My first experiences with welding were taking a night class in mechanic school, 2-3 hours twice a week. A few weeks in, I felt like I was making progress. I dont remember what process I was using, either stick or gas, but i do remember it was a one sided lap joint, because it was a joint that could be bent 180 degrees. I remember this, because the instructor came over and looked at my weld. "That wont hold up," he said. My gut told me it wasnt bad. "I think it will." He didnt like that, took it over to the vice, and with a 5lb hammer, bent the weld as far as it would go, 180 degrees. Sad it didnt fail, he kept pounding on it anyway, until the vice jaws broke off. One of the full time students turned to me and said, "and he's the one who welded the vice." 😂 1. Ugly welds can be strong. 2. Career welders are very insecure and obsessively put everyone down.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing your story and thoughts. Sounds like you did a solid job on welding that 😀. I am not sure where the insecurity comes from with a lot of instructors, and welders too. It’s hard to teach a lot of people with welding, because they believe they know the right way, or believe the way they were taught is the only way to do something. On something so complex as welding, things are rarely cut and dry. That’s why I encourage people to test their own welds often, and research information from multiple sources. There is so much hearsay out there it’s hard to know what’s accurate and what’s not. Hands on testing is worth 20 opinions on what to do. What you welded was the testing that showed you were on the right path and that the opinions were wrong lol.

@ZaHandle

28 күн бұрын

Look like you’re ready to take on a marine contract

@taiwanluthiers

25 күн бұрын

Basically you just need full penetration, and that's what counts. Sometimes a good looking weld doesn't have penetration and those will fail. Better to have a weld with full penetration that looks a bit oxidized (on stainless) than a good looking weld that has no penetration. If it needs to be free of oxidation because of sanitary reason, just run it with electropolishing brush and you're done (you know the phosphoric acid solution ones).

@taiwanluthiers

25 күн бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg How do you improve penetration on MIG weld? It seems like a lot of MIG welds don't seem to penetrate that well, is that the point?

@jvogler_art4708

21 күн бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgregwelding is like weight lifting, it’s hard to get actual science, you instead get bro science because it’s a masculine dominated field where people think their social status actually determines reality and science. Glad to see people actually running tests and experiments to determine actual reality.

This video took me down the memory lane to when I was about ten years old and my dear late father taught me how to weld. First he let me practice on scrap steel that was not going to be used for anything, and at regular intervals he observed me while I was welding, gave me instructions. Sometimes he would grind down my welds, inspect them and give me both criticism and praise. Finally, I was allowed to weld "for real". He was smart though, and the first job he let me weld on was welding wear plates on the chute and the vibration feeder on a crushing plant with no structural load. Later he let me weld on excavators, dump trucks etc., but never on critical parts such as e.g. the boom of an excavator. He didn't say this at the time and this is something we talked about many years later, but at the time it gave me the feeling of being a "real welder" and sense of accomplishment. When I was 15, I started at the trade school and were about to learn how to weld the teacher told me that he had never had a student who could weld so well, by a good margin. In hindsight I must admit that the competition wasn't very tough, but at the time I was still incredibly proud. I went on and got a certificate as a machinist. For the past 25 years, I have worked as a software developer, a profession I enjoy very much. However, I quite often miss the handiwork and the tangibility of making physical products from metal. Especially when I watch videos like this. Thanks!

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Thanks for the reply and sharing your stories. It’s amazing what a good guiding hand can do to help someone out. Even though you never wound up being a welder, you still have awesome memories of doing it with your father, and those are the awesome memories to hold onto.

@Hnkka

Ай бұрын

During my time at school, my teacher was amazed by my proficiency in TIG and stick welding. He expressed astonishment at the quality of the beads I produced, remarking that he had never seen such clean workmanship among his students. As a result, he recommended me for vocational metalwork and machinery classes, where I had the opportunity to undergo welding tests and receive expert instruction. Today, I am a certified plumber with Class B/C certification in TIG and stick welding. According to my teacher, I am the first student in years to show such keen interest in pursuing this education and to have received this opportunity for free beacause in building maintenance technology school tehy dont usually do stuff like that.

@palikariena7292

26 күн бұрын

Great story. This is more important than most people think. I had a very similar upbringing, my father was a general contractor and told me the trade from when I was nine-year-old. I’m a doctor now, but I do miss the hands-on outdoor work as my job now is just cognitive.

@TheObeyMayhem

20 күн бұрын

Hey, it's nice to see other peoples dad's aren't as worthless as mine. Mine knows everything there is to know about a lot of different jobs and taught me none of it. he's just a shitty person to be around and has no patience for anyone other than himself. Being around him is just non stop verbal abuse, nothing I did or taught myself to impress him was good enough. Every choice I made was overshadowed with "why didn't you do this" regardless of what it was. I joined the Marines, he said I should have joined the air force, I engine and driveline swapped a car by myself in a month, wasn't good enough. This asshole blamed me for not being old enough to spend time with, mom divorced him and he never even made an attempt to stay in contact, he had my number. It took me two years to even call him and he has the audacity to judge me for not having a career started at 29 years old because nothing I do is good enough. Yea, I'm glad everyone else had a good father. Asshole literally sets me up for failure and judges me for being a failure. Go fucking figure.

This test showed that even very bad console welds can be good for some cases. Thank you, I will continue to weld like I used to before. Cheers.

@alexvids9232

2 ай бұрын

Yup. Proves crap works for everyday items like bbq pits etc.

@stuppittyhed

2 ай бұрын

@@alexvids9232 it doesnt at all

Yea good video. I’m a total newb and if I laid any of those welds I would think I’m killing it lol. Glad to know I’m not even up to terrible yet. However…..I have not just yet started marketing my backwoods car lift using my welds so I think I’m safe

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

The cap passes on those poor roots weren’t too bad all things considered, they were actually far better than I expected they would be. I probably was a bit unfair calling them trash, the cap passes weren’t really that bad, but the whole thing was trash because of that root 😅. Don’t you worry, if you keep up with practicing you will be in good shape before you know it. Like learning to write, it takes time and hard work to get it dialed in. You can do it 😀

@kaasmeester5903

3 ай бұрын

Yeah except #2 and #3, I'd be happy with these especially the first one. For me, the hard part is recognizing exactly what I am doing wrong. Over amp, under amp, moving too fast, too thin or too thick wire, etc? At least most of the stuff I have welded hasn't come apart yet... Not quite ready yet for that career change.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

What you describe is one of the hardest things to figure out with welding. When you stare at a weld you need to figure out what are all the defects, and what to do to get rid of them on the next weld. It really comes down to mastering the simple. You need to run a perfectly straight bead that is equal in height, width, and is consistent. It probably sounds ridiculous (and nobody teaches it) but consistency is the most important thing. If you travel the same speed start to finish, and that speed happens to be too fast (you see undercut, narrow welds, or little metal put down), you simply run 5-10% slower next bead. Only when you move consistently can you determine what the problem is. If your whole bead looks identical but it’s laying on the plate like a bead of caulk, you know you need more “heat”. The whole bead is consistently excessively wide, with melted holes through the plate, you know you need to reduce the heat input or move faster. If the whole weld has every weld defect you can imagine it’s impossible to know for sure what’s wrong, lack consistency is the main issue. So the number one thing is focus on making 2-3 welds in a row look identical to one another and from start to finish. When you can do that tweaking settings can be done to dial things in

@slowb4lls1

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg awesome Greg thanks a lot. Actually since I posted my last thing it’s been like -247 degrees outside here in NC so I’ve been stuck in my garage tinkering on some stuff and somehow randomly I hit a point where I’m able to actually be somewhat consistent in laying a bead now actually, I dunno how or what I did that made it like to come to me but I feel like I’m like 50% further along learning then I felt last week, and this is great info also so thanks. Yea I’ve found that running the machine like a tad over halfway on the heat/ voltage does make things go smoother without being a slagfest and poor looking but I see it’s a balance too between not turning it into a plasma cutter, but on the thicker material in which I’m mainly practicing on now, it tends to like to run a little hotter and I remember you saying in some video that you want almost the metal glowing just as you finish the pass or close to it but not the whole bar glowing and that’s kind of help me dial in what voltage to use so that I’m laying more consistent beads

@slowb4lls1

3 ай бұрын

Also I would like to note 📝 for anyone else who’s learning or just getting started that the harbour freight Vulcan Equiptment might be decent, however, their flux core wire might be the worst possible investment you can make and def plan to put down more slag pelllets and set aside the time to spend the day grinding that off cause there’s gonna be more than the actual beads of metal you put down lol. Dear lord it’s amazing I can easily lay down a pretty half decent weld using the Lincoln wire from either Lowe’s or depot and have like ten little spots of slag to slap off and it looks great. I can use the same exact Vulcan brand wide and it looks like I used a salt shaker 🧂 full of hot slag and dumped it all around where I’m welding, workbench, what your welding, all over, and you gotta the fight to get all that cleaned 🧼 off it’s nightmare so just a heads up

23:01 This is very true. I build vibrating screens and feeders for the aggregate and mining industry. While most machines are built in such a way to reduce vibrations as much as possible, our machines are specifically designed to vibrate like crazy. Because of this, its very important that our welds are very strong. We have very high quality standards. So much so that if something happens and you have to stop a weld halfway through, you have to grind it out and restart, because we don't want cold spots from the stops/starts in the middle of a weld. If we get any porosity, we grind the weld out, no questions asked. One of the most important pieces we make are these bridges for exciter mechs. I'm one of only 4 guys there (out of 250 or so) that know how and are trusted enough to weld on these things. We don't build them very often, but when we do, they make a lot of money. Theyre usually either 10ft, 12ft, or 14ft wide, and its welded solid, with every weld using .052 wire, and we have to weld it in the 1F position. All of those 10-14ft welds, they have to be solid, and since we have braces welded inside there, that means we have to use 2 people to do it. So, there are these holes on either side, and we each get inside one of them. Then, one of us starts the weld and welds it to about the halfway point. Then, in the middle, you hand off the welder to the other guy, while still welding. It takes some practice, but it allows us to make all of those welds completely solid, with no cold spots. Those exciter mechs then get x-rayed and heat treated to relax the tension that builds up from all the heat that goes into it. Theyre hard, but fun to weld. I might post a video of one of them running on here. Theyre crazy to watch. Each mech has these 2 counterweights on either side that each weigh several hundred pounds, and they spin at hundreds of rpm. I was talking to one of the engineers and he said that those mechs can put out over 100 tons of force. When our asymetrical shafts that go in many of our more typical screens and feeders usually put out around 20 or 30. And many of the feeders those go on get two of them! The screen itself is a monster too. Most of the screens have these sashs that are composed of tubes that are like 2 or 3 inches by 8 to 10 inches, and 3/8" or 1/2" thick. The tubes in this fcker were 12" x 18" with 1" thick sidewalls. Once we're done welding that bridge and after it gets x-rayed and heat treated, they mill off about 1/2" of material from the surfaces where its going to bolt on to the screen, and where the mechs bolt on to it. This is because its very important for the services to be extremely flat, so that loads are transferred evenly, and because the bolts need to be able to sit perfectly flat against it. If the nuts and bolts arent flat, there's more pressure being localized to where its making contact, and it literally snaps the bolts. These are 1" grade 8 bolts too. The last one we made was just finished at the beginning of the year and when they got it back from the machining/milling process and were testing it, it was snapping bolts. They were able to get it dialed in and fixed though. That particular mech/screen is going to be used for gold mining, so its going to make a lot of money, which will help with the $500-$600k price tag.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

26 күн бұрын

Thanks for sharing that, sounds like some big cool stuff you get to make. Zero room for poor welds too. Clearly that requires skill, absolutely consistent prep/setup, consistent welding, and inspection/defect repair. What you wrote is interesting because just last night a guy contacted me to repair an aluminum dump truck floor where a vibrator attached to shake material out. It broke the floor plate in numerous places, was repaired (poorly) and broke in the same (and new) places. I declined to do the job because it would take days to cut out/clean up all the bad material, weld in clean material, and reengineer how the vibrator mounts. My thought was to switch to a thicker aluminum plate that was bolted and epoxied to the floor, because the aluminum welds cause a loss of heat treatment in the weld area. I am not sure if it would be possible to not have cracks not form on aluminum weld HAZ with a big vibrator on it. Getting 100% solid welds on 3/16th to 3/8th thick aluminum it was made out of when it’s beat to hell, filthy, and previously repaired is asking a lot. More than I wanted to sign my name on, especially because a lifting ram mount for the bed was close to the cracked plates. Everything you shared gave me a lot of things to think of if I were to tackle something like that in the future. Obviously what you’re doing is high dollar extreme use, but the attention to details you have will only benefit lesser builds as well 👍

@undeadarmy19

26 күн бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg I'm glad you like my comment. I know sometimes people have an issue with the length of my comments. Sometimes I have a lot to say, and I don't mind reading longer comments. I know social media has done a lot to shorten people's attention spans, while also making it to where people don't want to read very much either. Anywho. Yeah those dump body vibrators can be a pain in the butt. Like I was saying before, when engineers are designing almost any machine, they're trying their best to prevent or minimize vibrations. Its pretty obvious why they do this, not only for comfort in something like a vehicle, but also because vibrations introduce a lot of unnecessary force into the material, which weakens it and can easily break it. Was this vibrator a part of the truck from the factory? Or was it a 3rd-party install done later? The funny thing is, my first real welding job was for a company called Novae. They make Sure-Trac trailers. I actually worked in the factory where they made their dump trailers. So, I have a few years of experience building dump trailers lol. If it were me, I'd probably build some sort of frame/bracket that you can weld into the upper underside of the trailer bed, making sure to move around a lot to avoid putting too much heat into any area. Then you could attack the vibrator to that and it should work really well. There s should be some a couple of support pieces running the length of the under-side of the bed, along with some crossmembers running perpendicular to every so many inches. This should create a bunch of empty square/rectangular sections , and you can use one of the middle ones towards the top ot the trailer to mount a frame in there. That frame would create a lot of additional support, and it would allow the force from the vibrator to be spread out over more welds/material, which should reduce any localized stress points. I'm sure you've probably already thought of most of that anyways. I can def understand not wanting to take on a bigger project like that. What was the make/model of the truck if you don't mind me asking? Was it a single ram unit lifting from the center? Or a dual ram unit? There are also scissor lift units and telescopic lifting units too, although I don't think think the telescopic ones are as stable as the dual ram or scissor units are. I only just learned how to build the bridge for those exciter mechs within the past 6 months. One of the other guys left and I was called up. I had a sitdown with the head of quality control and my supervisor and they had to go over the importance of taking my time and making sure that each weld was done right. The department that I work in is called "EMF", which stands for "electro-mechanical feeder". Since these units are a lot smaller than most of the screens and feeders the company does, one person will typically build and assemble the whole unit themselves. Depending on the type of EMF and the size, that can take anywhere between a week (5 full work days), and almost 2 weeks (9 or 10 full work days). Theyre more of a specialized unit though, so we have times where we don't have any to build, which turns our area into a sort of catch-all department. Its kind of cool because we get to build a lot of different stuff that way. Anyways, these EMFs are the only machines that are welded solid, aside from the bridges for the exciter mechs. One thing I learned when I first got to that department was the importance of weld planning. Like I was saying before, they don't want you to start a weld, stop halfway, then restart again. This creates a cold spot in the weld. You also have a cold spot at the beginning of each weld. Especially when you're welding something solid, you're inevitably going to run into points where you have to start a weld on top of the end of another weld. The good thing is, we don't just have welds going one way on a single plane though, so you can do that, then run one of the perpendicular welds into it. For example, say you have a sheet of steel and youre welding 4 flats to it in the shape of a square. You would do the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd welds along the long side of the flat, welding it to the sheet, then the 4th one would have to start where the 1st one ended. But, then you run a weld where the 2 flats meet perpendicular into that spot. These EMFs have a motor with 2 counterweights on either side that bolts into a "shaker drive frame", which is essentially just a box with and open top and a slightly U-shaped front to allow access to the motor. One of the important things here is that the motor needs to be as rigidly attached to that frame as possible. If its loose at all, or if it can become loose anywhere, the vibrations will exploit that spot and make it much worse. Because of this, we use 1 1/4" bolts, and they're torqued to 1000 ft/lb. Each motor is either 3, 5 or 8 HP, and gets either 4 or 6 bolts. That shaker drive frame is then attached to the feeder via these rods we called "compression rods", and a bunch of very large springs. The springs help to dampen the vibrations and make it to where the vibrations are transferred much more smoothly. The back of the shaker drive frame is where its attached, and that plate is called the spring plate. There are 4-8 holes drilled in it where 4-8 springs are going to sit against it. Each hole is for a bolt that goes through it and into one of those compression rods. The compressions rods are this thick rods that have a threaded hole on either end. Each of the holes on the spring plate on that shaker drive has a small piece of pipe welded to it which serves as a guide for the compression rods, and a larger diameter pip[e which serves as a guide and retainer for a spring. The springs them slide over the compression rods, then you set the EMF frame on top of those springs. The EMF frame has its own spring plate with retention cups for the springs bolted to each spot with 4 - 3/4" bolts. About half of the compression rod protrudes through the EMF, and this is where we put another set of springs, followed by a spring retention cup cap. Then, we put a bolt through the center of those caps, which threads into the other end of the compression rods. So, once youre done, a bunch of springs sandwiched in there between the shaker drive frame's spring plate, the spring plate on the EMF frame, and the retention cup end caps. Those springs are held under tension, but those springs are what handles the force transfer between the motor/shaker drive frame, and the EMF frame itself. I should def upload some of this stuff so you can see what I'm talking about. it makes it a lot easier to understand when you can see it. I'll see about linking to one of my social media pages or something and you can see them there.

You repeated the things I learned in the welding class in the 1980s. The failure test demonstration was good, which was not demonstrated in class. I now have a better understanding of root penetration when the instructor talked about the subject. I'm still an infrequent, novice welder. I've gained a lot of insight from watching your video. Thank you.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Glad it helped you 😀. It’s a lot easier to see hands on demonstration testing the actual strength of poor welds, than reading about it. I will be honest, the terrible welds proved to be stronger than expected, but nowhere near as strong as a clean weld.

@wilhelmschmidt7240

Ай бұрын

Where I went to school I was lucky to have them do all the testing with us so we could see how it went. We would chop our welds into a strip, check the porosity and bend them until they broke. We graduated fully ready for AWS certification, but it wasn't just a welding class, it was a 4 year trade school welding every day.

I'd love to see what a clean three weld pass,, as well as a three weld pass with no shielding gas would endure on that first test.

As a weld QA tech doing CPE on hundreds of welds a week potentially and thousands of destructive tests a week and being a welder myself I can say this is pretty consistent with what I see.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

That is a ton of testing. Do you find that people try to hide their screw ups? I know years ago when I was in welding school people would always take welding test plate to the teacher to break, knowing they had a some serious defects they welded over. The instructor would break it in some manner, show the flaw, and say “try again” lol.

@765outdoors

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg yes it’s a problem. It’s a write up if we see it because of how serious it is. Welds with porosity tend to break straight down the middle because no penetration occurs in the root. And they are usually very brittle welds. I always explained it to people like a KIT-KAT vs a pay day.

This video proves that as long as you clean your metal and run your C25, MIG is essentially hot Glue for steel.

This is very useful for some of us who don't get to weld nearly as much as we would like.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

26 күн бұрын

Obviously the more you weld the better you are, but sometimes you need to fix something without the skill to do it. In such cases it’s important to do everything you can to make the probability of success high, like cleaning the material well, doing a few practice pieces, and having patience if things don’t go well. Also, as the old saying goes: do your best, grind the rest lol.

Thanks Greg I'm always learning from your videos!

I’d like to see a cross section of each weld by cutting maybe a quarter inch off each sample. This could help explain the failure. To keep the tests consistent with previous tests with your testing equipment you would need to adjust the samples so that the remaining width is the same as your current sample set. Really enjoyed watching this.

I bought a mig welder 23 years ago... read the manual and went to work practicing... basically got what you have there at first 😃 Time and testing got me pretty well adjusted. Don't want to grind if you can help it, but in some cases it has to be done...

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Yep, poor welds are part of life, it’s what you do with them that matters. I really wish I had some of my first welds because it would be hilarious to show them. I never had a lot of porosity issues, more like “nothing fused and it fell apart” problems 😅. It’s not where you start but where you finish 😀

Thank you for the video. It was great to watch. always love the book and real world learning!

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

This video was definitely surprising, the single pass weld with no shielding gas was actually stronger than I thought. I wish everyone could feel how brittle it was, it literally felt like breaking pasta lol. Not confidence inspiring at all.

The torque at the plate depends on the angle of the breaker bar. In case the breaker bar is in line with the "subscribe iron" it is ("subscribe irons length from the welded test object to the square drive" + "length from square drive to the hand") times the force from the hand. This force is "displayed torque" divided by "length from square drive to the hand". So it matters at which position you put your hand on the breaker bar. Also it matters how you pull on the bar. If you pull perpendicular on the bar then you can calculate the torque at the weld like that. In case the breaker bar is at an angle but you can manage to pull perpendicular to the breaker bar and you can determine the position on the breaker bar where you apply the force then the torque at the weld(center of plate) is like this: torque= ("vertical distance from the weld to the subscribe irons center-line that also is on the same level as the square drive" * sin(the angle) + "horizontal length of subscribe iron, center of welded plate to square drive" * cos(the angle) + "length of breaker bar, square drive to hand") * "hand force" and the hand force is like before "displayed torque" divided by "length from square drive to the hand" The angle is in reference to the horizontal subscribe iron. If I made mistakes please correct me somebody.

@omaristephens2143

Ай бұрын

Yeah, this is correct. The easy demonstration is that if you have the breaker bar pointing 90° downward and hang a few hundred pounds from it, the torque meter will show 0, but the test piece will still bend

@periodictable118

28 күн бұрын

Yes! Never forget to consider Combined Loading!

An eye-opener! I remember my very first MIG-welds looked quite similar to these, but to be honest, I used shielding gas😂. None of these welds survived the first contact to reality. That made my overthinking my actions and to get into training MIG-welding. But for a long period of time I had the feeling that my best welds are the ones that are bolted. 😅 If I now produce welds that do not fit my expectations I grind them out (or even gauge them with plasma) and reweld them. Over times i got more and more aware how dangerous shitty welds can be for us homegamers, too. When a weld on a homebrew shelf breaks it is usually no big deal. But when repairing or building heavier equipment I tend to be very picky with my welds. Sending something like a mini excavator bucket Flying due to a shitty snapping weld is absolutely no joke.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

The hardest part of fixing screw ups is the bad weld removal. Especially since it always happens in the hardest to fix area of what you’re welding lol.

@sebastianleicht

3 ай бұрын

😂 That's where my colourful language comes from. But plasma and a needle scaler really helps. It reaches in where an angle grinder can't and removes fast where a die grinder takes forever.

@danielmartin531

20 күн бұрын

​@@sebastianleicht a good die grinder and aggressive bit removes weld fast af from my experience. I just hate getting covered in the forbidden glitter.

Great video greg.

very interesting thanks for sharing.

Thank you for creating this video! Very informative at an entry level. I shared/featured it on my small Budget DIY discord server. In the end of the video, you mentioned what homegamers/DIY people tend to require from their welds. I could be considered a homegamer/DIY person. But I don't have a fancy mig welder with gas. I use a very cheap flux-core mig welder. It doesn't even have a name, it just says "130" on it. 1 freespin knob to maybe adjust wire speed (probably broken from the factory) and 2 switches to adjust the power. My welds ALWAYS have plenty buckshot. Which is just mandatory, because of welding with flux-core wire. Very often, my welds also look just poopy. But it's a very different kind of poopy. I can't re-create your "terrible" welds, because gas is always included. I will also only weld metals up to 3 mm thick, which is on occasion somewhat structural. (bicycle trailer, which once carried up to 250 kg, used it for many dozens of km like this) I do get all the penetration in my welds, and I'm currently at an expert lvl for stitching holes back up. I wonder if you could do a follow up video with a flux-core welder with basic settings, and horrible looking welds. Because when I do destructive testing, I tend to break/snap the base metals, not the welds. Even if the welds look REALLY ugly.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

So flux core wire has a lot of interesting properties/strengths/weaknesses. It’s very common for cheap machines to weld on AC output (which the wire is designed to weld on DC) which means a ton of spatter is guaranteed. It’s also very common for the welders to have the wrong polarity, flux core wire runs DCEN instead of typical DCEP of gas shielded MiG. Flux core is looked upon as a poor cheap process but it’s fully capable of making quality/strong welds, but it takes a decent machine, a quality wire, and a person who is skilled. The main limitations of the flux core process is internal weld porosity issues, weld brittleness, and other weird restrictions (like number of passes limitations and vibration/impact force problems). At the home gamer level flux core wire has great penetration and strong welds on steel from auto body thick to about 1/4in. When you go thicker than 1/4 steel the .035 flux core tends to have welds full of internal porosity. To get around this you must run .045 or bigger wire, which most home gamer machines can’t run (no drive rolls or liners available). From a raw strength perspective flux core has excellent penetration however short arc mig will survive a fillet weld bend test away from the face far better. The solution to flux core wires issues comes in the way of dual shield (gas shielded flux core). That wire has no issues with weld porosity, or strength. However once again .035 dual shield tends to have poor performance over .045. So in a nutshell any steel over 1/4in (6.4mm) thick is beyond a conventional smaller flux core welders ability to make strong welds on. Luckily most of what people weld is far thinner so flux core offers good performance in those cases. I will be going back into some Dual shield/flux core comparison videos with my new esab welder soon.

@Jahee-Official

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thank you for your long reply! And congrats for having this video blown up a bit. (it somehow ended up on my homepage, while I usually don't watch welding related YT vids)

There is welding, and there is sticking things together. If you're not hot enough to melt the base metal, there is no coalescence. If there is no coalescence, by definition, you're not welding. Bending a fillet weld towards the weld is probably not typical. They're just not as strong in that direction. When experiencing force in that direction, weld the other side, weld both sides, or bevel your plate. Some defects may be acceptable depending on the application and the amount of weld. A cold start, one porosity, etc may be perfectly acceptable in a decorative application. They'll probably get really sad if it's on a pipeline.

Long story short, if you weld everything with that 6010 Hippy rod in your hand, you can avoid all those problems in the first place. That's the go-to rod when you just gotta turn and burn (pun intended). I'll even choose that over the grey 5p+ when Im capping out a downhill pipe weld.

As now recent retired ME, I called out for visual on significant load path items (unless well over SFy>3 & SFult>5, on some occasions). Dye P was mostly reserved for containment, but sometimes might be called out along with visual if it really mattered. Other NDE (mag particle, x-ray, ...) are more rarely used, mostly for small capsules with porosity limited to a suprisingly high 50mil max (largely due to ability to discriminate). Part of the reason for reliance on V and P inspection is that they are quite/more practical for the majority of welds. Also, visual involves trained inspector's check of prep, settings, welder qual, MTR & filler before the job, as well as review of the finished piece. Note: Most of our work is related to nuclear with higher SF's, predominantly GTAW, a lot of austenitic SST (for operational HNO3 cleanup) and less piece-rate cost concern.....so others in industry may be different. Thanks for the informative video. At work, we probably don't do enough destructive tests. As a suggestion, an interesting follow-on might be weld-joining effects on aluminum-alloy stock, both plate(6061-T6) and extruded tube (typical 6063-T5). I've caught calcs and harped on young bucks to watch out on weld anneal. 6061-T6 can reduce at puddle & HAZ to about 6061-T0 annealed strength, and I've often reverted to old-fashion-looking bolted joints to avoid it. However, I'm amazed how often I see assumption of the -T6 temper despite weld (example: take a look at an aluminum utility trailer).

@makingmistakeswithgreg

17 күн бұрын

Aluminum is one of those metals that it really pays to know a lot about it in general, far beyond just how to weld it. I actually have a short video coming out soon dealing with an aluminum repair that I passed on doing. It was an aluminum dump truck box with a vibrator that was attached, and everything cracked. Due to the change in the heat affected zone (like you mentioned) I don’t believe I could have been successful in repairing it without redesigning the way it worked (and likely using bolts/epoxy) to hold the vibrator on. Aluminum is definitely one of those things that things can go really bad fast, it’s not worth sticking my name on something that is a flawed design lol.

I love how you bypassed butt ton and ass ton and went straight to the triple dog dare! and made it metric,! I build fire tenders well the tanks for them and it never fails that im in the far end of a tank and in the worst possible spot to grind, every time, thats where the gas runs out.....Murphy is my Siamese twin I use pulse mig most of the time and I can usually burn out the porosity, but im used to super hot fast welding. i have a "starter"block of metal i weld on to get the gas going and such so i have bad and good passes on it and after a few years it got big and i cut it in half and hardly any porosity, almost looks like a life size slice of metal bread. So if you have that "corner no grinderdisk can get too" Pulse is pretty good and burning all that stuff out as opposed to straight mig.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Porosity with Mig seems far easier to weld over and have clean internal welds on a pass on top, especially if it’s due to a lack of gas and not metal contaminates. I think a lot of that is due to the pores not containing slag. It’s definitely not ideal, but the real world is far from ideal sometimes. With stick 6010 doesn’t really care, 7018 tends to have a poor puddle but will weld over porosity, and I find 6013 to not tolerate it much at all. No doubt a weaker weld will result, and adding in a ton of variables to the potential strength isn’t desirable, but the real world is far from perfect. I haven’t ran a hot pulse/spray over porosity, but I have tested a hot 6010 pass over a real poor weld and it actually worked pretty good. The go to plan should be grind out the bad, weld in the good, but that will go out the window when repairing something like a filthy dumpster thats full of rusty material and can’t be prepped properly lol.

@mindbenderx1174

3 ай бұрын

my first welding job was repairing chicken carriers for Foster Farms, nothing like the aromas of a fine BBQ chicken crap rusted steel!@@makingmistakeswithgreg

ESAB used to be junk, I'm currently using a 260 and I'm really impressed with the unit, from the wire feeder to the duty cycle, I've even done some aluminum welding with the 15' lead and it's pushed the wire fairly well, a spool gun is certainly superior, but it worked in a pinch. I'd love to see you do a test with different shielding gas mixtures. 100% CO2, 75-25, 90-10 and 100% Argon.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

I second that esab used to have a bunch of stinkers. Honestly the rebel and rogue welders I like a lot. Their tig machines are still not competitive though. I have been meaning to test c02 vs c25. Now that I have a welder that is capable of hitting high enough voltage, I will be testing that soon 😀.

@richb.4374

3 ай бұрын

Years ago I worked for a government contractor weld shop. The owner bought Esab mig welders. Worst pieces of junk I ever had the displeasure of welding with. The duty cycle was terrible and the contactors would melt down. Our Millers would take a beating and keep on welding.

@danielmartin531

20 күн бұрын

I know with 100% CO2 it penetrates so well I gotta turn my voltage down quite a bit vs 75/25 using dual shield and .052 wire.

I really love how to the point and info oriented you are, thank you. Not a welder by trade but I've done a few things in the garage and a few car things that were non-structural (at least not enduring much, like an exhaust hanger with rubber bushing). Never really knew how to gauge my welds but I'm glad I focused on good penetration over anything. Edit: That accent also makes me want to drink with you lol

@makingmistakeswithgreg

24 күн бұрын

Focusing on running fairly hot and consistent will produce serviceable welds, even if they aren’t the prettiest. There are tons of welding defects that weaken welds, but the worst one is no fusion lol. The whole goal of welding is fusion, so if that doesn’t happen you’re gluing lol. 🍻

Great video, very informative. I myself am responsible for inspecting welds in an auto factory and I can tell you that I have seen far, "FAR" worse welds. One of the main causes for some of the worst welds I have seen is when the welding nozzle falls off, this obviously wouldn't happen with manual welding unless you're blind, doing it intentionally or just plain ignorant. We of course call it porossity but it is different from what you got, this kind actually burrows deep into the material and depending on the materials thickness/ how deep it burrows, it will burn a hole all the way through it.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

If you’re running higher settings or have thinner material the porosity or worm holes will have a far worse impact. In the case of the video welds the base material was surprisingly clean because there wasn’t much penetration. In 1/4in or thinner the base metal could be completely turned into porosity or worm holes and at that point it could be really difficult to fix. In your case does a person manually fix the bad welds via grinding them out and rewelding? That must be an interesting job, definitely not a fun lol.

@jackn2236

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg most of the parts we work with are thinner than 1/4in thick. We do have a person who is responsible for manually fixing bad welds as we see many different problems, most of them being easy to fix like blow holes, notching, short/missing welds. However, in the case of serious problems like burn throughs, blow outs and of course welds like I described, we typically throw them in the scrap as maybe less than 5% of attempts to fix them are successfull.

awesome vid. This guy knows how to teach.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

7 күн бұрын

Thanks for the kind words 😀

Thanks for a interesting topic and all work. Please put some thick acrilic plate in front of those pieces on the press.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

21 күн бұрын

I am not too worried about the press. The loads on the material aren’t nearly as high as a lot of what you see on KZread and I am not pressing hardened steel. I appreciate your concern though.

dude that triple is solid and aint going nowhere, regardless of the root pass.

Thanks for the deets

I use mig. But I would never attempt metal that thick. If I did I would have to get it real hot. But I would not bother stick weld that. People are not using mig for bridges.

The reason the multipass world was a lot stronger than you expected was because the weld material strength was what mattered, not that of fusion to the original plates.

I’ve never welded never tried never been interested but It looks like Im going to watch your entire video and now others to understand more because I had homie who does crazy insane welds and immediately started on Baja trucks didn’t realize how good he is and just kinda brushed past it

@makingmistakeswithgreg

18 күн бұрын

Welding is far more complex and involved than even I realized at first. A good way to think of it is you’re trying to do your best work under the worst conditions, with 85 out of 100 ways you could do it will end in failure. Sometimes things start ok and turn to trash, other times you can’t get things to work period. The best welders are the people who don’t give up easily when they are frustrated and nothing is going right lol.

Before i wondered how do you get into the space in between and got an answer so no reaction with air equals more energy to the whole piece

If you add a universal joint between your breaker bar and the dyno you will get an accurate measurement of the torque you are applying to the joint. That is because doing so requires you to counter the force you put on the handle at the head of the universal joint, thereby making you apply a pure moment to the dyno. Moments are transferred through structures without modifications due to geometry.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Great idea. I may end up doing that. It has proven to be consistent in testing for comparisons sake. I can get very close results with multiple tests. I really only planned on breaking them with a breaker bar, but the fact a simple device could give a hard number to compare multiple tests made it worth it to use the torque gauge.

Good video as always. In the past, did you test bad stick welds? Eg 7024, 7014, 6013 with slag inclusions (typical defect with them). Or 7016 , 7018 with porosity. Thanks for your time. Sart0

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

The difficulty with testing welds like that is how to create the defects. Mig is easy, just shut off the gas, or use poor settings. With stick the only real way to create porosity is to remove some flux, and that tends to just produce arc blow and it makes even worse welds than mig without gas. I might give it a shot but I know it’s going to be almost impossible to get consistent defects in the welds.

@chrishayes5755

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg could also try using rods that are damp. or just let me do the welding. you'll have plenty of worm holes, defects, wobbly mess everywhere lol

@catsaregovernmentspies

3 ай бұрын

To get slag inclusion you could weld vertically from top to bottom?

Thanks again Greg, this video was super helpful. I've been practicing and will continue, but one question I keep hearing in the back of my mind is "so, how much is enough?" and how strong is this? I have a woodworking background and have a good feeling if something (wooden) I'm building will hold or not. With metal, I don't have that accumulated experience yet, but am looking forward to a day when I have that as well. The other thing I've heard you and other qualified welders say is to fix my issues, just grind 'em down and weld it again. Compared to wood it doesn't quite work like that.. so while it might seem remedial to others I would appreciate a video that shows a mistake and a proper correction. Much appreciated!

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Over time you get a feeling for what is strong enough and what’s not. A lot of it is confidence built up from not seeing things fail that you built. There are some simple rules to follow to get solid results, hopefully this helps you a bit: Metal working and welds are just like a chain, they are only as strong as the weakest link. If the weld is equal in thickness as the base material, and fused properly, you will have a strong “chain”. If the area between pieces of metal is not fully fused, the chain may be weaker than it should be. It is most important to weld with enough heat input to metal the metal together. It’s actually far better to weld too hot than too cold when it comes to strength. As far as how much weld is enough, most people over weld what they really need for a job, aka more weld than what would be needed. That’s ok because for the most part it’s not an issue. Too much weld can overheat material which causes warping, but a couple extra inches of weld isn’t a big deal. Once you build a few things (and even do a few destructive tests) you will realize how strong your welds really are and gain confidence.

Interesting! The welds got brittle, so all the elasticity is now tensile strength. Certainly not what you would expect from a weld... Corrosion resistance would be interesting with all those holes and impurities in the weld.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

It was stronger than I expected but I definitely didn’t test fatigue strength. No doubt if it was loaded to 75-80% max strength a few times in a cycle it probably would have failed. I bet if it was exposed to salt and water it would have virtually no strength within a year lol.

This better demonstrated why design play the biggest part in end product, welding is part of it, but not all, one could do great job but the thing would fail because how load is distributed. While bad weld would stay forever if it was well designed. So good enough weld is great for most cases, no need to obsess in perfect weld.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Weld defects definitely are not a positive, but for many things a person might make it’s possible to design them so that the defects don’t cause a failure. Once a decent skill level is reached it becomes hard to have welds that have any significant defects, which is a good thing. Not to mention periodic testing ensures things are going well. Simple tests can give so much insight that it’s a shame most people don’t do them. Realistically a perfect weld is virtually impossible to achieve, and focusing on that can be a detriment like you said. Making sure you have consistently good fusion, fairly defect free welds, and adequate weld size for the material will take care of most situations. Its cold welds with no fusion that are the worst. Welds with porosity, undercut, that are undersized, etc, will outperform cold welds any day of the week.

@worawatli8952

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks for your insight, I am just DIY welder that do it like once a year. I had experience with cold weld breaking before on my college years tricycle project, lf it was motorbike or car then i might not be here watching your video. Thanks again for your video encouraging practice by reassuring that ugly weld that is strong should be appreciate instead of ridiculed. And hopefully prevent people from learning it the hard way like I did back in the day, the trike front suspension snapped in half in a park near my college. rofl It was combinations of bad design and bad weld, after changing the design, it never break again despite me not doing good job welding it, it outlasted other components. Also the welding machine we had at the workshop was awful, it always too hot or too cold and it fluctuated, never able to get it right, so I just didn't care, just make it melt and it's good enough. lol

This is information that will help me weld better, for sure! I understand the need for strong fusion at the root, and the strengths and weaknesses of cap weld passes. I will be thinking a lot more about consistent speed, and proper heat and wire feed. I wind up reoairing a lot of welds made by people who learned to weld from TikTok welding fakery videos (MIG as TIG stacked-dimes "pretty" welds that have little penetration, plenty of deposition, and look far better than they perform are the most common. Somewhere in the jump cut, they'll use a real welder to do it, edit that out, then cut back to the fake crap. Looks good and works good are separate concepts

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

What you mentioned is the subject of a video that will be out soon. I talk about why it’s important to weld with enough heat to get fusion. I took a actual failed part that was “migged like tig”, discussed why I thought it failed, and cut it apart to verify my thoughts. I also made a couple welds attempting to make them look like dimes, and strength tested them. The results will definitely fall into the “looks good, but doesn’t work good” category lol.

@kdawson020279

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg I don't always get lucky enough to have welds that don't need a ton of grinding, but I am more focused on welds that actually melt the base metal substantially enough to get fusion. Fabrication and welding is just one of the many hats I wear, and I improve my technique with time. By the time I'm eligible to retire, hopefully it's more time holding the torch and less time running the grinder. Thanks for the video and I'll watch out for the next!

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

The progression from a “grinder” to a welder is a slow but steady battle lol. Eventually with practice it becomes harder to make bad welds, and the grinder needs to come out less. All it takes is a desire to improve and enough care to be decent. Which is why it has always shocked me how people have gone whole careers never welding beyond the skill of someone in highschool that cares. You would think improvement would happen at some point whether a person wanted it or not lol.

Talking about the leverage on bending it towards the weld, it makes sense the 3 pass weld held on good. Because the lever ration is than smaller because the weld is thicker. At least my gut tells me that that is the reason. But I could also be wrong.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

Generally speaking a single sided fillet weld would need an oversized weld to achieve significant strength. It’s desirable to weld both sides of a fillet weld if possible, but if that’s not possible a beveled multiple pass or a multi pass unbeveled plate weld will be needed.

Good stuff and advice. Actually, I really wanted the one with the crap root but two cover welds to fail... It might make some think they can take the easy way out. Not this group, but others that haven't watched your vids...

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

It was a hard one to predict. It could have gone either way. It’s pretty crazy to see how much porosity was in that weld yet it held. It really shows how important how force is applied to determine if something will hold or not. At the same time it’s pretty scary how such a bad weld can be covered up lol. I honestly didn’t think the surface of the cover passes would be clean. It welded poorly but, it’s not blatantly obvious as to what’s underneath lol.

@kdawson020279

3 ай бұрын

The thing you pointed out, though, is the triangulation of the cap passes creates a chord to handle the tensile forces even with the crap root. It's not ideal, but what it tells me is that in the event grinding back down to the base metal is not an option, a simple gusset can be an imperfect but acceptable solution in non-critical applications. For hoisting and load-bearing applications, there's no second chance to make a first impression.

As an absolute bare-minimum hobbyist who hasn't done much welding, I was so confused seeing those middle welds at first. I wasn't even sure how you got it to look like that. I didn't realize you could even weld without the gas on a MIG welder - never tried it, always assumed it's necessary and that it won't even work without the inert gas.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

28 күн бұрын

You definitely can weld without gas, but the molten metal will react with oxygen and make a Swiss cheese weld lol. The poor weld actually had surprising static strength. I didn’t test it in the video, but the fatigue resistance of the porous weld would have been about zero. A solid weld could take 70-80% of its max load (before failure) for a long time (cycling between no load and 80%) before failure. Defect filled welds might hold a lot of weight once, but cycle them and they will fail far faster than a clean weld. Always focus on trying to make clean welds 😀

I'd love to see a MiG comparison involving arc length. Like how close you get with the torch vs penetration of that makes sense

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

So the stickout distance has some leeway. The biggest issue is the longer the stickout, the hotter the wire will get. This will generally cause more spatter. The shielding gas will often cover poorer, which will lead to more porosity issue. If I had to make a bet I would think the performance would stay similar up until the point the shielding gas issue reared its head. I will definitely test this to see what happens.

How much does it take to break a good weld?

@daPsychoNinja

23 күн бұрын

Good welds don't break not in metal like the video. The point is that the two coupons should act like 1 piece of metal for life. EDIT:Fixed typo

Thank you Sr. Could you recommend some readding materials? Just a basic list would be much apreciated!!! Thank you

@melgross

3 ай бұрын

Miller has a number of downloadable booklets on most aspects of welding for beginners. I recommend them. Another good channel like this one is Timwelds. It’s for beginners and more structured. It’s not really in competition with this one so I don’t mind recommending it.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Miller has a many great pamphlets that are great for learning as Melgross mentioned. Lincoln too. From a book perspective most of the welding books I have read are incredibly dry and difficult reads. Virtually all the welding books I own are based on metallurgy or the science behind welding, which is great knowledge but the time would be better spent with more “how to weld” material.

@melgross

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg agreed. That’s why I don’t recommend them. Many already assume knowledge most people don’t have.

How about some cut, and etch testing for some visuals of the weld penetration. Thanks for your videos.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

I have done probably more than 10 videos with just cut and etches in the past. This particular video could demonstrate everything I needed to show without trying to cut the small coupon apart. The video I am working on where I compare 100% co2 vs c25 will have both bend tests and cut and etches since I have never done that before.

Having worked in nuclear power for 45 years I have seen a wide range of welds. You can’t tell a weld is good just by looking at it. That is why they do nondestructive testing.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 күн бұрын

100% right. Non destructive testing will find flaws that would be impossible to see otherwise. The higher the liability the more likely NDT will be brought in.

I’ve found that experimenting with welding over a burnt weld (no gas), the new weld fixes some of the problems of the first weld as it remelts most if it and some of the oxidized metal reverts. Not the way to fix a bad weld, but it will somewhat mitigate it. Never do that for anything structural or requiring code, of course. Ok, so really, just don’t do it. It’s just a matter of academic interest.

@z1teq

3 ай бұрын

Its a big no no for anything other than purely aesthetic welds. There's a reason any porosities have to be completely removed from a weld before attempting to weld over it, it will always be porous if not, this is common knowledge for anyone doing high level welds that need to pass xray etc. Hell even a regular weld that might look absolutely perfect, can be porous under the surface due to any number of causes. I've personally failed xray on TIG welds that looked gorgeous and had all the prep work done perfectly. A gust of wind or a piece of dust landing in your weld is all it takes.

Okay todays rained out so todays the day we see if my machine will run a 6010 rod, I like my 6011 now, it was the first rod I started with and Jesus, how depressing, it will make a master grinder out of you for sure. But it’s gotten a ton better now to where I like it

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

6011 just requires a slow forward travel speed. Think of 6010 and 6011 as 75% arc gouging and 25% metal deposition. 7018 and 6013 are about 75% metal deposition 25% arc gouging. If you move to fast you don’t fill the undercut you left. If you are smooth and consistent in movement you will find 6010/11 easier to run. The weld pool freezes so fast it captures everything, so a rough looking weld means you are simply inconsistent in movement. You must also get used to the fact the weld pool is way wider with 6010/11 than most other rods. They both run at higher voltage, and higher voltage means wider arc cone, thus wider weld. If you can run a decent bead with 7018, 7014, or 6013 you can as well with 6011/10. Just slow down your forward progression speed by about 40-60% over those other rods and give it time to deposit metal 😀

I swear you sound like my high school teacher. Good time arc welding

Great video 👍

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Thanks 😀

Hey Greg, when is the part two of the miller dial arc videos coming out?

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

This next week, it’s edited and uploaded but there are some in the queue ahead of it 😀

@biasplies3273

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg sweet! Can’t wait to see it

after seeing a lot of random people complaining about welds on random youtube videos, this was cool to see, because you understand what they are talking about. But in my opinion, after seeing this, the welds they were complaining about would have been decently strong but not great.

On that first hydraulic pressure test I started thinking... "I hope this guy has some safety measures in place for projectiles." But I'm not experienced with this stuff so I don't have much idea how dangerous a hand operated press is. I do watch some stuff from the hydraulic press channel and that's about all that informed my opinion, lol.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

The plates could catastrophically fail, but they would fail outwards in the direction I am not standing. The pressure that particular press can produce is not really that much. I also don’t press tool steels in it, which is where a lot of the danger is. Tool steels max strength and its yield strength (when it starts deforming) are close to one another. So you don’t have much warning when it’s going to break. Mild steel will start to give long before it hits its maximum strength. Think of it like play dough (mild steel) and glass (hardened steel).

This is way better than what my shop teacher used to do, in high school. He would just take your work and spike it into the ground like a foot ball. If it broke you failed 😅

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

Haha what was the failure rate. That would have been embarrassing to have it fail 😅

@mora103

2 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg yeah a few still managed to fail though. They just didn't have the will, or would just be moving too fast. Not many failed though 😅

Been trying to hit all your videos hoping I can learn something, my background is tool and die making and what i find interesting is your method of testing welds destructively, I have read some about the American welding society testing and methods and what's involved to do them, like the charpy V notch test, OMG the price of the machine alone is beyond the reach of mortal man. as is the rest of the testing equipment. Then it dawned on me why not develop your own testing methods with your own repeatable means of testing. My work was in the nuclear industry so i understand standards that are ridged and uniform with extremely expensive testing equipment. You have given me some ideas I can expand on. so my question is this , on the guided bend test is there any reason it can't be done with thinner plate like 3/16" and wrapped around the bending die of a harbor freight compact metal bender using a smaller die? if I do it the same way each time wouldn't the outcome be the same as A not THE standard go's?, but what sparks my interest is the impact test, I find it a challenge to build a tester with some kind of a foot pounds value. thanks for all the information.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

With conventional “home” destructive testing (like a fillet weld break test) the main info gained is depth of penetration and ultimate strength. Cut and etches show depth of penetration in one spot, not the whole weld. A fillet weld break test shows a whole weld, which is very important because welds are rarely consistent start to finish. Beyond those tests and visual inspection, there isn’t a whole lot more than can be easily achieved at home. It is possible to test impact force resistance via dropping a weight (from a measured height, measured weight, in a tube) upon a weldment. The problem (as you found out) with replicating charpy-v notch is the precision required in the test specimens. I know I could make a machine that could duplicate the charpy machine, but machining test specimens would be extremely time consuming. So ultimately it becomes an issue of what can be done to achieve consistent results good enough for someone to use as a comparison. My thoughts are if the results with a machine are repeatable, and they are consistent, the machine will work for comparisons sake. Using the shop press like I do shows clear evidence that there are actual strength differences between welding processes. For you at home you should focus on testing to verify root fusion and consistency of that fusion start to finish. You should verify lack of porosity inside of welds. The method you described on using thinner material bent over a die could provide valuable info as well. Keep in mind if you did a butt weld (and only welded one side), it would likely pass if bent with the weld facing away from the die. The positioning of where the welded area hit on the die would also possibly change the outcome. Typical weld bend testing (where a strip of weld is cut out) is bent with the weld at the direct center of the die, and the plate is bent equally around to die on both ends. This is a bit more consistent than bending the plate around a die from one side to another. Based on my testing thus far er70 mig, 7018 stick, and tig will have very favorable performance and will exceed the base materials strength provided a defect free weld is put down. This is based on a 200amp home level welder. If more power is available the performance of a spray arc or .045+ dual shield wire will likely outperform 1/8th in stick rods (single pass non beveled plates). Basically in a nut shell the most important thing is no weld defects, root fusion, and the engineering behind what you’re making. If you want to test things at home you can follow what I have done and likely get pretty accurate comparisons. The hardest part will be to reliably get repeatable results, which requires you to be a very consistent/skilled welder. It’s also very difficult to determine small differences. When I do a tig/mig/stick ultimate strength comparison it will be exceptionally hard to be fair because I could easily skew the test.

Excellent info. Very helpful.

This example is the excuse stick welders had for many years that you cannot get good penetration with mig welding. The technology has changed drasticly. For these small amp home welders some people suggest grinding a bevel on any metal thicker than 3/16 so the root pass will have a better bite. If no gas, use flux core wire. Some medium home welders now crank out 200 amps DC.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

I have definitely tested a bunch of stick rods and short arc mig. I agree, with a 200 amp class mig machine you can get some solid welds on 1/4 and 3/8th steel. In many cases the short arc mig welds surpass the strength (bends towards face of the weld) than stick rods. The only thing that bothers me with short arc mig is how a decent looking weld can have no fusion. What was shown in the video is a bad example, since the cap passes were clean, but the root was trash (same thing could be done with stick). What I am talking about are the single pass mig welds I have seen that visually look decent (just like they did on the cap passes in this video) that break right off the base material. Normally this is a direct result of poor material prep, thick material, slightly cold settings, and someone doing big circle E’s. Basically how the weld looks is not a reliable gauge of performance with a mig weld as much as it is of a stick weld. Even so short arc mig run right (with a 200amp+ machine) is a solid performer. I would weld with that over 6013 any day, it performs far better in the destructive testing I have done.

@mathewmolk2089

3 ай бұрын

BAd technique. You can get beyond root penetration. if you do it right. (I call it the Bob Villa Syndrome)

Is Arc Gouging doable for the home workshop? How many amps do you really need to run one? Give us the lowdown on it to up our game.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

It’s funny you mentioned that, since I was helping with some arc gouging this past week. Here is the details on arc gouging: It takes a very big welder. Essentially you use a copper coated graphite/carbon rod that just has a electric arc present. The rod doesn’t deposit any metal. A constant stream/jet of air comes out of the rod holder and blows the molten metal away. Much like reverse welding. Where the problem is with home arc gouging is the need for a massive welder. Normal stick rods run at 60-160amps and between 16 to 30v. Arc gouging operates at 35-55v and very high amperage. Many home welders are incapable of outputting 35v with a arc, but 40+ will cause the arc to drop out. So what you would find is any 5/32 and 3/16th carbon would not stay running with most home stick welders. They do make 1/8th carbons that run up to 100amps but I doubt most home machines would run those either because of the high voltage requirement. On face value you could hook a voltage tester to a stick welders output and run a 6010 rod. If you pull the rod off the plate while welding and hold a long arc, the voltage right before the arc cuts out is your max closed circuit voltage. If it’s below 45 it would be hopeless to arc gouge with the machine. For a practical example the harbor freight 225 welder would probably run with a 1/8th carbon. A 5/32 would probably barely run. A 3/16th wouldn’t run. If it did it would hit the thermal overload in 1-2 minutes. Basically a 300-400+ amp machine is needed to get any kind of duty cycle out of the process. The best option for the home shop is plasma gouging and torch work with a scarfing tip.

@tughillplateau2129

3 ай бұрын

I would try it with my cst 280 .@@makingmistakeswithgreg

@sebastianleicht

3 ай бұрын

Take a plasma - but not the cheapest. I wrecked one with gauging. It basically burnt the relais that engages the "Power-circuit" once the pilotarc is established. I think this is because you have often a stuttering arc (Plasma-beam) when the gap to your tip becomes bigger. The relais does many fast swiching-operations under high Amps and dies. And there may be HV-backlashes within this design, too. With plasmas 600€ up I had no such problems. If you're looking on the cheap side a older used industrial grade may be an option. But be aware: a 100A transformer plasma will dran more Amps from your outlet then Gregs miller dialarc! (40 - 50A 3-phase 400V.....) and you need a quite strong compressor because these dinosaurs need much air and have 2 separate air-lines, one for cutting and the other for cooling. Look at "Jäckle 60-100 plasma"

@michaelc9507

3 ай бұрын

I run a gouger on a welder with 500 amps to cut out welds on 1 inch AR 400 450 500 plate, it takes some practice technique. My home setup I have enough amps on portable machine at 225 amps or run a gouger but you need air source. Good luck it’s nice a good tool to use or know how to use it.

@mathewmolk2089

3 ай бұрын

Not really. Realistically you nee 400 amps to do any real damage. - Now the rod is expensive but the ArcAir slice torch can be used anywhere.

To answer your question. The sky, ceiling, roof etc. They are all up.

I have had a problem with vertical up fillet welding with MIG and/or 7018. The weld bead profile (width, depth, size) starts out good, then as it progresses upward until about 3/4 of the way up it gets gradually hotter and the weld flattens out and gets wider. This gets worse as it nears the end and sometimes blows out the top edge of the base material from the heat. Sometimes the last inch or so is glowing red all around. I've tried to speed up as the weld progresses, but that just makes the bead get too narrow. Any suggestions?

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Sure, couple tips: One of the unfortunate problems with both uphill MiG and 7018 is they both tend to be cold at the start, ok during the middle, and hot at the end. With 7018 it’s possible to run an uphill stringer or at worst slight back and forth movement. Mig requires a weave because you need to allow the metal to cool and stack metal on metal (pulse Mig can allow for straight in). Generally speaking for proper strength both must be run vertical up, because down limits penetration. With that said let’s look at how to dial it in. With 7018 it’s important to set the amperage more towards the low end. On vertical up 1/8th rod somewhere between 100 and 115 depending on machine (some are off by a bit reality vs machine setpoint). You move slower at the bottom of the plate by a little bit and faster near the top. It’s very important to use your arc gap to control heat input. If you keep that arc super tight near the top you will limit heat input, which is good. If the machine has adjustable arc force or dig make sure it’s very low (3 out of 10 or 30% and experiment lower). The fact your plate is glowing red suggests you’re moving too slow, your weld is too wide, or your amperage is too high. With mig you need to weld wide enough that where you were cools off so when you cross over to the other side and then back ontop of what you just welded, that it’s solid metal. The reason for weaving is to give the newly deposited metal time to solidify so the molten pool sticks to the solid metal via surface tension, and becomes solid faster due to the heat being pulled out. If your settings are too hot you will not be able to control the molten pool properly. You will need to experiment with slightly lower values or with moving faster to keep the top part of the weld from being that hot. Couple other tips/thoughts. With uphill mig it’s very common to make welds that are bigger (aka oversized) for the material thickness. This is a reality of the limits of the process. You will not be able to achieve the same size weld on say 1/4in plate uphill in comparison to flat with mig. With stick it is possible (but difficult) to make the same size welds uphill vs flat with 7018. Both processes will suffer from inconsistent root fusion depth on vertical up. Basically the start of the weld and the first inch will have the least root fusion/penetration, the last inch will have the most. If you set the machine to make the first part fully fused the last part will be far too hot. Again this is just limitations of the processes. The hardest part will be figuring out the right heat input to not overheat at the top. It really comes down to a bunch of practice and some fooling around. With mig in particular try dropping the settings to one or two whole metal thicknesses lower than what is suggested for the material. On a final note I won’t sugar coat it, both take a fair amount of practice to get acceptably good. It’s imperative you use a room temp plate to practice because the additional heat will make it drastically harder to control the weld. Also, it may help if you put a fat tack weld at the top of what you’re welding on (or a stringer bead across if you’re just practicing on flat plate). The extra mass will help you from blowing out the end of the plate as much. Make sure to count on the sides of a weave too. Spend little time in the center and most on the sides. Cross the center, hold the side for 1-2.5 seconds and move to the other side. You will get it 👍

@fastbusiness

3 ай бұрын

​@@makingmistakeswithgreg Thanks for your detailed explanation. I understand what you've said and I'm thinking through how to apply your specific advice and instructions. Also, I've been watching all your playlists on stick welding and flux core welding and taking notes so I can have a step-by-step plan to follow. Welding vertical up might be a little too advanced for me right now, but don't think you wasted your time on your answer. I'm going to write down what you advise here and work on it when I get to that skill level. For the time being, going back to the basics is what I need to be doing, like you show in your other videos. There's no need to be fooling around with more advanced techniques without even knowing the basics, is there? Since I don't have a regular workshop and must work outdoors, I've been waiting for a few days for it to warm up a little. Everything is sitting right there on the welding table ready to go in a day or two. Thanks again. 🌟

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Without a doubt it’s common to “put the cart before the horse” with welding. That’s not a bad thing, because you need to know where you are. If all you do is what’s easy and what you’re comfortable with, you will never get to what you’re capable of. If you feel you’re struggling too much go back to the basics and try to fine tune them. Then go back to what’s harder. You may also find it easier to put a practice plate at something less than purely vertical as well. Its still harder to weld at a 45degree from flat than flat. When I was learning to weld stick vertical up in school I had burned a few hundred lbs of rods in the flat and horizontal positions. I still found vertical up to be a challenge at first. Practice is what makes everything better. What Practice really does is it makes your unconscious brain control most of the variables so you don’t have to waste time trying to control them consciously. Travel speed, arc gap, smooth movement, etc become automatic (think auto pilot). You will get there just don’t give up and be sure to expect a lot of problems lol. And don’t be afraid to test your skills on challenging welds.

@fastbusiness

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Makes sense. I appreciate it.

They must be surprisingly strong seeing as how the welds on the county fair rides give me a panick attack 😅

@makingmistakeswithgreg

24 күн бұрын

I bet welds that look just like Swiss cheese are on park rides everywhere, especially the ones that are only in town for a week lol. If they are holding a static load even Swiss cheese is strong. If they experience vibration or dynamic loads all bets are off. Just make sure to buy a couple beers from the clown in the beer tent before you ride 😅

You have the same exact voice as Jeffrey Sachs 👍 It took me a minute to figure it out. Dead ringer !

@drewreed7423

3 ай бұрын

I was thinking Jamie Hyneman lol

im not even into welding. im a diy carpenter. why am i watching this. gr8 vid thenks mate

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

No problem 😀. It wouldn’t hurt to add some welding skill to your tool belt, you can at a minimum make your own tools and make some extra side money fixing things for people. I did 15 years in home remodeling/brickwork/finish carpentry before I got into welding heavily, it pays to have lots of skills 😀

The sound of frying bacon is great until you start smelling it 🤣

@Initial_Gopnik

3 ай бұрын

If its close enough for me to smell it im asking for a piece 😂

So what would you ay the lesson here is? (Assuming that you are just an at-home welder, not welding for money bur rather on farm equipment or other stuff around the house or shop) 1. If you make a bad weld, clean it up and make a couple of more passes? 2. If you make a bad weld, grind it all off and start again? It seemed to me that the two welds where you made 3 passes did "alright" in the strength tests ... am I right or wrong?

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

The main takeaway should be that if you weld a multi pass weld and the first pass is trash, you should fix it. You will lose a lot of strength if the weld is only on one side and the force is applied towards the face of the weld. The second takeaway is that you can’t over weld your way to make a poor first pass stronger. I did a part two to this video in which I did a clean 3 pass weld. It broke at 30% higher load than the 3 pass with the poor root in this video. It’s a common belief that simply putting more welds down solves a poor root, this simply isn’t the case.

Not really that surprising that the first two pass weld did as well as it did, cause the gunkiest section was loaded in tension, which the material is much stronger in. The cap passes move the fulcrum point out, dividing the amount of force that section of the weld had to withstand compared to the single crummy pass, and had a stronger fulcrum section which didn't buckle as easily. Probably the first thing that happened to that single pass weld was the face of the weld starting to buckle which propagated through the rest of the material pretty immediately afterwards. Same thing might have happened to the two pass one, but much later.. or it might not have broken until the tension pulled apart the root, and either of those is gonna take a lot more force.

@LifeInJambles

3 ай бұрын

The break on the single pass starting with the front buckling also explains why it sounded more crackly than the two pass. Break happened progressively as the buckling would have happened, then adding bending into the mix would have made failures happen throughout the material bit by bit rather than happening all at once. Especially since it wasn't a uniform bit of material, but instead little chunks of different thicknesses.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Great thoughts on the test. No doubt the root had the least leverage on it. It’s also why when I tested a 3 pass weld with a 6010 root 2 bead 7018 cap it would handle the same bend without failure, but a 3 bead 6010 would fail.

@LifeInJambles

3 ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg Nifty. I find the physics/materials science aspect to welding particularly interesting. I feel like it's one of those things where you can absolutely be an excellent welder by just understanding convention and going through experience, but there's a separate level of expertise or craftsmanship (that's really not strictly necessary in almost any situation) that kind of necessitates understanding the underlying principles. I just tend to enjoy things more the more depth I find to them. Probably the ADHD. *shrug*

Brilliant…. I’ll stop welding cold from this day forth

Hey Greg is it true tht welding is bad for the eyes, me and my GF had a debate on this and she claimed that welding is really bad for your eyes. I was going to go to school for it Im 52 and I treasure my eyesight so thats a big factor in my decision to go to school for welding, I look forward to your response thank you.

@Keyboard-Emperor

Ай бұрын

Yes! It can blind you. But you just have to be careful and not look at the ark bare-eyed. It is Ultraviolet light, you get literally a sunburn on your eyeballs. It feels like sand stuck in your eyes. But yes 100% welding CAN BE very hard òn your eyes, plus there's inhalation hazards too. But every trade has its Pros and Cons welding is actually a pretty gravy Trade

@Keyboard-Emperor

Ай бұрын

Think about how just a little piece of wire glows bright enough to light up a room, now picture a wrench sized piece of that same wire glowing just as bright,.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

So there is a lot to be said for eye safety. A proper welding helmet (stick with a quality one) will block all UV light and heat radiation from welding even in the undarkened state. If you were to arc flash yourself (have nothing between your bare eye and the welding arc) you can definitely do damage. Keyboard-emperor said it best, it’s a sunburn on your eyes and it feels like you have sand on them. I have worked with many people who have made a long career of welding and most of them had eye issues in their 60s-70s. They also all smoked, drank heavily, and had a lot of bad habits. It can be difficult to determine the root cause of the eye problems because genetics can play a role. I can tell you this, with modern safety gear (a good helmet and not putting your face too close to the arc) your eye health will be mostly unaffected. It is common for people to have eye strain if your near vision isn’t very good and you don’t use magnifiers. It’s also common to have dry eyes when learning to weld. I personally don’t have any of those issues and I weld a lot. If in doubt talk with an optometrist and they will help you make the best decision.

@Keyboard-Emperor

Ай бұрын

@@makingmistakeswithgreg My dumbass thought that the Solarstrip on my auto darkening helmet was for Charging it, so I would leave it out in the sun thinking it was charging the battery, It got me good when I was practicing Tig, it lit up(undarkened) for just a second but I felt a weird tingle but didn't think about it, till I tried to close my eyes to sleep then BAM! And I had no idea what it was. But hey live and learn👍👍👍

For the total force, don't you have to measure the distance from the fulcrum?

@makingmistakeswithgreg

26 күн бұрын

You do, the numbers I gave out are only accurate to the test apparatus I used. The actual force is higher because the load cell is extended from the plate itself. For comparisons sake it works good, and it gives numbers to compare one to another.

As long as you were testing to destruction hy didn't you cut an etch them? - You can even use battery acid in a pinch.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

So I have done a ton of cut and etches on the channel previously that’s the primary reason. It’s also tough to do a cut on such a small coupon. The penetration generally speaking is pretty limited with short circuit MiG. When I test c25 vs 100% co2 I will be doing both bend tests and cut and etches 😀

An interesting video young man. Another thing to consider is the specification and quality of the material. Here in the UK, oriental structural steels are banned. Only structural steel from the UK, Europe and the USA/Canada can be used due to higher quality standards. I also know that in the energy industry, oriental welded components are a cause of failure. This is due to poor welding procedures and a single broad weave pass. Whereas, USA made components have 100% penetration and several passes. This has come to light recently in the renewable energy Industry.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Very interesting. In many cases it’s hard to know where steel is coming from when you buy it. Many of the companies stamped on the materials are american companies but only in name lol. With actual high liability jobs I am sure specifications and testing is far more stringent.

For us across the pond, A metric ton is 40lb short of an imperial ton !

I love the vide and the idea only one proble; Nope not faire they may be bad not saying they arent but a novice shudevt welded some of the pices you are a pro even your bad welds are better then a novices ,

more weld = more better ;)

I am an engineer and hobby welder. I had a problem with your conclusions of the welds that you bent to failure. These welds predominantly failed down the center of the weld lines, not on the interface between the weldment and base metal. The weldment is almost always stronger than the base metal, which in this case is probably some form of mild steel. Look at the frame at 20:35. This clearly shows a failure down the weld line, and not at the interface between the weldment and base metal. This tells me there was good adhesion between the weldment and base metal. The failure occurred in the weldment. The material properties of weldment were exceeded. There is no remedy for that. I would suggest that your bending test does not properly evaluate the strength of these welds nor how adequate they are. The shear capacity of these welds is probably quite good. The quality in tension is unknown. I think there may be some misconception about the value of penetration. The weldment material and the base material do not mix. They form a good adhesion when a high enough temp is reached. The more surface area between the weldment and base material, the higher the load capacity. A deeper penetration just increases the interface area., thereby strength. I could be wrong.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

The welds tore through, I am not sure why you think it would tear through at the point which the weld metal meets the base metal. If the weld has consistent fusion and is consistent in size, they will fail down the middle of the weld and not break off the sides. This is due to the weld being fused into both plates, and how the plate is using the weld as a fulcrum point. The only time you see them rip off the plate is when the fusion is limited or inconsistent, or if the weld was significantly bigger than the base material (aka 4+ pass 1/2in thick fillet weld on 1/4in material). The more penetration that is present in the root the harder it is to bend the plate. Both push and pull would have held on past the point of the plate bending if I bent them away from the face (opposite of what I did). Bending the plates towards the face will always post higher numbers with higher penetration. If I ran a 6010 pass on it with high arc force it would post higher numbers than the short arc mig despite it being significantly weaker is specifications, and despite it not being a bigger physical weld. Also, in the testing the same bar of steel was used, the same welder, with the same settings, and they were all done back to back. All of the test results in the video (and previous testing I have done) points to one thing: pulling increases root fusion/penetration. If root fusion matters completely comes down to what’s being welded, how many passes, and how it’s going to be stressed. Most people at home do single pass welds and call it good. Under no circumstance will more root fusion be a negative thing, so if a simple change to a pull angle could produce a higher strength single pass weld, a person should probably do it. Edit: I am not sure what you mean by the “weldment material and the base material do not mix”, in the case of brazing this is true. In actual welding the base material and filler rod form an alloy that is a combination of the two. It’s not the same material as the welding wire and it’s not the same as the base material. This is why when welding things like cast iron care must be taken to use a welding rod that doesn’t become brittle when it absorbs carbon from the cast iron. When welding high carbon cast excessive carbon gets pulled from the casting into the molten pool and the solidified weld will be extremely brittle. To get around this problem an alloy is used that doesn’t become brittle via carbon absorption (nickel) and the welds will retain higher strength than what would be possible with mild steel wire.

From these tests terrible welds are looking pretty good.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

28 күн бұрын

They are stronger than expected for what they are lol. Although I didn’t test it, I have a feeling they would fail on repetitive load cycles far before clean welds lol.

Hmm. I just built a 12ft x10 ft gantry crane and my welds look like 1-3 left to right. So far ive put 450 lbs and im still ok lol. Lets see how it holds up

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Well if you have a few solid ones you would be shocked at how strong even a little weld is. That’s something I need to test, even a 1/2in weld can withstand literal tons of weight depending on how the force is applied 😀

So what i get from the video having never welded a day in my life is unless your working on heavy machinery your MIG weld can be trash and probably still get by

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Well the biggest issue is if a weld is on something thicker than sheet metal it needs to be clean. Where the liability issue comes in is what is a person welding. A trash MiG weld on a garden gate is not a concern. A trash MiG weld on a suspension component could cause loss of life or property. A terrible weld can be 30% the strength of a better one, or worse. Having skill and knowing when your skill isn’t enough to weld something is important.

19:47 carbon arc gouging that will be close to impossible as the metal molecules are not truly attached to together and won't conduct electric very well it will spit and spider and make a huge mess

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

I gouge material like that fairly often, it definitely will make a mess. Depending on how much is trashed it would be easier to use a burr bit or a hard rock for sure. Whatever it takes to get to clean metal.

@jeremyhanna3852

3 ай бұрын

I use to work with a old man named Lee he passed away a few yrs back he work in the field with me a lot of yrs anyways he would heat that Bad weld full of porosity with a oxy acetylene till its liquid and cook all the continmantes out and it worked pretty well wash most of it wash and reweld

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

That’s something I have never tried, I could see it working. It definitely pays to have some tricks to fix mistakes, because they will definitely happen lol.

To be fair, the porous welds are stronger than expected but I definitely still wouldn't trust them.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

I definitely wouldn’t either lol. If I had a way to fatigue test (say take it to 65% max load in a test cycle of say 200 tests) I bet that porosity filled weld wouldn’t even make it to 30 lol.

Cool! I learned that my shitty welds are strong enough for what I need! I can sleep at night now. Whew! I also learned that experienced welders can't tell how strong their welds are either. When we all learn, that's a win! Mostly joking here....

first time in my life i heard about a ,, foot -pund,,^^

That seemed really dangerous with the press

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

Wear safety squints and don’t stand infront of it lol. Seriously though, shop presses can be dangerous without a doubt. Being that it’s a pretty small one and if it fails it would shoot out straight, I am not too worried. If it was a 20+ ton and I had it maxed out I would be far more worried. When things let go at 20ton+ the whole press will lift off the ground lol.

I was looking at the first one thinking it wasn't that ugly before you said its about average

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

Not the best, not the worst, but average 😀.

This trash weld seemed strong enough for me... Isn't 4 tons a lot? Like, let's say you're welding a 3mm thick hollow steel for a bench press or something like that, or some other gym equipment... Wouldn't this kind of weld still strong enough for the job?

if you measure the size of the breaking tool you could calculate the actual strength

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

You are correct, I have just been too lazy to do it lol.

And now, why not welding so deep to the point that the entire surface where both plates of steel touch is welded? Yea i get it, it'd take more energy and time for a weld to penetrate that deep, but i think it'd be so much stronger it'd be absolutely worth it and even a sin not to do it

@wilhelmschmidt7240

Ай бұрын

Ideally you penetrate fully at the root and then layer multiple welds instead of trying to do one giant weld. For one thing, the heat dissipation through the rest of your work is going to be extreme, and this can lead to distortion of the metal and issues both in overall shape and molecular integrity. It's also much harder to keep that much surface area free from oxidization with your shielding gas. It COULD be done, but would likely only result in a worse quality weld and a lot of wasted energy and material.

19:10 just a shit-ton of porosity. Not just any shit-ton, a metric shit-ton. lol

@makingmistakeswithgreg

Ай бұрын

A metric shit ton will definitely tank a project 😅

Your worst welds are better than my best welds. 😥

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Don’t you worry, it just comes down to time and experience. There was a time I couldn’t weld a shock tower in a car without it falling off when I was done 😅. I have a lot of time welding time under my belt, that makes it far easier to weld decent. Just practice and focus on being smooth/consistent. It skill will come 😀

a weld is a weld

Those terrible welds, look like my good welds.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

Don’t worry, my “good welds” at one point were far worse than the terrible welds in the video lol. It’s not where you start, it’s where you finish 😀

4tons even at bad weld? isnt thats a whole lot already?

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

Yes and no, that’s 4 tons at a couple inches from the weld. If you make something that happens to have a longer lever to the weld (aka a longer plate) it will break with much less force. Impact forces are not taken into account either, a few hundred pound force impacting that plate could cause a complete failure with the poor weld vs stronger weld.

Id say those are decent welds if u need a press to break them id say strong enough for my go kart build

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

The key with any weld is try to reduce as many defects as possible. All defects are undesirable, so anything that can be done (including tons of practice) will result in higher strength welds. Failures are rarely fun, and high strength welds go a long way to prevent those 😀

Nobody puts a 3 pass on top of a crappy weld because it shows, and they will be asked to grind it off and do it again. You should have tested what the MFs do: get a weld full of porosity then put a single pass weave on top to hide the garbage weld, and hide the holes that blow through the weave with tacks and grinder.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

lol that sounds like the “I will leave it for day shift” special.

Good enough for a BBQ or a fire pit or something similar.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

I definitely think the dimes has a place on those things for sure. On a suspension component not so much lol.

lol, i dont think it came out as you expected...seems plenty strong to me.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

13 күн бұрын

Strong with a static load yes, however if that was subject to vibration, varying stress in multiple directions, or significant stress away from the face of the welds, there is no question it would fail a lot sooner than a clean weld. That’s something I am making a test setup to replicate 😀

Ugly welds are above all weak when subjected to fatigue

@makingmistakeswithgreg

2 ай бұрын

That’s for sure. The unpredictable nature of weld defects is something that is very difficult to predict the performance of.

You didn't test cyclic stress which would be bad on bad welds.

@makingmistakeswithgreg

3 ай бұрын

I definitely didn’t test that, you’re right. That porosity filled weld over time will fail no doubt. Even water getting into it and freezing in cold climates would massive contribute towards failures.