I think father plays a big role in mother-son enmeshment. Father is absent physically or emotionally for both mother/spouse and son; or father has checked out as ‘paternal’ figure giving up the reins to a dominant (narcissist/cluster b) female spouse to keep the peace. The boy feels like the essential hero to this mother, who has usually no relationship with any daughters, and creates a continual drama/rescue me dynamic with her favoured son. I have seen this in life. Never ends.

Older female here. I really don't see this as the fault of the grown sons who are enmeshed. For me the fault lies in the narcissistic mothers who train the sons from a very early age to do their bidding. They groom their sons to be their surrogate husbands and these young boys do not understand that this is not normal. It's the only reality they have ever known and they have been brainwashed by mother. When they start to grow up and become more independent minded and find a girl/woman that they want to marry, their mothers refuse to let go. These toxic mothers do not hold up their end of the bargain regarding the Biblical "Leave and Cleave" principle for marriage. They refuse to "release" their sons to their new wives and therefore "compete" with their sons new wife and thus become the typical "mother in law from hell". This puts a huge strain on the son's marriage, because he cannot understand why his wife objects so much. These dynamics are "normal" for him. Even if he has become aware that his mother is narcissistic and that this dynamic is harmful to his marriage, he feels indebted to his mother (who has groomed him) and he feel excessive guilt if he refuses to do his mothers bidding. He feels guilty to show his mother that another woman (his wife) is now his priority and that he will have so install boundaries in order to preserve his marriage. I think these men need a lot of support, sympathy and understanding, because lots of times they grow up completely unaware that they have actually been victims of narcissistic abuse (enmeshment) all of their lives.

@margaretvanson3601

10 ай бұрын

You sound as tho, just like me, you have had a mother - in - law from hell. I saw a woman in the supermarket yesterday with two enmeshed sons. One of them caught my eye and the desperation in his eyes broke my heart. My husband, who was able to break his enmeshment, was the one who identified the look and provided the description, "desperate". In so doing he verbalised what it feels like to be one of those poor men whose mothers sacrificed them on the alter of their narcissistic needs and desires.

@blitzkrieg6872

10 ай бұрын

@@margaretvanson3601 Yes, I do have a mother in law from hell. However, she is no longer part of our lives. We are estranged from her and she is no longer welcome in our home. She refused to act civil towards us. She was rude, critical and demanding. We have gone no contact and our lives are so much better for it.

@margaretvanson3601

10 ай бұрын

@@blitzkrieg6872 good for you. So impressed your husband was able to see the damage and make the break. There's an awful lot of enmeshment/covert incest mother - to - son and at some stage society will have to have a conversation about it. Give your brave husband a pat on the back from me.

@user-cg7gh4bk7z

7 ай бұрын

Well said. I am the "other woman"😁 the girlfriend 😅 I joke but it is actually very serious. The sabotage and complete selfishness of a mother like this. I have spent a couple years trying to figure out what exactly was wrong in this situation and where my rights begin and his mother's begin or vise versa. With her being his Mother, I agree , yet at the same time I can't help but think with awareness comes responsibility.....

@blitzkrieg6872

7 ай бұрын

@@user-cg7gh4bk7z Thanks for your response. Yes, I am also the "other woman" (the wife). My "mother in law from hell" has causes major damage to my marriage as well, due to her inability to let go and her constant competing with me. It has taken me two solid years and many arguments with my husband, to open his eyes and set the neccessay boundaries in order to avoid divorce. It's a very serious problem.

Yeah my mom would always find excuses to be doing something in the bathroom while I was in the shower, which always included creepy staring at me, naked in the shower. And she would be naked too. There were ZERO boundaries. I have zero sense of self and fold my reality to meet whatever mom needs

@SeekingIntegrity

3 жыл бұрын

You are not alone with this experience. Thank you for sharing it.

@user-cg7gh4bk7z

7 ай бұрын

😢 so sorry 😔

Part 2A is actually missing. We only have 2B. Would love the first half!

Thank you for this question and answer session. You guys deserve more views. This is great information you are offering here. Blessings! :)

@MPHswayze

Жыл бұрын

Some of the asides and metaphors in between questions were things I've never heard. The Q&A format was great for bouncing ideas around

My boyfriend for the last four years won’t even discuss or acknowledge his dysfunctional enmeshment with his alcoholic and narcissist mother. He continually gaslights me and projects that I’m not attentive or loving to avoid taking accountability.His mother lives with him and he goes home to her every day and neglects me.

@6955beniegn

2 жыл бұрын

im a mother enmeshed man. i used to live with my narc mother too, trust me, its not his fault, its like he is brainwashed, like in a cult, he will never see that his mother is evil until he gets counseling and gets deprogrammed.

@MissSarahGM

2 жыл бұрын

@@6955beniegn Is an enmeshed mother necessarily a narcissist? My ex boyfriend (39) seemed enmeshed and he was so focused on pleasing his parents and having their validation (also his siblings), more than he was focused on me. And he has poor self-esteem. He never had a gf before me. I feel like the mother sabotaged it and he confided in her. They seem all nice and friendly at first, but after a while staying with my ex, and I saw how he was chatting on their family group chat each evening, the mom could pop up at the front door. She talked to me and she talked about her son as someone not ready to be in a relationship, and like she knew everything about him. She overshared and talked about her a lot. Quite self-absorbed and also trying to seduce me.

@6955beniegn

2 жыл бұрын

​@@MissSarahGM In my opinion, yes, a domineering mother can be a narcissist too. In Dr Adams book, 'when hes married to mom', he never explicitly says that all enmeshing mothers are narcissists, but some definitely are. My mother was a narcissist, and also enmeshed and used me. The enmeshing mother only cares about herself, and will use her son for her own needs. Yes, I'd say your bf is enmeshed with his mother. I was too close to my mother too, and there's a sort of subtle brainwashing that goes on, where the son puts his mother first, before his own needs. . I never went to work, and went 13 yrs with no relationship or gf at all. My mother's needs came first. Im 54 now, and still trying to separate from my mother. Your bf's mother may seem nice, but she wants her son all to herself, and your the competition. Your bf's mother is probably putting you down and belittling you when your not around, to slowly convince him to dump you, so then she can have her son all to herself again. I gave up on all relationships in my life, just to now be alone with my mother. I finally moved out, she is 90, im just waiting for her to die, so i can be rid of her, im an only child, i have to care take her. Yes, i had self esteem issues too, your bf's mother has put your bf down all his life, and now that his mother has held him back, he holds himself back. I recommend you read dr adams book. You'll understand your bf better, and why he is trapped with his mother. There's a way out for your bf, like setting boundaries etc, its all in the book.

@MissSarahGM

2 жыл бұрын

@@6955beniegn Wow thank you so much for your reply. I will see if I can order this book where I am. My heart goes out to you. The damage these mothers can do is terrible. It's parasitic. Such an awful thing. Especially as the enmeshed man seems to be unaware for a very long time, if he ever wakes up. I am hoping your healing journey will liberate you so you can live your own life and put yourself first, as you deserve. Fortunately not all women are overbearing and controlling. I know how a narc parent can mess up with our brain as my dad is one. He's 79 and maybe because it wasn't as close as the mother, I rapidly learnt to hide things and not confide in him fully. But he would also put me in a box, seduce me, keep me dependent financially and create fears in me. I hope you can set boundaries with your mother now, even if you still take care of her, but don't sacrifice your life. I have observed my ex's symptoms, it looked like BPD sometimes, CPTSD, and OCD (he obsessed over the rightness of the relationship, if he had strong enough feelings for me, finding flaws etc), but in the end, learning about the enmeshment and narcissistic families is what makes more sense. My ex had constant doubts, he loved the closeness with me but then would become fearful (I felt like he saw his scary mother in me at times), and would have urges to break up. The irony is that he would ask his mom (and sister who also seems narcissist) for advice. And like you said, they probably pushed him away from me. It was during the holiday so they were all together, perfect time for brain washing. Maybe that's to keep him in his place, dependent emotionally and unable to thrive on his own. He would say self-loathing things and this must come from his family cultivating his shame and guilt, and that "he's not enough". Instead of connecting the dots, and be angry at her, he projected his anger onto me! And honestly I was pretty patient and loving. Like you said, about putting your mom's needs first, it seemed as if he didn't even know what were his needs, he would neglect his health too. Doubt my love, as if this couldn't be true and I would leave. I had the opportunity to talk to him about the breakup and how it wasn't fair that he went to her for advice instead of talking with me. It was a relief. I felt like I was fighting for our love but it was doomed from the beginning and he was in a cult. The few things that makes me believe she could be NPD is that she overshared about her adult children and husband, revealing details undermining them, as if they had no right for privacy and they were her extensions. also presenting herself as a martyr mom. She also mentioned at some point she still had a sexual life with the dad, which seemed inappropriate. She sort of seduced me with compliments. She kept saying my ex was not ready and a loner and she wondered why he was even dating. Which shows she lacks empathy. He's a man and everybody wants to find connection and love! Maybe she convinced him he's not meant to be in a relationship. And he's so gullible he believed the discomfort he felt with me meant I wasn't the right person. When in fact it was the trauma left by the mother! He recently contacted me after months of no contact. I will let him open up, he never was fully showing his feelings, so maybe I am hoping in vain. But would you have an idea how I could bring up the subject? It doesn't seem like he has awareness regarding his family system, it's like he is still a boy depending on his parents, trying to please, be validated and probably to avoid their rejection.

@6955beniegn

2 жыл бұрын

​@@MissSarahGM i got busy, sarah, ill read and respond to your message tomorrow, ok, talk to you then, take care

Thank you both!!!!!!

Very helpful.

*would love first half of part 2.

Enmeshment comes from narcissists many times.. you should stop saying it isn’t malicious bc sometimes it is.

@SENSEF

Жыл бұрын

I completely agree! Mothers (and Fathers) who only care about their own feelings, not the son's (or daughter's). These people are not healthy to keep in your life, they intentionally push your boundaries constantly and create drama just to prove they are still in power. This needs addressed more. There are times "no contact" is absolutely necessary.

@nickieglazer7065

10 ай бұрын

@@SENSEFTotally agree. Enmeshment & Narcissism go hand in hand. You are seen as an extension and objectified. There is no separation individuation or healthy boundaries.

I always felt odd around my boyfriends family and felt the dynamic was strange. I could never pin point what it was….until now! Now that I have a name for it I can look at it and decide if I want to be apart of that, I chose to walk away. It’s too embedded and according to them “I was raised wrong and lack a close family dynamic”. 😂 He fails to realize he is on his 3rd Marriage and it “never his fault” because the Cult family reinforces his actions

@KalmateTurista

10 ай бұрын

Do you feel better now?

Could you please pick a part Pedro from Family Chantel so you could give attention to this important topic that everybody is avoiding because of the holy position of the mother. This how I ended up here by the way. I have always been victim blamed for complaining about my mother instead of my father about child abuse Not that my father would win any awards for father of the year but I could see who the real captain on the ship was I could see how she say me her own daughter as competition and how she was destroying my brothers, but I am the enemy of all

Part 2a and 2b is the same video uploaded twice.

@_Trakman

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, was just about to comment this too

@Spinning4Lisa

3 жыл бұрын

Ditto

Father is the one that takes the kid from the mother, especially sons, around the age of 4(then it starts), even the kid him/herself asks for dad, so mother should be in second place, it is painful for her, but she should be able to handle it... and they both shouldn't be a wuss about it... women's intuition has all the answers how a man should be, which is extremely interesting... the problem is that this world is trying to brainwash us that it is more than ok to be nowhere near emotional maturity... but a woman's intuition always can tell(they all want strong character, self-confidence, etc. etc.)-it is all a result of full maturity, no mother or father can make a grown man decide or not decide something based on emotion, only if that mature man believes that same thing himself because of his own individual thinking and feeling...

What about men who act out sexually and look for ananymous sex on the premise that it's a behaviour they CAN control and while it's anonymous it's sex without complications. Eventually the secret life ends up controlling THEM. And they get caught when they gave explain to their wife why they are HIV.

@KalmateTurista

10 ай бұрын

A lot of assumptions in that comment

Some of this is a bit extreme, like I have over the years run from the bathroom to my bedroom with a towel. WITH A TOWEL. That is not ''exhibitionism''. Geez. Feeling guilty now that I put my clothes on the clothing horse in the kitchen. And that has obviously included (some) underwear. Some people are allowed to be women. A mother is actually allowed to be a woman. There's a big difference between behaving inappropriately and just living in your own house as a woman.

@kristen9827

9 ай бұрын

A bathrobe? That works. Underwear on the coat rack?🤔 This shouldn’t be that hard. Of course you can be a woman, but being mindful who’s around you. And be aware of your motives.