To see you having fun with a machine you can finally trust again. That is a good feeling.

If it were my machine I'd be getting up in the middle of the night just to go into the workshop just to sit and stare at it!....................great news Seon!

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Hahaha, I've been getting up at 5am ;)

I am so happy for you. I hope you will be enjoying your production runs for a long time to come and the exciting new projects you can do with all your energy.

Glad to see you smiling again! Congrats, Seon! All the best and may this machine bring a lot of joy :)

That is amazing Seon. You certainly deserve this after all the troubles you have had. A fantastic peace of mind that you can concentrate on things that matter and let the machine do the job it was intended to do.. AWESOME!!!

Your happiness really shines through during this video - Understandable! I would be all giddy watching this machine work and the sounds of valves and motors 'manufacturing' really is fantastic :D Congratulations on your success - you've more than earned it!

Wow, Seon! That's incredibly nice for a first run on a new machine. Can't wait to see it working after you've had a chance to tweak positions and heights and stuff. Congrats!!

I am REALLY glad to see you've finally a working PnP machine. 2020 is not a bad year after all. I can not wait for an optimised PnP run video.

Great to have something you can depend on. You certainly are due a break. Looks like you will have a merry Christmas. Stay safe.

Really good to hear you enjoying your work!

Congratulations to the successful first run! Feeling relieved with you!

Nice when you get a tool that can do what it is supposed to do glad you are happy with your new machine

My faith that a professional & reliable home based PNP machine that is actually affordable for a small business has been restored by watching this! Been following the PNP game since Neoden released their first machine. Looks like they nailed it with this design. Keep the high quality videos coming!

awesome result ! you upgraded from a fancy fair crane machine to an actual Pick and Place machine

Well aren't you mister fancy! Congrats, ending this crazy year on a high note. Well done. Looking forward to your upcoming progress.

Great news Seon! Wish you the best with this pnp!!

So happy for you mate, you deserve a good machine and this one seems to be meeting the brief!

Glad to see things working as expected. Excited to see more!

This is great news! Glad it worked on the first try. Awesome quality.

great job. and the speed is now without optimizing already great. nice to see. this is great.

Great to see a machine that works. Congratulations.

So pleased see you've got a machine which works!

So happy for you mate! Let's get some making done 😎🐨

Great to see this working. From what you said, it seems like after the machine arrived, you couldn't sleep until you got it to the stage where you'd know whether your long nightmare was over!

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Yup, I had to know as soon as possible if I had broken my PnP curse! :)

Really happy for you, Seon. It’s night and day the difference.

Congratulations! That went really well. It makes me want to get one, but I should come up with a product first...

Congratulations! This looks great. I am glad you found a working machine finally! :) It is on par with the results I am getting with my Quad 4000C. I love how the NeoDen is so nice and quiet. The vibration feeders are always a pain in the butt though, even worse with ICs that love to climb onto each other. So I always try my hardest to not have parts in tubes if I can avoid it. That said, I bet you will learn more details about the machine and optimize the assembly time and pickup reliability over time, but that is just the remaining 1% that is how it should be if you ask me. Again, I am so happy for you! :)

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

I've now sourced and ordered JST and STEMMA connectors on reels ;)

Looking forward to a full series on this machine. Our 24yo pnp machine just died and will cost almost as much as a new machine to get back up. So we are looking at new machines now.

This is so good to see! Awesome!

Wow that's so amazing to see compared to what you produced before this! Those 'crooked' parts will probably reflow just fine and center out during that

Congrats on the new PNP! Looks great! If I have increased production requirements I will get one.

Yay! Very happy for you. And, in time for x-mas.

Very happy for you Seon!

An absolute world of difference from the scamhigh. Congrats Seon, it's great to see you happy :)

That intro says it all. This makes me smile. Now I want one but I have no where to put it. :'(

Great news . Glad you had a win finally.

Congrats on the new machine and glad to hear you happy. Maybe you should send the video to charmhigh! Then again, maybe to Neoden and see what they say about how you can improve things.

mesmerising to watch, its better than watching 3d printing time-lapse --- and this is at real speed. You have one very impressive robot there - and its building lil robot brains........ Seon the Mass producer!!!!

I’m glad it’s finally working out

It’s really a pleasure to watch this machine in comparison with the crappy charmhigh. And this result after one day is incredible. I hope that you now can produce your boards without any hassle and move on to new interesting projects in the future.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Michael! That is also my hope!!!!

awesome result Seon and that was 60%. Imagine 80% or 100%!!

Good for you! I bought a NeoDen4 and IN6 based on your issues with Charmhigh. My NeoDen4 had accuracy just likes yours out of the box. Unfortunately I haven't had a lot of time to use the machine yet. There were some minor manufacturing issues from NeoDen. Nothing that couldn't be resolved. They are quick to return emails. NeoDen seems like a good choice for PNP machines.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, Neoden support is pretty great. they show they really care about their machines and their customer support!

You might need one or two (under) support pins in the middle of the pcb to stop the bouncing. Great to have such a accurate outcome on your first pass. Hope this new unit gives you back some time for family and new projects. A layer of clear double-sided tape on front of vibration feeder can help with feeder tubes positioning. The volume level on the video could indicate the amplitude it vibrates at, is likely at a far higher level than it needs to be to move parts to pickup point. Setting placing program if it allows to put IC's down first, then connectors, other parts, then the smaller passives last, will help with not having tiny parts under costly parts or things where noticing an out of place passive would make fault diagnosis difficult.

WOW picks and places. 👌👏👍👍

I TOLD YOU SO. *grin* I love my Neoden... and I think it will serve you well Seon.

Congrats Seon!

Amazing!

Day of awesomeness!

The thumbnail makes me happy

I can guarantee that if I ever buy a pnp it will not be a craplow. And I might fancy a neoden.

Amazing, what an improvement in quality! 😱 I might have to start outsourcing my SMD boards to you mate!

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

hahaha

@Cybernetic_Systems

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker in all seriousness, if you get to the point where you have capacity for small runs, let me know.👍

It's amazing what happens when you get hold of someone that actually knows what they're doing.

Glad it's going well.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

Excellent. :-)

G'Day N8!

Great news Seon. I know this will help you in your production. If any questions, do not hesitate to ask.

But the real question is how many parts are on the floor? But in all seriousness, that panel looks phenomenal and the video w/ the lid closed was perfectly clear. Great to see that the Neoden was is working great and looking forward to seeing your journey as you optimize this. For a follow-up, might I suggest a comparison of 60% vs 100% speed to see if the accuracy drops? This looks pretty solidly built so I don't suspect it will, but it could make for an interesting watch.

its a money printing machine! ;) very happy for you mate hopefully you will be getting more quality sleep these days

Great to see the amazing results! Obviously you chose well, but why did you pick that model instead of Neoden 4, or something like a Small SMT 2800? I'm looking at getting a small scale production PNP in the near future so I'd be interested to hear what made you get that specific one. 🙂

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

My current production requirements are not "small scale qty" and I wanted something that would future proof me for a while and that I could really flex my capabilities with. 8 heads, fast, reliable 0201 and support for mixed pneumatic and electric feeders.

Yay

Do you think the S1 would have worked eventually? How do you compare the two? What was the price difference? I have a Neoden 4. It does not appear to pick up the components as well as this machine.

Thanks for your sharing, SO I got some question to ask you about machine when start Mounting Feeder not feed to machine pick, so what going on with it? And I ready check on fuse it is ok How we should do more?

No stopping you now Seon !!!....

On the one hand I want a PNP machine on the other, hand soldering PCBs is one of the things I enjoy most about the hobby.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

I also enjoy hand assembly, but not when I have to make thousands of boards- that kinda sucks the fun out of it ;)

@oliverer3

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker yeah I can definitely see that getting tedious haha :)

Long ago I heard this: Remember that long after the joy of a low price is forgotten, the annoyance of poor quality is remembered. An early christmas gift it seems - lots of joy and happy moments with it :ø)

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

True! But I didn't buy the CHMT based on price, which made it even more disappointing when it was rubbish.

HI Unexpected Maker, love your videos! Question... You've had the Neoden K1830 for nearly 2 years now, is it still the best thing since sliced bread? Have you had any problems (technical or support)? I am on the market for an SMT machine and keen on your thoughts now you have had yours for almost a couple of years mate. Cheers from NZ.

Congrat; how do you feel about it after about 4 weeks of using this machine, and do you recommend it. I'm thinking to buy one here in the US.

Well done mate. After all the stress of the past you can now spend your time making instead of fixing

Make a ' chear sheet " of component heights when you set up for things like the JST connector. Most, if not all of similar parts would need an ajustment when you start new board designs, and faster knowing the refrence speed/height/placement/pickup-hold values from this ( and other boards ). Definitly way better than playing scramble after every run to recover expensive components.

incredible! why is it placing 1 board at a time? Is this because of nozzle sizes are all different?

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

it's because I am using the N8 software to panellise the placement, so a single board turns into 8 and get's done 1 at a time, just like JLC panellise a single board into a panel.

Hello I am going to buy neoden 8 pick and place can i know if i should go for it and should i buy pneumatic feeders or electronic feeders? your help would be really appretiated.

Which is a rating for the machine from 1 to 10? How much is really speed CPH in work? Whether you are satisfied with the precision and which smallest components it can mount? You have very great videos, thanks for that.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure I cover most of that here :) kzread.info/dash/bejne/Yp1t1KRmpZDUn8Y.html

Hi Seon, I have a question relating to the Neoden 8 Pick and Place Machine. I have watched your videos (you are very inspiring!) and have read through the comments (your community is wonderful!) but have not seen anything that details why you changed from Neoden 8 to the new Juki machine. I read a post on EEVBlog that said it was having problems but there is nothing of substance. Are you able to provide a little context on why you stopped using the Neoden 8 and maybe how you felt about it after a few years of using. Thanks Heaps.

I am planning to buy all the line ( stencils , P&P, reflow ) , following you videos with a big interest what about wave or selective or dip machine for thru holes ?

@Tupeutla

3 жыл бұрын

have you been in contact directly with Tonny at Neoden ?

my dream meshing bro...

Neat machine and placement. Btw did you place the fiducials on the PCB or does JLCPCB do it ?

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

JLC PCB panellised these boards, so they did the edge rails with the fidicuals.

@tecknologg2289

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker Ah I see. Well maybe you could ask them for the panelized gerbers and then submit it when you order. That way the fiducial placement can always be the same.

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Good idea!

looks definately more reliable than the craphigh... about 15 mn per board at this speed... just add a light inside ! the air expelled seems to make quite a noise too argh a JST jumped... it looked like it's going down too far when placing that connector, the board was flexing somewhat now go make some more so that Nate earns her keep ;-)

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

There are 2 super bright lights inside already.

@AmauryJacquot

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker hah. keeping the cover open may add reasons for vibrations. defeating the sensor shouldn't be hard

Can u deal with second hand machine or used machine

Electric feeder price for neo den 8 how much??

Did you hve any trouble getting it Off the pallet without a fork truck?

@UnexpectedMaker

2 жыл бұрын

I used a forklift to get it off. It can not be take off without sue form or lifting device.

@pmcgrorty

2 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker Thanks. Was confident for the K1830 @ 350kg could easily get this removed from the packing crate with only a couple of hand pallet trucks. Not so confident now with the N10 at 1 ton. :) We will sort something out though so we can do this at home (not the factory). Have a proper truck at work where it would have been a doddle.

Those chips soldered slightly not straight were due to PCB design and mask layout issue. 😁 Anyway, a beautiful board.

At 15:18, it looks like the high pin count IC is completely misaligned?

@UnexpectedMaker

Жыл бұрын

Nope, it was aligned to the pins - just the paste was offset a little, making it look like it was out :)

Whats this magic double sided tape you use? Is it like solder tape or something. Much confusion

@UnexpectedMaker

2 ай бұрын

Just dbl sided 3m tape.

@BeefIngot

2 ай бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker Ah, I for some reason got the impression this was like a doubke sided tape version of solder paste which sounded amazing.

Hello can anybody help with xy intialize error?

Not fantastic? Looks great!

And how many parts ended on the floor? None I guess 😁😁👍👍

Looks fantastic. ;) It's almost as if that company knows how to build PnP machines properly. lol

hello does anybody know about KAYO machines are they ok?

do you have electric or pneumatic feeders ?

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

I'm currently running pneumatic for 12mm+ feeders and the hybrid electric/pneumatic for 8mm. I do have some 8mm fully electric here, but they are not being used yet.

@Tupeutla

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker seems the pneumatic feeders are 4 times less expensive than the electric ones ( for 8 and 12mm) , then the price is the same after 16mm . ( or my chinese supplier made mistake on the quote )

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

@@Tupeutla Yes, electric are much more expensive than pneumatic.It comes down to what components you are wanting to feed. You can't reliably do small (0402 and similar size packages or below) with pneumatic unless it's a REALLY high end PnP, and then I'd still be going electric.

@Tupeutla

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker we are talking about 250+ yankee dollars for 8 / 12 mm , right ? ;)

HA HA! nice to hear you happy and like you say with a few more tweaks it should be perfect, so much better than your charming charmhigh crap :-)

You should do a side by side comparison

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

With what? The CHMT? That's never bring turn on again (by me) - ever ;)

@taftse

3 жыл бұрын

@@UnexpectedMaker I'm sure you have plenty of videos of it not doing what it was supposed to do. But happy to hear this new investment is working out for you

All that time coming up with puns for “Neoden” waisted! Congratulations Seon!

@UnexpectedMaker

3 жыл бұрын

Hahaha... go on, do it anyway!

The difference is absolutely chalk and cheese.

К 1830 удивился они очень старые . Времён СССР. Погуглил - arduino IDE их программировать может до сих пор. А тут не микросхема а станок по их распайке 😂

Well. Philosophically you've helped out many by showing how poor Charmlow is. Tried the rest now try the best.

Wow what an impressive machine this Neoden is! Gratz on finally getting a worthwhile machine :) Lol a thumbs down from ShamHigh no doubt!!

I know you keep knocking Charmhigh -- but you have not disclosed here that this machine is about 3X the cost of your older machine... Right? In fairness, you have upgraded to better equipment, and this is not an apples to apples comparison anymore. I think many of your parts are slightly off-center. You don't have fiducial markings on the board to line up on? Why not? What is your total cost for the machine and the feeders? Feeders are a big part of the price so, that is an important part of the investment. Are these proprietary NeoDen feeders? Or some industry standard?

Oh how different. Looks, sounds and behaves as a professional machine, not the hair tearing "toy" disaster as the Charm****!#$#** was. To have a first run come out as near perfect, before even making the typical optimisations is just great. That it is possible to get this result before really becoming familiar means it has few quirks and idosyncrosies. The multihead and camera systems seem to be working especially well, and positioning seems to remain spot on, not drifting over time. Not visible if any parts have skipped/fall down, which was one of the worst problems on th Ch..... Now you will not be sweeping up a fortune of parts all the time. Also can likely get production running to a schedule and expect to keep to schedule, withour needing 24/7 observation and rework. You are finally on the way,.

2 Failed components on the whole board! So much better!