Surely I won't talk about female characters and how to write them a THIRD time...

@cryo9017

3 ай бұрын

You probably will but you'll do great bro. (Even though I don't agree with you.)

@thedotgiver2820

3 ай бұрын

.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

@@thedotgiver2820 thanks for the .

@mistingwolf

3 ай бұрын

Defenestrate is one of my favorite words! I practically GASPED when I heard it. Thank you for making my day.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

@@demod2080 A couple of decades ago, sometimes the only purpose a female character would ever serve in the story was as a sex symbol or a love interest. In fact, it was the majority of movies and fiction. In my opinion, the writing for female characters has gotten better, not worse. Though it's not difficult to do better than "brick wall with a pair of honkers" as a personality type. Pointing out that exceptions like Ripley existed doesn't disprove this either. And as I said in my video, having a list of female characters prepared kinda proves my point. Often times we remember what is good, and forget what is boring or bad unless it's so bad we can't help but hate it. And in the case we hate it, we will think it's everywhere when it's not because of negativity bias. Either way, I write, and I think I can make good female characters. So much so that I've invited you to read what i've written. I am allowed to shill my own book on my own channel. I dunno how to tell you this, but I was being honest. And 'streamlining' the video by taking out the part about meta commentary would have defeated the purpose of the video because the point of the video was to address that side of critique. I have another video on my channel which you can watch that doesn't go into it so much. If I were you, I would question why you feel so against what I said since none of what I said should really offend you. And if it offends you, then ask yourself where those feelings come from, and who made you believe in what you believe. I don't think these opinions are your own because I've seen it espoused by plenty of the YT review 'critics' I make fun of in the video.

How to write a female character Step 1:Write a character Step 2:Make them female

@engineergaming1669

3 ай бұрын

An alternative way, write the words “a female character”

@buggypc9753

3 ай бұрын

​@@engineergaming1669 No. Freaking. Way.

@mr.j3rs3y

3 ай бұрын

Pretty much this, unless ofc the story wants to focus on specific female traits or common attributes associated with women for thematic purposes or what not, besides that it’s like, just write a character XD

@gumball2253

3 ай бұрын

Step 3: profit

@revimfadli4666

3 ай бұрын

Instructions unclear; toxic characters happen to be female

How to write female characters? Simple. Treat them as people. The problem with a lot of modern media especially Disney is that they treat women as a totally different species incapable of being defeated, having any flaws or needing growth forgetting that women are humans too. We as humans aren’t invincible. We make mistakes. We have flaws but from those flaws we can grow and become better versions of ourselves. This is something most media especially Disney seems to forget. Just look at Rey, She Hulk, Mulan, Wendy, Captain Marvel, Batwoman, Galadriel and Velma. They made these characters to “empower” girls and women but really all they’re doing is setting up impossible expectations for these women. Meanwhile we have characters like Ahsoka, Natasha, Gwen, Jinx and Vi that show women that they can be strong and still be vulnerable. That they can make mistakes and grow from them. That they can ask for help when they need it

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Yep thats the problem & also the fact that their world & villains are boring & dumb.

@gumball2253

3 ай бұрын

she-hulk and captain marvel definitely have moments of vulnerability

@Achieme

3 ай бұрын

It's not just that modern media have this weird way of writing women as the yaaas queen she don't need no man, she strong and independent but also like spinning a narrative that Men (insinuating that all) are evil while down play men who aren't evil because they take their personal experience/issues and use it as a megaphone.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@gumball2253 No not really they are always in the right, never struggle & Get everything they want in the end no consequenses & their villains suck.

@LogicNG

3 ай бұрын

@@Achieme whoa that thing men have been doing to women throughout all of history? Damn don’t dish out what you can’t take I guess lmao

I swear that Pomni and Ragatha (TADC) work so damn well! They’re not like those female characters in cartoons who get mad and mean over bullshit reasons.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

i see that a lot with Modern female characters Like Teela & she hulk.

@Theweirdunicorn69

3 ай бұрын

Yeah, I hate characters who just get mad for no reason and it’s treated as “oh it’s just women ☕“

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@Theweirdunicorn69 yeah that is annoying how They get to act mean & Unlikeable for that very reason.

@AbimaelLopez-hz3qq

3 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252female characters from old movies are fine like the secret of nimph

@AbimaelLopez-hz3qq

3 ай бұрын

@@Theweirdunicorn69female characters from the secret of nimph are great

Ena is a well written female character, change my mind.

@rise.-mikey

3 ай бұрын

Can't change mind because that's a fact

@Dragon_named

3 ай бұрын

Finally! A man of culture!

@BrianGeller

3 ай бұрын

Agree

@sairentokir5060

3 ай бұрын

HEYLL YEAAA

@re-box1182

3 ай бұрын

This is a fact.

As a girl, thank u so much this is so real. There is nothing to overthink - just write a good character. Their gender isn’t a personality trait.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Yep been trying to say that forever People are too obsessed with Gender/race & politics & cannot break Free from that, its weird.

@emiliabaran6830

2 ай бұрын

THIS Edit: Also I love your Kai pfp 💕

@daranaqelforastero319

2 ай бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252I can actually agree with that, yeah you're right

@sugarzblossom8168

2 ай бұрын

You are right but even if the writers don't think about a character's gender too much audiences definitely will. Badly written female characters are only badly written because of their gender unlike badly written male characters to people. Even when they hardly if ever bring up their gender.

@daranaqelforastero319

2 ай бұрын

Hey btw, do you like Dragons Rising? (I do 🫠)

Ok, little personal story here about my experience writing female characters as a male. I wrote a story with a group who has a female leader (her name is sasha), and it was so stressful because it felt like i had a responsibility to absolutely nail her. I didn't wanna make her too strong or compitent or she'll be a marry sue. I can't make her too weak or im sexist. Can't make her too attractive or im another male writer perv. But it took me way too long to realise that... i just need to stop worrying and just enjoy writing her, and not be ashamed of it! This video just oozes quality, and it makes me feel better as a writer. Im not ashamed to write my hot headed yet very caring muscle mommy anymore.

@audreyharris7643

3 ай бұрын

Thats the spirit you go bro

@LogicNG

3 ай бұрын

That’s the ticket, writing comes from within

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

The attitude to writing these characters my friend is stop Caring what people think they will get offended over Everything nowadays its Not worth bending to the Knee to crybabies & letting Them control youre vision.

@sugarzblossom8168

3 ай бұрын

I never really think about people who will complain. My stories would probably be called woke but I don't care

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@sugarzblossom8168 Well you should adress criticism if you cannot do that like the Guy who made the video i Doubt hes going to be sucessful Because of that flaw.

i think frieren is like mob psycho in some way, they both look stoic and emotionless and is shown to be very powerful, but what makes them interesting is that they are more than those. they have their own struggles they deal with, and that mostly takes center in their character growth. frieren is someone with long lifespan which helped her to hone her abilities (she have lots of time) but she inevitably suffer from the fact that everything around her come and go, which just made her almost numb and have difficulty in getting attached to things and people, she just sees them as something/someone that will soon fade before her eyes. mob is someone gifted with really powerful psychic powers, but what he wanted was to have a normal life and with his power is tied to his emotions, he can't help but to force himself to not feel anything, otherwise he might burst. both of these characters won't be as relatable and interesting without these flaws.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

interesting parallel to draw between those two characters. Mob is also characterized by the fact that their psychic abilities are the ONLY thing they are really good at. Where most writers would probably turn Mob into a star student who uses their psychic brain waves to think better than his classmates, Mob acknowledges there's a difference between intelligence and psionic ability. Mob Psycho is not really about being a normal person as much as it is becoming a better more whole person. Where all of the villains rely on their psychic abilities to be special, Mob goes out of his comfort zone to pursue skills which make him a better person outside of psychic talent.

@Thesmus

3 ай бұрын

@@ScritRighter i do think mob just wanted to have a normal life, but i do agree that the show is also about mob becoming a better person

@Thesmus

3 ай бұрын

@@ScritRighter also honestly was thinking of one punch man first, but then realized mob psycho is probably a closer comparison, especially in terms of dealing with personal growth

@pandabanaan9208

2 ай бұрын

christ all this talk about frieren is gonna cause me to get a crunchyroll subscription

@gong-hl7fw

19 күн бұрын

​@@pandabanaan9208 so have you watched frieren

You make a good point about the creator of the Digital Circus not propping up Pomni as as great female lead but instead gives us a great show. That is the majour flag. Any show that spends half its marketing budget on "It has a strong female lead" or "it has a diverse cast" rather than advertising "The Story" has no story to speak of in the first place, and one is fully justified in prejeducely assuming that it is going to be crap.

@RK10701

3 ай бұрын

As much as I like to see female characters that aren’t weak, I do believe they should have flaws too

@StarlasAiko

3 ай бұрын

@@RK10701 There is such a thing as feminine strength and masculine strength. As far as I have seen, the strongest female character ever to come out of Holliwood is the lead character in "Secret of NIMH".

@PumpkinSwag

3 ай бұрын

@@StarlasAiko I'm so glad you brought up Mrs. Brisby from Secret of NIMH! She is able to show heroic traits to help both her family and the rats of Nimh while still being feminine and being a flawed character who can develop. She's a great example of how women don't have to "try to be men" just to be heroic. Dorothy from Wizard of Oz is another great example.

@sugarzblossom8168

3 ай бұрын

​@@StarlasAikopeople talk about feminine/masculine this or feminine/masculine that as being strength of weaknesses mere seconds after saying write a male character and make them a female or that write a character first and then give them a gender.

@StarlasAiko

3 ай бұрын

@@sugarzblossom8168 Sadly, that is true, and sadly, for many people that is the only way to prevent writing caricatures of men/women. It takes a lot more effort and understanding to be able to write men and women that are neither caricatures nor bland neuters.

To fair I do think Helluva boss does deserve some criticism on how it was written female characters.

@edgyelectrokinetic6761

3 ай бұрын

I'm with you here. Absolutely not a fan of how Stella was only used as a plot device to gaslight people into thinking Stolas did nothing wrong

@IsabellaMathew

3 ай бұрын

@@edgyelectrokinetic6761 exactly. That why don’t like her character. I think worse part about it that people accuse you of being sexist if you call it out.

@Faunadoodlez

3 ай бұрын

Yess

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@IsabellaMathew Sick of that nonsense People should have the Right to do that.

@goddessofchaos2679

3 ай бұрын

She was written that way to begin with yall just want to make up stuff for no reason

I treat my female characters as I treat all my other characters: as characters It doesn’t really matter their gender or race, what matters is how their character is written I’m sure lots of people have said this before though

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

too bad hollywood doesnt.

@Acro_YT

2 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 I will consume you

@bubblegumCrystal

2 ай бұрын

Yeah I agree

@pakuvang4775

Ай бұрын

Yeah, I do the exact same thing. It's their personality traits that make them who they are, not their gender.

9:24 😭 I think when writing females ppl don’t really realize its okay for things to get messy, they can self destruct, or get beaten up, theyre just characters who happen to be female 👍

I haven't seen your other videos about writing female characters (yet) but in my opinion Amphibia is another great example of writing strong female characters. You have three main characters, all teenage girls who grow into strong warriors, and throughout the series, it's NEVER treated as a "LET'S GO FEMINISM" statement. They're GOOD CHARACTERS who HAPPEN to be girls. They're flawed, relatable, and loveable, and that's why they're so adored by fans. They're given more focus on character growth while their ability to fight, while awesome to see, is more a part of the action.

@audreyharris7643

3 ай бұрын

Amphibia is great i should rewatch it

@Roxie_ET

3 ай бұрын

@@audreyharris7643 Yea! I've rewatched it recently to study its story writing (and to enjoy silly frog shenanigans). It's such a well thought out show.

@audreyharris7643

3 ай бұрын

@@Roxie_ET what did you think of the owl house or ghost and Molly McGee?

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@audreyharris7643 Meh thats what i say.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@audreyharris7643 Amphibia was good im glad it ended & didnt go on for Too long.

What makes a character good regardless of gender are their flaws. The media tries to make women empowered and this makes them practically perfect beings, and this becomes boring because the public wants to identify

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Yeah & they also try to appeal Only to women & say its not For men, which is weird Cause they say men should Like it but do everything To marginilize men from Ever liking it in the first place it weird & just sexist.

@mattd5240

2 ай бұрын

They've mastered the art of doublethink.​@elongatedmanforever1252

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252is The Legend of Korra still hot garbage ever since ATLA is a boys media show ruined by forced feminism for the sequel?

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@noahalcantar2431 Thats the issue they keep Trying to make boy brands Girl brands.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@mattd5240 And double the failure They made female leads Look unprofitable & thats Sad.

I agree with what you're saying, but people will get angry about male characters having feminine traits, they just usually call them gay

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

Because most of them are Cringe & are worst then Damsels in distress.

@suspiciousfigure3096

2 ай бұрын

Maybe. One pf my fav shows to watch and read about is Jojos, the author takes the concepts and traits of manliness from the era it was written in and brings it to light. The clothing they wear, although feminine, doesnt affect their character in any way. Doesnt make them any less manly. Or the way the story frames their bodies, poses, or the way they interact with one another. The characters are flawed in different ways, yet are so wonderfully human despite what you'd think about them at first glance.

@Kiralmao

2 ай бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252what

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@Kiralmao im just being honest.

@seekingabsolution1907

2 ай бұрын

​@@suspiciousfigure3096Araki loves his high fashion.

Step 1: Write story backbone. Step 2: Make character backbones. Step 3: Give the story flesh. Step 4: Give the character flesh via personality and backstory. Step 5: Interweave the story and characters together. Step 6: Give the story texture. Step 7: Give the characters skin. And it is at Step 7 where you can decide "B**** I will draw a WOMAN." At least that's how I write female characters anyway. The point is however, story should come first.

Physically strong women are definitely targeted more for no reason. "Girl failures" or however you name that trope seems to be pretty well liked. In general lower confident characters are easier to relate too, but people also don't seem to find these kinds of characters "threatening". If Aang and Korra's genders were reversed, there wouldnt be nearly as much hate for Korra I think. Maybe that's just cope, but I can already imagine people still finding Aang to be the same fun and sweet kid because of their more docile nature, while Korra goes from being Woke to a Himbo. timid men "just need to get strong", and strong women are just seen as wrong to the people who complain over them. The show's writing isnt the best thing ever, but Korra as a character is so great.It's just harder to relate to a confident character. Generally we aspire to be the more confident ones but relate to the timid. I think all of these things bubbly over into people saying Korra is a bad charcter or a Mary Sue when she wears her flaws just as boldly as aang.

@boomgirlbucko

3 ай бұрын

I guess the haters just blocked out the part where Korra literally destroyed the ancient air bending training device because she was too impatient to learn it peacefully. There's her flaw right there, in season 1. And she was too reckless cuz she just went out in public and started playing that bending sport.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@boomgirlbucko Does she get called out for it though?? Rarely ever & she Treats her mentor tenzin terribly.

@boomgirlbucko

3 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 That's because Tenzin is a pacifist. That's his flaw that he doesn't discipline her well enough.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

The problem i have with korra is From the very beginning she acts obnoxious saying "im the avatar deal with it" the difference of male Characters & strong female Characters is the male Characters dont start off as badass, awesome & Great, they grow & develope Over time & they endear You to them theres no aggressive push to prove Some point to the auduence like with characters like korra rey or captain marvel, korra Has flaws yes but id say too Much of them & rarely any Redeeming qualities & when they try to do that in later seasons it feels Forced & it makes it worse That korra rarely gets consequenses For her actions, for example she got her bending Taken away just to get it back instantly also id disagree if korra were a guy there would definetly be Criticism.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@boomgirlbucko Hard to do that if youre student isnt really willing To learn & acts arrogant korra does have flaws & isnt a mary sue but is just not a good Character & rarely Learns from her mistakes.

I think a big problem with the conversation about good female characters is that people who care a lot about female representation place too much stock on whether a female character defies gender norms. If she has little personality or no significant flaws, but she runs her own company or beats up men, then she gets a free pass. But if she is likeable, funny, and well-developed, but she has to be rescued by a man, she falls in love with a man, or likes fashion, then she gets written off as holding women back. So it becomes less a conversation of how well her writing serves the story and more about how much she affirms the viewer's worldview. Kind of ties in to the idea of women being seen as representing "all women" even though that should almost never be the case because women are varied and have a wide array of worldviews. Just because your views and experiences may be informed by the fact that you're a woman instead of a man, doesn't mean that they will be the same as every other woman's. Not saying we shouldn't have "girlboss" or "action girl" characters. We should. I'm just saying that they don't ALL need to be that way, nor are their writers owed praise for making them that way.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Thats my complete issue these Woke people are holding women From being characters & just Want them to be reprsentive Of a monolith.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Thats my issue 100% with Why these characters are bad.

@morningglory.2

2 ай бұрын

Agreed! I think your comment encapsulates why it’s so important to have a variety of female representation- so all kinds of woman with all kinds of flaws, core beliefs, desires and circumstances can have some time in the limelight. Feminine women and masculine women should be allowed to exist in the same story and boost each others existence, not conflict.

The reason male characters are not judged the same way female characters - or the perception that such is true - requires one to step back and look at the bigger picture. For starters, what genre is this discussion usually attached to? Action. Yes, there are variations spanning Sci-Fi, Fantasy, Espionage, etc., but they usually come down to resolving conflict through fighting, hence the general banner is Action. As such, we must recognize that the Action genre usually features men as the leads, because men are, historically, more likely to be fighters. This is in contrast with the Romance genre, where leads are more often female. The significance here is that since males are usually Action leads, seeing them as such is the standard. Female action leads are not as common, and thus are considered "different" by default. Being different, they will naturally be held up to scrutiny. Imagine that you have a machine which has used the same parts to serve the same function for years. Every so often, though, salesmen come along with new parts you can install that will make the machine run just as well or even better. If you install them, you'll be paying very close attention to how those pieces affect the machine's operation, and if something goes wrong, you're probably going to blame the new piece first. That's what we're dealing with here. Female characters are the proverbial new pieces in the machine that is the Action genre, which means they are going to be scrutinized, whether it's by the Leftist who thinks she's oversexualized or the Rightist who thinks she's a Mary Sue. It may not be fair, but I do think that is what we're observing. But of course, even though you say that you can't think of any male characters who get critiqued the way female characters do, that doesn't mean there are none. I'm sure that, at some point, you've heard somebody say that Superman is boring because he's too powerful and too alien/godlike to be relatable. Many people believe it (betraying the fact that they've never read a single Superman comic in their lives), and call Superman a bad character for it. Indeed, Superman was held to a very high standard in the recent films, with critiques running from how he's too violent to, I kid you not, the fact that he doesn't smile enough. People hates this version of Superman until Henry Cavill stood up for fans in interviews, which got them to shift from "he's a bad Superman" to "he's a good Superman stuck with bad scripts". Then we have Edward Cullen from the Twilight books. Sure, the female lead Bella was also critiqued for being bland, but Edward got it just as bad. Many noticed how he had a lot of very disturbing traits which made him look downright abusive on an emotional (and later physical) level, yet these traits were romanticized. That's on top of how he functions as a vampire. Jacob also got it bad for his various actions in later books, especially his actions towards Bella's newborn daughter which read as...just plain gross. Really, the critique of male characters in the Romance genre being either flat or abusive is a fairly common one. Lest I forget, we also have James Cameron's Avatar, in which protagonist Jake Sully is frequently lambasted by fans for not just being bland, but also for not even trying to fulfill the task he was assigned to do. He was sent to negotiate some kind of truce between the Humans and the Na'vi, then decided on his own that such a truce was possible, which led to all kinds of death and destruction. The man has all kinds of blood on his hands, and he's supposed to be the hero who made the right call. Very few people believe he is. I could go on, but this comment is long enough. I just hope what I've written down makes sense. I, naturally, speak as an author who has written female characters as well.

@tavig7410

3 ай бұрын

You put my thoughts into words perfectly, thank you!!

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Male characters are judged a lot Just for different reasons because They dont have "social ills" attached To them, eric july explained this in his videos.

@angelcrush3320

3 ай бұрын

you basicaly put into words, what doesn't make any sense about his critique. a well thought out commen!

@zacharybosley1935

2 ай бұрын

Here's the thing There's a laundry list of dude characters who have their flaws and shortcomings, and pretty archetypally those are treated as just shitty characters in a vacuum. The trend for female characters in a nontraditional role is that they have to hit their notes perfectly, or the slavering masses will inevitably use those nontraditional women as an excuse to claim that stories should not attempt to fit women in nontraditional roles. The Good Strong female characters get ignored, the Bad ones are used to prove thay women should stay in their lane.

@freelancerthe2561

2 ай бұрын

@@zacharybosley1935 Action movies have a pretty long history of women who are more macho then the macho men they work with. This is a fine line to walk, because, outside of satire, super machomen are practically insufferable by design. You have to round them out a bit, to align them with the audience. Case in point, the whole cast of Predator are the manliest men to have ever men'd. They're unstoppable warriors with a touch of arrogance. But they all have quirks that make them human, without making them look weak. This was carefully crafted so the audience at least likes them a little bit, so when Predator starts taking them out, we both care that they're dying, AND realize the how big of a threat it is. Michelle Rodriguez made a whole career out of being the most macho person in the room. And the "you hit like a girl" jokes land harder when a women is saying it. The reason this works is that you can easily imagine this as a byproduct of how soldiers tease each other. And how being an easy target early on, she is more motivated to prove herself, presumably has at some point, and knows how to S*&$ talk with the best of them. However.... depending on the movie, how the audience reads this boils down to the attitude displayed and the implied context. And its hard to explain, because the difference is subtle. If its implied just one or to guys are being idiots, then its just those guys being idiots. If its implied all men treat them this way, then its insulting all men. ...or it could just be the writers don't know how to S*&$ talk, so the characters all fail at it.

Step one: write a character. Step two: when done, give it female pronouns. Step three: you just wrote a female.

@ThoronSage

4 күн бұрын

Bro solved the Navier-Stokes problem

@JackRook

3 күн бұрын

@@ThoronSage haha, gender fluid

As a writer I feel that female characters fall into a weird place since there is always going to be someone critizicing them just because they are female. Is she a strong character? Too woke. Is she a bad person? That only works with male characters. Is she sexy? You are objectifying her! Is she ugly? Why would you do that, everyone is beautiful! You are always too woke or too misogynistic or your character its not apreciated enough. So, just write your female characters as characters! It doesnt matter if they are sexy, or femenine, or masculine or bad people, just write a good character that is a female! For example, all my main girls are a mess! The protagonist is a chronical validation seeker to the point of backstabbing the people she loves, other one is an ex teen drug addict and the last one is the literal boss of a terrorist group lol

@s0ulcode

3 ай бұрын

Honestly I think you and OP hit the nail on the head. I think male characters that don’t overlap with any kind of minority are considered the default, and anything else is either automatically pandering, or a representation which must be Perfect™️ or it gives everyone a bad name. It gets to the point that while no one is saying “only write white straight men” lots of people are complaining about getting anything else. Are these characters badly written or do their critics just not like women, yk?

@mariaandcrobat

3 ай бұрын

@@s0ulcode I don't think they just hate women, they just hate anything that is not a straight white man or what they think the default should be. But yeah, OP said it perfectly

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@s0ulcode Thats untrue they arent The default & saying they Dont like women is a lazy unintelligent arguement There are millions of People with their own complex reasons of Why female characters Dont work for them to Just say "its sexism" is just lazy.

@s0ulcode

3 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 sweetheart I see you fighting for your life in other comments just on this video, it’s okay that you’re embarrassed

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@mariaandcrobat where did you get that from?? because thats bs People criticize & dislike male Characters just Like female characters, nobody is saying female characters Shouldnt exist thats a strawman.

Alrighty, I enjoy the edit and music choices here as well as the examples you brought here and why people find certain tropes annoying that were not visible to the eye because people have enjoyed the content they consumed. I do remember that I never really had a favorite female character as a child, I honestly don't know why but maybe it's mainly because of the fact we don't get to see more of side characters who are girls to have their time to shine nor do they have flaws in which you can resonate with the character. It's really weird- I do remember that I did liked Sandy Cheeks, Winnie Wanna or Bubbles from Powerpuff girls but not to the point I would call the characters all time favorites. That's until My Little Pony friendship is magic, I think maybe that's why this show also succeeded as a whole. Because these characters have quirks and flaws that a lot of people could resonate with. There is even a very feminine character, who genuinely became a favorite of mine because she's funny and had a lot of growth to her character over the course of this show. I wish people can just do what you said in this video and just write a character without worrying too much about the gender.

I hate when a bad take gets to me first.... before I see a female character first hand. Then it becomes a task to "unsee" the bad take.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

So this video then??

The author of Chainsaw Man said it best when he writes female characters he doesn't write them as women. He writes them as "CHARACTERS".

@ScritRighter

2 ай бұрын

Oh he most definitely writes them as women. And women he is particularly attracted to from a fetish standpoint. He has gone on record saying as much.

@EG.Studios

2 ай бұрын

Right. What I mean is I remember in an interview he made the female characters more proactive in the story compared to previous Shonen manga.@@ScritRighter

@LotsOfToubleUsuallySerious

20 күн бұрын

​@@ScritRighterwhat is this? I don't know anything about Chainsaw Man, didn't watch it either, but i'd like to know

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

​@@ScritRighterand yet somehow they manage to be some of the better written women in fiction right now. Funny how being attractive doesn't devalue them when they're actually written as interesting characters you want to watch. Most of the women in CSM are largely extremely capable and in charge of almost any situation they're in, and when they aren't it's for a good character reason. But beyond that, they're written as believable, and on an even playing field with the men in the series. They're also sexually independent, (Himeno, Makima, Reze, Quanxi, ect.) which is EXTREMELY IMPORTANT for writing good women in a series with any degree of sex or sex adjacent material at all. They aren't sexless, and they aren't sex objects, they're human with human needs and desires and the agency to explore that. CSM author is actually rather good at that as a whole. The text itself is explicit about how sexiness due to superficial things is boring. In the authors mind, women in CSM HAD to be good characters you enjoyed to be sexy in the first place, and by that point they're valuable, integral parts of the story.. written like real human beings with real motivations, agency and desires. This isn't a universal one size fits all tactic to writing good women in fiction, but it's an interesting and valuable case study about how you can write women well and still have them be explicitly hot. Sometimes the idea that women can't be sexualized in fiction without losing all their value as characters borders on infantilization, and it really isn't the case at all.

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

sorry for the literal novel but this is stuff I think about a lot and Chainsaw Man is such a great jumping off point for these discussions.

I just write my female characters as human beings with goals, emotions, dislikes, and basic human logic. It's actually easier than I thought it would be, I'm so confused how badly women are often written.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

Its mostly because of politics.

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252it's mostly because of people overcorrecting from one sexist extreme to another, less sexist but equally boring extreme. It's an easy, but amateur mistake to make.

@elongatedmanforever1252

17 күн бұрын

@@Electric0eye I would argue the Way men are portrayed in modern media nowadays is far more sexist.

"everyone can agree [yes men] are annoying, changing their personality to appease who they're speaking too." *Shows persona*. You're so real for that 😂 being everyone's yes men to advance their social links sucks lol. Killing a sense of personality from the MC

@BelBelle468

3 ай бұрын

Persona 4-5 feels like you have to teach everyone what to do. P3 feels like you’re in enabler “yes man” to everyone. But P3 tends to be better cuz it’s up to the person you’re spending time with to become a better person without player input. And the lack of “personality” is part of the mc’s whole shtick. Essentially going from a person who’s passive and apathetic, to someone who does care. Them being an enabler is a “personality” all on their own. But the game itself wants the player character to have a distinct “personality” AND be a player character. Which doesn’t work.

@jumpingmoose5554

3 ай бұрын

@@BelBelle468 yeah it definitely doesn't work, I'd rather persona just lean further into the main characters having their own personalities. It doesn't take away from the player being able to make decisions or role play.

@exyzt9877

2 ай бұрын

What's even worse is just how incongruent this design is with the main themes of the games. The main thematic throughline in the Persona series is the Formation of Identity and the way other people can influence it. That's the reason behind a lot of the gameplay design choices in modern persona games. The reason Wildcard personas work the way they do and can change at will while the rest of the party (who already have mostly fully formed identities) have their personas mostly set in stone. And yet it never REALLY feels like the main character's identity is really... forming, the way the gameplay tries to imply it is. Makoto's story implies he's found value in his life, but a lot of the social links have him be so passive and just... there, that by the end, it doesn't really... FEEL like it.

I have more to add to this idea though, how do you write a female character? You can start by answering the following questions. Have you thought about your storys theme? If so, construct your female character to have a prespective on this theme. And decide what feminine traits will fit the theme, and witch feminine traits wont. There is also trying to find appeal in your female character after you discover what you want to do with her. What personality does she have? Where does she sit on the enneagram? How does she suport the narrative? Does she have dimensions that change her throughout the story? How does her change support the theme? Is the arch still satisfactory on the surface?

Thank you so much for mentioning how male essayists often use femininity as a scale for how well female characters are written. As a genderless female, it bothers me, even when used on male characters. The problem is with the building blocks of writing, not gender roles being too lax. Why are you talking about X not wanting to be a mom when she's just not compelling?? It's the same with "ugly" female character design: the answer isn't sexier females, but more attractive designs. Pomni, Sonic & Mario have attractive designs; does that mean they're hot? No (for normal folks). I just fear that this'll misguide novice writers into putting their characters into boxes. I think gender identity & expression is an interesting avenue to explore your OCs, especially when you're dealing with A.I., aliens, gods, humans who've been isolated for decades, etc. P.S.: It's so weird seeing my first comment in the intro =w=... But ty!

@JazzSicaa

3 ай бұрын

THIS!! I'm just so fucking tired of people thinking a female character is only good if they are "more feminine" or something like this, and if the character doesn't fit society's norm of "being feminine" the character is automaticaly not well written. We women are people too, we are different from each other and not some kind of NPC.

@sugarzblossom8168

3 ай бұрын

I hate it when people say she might as well just be a man. What happened with writing characters first?

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@JazzSicaa The problem is when Youre trying to make Every woman strong super intelligent & Brave, Thats just not realistic & also its Sexist cause they Dont have any negative Traits or flaws, but in Most of these quote On quote "woke shows" its always the men Portayed as inept Or villainous that Have them while Vice versa they have None.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@sugarzblossom8168 the people arent writing Them as characters just Social justice vehicles To say they are as strong as men & people cant stand it.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

The issue is when people Make female characters 1-thing like making them all act like men, or all be Physically unnatractive & act rude & mean its Really the lack of Personality & just Having unnappealing Behavior & looks.

19:30 NAWH CUZ THE TIKTOK IN THE BACKGROUND IS CRIMINAL 💀

As a small writer I admire the people who can write such amazing stories and characters. I aspire to be like them.

@jonathanspalding6973

2 ай бұрын

Same. I've been trying my hand at writing a book, and it is tough. One thing that has helped me is knowing my diverse group of friends. It's almost as if I use what I know about them to talk to myself through a sock puppet comprised of different parts of different friends.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

So do i.

i'm writing a character who is a girl, brown, and queer but who is just a normal person in an abnormal situation trying to make the best of her situation and im satisfied with her.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

You can right youre character Anyway you want, i just wouldnt Lead with being a certain race Or certain sexuality or gender.

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252these can be valuable traits, or inconsequential ones. But that aside I think you missed what they were saying

@elongatedmanforever1252

17 күн бұрын

@@Electric0eye The issue is when people Lead with stuff like race/gender It usually ends up being bad 97% of the time, mostly because It's mostly not to just create a good character but to check Off a box or pander to someone.

im a person who was assigned female at birth, and while i no longer identify as female myself, i still felt very seen by this video based on the experiences i made while i did identify as a woman. great video, thank you! im also an aspiring writer, and i really appreciate you and this video.

Not gonna lie to you, when this popped up in my feed, and the first thing I heard when I clicked on it was a man's voice, my first instinct was "Hooboy, here we go again then..." As a writer myself, I've had way too many recommendations for Endymion and Critical Drinker rants to not get an automatic sinking feeling every time I see a 'Writing female characters' video. But.. wow! What a pleasant surprise you turned out to be, sir. THIS is what we need way more of on KZread; insightful, balanced essays that explore all sides of the arguments, instead of just defaulting to the "Ewww, look at all the Woke, the Woke is everywhere, and it's getting Diversity all over my precious media shoes!" I am now subscribed, and looking forward to hearing more from you.

The 1st step on "learning from mistakes" is to first accept that you made a mistake. Open-minded is one of the positive traits a writer should have to create a compelling stories. It means to know what works and what's not.

Episode 2 of Amazing Digital Circus just came out. Can confirm it has pretty well written female characters. Also can we just appreciate how Pomni expressed all those great messages bout mental health

A lot of people who complain wouldn't care about bad female characters if they served as fanservice.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

That's a pretty good point tbh. The people who complain about it are not the same people complaining about characters like Captain Marvel or Korra. But we see plenty of terrible harem anime with the most poorly written female characters you can imagine. Or old movies where it's pretty clear the only purpose a certain female character serves is to be the love interest despite there being 0 romantic chemistry between them. It's bad writing, but those same people don't ever seem to call that stuff out so long as the woman is attractive to them. If anything, it offends them more when the woman is unattractive than it does when the woman is boring.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Thats somewhat true but also False, because people would Get annoyed with the lack Of depth & see it as a problem female characters can be Good characters & fan Service i dont know why They have to be mutual Exclusive its not like That with male characters.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

@@ScritRighter Thats because woke modern Day writers usually make the Character ugly not just Physically but personality Wise too making them insufferable nobody Wants that.

@thetruestar6348

2 ай бұрын

That’s just a bs argument

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@thetruestar6348 My point exactly.

Actually, one of the reasons korra failed us as a character is because she was constantly failing to grow up, and learn from her mistakes. All the way to the end of the show. But also they tried to expand the magic system by turning characters into big super monsters. Instead of make a spirit channeling system of some sort. They ruined the shows continuity by having the grand Finale bring in a mecha. That shoots Lazers.

@drfoto2673

3 ай бұрын

I think the main issue with Korra is that she has a lot of really grating and unlikeable traits to her character. That, combined with the writing issues of the entire show (which drastically lowers the amount of leeway people are willing to give any character) and her being the face of the show, lets her take a lot of the heat. Both stuff that is deserved, but also stuff that really should be directed elsewhere. Many of the characters in Korra were bad, but most of them at least had some redeeming positive qualities that made them more likeable.

@eternaldarkbrin

3 ай бұрын

@@drfoto2673 "Likable" should not be the goal, instead, when there is an unlikeable trait in a character, this should be an opportunity for them to grow in a thematical or otherwise interesting way. a good example is Soak's sexism. but when the character stays the same as if they only have one dimension. we start to question in our heads as the audience, what the point of the character is even supposed to be. can they be unlikeable? sure, but are they unlikeable with purpose? if not, back to the drawing board.

bro omfg finally a male skylar white defender thats so awesome

How to write female characters: Step 1: Make a character, that is female. Step 2: Treat them the same as the male characters. Note: If you want to make a plot point about a male, or female characters gender, make sure that it isn’t isolating the characters personality and how they’d react to the things related to their gender. I.e. if a character that is emotional, sensitive, and likes soapy things like poetry, and that character is also male, and they experience societal pressures to not act that way, don’t erase those parts of their personality. They are still a character, and they should have an actual, REAL reaction to the topic of their gender however you want to represent it. Make sure to justify it. For example, the male character could be sad, and sensitive because he’s being excluded from everything because he isn’t “manly” and he reacts to the gendered thing with insecurity, and hides his feelings from others. You can use this logic for a FEMALE character, like someone who’s rambunctious, strong, hotheaded, who’s also female, make sure to EMPATHIZE with your character, and make sure to keep those traits as reasoning for her reaction to someone saying it’s “unladylike” to like, I don’t know, playing video games or something. (I’m basing this on dumb stereotypes that are REALLY outdated.)

I’m working on making my own stories, and I wanna make characters that people can love and appreciate. I wanna make good characters, regardless of gender, race, sexuality, etc. I’m female myself, and I appreciate characters that I can relate to. Not in terms of gender, but personality. I might give Frieren a try, it sounds interesting. And the character sounds very interesting and like I character I can relate to.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

so do i, i want to make Something of quality & To be very compelling & possibly make a Animation of it.

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​​@@elongatedmanforever1252how do I make a great but simplistic female protagonist that isn't the next Rey Palpatine, Velma, Korra, She Hulk, and Captain Marvel

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@noahalcantar2431 Easy make a good character Have them be interesting & have them go through adversity that is human & not gender/politically Based, also make them likeable.

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​​@@elongatedmanforever1252 can an jerk with a heart of gold female character be done correctly if it's relatable

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​@@elongatedmanforever1252If I were to make a good and likeable simplistic female protagonist, I would just give her big eyes, line mouth, no nose, and she wears feminine clothing sometimes similar to anime and 2000s Western cartoon female characters

4:04 Class of '09 mentioned, instant subscribe! 🔥🔥🔥

TL;DR Write women as normal people, not better than men or worse than men.

The best female character for me is "The boss" from Metal Gear Solid 3

The problem I think a lot of people take with characters like Rei in Star Wars, Captain Marvel, or Mulan in the Disney remake is not that they're female or that they're powerful or any of that. It's not sexism. It's the fact that they're basically flawless Mary Sue/Gary Stu type characters with very few defining character traits, akin to Kirito or any number of other shallow self-insert protagonists. Your sex/gender does play a role in who you are but it's not your defining character trait. A lot of the "strong female lead" characters, especially in Hollywood, have little to no flaws and are propped up on a pedestal by virtue of nothing but their sex. That's why people have a problem with them. It happens with male characters too, but I've yet to see a director or lead writer talk about, let alone make a big deal of them having a "strong male lead".

@zacharybosley1935

2 ай бұрын

Wasn't Rei's incompetence half the reason everything went south in The Last Jedi? Was she really a Mary Sue if even Luke, a character known for seeing the good in everyone, refused to train her?

@765craven4

2 ай бұрын

@@zacharybosley1935 I can't say having only seen Force Awakens, but basically anybody I know who has seen the other movies of the trilogy, even those with more positive opinions of them, tend to think Rei was at best a poorly written character. And from my understanding Luke's refusal to train her has more to do with his own personal trauma than any issues of character that she had, but again, I haven't seen the movie. And regardless of the reason, if the narrative frames Luke's decision to not train her as bad, then Rei still falls into the category of Mary Sue since it means anybody within the narrative with a poor opinion of her could be argued to have an unfair bias against her, which is one of the defining characteristics of a Mary Sue. And Rei is just a commonly cited example of a Mary Sue that I used and isn't super necessary for the argument here regardless, as other characters used are fine examples of the issue at play here. One I didn't even bring up is Captain Marvel, who is a good example of basically every issue with "Girl Boss Feminism" and how it makes "Strong Female Leads" look like a bad joke.

@zacharybosley1935

2 ай бұрын

@@765craven4 Captain Marvel's such a massive failure that The Marvel's Major conflict revolves around an antagonist she created on accident. Its not very Mary-Sue-like behavior to fuck up That Badly.

@765craven4

2 ай бұрын

@@zacharybosley1935 I don't think you understand what a Mary-Sue is. Things happening beyond their control that could retroactively be considered a mistake does not make them not a Mary Sue. Any flaw a Mary Sue has is a fluke that doesn't come up more than once or is actually a positive trait that someone else turns into a negative. A villain coming out of the shadows because of the actions of a Mary Sue does not make them not a Mary Sue.

@seekingabsolution1907

2 ай бұрын

I disagree. Rey at least is very very flawed. She's far too confident in TLJ, borderline naive in fact and she pays for it by getting tortured, fails to get Kylo on her side and then runs away with her tail between her legs. TRS was another matter, and I didn't watch it. I did watch TLJ though and my problems with that film were not that Rey was overly flawless, it was that her story arc with Luke didn't have time to breath.

Pomni I don't want to alarm you but there's a elf grandma right behind you OH NO POMNI RUN SHE THINKS YOUR A DEMON

I'm glad your video exist. It's good to know, that I wasn't the only one weirded out by those critics critizing female characters on weird stereotypes and because they're female. I'm above gender (before I came out as nb too) so it's natural to judge people aside their gender.

@morningglory.2

2 ай бұрын

Ok I’m a girl but you are actually so real for saying you’re “above gender” lmao. Never once heard someone phrase it like that but it’s hilarious, love it.

@Absbor

2 ай бұрын

@@morningglory.2 girl, everyone can be above gender. don't let your dreams stay dreams.

I don't get how people have problems with this. Just write a good character.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

It's not really that simple.

Extremely interesting and well explained perspective! I agree with a lot, mainly that people need to just stand on business and have more belief in what they enjoy to create in their characters. Creation from the heart is one of the most important tools imo

I'm a female writer. I've been known to give female characters more flaws in fan works if I think they're too perfect in the narrative, allowing them to fail so they can have an arc. I've yet to have anyone complain to me that I made the character I write for too imperfect and flawed. If anything, I made her human and that makes her more likable and relatable. I don't get how "strong" came to mean emotionless or perfect. I don't like perfection. I like flawed characters learning to overcome their flaws.

As an aspiring animator planning to make a web series with one of the protagonists being female, this video really helped, thanks dude

I just saw this and I gotta say: How to write a female character? Simple. Let me show you all the female characters on Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood. They’re all PEOPLE and SO WELL MADE. They’re SUPERIOR 💜 Anyways… Olivier Armstrong & Izumi Curtis my goddesses 🛐

I think it's also important to acknowledge that writing a good female character does not mean you cannot incorporate the fact that they are female into your story, so long as they aren't specifically defined by their gender identity. For example, Class of '09 is a visual novel heavily focused around critiquing the oversexualisation of adolescent women in our society, by putting the player into the shoes of somebody who experiences the suffrage caused by these issues directly. As such, the protagonist-- Nichole-- would not be able to function the way she's written if she was not female. However, her characterization has nuance outside of her gender identity. Class of '09 is as well about sticking to your beliefs even if they aren't the societal norm, thus Nichole is portrayed as progressive and firm in her morals. And Class of '09 is equally about how taking revenge on people can cause harm no matter who may be in the moral light, ergo Nichole is a character who oftentimes manipulates those that treat her poorly and must face the consequences that come from said choices. The game's narratival depth allows Nichole to be a great female lead, while allowing her to excell as a character in ways not correlated to her gender.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

the problem i have with those Kinds of stories is they are Usually 1-sided.

This was such a great video discussion video with great points I never knew how to word, now I gotta watch your other videos! *subscribes* c:

Step 1: make a well fleshed out character Step 2: make them female That is it… in a really dumb and quick extent

I haven’t read much of your story yet but I kid you not I got chills on the first couple of lines😂 it’s great so far

A compelling argument for a simple conclusion, love it!

The criticism of Female characters, especially modern "strong female characters" especially when it comes to putting men in their place, was built based on how those female characters were presented to be perfect in every sense while putting the male characters down for their flaws. It's simply the old repetitive argument that Mary Sue's don't work, especially Mary Sue's who degrade male characters because of their flaws and simply for existing (hence why they blame feminists and to be fair it's the toxic far left that are comfortable in presenting men in a degrading manner). Most of those KZread channels you presented say this. Still, the question is whether they state this as genuine fans of the art they're criticizing as audiences (and in turn prosumers) or are they just grifting while presenting understandable arguments and criticism for the sake of cash.

@audreyharris7643

3 ай бұрын

That's the question Id say both depending on who your talking about

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@audreyharris7643 Both ?? meh i dont think so.

@audreyharris7643

2 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 why is that

Advice for future writers: write your characters as if they were a real person.

I completely agree with you. When I become the writer I’ve always wanted to be, I will remember to write from the heart while making characters that are likable but also relatable. 🙂

3:09 People's different interpretations of anything, especially another's intent, is really important. Most of the time, when people interpret things differently, they immediately go to hostile/defensive mode, and fight over infinitessimal things that don't matter and that the origin person of that thing didn't mean anything by (that might be confusingly worded). It is vital that, rather than fighting, we all connect and peacefully share our views and be HUMBLE and accept Truth when we see it in others' views, even if it contradicts our first interpretation of the same thing. I have done this multiple times, where I was wrong and someone corrected me, and even though the correction embarrassed me, I saw that they were right and followed their correction in humility. If everyone does this, we would literally have world peace.

How do i keep getting in? well you see there's this KZread channel that shows how to break or unlock certain locks.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

The ultimate key: A masterlock

11:06 it does but not in the way people think. It's the issue where producers/showrunners/execs feel like they have to run such things by a board/panel/etc to make them as accurate/marketable/inoffensive as possible, but with a dozen or so people with different opinions/messages they'd like to push/etc having a hand in the writing and no leading 'voice' per-say it ends up being disjointed and feels disingenuous as a result.

I KID YOU NOT I WAS PLAYING THIS VIDEO on my tv and when you said that the story may not resonate with everyone I had to search for my phone and subscribe! Let’s gooooo! Basest response.

@brainthebrian3690

Ай бұрын

😐

@noeactually

Ай бұрын

@@brainthebrian3690I know I know… my standards on content creation are bare minimum 😭

facts spoken at 17:00, i dislike certain media with female leads because its all this perfect female character who can do no worng. thats not a story thats a fantasy i dont write and i have no experience but when i get that far i hope i dont make this mistake

Here's my take about the strong female character or girl boss trope. What people dislike about them is that they're written what females or sometimes males have an idea what a male character is try to replicate it in a poor way and make them unlikable. It would be interesting if they make them vulnerable or show flaws you and others talk about. Sometimes they also have this narrative of she don't need no man or portray men as evil, sexist, rapist pigs while disregarding men who aren't those things and having a shitty arrogant attitude. You can call me whatever but I don't wanna hear about how evil these groups of people are while ignoring others who don't share the same sentiment. I understand what you're saying about male characters not needing a list of how poorly written they are but men do get criticized for how they're poorly written. Finn from starwars, Mark from Korra, MCU Hulk is trash now, Kang,Hell people myself included disliked Tom holland Spider-Man for being written as iron boy even having shit handed to him by Tony. comic fans don't like how Jason Todd is written going back and forth with Batman and using guns, people didnt like superman from man of steel, Vegeta fans hate that Goku stole his kill when vegeta was whooping frieza's ass. People have issues with how Goku is written sometimes. Jotaro from JoJo pt3 gets criticized for being a Gary sue, One of my favorite TV shows Ben 10 there are moments that fans criticized Ben's character being arrogant, having an ego and down right insensitive.

@cryo9017

3 ай бұрын

You right

@irinaiturri

2 ай бұрын

the problem is when a bad written female character in non-stereotipically female genres happens some people blames her in a way that implies that writing female characters for that genre or subgenre are a bad idea per se, instead of only individualizing that bad characters like is made for bad-written male characters

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

Yeah thats annoying because These stories are generalizing All men as bad, when only a Few are & act like women Cannot be evil which is just Delusional.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

@@irinaiturri Because it usually is that Characters fault, strong female Characters inherently try to Break gender roles & nobody Cares about that.

@irinaiturri

2 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 you seem to care a lot about this

As one of the people that finished LoK when it came out, she is one of my favourite female characters ever. I love everything about her arc and what was achieved with her under such horrible constraints was so f*cking impressive. I gave up on the avatar fandom completely after the hate crowd that wouldn't shut up at the time, but now, with more people giving it a chance, I'm able to engage with interesting and more positive content from other fans of the series and it's so much fun

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

Korra is overrated

i'm so glad this video popped up. i'm writing a book too with twin sisters going on two life changing paths, and this perfectly explains why people hate female leads... deep rooted insecurities. i wish you luck in your journey👍🏿

This is so helpful . As someone who is a beginner artist and writer I have trouble writing a GOOD female because I'm scared if I do something wrong and people hate it😂

Question: Is it possible to have a woman in a story similar to berserk or is it impossible to be done in this age?

@riceyboi5215

3 ай бұрын

you mean they get raped by a horse?

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

It's possible to have a woman in any story. And I know there are a lot of people who are apalled by Berserk and the things which happen in it because it is a very dark story, but I personally disagree with those people. I would say handle those topics with care.

@infiniwaffle1214

3 ай бұрын

Check out Claymore. Lots of badass women fighting demons

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

​@@riceyboi5215 Wut now??

@michi4066

2 ай бұрын

Blue Eye Samurai

I’m a trans ftm and I’ve been obsessed with men and masculine characters. Which reflects in my writing. And I’ve been stuck just making mostly making masc characters. My friend has been giving me heat for it. And honestly it’s a struggle, since I do know what it’s like to be a woman. And mostly grew up with women. But honestly each time I try to make a woman/fem presenting character it feels like I’m pandering, and I hate it. And hate myself. Because I don’t want to make it seem that way. The advice given in this video was useful though. 😊

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

Keep at it! A lot goes into writing a good character and experience with being the same gender as them can only take you so far. Every artist has weaknesses. So long as you're curious, you'll improve in your weaker areas, count on it.

My favorite female characters are from Murder drones. I love all the female characters from that show. They are written great in my opinion.

16:02 oh, buddy, you just hit the nail on the head perfectly. Two episodes in, and people are complaining that a character from TADC was "ruined" because the portrayal didn't match what certain fans wanted. Granted, the character in question is Jax, one of the male characters of the show, but given the full extent of the topic of the video, that doesn't entirely matter

Step 1: Talk to women. Mom, sister, coworkers, classmates, girlfriend that is real. Talk to them and get to know each other. Step 2: Use as inspiration to write female characters, specifically their wants, needs, fears and other such querks necessary for the story. Step 3: Establish a challenge or goal your character wants to achieve or a status quo they want to maintain. Usually your character is expected to learn, grow and change compared to the start of the story. Step 4: Profit

Hey the first chapter of your book is bad and you should feel bad about it 1) Try not to make your fantasy names sound like stroke vocalizations 2) You start in the middle of the action (good) only to go on a tangent about the protag's age, face, and "red-gold eyes", followed by flashbacks about his mother (bad) 3) Grimaces can't be cynical, and find better word choice so I don't have to think about a 10 year old having "unsavory thoughts" 4) Don't start sentences with a proposition. 5) Avoid expositing what the character is feeling when you could imply characterization through their actions. Having Dreiki jump in to save the bat while revealing at a later point his heritage and the racial dynamics of the setting might strengthen the scene and recontextualize his actions, without interrupting the action to explain to the audience the exact reasoning for Dreiki's initial decision. Anyway video itself was pretty good, just found it funny when you said you're critiquing from a place of expertise. You should avoid turning yourself into an authoritative source of critique unless you have genuine reason to be considered an authority (as in, you are a published and preferably successful author). That claim wasn't even necessary. Critique is made valid via its accuracy, not by the qualifications of its source.

@audreyharris7643

2 ай бұрын

Damn

Thank you. I’m feeling less bad about how bland and weak and dragged around by everything happening around her my female lead in my romance novel feels right now. I know she’s getting better and that some of my supporting characters are more solid… but how can I write a good character when I’ve hardly written, and barely lived? That was a much needed reminder.

I myself am eventually going to be making a story. Been thinking about the whole story for years. Trying to perfect it the best I can. And at first I didn’t do anything with the female characters much. But I started to understand the good written female character vs the poorly/bad written female character. I’ve been studying of how to make it a good balance, but not to where they are the same as males. I just let it run, see how well the female character would be. Having the female characteristics (actual studies vs males even though it is debatable which is why I’m not doing it in full), and having them as another person. They are going to be strong characters, even sweet with a side of strong. It is honestly a delicate thing even for male characters at times. My suggestion is, play it out. Do it in a realistic manner. Use inspiration of actual females you know who are tough or just of how they act. My goal was to make a fine line. Not going towards the status quo, but to utilize what the other writers have made that is considered ‘woke’, utilize what I have learned about females. Each character I have developed is unique amongst each other. I jab jokes at the typical character designs/personalities. But the characters are their own. None are copy and paste (which some may do). Each character has an important part to the story. No one is subsided for one character to shine. I made it to where there is no true main character. Allowing for all to be important. I have been doing experiments for years. Have written stories at school and have been told they have enjoyed it a lot. Some of you may not agree with what I say and that’s okay. To be fair no one has seen of what I’m creating. So you may be confused of what I mean till it really releases. It’s the same with anyone else. A pilot episode gives like a rough draft, or a preview of how the story and characters will be. Some things may be different when released fully. That’s just how it is. I hope you all can read this comment and understand that he has good points on things. Almost everyone goes for the status quo or what a critic says to heart.

Alright I'm a say it women are...... awesome plan and simple. But I do think your wrong with drinker or Endy although when comes to me with female characters they should be written with care. As me personally I hate when a female is wriiten like trash or get beaten in every fight or is bland or the big sue.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

Also male characters are usually well written why are people always trying To lower the bar with female Characters?? Its this entitlement That irritates me that just Because they are female im supposed to like them.

@cryo9017

3 ай бұрын

You right

@cryo9017

3 ай бұрын

@@elongatedmanforever1252 👌🥵🥵🥵 now that was fire.

@LogicNG

3 ай бұрын

That’s the problem. You just said it yourself. You only like female characters if they’re written to your preference, I doubt you hold male characters to this same very specific standard

@esosaodiase4482

3 ай бұрын

@@LogicNGumm….I don’t think that’s what they said exactly. They just said they prefer them to not be written badly. I don’t wanna speak for them but I feel like most people still apply that to male characters even without saying it. It’s just that the discussion surrounding these kinds of topics primarily center around female characters. That’s why they’re brought up a lot

1:25 i learned that word to make some valentines card

I may not agree with all of you politics (that I’ve seen) but you have a valuable perspective and good information. So I’m subscribing. (And yes I can still get along with people that I don’t fully align with in beliefs.)

The main issue with Korra is not Korra herself, it's her relationships with her friend group (or love polygon), she doesn’t have a real friendship with none of them, not even Asami (their eventual relationship has any proper build up)

As a female writer, you earned my sub. I think a lot of people treat gender completely wrong when they write characters and it can be distracting because gender roles are treated like fundamental personality traits, rather than a complicated mix of social and biological relationships that sometimes inform personality or at least attitudes about life. Sometimes I end up writing characters before I even know what gender they are and it can actually be a good way to determine what sort of character you need and open up creative ways to write discussions about gender into that.

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

The problem is that discussions About gender are usually 1-sided.

"Good writing can make people forget their biases." That may be why I've heard very few people complain about the female protagonists in Cartoon Saloon's films -- Parvana in "The Breadwinner," Robyn and Mebh in "Wolfwalkers" -- as being "woke." They're so beautifully written and performed that they rarely trigger the portion of the audience primed to think the worst of female characters.

@elongatedmanforever1252

3 ай бұрын

people think the worst of every character, its mostly That constantly beating People over the head With messages turns People off more.

Fantastic job with the video. You made a lot of really good points and I like how you show that bad writing for a female character is less about the gender and more about the underlining problem with the writing itself. But there's one thing I wanted to bring up I think you failed to mention. You say "you have to write what appeals to you best and not worry about if it empowers women," but the biggest problem is those writers can't just write what they want everytime and instead have to listen to whatever their higherups tell them. What I'm mainly talking about is Hollywood. A great example is Kung Fu Panda 4. The writers WANTED to tell a story that fits the first 3 movies better, but the main director refused and did whatever he wanted while labelling different opinions in the studio as "stupid." This is an example of how writers can't write what they want (at least in a corporate setting) but how does that translate to female characters? When you say people will say "wokism has destroyed hollywood" while that's a stupid claim to make, there is a level of truth to that. Like in the MCU for an example. Brie Larson, the actor for Captain Marvel, calls critics of her movie "misogynists" even if they are just talking about the writing, and says stuff like "I want to empower little girls, I don't care what the white guys have to say", which not only villanises men and justifying their distaste for the character/actress in the first place, but also showcases the problem with Hollywood as a whole. There's no denying that Hollywood shifted it's focus to stuff like female empowerment or representation over the years, which is what causes the discussions and outcries in the first place, whether they're valid or ridiculous. And when a story makes "the female character" this perfect independant one everytime while making "the white guy" dumb and incompetent as frequently as modern Hollywood does, it can be very patronizing. There's a difference between a well writen female character, and a female charater that is writen in a way to appease investors regardless of how that might damage the story, going back that that main problem of the writting itself having issues. The Super Mario Movie has a few of these problems too. Princess Peach is already this perfect character with zero flaws and "doesn't need a hero." While we see that the reason why she's better than mario at the obstacle course in the beginning was because she was raised there, it leaves her character as static, and in comparison to the video game version of her, it feels like she's been "hollywood-ified" if that makes sense. But that problem doesn't stop at Peach's characterisation, it leads to the rest of the movie's writing problems: it's rushed pacing and lack of depth. When you bring up Frieren, that shows how well written the writing was. No one is complaining about how Frieren is "the strong independent woman" because that isn't the focus, and it never comes across like they want to push politics or agendas on you. She and the other female leads are just amazing characters in a well written world. Something like that is lost in a lot of Hollywood productions these days, where it often feels like a certain character is there or is made that way because "they want to sell empowerment and representation again" even if that isn't always the truth. Again, great video. I've found your channel recently and I am really interested to see what else you have made over the years!

This is something I think Zun does really well with Touhou Project. Considering the fact that about 99% of the characters are women, they had to all be different and interesting enough to care about . Considering how much the community cares about Touhou's characters means that Zun, while only giving most characters a few sentences of dialogue, managed to compel players enough to where they can create their own interpretations of them and change the way they see the story and the series' world as a whole.

Okay, I get it, different people like different things and everyone understands things differently, but how can i watch Velma and think it's actually good?

I dont think I've ever heard strong female character in anything that wasnt using representation as a sword and shield to defend mid.

@LogicNG

3 ай бұрын

Then you clearly haven’t left your alt right dope circlejerk

@elongatedmanforever1252

2 ай бұрын

Because its exactly what it intends to do, not tell a Story but to pander to Women & be only for Women.

The thing is writing isn't a strict set of lines you have to follow to make a good and a compelling story and experimenting can lead to a great if not a better style of writing in some cases.

Thanks. you're last statement was very powerful. I think I'll do just that.

Ehi Scrit, I am a new subscriber. Many people had critized Pomni since they didn't like her "character"; they didn't like her action, her felling or how she treated other person but after I saw they changed their point of view. I really like that video and I can't wait to see other, good luck with your work.👍

3rd strike music let’s gooooo

freiren vs galadriel comparsion video comes to mind when you think of the topic

Very good video!!!

The reason you never hear about how to write a male character right is because most of the products that are being changed are usually tergeted to males ie action and superhero movies. Just image if stuff like twilight started focus on the needs of their male audience. It's not that bad male characters don't exist, it's just that man usually don't invade mostly female spaces and demand changes on stuff that they wouldn't even support.

@ScritRighter

3 ай бұрын

Iseikai fantasy used to be a female dominated genre, and now it's almost exclusively male power fantasy. Just an example.

@nameless.thelivingdock5711

3 ай бұрын

@@ScritRighter yeah, that's why most isekai stories suck. We need stop invading each others fandoms and just let each other be. Where do think the term Garry Sue comes from isekaiiiiiiiii, JK 😂😂😂 But for real thou, it does get fostering when the audience that the are try to appeal to doesn't care about the medium of story telling that the are using. I have shown many girls and women stuff like The Marvels, ATLK, last jadi and their the first ones to leave the room leaving me wondering why the fan base must suffer just for people that are not going to even show up in the first place. Because it's not like they don't watch movies, Barbie proved that the is a market for these types of people.

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​@@nameless.thelivingdock5711I hate this trend where forced female protagonists take over male dominated media

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​​@@nameless.thelivingdock5711I wished that didn't happened to the Isekai genre

@noahalcantar2431

2 ай бұрын

​@@nameless.thelivingdock5711when will trend stop because I hate it

Suspicious first 3 characters this video's URL code...

Content aside, unless I'm mistaken and you already have, you should check out season 3 of Korra sometime. Seasons 1 & 2 were pretty rough, but some switch was flipped in the writers room after that and they wrote a season I consider on-par with the original series.

@ScritRighter

2 ай бұрын

that's what I've heard

As someone who has written many female protagonists (still practicing and improving) here's one thing I can say... Regardless of what gender your character is, the best stories and characters come from passion. If you have an idea, a passion for it and you are excited about it, go for it. But don't go to fast, because the best stories, come with hard work and dedication. Now hard work doesn't have to be pulling out a pencil and paper and writing each word of the story slowly but, brainstorming is where the hard work comes in. The best stories have a lot of thought and passion in them. The more thought, reasoning and passion you put into a story. The better. And keep practicing! Learn from your work, and make something you can be proud of in the future.

hes a professional womener

@Electric0eye

17 күн бұрын

a real womanizer 😎👉👉

Okay, so I got my own little take. I dislike very badly written characters overall. While there are many female, there are more male ones (i mean probably because there judt are a lot more). But yeah, even I seem to have a higher standard to what a good written female character is, but it's not about how feminine they are or how they take away from our masculinity, because that is bullshit. I think the issue is that there are many female characters that are supposed to be the lead, be the hero, but then turn out to be the worst written character in the entire thing. Many of them just are so extreme to one spot. (I just really hate Mary Sue's)

As a male i’ve always been interested in female characters,ans often they are my favorite characters of shows. Your point with pomni was a really good point too!

video pazzesco fra, grazie dei suggerimenti