If you are a new rider or a rider who wants to continue to grow (That should be all of us ;) ) and you are not a Member at MCrider you are missing out on the best part of MCrider. Go to www.MCrider.com/Member and get access to the Forums and Field Guide. - The Forum is an active, friendly place where riders share riding tips, ideas, travel photos, and show off their new motorcycles. Riders and instructors from all over the world are active on the forums and ready to share in the adventure with you. - The Field Guide is a section of the forums that have very specific training exercises that you can work on in any open parking lot to develop your riding skills. In addition to these resources, you can discuss every MCrider video, suggest future training videos, read and share gear reviews, and more. By becoming a member you help support MCrider and keep the weekly videos coming but you also get access to a world of riders who share tips and techniques to help us all enjoy the ride and increase our skills. www.MCrider.com/Member

@BeingHumanInSouthAfrica

3 жыл бұрын

I became a patron a while ago. Just joined the forum.

@MCrider

3 жыл бұрын

Glad to have you on board David! 👍🏻

@Stacy_Smith

Жыл бұрын

Off topic but same principle: I think the Marine Corps takes a little too much credit for their success. It takes a special civilian to CHOOSE the longest boot camp, most rigorous training, toughest physical fitness test, and all with hand-me-down gear. It takes an even more special civilian to not washout and earn the title of United States Marine.

I've been riding for nearly 40 yrs and a lot of irresponsible hooning in my youth(mountains, coastal roads etc). Also I ran my own rider instructing business successfully for many years too. I like your views on using the front brake lightly for 'loosely' called trail braking. I've always known Trail braking is from the rear as the rear is the trail, front braking would possibly be termed lead braking as in leading. You are correct in a lot of the explanation of the physics as to what is going on. Soft pressure from the front leading into the corner, after the main braking force has been completed, works. Using the front brake isn't what I'd say helps the turn in as it is loading up the front and taking the movement out of the forks. Yes this does shorten the steering rake and the wheelbase and technically it could help. The thing that does help the turn is the unloading of the front just before you are at the apex of the turn and getting on the gas as it allows the suspension to be light and accommodate any undulations of the road. Accelerating also gets the tyre turning faster and more grip is offered that way and with the gyroscopic force. Using the front in a corner is One, going to try to stand the bike up (as you have helped spread the contact patch of the tyre out more and loaded the suspension) and Two if applied too much and suddenly will make the front wash out. Same as using it and finding something loose and the same colour as the bitumen will make you go down fast too. What I have used and taught to those I knew who had the capabilities and the quest for knowledge is to hold that light pressure you talk about on the rear brake whilst leading into the turn and while in the transition of moving from braking to accelerating. Can I challenge you to take a lot of what you have spoken about using the front brake for leading into the corner and change it to applying it to dragging a little rear brake for Trail braking through the prep of a corner? This is after you have finished with the main front braking force to slow speed off. Hold the rear till the transition from braking to accelerating is done. Make another video next week about your findings if they are positive The rear brake is very forgiving and even with a reasonably firm application it will compress the front forks down but more evenly throughout the bike. I've used that plenty of times when over the speed limit and spotting cops, hit the rear firmly to take the speed off and it doesn't nose dive the front which doesn't give your actions away. Trailing the rear brake is also wonderful for going slow and making tight turns. Slipping the clutch a bit brings you into slow control for those U turns and carpark/parking lot turns as another viewer has commented. Same as for making stationary right or left turns across traffic depending where in the world you are from and what side of the road you drive on

I reallllllllly hope you get a change to go to Champ School as a student...I’m going back for their 2-day course next year...talk about trial braking at the highest level where current professional racers are the instructors. But yes I agree trail braking shouldn’t be taught to new riders...Nick and the guys at a Champ School don’t teach new riders at a formal state-wide approved beginner course, like you said it’s very different than people paying $2,000+ for a 2 day course or a buddy one on one. I talk about Champ School like a PhD level course and any beginner course is an 8th grade course and I also recommend riders take at least 2 or 3 courses and have at least 10k miles of experience before going to Champ School because they may be too overwhelmed by the information, riding on a track, around really fast riders, pro racers, etc. I also talk about trail braking as a tool...just because you’re taught it doesn’t mean you need it for every ride, on every corner, at every pace, on every bike. Practice all the techniques you’re taught but you may not need every tool at every moment. 😊👍🏼 hope we can work something out where I can come to Texas and go riding with you.

@iceman0502me

3 жыл бұрын

Sure would love to see a collaboration between MotoJitsu and MCrider! Both you guys (and a couple others) have made a HUGE impact on my journey into riding! Practice, practice, practice! Y’all teach that and I do as often as I can. I just started riding about a year ago and can out handle a bike over people I know with years of “experience”. Thank you for what you do!

@MCrider

3 жыл бұрын

I would love to go to Champion School!!! As far as I know they only offer the class on either coast. They need something in the middle of the country and I am there. ;)

@Ridelikeachampionycrs

3 жыл бұрын

@@MCrider we'd love to have ya! We have schools in California, Washington, Arizona, New Jersey, North Carolina, and Pennsylvania. As for trail braking, we teach this vital technique to all our students regardless of whether they are new to riding or experienced riders. We believe trail braking is crucial to having control and adjustability and emphasize that the degree of application depends on the circumstances (track/street/pace, etc) but the principles and advantages of having this in your toolbox don't change

@paulpease1788

3 жыл бұрын

That's cool. The only 2 guys I do patreon to on KZread actually communicating with each other.

@wobblysauce

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, don't need to use all the tools in your shed every day, but when you need it, it is there.

I've "Trail Braked" my entire riding life (40+ years), since before the MSF course existed around my area. My Dad, who rode an Indian 4 cylinder way back in the late 30's, taught me technique. Until a few years ago I didn't know I was doing anything differently.

I learned MSF's corner technique and naturally progressed to trail braking, really without thinking about it. I'll bet many people do the same.

@cisium1184

3 жыл бұрын

Yep. I was trail braking on a mountain bike for years without thinking about it. As I got more comfortable on a motorbike, I just fell right back into it.

@lorditsprobingtime6668

3 жыл бұрын

I started riding 52 years ago and developed my own style naturally over time, mostly by pure feel and as I progressed and was racing against mates on a few local mostly bush tracks my style developed more for the dirt if anything and even now there's a few slight differences between how I go into corners and pitch it around and mostly it's been based on: Yay, win,. Or bummer, that hurt and I really hate severe gravel rash. Or it varies depending on surface conditions, eg, if I can see and sand, gravel, oil, a wet patch or simply some over zealous road repair guy has sprayed pure smooth bitumen with no gravel I'm wary of that and in any of those situations I'm reluctant to be on the front brake at all once I start to lean. 1 (I think) advantage I had was earlier my first push bike since my parents were real tight arses with my brother and I they wouldn't buy me a pushbike so I'd wound up spending months scrounging around rubbish tips for parts and eventually managed to sand clean and paint and with some parts, get chromed and put together a 28 inch bike that was essentially was way too big for me but it was my first bit of freedom machine. One major thing though was I had a Sturmy Archer 3 speed hub gears and nowhere to mount any sort of brake without some welding and making bits to go together that was just beyond my early experience but did have front brakes so although it cost me plenty of skin a few times when pushing braking to the limit was essential due to circumstances and I had no other choice than using the front brake and HAD to push it to and sometimes beyond it's limit which then lost me more skin. Over these last 52 years of mostly just riding purely for fun or transport to a lot of racing on the dirt just amongst friends and anyone else that turned up plus some more serious club com petition short circuit and just a bit of road racing too I just grew into what worked and never really thought about much of it so could never really explain what I was actually doing because I just did it without thinking and adapted to changing conditions without even thinking too so I've never been great at teaching others any of the finer details since I never even think about what I'm doing since after this long it's all purely automatic. I only reasonably recently even had this trail braking explained to me and didn't even understand what the bloke was talking about for some time till one day I made a determined point of trying to just do things as naturally as possible without letting it interfere with what I just did without usually thinking and found I was trail braking a lot and even if I was on a really good tight and twisty mountain road if I was having fun and forgetting police even existed and pushing it I found I would often come in hard on the front brake progressively easing off the further over I leant but found I was even using the front to compress the front suspension then suddenly letting the front right off and sort of snapping it round at the same time using the rebound to actually help get that momentary extra bight to really whip it around that particular one. I've never been a good student at school or anywhere so pretty much everything is entirely learnt through experience but has worked well for me for most of those 52 years, at least up till a young idiot in a trendily and ridiculously jacked up Jeep wagon stupidly launched out in front of me while at highway (but legal) cruising speed with me only around 20 feet from him which did $16,000 damage to the bike including a cracked frame (the bastards just wouldn't write it off, so really messed up the best bike I'd ever owned by far, a BMW S 1,000 R that I absolutely loved and without going into the gory details suffice it to say that even all the doctors and nurses and even cleaning staff who saw me when they brought me into that hospital were sure I would be very soon headed to the morgue yet somehow after a couple of months in intensive care then more in the wards I eventually got out of there still badly damaged but alive and still keen to get back on a bike. I still do but can't justify the expense of a bike like that since I can't ride more than about 100 ks before it starts getting tool painful to enjoy any more which is really sad to me. I finally had the honour of owning the most insanely quick bike that did everything pretty much perfectly then thanks to a moment of someone elses stupidity I just can't ride sports type bikes at all now, my shoulders are too torn up for that extra pressure from the leaning forward positioning on them so I do still ride but not far and nowhere near as often. Sorry for the entire life story rant but it just kinda poured out, I fully understand anyone not bothering and thanks for tolerating me to anyone who does read that whole thing.

@SteveG-pf9mq

3 жыл бұрын

Absolutely correct. Time and experience are great teachers

@ezpoppy55

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed. It just seemed to happen, without a plan. And when it started happening, I felt like I had more control into, through, and past the turn.

@mickhunt1965ii

3 жыл бұрын

It's obvious when learned. What is also obvious is how nuts it is when one rationalizes prior errors. Trail braking on public roads must be a safety thing, track is time... on an open corner you shouldn't need to trail brake then, the speed should be right obviously. On a blind it's good to have it there to convert to a stop. I live in a rural area, the no. of times I have had to stop due to a hiding horse rider, a walker playing games, or a temp roadworks. On a national speed road this is serious. Nobody but a biker would even think about the consequences of what is coming round that bend - out of sight. Having a trail on converts to an emergency stop smoothly. That is the benefit where I live, having learned it.

I m really thankful to find channels like @Mc rider @Motojitsu @dandanthefireman @ride like a pro @ ride like a champion These have helped me alot to imrove my riding skills

I started using the trail-braking technique over the last year and a half... ever since your first (and other respected KZread videos) introduction on the topic. I now use it almost exclusively as well. So thanks for your original video... I was watching and learning back then.

@philipmartin708

4 жыл бұрын

I could have written an identical comment as yours. It took me a long time to overcome my deeply ingrained fear of continuing with some front break while leaning. I don't go wide anymore. I think trail braking should be taught to beginners. If it had been all these years, way fewer people would have died from going wide. For those of us who FINALLY started trail braking , we had to be grateful we learned it before it was too late.

The single best thing about trail braking is: even if you make a judgment mistake on a corner that is tighter than you expected....just squeeze the brakes a wee bit harder and scrub that extra 5 mph of speed. That is all the difference.

@omarsalgado9715

3 жыл бұрын

Tyres lose their traction well beyond and after any other part of the bike hits the ground, like the pegs, thus another option is to lean more if there is clearance. Trail braking is a technique for speed. If properly judged and taken a corner, the technique only leads to a decelaration below the capabilities of the bike and the rider. In the street and within speed limits, the SLPR technique is adequate and does not take more distance to come to a full stop. It is not implied that trail braking is not useful, but it does has its applications when riding joyfully. When trail braking is applied, the effect on the leaning of the bike is not due to having a close wheel base (this is secondary), but due to the gyroscopic effect and its deceleration (primary). Closing the wheel base on a cruiser is negligible for having it more leaned, for example. Anyway, streets are not for speed. Streets are not circuits. Both techniques are valid and with application in certain circumstances or riding modes.

@iceman0502me

3 жыл бұрын

Omar Salgado, good night! You need your own successful KZread channel. I’ll subscribe even if you’re misspoken

@omarsalgado9715

3 жыл бұрын

@@iceman0502me Believe what you want. Physics are first.

@iceman0502me

3 жыл бұрын

Omar Salgado I just re-read your comment. I apologize, I was out of line/misspoken myself, and did not intend to undermine your opinions and knowledge. I definitely agree that the streets are NOT for speed! Enjoy the ride safely...that’s what it’s all about!

@sjoerdeggenkamp4004

3 жыл бұрын

@@omarsalgado9715 Well, the point about trail braking is that you adjust your speed accordingly. If the corner is thighter than expected (if you look through the corner) you can spot it before you are there. In that little time (if you are trail braking) you can scrub 5 tot 10 kph without any problems. That is all the difference between a tight corner and an easy corner. For me it took away exactly those moments you describe, just push the bike down......with trail braking I never need to do that, because (like I said before) I have adjusted my speed before I''m actually in that tight part of the corner.

What a clear and concise discussion of an important technique. Thank you.

Excellent technical trail breaking explanation. Useful, indeed. Thanks Kevin.

"That's about as fast as I can talk here in Texas..." - good one! haahaha

@jemimawanjiru22

3 жыл бұрын

😂😂😂😂

@sailcraze

3 жыл бұрын

They haven’t heard Arkansaw yet.

@lukehoffman877

3 жыл бұрын

I dont get the joke. Help me out

@ErikaEmody

3 жыл бұрын

@@lukehoffman877 the stereotypical speech in Texas is super relaxed and drawn out. They aren’t in a hurry

@lukehoffman877

3 жыл бұрын

@@ErikaEmody that makes sense, thanks for the reply. I love this channel

Always learning new stuff from you. Love the information you provide. Gonna try this ever so cautiously on my next ride.

Thank You! I always appreciate your insight. I will practice this.

Thanks Kevin for this great video. This is the best explanation and teaching of trail braking I have seen. Will certainly start practicing it

When i took my msf class last year, the instructor told us to use the rear brake when trail braking and told us to keep our hands off the front break completely. I never knew it was backwards until i started watchkng your videos. Your videos have made me so much more confident in corners.

That was a great explanation of trail breaking. Thank you.

Great explanation of trail braking. Thanks Kevin.

You are always raising my game. Something to practice and experience. I have used this in sharp corners, not in all. Thanks for what you do.

Kevin, Thanks for this video, and talking up trail braking. Once that "Never touch the front brake while you're turning" was ingrained in me, and reinforced in every turn I made over the years, it took me a long time to overcome that fear, and get comfortable with trail braking. I agree with Nick that trail braking should be taught to beginners. I'd be willing to bet that way more people died from going wide than from low siding.

Great video. Hit some points I never thought about before

Thanks for the info. Riding on backroad twisties today and trail braked and noticed a positive difference. It will be part of my routine every time on my ride.

Great explanation of trailing braking and when to do so. Thanks.

Good points Kevin. It sure makes a difference and is just another tool to make one a better rider...

Perfect! Very well explained trail braking.....

I’ve been enjoying your teaching videos for over a year. I do enjoy them, and your teaching style.

@MCrider

4 жыл бұрын

I appreciate that!

Great video, Kevin! Smooth is fun! I love it when I get off my bike after stringing together hundreds or more smooth moments creating a near-perfect ride. I've never had a perfect ride!

Thanks for your good experienced advise.Might save a few of our lives.

Thanks Kevin. Good topic and you covered it well.

@MCrider

4 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

Kevin, thank you for your passion of riding and sharing your expertise. I’ve slowly introduced trail braking to my daily commute to and from work over a moderately curvy mountain road in Northern Alabama. This gave me the confidence to ride the “Tail of the Dragon “ where that technique comes in handy. See you on the road......

Fantastic explanation of trail braking. Thank you for sharing Kevin.

@MCrider

4 жыл бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Great simple explanation; I think I already do it without thinking about it..Thank you for explaining trail braking and including how front forks affect the turn..very very helpful

I have enjoyed your video, explained well, and very good information!

I learned something new to improve my riding skills! Thank you for another great video

@MCrider

3 жыл бұрын

Happy to help!

Trail breaking improved my cornering and confidence 100% Good to hear your explanation of the technique Kevin!! Cheers from NZ :)

Another great video, Kevin!

Thanks Kevin, great comparison and perspective. I tend to use extra following distance and slow before the corners so I don't often get into cornering trouble but I do use the trail breaking technique as it also keeps the break light on to help drivers see me. God bless and stay safe.

Your analysis of 2 different sets of students is spot on. Student intent, motivation, and cost are all factors with new riders. Continued education from quality instructors about riding techniques are key to becoming a good rider. MSF gets students through DMV, but in reality, not much more.

@MCrider

4 жыл бұрын

Well said!

Excellent explanation. Many thanks.

Kevin I’ve learnt loads from your videos. Over the years...and your points actually stay with me when riding... Keep it up amigo👍👍🇬🇧

@MCrider

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Anthony. 👍🏻

This is the best explanation of how to trail brake I've heard. I love how you explain how much brake to use by practicing in the garage. I've watched many videos trying to figure it out and now I finally understand it. I think I trail brake sometimes without thinking about it. I'm going to have to pay attention to it when I get my new brake hose and can ride again. Thank you.

Great advice Kevin... thank you. Clarification about "medium to advance" level riders is especially valuable. Thank you once more. Keep the vids coming and be safe all. Have a great rides ;). Best regards from me.

Throttle steering. I was taught this technique as part of race track training back on 2001. It seems to fall in with a combination of trail breaking. Using some of each can improve your control in cornering and help steer where you want to go better in conjunction with pressing on the bar side in the desired direction. I've not seen much info about it on you tube, but it was one of the best bits of training that have saved me from running wide a few times. From unexpected situations to mind wander, it will happen and knowing how to add throttle steering to your skill set can improve road strategy. The effect of throttling up and down, and controlling the rate, changes the lean or pitch, similar to doing this in an aircraft. Throttle up pitches nose up. Throttle down pitches nose down. Have you ever come across this in your trainings? Is it a subject to do a lesson on and offer ideas on how to integrate it with other steering techniques?

Well explained, Kevin! Thanx 4 that

amen on trail braking. I thought my linked brakes would make it bad, but its so much better

Great video!

I went through and MSF Basic Rider course several years ago. I have been watching your videos. I was driving may car one day and I discovered myself employing the slow, look, and accelerate as I was rounding a curve. I try to practice this technic even as I am driving a car so that hopefully it will become more of an instinct when I get on two wheels. In my mind the MSF course has made me a better driver too. Hope this makes sense.

I enjoy your videos Kevin, Thank You. Riding in my home state of Montana and back here in Iowa we deal with farm and tractor traffic dragging mud or gravel onto the roads. Three of my bikes are pre ABS brake systems and with my dead right hand trail braking is something I do not attempt. I rode long before I was blown up during my Army service, but is was never two-up riding. Now that I have a Lady I am responsible for I am practicing more techniques to control myself and the bike. Because I have no feeling in my right hand, grabbing the brake requires observation. For a new rider with physical limitations I suggest a great deal of parking lot practice time to get through the awkward. I have practiced a quick glance to know my fingers have the brake lever, then I check that mirror on my way to getting my eyes far out ahead of the bike. Whether this technique is "perfect" I pray I never find out the hard way. Using my foot/rear brake mostly works on everything except my 87 Goldwing. It's sunny and warm today so I am heading to the school parking lot to practice front brake use. HUMILITY! If you are concerned about what others will think of you if you get caught practicing, I believe you need to stick to a cage. As a rider for most of my life, other peoples opinions has never been my prime concern. Staying healthy, practiced and alive for my children, grand children and my Lady as well as myself is far more important then some body possibly ridiculing me. Be emotionally strong, practice and grow your self esteem while you enjoy this life style behind bars. You all are in my prayers. Hoka Hey

Good video, I completely agree with trail-braking...

I just got received my m class license and was bothering me that I was using my front brake during turns, cause I was taught differently. Glad I'm not the only one and that it isn't the wrong thing to do. Love the videos and thank you

Slow. Look. Trail break. Follow up speed.....Enough said. Thank you for your time Kev. Knowledge IS power.

Nice job on the man and canine cave, Kev - I thoroughly enjoy your videos - keep up the great work ... see you next Friday 👍🏻

Great Explanation!

I’m really glad to see this video. These concepts are really starting to come in to popular acceptance. With your endorsement and singular point of view, your audience will learn how to be more confident and safer, and maybe become potential teachers by example and rider to rider conversations of safer more satisfying motorcycle handling techniques. A rising tide floats all boats.

thats m8, I use both techniques, trail braking on down hills & fast country swipers, work well for me. and roll on up hills. I just seems natural to me. Thank you for your advice it's been a big help over the years, also what helped me was watching Motorcycle fails and not doing the same and larf n of course.

Have a lot of curves here in northern California, trail brake all the time. Great video. Keep them coming.

@motzoh

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, San Jose: Grant Rd from Aborn by mirassou vineyard all the way up to Mt Hamilton observatory was one of my faves in the 90s!

Thanks Kevin. Great advice for helping stay alive.

Absolutely, the same here, been doing this Kevin ever since you first introduced it, every ride is a practice session, only makes logical sense to continually do what you believe makes you as safe as possible, i had 2 riders following me on a group benefit ride once during one of those long curves that tighten up its radius beyond your sight, I with my wife, 2 up, came thru it, though tense, had I not been practicing this technique daily, we would have crashed, the two behind me did, they were blessed to be able to walk away though one was skinned head to toe. Trail braking definitely puts you in a better prepared condition for the unforeseen and when you mistakenly don't leave yourself enough reserve of your personal limitations.

Great content. Thank you.

I almost always use trail braking. However, I heard a guy some time back answer a write in question from a new rider, he asked if he could use the front brake in a corner if he was going too fast. He replied, "absolutely you can use the front brake in a corner" and basically left it at that. My immediate thought was that the new rider now thought it was ok to scream into a turn then GRAB the front brake in the lean to shave off the speed. Trail braking is great, but could be deadly if not explained properly. You did a great job at explaining it, and I pray that both of the people I was referring to watch this video. Well done, Kevin.

As a new rider I appreciate all advice that you can bring. Great information. I pick up my new bike I. 4 hours so I am excited and nervous about the whole thing 😂

after a 25 year hiatus, my 2nd bike is a 86 Goldwing 1200 and the fact that it's foot brake operates the front and rear brakes and using trail braking a lot, has helped me gain confidence and keep the bike upright not only during low speed ops, but also cornering where I feel I need to bleed some speed off.

Great video Kevin. I ve read quite a few of the comments and although most are in keeping with the theory behind trail braking, some point to the writers limited experience with the use of front and rear brakes in different settings. E.g. use of the respective brakes while performing slow speed maneuvers vs moderate and higher speed riding. Taking various in-structural courses goes a long way to improving our overall riding ability and increasing our understanding of various techniques including trail braking. I learn something with every one of your videos Kevin as you share your interpretations and insights. Thanks again.

Thank you for the instructions. Although i have been practicing this technique i was not sure if i was holding the brake properly

This is fantastic. When I first started riding (and for a time after) the conflicting info between NEVER TOUCH YOUR BRAKE IN A TURN and trail braking had my head spinning. I was terrified of using the brake in a turn and would panic when I found I was already in a turn and using the front brake without noticing. This will hopefully help others in the same confused state. Great explanation and comparison between techniques.

@mickhunt1965ii

3 жыл бұрын

been there too, horribile head trap isn't it? My answer was to be smart,, countersteer and apply front brake only on a wet road... erm, ah, learned the hard way. Got it. Ajuuu

@wobblysauce

3 жыл бұрын

And for that, most people don't even know the limit of the brakes... what they think is 100% could be only 50% of what the bike can do.

@gnarthdarkanen7464

2 жыл бұрын

Hate that myth, myself... I have a question... or three. 1. If you can't touch the brake, how do you stop the bike? -either brake 2. If you can't stop the bike ANYWHERE at ANY TIME and at YOUR WILL on the road, do you REALLY have control of it??? 3. If you don't have control of your motorcycle at ALL times, then how smart could you be to BET YOUR LIFE on surviving a ride??? Anybody's welcome to make it make sense to me... I just don't see it. While I don't necessarily recommend teaching trail braking to the new riders at an MSF course, I don't think they should be quite so aggressive about the brakes being so hazardous in curves and during turns. They should brush over it as a concept, but pre-emptively warn (as aggressive as they like) that it's an advanced technique... BUT it's HOW you use the brakes in turns, not whether you can or not. ;o)

Great video ... I love the term "maintenance throttle"!

@danielcharles4451

3 жыл бұрын

In Oz we call it “positive throttle”

I took the MSF course last March. After racing bicycles for 20 years, the Slow, Look, Press, and Roll technique was tedious to perform in the class. Most of the class I was using trail braking but didn't even know there was a term for it, it was just how I'd been entering turns that needed some slowing forever. It's nice to hear the reasonings for it. Thanks.

Interesting stuff. Thanks 😎😎

Thank you Kevin. Until a few years ago, 'slow, press, and roll' was my cornering technique. Then I adopted trail-braking, which has made a huge difference for me, especially on twisty mountain roads (which I always loved...but always caused me apprehension at the same time). Trail-braking into corners better enables a later entry point and with better control of speed and lean angle throughout the turn. Corners on unfamiliar mountain roads no longer cause me fear and anxiety. I now ride those roads with confidence...meaning, with a lot more enjoyment. And I owe that increased level of enjoyment entirely to trail-braking through the corners.

Thank you so much for providing this channel! I just recently discovered you and watched "the eye" story. I have a very good friend I like to ride with who has over 135,000 miles on an 02 Goldwing, and he is blind in one eye from a table saw accident. Your commitment to the US military and your willingness to share your faith in Jesus set you apart (for me) from so many other youtube channels. I'm trying to pump as much rider safety into my brain as possible as I am 68 yrs. old and just returned to riding after a 4 year break. I'm looking at doing some solo trips this summer camping off the bike in Wyoming and Montana. Just bought a low mileage DL650 and had to put it away because of the weather here in Iowa. Looking forward to watching all your videos these next few months while it's snowing outside. Thanks for your help, John A

I hadnt heard about trail braking till this video. Going to give it a try.

I was instructed a good few years ago now and my instructor drummed in to us “if you approach any junction, obstacle or any corner. In the correct gear and correct speed. Then you will be able to negotiate it safely” You can never have too much training, in my opinion. Thanks.

I’ve been riding for one year now, and I just did another MSF course a few weeks ago. Many of the students had never been on a motorcycle. I totally agree with you, to teach trail braking successfully in the allotted time would have been very difficult. I do wish there were more intermediate-advanced courses. Finding one in my area locally has been very difficult, and I don’t have the money to do Champ School (yet). Although that is my goal.

Great video. Great explanation. I believe both techniques have advantages. Slowing down before the turn buys you time and distance. That is definitely best. Learning to brake in the corner gives you more options. If you are not driving at 100 percent into a corner you will always have traction in reserve to brake actually allowing you to go faster. Kinda funny how that works. Even before I ever heard of trail breaking I have always felt more comfortable with mild braking in the corner. You just need to learn how to manage and master the technique without panicking on the brakes.

Love this explenation Kevin. When you’re NOT on the track, it’s all about SAFETY not SPEED. So trailbraking can come in handy as a defencif riding technique not so much as a highspeed cornering technique.

Certainly another difference between the two courses you mentioned, Kevin (in addition to the populations served and their goals) are the conditions. Track riding presents an extremely "clean" riding condition (no blind corners, pedestrians, tree branches, oil slicks, gravel, etc...), plus unobstructed view of the entire turn. Riding on the street, on the other hand, one is never sure what is going to be on the road. Even a road you ride you every single day could have some nasty surprises that were not there earlier in the day. That, and the typical MSF student's goal in the class, make a tremendous difference in approach and strategies being taught. Excellent video, as always. Love the very approachable manner you have. Keep up the great work!

It also makes a difference what type of front end you have, Kevin. Your Goldwing has a Hossack front end and your GS has the much vaunted Telelever. Neither of those front suspension systems have the "teeter totter" weight transfer conventional forks have.

Nice. Spot on, I'd say. Went on a group ride last year with just a few others. The leader was going pretty quick when a surprise tight curve came around. Two riders (one of them on a trike) went over the double yellow. Yikes. I didn't cross over (along with others). All this to say (like others), I think I picked up trail braking in my riding even after being taught the "former/other" in my MSC course 6 years ago (at age 50) when I learned to ride.

Kinda like Drivers Ed versus High Performance Drivers School, they are different and both will teach you something. I admit I was from a time where I taught myself and isn't the best way to learn. But was the way back then, with a Motorcycle Permit before the Drivers License. However, reviewing you videos I find I already do most of techniques and tweaked up the bad habits. Never feared use of the front brake due to being told it was 70% of our stopping, even in the early days... Never understood the term "Trail Braking" and thanks for the posts and like counter-steer, I had already adopted from years of riding. I do find I was pulling the outside bar and not pushing. Just never thought about it. To mentally change after 50 years, well the counter-steer is still being done without confusing myself now. The concept is there and refreshing to see all this information being passed onto new riders and was unavailable in the old days...

Trail braking gives you an advantage going into a blind corner that you are not familiar with. Using slow, look, press, roll, - how do you know how much to slow down for the entrance to the corner when you cannot see through the blind corner? Using trail braking, you can trail on the brakes until the apex, and trail off the brake as you can then see your exit. An unfamiliar blind corner with a tightening radius is best handled trail braking so that as the radius tightens, you are already on the brakes and can add just a little more as needed. Great video Kevin!

Kevin, your videos are a priceless resource for all [and especially new] riders; but at 13:30 I believe you meant to say EXTEND rather than reduce, and at 14:20, STREET rather than track. Many of the techniques of riding a cycle safely have also applied to my 55 years [yes, true] of driving [most of it] a gasoline tanker in the northeastern U.S.

Like you I tried the trail braking technique a while ago. Without even realizing it I went from consciously using it to doing it all the time. I don't think about it but I am Trail braking automatically now. It makes me feel more secure and ready. Being able to go faster is a side benefit but not my primary reason. Of course with a leading link front end instead of regular forks it might be different. It wouldn't change the wheelbase but it still puts the weight forward and my hand on the brake lever. And it works on my CBX that doesn't have Abs. So I think I have to agree with teaching it to new riders.

First off, I love your videos and look forward to new ones. Some of these techniques that come from the track are very valid on the street. However, location is a key component to that. In your neck of the woods, the roads are for the most part pristine. Just like a race track. But up here, north of the 49th, where we sand the roads for 6 months of the year, such is not the case. Even after the spring street sweeping, which by the way is usually about two months after the bikes have come back out, the roads are actually “never” fully clear of sand or gravel. So in our neck of the woods, this technique likely would see more people dropping their bikes. Especially new riders who are looking at everything except that little bit of sand or gravel on the inside of that corner. Keep the vids coming and stay safe.

@usernamemykel

3 жыл бұрын

Obviously, you need to see a chiropractor to relocate your neck...

Thanks Kevin! I’ve heard Nick refer to this technique as the “Brake Light Initiative.” I consider myself a fairly advanced rider, and trail braking has raised my skills in proper and proficient cornering. Here in Western Pa last Spring, I came around a blind corner in the dark) at 35 mph and trail braking. A deer was right there at the apex and I successfully stopped without incident. One warning though...always be aware of who is driving behind you. You will be able to stop, but the person behind may not. Get out of there as soon as possible! As soon as I went around the deer, within 3 seconds, she got clobbered by a pickup. Not good.

@MCrider

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, "brake light initiative" for those who are new to the concept you can google that and find good reading on the subject.

@glynhannaford7332

3 жыл бұрын

You did well Jim, possibly saved your own life.

@jimgravante6497

3 жыл бұрын

Over the hill near Monroeville!

@mickhunt1965ii

3 жыл бұрын

Excellent post Jim, perfect example of why we need access to brakes on any blind corner, thanks.

@jimgravante6497

3 жыл бұрын

Mick Hunt Thanks Mick. I’m only 5’8” and riding a 650 pound Yamaha FJR1300, I’ll use all the skills I can to keep her upright. If you have the chance, I highly recommend Lee Parks Total Control Advanced Riding Clinic. You will be amazed at what they will teach you.

The difference between schools isn't desire to learn, it's income. In the end, two days don't give you all of the skills that you need to be safe and successful on the street. What helped me most after the ABATE school was riding my bike to work on most nice days, and riding to grocery stores for items that fit. Many riders that I know treat their bikes like toys. I treat mine like transportation. That said, I enjoy your videos and learn a lot from them.

The other thing that trail braking every day does is it keeps you in practice for when you need it. Keep the good stuff coming Kevin.

i think the biggest piont of this method is that of pre'loading the front tyre through the turn, to the piont of clear vision, then release the all be it "slight" brake pressure and roll on. If an emergency brake situation arises anywhere in the turn, you can apply more front brake without the danger a front nose dip can bring because its already holding a compressed position. and your prepared, covering the front brake, reducing panic grab plus you can jump on the rear brake as well to help stand the bike up.

I've been off a cycle for 25 years. When I was on one, I was cautious more than I was capable. So I've been trying to relearn these advanced topics. My MSF instructor talked about entering the corner with compressed forks vs. braking, letting forks decompressed before the corner. Its a very difficult concept to think through. Maybe after we get through this I can get to a class to work through these more advanced concepts.

Nothing should be discarded. Keep learning and work to master all of it. Keep it all in the tool bag. Better to have the tool even if rarely used than to lack when needed.

What you said about being in the best position to apply more brakes if something unexpected comes up in a corner is why I think you got to teach new riders these variables to some extent! So the ones who can't afford expensive official training don't go away thinking that what they learned early on is the only way. Where I live if you do the learner thing and then there is a steep descent to one side and some giant pothole in front of you and you freak a bit - not knowing anything about trail braking or where the weight of the bike is could be a death sentence on day 1.

I trail brake on nearly every turn as well, only exception is slow speed turns, such as parking lots.

@DR4WZ

3 жыл бұрын

@patrick henry you can still drag the rear brake when trail braking.

@PeterSmith-or3pq

3 жыл бұрын

Yes trail brake is a natural way to use the ultra glide weight to comfortably handle your house glide in a turn)

Just a thought. My Kawasaki Voyager has linked brakes that apply some front braking while applying the rear. I thinkn this system works pretty well in the corners as you can apply just a little rear and the front starts to plant down. Then apply front as needed very gently if additional braking in a corner is needed. This bike is a 900 plus pound bike and speed isn't my riding style but once I learned to use linked brakes to my advantage the bike handles well in various conditions.

Big fan here. I agree with everything you said, but in my opinion you forgot to mention that you should trail brake with two fingers in order to reduce reaction time. It makes trail braking more stable then doing it with full hand. I personally have always two finger on the brakes even when I am not braking. Makes me more safer... Thanks Kevin for making all of us a better rider....

Wow, McRider,,, you bring up so MANY things,,,,,,,, that so many of us,,,,,,,,don't even "THINK" about, we just "DO"? Unconsciously , I guess?

I agree ...took the Champ School.. trail braking gets you better prepared for unexpected situations in particular blind comers .. champ school expensive but well worth it for those interested in learning and becoming a better rider. Very good video Kevin.. I also agree in your assessment of some who just want to get their licence and go ... we spend big money on motorcycles .. however the best money we spend should be in investing in ourselves through training & practice to be better, safer and more responsible riders. Just my opinion..😊

Great video, as usual Kevin. I would love to see some videos where you apply some of these techniques on the Goldwing DCT and where you think some techniques might vary when a clutch is not involved.

@MCrider

3 жыл бұрын

On this it makes no difference at all. 👍🏻

I'll give it a shot. Never thought about it. I tend to accelerate coming out if a turn but on roads I do not know this could be a very helpful option. I'm not trying to seriously improve my riding skills at 62 but I'm not opposed. The thing that weighs on my mind more than anything are roads that I'm not familiar with because I have seen some crazy turns in my life that said speed limit 55 and there is no way some one not paying very close attention to what they are doing is going to execute that turn at 55 with so many riders on the road now that haven't ridden for 10 plus years.

I agree with you on MSF coarse.

@kenwittlief255

3 жыл бұрын

The MSF coarse is Very Fine!

having the visual while he explains, helps a lot.

I live in the mountains and I started trail breaking even before I knew what it was. It made a world of difference.

Great topic, I definitely want to explore trail braking now. Minor issue with the video: you said “decreases” where I think you should have said “decreases” twice, at 11:40 (turning radius) and 13:31 (braking distance.) I definitely rewound because I thought “Wait! What?!?”