I think Man O' War & Secretariat would agree there's no need for comparison, then trot off to the barn together for some oats, apples, and carrots.

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

Very nice post. Sharing a meal together makes them good buddies, as well as arguably the two finest racehorses ever seen in the U.S. Don't know if any horses in other countries had any two as outstanding as those two were!

@sarahcallaway9969

3 ай бұрын

And don't forget the peeled oranges!😊❤

@OldDawg-mc3dy

Ай бұрын

And mares

@ObamAmerican48

Ай бұрын

@@OldDawg-mc3dy yeah 🤣

@rolltide9547

25 күн бұрын

You sound just like what a soft ass pansy liberal would say

They were both wonderful champions. i don't think there is any need to compare them, just appreciate them.

@rossogden9920

11 ай бұрын

Join reality lady. Champions from different eras of ALL sports have been compared for hundreds of years.

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@rossogden9920 Lots of people say that, and she only means well. But indeed, even racing writers in 1920 were saying that (yes, I read ancient DRFs) regarding Man O'War, comparing him to Colin or (???) Luke Blackburn (not the first horse I'd think to compare him to).

@Psyfi85

11 ай бұрын

Yes, handsome chestnut pillars of the sport. Completely different eras anyway.

@dlmullins9054

11 ай бұрын

Yes, but sports people will always do it.

@horsewomn

11 ай бұрын

When I saw American Pharaoh, I immediately thought damn he could be Secretariat reincarnated! I mean he had the same way of going, the same, arrogant attitude and he had the look of eagles! I love Man O’ War and I love Secretariat and American Pharaoh, all related by blood to Each other. In the movie National Velvet a son of Man O’ War played The Pie. I was lucky enough to have great grandson of both Secretariat and Man O’ War. His name was Flame, he went from race horse that set a track record to my trail horse and when I could no longer care for him he became the darling of the United States Park Police, I even had their Chief call me and said I really must talk to you about the horse you donated. I asked why is he ok? He laughed and said you have my cadets fighting over who gets to have him as their permanent mount. He was in Bush Senior’s Inaugural Parade. He was a one of the best horses I had the privilege to have, train, and love.

Regarding the animated race... #1. Secretariat was always paced behind the leader, then beside the leader, then to take the lead... #2 Secretariat's main jockey, Tourette and the jockey who rode him in the Belmont, NEVER took a whip to him when asking for more speed, Secretariat never experienced a whip... beautiful...🦋

@sl-rt5kv

4 ай бұрын

*Secretariat never experienced a whip... beautiful* Tourcotte used the whip on Secretariat in plenty of races. For example, just look at him coming down the stretch of the 1973 Woodward. Secretariat was whipped many times. One horse who they almost never used the stick on was Dr. Fager. He resented it and, in the one or two instances when they did use the stick on him, he let his jockeys know about it immediately.

@FrankCarolei-lv6rb

Ай бұрын

Father never needed to be hit ,not because he resented it,shut your mouth doctor doolittle

@FrankCarolei-lv6rb

Ай бұрын

Secretariat got hit when he got beat by onion ,prove out and others,you sound stupid, and by the way he was juiced

@Fred-vy1hm

28 күн бұрын

Ron Turcotte*

@deborahjeanne2141

26 күн бұрын

@@Fred-vy1hm spell check taking over.

No athlete ever rose to the occasion like Big Red did in the Belmont. It’s as if he knew exactly what was at stake. Because he DID. Magnificence on display.

@jimfrazier8611

Ай бұрын

Especially when you consider all the reasons that the Belmont is where Triple Crown dreams go to die. All the top distance horses come out of the woodwork, to take down the pretenders who aren't made from something really special.

@edro3838

27 күн бұрын

👍 “…Secretariat is widening now. He’s moving like a tremendous machine” ~ Chick Anderson

@rubroken

25 күн бұрын

All three races of the triple crown.......Secretariat set the record for all 3 and the times, still unbeaten

I remember 1973 like it was yesterday. When Secretariat broke last in the Preakness, I thought, Bah. And then all of a sudden he took off like a bat outta hell, passing every other horse and won. No one predicted he would do what he did in the Belmont. I remember watching it on TV, and as he came down the back stretch, I stood up and clapped with tears pouring down my face, I was so overwhelmed by what I was seeing. When he died, I cried again. He will always be my favorite horse. Ruffian was my other favorite. 😢

@RoadDawgs996

3 ай бұрын

I cried with you. The horse that God built.

@deborahjeanne2141

3 ай бұрын

@@RoadDawgs996 I don’t know if you’ve ever read the book William Knack wrote about Secretariat but it reads like a fairy tale. Well worth reading if you’re a Secretariat fan or even just a fan of horses.

@RoadDawgs996

3 ай бұрын

@@deborahjeanne2141 Yes I have and thank you for the reminder I have this book and it is well deserved of another read

@deborahjeanne2141

3 ай бұрын

@@RoadDawgs996 LOL! I have it too, and you’re right- it’s time to read it again! 🐎

@jeangrissom1071

Ай бұрын

I cried both when he won the Triple Crown, and when he died, but also when I saw the movie and read the book. I fell in love with horses when I was a young girl and read Man O’War. I still at 70 tear up when I watch videos about either horse. ❤

I know very little about horse racing but I know what I witnessed back in 73. He was one of a kind. When you factor in the money, the breeding, the training, the nutrition, and the computer science that has been developed over the last 50 years, it makes his record achievements even more stunning. Not until they make a "Super Horse" in a lab will Secretariats' records ever be broken.

@jet7111

11 ай бұрын

Well that's part of it. The breeding worked out brilliantly. But even with that you didn't expect a 22 pound heart. That's what did it all. He processed oxygen faster than any of them.

@laurenurban3942

11 ай бұрын

What you saw back in 1973 was a phenomenon that will never happen again. Appreciate what you witnessed. It will never happen again.

@maninacrowd2342

11 ай бұрын

I think the closest we’ve seen is Flightline and I’d love to have seen him in the triple to see his times!

@kevinwells4888

11 ай бұрын

@@jet7111 The literal heart and the figurative one as well. :-)

@brendaclark5185

11 ай бұрын

​@maninacrowd2342 - Flightline's last race? He did something only attributed to Secretariat. He paused and examined his foes, like a king watching his minions. Then he showed himself to be the king. Breathtaking.

Secretariat was an absolute DREAM! By the WAY he strove towards the most memorable finishing ROUTE of any race

@ruthlickey7043

7 ай бұрын

Both were champions, but SECRETARIAT was the greatest horse ever. MAN O'WAR never won a race with the width between horses.

Secretariat had one thing that most don't, other than his enlarged heart. This Horse was "cocky" "tude". If you ever saw this horse in person you could see it . Calm cool and collective but when he approached the press and track, he turned it on like Muhammad Ali before a fight.

@MoniekRedhead

Ай бұрын

All great racehorses trace back to Eclipse, whose dam Spiletta was homozygous for the large heart gene. So since 97% of all horses trace back to Eclipse (whose heart was 17lbs) there are a lot of horses with a large heart. Also the heart is a muscle and therefore trainable...

@lenacaruso699

29 күн бұрын

His competitor sham had an enlarged heart too its more common than you think

Both horses were exceptional in their day. Choosing between them is a waste of time.

@mikewarren1401

11 ай бұрын

No it’s not it’s Secretariat and it’s not even close!

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

@Mike Warren No, it's Man O' War and it's not even close!!!

@mikewarren1401

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 well you can think that but times don’t lie! MOW holds no records anymore while Secretsriat records are still standing after 50 years!

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

@Mike Warren Man O' War raced over 100 years ago. Records aren't everything. And Secretariat only holds the KD record not the distance record. The Belmont and 1 1/2 time on dirt, not turf. So, big whoop. So, that means every horse who has run the distances faster is better?? Don't sound stupid.

@mikewarren1401

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 times are everything! MOW mile and a half time us 2:28. Secretsriat broke more records then any other horse. After each loss he came back and broke that track record. He still owns the world dirt record for mile and a half! It will never be broken and he did it hand ridden . MOW was slow! He owns no records

Man O War and Secretariat were great horses, but no horse can honestly be declared the greatest of all time. There's an entire world of racehorses, and centuries of racing. Eclipse? Phar Lap? We can't know how they'd have done against them, plus conditions were different. And you can't compare a steeplechaser like Red Rum to a flat race runner like Secretariat - different types of racing, different skills. All great horses though.

I got nervous for a second. Secretariat gives me goose bumps every time, even in this digital race.

Two exceptional horses. I adored secretariat. However, I also realize that the conditions for training and the track were contributors to increase speeds during secretariat’s time.

@BWCheese

8 ай бұрын

I know nothing about horse racing... But I think it would be fun if someone took a sample of race horses and recreated the conditions that Secretariat faced and the conditions Man O' War faced and raced them. Then take the average delta of all the horses between each set of conditions. Then you could project how much faster Man O' War would have been with lighter weight and better track/gate conditions. Though there would be no way to project his full potential if there is an argument that Man O' War wasn't really trying due to weak competition.

We need to appreciate both of them!

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

That would be easy if team Secretariat and insecure nasty fans would stop trying to dethrone the original Big Red, but they just keep shoving this horse down our throats. It's like as a diehard fan of Man O'War, I am willing to concede when Secretariat lost ,he DID have legit excuses, but what I can't stand is when they sarcastically belittle Spectacular Bid, and we all know how they reacted about his TripleCrown. A bunch of shi*as* hypocrites.

@mariabykofsky4502

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 Stop being so negative, especially calling fans negative regardless of horse...

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

@@mariabykofsky4502 "Negative" lol. I've had 50 years of nasty, sarcastic, and "negative" experience with fans of THIS horse. If you aren't, then don't worry about it.

@MosheGoldbergTheKing

10 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 100%. The Cult Of Secretariat are the "horse racing fans" who show up in early May with their "They'll never be another..." comments and disappear when the Derby winner doesn't win the Preakness or Belmont. Repeat year after year. 95% of them couldn't name ten horses if their lives depended on it and don't know what Handicapping is. They cling to the mythos because for a lot of them it happened in their lifetime, and that's it. They're dying off though. Another 15-20 years and the sane conversations can come back. They're the Michael Jordan fanboys of Horse Racing.....

@sandralogue1774

3 ай бұрын

@@mariabykofsky4502 l fully appreciate both horses,without doubt Secretariat was a great horse,I remember watching that Belmont Stakes,think I was 10 years old and had newspaper articles of him plastered all over my bedroom wall,he has a definitive spot in horse racing history.

Both were great horses. I wish there was more footage of Man O'War. Man O'War is concidered the better sire, the most prominent offpsring being his son, War Admiral, triple crown winner and yet another amazing horse. Man O'War had a longer stride than Secretariat (28 v. 25) and was never ridden full out as his owner forbade it. I believe the most Secretariat carried was 129 pounds. The winner in one of his losses carried 7 pounds more than him. Man O'War was retired early mainly because the owner was told they would continue to up the weight on him to never-before-seen weights. Both horses are distantly relatead through Man O'War's sire. Isn't it strange both of these wonderful thoroughbreds were sorrels?

You cannot compare a horse that ran in the 1920's and one that ran in the 1970's. There are so many differences, not just in the training they received, but track conditions, the weight Man o' War carried, etc., etc. Man o' War and Secretariat both were large horses, with MOW being a bit larger. Both called Big Red, and both had stamina. The only reason that MOW lost a race was because his jockey had him turned in the wrong direction when the race started, there were no gates used back then. MOW also won by 100 lengths in one race that was 1 5/8 miles long, that win was by 1/4 mile. There is also one important factor, MOW had a stride length 28' (the most of any horse) while Secretariat's stride was 25'. Both great horses in their time, and we should all appreciate what they were and did, and leave it at that.

@sonnestt

11 ай бұрын

Well said

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

Not even in the same universe Do you realize Secr is 4 seconds faster on a mile and a half track THE TIMES DONT LIE NOTHING IS MAKING THAT UP

@simranjitsingh4804

11 ай бұрын

@@joecolabelli4339 You keep on mentioning 4 seconds? Do you know that for every extra 1 pound that a horse carries on the track it sets him back by 3 lengths? Man O War carried more than 136 pounds which is unheard of ? Grow up. Please get a cross word puzzle. MOW is a greatest horse. According to The Associated Press, The Blood Line Horse, and other sources MOW is the greatest horse of the 20th century.

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

@@simranjitsingh4804 HELLO my buddy had a horse in the DERBY (I GREW UP IN COLTS NECK NJ 0I forgot more about racing than you know ANDREW BEYER assigned the highest speed rating in history to SECR (140 ) Accordingly you want to wager 1 lb is not equal to 3 furlongs MOW RECORDS WERE BROKEN WITH 10 YEARS OF HIM SETTING THEM EDUCATE BEFORE YOU POST

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@joecolabelli4339 Times DO "lie" - across tracks and regions and time. This is why Andrew Beyer developed his Speed Figures. BTW, despite his biggest computed BSF ever being Sec's Belmont Stk, it's interesting to note, as he usually would, that almost every track record at Belmont was FROM 1973 THAT YEAR. IOW, possibly a bit "greased" (as was Aqueduct, as well). Otherwise, I respect Sec's Belmont because he DID win by at least 25 lengths (the original call), although the field was somewhat small. Margin combined with "fast" time tends to mean Big Speed Figure.

I have the videos of Secretariat's triple crown races. Compared to the competitors I am just amazed at how much longer his strides were. I tear up every time I watch them. I was an apprentice trainer and exercise jockey in the 70s. I still ride for pleasure.

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

If Sec's stride was so great, how come it was measured at 24 feet, 11 in., while Man o' War was measured at an incredible, much larger 28 feet?

@CharliesHopechest

11 ай бұрын

@@freeguy77 I can only compare him to the ones hes racing in the video.

@karenstepeck8337

10 ай бұрын

​@@freeguy77r.c

@marykuettner752

7 ай бұрын

Yeah Man o War had the longer stride.

You can never truly predict how two horses like these two would compare in an actual race without putting them in an actual race. Mainly because some extraordinary horses will take the measure of their opponents by looking them in the eye…and then adjust their effort accordingly. Some horses just have no quit in them and what the statistics say SHOULD happen may be far from what ACTUALLY happens.

@debbylou5729

3 ай бұрын

Penny said it best, secretariat ran his own races. I can’t imagine that horse slacking off just because of how another horse ‘looked’

@jeansmith-wl7xt

2 ай бұрын

Maybe we should look at their records as sire, that would be their true legacy

@DanielSong39

24 күн бұрын

@@jeansmith-wl7xt I think Storm Cat wins there

That's precisely how would have gone down, but I'd expect Secretariat to have pulled away approaching the end of the back straight and pulling even further ahead as he exited the final turn and continued to pull away. That ginormous heart of his was simply able to pump more oxygenated blood throughout his extremities which is what allowed him to run a his peak speed for far longer than any other horse, all of which began to feel the lactic acid burn by the time they hit the home stretch. Manowar certainly was a specimen, but Secretariat was to Horse Racing what MJ was to basketball. Literally built different.

@sl-rt5kv

Ай бұрын

*That's precisely how would have gone down* No one knows how it would have gone down. Both Secretariat and MOW lost races. That's why they determine the outcome of races on a racetrack rather than on arguments and rationalizations claiming that one horse or another would win.

Eddie Arcaro put it best. Discussions like this make for great barroom conversations, but there is really no way to know for sure. Eddie did go on to say that he believed no horse who ever lived would have beaten Secretariat on the day he won the Belmont.

Secretariat had one bad race in his career - his very first - which I can overlook. He was hampered with an abscess at acqueduct, where he lost, raced with a fever at the Whitney, but somehow sill managed to finish second and then lost on an uber muddy track at the Woodward. When he was healthy and raced on clean track, there was no one that could touch him. He also beat much stiffer competition than Man 'O War did. If they could clone both horses a race between them would be must see TV.

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

Sorry, but the abscess is likely bogus. There was zero mention of such a thing in the DRF all the way through August of that year (unfortunately, UKY took down DRFs after 1959 so I'm going by memory as a friend had done research at the TIME saying no magazines or anything back then mentioned this for a full year). Racing writers were still "mystified" why Secretariat lost the Wood long into the summer. There was a KZread of a track vet who was called on TUESDAY after the Wood about an abscess. Additionally, the other book that had been considered a "bible" of Sec was by Raymond Woolfe (highly recommend, as it is beautiful, shows all his racing charts and all his works) and he did not mention this at all; only that Turcotte was not pleased with his work or race. So once again, it seems the source of these curious stories is Bill Nack, considered the "bible" writer of the other story (emphasis on that word). But I consider Nack a lackey and a schoolgirl for Sec, especially after other curious stories he's put by (such as about Ruffian, and about Sec being downvoted to 14 by someone - why is it ALWAYS Nack who is behind these stories?). I think he's a liar. Why would this abscess story not appear even a little later? Was someone trying to get better odds? That's the only reason I can understand for not defending your horse with an excuse, especially a concrete one.

@natalieelliott5389

11 ай бұрын

Thank you. Finally someone said it.

@JoeKoOhNo

11 ай бұрын

@@theOlLineRebel If you listen to the Secretariat lovers, he was well in Jan, Feb, and March; when he won; sick in April; when he lost; well in May and June; when he won the TC; sick in August when Onion beat him; well 3 weeks later when he beat Onion; well in September when he beat Riva Ridge and Cougar; sick when Prove Out whupped him. Of course, they ignore the fact that he beat Riva Ridge and Cougar by greater margins when he lost to Prove Out. Secretariat is the most overrated horse in history and every great frontrunner would have handled him easily just as Angle Light, Onion, and Prove Out did.

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@JoeKoOhNo Well, Sec was a great horse, no doubt; we're splitting hairs here when we argue "who is #1"! There are so many great horses, but we fight over 2. Secretariat indeed proved himself greatly. I do think he's overrated, but not too much. For me, Ruffian is THE most overrated racehorse of all time - although, perhaps Kincsem could be called so as well. When you have people seriously thinking Ruffian's the greatest horse to ever run - really - never mind universally hailed as the best female - that is overrated.

@JoeKoOhNo

11 ай бұрын

@@theOlLineRebel I agree that Ruffian is vastly overrated. No filly or mare ranks as the "greatest" racehorse. But I also only consider speed horses as possible candidates and Red was a closer so he's out, imo.

Very well done! Seems you covered pretty much all of the considerations. Your conclusions are sound. Your race call was very good. And whatever software product you used to produce that race is pretty cool too. I was 10 years old when Secretariat won the triple crown. He was my introduction to horse racing. I have a short list of who I want to meet in heaven and one of them is a red horse.

Secretariat no doubt about it " he is moving like a tremendous machine"

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

Only one race where he did that! June 9, 1973. Maybe on another day, NOT so fast!

Secretariet everytime all day every day, wish i could have ridden him. Saw him on tv live in 1973 best race i ever saw, the Belmont , i was screaming with joy how he ran his race. It was and still is thrilling. I tell the young people to watch his races. Man of war was amazing but I'll take my guy he ran faster every quarter. He loved to run and the attention, show off!♥️ what a HORSE! ♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️♥️

@christianmonturanoii6539

9 ай бұрын

Ya right dummy man o war would school him imagine of he was 50 years later he would have been even better probably good one dude

@janislohman8125

9 ай бұрын

@@christianmonturanoii6539 maybe, but i still wish i could have ridden him. Both were fast but i loved that in the belmont he ran each quarter faster and smoked the field. What a heart he had without being whipped.. i saw him on tv that day live. Thanks for your opinion it is respected. But dummy was not called for.

@BrianK-zz4fk

28 күн бұрын

@@christianmonturanoii6539no horse ever would have beaten secretariat that day at the belmont.

@christianmonturanoii6539

27 күн бұрын

I don't think so sorry and he was 5 years before that and he was still the best. Man o war would woop secriariet. Maybe he's 2nd best

Thank You for the great video, fun and informative to watch. Horse racing is a history lesson and this one was A+

His offspring were the geartest hunter and jumper horses on earth . I loved riding secret legend at KIng's Bridge farms winning easily in the 3' 6" medal .

@bobblowhard8823

7 ай бұрын

What?

That was fun! Thank you for your delightful enthusiasm for these wonderful champions!

Both were great, one trained to go over a mile, the other had to learn how to go that extra more track, and ended up going much ferder than any other horse has other done.

my favorite racehorse was my favorite but Man o War was also a great ❤❤ horse. nothing can be taken away from either champion.😊

The fact that his records still hold up for the Derby, Preakness and Belmont tell me just about everything I need to know as well as the fact that his heart muscle was so large. I'd say, hands down, Secretariat is the winner.

@jasonwiggins

11 ай бұрын

Sham also had an enlarged heart. It's a byproduct of steroid abuse. So were his infertility issues when he first went to stud and Sports Illustrated wrote that it was most likely because of his steroid use.

@suzanneterrey4499

11 ай бұрын

@@jasonwiggins What is the source for your comment on enlarged hearts being the byproduct of steroid abuse?

@jasonwiggins

11 ай бұрын

@@suzanneterrey4499 Countless PEER review papers and studies. It has been written about in numerous Scientific Journals. Bodybuilder deaths are extremely high. Scientific Daily. Men's Health. Government studies and the corresponding PEER review literature. Literally too many to count. It's an established fact. Also, Secretariat fans will tell you that it's genetic. It's not. There have been studies searching for "gene x", which could account for a hereditary anomaly that would explain it, but those studies cannot find a link. Numerous Thoroughbreds have been documented as having enlarged hearts and internal organs. The rise of cases coincides with the introduction of steroids into Thoroughbred racing in the 60's.

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

@@jasonwiggins It could never be by a natural genetic growth? They used illegal steroids on horses by the early-'70s? How come there was no DQ on horses who had those drugs in them? Wasn't there tests for drugs then? No? What year did drug tests that could find steroid use start?

@jasonwiggins

11 ай бұрын

@@freeguy77 I'll start with this from last year. "New York’s Equine Drug Testing and Research Laboratory is considered one of the most preeminent in the country, but its director, George Maylin, and his team acknowledge their lab can test for and identify only a portion of the substances found in the thousands of samples taken from New York racehorses every year. "Here’s the problem: The so-called performance-enhancing drugs, no one - nobody - knows what they are,” Maylin said. “Nobody has a test for them.” Hall of Fame trainer Elliott Birch stated that steroids were introduced to Thoroughbred racing in the 60's, it was rampant by the 70's. The science behind performance enhancing drugs ALWAYS is ahead of testing. Remember the 2008 winner of the Derby and Preakness Big Brown? This was his trainers response for losing the Belmont. "Trainer Rick Dutrow told reporters that he had not given Big Brown a shot of the anabolic steroid Winstrol since before the Kentucky Derby and would not use it Saturday at the Belmont. Earlier, Dutrow admitted that he gave Big Brown and all his other horses shots of Winstrol on the 15th of each month." Read carefully. "Big Brown did not receive his monthly dosage of legal steroids in mid-May. Even the most peripheral horse player knows not to alter a horse's regimen during the racing season, unless it is endangering the horse's health." Testing was changed again after this admission, but as stated earlier, it's not enough. It never is. Steroids are allowed to this day, but in smaller doses citing the health benefits of the horse. Again, illegal steroids are given and testing can't find it. It's not a secret. EVERY Thoroughbred Racing Horse is on steroids. Some more than others, but EVERY one of them are on steroids. Fact. BTW: There have been COUNTLESS Thoroughbreds with enlarged hearts, lungs, and other internal organs. It's quite humorous that Secretariat's fans brag about his enlarged heart knowing what caused it.

Love the stories and the virtual re-enactment. Great video & narrative !

Debating Secretariat/MoW is like debating Jordan/Chamberlin. MoW/Chamberlin was an enigma, though he always loses in the debate against Secretariat/Jordan because of the times and competition. Even though MoW/Chamberlin had the more impressive stats.

This was fun to watch. Thanks for creating it!

My understanding is that ManOWar had many many decendents who proved to be great horses in their own right while Secretariet had few, if any, that performed well. With some refering to Secretariat as a "dud stud". So I guess greatness can be judged from many angles. As kids, I picked Sham back in the day while my sister chose Secretariat. It was heartbreaking to lose, but awesome to watch that Belmont! I still stand by ManOWar as my dad once owned a maternal relative of his who became just a saddle horse with only 1 good leg. So we grew up revering ManOWar thanks, in part, to books by CWAnderson. I no longer follow horse racing because of all the used up and broken down horses it leaves in its wake..... Besides, my idea of a superhorse was wonderfully embodied by an old grade mare named Easter. She was 14-2 and could neither run swiftly nor jump much more than 18 inches. But she had nerves of steel and was gentle as a lamb. I could ride her without a care in the world bareback with no bridle! She would pull a small sulky, too. I could call my dog to leap up on her to safely cross roads. And she would back continously for literally a hundred feet or more....UPHILL! All other horses pale in comparison to her in my book....she was kinda like riding an overstuffed chair....comfortable and absolutely dependable....I can still see the moonlight twinkling on freshly fallen snow as she ambled through the darkness....or the stars overhead as I laid back on her hindquarters. We bought her from Patty's Riding Stables in Burke VA in 1976 as they were going out of business. They told us she was the ONLY horse there that didn't threaten to kick them when they went out in the field to catch them for a day's work as rental horses. SHE was the greatest of all times!!!❤

@shopahauliquewithjacquelin7025

11 ай бұрын

At all times all but one horse in the 2023 Derby were single to triple descendants of Secretariat. Derma Sotogate being the only exception. Inbreeding to Secretariat is an actual thing. My double Secretariat mare is being bred to single Secretariat son of Tapit and Belmont winner Tonalist. Secretariat is probably the best broodmare sire the US has seen.

@sidney5383

11 ай бұрын

@@shopahauliquewithjacquelin7025 Interesting....I did not know Secretariat's genes were that highly sought after. I guess I should have noted that my research was done roughly 40 years ago....long before the internet and long before all those generations of horses even existed. As the sister of a veterinarian and as a former breeder of show quality Indian Runner Ducks and former member of The American Livestock Breeds Conservancy, hearing that there is THAT much inbreeding going on in Thoroughbreds is frightening. Narrowing the gene pool never bodes well for the resulting creatures as a whole. Oh yes....I will admit that you can achieve some truly stunning results! BUT the other side of that coin is often tragically deformed and crippled. Whenever man tries to remaster God's creations, things go awry. I put my share of malformed ducks on the dinner table so I do speak from firsthand knowledge. I hope the trend to focus on Secretariat bloodlines proves more fruitful than detrimental to the resulting innocent creatures. May God bless your mare with healthy babies!

@shopahauliquewithjacquelin7025

11 ай бұрын

@@sidney5383 thank you. The beauty of Secretariat is he had no conformational flaw to worry about multiplying by inbreeding. It’s those Native and Northern Dancer flaws that will get you. My mare was an A+++ match with Mineshaft, but since he’s a son of A.P. Indy and my mare is a granddaughter, it was too close for me. With Tonalist I get Tapit on the same cross as Country Grammer.

@shopahauliquewithjacquelin7025

11 ай бұрын

@@sidney5383 Flightline, the best horse in the world, is a double Secretariat. Monomoy Girl is also a double Secretariat and a double Seatle Slew. She just had an Into Mischief foal. So, the foal is a triple Secretariat.

@tobleroonie5043

8 ай бұрын

Only short-sighted people called Secretariat a dud, those who were looking for his first crop sons to copy him. He did not sire great sons, but great daughters. And his daughters produced great sons. So Secretariat was incredibly valued as a broodmare sire, and as others said he appears again and again in the pedigrees of the top racehorses today--many of them via A.P. Indy, a son of Seattle Slew and maternal grandson of Secretariat, who was so prolific and produced so many winners that he has essentially remade the entire breed in his image.

And then there was Ruffian. She was only 3 when she tragically broke her ankle and mercifully was put down. In her three years she was undefeated. The sad thing is that she was never asked to run. She had so much power that her people were afraid if she ever was asked to run they would never get her to slow down and stop. She never got to show what she was made of!

Really fun examination of some amazing horses!! Really liked your comments after the simulation. Secretariat was AMAZING, but Man O'War was seriously *phenomenal* too, in a way that I think it's harder for use to grasp given the difference in time. It was really great to be able to put Man O'War's grit and power into perspective a little bit more for us

According to Dorothy Ours in her biography Man O'War, the reason why Sam Riddle decided to retire Man O'War following the match race with Sir Barton was that Man O'War came up lame afterwards. He had not planned to retire him so soon; however, after giving the matter serious thought, decided that the best course of action was to retire him to stud. This was not the first time Man O'War had come up lame after a race. It is very possible that nobody realized that the heavy weights he was being forced to carry were causing damage to his legs. Personally I think a match race between Man O'War and Secretariat would end in tragedy for one or both of them. Especially if Man O'War had compromised legs. Neither one was a quitter. I can see where both would push themselves past the point of safety. Secretariat was very, very lucky that he did not break down on the track or in training. That Belmont victory is stunning, yes, but also very, very scary. Moving at the rate he did, there would be no way to recover from a badly landed step. This is not so rare as one might think. The horse racing industry is under fire because of the number of deaths and injuries that occur each year.

@Vydio

Ай бұрын

If I recall correctly, Sam Riddle was also becoming overwhelmed with the responsibility of owning Man O War.

On his best day (like the Belmont) no horse would ever beat Secretariat.

So educational & interesting, Sketchy! Thank you for making this video.

Man 'O War was the first 'Big Red' ! He is/was described as being chestnut in color. Beyond that, no comparison should be made, imo.

With these two great horse you can not bet on which one would win. It all depends on that day.❤

Man o'War also ran in Canada, his last start against Sir Barton was at Kenilworth Park. His races were also much closer together. I respectfully disagree with your conclusion, racetracks and peripherals improved dramatically in the 50 years following Man o'War's career, which might explain why his records fell. He was never really extended, after all. Secretariat was a nice horse, but he never carried as much weight, and didn't seem to be able to overcome adversity as well, which is why I, and I suspect the Blood Horse, chose Man o'War. I should add, I had a few issues of the 1948 Turf & Sport Digest, and they were full of arguments as to why Citation would never be the equal of Count Fleet. Different years, same arguments!

@noelharris1177

11 ай бұрын

Secretariat,a "nice" horse? What's that suppose ta mean? Still holds the TC records.Thats like sayin The Beatles we're a"nice"band. . .

@djkent9747

11 ай бұрын

@@noelharris1177 I dunno, been watching racing for 60 years, and found his performances. . . somewhat hard to believe. Factor in his breeding problems right after he retired, his death from chronic laminitis, and the enlarged heart, well, you do the math.

@vernonfrance2974

11 ай бұрын

@@djkent9747 He test bred appaloosas and had no problem. Many horses get laminitis. The heart was totally normal except for size according to the vet who did the autopsy. "Dr. Swerczek took a moment, and replied, “It isn’t awfully large, it is the largest heart I have ever seen.” “I was amazed. There were no pathological abnormalities of the heart, typically found in an animal with an enlarged heart. All of the chambers were normal. There were no lesions. It was a perfect heart, everything was just bigger,” he explained, “the average Thoroughbred’s heart is about 8-9 lbs. After doing necropsies on thousands of horses, I was very accurate at knowing how much a horse’s heart would weigh just by looking at it. I estimated his heart to be 21-22 lbs., nearly 2.5 times larger than the average heart issuu.com/equestriandirectory.ensomedia/docs/ked-2020/s/10168613." He has a daughter, Lady's Secret which was Horse of the Year. His son Risen Star won two thirds of the Triple Crown and another son, General Assembly, held the Travers record for many years. A son in Australia won the prestigious Melbourne Cup in 1990 with the fastest time for the two miles of the race ever and still holds that stakes record.

@djkent9747

11 ай бұрын

@@vernonfrance2974 I was around back then, and I remember the controversy over his breeding problems, given that he had just been syndicated for 6 million. You could google it, the info is out therr.

@djkent9747

11 ай бұрын

there. The heart thing is still being argued about. Supposedly Sham also had a larger heart.

LOL 👀 your play-by-play gave me moose bumps😂 thx!!

Great video breakdown of two amazing horses!!

There are many facts that would put Man O' War first because Man O' war had a HUGE stride. That determines a lot in racing. They are also related, and the way Man O' War ran, and his size, it's also likely his heart was also larger than normal. Wouldn't know without an autopsy, which is too late. John P Greer was the only horse to run with Man O' War for a distance and was never the same again. Also Man O' War's owner was NOT after track records any more than he was after an early race such as the Kentucky Derby. So if Man O' War would have had the same opportunities in the same time frame it's likely his untapped speed, and huge stride wouod have definitely challenged Secretariat. I do believe however that those two would have been more evenly matched than any of the horses out there. I think you should recheck track records, as I'm pretty sure Man O' War still has unbroken records. Most of the greats are related if you look at their bloodlines, whether its Hastings or Bold Ruler. Even Seabiscuit and War Admiral were related. Whats hard is even the best horses have bad days, and you could race them on separate days and each would win a different race, same length, same conditions. We'll never truly know, but I still believe after all Man O' Wars races and his progeny also dominating the sport, and other sports as well, I think Man O' War is still tops. Seattle Slew looked the most like him in build and attitude. A Large horse with an attitude and a big appetite. lol

@Jeni-ow1kl

11 ай бұрын

I believe that ‘Man O’ War’ had the longest stride ever recorded by any TB to date!?!!! I had the Great honor to see Secretariat in in last year. He was ABSOLUTELY AN AMAZING HORSE!⭐️ I have also had the great fortune to own a great granddaughter of Man O’War & Secretariat! The Man O’War mares were much ‘fiercely’ competitors than the Secretariat mares! But, BOTH Horses are ABSOLUTELY LEGENDARY ♥️✨

@joecolabelli4339

10 ай бұрын

Secr is over 4 SECONDS FAST ON A 1.5 MILE TRACK DO YOU HAVE A CLUE HOW FAR THAT IS ??

@harveyhorwitz1346

9 ай бұрын

All you can compare is times. Secretariat has records that have stood for over 50 years. Both healthy and running their fastest times Secretariat would have blown Man O’ War away.

@joecolabelli4339

9 ай бұрын

@@harveyhorwitz1346 Great post (100% correct )In exactly 150 years of racing COMBINED no horse has beat any of his 3 records (Think about that )

MOW would have challenged Secretariat. But that stallion attitude of Secretariat would not have allowed him to run second unless he was sick or fouled.

You nailed it on the head. Secretariat loved to run. From the back or lead from the front.

Very cool animation. And I really liked the Call. Well done, Sketchy.

Both Mon O' War and Secretariat were great race horses. I'm glad you chose Secretariat as the faster horse. Let's not forget that at Belmont and Preakness, Secretariat was actually accelerating as he crossed the finish line, showing that he could have gone even faster, if he wanted to. I give kudos to Man O' War, Sham, Sea Biscuit, War Admiral, and all the other great race horses in history, but none even comes close to Secretariat. He has been called by many as the greatest athlete of all time, human or animal.

@victorduncan3254

7 ай бұрын

Given the modern training and lighter horseshoes AND faster racetracks, Secretariat probably was faster. But he never went up against a determined horse like Man O War or a Citation. Imagine having a Jerry Bailey or Pincay on Man O War. The government probably would have stepped in and said is wasn't fair to allow betting against a lock like that

Remember Spectacular Bid still holds the world record time for 11/4 miles on dirt. He was 4 when that happened in 1980.

@JayAr709

Ай бұрын

When Secretariat retired, never racing at Four, he hid from history.

@joecolabelli4339

Ай бұрын

Compare their times when BOTH WERE 3 YEAR OLDS Hello horses get faster at 4

@sl-rt5kv

Ай бұрын

@@joecolabelli4339 *Compare their times when BOTH WERE 3 YEAR OLDS Hello horses get faster at 4* In fact, many horses look better if you compare their 3-year old times with the 4-year old times of other horses. Buckpasser set a world record for the mile at age 3 and covered the distance 2 seconds slower at age 4. Affirmed's best time for 1 1/2 miles at age 3 was faster at age 4 than it was at age 3. Damascus ran the 2-mile JCGC substantially slower at age 4 than he did at age 3. Seattle Slew ran 7f faster at 3 than he did at 4. The list goes on.

@jerryraper9386

13 күн бұрын

Not all horses get faster with age. It depends on soundness. Great 3 year olds are retired after a successful year. Insurance is to high to race them plus they will make a thousand times the money in the breeding shed. Which horse still holds all of the records in all triple crown races. And by a good margin. The Belmont time off 2.24 flat will never be equaled!

@sl-rt5kv

13 күн бұрын

@@jerryraper9386 The only thing that _counts_ in horse racing is winning. If you set a record, it still only counts as one win. That is why jockeys focus on winning while minimizing wear and tear on horses, as opposed to running the fastest times possible. Secretariat's 1 1/2 mile record may be unbroken, but the world records for 2 miles, 1 5/8, miles, and 1 mile have lasted even longer. Why does this matter?

Secretariat I believe would run as fast as would be necessary to win, he played his opponents. He ran from behind, he obviously could run any distance and would also beat Man o War, as you said all his times are recods.

Great video. You make the horses even more interesting. Would enjoy your doing a review of other individual racehorses whose names I remember, like Citation, Affirmed, and Seattle Slew!

The 3 races Secretariat lost. 1 He was rammmed by Quebec at the starting gate. 2 He had a bad abcess in his mouth. 3 He had a fevor, he ran sick. Secretariat always broke next to last in all his races and still won. Had he broke up front his races would have set more records.. There is no horse including man of war that could beat Secretariat, he is still supreme.

@MosheGoldbergTheKing

10 ай бұрын

He lost five races

@robertdoble7665

5 ай бұрын

@@MosheGoldbergTheKing All 3 Triple Crown track times still stand 50 years later.

@sl-rt5kv

2 ай бұрын

@@robertdoble7665 Yes but Citation won 19 races as 3-year old versus 9 for Secretariat. Winning 19 races in a single season is incredible. There isn't a snowball's chance in hell that Secretariat could have won 19 races in a single season under any circumstances. It's questionable whether he could have won 19 races in two seasons. In that season where he won 9, Secretariat also lost 3 times. That said, I would never claim that Citation was better than Secretariat or vice versa. The most reasonable thing I can say about these two is that they were different.

@robertdoble7665

2 ай бұрын

@@sl-rt5kv Would have liked to see them race though. You have valid points.

@question_it_701

Ай бұрын

yep, lol. Making excuses. I was undefeated in my high school and college sports season, when you let me throw in excuses. Quit being so foolish. He's an animal. Things don't always go as planned. Losing happens. Secretariat lost almost 25% of his races. He never won 6 races in a row. He had many many chances to win 6 in a row and he could never do it. His 3 race triple crown series was the best ever. His other races...outside of those, show him as just "better than average" -- losing 28% of the time outside of the TC series. Facts.

No way Secretariat would’ve ran Man O War off his feet like that when he was full extended to beat Sham in the Derby and Preakness. Man O War faced higher weights, quick turnarounds from race to race, deeper and more tiring tracks, heavier shoes, and still was solid, consistent, and so brilliant he won his races under a chokehold. You have to remember that races back then were also hand timed, Man O War was visually impressive enough to show us why he broke so many but those horses that supposedly “matched” or broke his records could’ve been human error, or heck even Man O War’s times were clocked slower than they actually were and as technology improved the records were taken away. The proof you need is in Secretariat’s Preakness. The electric eye failed and they had him at 1:55 and change until 2012. When they realized he was actually 1:53 flat. If they could make that big of an error 50 years after Man O War, imagine what they did in his time period. Man O War all the way.

@joecolabelli4339

Ай бұрын

BS Hello theres 5 plus seconds differ between the 2 over the same distance Get in your car and drive 5 seconds at 37 MPH

@rubroken

25 күн бұрын

Secretariat set course records for all 3 triple crown races, all 3 records still stand

@lynnhoffman247

20 күн бұрын

Man ‘O War’s stride angle was 88°…Secretariat’s was 110°. Secretariat 💯

@jerryraper9386

11 күн бұрын

Secretariat wasn’t all out in any three of his triple crown races. Especially in the Preakness. He toyed with Sham. How many times do think Sham was hit with the whip starting at the head of the stretch? Secretariat was hand ridden never even shown the whip. Could have won by more. To prove the point in his Belmont victory he ran each furlong faster than the previous . Freakish athletes come once in a lifetime. Super freaky comes once in the history of there entire sport from the beginning to the present. We were very fortunate to witness perfection . The closest to his Belmont performance 2 seconds and that was the second best at 2.26 was Easy Goer who was a superior race horse in his own right. When Pat Day claimed he was the best horse he had ever ridden that’s enough for me . All stats and studies prove that Secretariat was really in a class of his own. Don’t forget his final race on turf at Woodbine with a substitute jockey just had to hold on

@jerryraper9386

11 күн бұрын

Secretariat actually ran in 1.52 and change but that was not the eye catching part, it was how easy he did it if you want to talk about chock holds . He was eased and settled when he blew to the led coming out of the first turn and wasn’t asked for anything the remainder of the trip. He toyed with his competition

Good day, sir,I watched all of the triple Crown races of 1973. My parents were big horse racing fans and I am also, what we saw that Spring and summer of 73 was a once in a lifetime in a life time of great race horses “ Secretariat” greatest racehorse that ever drew a breath Period.

Fun fact: stride length and stride angle play the biggest roles in horse racing. Secretariat's stride angle was an amazing 110 degrees on a stride length of 25 feet. He had incredible flexion in his back and major joints meaning his "break over", or his ability to propel himself forward faster and faster, was the best in the game. Man o' War had a maximum stride length of 28 feet, which is still the longest ever recorded, but his stride angle was a mere 88 degrees, so his forward movement would have been arrested by less flexion in his frame. If we were to include a modern horse legend: American Pharoah has a stride length of 26 feet and a stride angle of 112 degrees. He is also larger on the whole than Secretariat. Who would win would, I think, come down to how efficiently the horse's body could maintain the speed. Secretariat's enormous heart and larger chest girth would give him a major edge. His heart could move his blood around much more efficiently than the others, and his larger girth allows for greater lung capacity.

Comparing 2 Champions from different eras will Always be impossible. Too many factors determine results. IMO Secretariat is the greatest race horse. Most consistent and toughest, ManOWar. Seabiscuit, Forego also get a mention as 2 of my favorites 🤷🏻‍♂️

i like the dream race segment; my only quibble is Man o War was much more of a frontrunner than Sec so in that race MW would most likely have been in the lead with Sec right behind; Sec would have then passed MW on the turn into the homestretch

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

We'll never know for sure, but readiing that MoW was a front-runner, exactly the opp strategy of Sec, it would have been interesting to see if Sec could have truly made up such a large (or maybe only a medium 5-7 lengths?) lead by MoW going into the turn at the start of the stretch, or not! I think MoW was such a superb race horse, he would have been pushed, more than other opponents in his 21 races almost all for sure, making him better in the stretch run with his huge 28-foot stride a decided advantage, 3 feet more than Sec.'s reported 24-feet 11-in., giving him the edge to hold on for the win. A champion responds to stiffer competition, and I think MoW was not pushed as hard as he could have, and still would have won by at least a half-length, if Sec was his opponent in 1919-1920. My opinion that no horse would have beaten Sec on June 9, 1973 at the Belmont, including MoW, with his magnificent 2:24 (beating the old record by 2.6 seconds), unless MoW could have stayed with him after that half-way point where Sec kept accelerating each 1/4-mile from the previous 1/4-mile. Would MoW been able to do that also, or not? That is the question!

@blackdog1153

10 ай бұрын

It's hard because MOW was never truly pushed and different conditions then today. 😕

As 3-year olds Citation won 19 races versus 11 for MOW and 9 for Secretariat. Winning 19 races in a season is incredible. It means that Citation was capable of sustained excellence while racing constantly with minimal rest between races. There is no evidence that Secretariat or MOW had the _ability_ to win 19 races in one season. That said, the fact that Citation was capable of winning more races does not mean he was better. There is no way to measure "better".

Loved this! Sounds like a reasonable outcome!

Greater racer? Secretariat. Greater stud? Man o' War. What he achieved his sons also did. Not so with Secretariat. His greatness is in his daughters.

@nancyjanzen5676

11 ай бұрын

You can't get a good racehorse without a good brood mare. It was from Something Royal that Secretariat got his staying power.

Such a fun video and EXACTLY what I was looking for to determine who was better. I still think it's a tie. 😂

I've always wondered what the outcome of a Secretariat/Man O' War match race would be. Excellent video Sketchy!

@RoadDawgs996

3 ай бұрын

There was never any question. This majestic animal was touched by God...go big red.

I love watching Secretariat run, almost makes it appear effortless when compared to the others. You can see him flawlessly change gears.

Fun to watch. Who knows who would have won. Both were amazing.

Man O' War. Remember in his day, they did not have manicured tracks that were 'fast', no starting gates, and no digital timers. Even so, some lady (I forget her name) did a comparison of times over the same distances as Secretariat, plus stride length and other factors and they came out so close it was hard to tell the difference. Now: add in the things for MOW that Secretariat had, and the first Big Red nails it.

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

Man of War was over 4 seconds slower on a mile and a half track Get a stopwatch drive 4 seconds at 32 mph NOT EVEN IN THE SAME UNIVERSE

@nealbennett4950

11 ай бұрын

I think starting gates slow a horse but if you backed Secretariat up two or three lengths give them all a head start he would have still beaten mow in every race except maybe Sham .

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@nealbennett4950 No, why do you think they introduced gates? Because the start was chaos of trying to keep horses in line, and is why many a race including MOW's Sanford AND his Potomac started poorly. In the Sanford, MOW and the other 2 outer-most horses were left at the line and probably had about a 4-length "handicap". Gates were great for making things more even.

@rudycantarini4649

11 ай бұрын

Man O'War was born in a year where there were 1,000 foals. Secretariat there were 25,000. No competition for Man O'War. Most times he raced against 1 or 2 horses. Secretariat still has world and track records 50 yrs later. He beat 3 Hall of Fame horses in one race+ Kennedy Road.

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

@@rudycantarini4649 1000% the debate is idiotic

That was fun. Now I need a Time Machine (big enough to haul horses). I watched Secretariat win the Belmont in 73. Nothing like it.

Secretariat was a freak of nature. Incredible finishing last quarter. When that horse died it was dissected and they found its heart was like 1 1/2 the size of a normal horse.

Secretariat had already won the Triple Crown but instead of getting a rest he continued racing steadily. He also faced older horses four times. Man O War did face the older Sir Barton after the first Triple Crown winner already had some ailments. MOW's record was 20 - 19 - 1- 0 while Secretariat's was 21 - 17 - 3 - 0. Native Dancer only ran three times as a four year old and was retired. Secretariat didn't run as as a four year old when he would probably have been even better. Secretariat lost his first race when he was bumped at the start, one race by DQ although it did not change the outcome of the race since his opponent still would have lost by many lengths and two starts against older horses when he probably needed a longer rest. A horse that should come up more often in the conversation IMP is Native Dancer. He won all of his races except one, and that by a nose. Of course, that was the prestigious Kentucky Derby. Talk about durability. In his three year old year he ran ten times from April 14 to August 22. He is probably in more modern thoroughbred pedigrees than any other with his two best known grandsons being the prolific Northern Dancer and Mr. Prospector. I think if he had ever run against the one year older Tom Fool and beaten him, his name would be even more heralded. Tom Fool was the sire of Buckpasser. He won 20 times, was second six times and third once in 27 races.

@noelharris1177

11 ай бұрын

21~16~3~1---4th in his debut

@vernonfrance2974

11 ай бұрын

@@noelharris1177 Right thanks!

@rickbateman2401

11 ай бұрын

Secretariat did get a rest after the TC races. It was 3 weeks after the Belmont before he ran his next race and more than a month after that before he ran his second race after the TC. He finished his racing career with 4 races between Sept. 15 and Oct. 28. On the flip side, Man-O-War ran a race on the weekend between the Preakness and Belmont which would be unheard of today.

@vernonfrance2974

11 ай бұрын

@@rickbateman2401 Native Dancer ran ten times between April 24th and August 22, losing only the Derby by a nose. If greatness were determined by the number of races a horse ran and the percentage of victories he would beat both MOW and Secretariat. However, it was the record speed of Secretariat's wins in the Triple Crown and the Marlboro Cup that distinguish him above MOW and ND, IMO. We'll never know, but many think Secretariat would have run even faster as a four year old. MOW did not even show up for the Derby because his owner thought that distance too far for a three year old early in the season. Many of his races had very few rivals. He also had to run in heavy iron shoes. So, we'll never know how they would have stacked up against each other. "They were both wonderful champions. "I don't think there is any need to compare them, just appreciate them." Carol Kelly But it's still fun to compare them and no one can prove anyone else is wrong.

@rickbateman2401

11 ай бұрын

@@vernonfrance2974 I agree that it would have been special to watch both of them run as 4 year olds but claiming records over a horse that ran in completely different conditions isn’t even close to a valid way to compare. All the advantages are Secretariat’s, especially the track surfaces. My point to the number of races is the fact that Secretariat wasn’t raced as hard as MOW or Native Dancer. Admittedly I don’t know much about Native Dancer but there is one thing I do know about Secretariat and MOW - neither horse was actually pushed hard in any of their victories and the races they lost were either human error, accidents or illness.

How could anyone claim they know alabought how man o war ran there's nobody alive who saw him race in person

@watchgoose

11 ай бұрын

His records are still available, plus still photos and even old b/w film.

Two great Champions in different era. You can say the same on Seattle Slew and American Pharoah. No discussion needed. We should appreciate their greatness.

Great video!

Love Man O War. Secretariat hands down

The track records says it all no comparison big red stands alone he has all three records

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

3, lol

Although they both raced in the Belmont, they did so at different distances. Man O' War's race was 220 yards shorter. In my math equation I assumed that MOW would not slow down over the last furlong. An adjustment that is clearly in MOW's favour, because almost all horses do slow down late in a race. In spite of this adjustment Secretariat won by about 2 seconds. The fact that Big Red's Triple Crown records still stand after 50 years says it all.

That was well done. Im a Secretariat fan. Having said that, thanks for putting Shame in the race. great horse. That was fun. Thanks brother.

Get this: Man O’War was the first horse to hold 3 American records simultaneously. By the end of 1920 he held 5 ARs simultaneously. Cannot verify yet, but he may be the ONLY horse ever to do that (Secretariat at best held 2, if you go by only dirt; in MOWs day no world or American records were separated and he beat grass records from Europe). I am now convinced the real reason MOW was adulated so was because of his uncanny record-breaking ability, which isn’t mentioned enough in modern discussions.

@brendaclark5185

11 ай бұрын

Just like Phar Lap, yeah

@janetgallo5720

11 ай бұрын

Play don’t even have accurate records from when Manowar ran

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@janetgallo5720 They have plenty. Do you think 50-year-old stuff is OK? They were still timed in fifths.

@nancyjanzen5676

11 ай бұрын

But none of those records lasted longer than 10 years. Secretariat 50 years and counting.

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

@@nancyjanzen5676 Where are you people getting the notion "NONE LASTED MORE THAN 10 YEARS"? FALSE. Track record at Belmont still there for 1-3/8 in 1973 (yes, Secretariat's year - and almost all records there were set that same 1973 incidentally). World record for 1-5/8 not broken until 1949. Come on. What are you going by, too? There are track, American (including Canadian and Mexican and Carribean) and world records. The WR means there is also an AR and a TR, so you HAVE to consider all those layers. For Sec AT THE TIME, only 1 was a WR and another an AR. The rest were TRs. Sec at best can be seen as 2WRs (1 of them qualified by surface, which wasn't recognized in 1973). So, maybe he wasn't as consistently "fast" as made out to be. Tracks and shoes etc were VERY different, as they are today, so don't go strictly by times - that is why Beyer Speed Figures were created, because even comparing day to day cannot be reliable!

Secretariat was never whipped, meaning he was never even asked to push it, he would have embarrassed MOW, it wouldn't have even been a race. MOW's owner never would have let them race, anytime he thought he might get beat, he would pull him. yes he lost one but that was the Jockey's fault, Let's say he raced in the Belmont against Sec, he would have been fighting for 2nd place. can't compete against the big heart gene.

@SSN862

10 ай бұрын

Secretariat was whipped. I can think of one instance for sure off the top of my head. In the Kentucky Derby watch him coming into the stretch coming off the turn. Ronnie whipped him. Man o War was only whipped once in his career, quickly opened up and broke a world record.

@jetdr

10 ай бұрын

@@SSN862 1 time just to let him know it was serious. you can watch Turcotte say that in an interview.

MOW was a great horse no doubt. That said, I saw Secretariat win the Belmont Stakes in 1973 on TV as a boy. It is without a doubt the most amazing athletic achievement I have ever seen.

Great video, great horses.

Once again, on his best day it is not whose number one, it is whose second behind Secretariat. P.S. As a second best , I take Sham and look Back.

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

Secretariat IS 2nd!

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 Your DREAMING Put the times side by side SEC IS over 4 seconds faster DID YOU KNOW THAT YES 4 SECONDS

@challloyd215

11 ай бұрын

@@joecolabelli4339 Is every Joe a fool???

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 ONLY an IDIOT would compare racehorses that are 4 seconds apart ACCORDINGLY WHY ARE TRACK RECORDS EVEN KEPT

@joecolabelli4339

11 ай бұрын

@@challloyd215 ONLY a complete and total IDIOT would begin to compare 2 racehorses that are over 4 seconds apart (SAME DISTANCE ) Accordingly why even keep track records BA HA HA EDUCATE BEFORE YOU POST

Secretariat is incomparable. It was absolutely humbling to watch his performance in the Belmont. I saw it live via TV and it totally blew my entire family away I was 30 years old at the time. Hell the only reason I even watched it was because of all the news media at the time. But I had NO idea that he would set the bar so high that it would NEVER be broken. Not EVER! Not a lotta people know this but he actually broke the all time 1 5/8 mile in this race as well even though the race was a mile and a half. Turcotte couldn't slow him down he was still accelerating!

@sl-rt5kv

4 ай бұрын

*he actually broke the all time 1 5/8 mile in this race as well even though the race was a mile and a half. Turcotte couldn't slow him down he was still accelerating* Actually, Secretariat was _decelerating._ He ran the second half of the Belmont Stakes _much slower_ than the first half. The final quarter mile of the race was his slowest by far. This is clearly recorded in the official fractional times at different stages of the race. Also, Secretariat did not break the 1 5/8 mile record because the official clock did not even record his time for 1 5/8 miles.

That was a lot of fun! Great analysis and effort on your part. Bottom line, you can only compare an athlete to his/her peers. Babe Ruth is the greatest baseball player of all time (in my opinion, and many others) but could he play today? With proper training, perhaps, but we'll never know. Luckily, we have videos of these great entertainers to watch, argue about and enjoy!

I feel blessed to have been alive to see the greatest racehorse who will probably ever live. A freak of nature that may never happen again with the good fortune to be healthy and racing. Secretariat.

What tilts my decision in Man O War's favor is that he was virtually unbeaten. And he took it very personally if you dared to try to go by him in a race. I think of Rocky Marciano when you think him. Incomperable

You got the winner right. Once Secretariat came on the scene, Man O War became just another horse.

@DoubleDogDare54

11 ай бұрын

Send Secretariat back to 1919 and 1920, race him the same schedule of races, under the same weights with the same conditions MOW ran for those two years, then get back to us on how Sec did. My guess is not so great.

@orbitsun

11 ай бұрын

@@DoubleDogDare54 Yeah, why don't you do that.

@DoubleDogDare54

11 ай бұрын

@@orbitsun Nice dodge. You know Sec wouldn't look so brilliant as a 2yo racing multiple times days apart with 130 on his back, steel shoes on his feet, running on the much slower dirt tracks of the time.

@roundtable3501

6 ай бұрын

@@DoubleDogDare54 Buddy, your entire case is based on an unproven hypothetical. It’s a useless argument. There’s no time travel.

@DoubleDogDare54

6 ай бұрын

@@roundtable3501 My case is based on common sense. I look at conditions the two colts raced under - weight, shoes, tracks, time between races - and Sec would not be able to do what MOW did. Even racing under the more favorable conditions in the early '70s Sec still got beat by Herbull, Stop the Music, Angle Light, Onion and Prove Out. Sham finished ahead of him in the Wood. He was not unbeatable, as his record proved. The single race MOW lost, he was facing the wrong direction when the barrier went up. I'm sure if Sec had been loaded the wrong way in the gate at the start of one of his other races he would have finished worse than second. So, MOW was the better colt. Hands down.

A lot of fun. And had you any other outcome...well torches and pitchforks would've been involved.

WOW! There is a lot about MOW and Secretariat you left out. I did a deep dive research on this subject to find the facts from the hype about MOW, and turned up some very interesting nuggets.

@SketchyTheHorseGuy

11 ай бұрын

Well then I’m glad I mentioned in advance in the video I likely was missing something because of how much their is to find about these horses lol. What are some of these cool nuggets you found during your research that I missed?

@freeguy77

11 ай бұрын

@@SketchyTheHorseGuy Still waiting on WickedFelina 2 weeks later! Maybe he is stuck in "El Paso" (1960 #1 hit song by Marty Robbins)?

@StayingFast

9 ай бұрын

@@SketchyTheHorseGuyyou left out that Man O War won the Lawrence Realization by 100 lengths, and the only race he lost he was facing backwards at the start.

@SketchyTheHorseGuy

9 ай бұрын

@@StayingFast I didn’t leave either of those things out in the video. The win in the Lawrence Realization is really not that impressive as he ran against one horse who was entered last minute by a relative of Sam Riddle. So not really worth anything his other races hold more merit

Tony Morris in his co-authored book "A Century of Champions" he gives a nuanced, balanced assessmet. Secretariat is definitely better than Man o' War

My grandmother saw them both. Said Man O War was the better horse.

@kevinwells4888

Ай бұрын

Finally someone with firsthand knowledge. Her opinion is duly noted.

@FoxScreamer565

24 күн бұрын

@jamessills5802 Was he faster?

Secretariat's over sized heart provides a strong physical edge over all others.

Both horses are legends,will always be. I was 9 yrs old when Secretariat won the crown. I remember those races to this day. I've seen the crown winners that followed Secretariat. Honestly,I don't remember those races. For whatever reason Secretariat made an impact on me.

Secretariat was a freak of nature. His abnormal physiology means that there really has never been a horse that could feasibly match, let alone beat him.

If man o wars heart wasn’t 10kgs I’ll eat my shorts! Tough to know which horse was better! Weight is one thing people forget about and it dose make a huge difference

nice video my friend.

Massive Respect for both champions... Man O' War and Secretariat... 🦋💜💜💜💜💜💜💜🦋

Sham should have been second

@fuzzipariah

8 ай бұрын

Sham second to Man O War. Secretariat third.

Man O' War I think only because I heard Secretariat had moments when he didn't want to run. Man O'War always wanted to run. So Man O'War had more heart.❤

I still watch Secretariats triple crown wins 50 years later. Long after the triple crown was over, he made the national news the few times he lost. Popularity was equal to all major sporting events at that time.

The colt that beat MOW in the Sanford was a colt named Upset. In the picture at 2:32 look at Upset's markings. Very similar to Secretariat. (Jan Griffiths).

I think Secretariat has Man O War blood in him did he i may be wrong but i think im right !!

@theOlLineRebel

11 ай бұрын

No, only sire Fair Play.

@AngelCatBaby

11 ай бұрын

I love both Secretariat and Man O’ War, but another great race horse is Ruffian, a filly who died after breaking her leg on the track while running, it would be her last race. She was in great pain and I cried for her. I remember this one very well. It was very sad, because she kept running even under anesthesia, they couldn’t keep her quiet. She gave her all. There was no way to save her. She should have been kept as a personal mare instead of racing her. Her legs were brittle from inbreeding and also from others in her lineage that had the same problem. Many times the horses haven’t developed enough for the rigorous of training for the life on the track, and many need more time for that to take place. But the racing season is also short lived. It’s sad, it’s more about the money than about the well being of the horse itself, but it wasn’t Ruffians fault, but the possibility of the breeders, who in trying to get that perfect racer, and In trying to get all into the lineage of previous winners, were also inbreeding certain qualities, and risk factors as well, with the inbreeding of genetic weaknesses into their horses ….weakness in the legs/bone structure. Race horses, I believe, are considered a year old around January 1st, even if their birthday falls later in the calendar year, such as the middle of June or even December months. Unfair to the horse. This is one reason why race horses have various problems later on while racing and/or with inbreeding genetics. Many years ago, I rode a race horse, named Tilly and retired from racing, she wasn’t allowed to run anymore, not only because of her age, but also because of her legs which were weakened enough to cause her to stumble and break down. I loved her dearly and she was fantastic, but still wanted to run. I had to keep her from doing that and also had to keep her calm. A lot of work, but I loved her. I still miss her…..🙏🏼❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

@AngelCatBaby

11 ай бұрын

@@theOlLineRebel…then in actuality, MOW would be a distant relative to Secretariat anyway because of Fair Play being MOW’s sire? Or would that be another horse sired by FP? I would like to research a lot of this on the horses, but I’m unable to pursue this, due to other responsibilities I have now. I’d love to know more about both horses, I thought the same thing when I first seen Sec, he looked a lot like MOW….❤️👍