In this video, I go over what I learned- everything from animal skin leather being coated in a plastic top coat, to non-animal alternatives, to investigating if leather is actually a ‘natural’ product that is as sustainable as many would like to think it is. As a vegan, I already knew that using animal skin leather was wrong, and what I learned in my leather deep-dive really helped to solidify that for me. I hope you learned something as well, and that this video has helped you to make better informed choices and be able to engage in conversations about leather more robustly. · Subscribe to the channel: kzread.info/dron/O7tf_Uhh2cYRJ7a2netIqw.html · Instagram: instagram.com/tofudog4u/

@temple69

6 ай бұрын

loved the video, though two things i have questions about, why arent you subscribed to jamies corner and also are you autistic?

@VeganSemihCyprus33

6 ай бұрын

Your videos are always very well researched and informative! Keep up the amazing work!

im always shocked to see how much we are influenced by marketing... the marketing tactics for leather remind me a lot of those from the diamond industry

Finally someone makes a video about this. Greenwashing regarding leather, wool, and other fake-sustainable fashion items has gotten extremely overwhelming lately.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Yep, it can be exhausting to watch people confidently excuse their behavior with pure nonsense. Had to put a word in

Luxury cars used to have cloth seats. It is more durable, warmer in the winter, and cooler in the summer. My family had a cheap 90s Nissan with cloth seats and it had, I think, 400k miles on it. The cloth was still in great condition while one of our cars with leather seats and ¼ of the miles were ruined.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Big fan of cloth seats myself! It's a shame that leather has been associated with higher-end vehicles

@familiarstranger9617

4 ай бұрын

idk why but when I read “Cloth seats” I imagined a care with an interior of denim

In terms of the difference between ancient (non-plastic-coated) leather, and what is commonly considered leather today (shiny, waterproof, etc.), I'd just remind you of vellum manuscripts. If you've ever handled a book (or map) on real vellum (ancient leather) at an archive or museum, you'd know the difference between its texture and a car seat (or a child's baseball glove) today.

So to recap: - Types of leather: Full grain > top grain > split, etc. Better leather might end up being less processed. - Types of processing: Tanning (nasty chemicals), dyeing (plastic), topcoat (PU). Also, PU is not very polluting to create, but PVC is. - Emissions: Tanning leather emits more co2 than discarding it, and more co2 than creating PU leather. - Plant-based alternatives: Vegan leather can be made with low or no plastic, and these alternatives are starting to see use for things like car seats. - Lab-grown leather: Skin could be grown without the rest of the animal in a post-beef-industry world, but it would still have to be processed. - Non-leather alternatives: Cotton (can be waxed for water resistance and texture/patina), canvas (can be coated with plastic for printing and water resistance). Thanks for doing the research and putting this all together! Did I miss anything? P.S. This is something I'd been wondering about for a while, so double thanks for sating my curiosity. I mostly care about reducing plastic and pollution, so I'll be on the lookout for fully plant-based alternatives, and it's also good to know that so much real leather is coated in plastic!

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Summary looks soild! Only thing I'd say is I didn't see that no/low plastic alternatives are being used for cars, they tend to be PVC/polyester so far, and plant-based/no plastic is still a bit on the experimental side for car use. However, this could certainly be coming soon. I'd also add cork to the non-leather alternatives, if it meets your needs :) Really glad you found it interesting! There's so much out there to be explored.

I have a leather motorcycle jacket that saved me two times from road rash. It's a bit scratched, but after two crashes it's still usable. I just don't know if any other material could have withstood the same treatment, maybe kevlar but I'm not sure. But in regular clothes not designed to literally save your life, alternatives are welcomed.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

This was something I was curious about too, I mentioned it and linked an article about specifically vegan friendly motorcycle gear. Seems to be not super abundant, but is out there!

@gusmonster59

6 ай бұрын

Ballistic mesh jackets do the same thing and are far cooler (temp wise) in the summer than leather.

Back in 2015, PETA spoke at Tesla’s shareholder meeting, and got them to look into using fake leather. Now, fake leather is the only option Tesla offers for their car interiors.

@WestlyEdell

6 ай бұрын

Thanks for the background. I am always surprised that Tesla gets no credit for this.

@gusmonster59

6 ай бұрын

Why Telsa get credit for listening to a group of people and then offering only fake leather? My guess is that they learned fake leather was cheaper to use, so went with that.

@SSStofu008

5 ай бұрын

@@gusmonster59 it doesn’t matter as much the reason why they did it

This video is critically underrated, I've shown it to many of my friends. and they all found lots of value in it.

I’ve come to the conclusion that buying new is always going to be worse despite “sustainable methods” compared to buying used. I used to work at a large manufacturer that makes the fake leather that goes into car interiors, and I really appreciate how well researched this video is.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thanks for the kind words! I buy basically nothing new, I agree it’s often the best way to go.

27:52 mycelium (pronounced mai-see-lee-uhm) is not a type of mushroom. It is a network of fungal threads, similar to the roots of a tree.

If leather lasts forever, why do people keep buying it 🤔

@EroticInferno

6 ай бұрын

Because people want to show their status via their processions. Why are some of the girlies buying 50 Stanley cups when the purpose is to reduce waste? Consumerism and “signaling wealth” have caused this. For leather and for everything else we buy.

This was a well thought and very informative video!! I appreciate the time and effort you put into researching this ☺️

I'm going to react to this one after dark tomorrow.

As a leatherworker I was very impressed by this video and I actually learned quite a few things.

I do think that in some cases high quality leather does outlast alternatives enough to offset the environmental impact. I own just a couple leather products (boots, belts and wallet) and they all last many, many times longer than any alternatives that I've ever owned. I expect that small high-wear items made with high quality leather have lower lifetime environmental impact than non-leather alternatives. Additionally it is worth noting that most plastics are a co-product to the fossil fuel industry, so there is some impact there as well. That said, there is a lot of progress being made on non-petrolium alternatives

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

I certainly agree that there is a lot of progress that needs to be made! No doubt a lot of high quality leather items last a very long time, but I also think that it's important to know that not all leather is the same, and that it isn't always a cut and dry situation.

On the point of "do you repair vegan leather" - where I lived for a while (Serbia), they explicitly refused to repair my vegan leather shoes and it took me three shoemakers to find a fourth one who was willing to patch them up. It comes down to what materials are in circulation for the shoe workers to learn to work with and repair, so not a stupid question at all.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Huh, makes sense! Thanks for sharing :)

@nobodyqwertyu

6 ай бұрын

Yes, I have also had a leatherworker refuse to repair artificial shoes

Great vid! Have not heard this objection much myself, but happy I’ll be much more informed on the topic when I do.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thanks very much! It’s one I tend to see more online, especially when the words “vegan leather” are used to describe a product, rather than in real life. But it stuck with me enough to need to know more!

I am only mentioning this for reasons of historical accuracy (i.e., I am vegan myself). Keep in mind that in ancient times leather was made more useful and water resistant by coating it (again and again) with liquid dubbin, i.e., disgustingly enough, a layer of animal fat (that would remain squishy to the touch). This was similar to the production of paint from bear grease. I wish I was joking. Many modern authors describing the ancient world are unaware of this (George R.R. Martin) and describe the use of ancient leather as if it were modern.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Yeah, there is a lot to learn if one is curious about the history of leather. There is also a type of leather that is tanned/processed by using the mashed up brains of animals.

@musicandbooklover-p2o

6 ай бұрын

Nowadays we use beeswax

Leather is SOO heavy. When I started Uni I got a beautiful leather messenger bag that I had wanted. I hated the look of canvas messenger bags so I asked for the leather one. It was so heavy. I ended up using a backpack if I had to carry more than one book and my notebook. That bag has hardly been used to this day. It's so pretty but so impractical.

Quote, "They are playing 'the floor is lava' but with the word plastic." 😊

I believe boots for wild land firefighters are required to be leather. I believe it has to do with melting and/or catching fire due to high heat.

Great video, thank you for making it. Hi Guts, hi Jotaro

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching! :)

Great job, how come you have so few subs? It's like asmr to hear someone finally saying how unsustainable real leather is

There was clearly a lot of work put into this video, thanks a lot! Props on the links to the sources.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thank you for watching! That's what makes all the work worth it

Kinda want to experiment with waxed canvas and the other materials mentioned to make boots. Never made a shoe before but waxed fabric is probably an easy start. Tho I probably don't want to use any waxed materials to make the soul lol.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Yeah, I think there is a lot of space for innovation in vegan-friendly shoes. There are definitely good options already out there, but people are so reliant on leather that the alternatives aren't nearly as well-explored as they could be! I wonder if cork could be a good option for the inner soles

@nobodyqwertyu

6 ай бұрын

Cork is really not a good option for shoe soles, It's not a durable material and on heavily used items will literally start disintegrating. @@tofudog4u

This was so informative, I learned a lot!! Also, your camera presence/video quality is very good considering how new your channel is. Subscribed!

@tofudog4u

5 ай бұрын

Thank you so much!!

Actually, a lot of specialist (at least where I live) don't repair vegan leather because that's not what they learned to do so they don't know how to do it

Thanks for the content

Love my faux leather jackets, got a Vegan patch for one of them and hoping to get one for the other. Don't want people to think I support wearing animal skins!

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Vegan patch is a great idea, love that!

I hope you'll talk about your antinatalism in a future video

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

It's on the list 👍

@EvanBoyar

6 ай бұрын

Very good@@tofudog4u

educational

Outstanding video. I hope it gets the attention it deserves. It seems the only reason anyone would want to wear leather is because they like someone else’s skin on or touching them. A symbol of domination, perhaps.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thanks! Leather really is pretty creepy when you think about it

I feel like your takes at around 19:00 are a bit too facetious - for example the idea that "leather practically has unlimited durability"... I'm very sure that no one EVER said that. I'm pretty certain that you're extrapolating a very realistic claim, that being that "leather is highly durable" and just taking that ad absurdum and claim that people say it's indestructible. There are a lot of leather items that people have for years and years BECAUSE it is durable. How often do you replace the leather seatings in your cars? I'd venture the answer is "never". How often do you buy leather couches? the answer is: Once the other couch is basically ruined, so after 15-20 years. That stands in no way comparable to fabrics that may last for 5 or 10 years. I think you can acknowledge that without saying "so leather is better and good night", you can still have all the arguments that leather comes from animals, that you sometimes need highly toxic chemicals and so on. There are many reasonable arguments against leather, but saying "Well someone said it's indestructible so stop buying it because why would you buy more if its indestructible" when no one said it was, is weird. It's not helping your otherwise good case.

Wonderful content! So many sources too. I'll be sharing this :)

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Thanks so much, means a lot :)

@Corvid_Moon

6 ай бұрын

@@tofudog4u It's certainly been a hot topic after I posted it in the r/sustainability subreddit :P

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

​@@Corvid_Moon haha, thank you for sharing it!!

@Corvid_Moon

6 ай бұрын

@@tofudog4u My pleasure! You make great content :)

Leather is disgusting and I find it really weird people are all for promoting leather for all kinds of clothing and furniture and whatnot, but will still be vehemently against fur products. Must be like the weirdness of people only against dog and cat cruelty but no other animals.

@tofudog4u

7 ай бұрын

Yeah, I think lots of people just don't actually recognize leather as skin. Very mentally detached from reality

As someone who owns a lot of second hand/vintage leather pieces I can confidently say, yess vegan leather is shit compared to real leather. I had vegan leather shoes that started cracking after a few months. And then I also have shoes that were worn for years by a previous owner that I still wear every week for years. The difference between the two? The lasting one is made from real leather.

@Corvid_Moon

6 ай бұрын

Just to counter-anecdote: I own 4 pairs of shoes/boots, none of which had come from an animal. All except 1 have lasted years & are still in great shape. There are good & bad products, irrespective of whether they're vegan-friendly or products of animal cruelty. We shouldn't allow our biases to cloud our higher judgement, especially when there are victims involved: kzread.info/dash/bejne/hHlmz8qan7i0kag.html Just because something is "vegan", doesn't mean it's "shit"; that's anti-vegan rhetoric & has no place in honest discourse.

OMG, this video got me so excited but for different reasons.(BTW I apologize for the mini essay) Firstly, I think this video is well written and I think I brought up a good point, I really do think that more people should watch this video That being said, I’m still not convinced that fake leather is the solution. I work with leather, specifically making wallets, I had never been able to find a wallet that was made with fake leather that could last me more that a year. I made a wallet out of leather about 2 years ago and its still works perfectly fine and I have no doubt that it it’ll last me many more. I think that especially in this case, leather still works WAYY better than any fake leather I’ve seen. In the same vein, I’m not particularly convinced that a high end brand using a product necessarily means quality, just because It’s expensive , doesn’t mean it’s good quality, just means that it has a brand name ppl like. As for all leather that isn’t naked Veg tan (i.e. veg tan with not plastic coating or synthetic dyes) it breaks my heart that people used them, I love the look and feel of naked Veg tan, and it has so many positives that it a shame that people want to undo that with oil(chrome) tanned leather. I really don’t think that leather has to be difficult to care for or stiff for that matter. Leather can be softened by tumbling and hammering which tenderizes it. You shouldn’t need some highly specific product to clean leather, naked veg tan can be cleaned with a mix of soap and milk/cream. I don’t think you need a plastic layer on it to keep it waterproof, a mixture of : beeswax, boiled linseed oil, and turpentine works great and it last a tremendously long amount of time and it can over a huge area. as for CO2 emissions, I don’t think that that is always the best argument. Plastic bags have a lower CO2 emission than cotton tote, it’s commonly sited that you’d need to use a cotton bag 173 times to lessen your CO2 emissions compared to a plastic bag. Leather is similar, as you said, pleather goods, have a lifetime of 1-7 years, lets say that it’s 7 years; a product using good quality leather can last 100 years, that’s already above the 7-1 ratio leather goods need to compete before they are better of the environment. And the thing about end of life is that naked Veg tan, is, at the end of the day, still skin and it will biodegrade, plastics wont for a long long time. If you use leather item for twice as long as pleather item, which, in my experience, isn’t difficult, then leather has already produced less CO2, using a leather product for 7 times longer than a pleather which in the case of wallets is very easy, then leather is already more sustainable and doesn’t pollute the planet with plastics and will decompose back into nature given a moist bacterial environment (compost). A leather sheet can also be split like you said so suede which has about the same lifetime as pleather, also still has the top grain which can be used for other things so you could get 2 things for the same sheet of leather, personally, I hate suede covered in plastics, I think naked Veg tan suede is beautiful and can be used for other things besides ripping off people. I like to make lace form it, it can be used to make tassels or other decorations, it can be used for dream catchers, or even, as a protective layer. Using suede to protect easily scratched stuff that will be in contact with that will try to scratch it is a good idea, like using it on the tip of shoes as it hides scratches a lot better or on steering wheels. I do thing that a large problem is not from the leather but how with think about the stuff we have. A lot of the time this idea of “sustainability” is used so that people keep buying, and I think that’s the problem, the fashion industry doesn’t want you to buy less so it tricks people with this Idea of “better for the environment” I think more people should take care of what the have and use it as much as they possible can instead of just buying something made from plastic that wont last long. I think leather solves this problem of being able to use an item for longer and being able to take care of it to buy less. When you buy less you lessen you impact. I personally found the comment of “veganism isn’t about sustainability” rather …odd. If veganism is about protecting the sentience of an animal, wouldn’t destroying the planet trough stuff like fast fashion and plastics impact their ability to live good life? Does that not also impact their consent? They do get a say in if they live or not, but they don’t get a say in what we do with the planet? at the end of the day wouldn’t not caring as much for the environment as you do about animals mean that you are still denying them some freedom? Anyways, I think that you brought up some ideas for alternatives for leather, I still don’t believe that polyurethane is the solution to this problem and I think just mixing plant matter with plastics still won’t solve the issue. That being said I do find the idea of using mycelium as leather is actually very smart, both mycelium and skin have very similar structures and I think that perhaps finding a strain of mycelium that has the same density as that of skin, could realistically replace leather without the need of PU and could in theory be tanned like regular leather, I think so far, this is the most promising avenue for replacing leather and I think that I could even be way more sustainable than both leather and PU. Also the idea of using your own skin as a sample to be grown is a truly interesting idea. Books have been bound in human leather and they work just as good as any other leather so I think the idea of lab grown leather to replace harvested leather to an incredibly promising one too. Imagine using lab grown skin form your cells to make both the parchment and leather to make an original tale or to be used as a diary, It could be an intensely personal experience. As for using canvas, cotton might be a bit too much, although I do like the idea of using waxed fabrics instead of leather products for a lot of cases. I think that perhaps hemp could work better. Hemp doesn’t contain the “happy” chemicals of weed but is a great fibrous plant. Another good plant fiber that could replace cotton for some uses could be jute. Jute is far less picky than cotton and has been used for a long time to make sacks bags and clothes. If you’re arguing purely on a moral basis, I still don’t think that pleather is the choice and I personally found it odd that you pushed pleather so much instead of spending more time focusing on greener, more sustainable, less polluting alternatives like jute and hemp. I do think that leather is way too prioritized, I don’t think that people need leather jackets when a cotton works just fine and is extremely warm, or thick canvas of protective cases. I do still think that leather still has a lot of great uses that pleather lacks and the reason why it falls short is not because of the material itself but rather because of the lies that are spread by people who want to keep you buying new and more stuff. Those are my thoughts, I really don’t hate the video, but I also don’t think that leather has to be this Evil thing that only insanely cruel people use.

🥗🥗🥗

@codysergeant1486

6 ай бұрын

Let her cook 🙄

@CDAActivism

6 ай бұрын

@@codysergeant1486 do you understand the reference?

@codysergeant1486

6 ай бұрын

Hmmm, 3 salads? I dont think so haha@@CDAActivism

@CDAActivism

6 ай бұрын

@@codysergeant1486 the KZread channel @vegangaze it's her slogan: saLAD 🥗🥗🥗

So what would a TOTALLY NATURAL alternative to leather be, because waxed cotton etc certainly isn't going to last well as soles on shoes - in fact I'd think it was unusable to be honest, far to thin - and I don't think you can write on it very well either (parchment and vellum are far superior for writing on and can be scraped down and reused multiple times, unlike paper or other substances). I don't use plastic coated leather anyway - won't wear plastic if I can possibly avoid it - and many substances made from plant fibres have multiple drawbacks (fabric for one, get much of it wet and it becomes as stiff as cardboard until it dries again, not very practical when you're wearing it - I know, I have plant fibre fabrics and you can't wear them if it looks like rain out). Alternatives are all very well but I haven't found anything that surpasses the natural leather (not even in gloves, I still wear kid gloves that are well over 100 years old - handed down from my great grandmother - but I don't think anything artificial would still be in as good a shape in the next century as they are now, and footwear made from artificial products certainly doesn't last long either. If you get a 12-18mths from a pair of artificially produced shoes you're lucky, my leather shoes from my great aunt (been wearing them since 1983 now) are still going strong and - apart from having to replace the rubber soles - should outlast me. I know leather tanning is destructive to the environment but so are many alternatives,

new sub, just caught your most recent video. commenting before watching. if cows are slaughtered for their meat by the millions, and they have skins that will be disposed of, is it not sustainable and even ethical to use those skins rather then send to landfill? yes many microbes and consume the skin but far more cannot and an over abundance of one food source for microbes could be very bad for soil food web which affects plants and therefore all animals in the area.

@hilliard665

6 ай бұрын

questions have been answered lol

Don't multiply... unless you're vegan & create more vegans to spread the message of veganism 😉

@Corvid_Moon

6 ай бұрын

Adopt, don't shop [give birth] Still looking for a way to make that a catchy phrase :P

Interesting video! I love leather, will always most likely prefer it, but I'm also very excited to see the new materials coming out and the development. I think most of it boils down to education of materials, and researching where you're buying from regardless of leather or leather alternatives

Animal testing would be interesting. Does boycott help. Also almost all food has been tested on animals at some point

@tofudog4u

7 ай бұрын

Was thinking about a video about animal testing next!

@MoistVegan

6 ай бұрын

@@tofudog4u wow, great. Was thinking yesterday how impossible foods had to test on rats because they choose to use a new ingredient. But then beyond meat 2nd ingredient was also tested on animals by some other company to get approval. So thinking of the difference between the two. Then there’s medical testing. And so on. I avoid buying toothpaste and shampoo tested on animals but wondering what’s big difference between that and the so many other foods tested on animals at some point. Anyway that’s my ramble

Me when i want to strawman indigenous climate activists by pretending they advocate for eurocentric factory farming methods when they speak to the enviromental sustainability of different materials AND practices (the AND PRACTICES part is very important). At least you are transparent ish about the fact that you are only discussing certain leather techniques and certain arguments, but not transparent enough to not trick the people on the fence into thinking your side is the obviously correct one. Very similar to the vegan tendency to describe the worst farming practices (which need criticism and justice) and conflating them with the act of eating or using any animal products in any way period (morally neutral, nature). Oh well.

@putriddivine

6 ай бұрын

I want to clarify, my point is that vegans make the mistake of refusing to leave their eurocentric point of view. By making the debate "should we mass produce plastic or leather?" You already lost. We need to change our relationship with our belongings! Your snark and highly intentional misleading framing is coming from INSIDE the environment destroying house! Starting infighting on your team is not justice for what your team has done to the earth. :/

@Corvid_Moon

6 ай бұрын

@@putriddivine So your argument is that because indigenous have been using leather products before Europeans colonised the American continent, that makes it okay to factory farm & slaughter literally trillions of animals around the world every year, billions of whom for their skin to make leather, all whilst ignoring modern-day indigenous peoples who are against all of these practices, and many of whom follow vegan principles themselves? You understand that's called soft bigotry of low expectations, right? To use the Noble Savage trope of racism as a means of tokenising indigenous peoples so you can continue to partake in acts of abject animal cruelty for things none of us need anymore in the modern era. I certainly hope you learn from this & understand why both soft bigotry & animal abuse are wrong.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

Using animals for their skin is wrong, no matter who does it and how

@putriddivine

6 ай бұрын

@@tofudog4u that i would say is a matter of personal opinion that doesn't have impact on the measurable sustainability of a practice. We can agree to disagree on the morality of veganism vs nonveganism, that has no impact on my point.

@tofudog4u

6 ай бұрын

@@putriddivine we could also argue that burning coal is sustainable, as long as only a small number of people are doing it. Even indigenous leather making wouldn't be sustainable at the scale of 8 billion people

Plastic doesn't break down for hundreds of years. If you think that is sustainable think again.

There is no such thing as vegan leather. It is leather or it isn't. That name a marketing ploy. There are places where leather is a better choice. And the TYPE of leather makes a difference in wear and life. Both manufacturing methods are polluting. But at least we aren't tanning leather in urine anymore. Neither is better than the other. It is a CHOICE. Everything used make something is going have some adverse affect on something somewhere. Yeah, even basket weaving (can put certain plants in danger of over use and extinction).

why is plastic 'bad'?

@tofudog4u

7 ай бұрын

Usually, people associate plastic with lower quality, as well as the fact that it breaks down into microplastics and doesn't really decompose. They think of plastic as being unnatural, while thinking that leather is natural (in their minds, making leather 'better')