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@curtisnixon5313

5 жыл бұрын

@stefanmilo I love this video and the history of boats vid too. I feel that first human swam in Lake Turkana, then the rest of the African lakes. For the ocean rafts come first. Maybe even involuntary earth rafts which is how iguanas and tortoises got to the Galapagos Is. Human may have been caught on tree and land debris and floated out to sea in the case of Cyprus and inshore islands. Later would come constructed rafts of wood and reeds. Maybe aboriginal people rafted across to Australia. Then came sailing boats later. A history question for you: have any other cultures apart from Roman had gladiatorial fighting to the death, as entertainment for the masses?

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Thanks very much! That's a very interesting question. I know civilizations have used fighting as a way to settle legal questions but strictly for entertainment I'm not sure. Would make a great video though, i'll look into that!

@mgarate8036

3 жыл бұрын

Hey Stefan maybe tey were drugged and maybe they were killed so when the king was alive it insured servants loyalty in looking after kingy

@nicelydunwell5681

3 жыл бұрын

"I'm gonna skip church that day" :)

I feel like there is a really fine line between voluntary and forced sacrifice. It was deemed an honour for Aztecs and their neighbouring peoples to be ritually sacrificed and thus ensure the continuation of the universe- though this doesn't necessarily mean captives always wanted to give up their lives that way. Perhaps it could have been similar in the ancient near east, other places like ancient China, and even Viking boat burials. People sort of thinking they were doing the right thing, potentially even being talked into it, but not necessarily committed 100%, obviously, because who wants to die. But that's where the drink and drugs come in, to numb the victim and make them go along with it without causing a scene. It's all pretty grim, but so interesting. We're basically sheep at the end of the day, and if your world view says people have to die to ensure a smooth passage of a god king to the afterlife, or to stop the world from dying, then a lot of people would probably just go along with it.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

That's very true. I mean if you thought the world literally depended on it then you may be resigned to your fate. Still at the back of your mind you probably wished Dave had been picked.

@HistoryTime

5 жыл бұрын

Stefan Milo Absolutely. Dave-Pilazer-Ur-Eridu more like

@misanthropicservitorofmars2116

5 жыл бұрын

That’s one of my favorite fallout bunkers

@davidbriggs264

5 жыл бұрын

It has occurred to me that such sacrifices might not be as a way to honor the previous monarch, but as a way to clear out his harem so that the newest monarch can start with a clean slate. I've always believed that some of the sacrifices were volunteers whereas others were forced into it. Also, don't say that the victims were not drugged, they very well could have been, but being given a whole lot of liquor would not kill them, but it WOULD make them easier to control before the final death blow. And that method of death (a spike into the skull) would both be quicker and more sure than drinking a poisoned beverage.

@Jyromi

5 жыл бұрын

History Time na na na every mom would not want ro sacrifice their hildren.

It's possible that the ones that were struck in the head were those who refused to drink the poison. They could also have served as an example to all others that were hesitant about following their master in death

Liking and commenting because, Sumerians. Nice video mate.

I witnessed a crow funeral in my back yard a few years ago. Weres what happened. Between two 70 year old spruce trees lay a dead crow. A murder of crows arrived and purched in the branches of several adjacent elm trees. They did not make a sound. As I watched one crow flew down, landed next to the dead one, looked at it, approached it, stopped and looked again, than pulled on one of the dead bird's feathers. It then flew back up into a tree. They all purched there for awhile than all flew away in silence. If this was not a funeral then what was it? The thing that impressed me most was the silence. This is the only time I have ever seen crows being quite.

@dmcgee3

2 жыл бұрын

I believe elephants have also been observed where the whole troop will come to the dead one and not all at once but singles or a few at a time, stay for a bit then leave. Pretty much exactly what we do at a visitation

@ingerellingsen6785

Жыл бұрын

Apparently someone has theorized that crows will investigate the death of a crow to see if there’s anything they need to be weary of (e.g. poisonous food source). If that theory is correct you witnessed a murder investigation

@cutler2639

Жыл бұрын

I have seen this happen on multiple occasions on our ranch. It’s really amazing

@courtneyriley185

4 ай бұрын

😂 it was the crows trying to figure out what killed them... funeral means they bury the body.

@helenamcginty4920

3 ай бұрын

​@@ingerellingsen6785 wow. Didnt know they had chemistry labs. 😂

I'm gonna skip church that day.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

I mean, I skip it everyday, but especially the day they're picking volunteers for the pointy spike.

@Josh-ek9pw

2 жыл бұрын

That line killed me🤣🤣🤣🤣

@CrazeeFy

Жыл бұрын

Oh KnowingBetter, the guy that thinks Columbus was a nice guy 👍

Honestly, I'd rather find a dog than a pile of the remains of ancient sacrificial victims. But that's just me :D

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

I played it down it a little but it was genuinely cool. The dog was fully articulated and was buried in the Bronze Age to accompany his master. The master and his grave had been totally ploughed to bits but in 4000 years of farming a plough had never touched the pooch.

@labibbidabibbadum

5 жыл бұрын

@@StefanMilo Was the dog a willing participant? Any evidence of blunt-force trauma in the poochy cranial regions?

@davidec.4021

4 жыл бұрын

Stefan Milo where was it? 😍

@bobmantheawesome

3 жыл бұрын

@@davidec.4021 in the ground

Simon I love how you are so engaged with your viewers and respond so kindly when people ask questions! It’s wonderful to know people like you are out there

Beg to disagree, Stefan. Other animals do "attend funerals" for example elephants. As researchers improve methods of observing non-humans in the wild, more examples will be seen. Always enjoy your posts, bro.

@axolotl-guy9801

2 ай бұрын

Indeed

Just found your channel. Now starts the bingewatching.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Ha thanks man. I must say, my videos have improved a little.

It's amazing and often terrifying what people can do to each other, whether by force or through misleading beliefs. Thank you for your very informative materials.

really glad you popped up in my recs! i love the format here, it's like i'm just sitting in the woods with a chill dude having a chat about ancient history.

I can only imagine they were sedated before they got the spike, seeing the guy with the spike work his way closer to you, witnessing all the death, would most likely create a panic. Even if they were led into the pit, and killed one at a time, seeing all the bodies would also create panic, but would be easier to manage. However, occult indoctrination does have a powerful effect on ones ability to rationalize the events happening around them.

Dude these videos are great! Really glad I found your channel!

Loving your delivery and information. Thanks man

Been looking for more ancient history and archaeology material for ages, then your channel pops up. Thanks, algorithm! And thank you for the great content! 😁

@Stefan Milo Thank you so much for your wonderful channel, I have gained many hours of enlightening entertainment and thought-provoking content from it, I regularly rewatch ( re-listen to ) your content whilst commuting or when trying to fall asleep, hearing about the long continuity of human history gives me great serenity in these difficult times. Thank you and all of your supporters for all that you do. Stay safe and stay healthy, everyone.

Elephants mourn the death of members of their group

@adrasthe314

5 жыл бұрын

Why are we talking about elephants

@RoccosVideos

5 жыл бұрын

So do crows and dolphins.

@KeganTheTowel

5 жыл бұрын

@@adrasthe314 At the beginning of the video, "you won't find any other animals attending a funeral." It's not accurate.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

I don't think it's fair to compare the rituals humans do to the emotional response of animals. Of course they love their families and are sad when they die but they certainly don't have funerals.

@Ck-zk3we

5 жыл бұрын

@@StefanMilo Than you should qualify your statement by saying no other animal beahves exactly like Humans when a memeber dies. And you should research Elephants a bit, you might be suprised at what you find..

“What a jolly time to be a colonial overlord” I love you Stefan

Here’s an idea: what if sacrificial victims were plied to sleep/unconsciousness with some kind of substance such as that in the cauldron, then arranged in order, and then ritually killed with one quick blow to the head? So that they wouldn’t feel pain but would also never wake up? I know opium has been used for thousands of years in that particular region, although I’m not sure about the eta these skeletons are dated to… I wish we could study the rest of the skeletons to determine if there are any defensive injuries, that would really help sort some things

Side note, theres quite a few animals that will acknowledge the passing of others. Elephants, gorillas, whales, dolphins, etc. I've seen cats and dogs mourn the loss of their owner or other pets in the home. I had one cat who almost starved herself to death because she was mourning the loss of her human who was put into a nursing facility.

0:08 Elephants be like "Am I nothing to you?"

"I'm gonna skip church that day." Lol. Me too. It's hard to say if sacrifices were "willing". Motivations don't preserve as well as bones do. It's hard enough to find them in living specimens. Was the choice "be sacrificed, or go do whatever you want, follow your bliss" or was the choice "be sacrificed this way, or be executed in a more horrible way". Some choices are more free than others.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Definitely! Can't help but feel bad for them though. I was actually just reading about a First Dynasty tomb in Egypt with over 300 human sacrifices :/

"I'm gonna skip church that day." Omg, that's funny as hell.

Thanks for the video. I found the video compelling.

Interesting and worthwhile video.

Hey just want to say, I love your channel. Very informative, interesting and funny! Can you do more videos on ancient Mesopotamia? I'm very interested in how people lived back then, and why did they start to build large civilizations, from hunter/gather, farming communities? How did these changes take place in such a short period of time? How did they create such advanced technologies so quickly? Where is the connection between hunter/gather to farmer, to large scale cities like UR? Curious to know! Thanks!

Can't believe it took Operation Odysseus for me to find your channel! This is exactly my cup of tea. Subscribed!

Thanks, we just watched your video after seeing a previous video on the excavation. My husband said that perhaps some were not dead after drinking the poison, but unconscious; for that reason the overseer of the situation may have killed them to prevent the terror of waking up and realizing they were buried alive. Another thought- what if some had plans to escape and did not drink the poison.

I was right wycked video brah, honestly I’ve watched a lot of stuff on Ur but this is the first video where I’ve heard any mention of these practices

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Yeah neither had I, when I read about it I thought it would make a great video. To be fair the practice only lasted about 200 years, and that was about 200 years before Ur became an empire so probably most people just skip it. Thanks for watching!

@Thrashdragon

5 жыл бұрын

Stefan Milo that’s surprising since my experience with early archeological endeavors was exploiting the sensational, so I’m surprised that they didn’t run with that narrative as part of the common story of Ur.

I visited the Ziggurat of Ur while stationed in COB Adder. Got to walk the steps with the group. It was the highlight of my tour in Iraq. So surreal to be standing on top a building that an ancient civilization built.

When you said, "I don't know, I've never tried it before" in reference to the head wounds, it cracked me up.

Great video Stefan. I agree with comments below that the retainers were either volunteers or slaves who were raised to expect to die with their owner, so sort of a volunteer (at least someone with no concept of the option to refuse). I think they probably all had their narcotic drinks, and lay down in orderly rows so the copper spike guy could do his thing.

Maybe the drink was a sedative, followed by the spike thing? Also, do we know for sure that these people were put there at the same time? Is it possible they died naturally later, were bunged in a royal tomb to act as servants, the number gradually accumulating, and had some kind of rudimentary trepanation applied at that point, eg, to allow the spirit to escape? Pure guess, but it would fit.

oh stefan youre a defining feature of my species ~

Great video! This is really intriguing. I would definitely skip church, too. But, with the bodies lined up how they were described you'd think someone put them there. Unless they had to line up to go in the death pit. I mean... How terrifying?!

How happy he is to tell about human sacrifice😃

no wonder Father Abraham fled Ur of the Chaldees. He said to hell with this I'm heading for Haran Syria, maybe even buy some land in Beersheba, and of course there is always Egypt.

@annaabrams8738

5 жыл бұрын

Pretty sure this would have been about 3 to 4 centuries before abraham. Not claiming to be an expert though

After spending loads of time reaching Mesopotamia for my next video, i just stumbled upon yours this is great stuff keep it up!

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Thanks a lot man, that means a lot coming from you!

Fascinating stuff. Seems like there is evidence pointing both directions, but I feel like at least some, if not most/all of them were unwilling.

woops ! 0:41-0:43 “twenty-second and twenty first” *_centuries_* , not *millennia* “B.C.E.” That (2200-2100) would be third millenium BCE. It's a sad day when i notice a small error in a video of yours (diminished by the fact that on screen the right dates appear) but then again, it's the joy of going through most of your videos i haven't watched yet ! Great work !

When a great father dies, your grief is so great that being left behind is unbearable and following him into the afterlife is appealing.

It’s gotta suck when your ruler dies and the entire court goes with them.

Very interesting vid. Here’s my take. Poisoned and then axed in the head to release their spirit. Then placed in the grave. Just way too messy for a burial. Brain and blood everywhere. Slipping hazard.

@klatie256

2 жыл бұрын

This is very good and darkly funny point. I had the exact same idea, probably plied with some kind of poison or narcotic and then done on with a quick and relatively clean blow to the head, maybe with a ritual weapon. People should consider practical logistics of blood sacrifice when examining historical and archeological evidence more often!!

awesome

@gpfamily3279

5 жыл бұрын

video*

I wish to leave a comment: yeeeeeowwwww! Thanks. Great vid!

You make a good case for the hypothesis that all of those bodies were the result of either voluntary death and inhumation or that someone "volunteered" all of those people to die in some ritual death to accompany their master or mistress. But that's not the only way to look at it. Consider the following: Life 5 or 6 millennia ago was, as Hobbes pointed out, ""solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short..." Warfare was one of the main reasons for this condition. Men have always waged waged war on each other. Civilization, however, brought with it organized warfare on a larger scale than that which occurred between tribes. Cities fielded larger and larger armies to compete for power with other cities or regional hegemons. In particular, the city of Ur was conquered and reconquered a number of times by various peoples - i.e., the Akkadians, Sumerians, Gutians, & etc. It was also not uncommon for conquerors to eliminate the political base of the conquered by executing everyone in the households of the former rulers. It was also not unheard of for competitors to a throne to kill off their rivals. I am not suggesting that the large mass burials were, in fact, the results of conquest or political rivalry - because I don't know enough about the history surrounding the city of Ur at the relevant times to make that call. What I would like to know is: What evidence do we have in the physical and written archeological record to disprove the hypothesis that these mass graves resulted from political upheavals?

0:30 you made it sound like the three examples before "the Tyrant" were different, but in actually the Egyptians were doing massive human burial sacrifices just before the Pyramids, the Yayoi/Kofun is also believed and documented to do human burial sacrifices, and of course, the Nordics with their ships also did. Also, isn't the thumbnail a reference to one of the woman in one of the thumbs? I think I remember hearing a comment about a specific woman that left the impression she was "late" for the ceremony and didn't had the time to finished wearing all the clothes and accessories.

Is this Washington Park? (I live in Portland)

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

It's grand army of the republic cemetery. Glad to have a fellow portlander on board!

penn museum? is that at the college? i think that's where i attended the amarna exhibit in 2006

I volunteer Milo for the Honor. Milo is the perfect Candidate. Milo is 9/10 God already, so close.

At 4:20 you say that you haven't tried killing anyone witha spear yet. That was back in November, have you tried it since and if you did how was it and how did you avoid arrest?

@labibbidabibbadum

5 жыл бұрын

Asking for a friend...

Remember the beginning scene in the movie AVP? Just like this.

@jamesruddy9264

4 жыл бұрын

As I recall, the beginning scene was the woman climbing an ice cliff.

I agree

nice vid i think both : they were asked, and if they refused, they were forced

0:09 actually elephants do. They may lack the thumbs to grab shovels, but the do understand the concept of death, displayed by their grief. Dont underestimate our Earthing friends. Thanks for the insight in pinnacles of human madness.

Regarding the initial claim - there seems to be some sort of reciprocal ritualistic behaviour between certain wolf and raven populations that may hint to something kinda like funerals.

Peer pressure and custom are the usual drivers: the willing sacrificial victim is the theme behind several religions, some of which did use ritual human sacrifice.

I've been to Ur! I was stationed there in 2009 with the US Army. The Zigerot was about a mile from my living area. I went to explore the ruins twice and went to the home of Abraham!

My personal theory, before reading any other comments, is that they all took a drink of something either to pass out, or dull the pain then came the blow to the head. I can see this in both willing participant, and as being duped. Can just imagine those party invites!

What was the date of these tombs?

It seems likely to me that the very concept of 'volunteering' for anything may have been entirely inconceivable to the sacrificial victims. Being, probably, attendants to the queen may well have been the functional equivalent to being the tyres on a bus; chattel born and chattel bred, life was the way it was, one did what one was told or one died, brutally and immediately. I recently watched your brief treatment of Hawaiian culture and there you touched on the kapu version of compulsory servitude. It seems likely that the system of god kings was nearly ubiquitous throughout ancient history, and a corollary of that is that a major portion of society is utterly subjugated and that the means and methods of that subjugation were institutionalized and vividly on display every day just to keep the power structure firmly fixed in everybody's minds. Given the above, then, willing and unwilling were likely to be unknown concepts to the subjugated classes. Otoh, running away must have occasionally occurred to folks. This may help to explain the rapid and thorough diffusion of humans in prehistory; some of the subjugated run away, set up their own version, perpetuate Devine kingship and eventually run off another batch to rinse and repeat. Pretty soon you've got Moai on Easter Island. And, speaking of islands, if you choose to go any more deeply into the fascinating topic of pre-contact Hawaiian culture, I would be happy to give you some perspectives on that subject as transmitted to me by various local people during my 12 years on Kauai. There is far more to the story than is addressed in most popular or even academic literature.

@klatie256

2 жыл бұрын

That is fascinating that you were able to learn more about pre-contact Hawaiian culture. I’m not Stefan, but could I ask you a few things about it? I’ve been fascinated with ancient Polynesia for ages

@larrybuzbee7344

2 жыл бұрын

@@klatie256 Certainly, I would be happy to share. But the real essence is all about place. Every hill and valley and odd rock formation has a name and a story and sometimes more than one. To me, all particulars aside, that deep connection to stories that animate every detail of the landscape is something that most modern people only have the foggiest notion of, if any at all. Whatcha wanna know?

I think the cauldron was full of wine (possibly opium-laced?), and they got them all drunk until they passed out, then did the deed.

it would be interesting to know if they all died at the same time

My Opinion: "Eeeyyaaa-ew ew ewwww, agggg!" (Gives me the willies. )

@milicoA

4 жыл бұрын

A very educated opinion!

Perhaps they were drugged before being killed. This would explain the large basin and cup. Interesting. I would love to see a microscopic residue scraping of the basin. Thank you for the video.

Read the Rigveda and the soma ritual, giving the victim the pressed juice and then subsequently sacrificing it

That's it, when I die I am taking everyone with me.

I think most people just don't want to kick up a fuss :)

The simplest explanation is they were given a choice, drink the potion that puts you to sleep. You will get the spike either way. It is just better to be asleep when it's your turn.

Started to wonder If this dude would face a firing squad with that little smile

Legit lol that you did not find a live dog just hanging out around the dig site.

There are a number of critters who hold funerals. Crows, elephants.........

No residue analysis yet of the cups that possibly contained poison?

4:20 "I've never tried it BEFORE" [emphasis added]. Have you tried it now?

But seriously, another cool vid. Thing is, much of our view of the past is coloured by modern ideas. Whatever we think of these practices, the pre science ancients were less troubled by religious sacrifice. For a given value of "real", this was real to them. As to the volunteer or pressed victim question? Perhaps a little from column A, a little from column B. Everyone knows it's part if the deal with the gods but when it comes down to it a decent intoxicant is used to prevent undignified panic right at the end. Take European bog bodies as another example of this, perhaps. Also, some kinds of intoxication were seen as being in the presence of the gods, so maybe it was seen as an appropriate precursor to the pointy stabby part of the ceremony.

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I think you would struggle to go through something like that without a stiff drink and a something to smoke. I wonder how long in advance these people knew they would die, from the moment the accepted or were put into the job? From the moment they were born? They may have been totally resigned to their fate. I was just last night reading about the lindow man as it happens. I'm preparing a video on religion in the British Iron Age for some point in December.

@tectosagos9327

5 жыл бұрын

Stefan, if you can find a copy I'd urge you to read Dying For The Gods by prof Miranda Aldhouse-Green. The Prof is the go to UK expert in this field. Superb well-balanced research and interpretation. A must have!

@StefanMilo

5 жыл бұрын

I was just looking at that book actually. I'm going to pick some up if amazon has a sale on after black Friday.

@tectosagos9327

5 жыл бұрын

Nice! Can't recommend that book highly enough.

@tectosagos9327

5 жыл бұрын

Also, here's a historical oddity for you. Try finding a short book called The Extraordinary Journey of Pytheas the Greek, by Prof Sir Barry Cunliffe. It's the kind of thing I'm sure would interest you! It's broadly about Mediterranean trade with Britain. Sort of.

Elephants may “go to funerals”.

I love your videos, but one thing. Some other species do have funerals.

حضارة بلدي افتخر بها

Very well informed video and well presented, the constant smiling throughout whilst talking about a very horrific theme was a little off putting but nevertheless it was a good presentation.

Human sacrifice changed shape, it's not gone, it's just for economic reasons now instead of religious ones.

One benefit derived from mass burial of subjects is when those subjects were the principle underlings of a reign of kings is that it makes political change possible. The vestiges of the old regime are thusly removed completely allowing progress to occur. In that regard, perhaps it would benefit modern societies greatly to re-institute the practice. Of course then you might have the problem of nobody wants to be around when the king dies.

It puts on a new perspective on why Abraham (or God telling Abraham) had to leave Ur.

@blugaledoh2669

5 жыл бұрын

I don't know if he exist, but I will understand why some society will be abhorrent such practice.

Crows Have funerals They just don’t bury the dead!

Took me a minute to realize there were graves behind you lmao

I know the video is old but in Ahmad ibn Fadlan's account of a viking funeral there is a woman who seems to volunteer to be violently sacrificed.

I watched a video here in youtube elephants doing something with a dead elephant that equated to funeral or burial.

4:50 So a pick then.

It's entirely possible that they were complicit. I know that histamine can do some strange things to your mental state. I've had allergic reactions (less than life-threatening in severity) that caused me to feel that I was utterly doomed to death in the near future (with no reason for me to believe this beyond the power of histamine to induce powerful hallucinations and delusions). Histamine is so so so important to religious/spiritual life, and many people are simply more sensitive to various inflammatory triggers, which makes them more susceptible to this level of psychological allergic reaction from a long list of seemingly safe plants or other environmental triggers - tobacco, potato, many kinds of seeds, etc. Different cultures have different inflammatory triggers of course, but my point is there's a *lot* of inflammatory triggers that can cause this level of a reaction in someone who has an overpowered innate immune system

Here’s my theory. The people drank poison willingly and, just to be sure, after they passed out they were given the coup de grace with the pick. Very similar to what I believe happened to the excavated skulls of the battle of Towton (substitute mortal battle wounds for poison). 👍

This very same thing happened in Jonestown, Guyanna back in the 70's. An old chap named Reverend Jim Jones forced over 800 followers to drink Kool-aid laced with cyanide and a sedative, and they all fell down, to accompany mister Jones to the afterlife.

So, how did the original excavator miss those spike holes in the skulls he preserved in wax?

It was probably similar to the Rus viking human sacrifice described by an Arab traveler. The sacrificial victim was sort of coerced to "volunteer", drugged, and then killed with a weapon. Poison was pretty messy back then (your stomach would inflate, you'd vomit etc) so it was probably easier to drug them or get them drunk and then kill them. The "volunteering" was important, because you want servant spirits in the afterlife, not vindictive ghosts.

I just wonder if Puabi is the same as body 61

If they were warriors they might prefer death by weapon over poison. A warrior's death can effect his afterlife.

Could be that their families bought access to the palace with this offering. There’s the case of the walled in old man in an Indian palace which, if I remember correctly, happened in recorded history.

Thank you from Mesopotamia🌺🌼🌺🧡

Elephants sort of have funerals. They have something going on, if not actual funerals. Check it out.

He who is valiant and pure of spirit may find the Holy Grail in the castle of Uuuuurrr...

My hypothesis: They all drank poison voluntarily and the spike was used to quickly finish off people who did not succumb quickly enough.