Not sure if I just missed it, but I believe you said that only the Rouge gets a skill increase and skill feat every level. As far as I know the Investigator also gets those every level, but he has to spend the increases and feats he gets at even levels at exclusively mental skills and skill feats connected to mental skills.

@RebelThenKing

4 ай бұрын

Oh right, I totally meant to call that out but forgot. Rogue is the only class with skills at every level without an asterisk attached to that which dictates the types of skills they can train into.

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

That's neat. Investigator could not keep up otherwise. One per level is Soo mnay more than any other class, I don't think you suffer from spending the extras, on an 'imvestigation' skill specifically. And if you don't want to be investing in those investigation skills, but want the massive selection, why aren't you playing a Rogue?

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

11:06 'Know that you won't hit?' Are you doing that thing again?

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

... 12:37 ... Or any PC with a 3rd action and a high MAP, could Assurance Trip the low Reflex enemy. Bloop. Setup Off Guard for the entire Party, Rogue included. Bonus, now the Rogue doesn't need to flank behind enemy lines, and become exposed. Reflex High? Fortitude Low? Same move. Assurance Grapple Enemy.

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

12:37 Bottled Lightning, unfortunately, for most PCs, would cost 2 actions. Draw (or Swap) 1. Throw 2. And a 3rd action, if they need to Draw a Weapon into that Hand again... If they don't want to be empty handed. One benefit to an empty handed playstyle. An Unarmed Monk... A Duelist with single hand weapon and empty off hand... A Kineticist... Maybe an archer... Keeps an empty hand for arrows, but can draw and throw a bomb... Someone using a Natural Claw as a primary weapon? Etc etc etc.

2:30 The baseline, after level 1. Almost every class baseline, receives a skill increase at odd levels. You also cannot increase to legendary until lvl 15. So.baseline, almost every class, will have maximum 3 legendary skills. There some ways to increase that. But the base from the classes before those various upgrades, Is max 3 legendary. Most classes also only gain expert bump options at 3rd and 5th, And only gain Master bump options, starting at 7th (7/9/11/13) That all functions from Int 10 and up. Higher Intelligence modifiers, gain you extra bumps from Untrained, to Trained. Not extra Expert or Master or Legendary bumps. Identical PCs (same Class/ancwstry/feats/Subclass etc) with Int 10 vs Int 18 vs Int 22, will all have the same nukber of skill bumps through level 20. They will only have higher number of Trained Skills. Skill Training is good. It allows you to add your level as a bonus proficiency. Not all. ACTIVITIES, can be performed Untrained. And after level 5, 10 and 15, lacking your level bonus will make 'level appropriate' or 'opposed' skill checks, much more difficult. For. Context, a +5 modifier to the level based DC is equivalent, to a Very Hard challenge. +10 DC is equivalent to an Extremely difficult challenge, for your level. So, if you deprive yourself of 5 or 10 points, you are making average challenges very difficult. And against average level opponents who have training, you will fall far behind fairly quickly, if you compete, without proficiency. However. Untrained Improvisation is available to everyone, and grants you your level as bonus proficiency on Untrained skills. That's enough, after level 5/10/15... To keep you in range to 'have a chance'. With hat alone... Now your opponent needs higher proficiency (Expert, Master etc... ) Or Higher ability modifiers (stronger / smarter / etc) Or some combination of both, in order to gain that same +5 or +10 advantage against you. Of note. Against an equally matched opponent, with equal Strength and Level. In a tug of war rope pull challenge, or arm wrestle... Matching one Athletics against the Other... The Expert vs the Untrained, will have a natural +4 advantage. Remember that's almost a +5 Very Diifcult challenge modifier. +2 is Difficult +5 is Very Difficult +10 is Extremely Difficult Remeber also, that you are increasing your odds of CRITICAL FAIL, or the opponents odds of CRITICAL. SUCCESS, with that 5 or 10 point difference. The ROGUE, specifically, Has one skill Bump, at every single level. Starting at 2nd, they can expert any trained skill. They can easily start with 6 or more trained skills. With an INT of 10. More, from any Ancestry, Background, or feature that would aid other classes as well. And they have access to a pretty great Skill Mastery class feat. If it's not enough. They can Expert at 2nd and up, (2/3/4/5/6) They can then Master those 5 skills, (7/8/9/10/11) they can then spend 12 and 13 to Expert and Master a 6th skill. And still have one left over, before they start 6 legendary skills from 15 to 20. That does not factor in bonus INT proficiency starting skills. It does not factor in bonus Feats, ancestry, background, whatever, to gain more skills, or higher proficiency with skills. It is fully double the number of default Legendary skills. Fully double the number of master skills from 7th level up, and gaining them faster. You gain your first 3 master skills, by level 7.8.9., instead of level 7.9.11 By level 11.the Rogue can have 5 default master skills. Which they were able to expert those 5 by level 6. It is exceptional, by comparison. On this single metric. The only other comment for the default Rogue skills, before upgrade features... They also have skill feats at every level instead of every second level. Twice as many skill feats. Many will require master or legendary proficiency, to unlock something really unique or cool. Ie wall jumping The Rogue has default 20 skill feats to spend. Minimum double the average class. Before upgrade options. That means they can do more cool unique things, and can do higher level, cooler things. How the investigator stacks up, I'm curious. Rogue excels. Takeaway. Intelligence score is, a minor thing. Profcliciemcy bonus is more important than ability score alone, and level bonus to proficiency is the biggest component after like, level... 5 ish. After level 7, level Bonus exceeds either ability bonus or proficiency (u/t/e/m/L)... After level 15/16, level Bonus exceeds Trianing + Ability combined...

Nice video! I have a dwarven ruffian rogue, and is truly amazing how much he can do. Arcane trickster, you will be missed. 😢

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

Do we know, why arcane Trickster isn't reprinted in Remaster? Do we know, if it's still allowed, like the other classes that didn't make it into Player Core 1?? Do we think, it's being reviewed for its own Remaster? Or did the Devs give a very specific answer to it being specifically cut?

I have a friend who loves Investigators and swears by their efficiency as ranged marcials. Also, maybe the magic subclass for rogue is missing because in the end it was just you picking a magic multiclass archetype?

@undrhil

4 ай бұрын

I'm hoping that when the player Core 2 is released, they have updated rules about archetypes and multi-class archetypes that will allow for the Eldritch trickster to have more to it than just being a multi-class of whichever class you choose

8:23 There are a few, rare, unarmed ranged attacks. They amount to like, the PC Leshy Seedpod Its a level 1, ancestry, Core Ancestry, Its not rare itself, but not often selected and thus... Uncommon at many tables... It is one example of a RANGED UNARMED ATTACK Others must exist. Things like shoot spine attacks, web attacks. Etc. We see them more often on Monsters, where they don't interact with Player Class features, So, they don't always have the same traits as obviously listed. Player Options for such abilities, need to have the distinctions so we know which Class features and such, interact or, qualify etc.

@robertd4061

3 ай бұрын

The automaton’s eye lasers and Kitsune Foxfire are two other examples!

@jonathanbennison9220

3 ай бұрын

@@robertd4061 Good call.

@bradlyhaskell9821

2 күн бұрын

@@robertd4061 also the pixie has one

If. If. I were playing an investigator only. I think I would want to have the Ancestral Longevity of the Elf, or similar Ancestry feat form other ancestry The ability to swap in one skill (or more at higher level) That I find I'm lacking and the party might be lacking. Seems great. Also let's me adjust (in the scenario when the party composition of allies changes... For 'some reason') But definitely allows you to change out your daily. Let's you have a combat skill for dungeons, a social skill for social events, A research or crafting skill for, downtime. Whatever you need. Even just the ability to take a special Lore skill, when you spend days in the library or archive, to really dial in that one thing you need to do well. Elf and I think other anvestries do let you invest in this thing, So that you can bump it up to expert or master, and gain more skills along the way. Great supplement for Investigator, or Bard, Where you lack the volume of the Rogue. Seriously. I'm test building an Ancient Elf Mastermind Rogue (Dedication Investigator) with Bounty Hunter Background and Ancestral Longevity (shift skill) IIRC, a familiar can do a similar thing, shifting its daily ability to assist you in unique ways depending on your primary task that day. Great bonus.

I have a doubt about the investigator's feat 1: takedown expert. Well, this allows you to add the intelligence modifier to the attack rolls of the club group, such as Sap; but in the DoE description; It already includes Sap as an option.

6:30 I'll give you this. Having an investigator in your party, to grant a bonus with Clue In, to your Thaumaturge Esoteric Lore master... Or Bardic Knowledge Master... Might be one of the few ways to bump those masters of Lore, RK, and therefore... Investigations... One step higher. Although. Circumstance Bonuses = Aid Ally. Success =+1 aid... Crit Success = +2 aid... Soooo... Can the Rogue and Thauma and Bard, do this already and almost automatically, Without any need for the investigator?

The first level, Int 18, Rogue vs Investigator, side by side, with all other choices = (background/ancestry/etc) Seem to have 11+ skills Rogue, vs 8+ skills Investigator. But, as say the mastermind, I seem to have 11 choices, +4 skills +my background Lore. Vs the Empiricism Investigator had 8+3 skills +the same Background Lore) So, 12 vs 16. Not including a Heritage and Ancestry choice, which I would try to keep the same for this side by side comparison. But, I'm looking close at the Rogue. With bonus level 1 Investigator Dedication. Because. This video inspired me to look really really closely. Won't have, say, the Empiricism. And I really like a Rogue skill Healer... So, Empiricism does admittedly look pretty awesome. With hourly Battle Medicine, for all targets (on successes), from 1st level, built in. That's very good, IMHO, from what I've seen. It seems to be somewhat comparable to if your entire party, had Godless Healing.

4:41 LVL 5 Rogue can have more Expert Feats (4 +) And a good chance to be comparing expert proficiency in matchups, against Untrained. That's a huge advantage against those who lack Untrained Improvisation. That's already a 9 point advantage in a competition between the Expert Rogue and the Untrained opponent. If it's an athletics competition? The RAW strength of an Untrained opponent will rarely match that 9 point advantage. Without even looking to buffs/penalties.

Oops. In testing. I accidentally have Too Many Skills at 1st level. As in. All skills. + 1 background Lore. +1 leftover choose any skill. + Ancestral Longevity would have given one flexible Trained choice. Nowhere for that to go now... Maybe pick it up later, when the Expert or Master versions unlock? But otherwise maybe take a different ancestry/feat... it's an 18 INT ANCIENT ELF BOUNTY HUNTER (detective right) MASTER MIND ROGUE (INVESTIGATOR DEDICATION BONUS) (ANCIENT ELF) ... It has all skills trained, +1 Rogue any skill choice left, + would have had Ancestral Longevity flexible... +1 any. Those can hypothetically, still be more choices I suppose. And then the flexible Lore can be used for research preparation when necessary. I suppose. Or it could pull back a point in INT or something somewhere. Hmm... Rogue. Wow.

Theorycraft pairing for these two classes is a typical ranged investigator paired up with a charismatic ruffian who possibly packs a champion dedication, the longspear is a D8 martial weapon, sneak attack on a reach weapon anyone?

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

Play a Leshy. With the Reach feature for any 2hand non reach weapon. And gain reach with any 2h non reach weapon. Now you can add other traits into the mix. Or grab other weapon types. That's Very exciting. Alternatively, plan for, Enlarge? As often as possible? To gain reach? With whatever? I like the ability to use a weapon which compliments my goal. Trip. Disarm. Shove. Agile. Deadly. Fatal. I also like the ability to choose a Crit Spec that compliments my build. Ie. More damage or more trips or whatever.

Positive Feedback for the Investigator. THAT'S ODD Does seem neat. You might have almost oversold it in your investigator showcase. But. Provided you have a DM who wants excuses to share Intel, and secrets, Its very good. And you get it from 1st level with Empiricism. That's very neat.

... I'd like to. Compare a leshy Ruffian with the Leshy reach next. Because, that seems to offer versatility in areas that would be restrictive otherwise And counter most of the drawbacks. Seems neat in theory... And the Elf mastermind seems 1 step too many skills. Hahaha.

4:20 Exactly. So. How does the investigator compare? Because. A Wizard also has high Int. Some Psychics also have high intel. Some Bards also have high skill. Counts. But we have established that Trianing is nice, but skill bumps (Expert +) Are highly prized. And also, that a single valuable general feat. Untrained Improvisation, grants the meat of Trained proficiency, to all Untrained skills. Ie. Level bonus. Because at level 10 and 20. Untrained = +0 proficiency bonus Trained 10 = +12 prof bonus (vs Untrained Improv 10 = +10) Trained 20 = +22 prof bonus (vs Untrained Improv 20 = +20) By comparison. Master 10 = 16 + Ability + Buffs - Penalties Legendary 20 = 28 + Ability + Buffs - Penalties So. Trianing is good, but, not the end of the discussion. Because Trained alone, won't unlock those super skill feats. And trained alone, can fall behind master from level 7 up, and legendary from lvl 15 up. 4 or 6 points behind which makes that contest, similar to a Very Difficult Challenge. Without even considering Ability Score differences. Similarly, proves that you can ultimately, be 4-6 points behind, in ABILITY MODIFIER matchup, against your opponent, but meet or exceed them if you have superior proficiency. We could go on. At greater length. But. Boom.

I'm trying hard to find positives for the Investigator vs the Rogue.

I consider the investigator to be more analogous to the Ranger then to the Rogue

@BlueSapphyre

4 ай бұрын

Interesting. I consider both Investigator and Rogue as skill monkeys. Why would you consider it more a Ranger?

@undrhil

4 ай бұрын

@@BlueSapphyre pursue a lead is basically hunt prey.

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

@@undrhil Pursue a lead, seems to be a minor boost to a. Skill check. If you mean, the Precision Ranger specifically, Who also has Precision bonus damage. That make some sense. It really just puts all three in comparison. But for skill count, it's hard to beat the investigator or Rogue. Really, it's almost impossible to kepp up with the Rogue. Really.

17:19 IMHO. I'd love it if you would back these conclusions and feeling statements up, In these reviews, And specifically in this case. With for example. How specifically does the Investigator unqiely, outperform the Rogue in solving a mystery. (I think I dissected the math above in depth. I'm curious, just exactly how much mathematical advantage the Investigator, at its best, at a given level, can pote tially outperform the Rogue at that level. Similarly, what unique benefit, the Investigator could gain. Clue in is almost an example, the somewhat unique ability to grant a bonus to an ally. Except. That seems to be basically the Aid Ally, with a different name. So again, what if anything can the investigator do uniquely, that sets them above what a similar Rogue could do. I'm seriously trying to find redemption, for the investigator.

14:08 Or a Wisdom based Rogue. Because. You could choose a. WISDOM spellcasting. Instead of Intelligence Or Charisma.

You're probably the most handsome PF2 KZreadr XD

17:51 Your Best advice. Final. Seconds. Haha. Precision Damage... Enemies can be Immune completely. Be prepared, for that.

3:42 So. Investigator = 4+1 +Int. Rogue = 7+1 +Int. So. And that doesn't consider what. The ancestry or the background?

Positive comment

16:55 FWIW and IMHO That's my Single Biggest... Issue? With your reviews. Currently. It seems as if, you strongly recommend, often, that if someone wants to play a Swashbuckling Pirate, Well , that is the Swashbuckler class... But if they want to play an Investigating Detective, Well, that is the Investigator. Don't fluff and narrate using the Rogue class, to Roleplay your Pirate or Detective... Those Narratives Belong to the other class. I really find it frustrating. FWIW It also seems to make its way into your Ratings and Rankings for classes. Ie. You grant Bonus points in your Ranking of the Swashbuckler, because Panache seems to be described in the book in a really fun way. Then you describe how much less fun and less practical the actual PANACHE and FINISHER systems are, from the humble ROGUE SNEAK ATTACK... In reality, what stops a player from describing the way that their scoundrel Rogue, tumbles behind the enemy, leaving them off guard, and flanked, (or trips the Foe for a similar outcome) and then for bonus points, they Demoralize the enemy, Before delivering a devastating series of strikes, which deliver Precision Bonus damage mechanically, And exploit the demoralized, Off Guard enemy (tripped or Flanked for bonus marks) And just describe and narrate all that Panache, using the same fun narrative roleplay, you would use for the swashbuckler? What part, of a Rogue PC swinging across a chandelier, or wall. Jumping behind the enemy, and demoralizing them, Is any less cool. K the Rogue, than on the Swashbuckler? I, personally don't understand it. But you consistently rate some of these classes as Inferior mechanically, but grant them cool points for some narrative, that would easily fit other, FUNCTIONAL, classes.

👍👍👍

0:11 Before this gets deep into it. I'm almost frustrated you chose rogue v investigator. Arg. Hahaha. I understand it, but. The Swash vs the Rogue have very similar combat because PANACHE and Sneak attack are quite similar in majority of baselines. Ie. Tumble behind, gain precision. Trip gain precision. Grapple gain precision. Etc etc etc.

@RebelThenKing

4 ай бұрын

Oh yeah, I see a lot of similarities between swashbuckler and rogue too, but hey, I wanted to pair all the classes up pretty evenly and really liked the idea of both overdrive and panache being a state, so I went with those two.

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

@@RebelThenKing I comment as I watch. I try to time stamp. For reference. And I comment, for the sake of engagement. I like, subscribe, and watch all the way through, Even when you and I disagree. I love what you are doing. Even though we might not be... "the same person"... Haha. Hope I never offend. Keep exploring the game we both love.

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

@@RebelThenKing That's Fair. I can't help comparing the Rogue to other Precision classes / subclasses... Because the Rogue does it well. And is so versatile with its skills, that it CNA kinds be a solid 'kit car' / 'build-a-bear' / 'custom. Build create your own' Like a putty base you build almost any scoundrel type up from. I Like what the Gunslinger does do, that the Rogue can't. It offers some unique benefits in exchange for what it, essentially , trades away. It gains some unique benefits, that the Rogue might be missing. I don't know that that is true for the Swashbuckler or the Investigator. I don't know, that they can do many things, Better than a Rogue designed to do the same thing. Ie. Solve mysteries. Ie. Tumble and Demoralize and Trip or Grapple the enemy, with 'style and flair' (panache) I don't know that they have many unique things, the Rogue can't do. Ie. A Fighter hits generally, with high accuracy. Ok. But the Flurry of a Monk or Ranger, actually Strike twice with a single action. The Flurry Ranger + Companion actually both Strike with higher accuracy against their Hunted Prey on 2nd strikes. And, they can make a lot of Strikes. Combined. The Monk, is sooo versatile. And Flurry of Blows, just give them more strikes than a Fighter? Isn't that just, Uniquely Cool? I get so disappointed when the Salespitch for a Class doesn't realistically function in game. I want, the class to. Match the Salespitch, (inside balance) Or The Salespitch to accurately represent the class. And. And. I want the Salespersons to be open minded and encourage creativity from players. IMHO.

Unique point for Investigator... Devise a stratagem does seem. Uniquely able to allow the Investigator to use Intelligence, with Devise a Stratagem and upgrades, in place of lower ability scores. Ok. So, instead of a +0 Str or Dex you could use a +4 or higher Int modifier. Ok. On an attack roll, or an athletic stratagem athletics check. OK. A Rogue can't do THAT, specifically, even with the Investigator Dedication. Ok. Neat. Not Overpowered. In fact, it inherently only helps you catch up/compete, with the string PC at the same task... Ie. Intelligence Athletics vs Strength Athletics...

every investigator is also trained in society and every rogue is trained in stealth at level 1!

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

Right. So all Rogues Choose 7+ Stealth. And gain 1 or 2 skills from their Racket. So total 9 or 10 skills. +Background. +Ancestry. +Intelligence bonus. It can be, a lot.

Key point. Investigator is not the best actual detective, just because the name says so, or the narrative suggestion brags about them. If they are not mechanically superior in the task. If they do not provide unique benefit no other class can. Then. Just not the actual best. Like a Word Champion trophy (belt) for competitors who faced only select local competition... No global competition, no global champion. Name and narrative do not make something awesome. If the Rogue or Bard or Thaumaturge are superior detectives, then the investigator, is not in fact, the best at investigating...

Oops. Accidentally figured out the best Investigator. Isn't an investigator. Haha. Its an Ancient Elf Rogue. Who selects Investigator Dedication. Haha. So you CNA be a Rogue, and you can Be On The Case, and Pursue a Lead, and Clue in an Ally. But still be a Rogue with way more skills. And way more expert/master/legendary skills. Hahaha. So good. And if Sneak Attack is more reliable than the alternative anyway. Boom. Bonus.

14:08 Or a Wisdom based Rogue. Because. You could choose a. WISDOM spellcasting. Instead of Intelligence Or Charisma. ... 15:08 Oh. Interesting. Eldritch Rogue gone currently. Interesting.

> "The investogator is stuck with that bad roll" No, quite the opposite. Everybody else is stuck with their bad rolls, but the investigator knows the bad roll in advance and can choose to do something else instead.

Don't forget background skills! Normally you get two.

@RebelThenKing

4 ай бұрын

So many skills I forgot to include them all!

@jonathanbennison9220

4 ай бұрын

True, but, every PC has a background, and essentially the same selection of potential backgrounds. (if not identical ideal fit... ) Every PC has an Ancestry too, and essentially identical access to the same selection. (if not identical ideal fit...) I try to skip past those in the comparison phase. It does add up to alot when you add in all the highest possible Skill Trainings at 1st level. Similarly, every PC has its Intelligence bonus to trained skills. But some PCs will neglect Intelligence. Most, Wizards, are highly incentivized to crank it. Sure. Similarly, I think Alchemists? And some Psychics, or Witches. Etc etc. Also, not all classes with a primary score that's not INT, will neglect INT. Its not as obviously valuable as say, the saves abilities. Ie. Reflex/Fortitude / Will WHICH also help other stats like, AC, HIT POINTS, or Perception, Or skills like Stealth, Acrobatics, Nature/Religion, Thievery, Survival, etc etc. And Charisma benefits Social skills. Directly, and several. Classes might have it as a Primary Ability. So, Int might fall below there. STRENGTH is also highly incentivized, for simple. Combat accuracy and damage, Carry capacity, And ATHLETICS. Among other things. Intelligence can find itself neglected or deprioritized, on some PCs. But. I do try not to over value the Ancestry Background, or Intelligence bonus skills. That others could also have.

@sethb3090

4 ай бұрын

@@jonathanbennison9220 it's mostly relevant to the proportion. If you don't look at additional skills, it's easy to compare 2 and 9 and go "wow, gator gets almost 5 times as many skills!" where even in the magus dumped int vs +3 int rogue case it's going to be minimum 5 skills vs 14 which is 2.8x rather than 5x.

@jonathanbennison9220

3 ай бұрын

@@sethb3090 That's a valid point. Mostly if considering multiples of skills. When comparing Class offers Number of skills max, against Rogue class offers X Number More Skills. One more is one more. 5 more is 5 more. Just needs to be pointed out when some one says the Rogue gets 9 or 10 skills from class and subclass alone before feats. Compared to classes that offer 2 or 4 skills . They all have backgrounds. They all have ancestries. Building a rogue to compare the investigator, My rogue ran out of skills to train at 1st level, with 1 or 2 choices left empty, and no skills left untrained. Lore, at that point, being the only remaining option. I built a Ruffian Str 18 rogue, And had all skills trained. Dropped a few of the mastermind build options, dropped my ancestry heritage choice, And still had all but 1 or 2 skills trained. At 1st.wothiut the ancestry /heritage choice. Comparing fraction or multiple is one way to look at the issue. But, looking at how many Untrained Skills your PC has vs a Rogue ... Is a serious consideration. A big adjustment if you played a rogue or an investigator, Enjoyed being skilled, And then play anything else. The skill bumps and skill feats, through 20 levels , Give them a significant advantage over basically every other class, in that arena. The fighter might seem to be the most accurate martial class, at a glance,... But skilled is a different equation.for sure.

17:35 What would I love to see improve? Could you be more Open-minded? ?? ... See, you do it the other way on the Rogue. You keep describing it as innately Shadowy. The investigator will excel in Exploration, but the Rogue is Shadowy. Its just not... I think it oversell the single narrative, I think it boxes people in. Telling them the stealthy shadowy PC is the Rogue. Telling them noone can hit as well as the Fighter (or the gunslinger, k) And that the Fighter will never miss and Crit constantly. (it's ironically almost the opposite of what you did in the Sorceress vs Wizard comparison. There you worked hard to point out that, while the chart at a glance makes it look like a Sorceror has more spellslots per day... The Wizard has some subtle bonus spellslots from features. That actually add up. And either balance the two, or, potentially, push the Wizard ahead in total spells per day. Neither compete with the Cleric Divine Font by the way, for total nukber of highest tier spellslots.the Cleric always has 4 or 5 or 6 extraax level Spellslots (for HEAL spells) (or suitable substitute spells) But, that's the opposite of the Sorceress... Who can spend their spellslots on any known spell. So. Yeah. But the point being, you pushed outside the strict limit of the single suggested narrative. And showed your viewers, that there are options. Versatility. Different ways to play. A Rogue, doesn't actually NEED to ever make a single Stealth check in a campaign. They probably can do it, and even neglected probably half decently. But it's not inherent to the class. A swashbuckler never needs to say,... ARRRrrrr Matey. I just wish, in presenting Pathfinder 2 to audiences, That you gave them a much less restrictive mindset. It feels very boxed in. Very regimented. The Rogue is sneaky. (Ruffian?) The Barbarian is stronger than the Rogue. (more class hit points? Yes. Always significantly stronger? No. Its ironically, a very 1e, old-school, boxed in mindset. A very pregen mindset. It misses the whole section in character creation, that tries to teach the art of being creative and writing your own narrative, and not feeling restricted into old TROPES and stereotypes. Not all. ROGUES, are thieves. Not all swashbuckler are pirates. We've moved to a place, where PF2 has opened up the game enough, that you can say, Not all mages have to be Wizards. Not all Priests have to be Clerics. Not all thieves have to be Rogues. But it seems like you get stuck from the other direction. Like your very fluid if you start with. I want to build a. STRONG character, who has good Martial weapon proficiency, but also can do this gishy thing or this sneaky thing. Or whatever. You list all the classes that have mechanics that lend themselves to a STR PC. Similarly if you wanted a high Charisma PC, you start with all the classes that can have a Primary or secondary (18 or 16) Charisma. And then you go from there, rating the various mechanics of a class, as they support or hinder the Character idea. But it seems as if, when you start with a Class first, You get very narrow minded... At least, in your descriptions. I wouldn't mind if you didn't list all the possibilities for every class. Too many of course. I wouldn't mind if you described the top 3 or top 5 tropes the class mechanics can BEST REPRESENT, or represent uniquely better than their closest competitors... But you seem repeatedly, to narrow down on One thing they supposedly do best, and one thing they supposedly do worst. And often, that seems more to do with the primary narrative of the class, and less to do with the mechanics of the class. I don't understand, why you do that. Like even if it were absolutely universally true that the Fighter will always have the highest possible accuracy in the game. And even if that was not ONLY A +2 difference. Then you often say, play the Fighter to never miss. And playing anything else means missing helf the time or more, compared to the Fighter. Despite it being usually a +2 difference at most. Less than that often. Despite the Flurry Ranger being MORE ACCURATE than the FIGHTER usually, On 2nd and 3rd and 4th and 5th strikes. Despite the Ranger and Monk being able to Make 4 and 5 and more strikes from low level. Ie. More strikes than the Fighter. And potentially significantly more accurate on all but the 1st strike. And potentially as accurate on even that first strike. And when the stats align, more accurate Ranger than Fighter on even that 1st strike. And then embarrassing the Fighter on 2nd and 3rd strikes. And then, Making 1 or 2 or more strikes after the Fighter stops swinging/shooting. That are, potentially, still. More accurate, than the fighters 2nd strike. But still, THE FIGHTER (or Gunslinger) are both OP, and, never miss. You like the narrative in the book, for the swashbuckler and investigator, so much, That you rate them extra cool. Points, despite rating their game mechanics less functional, awkward, more costly, or less effective. ... ... ... I do, Love watching these, but. What would I love to see improve? Could you be more Open-minded?

... Correction. All Rogues are Trained in Stealth +7 So actually 8+ + 1 or 2 skills from their Subclass. So, ALL Rogues have 9 or 10 skills, before Intelligence bonus. But all PCs of all classes gain bonus trained skills. For intelligence or for ancestry or for Background. Ie. You can take the same INT and ancestry and Background with any other Class. (exception, a Rogue, like the Investigator, like some Psychics, like Wizards or Witches, etc etc etc, can have INTELLIGENCE PRIMARY SCORE) (So, one of the few classes which could select a +4 INTELLIGENCE at 1st level.) (but, first boosts will catch any INT +3 (16s) up. And only fall behind again between then after the 2nd boosts, but catch up again after the 3rd boosts. Only falling behind, by 1. Point, in the final level 20, fourth boosts. (gradual ability boost Variant shifts the levels a bit but not the tiers.) Then like every PC they gain : Plus any bonuses from their Intelligence. Plus any bonuses from Ancestry or Background. At 1st Level. Soooo.... Examples. Academic Background. Seems to be appropriate, and, top. Of. List. Int Boost. +1 FREE Gain Crafting Skill. Gain 1 Lore (academia) (probably helps during Archive Research... Your experience in libraries and with tomes and stuff but.) +1 Free Skill (skill Training Bonus Feat. I love Medicine + Battle Medicine backgrounds, but. Academia seems great for a Detective. Lets keep looking. Bounty Hunter seems ideal too. A bit more practical world. Comes with Survival and Legal Lore, and Tracking skill feat. Great for what it's billed as. A Bounty Hunter, skip tracer. Hunting down fugitives. Applicable to almost any investigation. Complements a detective quite well.

5:43 Oh right. I remember this from before. Here is the biggest problem with the entire premise that the Investigator will be a better 'investigator' than the Rogue. After a couple levels, you can keep up if not exceed, the Investigator, with the Rogue. The investigator simply lacks the number of trained skills the Intelligent Rogue has. And worse... Lacks the number of Skill Bumps to expert/master/legendary, of any Rogue. Further. The Rogue has access to Skill Mastery. So. If it's not enough base. They can add more skills and skill bumps with ease. So. Even if your Investigator is Slightly more specialized in 1 to 3 exploration / RK skills. The Detective Player can easily pick those same skills and more, with the intelligent Rogue. And worse, can pick them sooner and more often, and more of them. That will actually put the Rogue ahead of the investigator at times. And the selling feature is to gain a +1 bonus to a check? And even if we spot you the INT 18 investigator vs the INT 16 detective Rogue. That's also only a +1. (which the detective Rogue can reclaim at 5th level when the INT 18 investigator can only bump to 19) So the Investigator will only have an INT advantage over the intelligent Detective Rogue, At specific levels. Worse if your DM uses Gradual Boost. Because it disperses the boosts over the 5 levels. Thus the level 2 Rogue could boost INT to 18 to match the Level 2 investigator who could only be at 19. And therefore would take something else instead. So. Now. There is an Intelligent Rogue? Who can use primary Intelligence like the investigator? And then have the same starting INT 18 (+4) Making the previous MOOT? Well. Well. But even the STR RUFFIAN ROGUE... Can compete with the Investigator in the Investigators specialities... But would exceed the investigator, on 3 or more other skills? Because every generic Rogue can have 5 expert skills by lvl 6, instead of 2. And can have 5 master skills at level 11 instead of 3, but 6 master skills at level 13, minimum, without upgrades, Instead of 3 for most classes without upgrades... If they have access to upgrades... At all) And, 3 legendary at level 17. Base. But 5 instead of max 3 at lvl 19, and 6 minimum at lvl 20. Which means... That Rogue has a massive proficiency bonus over the Investigators 'trained' but neglected skills. As much as +6 bonus in legendary Rogue skills, compared to Investigator Trained skills... Is there any feature of the Investigator that provides a +4 or +6 bonus to a trained skill? To catch or compete with the Rogue who is outperforming them? So the investigator can only slightly nudge ahead of the Rogue in 1-3 specialty skills. Max. And then only if those are there upgraded skills. (baseline without feats like mastery which provide extra bumps. To. Proficiency, and assuming the Rogue PC lacks those same options) I mean. Its just not compelling. In its own. Now. Tell me that the Investigator has unique feats that allow them to treat a Successful 'Investigation' result, as a Critical. Success, instead. That the Rogue lacks. And/or, tell me that the investigator can gain clues / information, unique, and advanced, beyond what the Rogue could learn with a critical success with the same skill. That would be unique. Example? The Flurry Ranger uses Hunted Prey, to gain a unique reduction in MAP. reduced at high level, down to only - 1/-2 with an agile wpn. Compared to a Fighter who swings with a +2 point advantage on 1st strike, but suffers a full - 4 /-8 on subsequent strikes. (adjust to - 2/-6 with the Fighter increased prof) (legend vs master / master vs expert... Etc etc etc) Add in the Hunted Strikes, for Bonus Strikes with fewer Actions. That's crazy good. And unqiely awesome for that Ranger. Starting at low level, they CNA make more strikes, more accurately, in a single turn, than the Fighter with the same weapon. Negating or surpassing the Accuracy advantage of the Fighter, from 2nd strike on. Factor in the Ignore Range Penalty of Hunted Prey, and that same Ranger can ignore penalties that the Sabotage the Fighter making the same shot. And it might seem minor at first. But. A level 3 Ranger and a lvl 3 Fighter, throwing daggers or hatchets, inside the 2nd increment. The Ranger ignores the - 2 range penalty. On all strikes. And 2nd and later strikes have reduced MAP by 2 points lower than the Fighter. And the Ranger can make 2 strikes for a Single action. (flourish once per round) The Fighter has some options. Ie. Vicious Swing. But. That level 3 Flurry Ranger can Hunt Prey and shoot 3 arrows on 1st turn. That Fighter, can Shoot 3 arrows, with bigger penalties. On 1st turn. Its dramatic. From low level, and exaggerates as levels rise.