"Oh Commissioner... this is going to be a tough job. It could cost me six, seven Robins"

What did you give Batman? Tom King: Crippling depression.

@dabossman5650

5 жыл бұрын

Al Pal LMAAOOOO

"You're mistaking whatever the current trend in thought is for knowing more." Fucking brilliant quote.

Tom King: "i put myself into Batman" well that explains a lot now

@ComicGladiator

5 жыл бұрын

"What, like in Slash fiction?"

@Pelcurus

5 жыл бұрын

@@ComicGladiator I will always hate you for getting that joke in before I could.

@ComicGladiator

4 жыл бұрын

@@Pelcurus It's not how quickly it gets in...it's how long it stays there.

@JR-ju3kj

4 жыл бұрын

I don't know how wise and recommendable of an idea putting yourself into characters is. Mind you, many people do do it. Jack Kirby did it with Captain America(Kirby practically was a real-life Captain America and was even a World War II veteran who saw combat just as Cap did) and The Thing from the Fantastic Four. Frank Miller did it with Batman.Todd McFarlane has said for years that Spawn is basically him(but that's a little different because McFarlane CREATED and OWNS Spawn, Tom King only just writes for Batman). I think it depends on what kind of person you are. I wouldn't put myself into any comic book character that I write but that's just me.

The fact that Frank of all people is defending Superman is kinda nice. Frank wrote 2 stories where it was nothing but Batman being his favorite, and in The Master Race he blind sided me with an awesome Superman moment.

@greendaleforever

5 жыл бұрын

Superman Year One! First book was great, he really loves and GETS the character!

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Angry Robot true

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Raindrops Keep Falling on My Head facts

Everyone on that stage is just helping Frank Miller roast Tom King mercifully.

@EmoEmu

5 жыл бұрын

And it was glorious.

I'd LOVE to hear Frank Miller's take on Heroes in Crisis lmao

@brawler5785

5 жыл бұрын

I can't believe Tom King destroyed my favorite comic book character in just nine issues.

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Raindrops Keep Falling on My Head Hahahaha same

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

You're Pretty Bad same

As much as I dislike his stories over the past two decades, Miller seems to have a much better understanding than many people writing the character today.

Listening to Frank, talk about batman compared to everyone else is clear Frank truly loves his craft.

Sean Gordon Murphy is a class act. Loved seeing him give Frank Miller the respect he deserves in respect to his work on Batman.

Do none of these modern writers understand that as Bruce Wayne, he extremely charitable individual. Who turns his corporation to pushing technology and medicine, and often gives to the police.

@dabossman5650

5 жыл бұрын

Michael Connor A lot r writing early Batman stories

Miller telling King that Superman is just a mentally healthy hero must have cut King deeply considering King can only write deeply disturbed and self destructive main characters (His Batman, Vision, Mr. Miracle, etc).

@plungecomics

5 жыл бұрын

Miller basically spoke from a knowledge-based place as a story teller and King came across as someone who doesn't know who Batman or Superman are. Its probably why I instinctively and unconsciously stopped reading his run a couple books in. And Batman is in my top 3 of all time greats.

@mrdrfly8336

5 жыл бұрын

@@plungecomics I purchased the majority of Miracle Man comics but never finished the run when it came time to actually read it. The art is gorgeous at least....

@sarahferris7892

3 жыл бұрын

Superman Up In The Sky rules though... Same with King's short story in Action Comics #1000

@MrAngerissues1

6 ай бұрын

Who let that clown TOM king on that stage?😂

Frank Miller showing why he’s the boss.

Clearly Tom King never read John Byrne's Superman comics and the only way superman can be boring is if wrote it. I like how the legend Frank Miller owns him when he says something idiotic. King doesn't care about batman or comics he just writes to pander to a audience that isn't there.

@JR-ju3kj

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, Miller owned King several times in the conversation. Especially on the part about realism. I don't read Batman or any other comic for that matter-for realism. I intend to write comics in the future and while I'll have SOME realism in them, it will only go up to a certain point. Reality is overrated,anyways and as Thanos said in Avengers:Infinity War, reality can often be disappointing. I see enough of reality every day.

30:33 "The whole point of working with the Batman character is that there is a core to that character. There is a core, and you can't....I mean you're responsible to the fans, you're responsible to the people who came before you NOT to destroy that core. And if you do then your story loses its stakes. If I'm writing a Batman that doesn't mold to that point of Batman then I'm just writing sort of bad fanfiction" LOOOOOOOOOOOL THE ABSOLUTE IRONY XD

Frank Miller roasted King. Also Mr. Miller was on fire and laughed about the killing of the Robin's.

Holy crap, I didn’t realize how much Tom King misunderstands Batman

@pat2430

5 жыл бұрын

He writes batman as he would a sucide letter.

@spaceknight793

5 жыл бұрын

At around the 33 minute mark, King shows he pretty much misunderstands superheroes in general.

@ardius9777

4 жыл бұрын

@milster never forget

Very revealing discussion. Looking at the defeated posture of King, his Batman now makes a lot more sense to me.

The most coherent miller's been for 20 years

Miller of all people rekting King with just the simple explanation of he's just a mentally healthy hero

Brilliant quotes from Frank Miller here. He truly understands Batman and this is why he dislikes King. King states in his own ego: "Batman would always win; the only one Batman loses against is his writers. We have the power, right?" Miller: "Or his heart." Batman DOES lose, but not in the way people think. This is what makes Batman so enduring and tragic. He can, through his mind and strength overcome everything, but the heartache and loss remains. It is also what drives him.

I loved watching all these guys in the same room talking about Batman. Made my day.

No one: Frank Miller: *I MADE ROBIN A GIRL*

@user-in1gv1uh2v

5 жыл бұрын

@milster I believe someone suggested to Frank to make Robin a girl.

@dabossman5650

5 жыл бұрын

Superdarkwater Comics It works whom tf cares

@dabossman5650

5 жыл бұрын

milster Not rlly

Spanish inquisition line from Frank just like the Sjw mob of today great analogy

This video makes me think Miller has seen D&C videos hahaha

Tom King in 2017: Batman as a character has a core. You're responsible to the fans not to destroy that core. Tom King in 2019: Wooooosh

@dabossman5650

5 жыл бұрын

Dead Head 😹😹😹😹

Frank Miller called the Robins “canon fodder” 😂😂😂😭😭😭

Frank Miller is the greatest.

About to get a lot more views since the D&C video just dropped.

@deestttone791

5 жыл бұрын

Ya Boi..!

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

smartrn1 lmfaooooooo

@Pelcurus

5 жыл бұрын

About 2000 in from when I started counting last night.

@bencarljamin3571

5 жыл бұрын

Right here.

@zoompt-lm5xw

5 жыл бұрын

Present!

Lot of Tom King hate here. I really enjoyed his first three storylines, but it all went to mush when it started the long, boring build to the non wedding. Then got totally mashed when it started the long, boring build to his endgame. Which then had 15 issues cut from it...15 issues is a lot of story to just cut...wonder how much of that will seamlessly end up in the maxi series. I think he’s got talent, but he is so obviously suffering from depression or anxiety. He needs some help, because as ineffective and not batman as his batman is, I genuinely feel there is talent there, possibly buried between whatever else is in his headspace. I’m only here because ya boi sent me.

@ferrarriohh

4 жыл бұрын

I think he really needs a writing mentor, as he says things that ARE worth exploring but no one is telling him that. The aspect about torture and waterboarding being ineffective measures was cool, and would be insightful things to put back into his stories.

James Tynion's moustache looks like some kind of batarang

Despite what Tom King did to Batman I hope he gets well. Depression is a terrible thing to go through.

@albertogarcia305

3 жыл бұрын

I think he enjoys being depressed man. He loves reveling in his sadness. He doesn't seem like he wants to be better.

Uncle Frank chose the right time to be sober that day.

God I didn't think I could hate Tom King more

@095mateusg

4 жыл бұрын

@@brandonhern Is it alright to hate him as an author your majesty? One who has single handedly ruined the Bruce/Selina dynamic in modern comics by making one of them a retarded manchild, and the other a bipolar walking contradiction. I ask because you seem confortable telling people what to think so you must be some sort of authority right.

@jackolas2007

4 жыл бұрын

haa haa haa

2:51 - Tom King tries to look cool by pretending he understands Miller's Nietzsche reference, but gets the wrong reference (Miller's reference was obviously to "what doesn't kill me makes me stronger", not, "and if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you. "). What a putz.

@Air_Serpent

5 жыл бұрын

I was wondering if I was confused about staring into the abyss reference.

@gurugeorge

5 жыл бұрын

@@Air_Serpent It does actually apply to Batman too - "be careful if you fight monsters, etc.," - and in fact Miller himself has played with that idea. But Miller was clearly responding to King's "he's had a tough time but pulled through" point.

Miller and Murphy bright past and bright future!

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Eldagusto yup

Frank is so good here, damn!

“ *Bags of Robins* “ 😂😂😂

Miller is a beastttttttttttttt love it

Came here from Diversity and Comics This is hilarious

Absolutely love this, this is a much watch for fans of Batman and other superhero comic books.

Tom King also doesn't understand Superman (or superheroes historically). He thinks they must be broken somehow. They do not. For decades, most superheroes became superheroes because they were decent people who believed in helping other people, making the world a better place. That King cannot connect with that tells us a lot more about himself than Superman. Apparently King only sees the selfish, miserable side of life.

@greengorilla6325

3 жыл бұрын

I mean Tom King did write Up in The Sky, which is great

battle of the guys who appropriated batman as their alter ego. miller wins because his batman was at least a man of action who kept his own counsel, and possessed some kind of dignity (even at his most infantile).

late to this, but I think everyone had very unique and interesting ideas. Frank was super interesting and coherent here, and I think he'd be a great editor given the opportunity. reading the comments, I dont get all the King hate. I think his Batman run had some very unique and interesting ideas. I liked 85% of it, and I think it will be a run that a lot of people revisit in the future. His Mister Miracle and Omega Men runs are some of the best modern comics I've ever read, maybe even instant classics. also, White Knight is amazing and Tyrions Detective run might be my favorite currently. I think all these writers had real unique voices and I want to see how they interpret the character

Really loved all the Frank Miller one liners. Robin: Boy Wonder, Moving Target.

This was enjoyable to watch.Tom King seems to use the CIA thing too much and in a way to heap more importance on himself.The real "King"of Batman comics is Frank Miller and Tom is not worthy .Sean Gordon Murphy though is the real deal and is already showing he is a worthy successor.

Wow. I always thought Tom King would sound like a bitch, but this is unreal. But I understand why I don't like King. He has no imagination. "Superman is boring. Mr. Miracle is boring". No Tom King, YOU are boring. Other writers have been able to look at these characters and see potential and wind up writing great stories. Seems like King is just narrow-minded and can't write anything unless he has directly experienced it. That's why he's always writing everyone like a depressed sitcom character. Under King, Batman is the most popular beta-male superhero.

@idleeidolon

5 жыл бұрын

tom king: can't write anything unless has direct experience. also tom king: doesn't bother to get life experience. instead writes every hero as a poor cypher of his depressed broken self.

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Handsome B. Wonderful so true

@JR-ju3kj

4 жыл бұрын

Great post. Superman isn't boring at all. Superman is only boring if the people who are writing and drawing the character are boring and don't understand the character. The fact that King said that Superman is boring, showed me that he doesn't understand Superman. No one who understands Superman as a character and who is a fan of the character would have ever said something like that about him. It's similar to how are all of the people who thought that Aquaman was lame, a joke and just some guy who talked to fish didn't have the first clue about understanding the character.

I gave up Batman before issue 50 because of Tom Kings’ neurosis

I think I would love to read DKRs original draft

Miller os Savage, I loved it

Fuck I love Frank Miller

@MakThaNife

5 жыл бұрын

impossible not to

Tom king looks like he's about to cry even when he laughs.

Apart of me enjoys everyone of these guys and how they contributed to the character of Batman.

After seeing Tom King in person, I understand why his comics suck. This dude needs some therapy before he should be allowed to write again.

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

michaelgerard2 for real

@JR-ju3kj

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah and maybe he should start working out,too. Have a sound body and mind-like Batman.

Where's Scott Snyder!?

@Lemondoor

6 жыл бұрын

These writers were at Comic Con.

@chinyereugwu9431

6 жыл бұрын

Scott is a big dude. He like Grant Morrison was interviewed solo dude.

@davidaaronartist

6 жыл бұрын

in the audience eating popcorn

Interviewer: Ridiculously wealthy... Tom King: hehehehhehehehhhe

This amazing

Tom King saying he made Batman happy....

@ashearer88

5 жыл бұрын

Hard Boiled Entertainment trying to be happy

I have to say, most what Tom’s saying doesn’t process for me. I think his best points were made very early on, then Lots of double speak, sadness & also happy(?), self-insertion (?) and while i feel like he has some points they don’t align with Batman. I think that approach works better for showing how others in Bruce’s life would think & feel. But Batman’s stoic. Brave and the Bold. The events that shaped him at a young age, and later the responsibility of his father figure role, it would give a great amount of emotional maturity, he’s a blade forged in fire, and probably colder, more than anything.

tom king: destroyer of myth.

Ya'boi

Tom King is Mark Waid and Dan Slott’s baby

Did Tom King select those chairs because they really look painful and uncomfortable to sit on, also wtf with the moderator dude Henry Faulkner trying to shove his shitty politics into the conversation XD

Frank miller will always be my favorite comic writer I don’t care about the lies and myths about him

30:35 to 30:58 Someone should tell that to Rian Johnson about Luke Skywalker.

@KnightHawk1990

5 жыл бұрын

Tom king should try taking his own advice.

@thesoulbearer

5 жыл бұрын

Moeez R. Hear! Hear! He doesn't really seem to live by example.

Tom King's batman is so awful fans give up.

The only one who's not chuckling like a bird through out the whole panel is Frank Miller who also seems like the only adult in the room.

This panel is an example of why comedy in comics is terrible. Modern comics are written by people with absolutely no sense of humour or drama. They all seem to think that the tragedy is the character, rather than tragedy being a jump off point. Very modern mindset of "My disorder is my identity". As much shit as Frank gets, he is an eccentric, and he knows how to write for a character. He writes to do the character justice, rather than to interject himself into the story under a veil. King and Tynion cannot talk about a character without saying "me" or "my" every few words. Pining for their own celebrity standing rather than earning it through groundbreaking writing. Bunch of bores. Miller is the only remotely interesting person on that stage, and his resumé is there to speak for him if you don't fancy the words coming out of his mouth.

@johnjackson9767

5 жыл бұрын

Agreed

@snakeyman5560

Жыл бұрын

I think Sean Gordon Murphy is pretty level

I want more of Duke Thomas as the Signal.

Kinda want to read the version of TDKR where Batman dies to a hail of police bullets. Also the dislikes are all Tom King

I don't like Superman: Year One but dear god Frank Miller is just a national treasure, no matter his past missteps. He can just own a room with an offhand joke. Somewhere underneath whatever's wrong with him now that perfect Batman writer is waiting to pop out and write one more great one as his last curtain call.

7:48 Wow! Disrespecting the Robins to make Duke look good isn't a very good idea, especially Jason. It's sad to think that the only writers who treat Jason with respect and care are Scott Lobdell and Netherrealm. The writers of Mortal Combat care more about Jason than the actual DC writers. This is sad.

@Slasherhorror1980

6 жыл бұрын

It's called humour dude relax...cartoons on a page don't get offended.

@endrelko2885

5 жыл бұрын

But the batfandom will, don't understand why they're so rude towards the most interesting part about DC in general. They invented sidekicks no less

@EhudJonathan

5 жыл бұрын

I don't mind Jason, but let's be real 1) he should've stayed dead and 2) is essentially Punisher with a mask. He serves no real purpose and I don't know why he has to keep getting shoved into the spotlight.

@mr.everwind5225

2 жыл бұрын

Scott lobdell has tanked all potential Jason ever had, he is the problem

I didn't "get" all the Robin jokes in this - isn't Damian like the 4th Robin? and no-one cares about Signal. Murphy's Duke Thomas is much better.

And then Tom King wrote Up in the Sky after this which is amazing

Man I need some Frank Miller shit talking rn.

12:12 #FrankMiller: _Duas coisas sobre isso. Uma é que ele nunca faria isso porqu_ .. #TomKing: _Eu pensei que ele fosse um mito. Nós podemos fazer o que queremos com ele_ . *hahahahahahahahh* que demais, poderia ficar assistindo esse video por horas!!

As much as I don't like Frank Miller's Batman in any freaking sense, his caoacity to endure criticism is legendary. Tom King contradicts himself each time.

Frank Miller is the only "creator" up there worth a damn. Damn, modern comics suck.

@joshpecker4352

5 жыл бұрын

Sean Gordon Murphy is pretty good

@sharavy6851

2 жыл бұрын

White Knight is pretty good

I was gonna make some lame joke about Frank Miller's nose and getting older but then I discovered he's only 63. 0_0

Superman 31:06

Batman hopes to properly train this new Robin.

Man, whoever picked authors just a few yrs ago really botched things imo. Id have handed Tom King Superman, and Brian Michael Bendis Batman. BMB’s street level heroes, always interesting. Tom’s bored by Superman, but id have instructed him to pair his Mr Miracle to a man like Clark, and let him explore that “hope” he pointed out very early on. Scott Free is an exceptionally exciting escape artist, but his childhood on Apokolips made him that way. I do see him an analogue to Clark in many ways, and i dont think he knows that because of his New Genesis heritage, he’s actually a powerful alien himself, (with a complex Father-Son dynamic) like if Superman had Batman’s origin. He’s actually smarter, faster, stronger, etc than an ordinary human, while also master of sleight of hand, illusion, lock-picking, etc.

Crazy that James T is only 30 years old. I definitely do like his interpretation in Detective Comics. For King i feel like the stories start well but always end poorly. Hes definitely super talented and is most likely in my top 5 writers but I always feel a bit disconnected from his Batman.

My boi Zack brought me here xD

@ashearer88

5 жыл бұрын

Spy Soldier oh shit dude that makes you a big deal.

Tom is a good writer, but he has an extremely narrow approach to the stories he writes. He just has a specific style and tone that he doesn't change. That is fine , but he should just pick projects that SUITS that style and tone and not force it on already established iconic characters.

Where is Chuck Dixon?

@christopherwinner4

5 жыл бұрын

@Carlton Banks I know that to be true but I'm going to convince others dc and goolag actually hate women so much they didn't want the man responsible for such empowered vixens as the Birds of Prey being accounted for. Guess it's "get woke, get Tom King the walking joke"

@briannxx

5 жыл бұрын

milster Ladies they are not

No, Snyder or morrison.

Never conform to social pressure! Too be or say anything that goes against the dominant Orthodoxy of Hollywood is actually courageous because it contains risk. Contrarians are vital in society whether an Atheist in a Christian town or a Christian in an all atheist town the ability to go against the grain while people call you stupid is a vital character trait

@idleeidolon

5 жыл бұрын

don't use nonconformity as an excuse to not bother improving yourself and live up to what you could be.

@briannxx

5 жыл бұрын

Moist Von Lipwig Define improve? Conformity was how National Socialism & communism came to power. Liberation of human mind by heaving dead cats into sanctuary’s vs conformity I’d encourage dead heaving for we have allot of secular sanctuaries today that have become just as Religiously dogmatic and conformist as the ones of old

@idleeidolon

5 жыл бұрын

@@briannxx i don't have to define improve for you. that would be authoritarian. and if you take someone else's definition of improve, that would be conformist. if you say improve is a construct and doesn't really exist, that would be post-modern and nihilistic. thing is, that little voice inside you. the one that makes you feel guilt? that thing knows what improve means. listen to it.

Soyboy Tom King got his @ss handed to him by Frank Miller. Lol

@777superlightwater

5 жыл бұрын

Johnny Marvéll lmfao

Painful to listen to Tom King now.

First mistake, mister King, myth doesn't mean you get to do whatever you want with it, but that you have the responsibility to honour what has been part of that myth and play with it in new and interesting ways. Second mistake, to put yourself into the myth because then you write for yourself and alienate the elements that universally resonate with the world, and third mistake, stating a character is boring because you don't understand it. To me, that means you don't even know what you're doing and shouldn't be writing comics. Good you're out of Batman soon. Hope you're out of writing comics so you stop mirroring yourself in the characters to destroy the myth by doing with it "whatever" you want. Good day to you, sir.

Why is Tom King even there?

Tom King projecting his depression and hope for all to be as weak as him mixed with far left politics has made me hate Batman because he is nothing but Tom King in a Bat suit

47:24 this is beyond cringy

Man Frank just doesnt fly with the robins.

Bob Kane created Batman, but Frank Miller gave him a personality.

@colemanlee2529

5 жыл бұрын

​@milster Yeah, I considered writing something more nuanced that included Denny O'Neil & Bill Finger, but sometimes bold & simple is more fun. Despite the weird sequels, DKR had a massive impact. Frank also redefined Daredevil's personality. By the way, ASB was totally redeemed in my eyes by the ninth issue, where Batman realizes he's being an awful influence on Robin and needs to start over their relationship. The series is a satire and critique of grim and gritty.

@user-in1gv1uh2v

5 жыл бұрын

Bill Finger created Batman too.

@colemanlee2529

5 жыл бұрын

@@user-in1gv1uh2v I know, I was just simplifying things for a one-liner.

@user-in1gv1uh2v

5 жыл бұрын

Ah ok.

No lower 3rds to identify these guys?

Tom kings mister miracle was a masterpiece

Get rid of King, Bendis and Didiot. Otherwise DC will be up shit creek without a paddle.

@fiannawolf

5 жыл бұрын

@milster Plus they arent even promoting any of the decent titles that are left. Guess those paddles will give away even quicker. Part of me just wants to see everything hard reset like the old ET landfill days of videogames.

@ardius9777

4 жыл бұрын

@@fiannawolf Forget giving them away, try nuking the paddles into another dimension from Andromeda. You git your wish buddy, they just announced another reboot after they literally crashed Rebirth with no survivors. Here's to hoping they that 5G isn't dead on arrival like the Nu52.

@fiannawolf

4 жыл бұрын

@@ardius9777 Yea, the more I hear about this 5G thing the more I am noping out of most if not all Trad Publish comics. Rebirth brought me back in, Didiot, Bendis and the rest are currently saving me about 200 bucks a month in comics right now. Only silver lining in this whole thing.

I hate google