a few solutions to this problem: kzread.info/dash/bejne/aISnpZWLqNXepLA.html

Don’t ask questions. Just consume product and get excited for next product.

But how are you gonna feed the poor Hasbro executives and their families if you don't buy their product every 2nd month of the year. Like Jesus before a massive set would come around maybe every 6th month or so maybe only one massive power creep set a year now we're getting them like rapid fire. It's way too much.

@Hydehunt

Ай бұрын

And there's a set two weeks after this big set too

@patstevenswhohatesbuttermi5861

Ай бұрын

It's worse than bimonthly ... we're at some type of product drop almost monthly, and sometimes less than a month apart. An eternal format shouldn't be one you need to keep up with that often.

@SinjohRuins

27 күн бұрын

We are a week past MH3 everyone has already moved on to Assassins Creed

@coulterbaker4663

25 күн бұрын

@@patstevenswhohatesbuttermi5861 its literally monthly - the only reason May lacked a release is BC they bundled BIG into OTJ because they thought it would fail as a standalone set based on how MOM aftermath performed.

Set a small budget for singles buys. Stick to it. It's been very liberating for me. I've also found it liberating to stop thinking that any card is an auto-include/staple and should never be removed. Any card is fair game to be swapped out for me. Usually because it's been power crept out, doesn't have sufficient synergy, is boring, or sometimes it's just too powerful. But sometimes I take cards out because they ARE staples.

@toddpacker1015

Ай бұрын

Set a small budget for Ink and Proxy Kingzz

@dimitriid

Ай бұрын

One thing I started doing that I thought wouldn't be wise but its turning out ok is this: Instead of looking at common commander decks and builds I've been looking at cedh decks instead. The trick is that by looking at the most efficient possible builds you get to just ignore a lot of the white noise: the casual commander player in me still gets excited about a lot of new cards coming in but once I get into the mentality of 'If it isn't a huge combo piece I'm not putting anything past 3 CMC cost on my deck and will try to aim for 2CMC at the most' then suddenly a lot of the 'must have' cards don't seem as relevant to me at all: I was fine with Thunder Junction buying zero sealed products and just picking I believe something like 9 or 10 singles one of them being Sara Lee but just the card itself, not the precon deck. There's going to be a few more on MH3 but honestly out of everything I've seen I'm still looking at the same maybe 10-20 cards I want but none that I actually *need* to make any of my decks perform really well.

@treeprophet4812

Ай бұрын

Take staples out! Exactly. I'd rather have some jank that has unique synergy with the rest of my deck

@mr.nakamura9088

Ай бұрын

Very solid strategy. I'll add to this by using a chart to try to snatch the lows. Reprints see the biggest retracement while the new cards tend to either be heavily overvalued or missed entirely until the masses figure out a card is good. Best recent example of this was Nerd Rage which was $.30 before people caught on it could both be abused and likely not be reprinted. Speculation aside think about new cards you have a home for to reduce collection bloat.

@GonzoEDH

Ай бұрын

I just stopped reading every card that gets released. Sure I look at the spoilers but who has the time to analyze in depth over a thousand cards every year. I also just buy random boosters once in a while. Singles only if I need a refill of a staple (always good to have the spare solring). It's much better for me to build with what I have, don't have perfect knowledge of the game, I always find myself reading a card that just hit the battlefield. On the spot new threat assestment is exhilarating (And opening a cool bomb you didn't even know it existed is also great)

The term power creep is not really applicable as the word creep would imply slow progress. That is no longer the case.

@aronsandstrom601

Ай бұрын

Yeah, this is a power explosion.

@moedark4390

Ай бұрын

power leap

@isidoreaerys8745

Ай бұрын

Arms race

@bg1020

Ай бұрын

Its forced rotation for an eternal format is what this is. So many cards are just direct upgrades and not exploring new design spaces. They have no time for creativity with their release schedule

@rameybartels6291

Ай бұрын

My friends all all it “power leap”

yep, i totally agree, the rain of new shit is too heavy.

I hear plenty of EDH players say the format was best before it was catered to, when it was "you get what you get" and people had to be creative with deckbuilding. Now, with so many "auto-includes" and with every product being catered to EDH, it seems like Wizards managed to trick us into playing EDH as a subscription model. Anyway, I am curious if you think another format could evade this culture. Peasant/Pauper EDH? That brings back some of that "you get what you get"

@Jeff32479

Ай бұрын

Statistically unlikely. Too many cards become ubiquitous across nearly every format in magic. You're absolutely right about commander. Play black? Demonic tutor and vampiric tutor are automatic. Cyclonic rift and mystical tutor in blue. Dockside and deflecting swat in red. Sylvan in green. Swords and path in white. Sol Ring and Mana Crypt. The number of slots you actually have in a commander deck keeps getting less and less

@Butmunch666

29 күн бұрын

Well you can always just agree with your friendgroup that certain cards you're just not gonna use.

@jolteon345

8 күн бұрын

@@Jeff32479The number of actual staples depends on your playgroup. The only way you get locked into staples is if your playgroup strictly plays at a high enough power level that you can’t not run the staples. My main playgroup has decks of a variety of power levels and wants to see unique/interesting cards, so I’ll rarely actually feel out of the game unless I don’t draw well or there’s a blatant power mismatch.

I’ve completely pulled out of Magic for now. I agree with you that the constant spoiler season, power creep and pressure to replace every single card with its newest, more efficient upgrade is exhausting. I’ll just keep playing the decks I have built and stop participating in the circus that is MtG right now. I’m sure I’ll come back at some point.

Soon WotC will power creep cards within their own sets. Day 1: spoil a power crept card. Day 10: spoil a direct upgrade to the spoiled card from Day 1

@Lazydino59

Ай бұрын

Def could see this, have a rare that’s really strong and a mythic that’s twice as good

@Xmr2024

Ай бұрын

Lol 😂

@SinjohRuins

27 күн бұрын

*Hasbro

@quintenfrancis8858

13 күн бұрын

That’s a good idea

With the over saturation of new products I have found myself gaining renewed appreciation for older cards from past sets! I have been finding myself adding in niche-narrow cards that [within that circumstance] preform better than 'must-have / staples'.

@ry7hym

Ай бұрын

I love this! I am thinking of taking "specifically-designed-with-commander-in-mind" cards (aka every card since they started making commander precons). But on the other side, (and that's mostly because I only started playing at around 2015) most of my decks are from that time period and my favourite deck is built from a precon. so my kind of soft-barrier I'm thinking of excluding cards is probably like from Zendikar Rising and on, because that's when they started making set-connected pre-cons.

@azelia2464

Ай бұрын

Same with me :P I make a lot of Commander decks on Frogtown and I've recently started adding some older cards here and there. Honestly it's fun using old cards IRL and seeing peoples reactions to them haha

@revanliviar1239

Ай бұрын

What kind of niche cards do you use? I love finding out new cards I didnt know about before

@user-gj1lb6xp3t

Ай бұрын

yeah I dig through boxes at my local stores for pre modern stuff

@andrewtaylor5883

Ай бұрын

@@revanliviar1239 in cEDH I run an artifact recycling package for triggering draw on cast. I use these cards to break parody. 1. Rebuild 2. Retract 3. Leave // Chance [personal favorite] 4. Hurkyl's Recall

A guy from our playgroup solved this problem by only playing ULTRAcommander, meaning he is only allowed to have ONE copy of a card (except not-utility lands) in ALL of his decks combined. This is such a great concept in my opinion. It‘s way easier than you would think and it doesn’t hurt PL in any meaningful way. I‘m leaning more and more towards it myself.

@crimsonleg4237

Ай бұрын

I have a similar restriction; I don't have duplicates of any card in any deck unless it has an alternate art, or a different border. My only exceptions are Sol Ring, Arcane Signet, and Command Tower. Other mana rocks and all other nonbasic lands are included in the restriction. So, if a card only has one art (doesn't matter how many printings in the same border), it goes in only one deck. That's it. I don't buy multiples of the same card with the same art with the same border.

@Krunschy

Ай бұрын

I completely see that. Though I personally wouldn't want to go this far, I hate getting asecond copy of a card I already own. It's a format all about diversity, I don't wanna keep seeing the same cards across completely different decks.

@chomper1329

Ай бұрын

Take it to the next step.... buy 1 copy, proxy the rest. no more $20 lands bought 6 different times.

@machinronii

Ай бұрын

@@chomper1329 but then you have the same problem of the video, even if you proxy the card you dont know what to do with it...

@chomper1329

Ай бұрын

​@@machinroniiyou play the proxy... It's like $0.25 to make.... What do you do with the proxy when replaced? Hold on to one or two and throw away the others... The main one gets stuck in a binder to call upon for tournaments.

As a newer player, a couple of years now, I ignore most new cards because it's just too overwhelming. And there are so many old cards I've yet to play.

I have broken free from my cardboard shackles

I’ve downsized to two decks. Well one actually but I intend to make one around Bloomburrow because I like the theme. I just don’t play enough to justify having more. After that I won’t upgrade anymore. I’m so sick of power creep and price creep for that matter!

@mjhenkel1984

Ай бұрын

no kidding! i buy bundles from normal sets but i hate these "premium" sets!

@Jeffophone

Ай бұрын

I very much agree. I only really have one deck, because I figure if there's another commander I like mechanically, it'll just be replaced by a "better" or more interesting version later. Now I'm just looking for one or two more commanders I really love for their art/flavor/lore. And for that one deck I have, I made a list of cards I do and don't want to replace - with the goal of getting a deck where I don't want to replace anything and never have to buy new cards for it.

@chomper1329

Ай бұрын

I started making my own cards tbh, and it's be fun as all get out. I made a USA Army themed deck - still working on Art, but I think the card interaction are all completed. Going to play test it sooner than later.

The volume and power of the new cards being printed is definitely overwhelming, as you said at the end. It's a tough balance between wanting to be competitive and casual, but the prices of everything makes it a lot easier to stick to buying one card per deck. I've been strictly trading for new cards rather than buying them, but that means that I am going to miss out on certain cards I really want. However, as enfranchised commander players, we most likely have enough cards in our collections to build reasonably powerful decks that can compete with the power creep. Deckbuilding prowess and skill during gameplay can make up for the microadvantages that power creep provides, so there is less and less reason to be buying the strictly better versions. If a card provides a unique effect, then it might be worth buying, but a Cultivate will still get done what needs to get done in the end. Leave the power crept cards to the new players so they can come to the table to compete and have fun with the enfranchised players without having to play optimally.

@W4llh4k

Ай бұрын

Many enfranchised players get caught in the following: "I NEED IT. IT'S A STAPLE". When there are no real staples in the format. The "upgrades" aren't ahead enough to merit running to buy them.

Players: like standard* WOTC: caters to standard* Players: move to modern* WOTC: caters to modern* Players: move to commander* WOTC: caters to commander* Hm it’s almost like people have shown repeatedly that they don’t like being spoon fed.

@teddymason6069

Ай бұрын

Very good point

@ry7hym

Ай бұрын

And now they are spoon feeding commander to modern (???)

@jaysuede2627

Ай бұрын

Right? It's like they think we're too stupid to build our own decks.

@ryanbolson23

Ай бұрын

@@jaysuede2627 exactly. Personally I just want R&D to worry about the individual cards and their design. I don’t want R&D to be thinking about my preferred play environment when designing a card. I just want cool cards man.

@xeper9458

Ай бұрын

@@jaysuede2627 No I don't think it's that it's that since Commander is the most popular format precons are the entry level product. Obviously it's what the majority wants because precons are their #1 top selling product. Personally, I love them. I like to upgrade them and put my own spin on them. They are also great for filling out your collection in my opinion

That's why I only play on a set budget. You get to ignore every single chase card, you wait a few months for the prices to set up so you're never caught up in the hype and you get more excited over chaff no one else wants because of the existence of a overpriced strict upgrade.

@rulezer0682

Ай бұрын

Exactly! Stick to budgets and play with weird fun cards. I purposely sell most of my pricy cards so I can build more decks

@rodgerlang884

Ай бұрын

That only works if your playgroup is in. The people I used to play with fully embrace the arms race

@draftmagicagain1000

19 күн бұрын

I wait until the cards rotate out of standard then pick them up at a discount. No rush 😊

great seeing how you feel about it. I really want them to make more niche and less generally good stuff or strictly better cards.

All my decks for the most part, are snapshots in time. I don't do incremental upgrades for the reasons that you have stated. I HATE feeling like Im compulsively buying things. The way that I look at things is, IF I still have the ability to win/compete consistently with a deck in my group, then there is really no need for me to passively upgrade my decks. It also makes it easier to tear down old decks that don't captivate me as much because there is no "new money" put into that deck.

@SmashCentralOfficial

Ай бұрын

I also feel like my decks are a snapshot in time from when I started played a couple years ago. It's so tedious to constantly update and rotate cards in and out.

@ry7hym

Ай бұрын

I always was the type of deck builder that looked for cards every time a new set came out. lately I've stopped doing that and I kinda hate myself for not doing that from the beginning on

Powercreep at maximum.

@rainbowcrash6990

Ай бұрын

Exactly. Power creep is natural, and magic did a good job at countering it anyway for years. New crazy powerful cards were much rare. 1-2 every 1-2 blocks? But now Hasbro needs it's $$$ so wizards has to print wilder and wilder stuff to force sales. Corpos ruining things that's creators cared about. I'm sad when I see a post from Maro responding to criticism with "but sales ⬆️". I hope he knows in his heart that he's helping to sell mtg as a paypig for the corpos.

@malmasterson3890

Ай бұрын

​@rainbowcrash6990 Maybe it's just because I'm comparing to the Peak of Powercreep, but imo the problem with the last 3 years is that they've been focusing too much on us the commander players, and putting out way too many products. Back when we had War of the Spark and The Year of Commander every single set seemed to break the entirety of magic in some way, meanwhile, the last few years has been much more tame set to set, but there's so many cards that it completely overloads us.

@Darkendlezzz

Ай бұрын

@@rainbowcrash6990it’s not natural. There’s nothing to win in power creep besides creating 3 losers more consistently. You’re an idiot

@moedark4390

Ай бұрын

power leap

recently the professor had a video where the guests used old lists of the time they started commander and it was really nostalgic, It would be nice to have a pre-2015 commander format and bring the power level down a little bit.

@StoneSourFanBoy

Ай бұрын

You can play a lower powerlevel deck, I don't understand the problem, except if you still want to compete with the top dogs while playing jank... More people should focus on loving their decks and having fun rather than just looking for the win :)

@Pedro49676

Ай бұрын

@@StoneSourFanBoy is not really fun to be the only person in an lgs with a 2015 power level deck, I don't need to win but doing nothing at the table

@Blacklodge_Willy

Ай бұрын

@@Pedro49676 PreEDH sounds like what you're looking for!

@StoneSourFanBoy

Ай бұрын

@@Pedro49676 if you can't find people to match the powerlevel of your deck, there should be a reason. 2015 wasn't "let's play a deck that does nothing", you were able to play synergies, so is the deck building process the problem ?

@jimharris5320

Ай бұрын

It's called pre-EDH. I think any card printed before the Commander 2011 is legal

It's getting so crazy that even new and younger players can spot that this set's MVPs will be subject to planned obsolescence in less than a year....

I've only started playing Magic about 2 years ago and I find trying to build a commander deck staggering, not only do I want to go back and look through the thousands of cards already printed but it seems every few weeks more and more cards are released... every time I feel like I got a deck planned out and ready to buy, a new set is leaked or released with cards that either fit one of my decks or gives me an entirely different idea for one. It's been over a year since I have been able to comfortably buy a new deck without having second thoughts or wanting to wait for the next best upgrade to a deck I haven't even got yet...😵

@davidcrain453

Ай бұрын

This will never change.

@AgentMurphy286

Ай бұрын

You’re still relatively new to the game. That FOMO will pass eventually. I took a 10 year break from the game. Came back about when you started, so I totally get the whole inundation thing. Just build decks you enjoy playing. You can always upgrade a deck later if you find that a bunch of cards have been printed that would be better for your deck. Also, waiting for cards to move out of standard can make buying singles cheaper. If you ever get to where the guy in the video is, talking about putting auto-includes compulsively is building themed decks. I have a wizard deck where every card in the deck evokes the idea of a pointy hat wizard. There are cards I have that are “auto-includes” but they’re off theme so I don’t use them. Sorry for the unsolicited advice haha

@moedark4390

Ай бұрын

@@davidcrain453 I wish some rich guy that cared about the integritty of the game would buy out wotc but thats not gonna happen.

@DD-to5ig

Ай бұрын

@@moedark4390 One day when Rudy owns Hasbro.

I'm taking a complete break. I really don't like the power creep or playing with such cards. It makes it unfun to me.

@kommanderkronk

Ай бұрын

I'm taking a forced break...I is broke 😂

@5kMagic

Ай бұрын

Me too. When every card does everything, what’s the point anymore??

@jeremyv3470

Ай бұрын

Yeah the power creep and complexity creep is making this game unrecognizable. It's sad to see.

@kommanderkronk

Ай бұрын

@@jeremyv3470 I personally dont mind the power creep. It's unfortunately a reality of most games. What I can't stand is the aesthetic change that makes the game not feel like Magic anymore

@jeremyv3470

Ай бұрын

@@kommanderkronk Power creep being inevitable is a fair point. However, it does feel like instead of a slow growth over the course of its life, it feels like the last few years they have put the pedal to the floor.

i would like to point out that proxying isn't the answer here. although that would save money, saving money isn't the entire issue. in fact it's a small part of the issue.

@totakekeslider3835

Ай бұрын

My friends and I proxy a bunch of decks, and we’re just getting really tired of having to sift through each set for each of our decks every other month and get 50 new cards. You’re right it’s not about the money, but it’s the relentless need to upgrade with constant new product that’s making the fatigue set in. If it was like once a year you make all the upgrades, that’s one thing, but it’s literally almost every month now. Double whammy from the amount of cards they’re just printing out and the quality of them.

@sunsfssb7699

Ай бұрын

Maybe this is a powerlevel 6-8 problem. If you play super high powered with Manadrain, Force of Will and Swansong even Counterspell feels like a bad card. But Powerlevel 7 of today will not be the same as Powerlevel 7 from next year. Powerlevel 10 on the other hand can't be upgraded by a lot anymore. Most cards you mentioned you got but didn't play and want to replace already are exactly that: Replacable cards. Maybe that's the whole reason why you feel like that. Natures Claim on the other hand usually is miles better than the new green card you mentioned. Swords to Plowshares and Path to Exile are go to white Removal spells. They don't really design something that's better than StoP, but between StoP and a randomly chosen 2 mana white creature removal is SO MUCH SPACE for powercreep. Obviously you don't have to play high powered if you don't want to, but what the way you say "I bought this card for each of my white decks" speaks to me like "I have boundaries I don't want to break. StoP will break them, but this card that isn't quite StoP won't." For WotC that means that they can design about 1000 cards thst are betwenn whatever white removal and StoP and you will buy all of them.

@okgut2033

Ай бұрын

i hear most a fear of missing out or being powercreped. so proxy is a solution. the other one is to dont give in and look for fun cards instead of strong ones.

@ry7hym

Ай бұрын

@@sunsfssb7699 yeah cEDH only gets a couple of new playables and for that format it's not as huge of a problem I think

@ry7hym

Ай бұрын

proxy is not at all part of the problem I think. it's just the constant steam of new products that are coming out with cards that replace cards from one or two sets ago. and that every set now is designed with Commander in mind

It's ok to have a mtg fatigue! It's fun to do something else for a while, and when you come back it's fun again. Regarding the strict upgrades: your decks are good right now. You have fun playing them the way they are, you don't have to upgrade them every set. Don't worry too much about the powerfull cards, there are 4 players at the table, no mater who is the most advanced in a game state will be kept in check by the other 3 players.

@Dragon_Fyre

Ай бұрын

I think one of the major shifts is the requirement for mass land destruction to be acceptable again. The ability to just put most of your decks land into play requires your opponents to be able to destroy that land. Everything draws cards now, so if I have 20 lands in play by turn 5, I don’t even care if I am arch-enemy. I can overwhelm all 3 opponents with ease.

@bluewzrd

Ай бұрын

​@@Dragon_FyreMLD is a valid strategy overall, but I don't think it's gonna solve the current meta. MLD help yo punish massive ramp and big cmc spells, but the format is pushing better 1-drop. MLD wont solve that.

@Dragon_Fyre

Ай бұрын

@@bluewzrd It’s not a singular solution, but where a players power level makes them the obvious arch-enemy, it’s very difficult aside from infinite combo win-cons out of nowhere that end the game to not be impacted by 3 players targeting your lands.

@bluewzrd

Ай бұрын

@@Dragon_Fyre (I'm just thinking here) I see three possible scenarios: you try to destroy some lands and the player will still be in the lead because of the overall advantage. You destroy all lands, reducing the chances of two other players to interract with the leading player and he is still in the lead because of its board presence. It sure is A solution though. But I think it's more about better use your removal, better politicing the table... And also accept the obvious defeat and simply go to the next game.

You hit the nail on the head. If you don't have a dedicated playgroup, it places a lot of pressure to either pay for new power or else have your decks get left behind quickly. Your Excise the Imperfect example was poignant. I started playing during the pandemic and have already seen numerous "staples" of the format get powercrept out; sometimes even the new powercrept versions get powercrept out! Of course, like any Magic player, I enjoy upgrading my decks and making them more powerful and synergistic, but when every set brings some new upgrades, I can't help but think "why am I spending so much money on a hobby that's determined to leave me behind?" Or even any money if my investments lose value within the span of a year? Sure, a lot of hobbies have some "upkeep" costs (raw materials, replacements, etc.), but usually a solid initial investment will last you. In Magic, that just seems to be less and less the case.

@Byteside546

Ай бұрын

Very good points. I would be out completely if not for a proxy pod

@LolindirElros

27 күн бұрын

I think the answer is then, try and get a dedicated group.

With Magic in a sense not really being Magic anymore due to Universes Beyond, I found that for me personally the most constructive way of engaging with the game is designing my own cards. I like unique commanders that rely on the huge card pool to function, like Mishra, Artificer Prodigy. Those decks cannot compete in an environment with steep power creep so EDH as a format has lost its luster to me. Making cards more powerful does not equate to interesting designs, but it risks leaving the more interestng designs behind. I think the future of the game lies with player driven formats and designs.

Okay, I think I'm remembering the EDHRECAST talking about redundancy being a good thing in commander decks.That being said; If they power creep too much, it's effectively turning the game into this weird suedo-limited format. You can run 2 of the whispering wildspeaker effectively. This feels a bit backward from how commander is supposed to be...

Totally hot take: Modern Horizons sets should have been reprint sets focusing on making the format more affordable at a base level while offering rare alt arts to entice collectors or the veterans who want to spice up their modern deck with more mint versions. Also super hot take: Modern Horizons should have had Modern precons to accompany the set. WotC could have designed the precon to be commander adjacent by making the precon singleton with a couple legendary creatures to act as the face card of the precon (the deck itself would still be 60 cards, but the deck could still be transitioned to commander with 40 extra cards). With this, players who are interested in Modern can still have a functional precon that they can tune up over time for modern or they can transfer into commander with those 60 cards.

It’s sad to see that drawbacks on cards have been done away with. One of my favourite parts of deck building is using cards to help a drawback on a card become a positive.

100% correct. People talking about casual commander as if power crept precons arent the most common used decks in casual because thats what newer players get. Anyone with a middle aged collection will see 80% of their cards blown out by things from just a couple years ago while those things get blown out by whatever is most recent

Maybe it's time to check out pauper commander? Something like whisperer of the wilds is a common while the new ronas is a rare. Wondering if focusing on these lower rarities prevents a lot of this creep.

@certanmike

Ай бұрын

The drawback is some colors are really strong others need the sub .50 rares to work

@guico33

Ай бұрын

If you're invested in the edh community, it's hard to switch to a fringe format. It might also be hard to find a playgroup.

@Z-S-H

27 күн бұрын

My playgroup did a "brew off" where we put together common card commander decks at sub $50 total deck price (any commander) we had a great time putting decks together and playing them together

@jhemp

25 күн бұрын

​@@Z-S-HI can also say this is a cool way to do things. I ALSO really like the idea of commander sealed pools. Have all players buy a box and build a deck. Each week everyone buys a few packs of X set and adjusts their deck. At the end of the "season" the others pitch in and buy them food or a box of cards or something. Whatever works for your budget.

The power creep is why me and my friends are going hard into pre-Modern as a format and are even playing pre-Modern commander. It's a little bit of a solved system, but WotC/Hasbro can't warp the format with obviously overturned cards. In a few months we might start adding extra sets in to keep things interesting, but Modern power creep is just absolutely insane and has been for a very long time. It's also significantly cheaper, which is nice.

If you made a series of what 1 card you would pick per set it would be amazing. And you could even take patreon decks and pick 1 card you would add for your patrons. It would be be soooo cool and a natural extension of the 10 card series that made me sub to begin with. What 1 card would you add to sefirs gluntch deck, we are dying to know haha

I'm starting to make "time decks" i use a commander from a set and i will only use cards that already existed when the commander was printed, i start extra budget and will upgrade from there I don't know if it's a solution, but there are so many products that this helps me to focus myself to build the deck and not feel overwhelmed

I've been complaining about power creep for 15 years. I think its just hitting the point now where its unreasonable. There are so many cards that used to be good.... but can not compete with modern cards.... would love to see a rebalence for every card to be competitive but you can't change cards post print... balance

WotC are making cards for ppl who play 5-6 days per week. While their player base is lucky to get a game every other month. It's just to much!!!

Been thinking about this for awhile, this is the first set I started proxying. I just end up buying too many 10$-30$ cards that I only play once, now I’m only buying stuff once I test it.

Personally ive just started building budget i dont really update the decks after i build them unless i get a surge of inspiration for reinvigorate the deck. Ive also been powering down my decks with budget includes so i dont feel pressured to always update them with new cards, also alows me to slot the cards i take out into new decks that dont quiet have enough fire power

Quite honestly, if you avoid the must-have auto-includes, you'll find it's still fairly affordable to keep up with things, provided you get the timing right. With the exception of undiscovered chase rares, around two weeks after release, a ton of stuff is just $0.25. The MDFC-lands here are all uncommons, and whales are going to crack so many of these packs they'll be pennies. Sure, lacking those cards put you at a disadvantage... against pubstompers or CEDH, lol. The former being people you wouldn't really want to play with anyways, and the latter being an opt-in format. I think the way to navigate it is to play things that are more niche, that don't really benefit from must-haves. After your Farid video, I made a turbo-eggs variant that hasn't needed an update in a while. Of course, it would be better with a Dockside, but I can't really bring myself to care enough.

@malmasterson3890

Ай бұрын

I do think the MDFC's will slowly shoot up later like many of the best from Zend did, even faster since it's a Horizons set. Regardless though you're pretty much right. I bit the bullet just cause I wanted to get it over with and grab the cards I wanted, and despite getting close to 40 cards I only paid like 50$. For a Horizons set I'd say that's pretty good, granted I did what you're saying essentially and betted on some of the chase rares dropping in price later down the line.

@bartoffer

Ай бұрын

@@malmasterson3890 Well, yes and no. They're stronger than the zend lands for sure, and there will be a natural accrual, but the Horizons sets are in print for longer and opened more than your usual standard set, generally. A lot of these lands aren't really playable in Modern but slot in just fine to Commander, so I think they'll stay depressed for a longer time. The reason I also recommend waiting 2 weeks before buying anything is that the presale prices are always, always inflated. Some cards will shoot up, like Hostile Investigator, but most collapse. Like Necrobloom is not an $8 card lol

@Dragon_Fyre

Ай бұрын

It is rather counter intuitive to say “If you avoid the must-have auto includes”… 😂

@vittoriosavian9964

Ай бұрын

​@@Dragon_Fyre not really tho. Auto includes are considered one just because they are strong. No one is forcing you to put them in your decks

@Dragon_Fyre

Ай бұрын

@@vittoriosavian9964 I was more addressing that the concern is cards being quickly phased out by strictly better versions, where staples (auto includes) are likely the one area where that is not much of a concern. For the most part the S-tier cards are safe. It’s B-tier cards (can be played in a lot of decks in lieu of better A-tier cards but better versions are available) being replaced by A-tier (can be played in most decks but not auto-include) and A-tier by S-tier cards (staples/auto-includes) that see those cards replaced. You need to have a massive amount of power creep before staples stop being staples. They just go from being in nearly every deck to being in alot of decks. The cards to stop buying are new cards that are B-tier or lower. Cards like fateful absence that get replaced were only ever good (not great) removal but never staples. Those are the cards I would pass on… Just as an example, Flare of Denial is a new powerful counter-spell… I would not expect to see Mana Drain, Fierce Guardianship, Force of Will, Pact of Negation, Swan Song or An Offer You Can’t Refuse being side-boarded or rendered obsolete anytime soon even with heightened power creep. Whether Flare of Denial is worth the price is another issue but you can reasonably expect it will be seeing alot of play. Strix Serenade on the other hand… you may not even see being played in a year or two except for budget reasons. It’s good but not great.

I still try to slot in my order of Thunder Junction - all fun and cool cards. I simply cant get myself to sort all my decks out and get into the eternal "101st card" struggle yet again and again and again and again.

@isidoreaerys8745

Ай бұрын

I have to keep a “Take outs” folder for every one of my arena brawl decks so I can keep track of all the cards I’ve switched out to try new ones.

This is why tribal are my preferred decks. I build for flavor and not power or efficiency.

The way I build decks is I allot card slots to different packages I want to accomplish. When a card comes out I like I must identify the package where it goes in and then cut a card from that package. What I found is when you build like this you rarely ever cut cards because most things are not cuttable for the new hotness.

I stopped directly after the Dr who stuff. Just kind of mentally checked out

I stopped buying sealed product about 2 years ago only singles now. I used to buy a box of each set and sometimes a collector box too, all are too expensive now a days. Almost $700 if you want to mh3. I have slowed down on buying singles too because of the fact that most of my commander decks are stacked with cards and finding slots is hard. I have to build new decks just to free up card slots from older decks.

@Lazydino59

Ай бұрын

Big agree. My new single buying policy is I have to know what swaps I’m making before I buy. Five years ago you could easily get 5x of a staple for cheap and it wasn’t a big deal, but now there are too many that I have great cards laying around that I thought about using but there’s too little deck space.

@ForgetfulPaladin

Ай бұрын

@@Lazydino59 great idea, I am on that plan too. Ialso try to buy when there is store credit bonus on TCGplayer and I am very patient when it comes to prices especially right after release I wait a month or two before buying. I am still catching up singles from the Ixalan and murders

I stopped approximately 2 years ago with updating my commander decks. I blinged out my 3 all time favorites. My friends stopped shortly later. We just play with what we have and its great. No more of the 'cold war' feeling in our playgroup. Its all fair matchups and therefore super fun

“Needing” to upgrade to a better version is a competitive mindset. Strictly playing a casual format with a competitive mindset is your problem. Branch out and you will feel the need to spike a casual format less. I am a very spikey player and I delved into commander to just let it be my casual outlet and I have never optimized any commander deck, the way I optimized my modern, pioneer and standard deck. This made my deck building desires be satiated by the formats available to me. If a new set comes out then I optimize my competitive decks for the competitive formats that I play. If I feel the need to build for fun then I tinker with my commander decks.

@technetin

14 күн бұрын

It's not

Demo you hit the nail right on the head. They had to devise a way to circumvent the obstacle of a singleton format driving profits. As far as Whisperer of the Wilds and Champion of Rhonas something key to consider is that the former is just a common, while the latter is rare. Champion of Rhonas is certainly mythic level powerful

@vittoriosavian9964

Ай бұрын

I think that he had good ideas, but apart from a few arguments, the rest were horrible. I think he used the wrong examples to explain the powercreep

I understand your point. It’s perfectly fine to have a commander that’s not optimised. I’ve been playing vindicate and wrath of god for decades and I’m doing fine. I’ll mostly include the cards I get through drafting and maybe purchase a few cheap singles, as I usually do.

@isidoreaerys8745

Ай бұрын

Wrath of god, doomskar, Day of judgment Are the best most efficient versatile board wipes. They are way better than Final Showdown. Final showdown fucking sucks. Never once have I had enough mana to cast that card when I needed it. Demo’s tripping about that card. Lmao.

there's a reason Bank of America made that report on how mtg is shooting themselves in the foot and printing too much. it's just way too much. I think I'm not gonna replace any cards in my current decks (other than one fun common I'm throwing into my Otharri deck), but a couple of the commanders did actually look fun to me, so I'm probably gonna build one or two (Azlask for a five color experience deck; Genku bc it's cute; Ajani for an Ajani tribal deck; and Rosheen bc I've been thinking of making an X deck for a while) but that's 4 new decks which is just ridiculous. I can't afford to make a single deck whenever each set comes out, let alone 4. I know it's one of the most common things to hear in this community, but the direction they're taking magic is just incredibly sad

The way I build de KS is I allowed cards to different packages I want to accomplish. When a card comes out I like I must identify the package where it goes in and then cut a card from that package. What I found is when you build like this you rarely ever cut cards because most things are not cuttable for the new hotness.

been there 5 years ago, before it get ridiculous with new crads =D

@malmasterson3890

Ай бұрын

Pre-Horizons. The before times...

Adding, upgrading and changing a deck is the thing I enjoy most about magic, probably more than actually playing it. If I don't update a deck anymore it's either hyper specific and there aren't new cards for it or I'm already mentally preparing to scrap it. Stagnation is not a solution for me. The day I get upgrade fatigue is the day I would quit magic. My condolences, this sounds like burnout to me.

@paull.9884

Ай бұрын

Agree

@nanoglitch6693

Ай бұрын

Yup. It's weird to act like you're compelled to upgrade *every* deck to ALL the newest tech every set. This isn't standard lmao. If you're actually playing casual then just getting a couple new toys every now and then is plenty and helps keep a deck from becoming stale imo.

@isidoreaerys8745

Ай бұрын

I too enjoy the building and searching and discovery process of Commander the most as well. However Demo is totally right that WotC is clearly trying to turn Commander into a rotating format using targeted powercreep, and this will actually limit creativity over time because you will be forced into situations where an “objectively better” option for your deck exists and just so happens to be the newest most expensive card WotC is hoping to make money off of.

@nwttp

Ай бұрын

Deckbuilding is my favorite part of the game. Adding and changing is cool, but buying 30 cards a set because theyre strickly better is not. A card costs 3cmc, then essentially the same card costs 2cmc, and that's fun for you? You run out and buy it? Sounds like you work for wizards, lmao.

Flare of cultivation is not a strict upgrade. You're either paying double green instead of 1, or you're losing a card in your hand. A strict upgrade would be Cultivate for 1G

I have quite a few decks and use a very simple set of rules for myself: 1. Only buy singles. 2. Only add a single copy of the card to one deck. Others can use alternatives that have similar effects. 3. Tribal synergy takes priority over anything else. Flavor is next with the same reasoning used and is more important then synergy or power. 4. Do not think of anything as a "staple". Just think of what is fun to use and try to advocate for the same mindset in your playgroup. This way I can enjoy more cards and have varied decks that do not feel copy-paste netdeck boredom. Still, I agree the product over-saturation and power creep is absurd, especially since around Kaladesh, but if you look at what Hasbro is doing, it does not surprise me at the slightest. They are driving the game into a mess that a set of 100-200 bans could probably not even bring close to fixing.

I have 32 commander decks, and my building rules are also singleton, meaning that apart from some bulk, all the decks combined only run 1 copy of a card. Makes new sets really easy, I never have to replace a ton of stuff and still get to enjoy it.

@crimsonleg4237

Ай бұрын

I have a similar restriction; I don't have duplicates of any card in any deck unless it has an alternate art, or a different border. My only exceptions are Sol Ring, Arcane Signet, and Command Tower. Other mana rocks and all other nonbasic lands are included in the restriction. So, if a card only has one art (doesn't matter how many printings in the same border), it goes in only one deck. That's it. I don't buy multiples of the same card with the same art with the same border.

@Z-S-H

27 күн бұрын

great restriction

@technetin

14 күн бұрын

This is explicitly why I don't proxy

Remove the concept of "staples" or "auto-includes" from your mind and stop buying multiple copies of things. Your decks will be a LOT more interesting, and most of your gripes go away.

@santhanamkumar862

Ай бұрын

Exactly...if it's casual commander who cares about full optimization

I had the EXACT same sentiment when I started seeing spoilers. I’ve been playing commander since before it was called commander and this set made me disgusted at the power creep.

Cube is the answer. Set cube, commander cube, modern cube, pauper cube. Cubes elude power creep. The reason to get the next best thing is to keep up with your opponents, no need in a cube. Perhaps you will desire to change things up but it doesn't have to happen to keep up with opponents.

Remember to proxy everyone, a printer and sheets of paper will always be a better investment

Side note - the flares aren't strict upgrades. Sacrificing a nontoken creature in any non-aristocrats deck is a serious cost. I don't usually have throw away creatures in my decks.

@fabienvirey4187

Ай бұрын

They are, you don't have to sacrifice of you pay the mana, now you have the choice ;)

@Nicolas0981

Ай бұрын

The blue and black ones are the strongest, black likes sacrificing and blue's is so powerful that even sacrificing your commander to counter a game-winning spell is worth.

The good thing about commander is that you play it with clearly communicated powerlevels. If you don't play in fully optimised pods, just keep the cards you like and don't care about the new busted cards.

In my opinion this is less an issue of strict upgrades and more an issue of legacy support. I wasn’t excited for the surveil lands because they are a “strict upgrade” to the scry lands, i was excited for them because I was running a surveil deck, with Dogged Detective and Enhanced Surveillance. It wasn’t until LotR Baldur’s gate in the form of Elminster that we actually had any payoffs for scrying anything, but in those decks the scry lands while not *strictly better* are *mechanically cohesive.* What I want is not a set pushing the envelope, but a set like futuresight but in reverse, where we rewind the clock and give a bunch of older card types or ideas new support

Thanks for Talking about this Demo, I am so fed up with the keep up culture with this nonsense. I am boycotting MH3 for this reason. I worry that MH3 will just kill the concept of eternal formats. It is almost deliberate

the sky is falling

This is the biggest problem with Hasbro releasing a new set every month. In a years time, the power creep turns into a power leap.

Welcome to the club. I haven’t purchased a card since LotR and I’ve also pretty much lost any desire to even play the game anymore. Power creep and burnout….

"So many auto includes" but you keep referencing cards that are not good

@alexanderficken9354

Ай бұрын

i was about to say, some of them are great, but many are buildarounds or draft chaff, like most of the cards he is talking about are 1 or 2 mana more than the cards he is replacing. More choices tend to be more powerful, yeah, but you are paying life or more mana to make them so

All this moaning and whining from you is getting kinda cringe

MTG is definitely at a crossroads. Since commander is so heavily being designed for, we get more and more generically good cards thrown at us as "auto-includes", so we're in a unique predicament of playing this game the way we want to play it VS playing optimally (not that this has never not been an option). Do you NEED the best card in every slot? If you do, wouldn't most decks be the same 30-40 cards with the rest as room for synergies/lands? Guess it's a bit of a pick your poison rut.

Yeah when mdfcs came out for the first time I gave them the side eye, I knew it wouldn't be a good change for the format. And I remember command zone saying in an episode that they now play like 6-7 mdfcs in every deck 😭

Why do you think the Necron precon is one of the most sought after commander precon? Bunch of black artifacts that slot into any black artifact deck. I still haven't been able to find that deck, and at a reasonable price.

Do all these land mdfcs make bounce lands more desirable? Using the land early is nice and bouncing it back to hand to use the effect later in the game is great.

With so many cards coming out, it is really hard to keep up. I am going to back to older sets and see what did I miss with all the hype.

Same for me. The Red line has been crossed for me with powercreeping COMMANDER Horizons III. Too many sets, too many Commander products (I play 97% Commander), way too much powercreep.

It sounds like you're having a healthy change in your perspective on how you're buying cards :) I've also found it helps to shake the mentality of "why wouldn't I run this" and "this is strictly better".

I’ve hit a similar point with my Thalisse deck. Each set comes with 5-10 cards that Thalisse will love to include or at least test, and the list is so tight that I don’t know what to cut. The only card that I ended up adding from MH3 was Angelic Aberration because it lets me mass upgrade my tokens, especially any tapped tokens, and still triggers my commander. But beyond that, cards like Warren Soultrader and Marionette Apprentice might be great, but I’m not sure if they’re upgrade enough to bother trying to find a slot for them.

Turning commander into a rotating format is such a good phrase that i havent heard before but it's actually a perfect way to describe what's happening.

I reached this point recently, with two kids, and not enough time to play, I stopped upgrading pre-existing decks. It just didn't make sense, your example of excise the imperfect is exactly the card I didn't buy thinking I wouldnt use it. Now I might as its a budget option. This is the unfortunate downside of a casual format being designed in a more competitive way.

Cultivate is okay, but I have noticed me taking it out of deck already that need to cast their general on turn 3... Flare of Cultivation is a Cultivate that you can cast on turn 1 and 2 so it's quite a bit better, I'm not sure if it replaces any of the 2 mana ramp, but I can definitely see it showing up in decks where I am using arboreal grazers effects, or decks that use access the grave more. In decks where I want Cultivate, I will just slot this in as a 3rd - 5th version (if you include Harrows). Not sure that it replaces Cultivate.

The thing that sucks is MH3 has some really cool card design on a few cards and im excited to see the energy stuff. Then there are these obviously ridiculous cards that a handful wouldve been cool to add at once but its so dense with the powercreep

flare of cultivation should cost GGG or 2GG, making it a trade off from actual cultivate, and having it either difficult to cast in 3 or more colored decks, or 4 mana

100% agree with you. The pricing killed me buying sealed product and was only doing the single thing. But your take is spot on and I might have to follow you.

The problem is that there is only so much design space, without going to half mana there isn't that much left for them to do, it's either print reprints, print books (which they're already doing) or print slightly better takes on older cards

Spot on with the analysis. Just like you, I got 4x copies of removal spells like [Infernal Grasp], [Bitter Triumph], [Lethal Scheme], etc. They're all sitting in my binder because I can neither tune nor play my decks fast enough before the next best thing comes out. This MH3 set I only bought immediate upgrades that I know I'd be using and not future-proofing all my decks.

It's fun to collect valuable things and all but me and many homies are balling on a budget. Proxies are 30 cents each and are almost the same level of quality. Real magic cards are fun to collect and are good for sanctioned events, but how many commander players are doing commander events and not just playing at the kitchen table?

Ironically, the more recent cards you buy, the less playable your collection becomes and that's something that a few people have noticed and I am pretty sure that there are groups out there who don't even play prEDH, yet they have set a certain set as a stop concerning the newest cards they can play. In my opinion, these people and those who play prEDH are playing with a bigger pool of cards than those who are always chasing over the latest cards. I think that an environment with cards up until Core 2019/Dominaria would be the best for those who don't want to limit themselves with the pool of prEDH, yet they also don't want anything to do with the recent crap.

Funny enough, my friends and I were having the same discussion about a day before you release your video. Before, i was excited to upgrade my decks, but now i don't even look at spoilers anymore, it requires too much time and money to keep my decks up-to-date. I continue to build new decks though, with the cards that are available at time of creation.

The way I handle choosing what to buy is I have a couple of decks that I keep optimised (within a reasonable budget). Then for all my other decks I only get cards if they look really fun/cool, or if the deck is lacking in a particular area and there's a synergistic piece that helps it there. An example of that last point is my Kestia auras deck. I like to keep it very on-theme and as a result it only has 3 cards in the deck that ramp. I plan to pick up a Nadu to help fill this gap because it synergises with the aura theme :)

You developed the attitude that I think we should all have. The way you were buying cards and your general attitude towards deck upgrading was wild to me. Autoincludes aren't a thing. It's a game, just make a deck you think is fun. Buying 6 copies of cards on release? Why? Do you want all of your decks to be homogenized? You pride yourself on making jank, let it be janky, you dont have to go get the crazy strong cards. You dont have to do anything, if you dont want to remove a card from your deck, dont. Not every deck needs to be min-maxxed to hell. We dont have to have any card. You going out and buying 6 copies of a card is exactly why they keep power creeping, because people go out and buy a bunch of copies of the same card.

what I usually do is when I buy the new cards it's only if they're much much better (i.e. if my version is a 5 mana budget card but there's a cheap 2 mana version) or if they fit the theme well. In my Karn Legacy Reforged deck I'm always looking to replace generic artifact cards with anything to do with Urza, Mishra or phyrexia if I can, otherwise I haven't upgraded it, or in my Baba lysaga deck I'd only bring in cards that make my deck more resilient or has multiple types

I feel the same way, many of the cards are auto includes, which doesn’t excite me personally. I usually focus on niche bulk cards that could fit into my decks. There are a lot of cards that are preordering at really high prices which, if in a standard release seem like they would be less (I know preordering is inflated) but needs to be done to prop up the high sealed product prices. I’m probably completely wrong about that but it all seems fluffed up. I didn’t like the theme of OTJ but had a big list of cards I ordered from it for a relatively small price. MH3 I can see myself picking up the odd card down the road but initially won’t be getting anything. I’m a lot more excited about Bloomburrow and it’s precons.

@likeloureed

Ай бұрын

I have a hard time buying cards that aren’t specifically interesting to me, for better or for worse and more often than not I use whatever ramp, draw, removal etc I have laying around and focus on picking up cards that interest me me (and often falls into those categories) and again not just strict upgrades.

Yeah, I'm not sure why you're talking about this... why, in any situation other than playing these decks for tournaments where you're risking prize pools, would you ever have to buy "direct upgrades?" Why would you buy them for every single deck they fit in? You've gotten *too* involved in your hobby, I'm not sure how else to put it. You can't still sit down and have fun without the biggest and bestest cards? That's a personal problem; not a MtG problem. Upgrade your decks every 3 years of something instead? Build decks for $40 and say "screw anything else." I love commander. I only play commander. You won't see me buying any of these "must-includes" because my deck simply already functions as I intended it to. Maybe someday I'll buy some of these cards or if they fall under $1 each, but damn man, are you even having fun anymore if all you're talking about is how strongly you feel that you *must* buy the better cards and *must* have your decks optimized?

you’re not alone, man. at this point, I’m intentionally *not* buying the new set and just sticking to what I’ve got until I’m power-crept out of my LGS 😂

Man I have felt this way for a while. I haven't bought anything or been excited about anything since Brothers War, and that was cause I'm a big Urza lore fan and thought was good they made a set covering that since they never did. But ya, I don't buy anything new anymore. I'd rather instead of getting a precon or a set, I'll just buy cool older foil cards and that's it. One of my favorites I've found recently is Aura Flux lol maybe a good candidate for a 10 cards vid.

As I have been buying sets this past year, I have been setting aside cards that are upgrades for my existing commander decks. When I have the time I will attempt to swap some things out. After a while, this pile has grown so much, and it has become so tiring to try to swap cards out. I don't want to have to do deck maintenance all the time. This is killing the fun for me. I guess I'm going to have to either be okay with just losing all the time, or just find a new game. But all the work I put into building some decks just only a year ago is proving to be useless. Part of the power creep is coming from pre-cons, so now these expensive and custom tailored decks I made are almost on par with these pre-cons, and it feels terrible.

I think a lot of people are getting tired, its spoiler season after spoiler season, I haven't played all the cards I got from OTJ and there are 3 more sets spoiled already. The power creep is ridiculous I can see the Hasbro executives trying to save their sinking ship with Magic, but they're just gonna take it with them all the way down...

One word: Proxy, you can get high quality prints for a quarter or less each. My entire friend group does. Power per deck is set by the group rather than each persons wallet. I have ten decks and have spent a few hundred dollars to build them with dozens of extra cards per deck I can tinker with.

on the one hand I definitely have a problem where I obsessively edit decks and it I know theres a limit with how much I can keep up with all the new cards. On the other hand I played an equip deck in yugioh before I started Magic so its gonna be a while before the novelty of getting actual direct upgrades wears off.