of the Batman character and the Batman story is the story of a traumatized 8-year-old boy who nobody rescued from his trauma, so he made himself into someone who could rescue others. And the beauty of that simple story is that it can be done with any number of tones and trappings. It can be silly, it can be fun, it can be campy, it can be serious, it can be tragic, or it can be multiple of those at once. And a Batman who is forever alone misses another core part of the character: Batman is a person who lost his family and creates a new one, with Alfred as his father figure, sometimes Leslie thompkins or someone else as a symbolic mother, and with his sidekicks as symbolic children. I think a version of Batman without that is a version of Batman that only tells part of the story.

I think in films, the image of dark gritty Batman has been so entrenched that it’s harder for studios to get away from that image for fear of upsetting fans. The Gotham tv series always caught a lot of flack for being weird and whacky but to be honest, that’s the tone of what I like my Batman stories to be. It’s one of the reasons I love the Gotham show because it was whacky and goofy and could be serious in one moment and totally bonkers the next. That show never let itself be held back and thrived on being strange and weird. I wish more Batman stories would have that tone. And as for Robin, given Marvel is clearly gearing up for young Avengers and Spider Man has had multiple films portraying him as a high schooler, there’s really no reason to not be able to do Robin even in a realistic and grounded way. Not to mention having Robin allows Batman actual growth of character.

@ZemplinTemplar

2 жыл бұрын

Trouble is, the live-action Gotham series had nowhere near the same level of intelligent script writing as the 90s animated series. The more ridiculous or fantastical elements of the 90s series worked because most of the writing was serious and thoughtful, with little bits of humour here and there. The live-action Gotham series was over-the-top or mean-spirited/"edgy" almost constantly, so it doesn't matter if it even adapts the more fantastical elements. And unlike the 90s animated series, the Gotham series was all about "hey, fans, spot the reference". Something the animated series didn't have to do, since it could actually rely on the stories being Batman-driven, rather than everything being centered on being a prequel. A desperate prequel at that, since they still couldn't resist focusing on the premature emergence of many future villains. There was a point to the animated series' storytelling, or the storytelling in Burton's or Nolan's live-action adaptations. I didn't really see any point to the storytelling in Gotham.

@gamblertoguru382

Жыл бұрын

Gotham stinks,and was borderline campy imo. I think the Iron Man comparison was spot on,and i would say that should be the perfect middle ground. Just have Batman be as obsessed about criminals as Tony was about technology. And you see how Tony was tortured but didn't feel the need to wear it on his sleeve? Please bring that back,as I think that makes for a better Bruce.The new Batman feels the need to beat us over the head with the fact he is tormented. A Batman who hides it,but lets it slip through his actions is a more tragic portrayl imo.

@Axel-ye8tt

Жыл бұрын

No one cares about the tone the gritty Batman are just higher quality products the whack Gotham show was ass

Afflecks solo Batman movie was going to be about Deathstroke coming after the Bat family ( Teased at the end of ZSJL ) so it’s a shame it was cancelled

I will say, I think the best batman stories are the more "gritty" ones, like Redhood and Year one, and I wouldn't want that element to go away. (I still think Christopher Nolan's Batman is the best movie-wise)But I like how the 90's Batman TAS managed to keep that dark element, while also being fun and even a little bit campy or silly at times while still keeping it's mature tone. I think something more like that would be great.

@riverAmazonNZ

2 жыл бұрын

Batman TAS is the pinnacle of Batman in my opinion. I respect that guy.

@albertokorogu1258

2 жыл бұрын

The day we get an adaptation of Dark Nights Metal or any of Scott Snyder's work will be the day I can finally collapse and die as a DC movie fanboy.

@albertokorogu1258

2 жыл бұрын

His run on Batman IMO is the best Batman run of all time. I think "best" storylines are subjective and I'm kind of biased in this case since Scott Snyder's Batman books are literally what got me into comic books again. Without Dark Nights Metal and Death Metal being so good, I would not be reading modern day comics just because most of them cater towards shock value and changing things just to change things.

"Realistic Batman" is overdone, and your analysis of the early comics that Bill Finger created with Bob Kane taking all the credit, is correct. They were for children, but it was a time when children's media was much more diverse in tone and less policed by adults trying to control what kids were reading. It's dark, like The Shadow pulps were dark. But silly is OK, too. I love watching the 60s show, and it was evocative of the Batman of the time. The 50s were a time of being desperate to NOT be controversial, in any way, after Doctor Wertham, the Kefauver juvenile delinquency hearings, and the comics code. I also think a new version of Robin would be incredibly welcome. Now...I also think the "My favorite Batman is the Kevin Conroy/Bruce Timm/Paul Dini animated version" is about as cliché at this point as the grimdark thing. I say that as a MASSIVE fan of that show, too, but it's legacy is just as stultifying as the "realistic" thing. As for THE BATMAN - I think it was "realistic," while still feeling "comic book-esque." My best comparison would be the 70's comics the O'Neal/Adams or Englehart/Rogers stuff. It felt dark, Batman felt scary, while still embracing a silliness. The "mystery" was fine, and good to have, while not really being all that great...like a lot of those 70s comics. Batman walking around crime scenes freely was ridiculous, yet the film sold it. The Penguin was dangerous, but also laughable. Etc. Etc.

@empatheticrambo4890

2 жыл бұрын

I couldn’t agree more in terms of it feels comic and surreal, yet grounded. I loved it for that (though I’d argue riddler was the least camp, which I think is a missed opportunity compared to his roots)

@SeasideDetective2

2 жыл бұрын

@@empatheticrambo4890 Matt Reeves has seemed to have missed the point of the Riddler entirely. Edward Nygma is a nerd, yes, but he's far from the derogatory incarnation of that stereotype we've seen in popular media in recent decades (the "incel," the school shooter, etc.). Traditionally nerds have been either heroes or comic relief, not villains; and while the Riddler IS a villain, I've always thought of him as playful rather than misanthropic and vicious. Nygma is supposed to be fueled by his brilliance and by a desire to match wits with others; he's not just another thug. So, yes, put him in a shamrock-green business suit and a matching derby, because that's how a sophisticated, elitist intellectual who was a little crazy would dress in real life. I don't want to see some sort of paramilitary S&M fetishist.

@SeasideDetective2

2 жыл бұрын

I really like the way you put things. Throughout my life so far, I've noted time and again that things that seem on the surface to be completely absurd actually contain a great deal of depth. I've heard even fans of the character complain that Batman looks ridiculous because "all he ever seems to do is fight clowns." People still make fun of the Joker and Harley Quinn and long for characters like Ra's al-Ghul and Bane to be Batman's foes more regularly. Such people are obviously not aware that the clown is, in fact, one of the most mysterious and potent archetypes in all of human folklore; and that when the Joker imagines himself as supernatural or even a god, he's standing on a very firm Jungian foundation. Clowns represent chaos - the force that created the very universe itself, if you believe the ancient mythology. Harley, too, is someone I believe deserves to be taken more seriously. Too often she gets dismissed as either an update of the blonde, ditzy, Prohibition-era gun moll from black-and-white movies or some kind of giggly Millennial hipster girl in punk fashions and weird makeup. Well, that's what you see if you only look at the surface, which after all is there mostly for humor and sex appeal. If you look INSIDE Harley, you see one of the most tragic figures in fiction. In fact, if I were to compare Harley to any other figure in our centuries-long legacy of Western fiction, it would be Francesca, the adulteress in Dante Alighieri's "Divine Comedy." It's a bit of a stretch, since Harley is not a sexual sinner but a violent criminal, but I argue that both characters have brought the same fate upon themselves, having caused themselves to be condemned (Francesca being literally in Hell, while Harley is stuck in an earthly version of it) by succumbing to their - to quote Harley creator Paul Dini - "mad love" (or "gentle heart," as Dante puts it). Both Harley and Francesca insist they are innocent because they have good intentions, believing that if you're full of (what you consider) love, you can't possibly be evil. Harley Quinn strikes me as a reminder that the "innocent" psychopaths tend to be the most dangerous, and this is precisely because, by definition, they lack any self-awareness to even try to stop what they are doing. So yes, I have no problem with Batman fighting clowns. I insist that all but the most hackneyed members of Batman's rogues gallery have their place. I even defend the Red Triangle Circus Gang from BATMAN RETURNS, arguing that the movie subtly hints at their tragic past and includes them in the narrative in order to emphasize the theme of lost childhood that has run throughout both the Batman comics and the films of Tim Burton from the very beginning.

@empatheticrambo4890

2 жыл бұрын

@@SeasideDetective2 Honestly, I do agree with you. I thought it was an interesting and fairly humanized take on the villain / internet extremist type character, but I don't particularly want that to be the Riddler. I'm very glad they did such a good job with clues and mystery, because otherwise it wouldn't have felt like the Riddler in any way

@geekarchivistpearce828

27 күн бұрын

@@empatheticrambo4890 Definitely needed work, plus the design was flipping garbage. The writing also drags it down with the modern narcissist BS

I don’t like talking about Batman because I start making fun of people. But they like him because it’s easy to do dark and moody stuff. And you can do that but also have fun. I would love to see a Batman horror movie, with Clayface, Solomon Grundy or Man-Bat. Or a sci-fi tale with Mr. Freeze.

I feel like the arkham games pretty much nailed the level of realism. It's reletively grounded but it's still uncanny and out there when it wants to be. Idk, it might still be a bit too 'realistic' compared to what your trying to say in this vid, but personally I think it's great

@Darek_B52

2 жыл бұрын

The Arkham games are a perfect blend of "realistic batman" and Animated series batman.

@doger6531

2 жыл бұрын

Ya love how unrealistic they are sometimes my type of Batman

“Critics who treat 'adult' as a term of approval, instead of as a merely descriptive term, cannot be adult themselves. To be concerned about being grown up, to admire the grown up because it is grown up, to blush at the suspicion of being childish; these things are the marks of childhood and adolescence. And in childhood and adolescence they are, in moderation, healthy symptoms. Young things ought to want to grow. But to carry on into middle life or even into early manhood this concern about being adult is a mark of really arrested development. When I was ten, I read fairy tales in secret and would have been ashamed if I had been found doing so. Now that I am fifty I read them openly. When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up.” - CS Leiws

Was disappointed that we didn't get to see more of the DCEU Batman was looking forward to seeing a live action Batman interacting with the more fantastical elements of the DC universe. Would have definitely bought something new to movie version of the character. Also Batman The Animated Series is awesome quite possibly my favourite version (that or Keaton but it's close)

@albertokorogu1258

2 жыл бұрын

I think its possible we get that with Matt Reeves Batman in the future. Because if you ask me I don't think Matt is dumb enough to just simply follow what came before and re-tread the old trilogy. If you want to get people invested in Battinson and this new universe you need to do something way different from like TDK trilogy.

@PhiberOptik23

2 жыл бұрын

I’m actually quite happy the removed references to the DCEU in The Batman. It would have weighed it down with all the references.

@albertokorogu1258

2 жыл бұрын

​@@PhiberOptik23 You mean the fact they made it an entirely different movie? Yeah if you asked me 5 years ago if I was hyped about The Batman in the current DCEU at that time I would have said that I genuinely don't know. The DCEU hasn't really gotten good until recently with movies like The Suicide Squad and The Snyder Cut coming out. Like yeah they've had some hits like Wonder Woman, Shazam, and Aquaman but those movies were mostly just to pass the time. I've never had the craving to just go back and watch Aquaman or Wonder Woman it's usually just when I'm in the mood.

@AllThingsKen

2 жыл бұрын

@@albertokorogu1258 but he just did

@albertokorogu1258

2 жыл бұрын

@@AllThingsKen Wdym

Part of what makes movies great is seeing things we cant see in reality.

I disagree, I think the movie recalled the Sixties TV series in a number of scenes. The sight of an ultra serious Batman solving clues while standing among police offers was quite absurd. Adam West also played Batman straight, with dead seriousness if ultimately comical effect. The scene with Batman is hanging off a cable in the new movie seemed a nod to the infamous shark scene in the Sixties movie. But...bring back Bat-Mite!

@philiphunn194

2 жыл бұрын

Not to mention the raised nose-guard on Battinson’s cowl was a very deliberate homage to West’s cowl.

I would say go for the B:TAS vibe with the new actor. Like you said, he needs his rogue's gallery. Then you can do the older Afleck-man version in the justice league setting. A few flash-backs to The Batman character would tie the two together and allow them both to move forward. And I really think that Christian Bale would make for a great older Batman now.

Empathy. What makes Animated Series Batman great is his empathy. He watches the video of Victor Fries being turned into Mr. Freeze and he’s horrified one human being could do that to another. He even gets *why* Freeze is doing what he’s doing, but Batman can’t let Freeze hurt innocent people in the name of revenge (and not just to protect the innocent; he knows becoming a murderer will be bad for Fries). That’s one of the things Nolan Batman gets right, and what Snyder missed about Batman. Batman may not always express it in a healthy way, but he *cares* about people being hurt (even his villains).

@doger6531

2 жыл бұрын

This this and more this

@IcyDiamond

Жыл бұрын

And then we’ll get to see more of Batman’s empathy in the second The Batman movie

I started out the same, but what changed things for me is everything after the Riddler thug throws the word "vengence" back at him: that's the turning point of the story where it looks like he's sufficiently rattled by it that he knows he can't continue to be the "gritty, dark" Batman he's been up until then, and has to be a symbol of hope.

@flowerboy5238

2 жыл бұрын

Me too I think the movie is about him realising he can be so much more than just a vigilante he can be a hero as similar hope and at the end of the movie I think he realises that cannot wait for the sequel

@Axel-ye8tt

Жыл бұрын

Batman is dark and gritty even when he’s a old mad you can still scare criminals and be a symbol for people

Which is why we never got live action takes on say: mr. freeze (if you count the Batman and Robin movie), Clayface, Man-Bat, The Ventriloquist, Solomon Grundy

I’ve been wanting a Bat-Family movie for the last ten years. I think a really good story could be told about that dynamic between Batman and his protégés. Thank you for adequately explaining why I didn’t love The Batman. I left the theater just empty. Technical aspects were good but the story left a hole. This is why, thank you

The quality of writing in these essays is really very good indeed. I feel that the subject matter can distract one from the very obvious inference I’ve gradually drawn, that Rowan can really write. It’s fantastic stuff and deserving of a much wider audience. Thank you.

Oh, and for pity's sake, if The Batman gets a sequel, can we have a villain other than the umpteenth take on the Joker? I know he was teased in the movie and the deleted scene that was released is admittedly nice and creepy but Batman does have an extensive rogues gallery with characters that are at least as interesting as Joker, if not more so. I think the animated series's take on Mr. Freeze was actually a fairly realistic and tragic version that would make a nice template for a live action version that escapes the campiness of Arnold Schwartzenegger's lame puns while still bringing some elements of the fantastical to a future movie.

@NoName-oo2td

2 жыл бұрын

If past superhero hero movie franchises taught us anything is that they're going to bring in the arch nemesis at some point. And Joker is Batman's arch nemesis. Heck all three live action Spider-Men have fought the Green Goblin (arch nemesis) in their respective franchises.

@youtubeistryingtocensorme

2 жыл бұрын

Yes please god. No more Joker. I’m so sick and tired of seeing the Joker.

@ZemplinTemplar

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly, I think Reeves will restrict him to a background character.

3:13 not correct. There were literally a handful of comic adaptations for the 66 series and that’s it. Very few, and it’s well known which ones were adaptations. Trivia : Mr Freeze was called Mr Zero in the comics. Batman 66 renamed him.

I can understant your point but I can see why creators always go with the dark brooding tone on Batman movies. Being a character with a long history in comics, with many types pf stories, some campy others dark, the movie creators have to choose which one will be the tone for the film and it's franchise. In the case of Batman, most of his best stories are dark noir detective drama, so creators try to adapt this type of stories and figure out to make some comic book elements to fit with the tone. Even Batman TAS went through, with creators having to make some changes, like having Robin already a teenager rather than a kid. In the case of Reeves Batman I think he has better balance between the realism of Nolan and the gothic style of Burton movies and I can see Batman dealing with more weird villains in the sequels without feeling inconsistent with the franchise's tone.

*Im glad someone else said it* we’ve seen realistic grounded Batman already with Nolan’s trilogy - I’d rather we’d have gotten a dark, fantastical movie like Glass or Split where there’s some wacky shit happening but the drama around that wacky shit makes you take it seriously.

Funny, I felt like this was much closer to Adventure Batman than the boring and dry Nolan Batman. The depiction of Bruce as an emo virgin pretty boy is so fantastical. I love it. I can definitely see this version going campier.

@edibleapeman

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah. Before I clicked on this video, the title of it had me thinking Rowan would be singing The Batman's praises for how unrealistic Pattinson's/Reeves' take on the Caped Crusader is.

@javierlopez9789

Жыл бұрын

Imagine calling nolan bruce dry when you have pattinson acting like an angsty 14 year old.

People who still think Robin is embarrassing clearly haven't watched Teen Titans or Young Justice.

Robin does very well in animation, especially on the various incarnations of the Teen Titans. Christian Bale's dark gritty Batman movies were already done before DC and Warner Brothers decided to create a larger universe similar to that of the Marvel franchise. Ben Affleck's Batman should have been in several movies as part of the larger DC universe, and probably would have spun off other Batman related characters. But Justice League's problems are already historical now. I doubt the new Batman will fit in the current DC universe.

I couldn't agree more with what you say. The once refreshing take on the character is decades old now. And I have to add - I wasn't that excited about the "realistic" approach in the first place (whilst I really didn't like the late 90s Batman either).

The funniest thing is that it’s supposedly to be “realistic” yet Batman snaps his neck on a bridge but gets up like nothing happened

If fantastical shit doesn't happen in the next film I'm fucking done with this world and Matt Reeves. Period.

A medieval Batman where he is a Scottish knight trained by Ras'al'Ghul while on the First Crusade only to return and find his king's castle has been overthrown by the court jester would be nice.

I can't say anything about the batman. I've tried 4 times and I keep falling asleep on it.

Another great video, thanks Rowan. Myself of all the batman films I've seen to date, and that isn't all of them, Batman (1989) is the one I enjoyed the most. Something I'd like to see live action is Batman of the Future. The realism comes from the characters and depth and the sci fi fantasy of the near future.

You have a point. However, I think Matt Reeves can put the fantastical elements of the batman mythos, just like you point out with characters like Iron Man, but he has to put it well and gradually so that it wouldn't end up like Batman and Robin

And yes, Batman TAS is the best on screen version of Batman by far

You can be dark and fun and believable without veering off into the /wrist territory. Basically, don't grimdark, just for the love of everything, DON'T! Not many people can pull it off. And that's exactly what Batman should be. Fun "dark fantasy" hero. Nolan pulled it off, but those movies were different, they were more akin to 24(Bourne? You get the idea) than to a true superhero movie. Robin's design is silly, but I love the character. Batman really needed him.

Just watched it. Was looking forward to this, and it’s simply a snooze. Drawn out dialogue, ridiculous runtime that isn’t justified by a slow pace story, and an abandonment from necessary character development (batman is on screen for almost the entire film). I’m not saying we need the same old song and dance for an origin story, but Batman’s in a fist fight within 5 minutes of the film. I felt like I was thrown in the middle of the film, and we never really returned to the beginning. The film wanted to be “real”, but then felt almost like a comic or video game. I just found this to be conflicting at times. I think diving into a heavier detective angle for the film was a fascinating take, and something fans have been hungry for.. unfortunately for me, it falls flat and I lost interest numerous times throughout…

@kinga.t.242

2 жыл бұрын

i dont know why you saw the movie as slow i never felt that and i watched it in the cinema

Well, first of all, it's ironic to hear the words "Gothic" and "fun" in the same sentence without a "but." Gothic literature includes Edgar Allan Poe and Lord Byron - two authors who, with a few exceptions (such as "The Gold Bug" and "Don Juan," respectively), are NOT "fun" to read. But yes, I understand that in our more poppy and lighthearted 20th and 21st centuries, "Gothic" is more about Halloween and monster movies than angst and alienation (even though those two realms can certainly be combined, as in Dante's "Inferno"). What we once called "Gothic" we now call "existentialist," which sounds a lot more boring and indeed seems to describe the post-2000 Batman films fairly well. But, yes, you're right. What has always drawn readers and viewers to Batman comics and media is their "chiaroscuro" - the mixture of dark and light. I will always think that Tim Burton's 1989 film achieved the perfect balance of realism and escapism for a PG-13 picture. In fact, when he was interviewed about his character, Jack Nicholson remarked that he knew millions of children would ask their parents to take them to see the film, and he had wanted to make the Joker menacing, but at the same time not so terrifying that kids wouldn't be able to laugh at him. That's a point that too often is forgotten: even the most vicious villain needs a lighthearted element in order to appeal to the audience. Even better, I think, was the 1990s animated series, which is still one of the greatest cartoons ever. That version of Batman could make me laugh, make me cry, AND terrify me, which was good; the best entertainment engages multiple human emotions. In fact, that series remains such a gold standard that it baffles me why neither Christopher Nolan nor Matt Reeves have been willing to draw more than a handful of elements from it. There still exists a reluctance, for example, to put Harley Quinn in a movie unless she's supposed to be the focus of it, and then the movie has to become a comedy. I think it's been proven time and again in other media that Quinn can be just as emotionally complex a character - if not more so - than the Joker. As I've suggested in the above paragraphs, the villains are key. The beauty of characters like the Joker, the Mad Hatter, the Ventriloquist, and Poison Ivy is that they're so outlandish that you can't make them "realistic" without distorting them beyond recognition. Who wants to see a Hatter who literally suffers from mercury poisoning, or a Ventriloquist who uses a tape recorder rather than a wooden doll to express his alter ego? I'm fine with these villains being irredeemably evil and slaughtering human beings by the hundreds, but there's no reason they can't be funny and imaginative too. I'd rather have them than Ra's al-Ghul; despite being a compelling villain in his own right, he can all too easily be reduced to just another terrorist.

I completely agree with you. The obsession with realistic Batman gets on my nerves, it’s why Keaton is my personal favorite. Having said that I like Robert Pattinson’s Batman a lot, I personally take more issue with the Bale movies, I like the way Pattinson’s movie does the whole “grounded” thing way more. I also appreciate that they utilized the Mafia families, as they get sidelined all the time, which is silly, especially because they are easily the most realistic Batman villains. The sequel for “The Batman” is gonna have Robin, which makes me hopeful.

I fear we'll never get a proper comic book adaptation that would tow more in line with the old animated series. Bring out Clayface for a movie!

Put Batman in space and have him fight dinosaurs WB you cowards!

I had a good laugh when Batman eats shit after using the wing suit. Not exactly the master of stealth and grace you see in the Tim Burton movie or the animated series.

I totally agree, the new Batman movie is boring as hell. I went with my boy to the Cinema, and after 30min I thought...OMG how long is that movie going to be. My boy and his friend found the movie ok, but a few days later he told me that pretty much everyone in school that the same, boring and not even close to Chris Nolans version.

I completely agree, Nolan’s take on Batman has grown extremely stale over time and I’m sick of film makers copying him ad nauseam. The Anthology, Animated Series, BVS and Arkham Games balance all of the elements perfectly in my view, stylish yet narratively strong, fantastical yet enjoyable. Though I really love Batman Begins, Nolan’s films slowly grew more generic with each film.

I actually have some optimism that while this take on Batman will stay grounded and "realistic" he will develop out of that angst edge lord character Batman has been stuck in for a while. It very much seems like these movies want to deconstruct that version of Batman and show him grow into being more the Batman we know from, say, the Animated series. A troubled man, but one who will sit with a dying child to be her only friend at the end. Someone who is trouble but is actually trying to do good rather than just beat up criminals.

Makes sense as to why Christopher Nolan went a more realistic route as people would have said he’s copying Tim Burton if it looked and felt like Burton’s films in anyway and if it looked and felt like Joel Schumacher’s films people wouldn’t have been happy due to those not being enjoyed as much. But even then, Nolan didn’t make it completely 100% realistic, there’s still suspension of disbelief and some stuff obviously probably wouldn’t happen in real life when you look at those film. I don’t mind the realistic version of Batman, but if one is going to make a Batman film or show with a realistic tone, make sure there’s some sort of lightness to it. In The Dark Knight Trilogy, Bruce’s interactions with Alfred and Fox are pretty humorous a good amount of the time. It balances out the darkness with some humor that fits the tone and doesn’t pull you out of the film. The Batman is a good film, a fine film, but there wasn’t much humor that sort of gave the film a bit of a light moment here or there. Hopefully, we’ll see some moments that are light enough that it balances out and fits the dark tone of the next film.

Never been a huge Batman fan (Marvel more my thing) but read quite a lot of issues. I think DC movies are just a bit embarrassed by their characters and don’t really understand superheroes comics. I do also think that Marvel were quite clever because all of the MCU movies from Iron Man on were starring heroes that, let’s face it , the general public hand little to no previous knowledge of, so they could form the movies around the actors and they cast the actors extremely well in every case.

@Carabas72

2 жыл бұрын

I think it's more that Marvel movies are being made by Marvel, and DC movies are being made by Warner Bross.

@johnberry5296

2 жыл бұрын

@@Carabas72 Warner Brothers own DC Comics

@Carabas72

2 жыл бұрын

@@johnberry5296 No. Time Warner/AT&T/Whatever it is now owns DC Comics. And WB is a film studio that is owned by the same conglomerate. DC Comics itself does not really have a lot to say about the movies. Marvel Studios on the other hand IS Marvel. Marvel did a big gamble, and created their own film studio.

The first Batman on screen was NOT 1960.s. It was 1943 With Lewis Wilson as the first Batman. NOT 1960's Adam West.

I want a more Bronze Age Batman. I would like a Kobra appearance in a film.

1. I love your take. You takes always make me think. 2. This is my favorite Batman movie. But not for any aesthetic or thematic reason. This was the first movie where Batman was shown as a detective. Being a long time comic fan, I enjoy the arcs where Batman is primarily a detective first and a super hero second. While the cartoons are fun, Batman Beyond was my favorite precisely b/c we got to see Terry be "coached" into becoming a detective; whereas, in the animated series, you might get an episode or two per season of detective-ness, but it really was focused on the tricked out ninja element of Batman. Beyond made Bruce Wayne a character. 3. In terms of your take, from an aesthetic and thematic point of view, I completely agree. But in terms of character, what sets this Batman apart is his brain and wealth (and all the limits to a detective that wealth brings in terms of knowledge and imagination). I read this Batman more as a one man police shop - a detective, a undercover cop, a political/economic enforcement agent, over funded soldier etc. - all of which individually is an extremely mentally taxing set of jobs, but rolled into one person, would definitely make you crazy. And that shows in this film. It was great for the plot! 4. Which is why I would propose what you really want is a Zoe Kravitz Catwoman film. I absolutely adore her performance in this film. But whereas the character is sometimes depicted as cowardly, depending on the writer, this version of Catwoman is very nuanced. She knows her limits and understands systemic problems and the scale systemic problems reproduce themselves on in a very logical, rational way. She understands her limits (which include wealth - you can never escape capitalism right?) in relation to those systemic issues. Which is why I loved the ending scene when Batman and her split, going in opposite directions. I think she understands mental health and how capitalism is taxing in so many ways to someone's health, mental or otherwise. And there is a lot of space for fun there b/c capitalism is fraught with irony. I'd love to see how that film plays with gender, politics, and economics in terms of a films meta commentary using witty jokes like Iron Man. And after the Halley Berry Catwoman, the film version of the character needs some help.

Just got HBO Max and this was on it. I only made it 40 minutes and got so bored I turned it off. To each their own but this was dull and lifeless to me.

Won't lie i am a bit tired of normal batman movies, how about we do batman beyond now, give me that sci-fi future Gotham.

Always such a great take, you've convinced me.

30 minutes into the movie and I was bored out of my skull. Honestly. I like the look of Batman. But something felt of in his character.

I’ve always been a fan of variety. Is wrong to want multiple Batman series. With a dark and gritty one, a fun romp with a semi serious Batman, and crazy Lego Batman like series.

Count me among those who loved “The Batman”, and realism wasn’t my main hope. I primarily go for how well the “scrap” gets handled, and I’m OK if Batman takes his lumps, since that is an aspect of reality that I can appreciate. I can go for some sci-fi villains to the degree of Man-Bat, since that can loosely be based on science. ClayFace? PLEASE, NO!! In that realm it’s inescapable for me to watch that not think about how one’s inner workings can be maintained amid all that, and also that with those abilities, it feels like ClayFace holds back from growing more pointed offshoots than Batman can defend against. I’m not utterly hinged on realism. I just wish to avoid aspects that push my suspension of disbelief too far.

Im not really into the hyperbole superhero films that are what currently gets shat out into the cinemas. Especially all the marvel MCU... the original "origin" films where really good but after that all got watered down. Hence i really hope they dont make batman that way too, with 50 sidekicks that all need 5 minutes of screentime thus the whole movie becomes a screentime focus solo switcharoo... All i want is a slow paced gritty authentic Hero movie.... we have nothing like this anymore (notice the absence of "Super?")

The thing I really want is more of the Rogue's Gallery. I liked being able to see the Riddler and Penguin in The Batman, but can I just say how tired I am of seeing the Joker? I'd love to see Poison Ivy, Mr Freeze, or Clay Face get a proper live action appearance in a good film. But with the Joker, how many times have we seen him since The Dark Knight? We keep getting interpretations, and I'm honestly just tired of seeing him. I want other villains to get a shot in the spotlight.

@michaelwhitehead6594

2 жыл бұрын

Plus The Wizard, The Mad Hatter, King Tut, would be awesome to see these as modern updates too! Like you, getting tired of modern batman keep doing the Joker, Riddler cat woman and penguin all the time.

@doger6531

2 жыл бұрын

Yes finally someone else says joker is overused like that clown has been used 2 times in a row in two big Batman live action movie franchises it’s time to give someone else a spotlight

I think “The Batman” animated series from the 2000’s properly paces tone that makes you ready for the Bat Family after two seasons.

I actually loved The Batman precisely for making it a point that being „Vengeance“ isn’t enough for being Batman. In the beginning he even scares the victim he is saving, later he realizes that the vengeance mentality (of just punishing criminals) doesn’t make him any different from someone like the Riddler and so in the end he is all about saving people and represents hope for them and a boy he saved isn’t scared of him. Indeed I feel Matt Reeves (and writer(s)) „get“ the character like no other filmmaker before (even Nolan) and so I am hopeful that sequels will focus more on Batman expanding his roster to include Robin and a whole Bat-Family. Hell, even in The Batman he already has Cateoman and Gordon as allies. The Dark Knight Trilogy took three films to get there 😂

@anthonygarcia8749

4 ай бұрын

He shouldn't have to learn vengeance isn't the answer in his second year of being Batman lmao.

@fgdj2000

4 ай бұрын

@@anthonygarcia8749 That's not the point. The point is, Batman is no anti-hero. He starts out as one (even in the original 1939 comics), but he becomes a true hero and that's his appeal... 85 years and counting.

@fgdj2000

4 ай бұрын

That and the fact that you can create almost any version of him and he still works. Adam West and Joel Schumacher's campy and silly take on Batman works just as well as a more serious and realistic take on him a la Christopher Nolan or Matt Reeves and anything in between, Tim Burton, Frank Miller, Paul Dini, Chuck Dixon, Carmine infantino, Kelley Jones, they all work as what they are and the character still feels true. A dark Superman for instance just doesn't work. Even Zack Snyder's Batman is still Batman (I don't like this version very much), but Zack Snyder's Superman just isn't Superman.

That clip from Amanda Waller in JLU is one I think of often as something that people seem to overlook about Batman

I want Clayface in all his mud monster with shape shifting powers glory and I want it in THE very next Batman movie

Realistic Batman would just be a dude in clothes that actually work as camouflage and real body armor, not a Bat costume.

@ShawnBirss

2 жыл бұрын

Just like how The Riddler is just dressed as someone who is hiding his identity online.

@stevenscott2136

2 жыл бұрын

A truly realistic Batman movie was made in the early 1970's, under the title "Death Wish" with Charles Bronson.

@ShawnBirss

2 жыл бұрын

@@stevenscott2136 I'll look it up! Thanks!

@ShawnBirss

2 жыл бұрын

@FN-1701AgentGodzillaRangerPrime Ω The cape is a liability

THANK YOU!!! I loved The Batman, and I feel the "realistic" take worked this time. Unlike Nolan's movies, this doesn't change stuff for the sake of realism. It focuses on the more down to earth elements like a detective driven plot or having his more realistic villains, so it respected the character in that regard. However, I don't want this to be the bar for the entire franchise this movie's setting up. If you're setting up a world of Batman characters, embrace all the elements!! Look at Batman:The Animated Series, some episodes are about Batman stopping some gangsters, while in others he fights a guy with a freeze gun and an actor who's a giant hunk of clay. It doesn't have to be "artsy and complex" to be taken seriously, just have strong writing and a story that thrills audiences. I hope Matt Reeves has considered this, after all, he directed movies where humans and monkeys battle each other

The issue with Robin is that he’s a kid. Why would Batman train a child to fight crime? It’s questionable. It’s child endangerment.

@KayleighBourquin

2 жыл бұрын

So you craft a story where the Robin character, whichever one you want, just keeps trying to emulate Batman no matter how many times Bruce tells him not, no matter how many times the kid gets his arse kicked. So Batman is kinda forced to train him as a means of protecting him.

Obviously it is a grounded movie but I still felt like it took much more from a comic book element than something like the dark knight I personally felt like I was reading the comics again especially the year one comic and playing the Arkham games. It’s not a surprise to me that the movie was as “realistic” as it is given that both antagonists in the penguin and riddler aren’t really fantastical to begin with , but I do think that the next movie should begin to introduce more mystic elements. Characters like Solomon Grundy and Man-Bat would really suit the creepier and gothic aesthetic of Reeve’s batverse, perhaps he could build them as some sort of urban legends or myths Batman has to confront

I don't mind gritty or dark stories but what I do want a less realistic Batman. I'd love to see all facets of Batman, his skill, tech, detective mind, fantastical villains. Imagine an Arkham games Batman live action? Incredible

Batman needs to be gritty and dark, but they gotta portray him with feats from the comics and arkham games. Batman v Superman was the closest to comic book batman feats wise

The batman film is a generic garbage film it has put me off, this film made the character useless if he wasn't in the film nothing would change because the director doesn't get the concept of good guy stopping the badguys evil plans and saves people then catching the badguy, it wasn't accurate to Batman what so ever! this film Is so stupid and idiots online call it a masterpiece when it's trash.

I feel the way about Batman the way I feel about James Bond. If you go to grounded it's not fun. But if you go to fantastical, I can't feel any stakes. Honestly it's a hard balance to strike but I've seen it done. (Although I do love a full silly Batman when done right)

I love batman since i was a kid him and Spiderman where my favourite superheroes my favourite aspects of batman are the supernatural elements on him white eyes and a cape that cover his body and he is like a shadow the two coolest things about what makes batman that many believe that wouldn't work in live action because batman has to be realistic absolutely ridiculous just let batman be batman for once and this comes from a marvel fan who saw the batman and things it's one of the best dc movies and Robert's performance one of the best still the depiction of batman didn't made him justice for one more time

They should adapt the O'Neil/Adams Batman of the early 70s. Stripped down and gritty but not overly gritty. Batman uses his detective skills and wants to save people. He's broody but not borderline psychotic. It was a refreshing change from the 60s TV show (which I also love).

Patrick Willems had a great breakdown/defense for Robin recently, I'd love to see another Robin on the big screen! Even though I really like The Batman it's not necessarily because I think this is the 'right' batman, it just fits my personal taste in films, and I suspect that The Dark Knight is the most popular batman film not because it's the 'best' version of batman but because it's one of Chris Nolan's best films. The real issue I see with modern interpretations of batman is that they're so constrained by the studio system. Batman Begins was made because Batman and Robin failed so hard, so they went in the opposite direction (and it worked!), Justice League and The Batman get to continue in that direction because it worked before, i.e. it's a safe bet for the studio because that kind of take hasn't failed (yet). Don't forget that Batman Forever and B&R were both responses to the merchandising problem caused by Returns' very mature themes and visuals. These films are all responses to whatever came before rather than attempts uniquely for the sake of exploring the character. I'd personally like to see less constraints on the character and the "universe" and just make several different batman films at once (or over a course of a few years or whatever) that don't HAVE to have anything to do with each other. Give us a campy batman and a serious batman and a bat-family. After the success of No Way Home I don't think anyone can argue that audiences can't handle the idea of multiple versions of the same character.

I hate that they've consistently moved away from the kinds of depictions that make batman more urban myth than man, Batman should never appear to the criminals as just some dude in a costume if he'd started that fight in the train station from the shadows by dragging one of the thugs into the darkness it would have been far more impactful than just walking in and having a straight up fist fight. In "The Batman" everyone just treats him as just a vigilante when nobody really he's at his most effective when nobody really knows if he's even real or not.

Honestly growing up I loved Batman and Robin and Batman Forever they were out of this world and very fastisical. The imagery was diffirent and unique. I originally hated Christopher Nolan take on Batman being so releastic and dark. But as I grew up I appreciated the movies much more. Nevertheless, a new fresh take on Batman that distances itself a bit more from dark and dreary take would be great to see on screen!

We might see Nightwing and Red Hood, but we'll never see Robin again in a film. Maybe just a quick flashback to show the transition into a new character. I'd love to see Robin and I'd love to see a blue onscreen Batsuit. Something based off the Denny O'neil/Neal Adams run could be great. Those stories were dark and mature WITH the blue suit

I have to say I disagree, but you make a compelling argument. For all intents and purposes, everything before Frank Miller's Batman: Year One didn't happen, and then after Flashpoint everything before that didn't happen, so who he was envisioned as in the 30s doesn't really matter that much. That being said, the strength of Batman as a character is he can be interpreted and portrayed in so many different and complex ways, from the campy cheese of Adam West to the gritty and dark Robert Pattinson. I will agree that the animated series was a marvel, but it also was FAR more graphic (including showing blood once, and they got in trouble for it) than animated shows of the day, and that Batman was more in the Batman 89 field of interpretation (which got worse and worse over time.) I like my Batman dark, but I do not have a problem with a properly interpreted Robin, one that tempers Bruce's dark impulses, and makes him a better Batman over time. If you have not watched him, check out Steve Shives and his video about putting Robin into a modern Batman movie. You and he seem to share some opinions on that one, and I agree. Not a huge fan of Robin myself, but when he is done right, he is integral to the journey of Bruce Wayne as a character. The problem is . . . the films and TV have largely done him wrong (animated series is probably the closest, but still not quite there regarding Robin). Again, amazing video.

I thought it was not a Batman film he might as well just been a detective, to much talk with no action. It was a pointless film not interesting and a waist of time.

James Rolfe pointed out a kinda funny similarity between The Batman and Batman The movie. Both feature The Penguin, Catwoman, The Riddler and The Joker.

I pretty much entirely agree with everything you've said here (except for saying Batman Forever isn't a great movie). The Batman became my favorite Batman movie precisely because of all of this, though. I don't think it shut itself off from some of the more fantastical elements anymore than Casino Royale prevented Spectre from happening (maybe a bad example since people inexplicably hate that movie). I very much want a Robin in this universe, and if Reeves thinks he can make a Mr. Freeze happen in this universe, then I think anything is possible. Plus, the way this ended, with Batman realizing he has to be more than anger and vengeance, that he has to be a symbol of hope, that's my Batman. That's the most character progression we've seen for Batman since Batman Forever.

I'm really suprised by this review. I was mostly blown away by it. Not as great as Bale's, but in close second. Of course it depends in part with what expectations one goes in. Yes, it was gritty, but different enough from Nolan's & Bale's interpretation. The true litmus test will be how it fairs on second and third viewing. I suspect, that in parts it will strech and feel slow. As for the rest. I would agree that calling Robin the Jarjar Binks of Batman is way harsh. But then Jarjar didn't irritate me. :-D A more funner version of Batman without going camp is indeed possible. I mean see the new Spiderman movies or the Marvel movies. My suggestion for a more fun Batman entry would be the Batman/TMNT crossover! The comics are great and the animated movie isn't bad either. I mean even a more serious interpretation would be fun. I also fully agree regarding bringing in all the other Bats, women, girls etc.

I definitely want to see more Bat-Family content. It's the best part of the franchise

I feel as though it was a Batman the animated series did a great job of creating a complex Bruce Wayne and Batman that was relatable because it showed their many layers. Bruce Wayne is Batman wears a complete badass who had grit and trauma but also showed deep love and compassion to friend and for a like. When we meet Bruce in “Batman Beyond” we see an old man who’s character has organically grown into a bitter recluse because of his life decisions. Unfortunately most people want Batman to shed what makes him Batman so they can have an exclusively emo and tortured character without the Humanity that makes him who we all know and care about. Personally I would love if they adapted the Mr. Freeze from “Batman The Animated Series” Give the villain sympathy with dashes of terror as he murders people with his freeze gun. Show the anguish of the relatives who have to live after the loss of their loved ones like they briefly showed in “Batman Beyond”