Love your vids Rob! The best e-mountain bike channel by far, looking forward to watching!

Great vid Rob. Really engaging and an incredible amount of work to organise 🤟 Your point about the motor sounds varying from bike design to bike bike design and frame material is spot on and true. People should take note of that. Personally, I think much of Mountain Biking comes down to the support you get, as we need it!! Bosch have lots of certified service centres, my LBS is one and Bosch warranty has been the best I have experienced in the bike industry when I needed it. That associated with it's 85nM and good performance in all test categories is the end of the decision process for me

Rob, fantastic 👏 video! Your emtb channel is by far the best. So much well thought out information presented... and on all current product lines. These various tests and comparisons between the different motors and bikes makes sorting one out for purchase much easier. Thank you for sharing this information.

This was one of the best you have done for a while. Very informative and covers all the questions potential buyers or owners would like to hear. Keep up the great work.!

Here's the 2022 test! Power / Noise / Integration and Reliability included in the vid! PS - I tried and Tried to get the new Rocky Mountain but sadly they were unable to send one. For the hill climb I never reached the top out motor cut off speed on the drag races- the hill was too steep. Hope you like the vid, happy riding!! Rob.

@justlikeyouful

2 жыл бұрын

I love how customizable the Shimano EP8 RS motor is in my Rise. I tweak it for the type of trails and ride duration. Have a Grail:ON eTap with the Bosch CX Speed (28mph) on order. It will serve 3 duties: Commuter/Gravel Bike/Road Bike. Big miles planned this year. Hopefully it can be adjusted to fit the day.

@resetbikes2265

2 жыл бұрын

It would be good to know how they all feel beyond the limiter with a power meter pedal on the flat at 22mph held for 30 sec same wheels tyres etc. Get back out there ... ;) PS good job on doing all this work - and big Props to John for great camera work.

@Emeric992

2 жыл бұрын

Rob, you've never tried the previous one. Other ones did. It would be good to go to France, and ask to tribe to get you one to try. In the south of france, le Var, nice place to discover. I even can make the guide if necessary.

@justlikeyouful

2 жыл бұрын

@@resetbikes2265 I love this comment! Ride all these f*n downhill bikes at 22+ on flat ground and then tell us how it felt! Rob would be in an f*ing coma. He is not an athlete if you haven't noticed.

Hi Rob, I’m just moving from a analogue bike to an e bike, and have been studying motors before buying in the next few months. This video is absolutely fantastic, and has provided a brilliant and comprehensive overview of all the things I would be interested in. Well done. Keep up the good work. 😀

@poplaurentiu4148

Жыл бұрын

Fully agreed this video is excellent just by watching it, definitely help me understand better what should i look for, when i'll be choosing to get an ev bike.. Tanks a lot Rob.. Safe ridings ! ;0)

@alexmalone1642

Жыл бұрын

U choose Bafang?

Excellent content Rob, with a concise break down of all bikes.. Thank you for your hard work..

Amazing work! Best emtb channel out there. Very informative and it's helping me look at new options and consider bikes I wouldn't have looked at otherwise.

An EPIC test, and well designed and implemented!

Thanks Rob So much work here and great editing and camera work again...

That was a timely video for me. I'm looking forward to owning my first E-bike and you really cut through the confusion. Much Mahalo and Aloha!

Great video Rob! I have a full size Levo and I'm thinking of adding a Levo SL and this video really helps!

Wow, this was really comprehensive! A review to rule them all

Rob, Great info. I found this highly informative. I have to say I wish my Orbea Rise would have done a little better in the comparison, but I love my Rise anyway. I think more info like this is always good, and I hope the manufacturers take note.

@CarkeekW

2 жыл бұрын

Rise Isa great bike as you say , enjoy it for its strengths 💪

New and beginner in this discipline but you help me so much to educate myself! Man you are doing an amazing job!

I really enjoyed the video and concluded: Bosch and Brose for me! By the way, your Rail looks awesome! Waiting for your test ride review with that new set up! Awesome bike!

Great test Rob. I really love the Yamaha motor on my new Reign E+1. It is a big improvement to the 2021 model that I testet last year. More quiet, a bit more power and just runs and goes nicely. Sure integration milles better.

The section on realibility was an informative addition to motor tests. It helps me avoid conditions that would raise the risk of damage. My Yamaha PWX3 will be carried over deeper water challenges on the trail.

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Glad to help

Well done Rob. Very informative video -another top job as always

Great review as always Rob, I’m sure we’ll see more motor manufacturers in the future which will shake up the establishment

Excellent video and really informative, keep up the top quality work Rob 🙂

Well done for addressing the reliability issue it's an important part of the picture that you don't see normally see in the media 👍🏻

I'm just learning about E-Bikes so I find your videos very helpful.

Recently had a buddy RUN OUT OF BATTERY on his cargo bike (Moondog Bullit) - he had to Push It. Basically un-rideable via the pedals. What happens to these 6 motors - can you pedal home when battery is completely dead - OR - are you fighting the battery and transmission to get home ????

@chongwong

Жыл бұрын

You can pedal through no bother, there is a little more resistance than a normal bike due to weight and motor resistance

@adrianhrusca4067

Жыл бұрын

You basicaly have a hybrid car, and your blood sugar is the gasoline😆😆

@noneofyourbusiness4294

Жыл бұрын

Bosch and Shimano do pretty well in that regard. At least everything 2019 and newer. Can't say much about the others, as I barely ever see them/work on them. There's bound to be SOME extra resistance, but honestly weight is the more limiting factor. Especially on cargo bikes, where the smaller wheels/tyres don't exactly make it easier to get the thing going, plus you tend to sit lower, so you're either not using an optimal pedaling angle, or have an unusual pedal position (like pedaling forward rather than down, limiting how much gravity helps you). Loads of factors being at work there

Hi Rob, fantastic video, great real life demonstration and analysis, thanks for your efforts efforts and thumbs up !!😀

Incredibly useful, thank you for your detailed side by side review!!

Well done! I like the disclaimer in regards to the testing not being scientific, yet your approach is fair and transparent. Off to check out more of your videos!

Great reviews Rob! Truly appreciate your massive effort on this one. Informative and enjoyable (as usual). Thanks!

@FINNdeischgut

9 ай бұрын

Don't you have problems with the motor overheating, or the motor suddenly losing a lot of power and a red LED flashing? I would also like to buy a Giant Reign E+ 2022 (2 or 1) or E+ 2 2023, but I read about a lot of problems in German forums. For example, it is very often written that the motor below is significantly weaker than a Bosch, Brose, Shimano or PW-X2 and has severe problems with overheating, which then causes a red LED to flash and the performance to be massively reduced, so it makes no difference whether you use level 2 or level 5 until the engine has cooled down for a few minutes. I also read that the motor switches off the support at 24km/h and, for example, with the Brose or Shimano only from around 26km/h. In addition, there is often mention of a rattling noise like with Shimano or Bosch. The rattling thing isn't really that important to me because it's the same with the Bosch CX. The only thing I'm a bit "afraid" of is overheating and the supposedly weak performance of the engine. I have no problem riding on hills at a high cadence so that the engine can use its full power, but I am afraid of not being able to keep up with Bosch or Brose riders if we ride together. When I'm riding alone, it's not that important that the motor is a little weaker than a Brose or Bosch, because I'm currently only driving a 50nm motor anyway, which struggles quite a bit on steep mountains since I also weigh over 100kg. So in comparison, the SyncDrive Pro2 is significantly stronger. I also drove a SyncDrive Pro1 (PW-X2) and level 2-3 was easily enough for me on steep climbs and level 1-2 on the flat.

Well done video. I appreciate your non biased opinions. Best on KZread.

Thank you for this. You put a lot of effort in your work!

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Cheers NinJazz

Again excellent vid Rob! Will you do a part 2 with testing the grunt and range (motor effiency)? As far as I have understood the Shimano has less km/wh and less grunt compared to the Bosch, dunno how it stacks up to the rest?

Great video. Thanks for the motors testing and analysis

Most helpful video I’ve watched so far on emtbs. Subbed

Thanks for the video, comparison is always interesting to watch.

Rob, thank you for the videos. Ended up buying an Orbea Rise. If you ever get a chance, it would be nice to see how energy efficient the motors are. As an example measure a battery before and after a hill climb.

I love your channel dude! I just found out about it and can't stop watching it! Subbed!

An excellent video, vital for someone making such a large purchase. My only issue is I would have loved to see how Rocky Mountains motor measures up to the others.

Man I’ve been watching so many e-bike videos lately. I just bought a Cube Hybrid Reaction Pro with the Bosch CX and can’t wait to get it! Still 2 weeks till delivery lol. I feel like a child at Christmas!

How on earth were you able to get all these bikes at the same time…? Massive undertaking, great test, large amount of relevant info (as always) there is a lot of work behind this. Thank you for that & Congratulations! Loved this video 👍

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! Took a long time!!

@nitraM321

2 жыл бұрын

he just owns them

@MustYouHaveAUsername

2 жыл бұрын

Bigger youtubers obviously get bikes with priority from the manufacturers so they can get a video out early. I'm 100% for that so I can find reviews before making a decision. :D It's still quite a lot of effort to get all these bikes together and I appreciate that a lot!

@billybobby7607

Жыл бұрын

Would like to see 2000w bafang mid drive

@gasparole

Жыл бұрын

@phillip warehamThe motors come pre-lubricated right?

Nice job, thanks a lot for showing.

Fantastic honest content. I think ultimately it will come down to personal preference after test riding. Which I will certainly be doing in the spring

Great test again, adding on previous tests you've done. The only thing missing that i would love to see, is an efficiency test. I know this is hard to do with different geometries and battery sizes etc. But, if you could choose similar bike geometry, and put the same wheel and tyres on from one bike to another, and then maybe do a 10 mile loop say, with a mix style of trails, steep climbs, and a little bit of fire track climbs. It would be good to see how each motor deals with it. Maybe use a watt meter to keep your input as fair as possible? KEEP MAKING GREAT VIDEOS! 👍🏽

@billybobby7607

Жыл бұрын

Nah you'd want to do that on bench test, via turbo trainer so exact same amount of resistance

excellent and useful video. Seemingly unbiased reviews are extremely helpful.

Another good video Rob. Have you experienced any issues when riding at different cadences with these motors? I tend to ride with a fairly high cadence (96 rpm) due to riding longer distances. I have found some motors do not like this cadence and my haibike indicates to slow my cadence down. It would be good to hear your findings when riding these bikes with their various motors.

Woul‘ve been nice to see, how Bafang is comparing to the rest of the companies. I was surprised how quit units like the M400 are working.

@acelectricalsecurity

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I have a BBSHD bolt on, and it's extremely quite, I assume their integrated motors are similar as well

@Tony_P

2 жыл бұрын

@@acelectricalsecurity Same , very quiet at full power , NO rattle and super reliable , it would have put these motors to shame in the performance and noise tests! I wish more bike manufacturers would equip their bikes with Bafang motors.

@acelectricalsecurity

2 жыл бұрын

@@Tony_P your spot on with what you say, I was surprised how quiet it is. Plus with the software or the app you can customise it to your preference.

@bonzobanana1

2 жыл бұрын

Also for I would have liked to have seen a standard bike in the comparison just to see how significantly the times vary. I question the reliability info though because a service centre has no way of knowing the sales of each unit and could have some bias towards brands it doesn't deal with like Shimano. Also sound levels are not a major concern for me. I remember reading that nylon cogs are less noisy than metal cogs so if a bike has a lot of internal nylon cogs it may be quieter but that may not be good for long term reliability. Bosch in the past seemed to have a lot of nylon cogs and belts and were highly rated for low levels of sound and now they seem to have more metal cogs and no internal belts and sound levels are louder. However without Bafang in the comparison and maybe a few other mid-drive Chinese brands it's hard to make full use of the info but still an interesting video but I can't really draw any conclusions from it. I am glad he raised the issue of Bosch being a closed environment meaning excessively expensive batteries and repairs etc. For that reason I would never ever buy a Bosch based ebike. To be fair I would never ever consider any of these bikes I would be looking at Bafang just for easy spares, greater reliability and customisation. These premium ebikes are a horrendous money pit and often short life.

@acelectricalsecurity

2 жыл бұрын

@@bonzobanana1 yeah you make a lot of valid points, I watched a guy replace all the bearing's in a Bosch gen 4 motor and it didn't look an easy job, very fiddly. To be fair this guy has done a bafang build and a cyc build, the cyc blew the stock bike away, and the cyc was in legal mode as well. The only thing these bikes have over a DIY kit is looks, I can't argue they look neater, but that's all really. For me I chose the bafang HD and I am very happy with it.

Brilliant video Rob

Great video. I would base the reliability of a motor highly, or possibly first, in choosing a brand of bike. Please keep these real world vids coming.

Really appreciate the reliability insights from the repair center.

Great info thanks. Due to the high price, I'm trying to learn all I can before a purchase.

Impressive video, thanx for all the hard work.

Great job, Rob. 👍

Great video really enjoyed it. What a selection of bikes...amazing.

Great video and very useful as a researching buyer!👏🏼

Would love to see another test like this soon Rob as there have been so many updates to the current line up on this video, great review though 👏

Very good and professionell test! Thank you.

This was awesome 👌.very informative 👏 👍 nicely done guys 👦

Epic as always rob I’m really liking my pwx3 in my reign, previous reign pwx2 not so much

Huge effort and very helpful.

Fantastic Video as alway!

Great video! I have had a NP Megawatt on order since October and have been getting increasingly worried about the EP8 motor and the problems they have been having. Seems it stacks up not too badly against the rest which is good to know!

Nice job Rob. Thumbs up! I subscribed.

Great review, always impressed with the honesty of the reviews. Would like to see one done on the Greyp G6.5 OFFROAD one day please…..

Great comparison video rob and great to see the motor reliability technology, nobody as I know and I watch a lot of EBIKE videos does the reliability comparison. By the way I think if you would have started out on the Bosch the time would have been even better.

Great review. It helped me out a lot

Thanks a lot for the interesting test. 👍😎

Just amazing! many thanks

Great video, would love to see one for 2023!

Thanks for this Video Rob, great Job, top informativ content.

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Cheers Paul 👊

I love my 2020 Turbo Levo SL. I have the best of both worlds! It feels just like my regular Stumpy. I’ve not experienced any issues at all since I purchased it…

Love the video! Great info

I believe they intentionally left it out ,Bafang m620/g510. Which costs a fraction of the price $ of every one of those Motors. And I also believe out sells them all. Great view review Rob as usual thank you again brother.

Superb vid as usual Rob, top stuff. I'm running the EP8 and i don't find the rattle to intrusive but love the way it's more discretely built in. Have to say I'm not a fan of the Bosch controls, they seem really bulky.

@dannyslaughter4845

Жыл бұрын

On the brose site it says it’s compatible with 4 different versions of control heads.

You are a legend, thanks for, great videos.

Nice video!!! 👍👍👍 I have a Turbo Creo SL with 1.1 SL motor...you are right is a little noise when climbing but doesn't rattle at all when you are going down. Love that little motor...on my Creo I can go up to 110km with a single charge and because is a Gravel bike you have the most of the engine at 90/100 cadence per minutes...2000km without issues.

Best video yet! Don’t own an eMTB, but motor reliability is my biggest concern. Thanks for tackling this topic.

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Glad it helped

@robvanduren761

2 жыл бұрын

Motor / battery / electronics etc are in the dinosaur era in terms of reliability and the fact that they cost more than MX / ENDURO Motorcycles is stupidity

Really interesting video and mostly mirrors my thoughts having gone from a Bosch Gen 4 to a Spesh Brose 2.2. However, I have to say I've found the Brose to be super quiet ascending and descending, especially when compared to the Bosch. Great video though, thanks Rob!

@chawkins45ify

2 жыл бұрын

I had a trek rail with Bosch and I'm on a gen 3 levo now. Brose is super quiet, most natural feeling power delivery, power is similar but the brose is way more efficient. Only issue I have with the brose is it seems draggy when you're not pedalling

@robcburton1

2 жыл бұрын

@@chawkins45ify Colt, thank you for mentioning this. I have the 2022 Levo and as crazy fast as it can be going up hills it is noticeably slower on the descents compared to my Trek Fuel non emtb. I am blaming the Magura brakes at the moment because, for the life of me, I cannot get them to NOT rub. Also, agree with Loz regarding the noise level. The vid was not what I experience at all but Rob called it out. I find it to be very quiet.

@chawkins45ify

2 жыл бұрын

@@robcburton1 those maguras are very draggy until they bed in, my buddy had the same issues with his bike

@lozetchells9164

2 жыл бұрын

@ From my 2 bikes, I would say the 700wh Spesh can definitely go further than the 625wh Bosch Cube I have, but probably not quite the 12-odd percent more it should do. However it's ridiculously difficult to conclude anything from that, since the assist levels, weights and gearing are all slightly different. I doubt if the Bosch is intrinsically any more efficient to any significant degree tbh, and the Brose is definitely a better motor overall, in my opinion. Both are great, mind. It's a high bar.

2 жыл бұрын

@@lozetchells9164 Thank you! I am between 2 models with the Brose, the Specialized Levo and the Fantic XEF 1.9 Enduro. Tough choice! Cheers!

Awesome video Rob. I got a Bosch and the winning annoys me a little on long ascents on gravel tracks when you are mostly enjoying the scenery. I believe that in the future noise control would be a key design feature.

@tuunaes

2 жыл бұрын

While one aspect of motor design, noise is also affected by bike frame design/material and motor with smooth noise in one frame can have whiny noise in another frame: kzread.info/dash/bejne/q31n0q5rlZiopZc.html

@danimayb

2 жыл бұрын

That's why I have my 1000w hub motor lol Can cruse along gravel and cycle tracks in total bliss........ OK I know, Completely different comparison, I'm not a mountain biker I won't be cruising through woods or gnarly trails, Just saying for the lols.

Very sturdy, and easy to clean.Excellent product

Very informative video. I'm currently in the market for my first e-bike. I have limited my options to an SL though. Im pretty fit but not the biggest chap so going for a full powered e-bike isnt for me. Had my eye on the Kenevo SL and after seeing a number of reviews on this bike along with yours, It looks like it will be the one for me. Just enough power and seems pretty reliable. The uphill whine is a touch disappointing but it ticks all the other boxes. 👍

That's a great video with very good info! I'm looking to buy my 2nd altitude powerplay,I wish you've test that new dyname 4.0.

Can’t wait to see next years! Seeing the new Trek Fuel exe has me excited for the near future of eMTB motors. Once the motors are more silent I’ll invest in one.

@MrRumBacardi

Жыл бұрын

You stole my comment! I share the same sentiment as you :)

@scoobydoozoom

Жыл бұрын

Don't wait! My ebike has transformed my riding. I'm a better rider on it, and I can ride all day if I want. I have the Giant Trance E+ and yeah you can hear the motor a bit, but not much and I don't see how they can make it any quieter honestly.

great job! man we should do a class action for that bosh controller and display.

Great video, been looking for more info on how quick the motors engage and disengage for tight technical climbing at slow speeds. Any chance you have info on that?

Thanks for the compare 👍

What a great, rounded review Rob and hats off for getting so many bikes. Personally I steered away from a Shimano based motor based on experience with E8000. They are apparently very hard to work on, and mine although a supposedly sealed unit when opened ( out of warranty and dead ) was full of water, in September. I never jet wash. Am very careful yet the motor was swamped. The new EP8 has seen it’s fair share of returns too. I hear sensor issues. I went Brose in the end. One, due to the feel of the motor and superb Mission Control, secondly due to Specialized warranty being strong and thirdly a strong network of third party motor repair centres that have great after warranty support for Brose. All motors don’t mix well with water. And still there seems to be a market for maintainable motors. It seems counter intuitive that if you try to service a motor the warranty is invalidated. At the end of the day maybe pick a bike based on your riding needs, your sizing and the kind of environment you like to ride in. Being 6’3” few bikes fitted me until the S sizing came out. Thanks again Rob, hope you are enjoying the new Rail (proper Slash type sizing for you !) and here’s to drier conditions in the UK !

@megane230f1

2 жыл бұрын

All these motors have one thing in common a lifespan of 3000 miles if you’re lucky, i love e bikes i think they’re marvellous but motors that rarely see 3000 miles? that aint good enough, 7-10 i think should be the mark with all replaceable mechanically as well as hardware software

Brilliant Rob 👏👏👏👏

Very good vid Rob. Lots of Informations and details. But please don't use sunglasses when talking to your audience. Perhaps I'm a bit old school but I'd like to see the eyes of the person talking to me. Keep up your work, really one of the better eMTB channels on YT.

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Noted, thanks for the feedback 👊

Very good work. Thank you.

Best video i watched. Thank you. I subscribed

That is exactly what u hear when u ride those eMTBs. Great video and test buddy

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Cheers!

Great info ,thanks keep it up

great video Rob, but wow, that rattle on the Focus, how does Jon put up with it! 😲

Thank you Rob for the your job helping and clarifying wich can be the best choice of an ebike.,pointing here one of most important part of the bike The motor ,source of pleasure but also of headache and harm ,

Great video! It would be nice to see in this kind of comparison videos how do the different motors feel when riding them while they are turned off (for example when You want to save the battery or when the battery is dead). I heard there are some differences in this regard. Thanks!-)

@brokenlegz

Жыл бұрын

Yeah I want to know this too. Or when you exceed the speed limit. I think the ep8 is the best from what I can find out. But I can’t find anything out about the giant.

@mikee8244

Жыл бұрын

@@brokenlegz apparently Giant have started to utilize the new Yamaha pwx3 with their own 'tune'. I'd like to know some more about this motor, as haibike have just put it in their new allmtn 7 and 10. Bloody lovely green with gold accents on the paint job on the 7. Fox 36 float performance front, fox dps performance rear, with magura mt7s and a Sram chainset. For £5299. But for an extra £700 for the allmtn 10 ( you don't get the my favorite colour scheme, it's gloss black, still cool looking though) you get factory kashima 38s, factory kashima x2, XT brakes and chainset. A hell of an up-spec for the price difference. As for how easy it is to outpedal the limiter, or ride with no power, I have no idea how it compares to other motors. Yes it will be doable. Just hard going.

@CJUrbex

Жыл бұрын

i thought if the motor was off if u wanted to save battery the bike just rides as a normal bike could without a motor regardless or am i wong ? Thanks in advance :)

@mikee8244

Жыл бұрын

@@CJUrbex they do. But without any assistance from the motor they're hard going, varying, due to the weight of the bike and how much drag/resistance the motor has, all motors vary in how hard they are to pedal when 'off'. This is why some emtb's are easier to out-pedal the motor when they hit the speed where the speed limiter cuts the assist. 15.5mph in Europe and (I think) 20mph in the USA. It's easier to out-pedal the motors limiter, once it's assisted to the legal assist speed. Than it is to get up to the same speed with no assist at all. And as i said, the difficulty will vary depending on bike weight and motor type. And how fit you are .

@radimpalus

Жыл бұрын

@@CJUrbex There are difference amongst the motors in terms of resistance they have when they are turned off. I suppose older models are worse and the newer one should be better. Some models were very hard to ride when turned off and some not.

Bravo! What a review! That must have taken a LOT of time to organise and shoot. Thank you for that. I’m throwing my leg over the Orbea Rise M10 at the moment and am lovin’ it as my first foray into the E-Bike world, having ridden ‘analogue’ for many years. You confirmed everything I’ve found with the Rise so far: noisy down, quiet up. The last segment on reliability was a tad concerning given the British winter I’ve been riding through, but so far… so good! I had to Lol with the 1st test… Mmmm, The Trek you spent your money on was the fastest bike in the drag test… I wonder if you tried just a teeny bit harder on that one! I would!

Definitely enjoyed the reliability side of the review. It's the most mysterious aspect of eMTB's and the manufactures don't help the cause by not allowing owners to manage the software diagnostics. At least the one's I'm aware of. Bike riders are by nature DIY'ers.

Fantastic! This is the video of my Dreams ;)

EXCELLENTE PRESENTATION !

Great video with a lot of in depth information Bosch need to ditch that giant screen and massive remote

Cheers rob really interesting 👍😉

@RobRidesEMTB

2 жыл бұрын

Cheers 👊