This channel is super-informative. Even though I work at imec and go there every day, like 80% of what he said was news to me! You are amazing Asianometry! Keep up the great work.

I had no idea about imec until this, and turns out they’re one of the most important organizations for modern technology.

@n0madfernan257

Жыл бұрын

yes, they were like the class representative who makes the rival kids shake hands and agree to clean the classroom altogether... something like that i suppose.

@pablomelana-dayton9221

Жыл бұрын

I felt that way about asml not too long ago

@theempirewasright7673

Жыл бұрын

@@pablomelana-dayton9221 im discovering new stuff abt this incredible complicated business every day it feels😂

@gamba4605

Жыл бұрын

It bcus you lack in reading.

@arthas640

Жыл бұрын

​@@theempirewasright7673 electronics is insanely complicated, especially since they need things to be extremely fast to produce since they need vast quantities before the parts become outdated, they need to be cheap since things are constantly evolving, and they need to be easy to produce to facilitating the first two requirements. hardware and software go hand in hand so you need incredibly complicated companies working on both. this is also why sectors are virtually monopolized by single companies or at least a very limited number. this all is also why so few countries and companies can do something like create their own facebook or Amazon with China' vast investments into what are essentially state own enterprises to compete with American equivalents one of the few who can pull it off.

Man, I feel like this channel is sending me deeper into a microprocessor rabbit hole with each video. First I learn about all the crazy stuff on the bleeding edge that firms like TSMC are doing, then I find out that they can only do what they do because of lithography devices that ASML builds, and now I'm being taken to the next level learning that ASML can only build those ,machines by integrating devices from IMEC, Zeiss, etc. Now I'm wondering how deep this information hole goes?

@martinsaunders7925

Жыл бұрын

The Crab nebula. The same place lost sms and socks from the dryer.

@marvin19966

Жыл бұрын

don't proceed any further for your own safety or you'll encounter physicists and they're weird

@bebokRZly

Жыл бұрын

If only people knew, they would understand how hard is to "just make a procesor or technology" and how well embargos are working as a penalty. Civilzation is dependent on just couple of companies :) and they are not Google, Amazon, Meta etc :)

@TAP7a

Жыл бұрын

@@marvin19966 too bad, ASML is already full of physicists

@martinsaunders7925

Жыл бұрын

@@bebokRZly depends where you want to start. The periodic table of elements,the Indian Vedas,the analog computer of the anticathera mechanism?

There was a period of time IMEC was investigating direct maskless lithography from such companies as Mapper Lithography BV (Netherlands) and KLA corporation (REBL). When ASMLs lithography proved to be viable, mapper for example lost all market share. A sister company is all that remains of them, Mapper LLC (RU).

@InTimeTraveller

Жыл бұрын

Mapper Lithography BV has been bought out by ASML. I found an article saying that they declared bankruptcy in 2018 and ASML is likely interested in the IP for inspection tools. The Russian subsidiary of Mapper was making MEMS and according to the same article was sold to Rusnano but continues to operate as an independent MEMS fab.

I thought this would be about water. Instead it's about industry collaboration, so I wasn't disappointed.

1:08 “A small district of about 6.6 million people” That small district is well over half the country of Belgium. Congratulations on your pronunciation of Leuven and prof. Van Overstraeten. It’s excellent (as are your videos in general btw)

@seahyx120

Жыл бұрын

The district has more people than my country!

@ReddoFreddo

Ай бұрын

State would probably have been a more appropriate term than district but I can't tell if he was being sarcastic.

Fortunate to work with IMEC during research days. This institution is a masterpiece and inspiration to many.

This video should be played to every freshman at imec. I got aware of the role imec is playing after almost one year I've been here.🤣

I was yearning for an asianometry video past 2-3 days. love it when a new one drops.

This channel is a blessing.

They should have an IMEC for all industries that require huge upfront capital investments for R&D before commercialization

@ShaggyRax

Жыл бұрын

Right like imagine an IMEC of sorts for Space companies or mineral refining

@PaulSpades

Жыл бұрын

@@ShaggyRax What is NASA for?

@bebokRZly

Жыл бұрын

@@PaulSpadesNASA Is not a goverment department, which pays to make technology and then order it? It is not integrator i think. More like rich customer who is syaing what he needs and then he pays for development to match these needs?

@ghostdog5525

Жыл бұрын

Well they do in Germany with the Fraunhofer Institutes. There are over 70 institutes covering most technology areas. Currently 30k employees and EUR3bn annual budget.

@maartentoors

Жыл бұрын

@@bebokRZly I think NASA (after getting budget) commissions orders, and then goes for the best pitch(es), hedging their end-product, all the while sharing their (enormous) trove of experience/data/engineering. While IMEC is more like a spider in the web in the much of the semiconductor manufacturing world.

Penn State in University City does something similar. They provide IP licenses and rent space to businesses and pull in huge sums of money doing it. Back when I went there, they were about to build a 250 Million dollar Lab to expand their 40 million dollar lab. During a tour they told us they made over $10 million a year in licensing fees.

@johndoh5182

Жыл бұрын

Different colleges across the US used to get a bit of govt. funding to go into R&D, and they worked with industry to develop technology. So, Penn State is one of many places this happens or used to happen, not so much the renting out of spaces, but the use of the college for R&D.

Hello from Leuven! I want to say that you have a lot of followers in imec.

Fascinating topic as always Jon! :D

Top Stuff, a valued addition to any KZread watch list, keep going.

It feels so weird seeing one of your videos about something I literally pass on the way to my campus. when I'm used to seeing videos about things half way across the world.

@William-Morey-Baker

Жыл бұрын

i realize theres nothing wrong with your use of "across" technically speaking... it just always makes me think of flat earthers... people usually say around the world, not across the world. again, its not technically incorrect to say across the world... its just far less common and is quickly becoming associated with flat earthers.

@tomassunaert1300

Жыл бұрын

@@William-Morey-Baker oh fuck I didn't realise. But dont worry I know my science and am well aware the earth is velociraptor shaped.

Great video. Am glad to see that consortiums can be worthwhile. My own experience (in another field) is that the various 'partners' are often regarded as competition and one needs to be cautious with what they share

I was hoping you would cover IMEC some day. Thank you! I pitched it to my wife who is working there here in Leuven. I told here to send it to the PR colleagues. ;)

Great video. Thanks, once again, John. Much appreciated.

Nice video! imec is also a major silicon photonics center, both for research and as a foundry. Probably the most advanced academic SiP foundry with a MPW offering and directly competitive with leading industrial foundries.

Perhaps the most interesting part of these videos to me is all the big names I've never heard of. I was somewhat aware of IMEC, but SkyWater and Tokyo Electron are new to me.

I used to visit Leuven a couple of times every year over 10 years ago and still never heard colleagues talking about IMEC. Leuven is a beautiful little city with quite an interesting tech business cluster growing out of KU Leuven. Worth a quick day trip if you ever visit Brussels.

@Asianometry

Жыл бұрын

I’d love to visit one day

@ericyang5237

Жыл бұрын

@@Asianometry And Leuven being a watering hole really gave me a chuckle: InBev has their massive Stella Artois brewery next to the train station, and on weekend evenings the pubs around the Oude Markt next to KU are filled with students chugging Duevel/Chimay/Leffe…

@Martinit0

3 ай бұрын

@@AsianometryMaybe someone from IMEC watching your channel can arrange an IMEC tour. Would certainly be interesting to have a video of that. Apart from that Leuven is worth a visit by itself, the variety of pubs, bars and beers is amazing. If you are ambitious you could even do a Europe tour, visiting ASML, as well as maybe Globalfoundries in Dresden, Germany or Carl Zeiss SMT

Your pronunciation of leuven was really good btw

@Asianometry

Жыл бұрын

Who says I don’t google the pronunciations?

@gregvanpaassen

Жыл бұрын

@@Asianometry ... but please pronounce "ArF" as "Argon Fluoride"! :-)

@ReddoFreddo

Жыл бұрын

He even did the Belgian Dutch pronunciation although that probably wasn't intentional.

@tomassunaert1300

Жыл бұрын

@@ReddoFreddo Its even the leuven dialect way of saying leuven.

@tomassunaert1300

Жыл бұрын

@@Asianometry It was the leuven dialect way of saying leuven aswel, I'll just use this as evidence form my conspiracy theorie that asianometry secretly speaks dutch.

A very good analyses about this special Belgium institute! 👌

Enlightened, once again. Thanks.

Osceola is pronounced Aw-See-Ole-Ah (it is actually rendered as Asi-yahola in creek). Many things in Florida are named after Chief Osceola, who was instrumental during the Second Seminole War, which resisted the US's efforts to forcibly relocate the tribe. Pronunciation of things like this have been used as shibboleths in the past; the fact that Walt Disney *could* correctly pronounce Kissimmee was how the US news media figured out that the Walt Disney Company was building Disney World in that area.

@x4700

Жыл бұрын

He also mispronounced stochastic and processes. :)

Excellent overview of IMEC and how it operates.

Singapore "missed the boat" on the semi-conductor industry despite having massive financial resources and a large number of well-educated government-sponsored scholars in the public sector. It had Chartered Semiconductor Manufacturing which could not compete and was sold to Global Foundries. Takeaway: It is not about money but people and management. Having the right people in charge - effective risk takers, not well educated but risk-adverse administrators is crucial. Also, money cannot buy time.

@tykjpelk

Жыл бұрын

They're currently catching up in the photonics space. One of the leading open access silicon photonics foundries, AMF, is in Singapore. They're directly competing with imec and better than them in some aspects. Singapore has several other integrated photonics foundries as well, but AMF is the biggest.

@geneballay9590

Жыл бұрын

GOOD POINT Takeaway: It is not about money but people and management. Having the right people in charge - effective risk takers, not well educated but risk-adverse administrators is crucial.

@ntabile

Жыл бұрын

We have IME....and A-star

@styx1272

Жыл бұрын

Pretty true of all business. Bad management vaporizes wealth. Seen so much good tech from Au Universities spun off to incompetent lazy jobs for the boys who must sit around congratulating themselves whilst making bad decisions and chewing through capital. Eventually they miss the boat as competitors leap frog them.

@Martinit0

3 ай бұрын

But Globalfoundries is still operating those fabs in SG, so not really a loss, just change of ownership.

I sign on to youtube for your videos! Thank you for what you do!

Great video on an organization that is mostly unknown to the general public.

Brilliant every time

Love the reference to the quote from Sean Connery in "The Rock ". Losers always whine about doing their best. Winners go home and f**k the prom queen. Of course, Nicholas Cage responded that his date was the prom queen. Top notch film! Much like this channel. 😇

It should be noted that IMEC is not doing research only in semiconductor design and manufacturing, but also in the field of PCB manufacturing. The DfM rules for example that my company - an assembly house for PCBs- use in PCB development largely come from research that IMEC has done (and also IPC guidelines).

Coincidentally I found out today that Belgium has one of the highest R&D spending in relation to GDP in Europe, imec is probably a big reason why.

@gregorivingerhoets6109

Жыл бұрын

That and biotech, biotech is probably the biggest chunk.

@ReddoFreddo

Жыл бұрын

@@gregorivingerhoets6109 Who knew

@gregorivingerhoets6109

Жыл бұрын

@@ReddoFreddo Anyone in Belgium working in Biotech/pharma :p?

I live in Belgium and had no idea this was a thing lol. also Flanders is not a "small district" it's 60% of the country lol

@kaanerdem2822

Жыл бұрын

Me too lol, embarased btw

@MJ-uk6lu

Жыл бұрын

But is it Ned Flanders?

Cool video! Now I am waiting for a video about: Stmicroelectronics Infineon Technoprobe

Do you have any recommended reading on the basics of semiconductors and their supply chains?

love the term 'watering hole' no mum im not having a bath im going to the watering hole

Lol, I was there when they installed the EUV machine. was super cool to be there

Next do the Albany NY ecosystem and IBM's influence there! It had one of the first 157nm, 193nm immersion, and EUV tools. It was also the first demonstration of 7nm with EUV with a robust vendor ecosystem as well.

@ChristianStout

Жыл бұрын

Is that the same area where GlobalFoundry's new headquarters is located?

@pseydtonne

Жыл бұрын

Also, you can just say "SUNY Albany" (SOO-knee AWL-buh-knee). They added the extra New York bit for that press release. SUNY is the umbrella for 64 colleges. It has four universities: Albany (the state capital), Binghamton (the flagship and my alma mater), Buffalo, and Stony Brook (way out on Long Island). It has a series liberal arts and teacher's schools (Geneseo, Oswego, and others that only us upstaters can pronounce), and every community college in the state.

I think this is the first time you mentioned Canon and Nikon (usually thought of camera makers) in semi conductor area.. May be an in depth video on those two companies in order? 🤔

@tykjpelk

Жыл бұрын

Any of the videos about lithography or Japanese semicon should feature Canon and Nikon

@Asianometry

Жыл бұрын

I’ve done a few videos on them already. Go check them out!

Love your content and will sign up for your Patreon! Yes, my dad and his company setup certain educational systems in Malay back in the early 2000s. It always struck me as odd that a Malay government would be even remotely interested in anything Anglo educational wise after the Rubber tree/Palm oil debacles and other negative Euro/Anglo issues. From what I recall they were a Muslim centric nation and even to this day fairly compartmentalized socially for instance although Muslim's don't eat pork the Chinese do and so you can eat pork in Malaysia although Muslim centric. The Malay men didn't do much it was the Malay women who educated themselves and wanted something better for themselves and their children. The Chinese were the smart ones, business owners who sent their kids off to be educated in Europe or America. It's a pity worldwide that wages are the "same as the workers grandfathers in 1975." Time to move into the 21st century. If you can't afford to pay your workers a relevant living wage, then you shouldn't have a business.

Lol im working at the SPIE Advanced Lithography Meeting right now in San Jose. 7:19....Lots of very exciting research here.

That's a cool building

Go Asianometry !

I spend quite some time there both in the 200mm and 300mm fabs during my career in AMAT. Interesting company. Do they still sell wine in the cafeteria? 😋

fascinating.

My grandma lives close to the IMEC tower. You can see her apartment in the top left of the final picture 😁 I've done a collaboration with IMEC for AI research, but I get the impression their business model doesn't really work for software. The European Patent Convention explicitly states that software is not patentable, so they basically don't have much more input than what you can find online. Love your channel Jon! ♥️

thats awesome

In the US, govt. funding used to be combined with business funding and college based R&D for different technology. The US used to be a leader in HARDWARE technology. Now? Look pretty much anywhere else. And because the country can't even agree because of stupid politics, which is why govt. funding dried up, on a basic curriculum to ensure people are getting a good enough education such as Common Core to enter highly technical education, engineers are coming from mostly other countries. Even the US's successful hardware companies have to rely on engineers from around the world. To some degree they always have but now engineers are overwhelmingly from other countries. Intel does a lot of development in Israel for instance. I guess they found that so many of their engineers were coming from Israel it made more sense to build a fab along with R&D there.

@seahyx120

Жыл бұрын

Instead of looking up to the sky, they're stuck looking at their feet.

@Martinit0

3 ай бұрын

US still going strong in the biotech / pharma sector as far as govt/college funding is concerned. Ever heard of NIH, Broad Institute etc? The reality is that US companies realized that it's very difficult to make money with hardware. Way easier with software and that is a consequence of a legal pecularity: instead of selling software outright you can (and everybody does) just license it for use, retain all ownership and control of the software. That gives you way more control over the customer. Whereas with hardware the minute you delivered it the customer has full ownership and control. Only Apple has figured out how to make money with hardware and that was by combining it with software and removing control of the hardware from users. That way Apple can get a 30% cut of EVERY monetary transaction on their phones for example. Imagine you manufacture cash registers and get 30% of revenue from every transaction. Back to biotech and pharma - you now realize that those sectors are likewise very well protected and developed in terms of IP and licensing and that makes it easier to defend and more money can be made and therefore flows into that sector.

Wrong C sound on Osceola. Only pointing out because it's named after a great Seminole leader and is still a common family name amongst the Seminole.

I can’t with these jokes 😂 Your voice and humor remind me so much of Nathan Fielder. Anyone else?

right click, 'add to dictionary'. but keep up the good work, you do good stuff.

I didn’t know there are Partridges with the technical expertise for lithography 🕊

I love collaboration!

@andersjjensen

Жыл бұрын

@Ben Dover Well... if they actually HAD collaborated rather than trying to continue the Soviet Union without the Union part things might have gone differently. And once Vladboi is no longer the presitator who knows if Russia can become a collaborator on the global scene.

@tijsvancauwenberge8675

Жыл бұрын

how was this commented 2 months ago

@andersjjensen

Жыл бұрын

@@tijsvancauwenberge8675 Patreon Early Access Tier.

@uncriecrasant

Жыл бұрын

Maybe. But it will take 2-3 generations in order to leave bitterness behind and recompose a new horizon...

maybe the real treasure was the semiconductors we made along the way

@Asianometry Next video suggestion : ASM International (Not to be confused with ASML)

I am glad to have fou d this chanel through Moores Law is Dead.

@dirk2518

6 ай бұрын

Imec themselves say that Moore’s law will be valid with years to come

NEVER heard of imec ! How on earth did they slipped under the radar like that??

@dirk2518

6 ай бұрын

Big countries underestimate small countries

€62m was peanuts for it's return. Other countries would write a blank cheque to attract them to relocate now. We have nothing comparable to this. Shows what foresight is needed and cash

I first thought the thumbnail is about intel, but to prevent trademark issues the logo was changed. Only after starting the video i got it xD

just call it SUNY albany - right next to RPI!

Well I'm just worried for when the makers are annexed but we'll see what happens ;./

@9:38 you spelled Stochastic wrong 😅 I found it funny the way you spelled it😂

Is a 4-letter acronym an industry requirement?

9:37 I think you mixed up Micro Bridge and Broken Line.

@teghem6723

Жыл бұрын

You could rather determine whether black or gray is the conductive strip or the insulator

feck. 43 mins late! Sorry man. Don't worry Jon, i'll watch the vid 3 times :) also, i'll do it at weird times.. like .. 2/6th past 22:00 but before 22:00:090 :0001

Lurvin' is where Barry White was born.

"Governemnt is Belgium have unusually large control over their industrial development"... In the West, a good thing that allows this kind of sucesses... In China :"cOmMunIsm thAt eVily MaNipuLates thE rUles of Maket"....

@dirk2518

Жыл бұрын

That is not what he is saying. In belgium the district of flanders can decide authonomisly from the central government to invest in Scientific research.

@germancarrasco2028

Жыл бұрын

@@dirk2518 Government coordination is a good thing. It is government that controls corporations or corporations that control governments. But corporations can only think in the short-time profit...

@Martinit0

3 ай бұрын

@@dirk2518How is that different in other countries? Where is it that a local government cannot support local businesses or research centers?

@dirk2518

3 ай бұрын

@@Martinit0 in a lot of countries there is only one central government and few authority for different régions. In Spain and Belgium governing is decentralised while France is much more centralised.

Question... What does the Rothchild Family and the semi-conductor industry have in common ?

..and a partridge in a pear tree"?

Pretty sure this is Nilered's alt informative KZread channel.. Is it only me, who thinks that?

The organization known as imec, sorry, ˙ ımec.

Why did the US University also get a prototype vs any other university considering Intel was already falling behind as was US advanced chip

Collaboration uses time and assets better

I pronounce the word 'stochastic' differently.

This is proof that for-profit endeavors(ie. capitalism) is not the only way to improve technology.

@00:13 spell checker caption... really? Tapping "Add to Dictionary" or "Ignore all" just once is all thats required to prevent spell checker 'insanity' lol

Lel.. My older brother is doing a PhD at imec

@marvin19966

Жыл бұрын

best of luck to him inshallah

Where was this prvately generated revenue of 6.5 million euro coming from?

Flanders is not a "small district" of Belgium but the (dutch) *half of the country* ... I must say that your info about European issues is sometimes a bit strange.

Almost all the information here is in favor of the argument of the Japanese lithography companies lol

@MrViki60

Жыл бұрын

Cope

To the person who is reading this, don't give up on your channel. Keep on going... Push harder... Its going to be better ❤️❤️

@0deepak

Жыл бұрын

You really want those subs, huh?

1:55 my God what a stupid building architecture.

To build an advanced car, you cooperate with many companies. For example, Toyota would provide wheels, Honda would provide a steering wheel, Mercedes would provide a cigarette lighter, rooftop would come from Kia, seats from someone else, pedals instead of an engine, and windshield wipers from Taiwan. You put all those pieces together, then share results with all who collaborate, and they get all the data directly from the IMEC dumpster. What a stupid idea!

@luipaardprint

Жыл бұрын

It's an extremely well engineered lighter.

Stochastic is pronounced 'sto-kas-tik'. Funny how a foreign trained speaker has so many mispronounced English words in multiple presentations. 😟

its pronounced "stəˈkastik"... i realize english sucks as a language, what with how many words break from basically all rules or conventions... but it couldnt hurt to look up how a word is pronounced when you arent sure. i realize its not a big deal, and it doesnt imply a lack of intelligence, its just a pet peeve of mine. i'm aware it usually means someone is actually well read and simply doesnt have anyone else to discuss the topic with so they dont hear the word spoken out loud, and stochastic isnt a super common word to use in everyday conversation... its just kinda funny hearing it pronounced the way it was here.

@Asianometry

Жыл бұрын

I looked it up. I think I prefer my pronunciation. Who says I can’t use it?

@johndoh5182

Жыл бұрын

Having spoken English since I was born, and having been around the world watching people try to talk in very technical ways and seeing just how many words they're saying that are English words, I think I'm glad I learned English. Really dude you didn't have to be a prick with that comment. We don't need people bashing each others' languages here.

@eliavrad2845

Жыл бұрын

Stochastic comes from Greek "stokhastikos", so as a non-native english speaker i tend to think of it as "stokhastic", and probably so do people of other languages that allow 'kh': I think it is genuinely more understandable being approximated as 'k' than a 'tsh' sound. It's Greek chi χ, "stoxastic" like in Mexico, not Xiaomi. Edit: This is also true for other Greek-derived sciency words, like machine, chaos, and chromatic, so I guess next video you are obligated to say something like "khemistry" or "tshromatic abberation".

Please pronounce 'processes' correctly. Not seas, more like sez.

@Asianometry

Жыл бұрын

Deal with it

@jwbowen

Жыл бұрын

I use both pronunciations interchangeably (American English)

@Martinit0

3 ай бұрын

Don't poke the bear or he will release the DRAM.

9:36 it's a hard "ch" in "stochastic" (stə-ˈka-stik) 10:30 it's a soft "c" in "Osceola"