Didn’t know people sued each other on trackdays

@FortyFourTeeth

28 күн бұрын

I know, it’s ridiculous

@jettamaster3297

28 күн бұрын

@@FortyFourTeeth exactly what I as gonna say before reading your reply, but with expletives!

@GeauxRilla

28 күн бұрын

Is this litigation stateside or strictly across the pond?

@russellstokke6888

28 күн бұрын

@@GeauxRillaat least in California, waivers don’t exempt negligence, like Gav states for the UK. Laguna Seca and a provider, Keigwin’s, were recently sued, because a track day rider went off track, hit a sand bag, crashed and broke his leg. The court ruled against the rider (the sandbag was legitimately there to mitigate water flowing onto the track, and the rider was in error being off track in the first place). I know a track instructor doing a 2-up lap was sued as well from a crash. They were both injured because a second bike went down and hit them. I agree with the overall “gentleman’s agreement” approach to track days. I think someone would have to be wildly out of control and unaccountable for someone to take it to court.

@juniorchats7565

28 күн бұрын

That guy seems to get a semi working on those cases though. Its a joke ​@FortyFourTeeth

I can't help but think it's not entirely a terrible thing. I belive that accidents do happen, and generally if you take your bike there you accept that level of risk. But. If someone is riding like an utter cunt, maybe in the wrong group and running people off or hitting them, then they cause an accident that wipes your bike apart, and or causes you a permanent injury, maybe putting you out of work, they absolutely should be held accountable for that. It's a track day isn't an excuse to forget how to be a decent person

@feaverish

28 күн бұрын

Like the dick who overtook me just before Donny coppice corner, planted his bike in front of mine and slammed the brakes on for the corner. How I missed him I will never know. I've always wanted to have a moan about that one 🤣🤣

@timmymallett1

26 күн бұрын

This. It's not racing, its a track day. If you chose to make a pass that endangers someone, just hang back. Otherwise get your ACU licence.

@cunningpunt

19 күн бұрын

@@timmymallett1 This is where it's going to get sticky. If you are overtaking but I change my line randomly and we clip who would you say is liable? The person passing 100%? The logical outcome is that no one should pass to eliminate the risk. I wouldn't fancy that tbh.

@ddon1797

15 күн бұрын

​@cunningpunt imagine that on a track ... be like getting stuck behind little old Irine at 35-40 all over again 😂

Did a trackday evening event at Donington, 2 groups. I was in slow-medium. After the Old Hairpin (left) there's a couple of rights that are double apexes. Anyway i was braking for the 1st set, lining up for the apex, when i heard a guy trying to slow down, and knew if i stayed on my line he was going to clatter into me. So i went wide of the apex, and he barely made it. The next set of rights he did the same thing and went straight into the back of the bike in front of him. He smashed the back of the guys bike, somehow his own numberplate ended up on the ground. The "victim" picked up the numberplate. The daft guy just carried on, like nothing had happened 😂 So i followed the victim into the pits. The victim was going bananas, understandably. He told the track day organiser, trying to get the guy black flagged. I explained how the daft rider had done the exact same thing on the corner before, and I had to run wide. Anyway session ends and "crasher" comes into the pit lane acting innocent 😅. Victim starts giving out to him. Crasher says "What's your problem, we're racing". No mate, it's a track day, and the MotoGP world title isn't on the line. Anyway Victim is waving Crasher's numberplate and won't give it back 😂 and Victim says to Crasher that he'll find out who he crashed into soon. Organiser didn't even want to tell Crasher to calm down or block him for a session. I think Crasher should have paid for the damage. He was a total liability. Event runner should have gave him a warning, or some penalty. But they did nothing. And I continued to keep mirrors on my bike on trackdays and stay in the slow group because at least then i hardly ever got passed, and it meant less chance of a Crasher clattering info me 😂 Expert and everyone, what do you think, could the victim have got something from Crasher or not? Should he have tried? Should the event runner have done a better job?

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

They don't give a shit. I have been to several events where rules have been given, rules have been blatantly disregarded, fuck all done. And one wonders why you have people suing for anal probers who believe they're more important than you because they're on a PB...

It really only takes one guy with a lawyer buddy to ruin things for everybody

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Or one prick trying to win the track day...

@DorianGRMC

28 күн бұрын

@@Hypersonik@Hypersonik Exactly, they ride recklessly on a cheap motorcycle, terrorising decent riders.

@ianmiles7916

27 күн бұрын

only takes one clown wanting brexit done to ruin things for everybody.

Does anyone else feel almost all joy has been sucked out of life.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Are you on about the victim getting punted of by a cock womble and losing tens of thousands of pounds in damaged bike and los tearnings?

@StewartyNo9

28 күн бұрын

Not really no

@stephencallil6512

28 күн бұрын

Yes I am 67 .Way too much rules @ regulation .As as I am concerned accidents on the the track is part of the deal. Anyone can make a mistake

@kingkire1556

27 күн бұрын

Ignorance is bliss. Delete all forms of media and enjoy this planet.

@ianmiles7916

27 күн бұрын

that's brexit for you.

I'm 50/50, if some clown Wannabe Rossi turns up and takes you out on a track hack through negligence fair enough sue them.

Brexit just keeps on giving. What a mess.

If there’s a hero bellend carving up noobs, and being a billy big balls, maybe a bit of litigation will put his ego in the box. A genuine mistake, like coming together on track should just be a handshake.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

A genuine mistake... Fair enough if you're a novice. But even then - push it when no one is about, not when there are 2 bikes approaching the apex. A bit of accountability goes a long way. I mean yeah, if you have a blow out, burst a brake line, snap a chain then that's force majeure. But if you have done 20 laps that day and you try doing 10mph faster apex speed because you saw another guy do it, then damn right you need to be accountable.

@Phillc748

28 күн бұрын

But an apology and handshake in this world of litigation is now a clear admission of guilt, where as before it was honourable. So we are done for, because just like on the road with the guys with the absolute obscene exhausts (race fit and that junk) it will be the minority that absolutely destroy it for the rest of us

You can thank the Americans for the 'sue culture'

@MrJonnyh1972

13 күн бұрын

Where there's blame there's a claim 🚑🏃🏼💨

Big fan of this series. Knowledge is power - keep em coming 👊

Track days are really fun and enjoyed by most. However we have all seen some idiots there too! Good to know the legal side. Which is important to know. Thanks Gavin and 44teeth! :)

I genuinely appreciate the knowledge.

Cheers Gav for sharing some knowledge 👍👍👍👍 and thanks for these segments Al and Chris 👍👍👍👍 l meet Gav at Podium Place top bloke.

I disagree that you should NEVER sue anyone for a Trackday accident. Some guy posted a video of him chasing lap times around Donington at a Trackday and he wrote of some guys daily rider whilst overtaking. As far as I’m concerned, I’ve signed up to, and followed, the Trackday rules and if some dick comes along and completely ignores all of this and writes my bike off then they should absolutely pay for my repairs.

The idea of being sued for a trackday/race crash is bloody terrifying. Can you guys explain the Shane Byrne MSV lawsuit.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Track day is not a race. I cannot believe you'd actually compare the two.

@theant9821

28 күн бұрын

@@Hypersonik Shakeys crash was not during a race weekend, it was on a test day. similar to a track day.

@Hypersonik

26 күн бұрын

@@theant9821 A test day is racing rules and timing apply. It is significantly different to a track day.

@mikey_bb

10 күн бұрын

They won't specifically explain the Byrne v MSV case I'm sure, with it still being an active legal case. However, if you listen to some of the points made during this video, you'll find it may answer some of your questions 😉

If everyone remembers this while out on track then possibly the riding standards will go up, how many times have you said while at a event they’re are no winners on track days calm down

@motopetefun

28 күн бұрын

Well said!!

i've crashed someone else's bike before, and i just paid out for the damage. it was a bit of a stretch for my finances at the time, and he let me pay in installments. why is that so hard?

UK blame culture, if you're doing a track day then be prepared for anything.

Biker Code vs the Code of Law?... Not just a Britainland issue but also elsewhere like Dutchland where I am. Every year Motorsports takes another hit from ecological pressure, sound limits, legalities etc. These typically hit the Biker community harder than others. Tracks are being closed and/or bikers are given less and less track time. If the primary path is suing one another then we all loose in my view. That industry will cannibalize itself into extinction and take a lot of the biker track-day scene with it. Track-days are a get together of people taking part in a risky activity under controlled conditions. That is a serious opportunity. Insurance policies for any and all riders is a much more sustainable industry than enriching lawyers and courts. More importantly more industries will then contribute to the sport since there is more certainty for investment. But most importantly government gets involved as TAXES are generated. At least, that is what has proven to work in Americanoland.

Always enjoy these interesting & enlightening vids. Often very sobering too as common sense seemingly doesn't play as big a part in the law as you'd like to think.

Where there’s blame there’s a claim says the solicitor 😂😂😂😂

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

And where there are idiots, there will always be incidents :)

I live right next to the Nürburgring and you would not believe how many idiots come here every single day. Accidents can always happen. But some stupid kid going way past his limits and taking ridiculous risks and endangering others for no other reason than his own amusement and then crashing into someone is simply not an accident! People acting negligent need to be held accountable.

So presumably this insurance technicality will apply to Enduro Pay & Play days as well, as they’re held on private land?

Could literally listen to Gavin all day!!! Really nice guy, met him a couple of times at the Nurburgring.

@gavingrewal6384

14 күн бұрын

@NurburgringBikerBlog Hi Billy, nice to hear from you! That was when I was younger and fitter, riding my ZZR1400 around the 'Ring! I will be back next year for Anlassen 😊

Everyone signs a waiver. I thought you just got your own track day insurance cover if you want full financial cover.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

They sign a waiver for the circuit/TDE. I'm pretty sure the briefing tells you not to be a twat when you're riding, yet there we go...

@mikey_bb

10 күн бұрын

Have you even listened to the video in full? I'm saying not as they covered this point very well..

Well that’s no more track days. Unless I am absolutely sure of the circuit, the group and now, the instructor. Only takes a change in perception and a mate to say he saw something to be stung with something you had no part in. The Gentleman’s agreement attracted Gentlemen. Now it’s going to be crash for cash.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

HAHAHAHAHA! So when you go to a circuit, are you looking to crash or something? I dunno, when I go to a circuit I haven't been before, I tend to start out slow, brake early, work things out, then build it up. If I plan to push, it won't be with someone directly infront of me or leaning into an apex when I have a closing speed of 20mph+ But that's me taking responsibility for my actions and wanting to make it back home in one piece.

@MrMandown46

25 күн бұрын

I bet it's not.

@BRMCaptChaos

24 күн бұрын

@@Hypersonik admirable, I do the same. It’s not the circuit, it’s the riders in groups you won’t know. This is about people crashing into you through their error. Or more disturbingly, forcing a perception of that happening and holding you liable. Best not to crash in the first place, but one guy turning up with mates who said they saw it differently rather changes the dynamic no?

I was looking into my first track day and wanted to insure my bike in case I crash it. Is that not the norm then? I don't understand why it would be frowned upon if I made a claim if someone hits me, i'm insured if I hit them, no?

My insurance says not covered for private trails so I cannot go on the trail at the ABR as I will not be insured? Does this ruling mean a vehicle is not insured when it is on a non public area like a car park at a festival??😮

My first track day was 20+ years ago at Sears Point, in CA. A guy on a very nice Aprilia RSVR hit a touch of mud mid-corner, turn 4, causing him to drop the bike. (The mud patch was small enough that it could be avoided, as most did, but nonetheless, it needed to be removed.) It turned out that a corner worker had driven a vechicle across the track, leaving the mud. The rider complained to the track day provider, and they basically gave him the cold shoulder. You can imagine the rider was pissed, but the hill climb to get reimbursement was too steep.

Does this mean if your bike is nicked from a circuit car park you are not covered?

This will kill trackdays.. Dont agree with this at all. If you go on track you take the risk end of Nice to meet you Gav, saw your grass excursion 😅

@gavingrewal6384

28 күн бұрын

I ran out of talent trying to pass the SRAD 😅 New found respect for my TL1000R was gained!! Did you capture it on video?

@mickl8212

28 күн бұрын

Chopsy, I agree, they tried this with car trackdays and all shit broke loose about it. And they started dropping it. WTF are they pushing this?? You sign the documentation saying you accept the risks. That's complete and utter rubbish. People will just stop doing trackdays. Lawyers like this are also leeches, and so it starts. Do a trackday and you risk losing your house through scummy lawyer working the law....not good is it.... If you're wiped out by Manuel in Spain, by an unintentional error, get lost. If you're wiped out by Johnny in Spain, get in, let's have his house and the shirt off his back. Ridiculous.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

I don't see why you should be able to ride without due care and attention on a track day. If you're a clown and twat someone off, they lose their bike, several weeks/months pay through being injured and not being able to work, maybe even their house etc all because some fuckstick was on a PB and couldn't be bothered to wait... That's killing track days.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

I don't see why you should be able to ride without due care and attention on a track day. If you're a clown and twat someone off, they lose their bike, several weeks/months pay through being injured and not being able to work, maybe even their house etc all because some fuckstick was on a PB and couldn't be bothered to wait... That's killing track days.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

I don't see why you should be able to ride without due care and attention on a track day. If you're a clown and twat someone off, they lose their bike, several weeks/months pay through being injured and not being able to work, maybe even their house etc all because some muppet was on a PB and couldn't be bothered to wait... That's killing track days.

Cant believe you got a golden ticket for Glastonbury, love that place .enjoyyyyy

So it’s time to bring transponders to UK track days so that wanna be hero’s or slower riders are in the right groups

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

How about just having a breather and thinking about the person in front instead of getting frustrated because you're gonna miss your PB on an event you shouldn't be timing on?

I do agree about the part of negligence. It does depend on the group you're riding I think. The few track days I've done, organisation was done very well and antisocial riders were warned (one even got ousted). I'm just there to have fun and not chasing times and so rightly put in a group were there's no idiots chasing times overtaking all the time. I like the gentleman's agreement but if the other party isn't being a gentleman about it ...

Even the most reputable insurance companies make mistakes. After a phone conversation I was told "That's all gone through you can start riding from Noon today" so I rode the bike 325miles, swapped it, and when I phoned to remove that bike and put the new bike on they said the bike I'd ridden wasn't on!😮 Heavens above!🙏

Do the same issues apply to racing as trackdays? I race at Freetech i'm gonna end up having to sell my house if i get sued everytime someone gets wiped out 🤣🤣

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

It'd be much more difficult to prove. There is a competitive element and you can make all sorts of arguments about gaps and lines and attacking and defending etc. On a track day you have none of that available to you.

Pretty scary stuff really. I always track-dayed on the assumption that I had no insurance on the track and if someone wiped me out it's bad luck on me. I figured that the waiver put me out of risk of being sued for my actions, and in turn suing another rider. To be fair though, human natural self preservation kept almost everybody safe every time I rode, the only issues that I witnessed were people on crossing lines who were alongside and one rider took out the other rider's front wheel, any other issue was riders just running wide all on their own.

Is this relevant in Club racing?

Simple answer, don't take 25k motorcycles on track, you won't go any slower on a 10k motorcycle🤣

@scottyuk

28 күн бұрын

That solves nothing

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Simple answer - ride within your limits. Expanded answer - Build up slowly, check your bike is serviceable, understand you shouldn't be timing, everyone has the same right as you to be at the corner you want to be at, a successful trackday is one you go home from in one piece, you are not, under any circumstance, going to get signed by a MotoGP factory team if you beat your PB.

I specifically gave up doing track days as i couldn't risk getting injured anymore.

So you can sue another rider for negligence, but can you buy insurance to cover yourself against this? I know there is personal injury insurance, like income protection. But I have never seen an insurance policy that would cover you is someone was to file a claim against you.

@LambChopRides

27 күн бұрын

Yes exactly... this is now a must. Imagine bring sued as you made a mistake and came together with another rider. The guy hurts himself and is off work, now you are being sued for his loss of earning, bike damage plus court and lawer fees.. so now I get a bill for £100,000 and my life is ruined... thanks

This is scary. I thought the disclaimer protected us but seems not. Its like going on the 'ring without insurance : If you are held to blame for a crash and theres massive medical bills etc then if youre sued and arent covered for 3rd party liability then you couod lose your home etc. This has happened to people on the 'ring. Are we all taking on a lot more risk than we realise??? Eeeeekk

@gavingrewal6384

28 күн бұрын

@scottyuk some disclaimers are very strong. Others not so much. You cannot disclaim out of injury or death, caused by negligence, in England and Wales. So, the answer to your question is, potentially yes. I haven't found a track day insurer who will cover ALL risks. Only your own bike. I say this as a fellow track rider. Just telling it how it is.

Don't you sign a waver every trackday that you or your relatives don't sue the track, the organisation or any other rider no matter what. Because what the hell have I been signing all these years. In my opinion just take it on the chin. It's a bloody racetrack.

@briansteele2723

28 күн бұрын

As he explained it's not the rider Vs track scenario that he is discussing, it's issues between participating riders

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

It maybe a race track, but it's not a race day. I don't understand why you don't expect a safe standard of riding on a track day. Or even a race day for that matter. Granted in a race, things are going to happen, but on a track day, no way.

@Don8789

26 күн бұрын

@@briansteele2723 I just picked one out of my email to check. It's from Bikerdays Spa. It specifically includes other participants. I know for a fact, that on Assen trackdays it is usually the same. So The Netherlands and Belgium are clear. You are liable for damage to the track though.

@Don8789

26 күн бұрын

@@Hypersonik I have done about 35 trackdays, ride the fast group and have never made contact with another rider. A bit of d*** thing to take someone else out offcourse but there is risk in riding at speed on a track with 40 strangers. People are not gonna do it on purpose. If people don't want to take the financial risk for their own bike, they should get trackday insurance or don't ride trackdays.

@Don8789

26 күн бұрын

@@briansteele2723 I checked a waver from Bikerdays from Spa-Francorchamps and other riders are included. I am also very certain that other riders are included in trackdays that I have done in the Netherlands on Assen and Zandvoort. So in Belgium and The Netherlands it seems that not suing other riders is included in the waver of the track/organiser.

Bit alarming about the ABR trail and anything off road. Just bought a middleweight adv

To some extent I agree with holding people accountable but like everything else in life its a double edge sword. I can easily see someone braking to early while moving into your line and you crash into him. Then he sues you because you rear ended him. Unless you/or someone else have in video you are stuffed. In the end if the day is one more shi** to worry about and in the way of some fun.

Touting for business in a sector that doesn't need it

@FortyFourTeeth

28 күн бұрын

Touting for business 😂 It’s an explanation

@mickl8212

28 күн бұрын

David, absolutely nail on the head there mate 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

See you at Glastonbury!

Well fuck that then....cant be arsed with all that palaver for a track day....guess im old school😮...did anyone ever get sued at the pb frenzys ???

@-DC-

28 күн бұрын

Only if you couldn't manage ten pints lol

7 mins in, can’t watch anymore, another nail in the coffin even for trackdays. Sad times! We all make mistakes, I specifically note the comment saying ‘the rider came to the garage and said he was sorry and gave some money’ so now in a litigious world that’s basically admitting fault. Better to crash on the road and at least have some insurance cover to start with. This genuinely sucks

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

There is making a mistake and there is reckless riding. Watching a guy tip into the apex and thinking 'Yeah, I'll get through there' and then twatting him off is not a mistake - it's something you could have waited for and avoided.

I'd love to get Gav's take on some of the more granular insurance issues and costs. As a personal example, I'm mid 30s, 4 years with my licence, no claims, live in a really quiet and safe area. When I quote my bike as being 'on private property' (my shed), the cheapest offer is £550 for the year. If I were to state it's kept in a garage, it's £150. Am I meant to believe that 70% of my risk / cost is theft from my home? At that case, provided my bike is only stolen once every 15 years or so (sarcasm), I'm better off lying and then resigning myself to not claiming in that event.

Can of worms opened. Used to be gentlemanly, known risks. But now, with the state of riding, and the video proof of shocking riding skills and etiquette, I think this will now happen more.

@JSmith19858

28 күн бұрын

Well...yeah. I got knocked the fuck upside down by another rider on a trackday that put me in hospital for two weeks. Their standard of riding had already been commented on during the day, and the brainless move that put them in my path shouldn't have gone unpunished. If I had a video of it I would have chased them to court, as I was off work for a while because someone else was riding like a helmet

@GeauxRilla

28 күн бұрын

​@@JSmith19858working man here in Georgia, ive got my own business, children, home.... I don't typically support suing folks to claim unwarranted funds, however you gotta be covered against recklessness when you're a weekend warrior like myself and many others!

@MrMandown46

25 күн бұрын

Perhaps then e can hope that the bellends will either cost themselves out of trackdays, or the standards will improve making it better for us all.

@icklepob88

23 күн бұрын

@MrMandown46 I'm already costed out of racing and trackdays, so really don't need any other expenses unfortunately. I ride courteously and understand it's only a trackday, unfortunately other seem to think it's qualifying for the moto gp championship final round, and need good content for their social media channels, as 74 subscribers DEMAND regular content.

@MrMandown46

23 күн бұрын

@@icklepob88 I feel you mate, basically my situation!

Awful lawyer bandits.

There is no agreement that you go on track and look after each other. So that's not true (legally). There is only a contract between rider and TD organiser and doesn't extend to the other riders. Debateable whether, as a rider, you owe a duty of care towards other riders whilst on track with them. Only if you do have such a duty could his point be right about "agreeing to look after each other". The whole issue of riders bringing claims against other riders is a murky one. Personally, I see the issue as "where do you draw a line"? And that depends on how negligent or reckless (and yes, I see plenty reckless riders out there too) the rider at fault is. Examples might help. Rider has turned up with a bike he has not maintained and checked it is track worthy. No recent oil service or (example he gave) didn't bolt check the sump plug, re-used an old oil filter, thinks its ok to run the pads down to the backing plate....whatever, you get the drift. He knows this. His pit garage mates know it. He dumps oil on the circuit. And riders go down on it and get injured. Is it ok to sue if you go down? Leave that to you as a collective to decide. Or, rider puts himself in the novice group as its the only space left. Clearly he is a faster rider (but not necessarily very experienced or very talented). He stuffs it up the inside of a novice rider down the hill into the last turn at portimao and loses the front taking the outside rider off or just sits the novice rider up in that corner and runs him off track where novice rider bins it. Again, is it ok to sue if you go down? Leave that to you as a collective to decide. Final example, fast group, experienced riders, similar pace, rider in front brakes slightly earlier into turn 1 than rider behind (remember, this will be 170+ mph), rider behind not expecting it and has to anchor on, on the brow of the hill, rear end lifts and comes around on him, he has no option other than to release the brake, and hits the rider in front, taking them both out at high speed. In all cases, the rider taken out is injured, can't work for a month, and has £10k damage to his bike. Is it ok to sue if you go down in any of those scenarios? Where is the line to be drawn? What is acceptable in the circumstances? My personal opinion is that the line should be drawn so far away from bringing a claim that it makes it a very hard (possibly also should be a costly) choice to bring an action. No win, no fee (which are called conditional fee agreements of CFAs) should not be on the table because, trust me, if a lawyer gets a sniff of work, they really don't give a f*ck whether it wins or loses. Its paid work so they will always do it. By the way, don't @ me on that point, I have been a lawyer for nearly 30 years so I do know. As a track dayer (regardless of whether I am lawyer - which I leave at the office, and never bring to the track), I am not comfortable with this litigation culture fuelled by no win no fee ambulance chasing lawyers (and that goes for all claims, whether PPI claims, diesel-gate, the latest car finance claims) - the whole culture of that kind of litigation produces the opposite of what is intended because insurer's who underwrite the whole process will always decide what to do in their own financial best interest (i.e. most will settle rather than pay to fight/defend etc even if the case, on its merits, should be defended or fought). There is no notion of "access to justice" or "enable justice to be served", if you think its based on that, you might also believe being told a unicorn sh*ts gold dust and rose petals. All of this needs to stop. Or track days will no longer be a viable business or hobby, simply because insurance will be unavailable and/or just make track days cost prohibitive. And then all these people that believe that suing people is acceptable after they have knowingly taken risks by participating in a dangerous hobby and it went wrong on the day, will be the cause of the end of something that the vast majority of us who watch this channel love to do. There is a famous ex-racer bringing a claim in the High Court at the moment, against the operator of a circuit. He is suing for over £1m. Suggesting that the circiut owner didn;t operate a safe environment. A rough estimate of the numbers of times he had ridden that corner on that circuit in his entire career is probably no less than 1000 times. Probably a lot more. Apear from, on this occasion, that ex-racer crashed. And got hurt. This ex-racer made millions from his career. Now wants more and is using the "justice" system and lawyers to try and get more. His case will kill the whole track day industry in the UK. Watch and see. What are your thoughts @FortyFourTeeth or anyone else?

Correct - Portimao as in porti-mow. Close ish..

To be honest the amount of bells on track I am not surprised people are being sued. I ride on track for fun, not to get a spinal injury because some dickhead thinks he’s fast.

I can see both sides. Most incidents I see on track between two riders are misjudgements but you can see why they made that mistake. I was at a trackday a few years ago though where there was a queue of 5/6 of us bunched up behind a CB500 at Oulton going into Hislop's, so no point everyone fighting into the chicane so everyone was just hanging back so we could all get past on the run out of knickerbrook. Then one dickhead decided to try and pass everyone on the left (we're all moving over to the left of the track from the right over Hilltop, which is where the line goes), and he ends up taking out the CB500 by hooking his handlebar with his elbow. It was an absolutely mental move to try and pull, everyone kicked off, and he wasn't even told to go home, he was out the next session still being a dickhead and standing people up etc. There was definitely a claim there IMO because he'd chosen to pull such a stupid move 5/6 bikes back, before he took someone out. Luckily no injuries, just a damaged bike, leathers and helmet, but still expensive for the CB500 rider and he never saw a penny.

Thats insane. Track days are ride at your own risk. Thats like a soccer player suing another player for being tripped or hit by the ball. You choose to ride on track. Knowing this, I would never ride on track in Europe.

First I’ve heard of this!

"Would you sue a fellow trackday rider?!" - NO, NEVER, EVER and I expect the same in retrospect. On the track all risks are on the rider, we know that that's how it works.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Then you're a muppet. If some afterbirth in leathers punts you off and you break your hand, write off your bike, and then lose a couple of months pay recovering (so now you're £20k in the hole), you're just going to go 'Oh well, nothing can be done!'? No, you're going to go 'That fucking prick owes me!'

Sued for a trackday incident ...the actual f@£k...it's a trackday FFS

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Yes, not a race day. Somehow, people seem to get confused on their way to being Rossi and think they'll be signed up at the end...

If you want to go the route of the USA, the only result would be richer lawyers and a much worse experience for everyone else. 😳 I wonder if it is easier to chance ambulances on the track 🤬

Where does this stop? I did a Jamie Whitham trackday at Snetterton last year and I am still shit, can I sue Trevor Nation and Davey Todd?

@belly450

28 күн бұрын

😂😂😂😂😂

'Before Brexit, none of this was a problem'.......yeah, we seem to get this a lot 😃

I'll be honest, Brexit or not, I've never heard of claims happening from track day crashes. I can understand if someone was malicious wanting to go after them but otherwise it's just part of the risk of being on track (for me anyway).

Lawyers ruin everything.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

No, dickheads do. If people rode sensibly, there wouldn't be an issue. Elimination of problem at the root cause.

Yes Gavlarrrrr 👍🏻👍🏻

Never ride a bike you can't afford to write off I loop my 1500 gsxr750 I'd rather stomach it 😂

Insurance companies never want 2 pay out,& solicitors ambulance 🚑 chasing. The UK is getting more like America. What next gun crime & drugs 🤷‍♂️

Brexit? Ruined things? Who'd of thought

I thought track days were for pushing your limits they used to have 3 groups a b c . C was for people how just wanted to ride the track even at walking speed and A was race speed and the riders should look like they are safe , but a crash could happen but is not racing . Think this lawyer could kill track days like all the fun thinks . Next there will be a speed camera and fine on the track will make them money .

That’s the end of trackdays then. Cos no one wants to risk their house for a few laps of a circuit…..

No. I think this is driven by insurance companies, they charge riders hundreds and thousands per year and they say on the end what you was doing is not covered, too risky and they do not pay. The other side is the riders who think an insurance is there for buying the latest bike on finance which cost over 10k+ but they only pay by the month then they want to look like Rossi with no risk taken and no lessons learned. Track day should be for people can take risk, want to do mistakes, and learning from them. Buy a cheap bike and expect to write it off any day, no tears. Zero, nada. And same goes for the gear, helmet, buy a Level 2 armour and don't complain if the leather is ripped. C@nt$ are everywhere, it is your job to stay out of the way and be aware of your environment. I would say this goes for the road too but we pretended to be civilised so we pay the price.

This will be the death of trackdays.

Shh, nobody tell anyone that you can sue!!

Welcome to Australia no track insurance

Watching on, maybe this is a video you shouldn't have posted. Don't give the Nancies the knowledge they CAN sue !!!

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

I think it's great - maybe people won't ride like cunts thinking they're one corner away from a factory contract...

Yay 😊

Say i crashed into a £30-40k bike and it was a total loss, No way i could pay for it

@motopetefun

28 күн бұрын

Don’t worry, they will take your house or direct payment from your wages 😅

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Then think a little before trying to be a hero. It really isn't that hard.

@riderzinc

28 күн бұрын

@@motopetefun Fucked then no house or wages lol

Well this will ruin track days, if someone does something stupid and takes me out, it sucks, expletives will be said but that's life when you pull onto a race track. FFS why do lawyers have to destroy everything.

So what happenes if you have a shunt in say a supermarket carpark? That's private land isn't it?

@MrMandown46

28 күн бұрын

Iirc it's no different to the road as its completely open to public, unlike tracks where admittance is gated and controlled

@-DC-

28 күн бұрын

Supermarket Car park is Private Land but Also a Public Place in law.

I'd never thought of it and It sounds shitty. But if someone writes off your 20k bike and injures you. It kinda makes sense to sue if you cant come to an agreement between yourselves

Vultures.

While I find these chats interesting to listen to I just end up getting pissed off at the entire system of insurance, sueing each other and just general modern life bs. If you take all this stuff to heart you'd be too worried about ever doing anything unless you're rich enough to not give a shit. And in the nicest possible way, because he seems like a OK bloke... layers like Gav really just enable this ridiculous merry go round.

He's an great asset to this 44Teeth channel & appears to be a real good person from the heart. Maybe in the furture get him onboard to review bikes with you. I for one would be more than happy to see that happen.

Dat würde bedeuten das die 44teeth fahrer gar nicht wissen können wer noch ne'ungeübte fahrweise hat sondern spulen aufgrund ihrer sehr professionellen fahrweise bestzeiten ab ( fahren in kurzer zeit dicht auf) - da rückspiegel wenig sinn ergeben kann der ungeübte vorrausfahrende gar nicht wissen wann und zu welcher seite überholt wird da überlegenheit zum tragen kommen ! ...i must full fill my leather if these racers are behind me 😖 should i disslike professional riders if i "circling with a moped at a track" ? for example

If you voted Brexit, do you now realize what you have done 🙌🙌🙌🙌

a bit pointless as no fucker would pay up anyway. if they haven't got any money then not much u can do. u take your chances on track days end of.

Might leave a bad taste but tbh makes sense. Why should someone be able to careen into you, break your legs and your 25k bike and then jolly off at 5pm?

@juniorchats7565

28 күн бұрын

So if you take your kids ice skating, some 10 year old falls over and takes you out at the same time breaking an ankle. You are going to sue them?

@_Makanko_

28 күн бұрын

@@juniorchats7565 Are you riding track days with 10year olds?

@luobomu9747

28 күн бұрын

​@@juniorchats7565Sounds to me like you're comparing a kids' accident to adult negligence. Not fair.

@juniorchats7565

28 күн бұрын

@luobomu9747 OK a middle aged man slips over and breaks someone's leg. Nobody goes out to hurt other people but we all make mistakes. If you try and make a claim after a track day you are a complete cunt.

Another Brexit benefit I see

best keep the woke off the track then

Not seen this much reeing about Brexit, in years 😂

never forget, "there cannot be any democratic choice against EU treaty" this is why we had brexit, we never voted to have no democracy.

So some people are mad they can't sue others in a foreign country on a track day if knocked off due to brexit, But all seem to say you should not sue, it's a track day you know the risks involved.

@Hypersonik

28 күн бұрын

Yes. The risks on a trackday are that I could fall off, have a bike failure, or that someone else could have a bike failure that cause me to fall off. I accept that. What I don't accept is a wunderkind trying to blast down the inside of me because he is entitled to more of the track day than me, and causing me to smash my leg/hand etc up meaning I lose 2 months+ salary from work.

@RupeWilson

27 күн бұрын

@@Hypersonik I agree with you,

Brexit - the gift that keeps on giving. Only being rear ended by a homie counts now.

Weird behaviour 🤷🏻‍♂️

Portimão= pohr-chy-mhaoun

Not to bitch, but this video is cursed w/ reverb. Warehouses don’t work so well w/ good audio. I want to say I’m still a great fan of 44T.

@megasheddiaries

28 күн бұрын

We're you even listening to the dialogue, or was thata joke?

@paulbarker5915

28 күн бұрын

@@megasheddiaries not constructive

Brexit was an amazing idea.

Jesus christ brexit has just been shit all over

@gnarshread

28 күн бұрын

Yup!

@BRMCaptChaos

28 күн бұрын

Personally I like the idea of being able to vote on 4th July for the rules, taxes and services we get. Not that we’ll get any good news this time, but it’s democracy.

why's this bell end keep going on about Brixit, ive know a few people that have had issues crashing wise in Europe and it didn't make a difference then and its the same now. If you want to go on track get track day insurance if you are that worried.