Thanks for the mention Sir, 👍😁 Looks like your weep holes in the bottom of the frame are blocked, probably with expanding foam. Doors and windows should be fitted using low expansion foam plus I wouldn't be a big fan of putting fixings through the bottom of the frame. I'd recommend a cill tray, ideally sheet metal to match the colour of the door. Get one fabricated and install it with a slight fall outwards. I'd use a heavy duty silicone like Teck7 coloured to match. Just don't block those weep holes. I hope this comment has been of some assistance, 🔨 🇮🇪

The foam has done it’s job in sealing in the frame and sadly blocked the drainage holes in the absence of a sill as normally you would foam under the sill and sides of the frame. I can understand the flush finish you’ve specified from the internal side but that can be achieved by lowering the dpm 20mm/ 30mm (sill thickness) to compensate for the sill. Fix: Clear out the foam from all the drain holes allowing the water to run out and seal the dpm internal side to the frame, once the sealant has gone off check with a hose pipe for any internal leaks. Hope this helps and great build and videos.

Fit a lead tray to the underneath the frame that's how express bifold fit all doors with no cill

With that big triple section at the bottom forget about adding bits of silicone, take the lot out, cut your blockwork down to allow for the height of a normal cill, refit in accordance with the manufacturer's instructions in terms of fixing and sealing. You can have your decking on top of the cill outside and still get the flush finish you want. Hope that helps. Thanks for all the great videos. Alex joiner

Where is the cill and drip edge with drainage holes, from the door channels? Great videos. Jon builder

I had a similar issue. The screws in the sill go through the DPM which could pull moisture down and past the expanding foam. Plus, the over hanging DPM outside will allow moisture to pull through from outside. I would consider trimming the foam/DPM and sealing with an external use waterproof tape. Maybe fold the DPM up on the inside and tape that to the door sill too, giving the water nowhere to go.

Would it be from drain holes and/or exposed screw fixing points in the base rail that would normally run onto the cill and then out but in this case drip directly onto your DPC? Also check any drain points as occasionally the stamping process doesn't fully punch them out on aluminium frames

Hard to see from the video, but is the drain holes in the face of the frame as you haven’t got a sill? Could be running back from the foam

There shouldnt be any need for that amount of expanding foam below the door. dpm should have been sealed down on the base and then the door sealed down on the dpm using silicone sealer or something similar.. Also a sill to help the rain run off would help. Looks like a bad fitting job to me. I would get the fitters back asap

Hi, if you're going to use an external sealant outside, look into using a 'backing rod' prior to applying. Good luck!

Hi, sorry to hear of your problem, but best find it out than when the plasterboard and floor coverings go in! I've seen this issue recently on some much much larger and pro. fitted sliders. Water is hitting the glass and running down flooding the track. The track will have drainage holes in it and a cill would then carry the water clear of the wall/frame. It's crucial in your case to have a continuous membrane under the frame /cill that will shoot the water outwards from the frame drainage holes. Sometimes the frame section has a facility for feeding and trapping the membrane inside it preventing water ingress. You may also need to dress the membrane up the inside vertical surface of the window frame, but this isn't ideal as it could still be seen after the floor covering goes down. Better that water doesn't track under at all. I've seen that in New Zealand they have to use a thin plastic tray under their widow and door installations to prevent this issue. I was advised to use Bostik flash band material inside the timber frame reveal of a dormer window I fitted which gives the timber a sound and impervious surface that can better seal with silicone or foam. Why have you opted for no cill with your set up. Wouldn't a cill prevent this problem? Are you going for a flush patio following the build? In which case you will need drainage channels externally at the base of your door frame to carry water away. If your door was fitted professionally I'd certainly have them back and reserve some payment until you are certain it is right. Not sure just adding more goo will solve the issue now that the whole lot is saturated. Hope this helps.👍

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea is to have a level threshold inside, and a slight step outside, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

Missing a sloped sill, I tend to flash tape the timbers than dpm also. Could also make an aluminium tray to completely bomb proof it

Are there any rubber washes on those screw heads? It will track down them too. Defo cut the foam back to stop any small pooling. Worst case scenario is wait for a dry day then use different colour dye in controlled areas.

Tbh there should not be concrete screws on the bottom rail which sits on the floor. There should be straps underneath the bottom rail and nailed or screwed into the floor joists. I don't think it's sealed properly underneath the bottom rail either, there should be no gap. Hope this helps.

We had a similar issue with our sliding doors, same situation, so on the inside the window is level with the floor so there is no threshold. We have a modern profile where water that enters the profile comes out at the outside bottom, so whenever a window like that is installed in Belgium they put down a bead of silicone and put the window on top of it, like that water can’t go to the inside but it can escape on the outside. At my place, the installer forgot that. So water came in just like you showed, they came back, took the expanding foam out, and sealed it at the inside bottom, problem solved. Also, expanding foam is not made to prevent water from passing, it will fail over time, always use some sort of silicone. Expanding foam around windows is to bridge the isolation gap between the wall isolation and the window, and has some other advantages, but it can never be a water barrier. Hope it helps.

@ColinDH12345

3 жыл бұрын

Agree with the foam but silicone fails over time as well.

@wannespq2151

3 жыл бұрын

@@ColinDH12345 correct. That’s why your primary barrier must be mechanical. So water that comes out of the window profile must be able to get out on the outside, hits the sill ( that is sloping towards the outside ). It water manages to get up between window and sill, it hits the silicone, if over time water manages to pass the silicone it will find the dpm membrane that’s under the sill and which is folded upwards on the inside of the window profile.

I guess it might of been ok till now? Then the north easterly wind blows and the track might fill up a bit from this heavy rain and then where does the water go? does it have a way out to the front from the track......do the screws need a smudge of silicon on them? Just a thought....Also I hope they sprayed under before putting the foam in as it sticks the foam better to the frame.....well thats what it says on my can

is it missing the bottom set?

I would say you need a sill even if it’s a small stub type, then the track should have drain holes that flow on to the sill. If not there should be drains into the front of the frame.

Rain water hits the glass of the door, runs down the door into the tracks. The tracks usually have a weep hole to carry water to the front face of the PVC frame, sometimes that hole can lead out to the bottom side of the track, sometimes it leads out to the front face of the track. If you silicone or spray foam the front edge you might have blocked the weep holes if they are on the bottom. I think the ones that have the holes on the bottom are meant to be sat on top of a plastic sill which has a flat section that the door sits on and then a sloped section to carry water away from the side of the building. That's my guess anyway. I'm not trade, just something I discovered on a regular UPVC door in my house in the past.

@HaroonAshraf

3 жыл бұрын

My thoughts above also. Haven't actually fitted external doors myself, but they would come with weep vents and sill to take water away from building envelope. Sorry can't be too helpful. Door supplier can't help?

@stewartos83

3 жыл бұрын

Totally agree frame designed to let water pass through weep holes, that’s why the detail below the frame needs to be spot on if your not stalling a cill that would normally come with the doors. Water has to track under or through the front of the frame to the outside & not back into the building.

@michaelanderson6625

3 жыл бұрын

I agree

You got already very good feedback on the problem, my two cents...I don't think it's good practice that there is no cill(specially been your own house, so no point for corner-cutting) and the presence of expanding foam under the bottom rail. Not only doesn't seal but also there's no mechanical strength, so every time you slide the doors, there is movement on the bottom of the frame pulling the water in as a pump and sponge...I would strongly suggest to install a rock solid cill and start from there. Big fan of your channel btw, I'm enjoying your content.,👍

@pawelkot5824

3 жыл бұрын

Just to add that I agree with the floor been flush with the bottom rail, so I would prefer to chisel out and little from the concrete block to make room for the cill installation. Pita job but cutting some slot with the grinder will make it a little easier.

Short sill , they will do a short version to match the door, if you put a linear drains outside just under , plus all the usual sealants , you'll be ok.

Needs a cill, as it forces/allows water away from the frame and to outside. If you don’t want the big lip on the outside you can get stubby versions.

Like you say cut foam and seal might be an idea to take them screws out and pump some silicone in and put screws back

The foam has/is stopping the door system from draining in the way in which they are designed. The door will drain via weep holes to the underside of the threshold.

Do the black slide trays have drainage holes in them ?

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, I'll check them for blockages

Cut and seal like you said😀

Hi, Thanks for sharing the problem. All uPVC patios will have weep holes engineered into the frame to allow run off of water. In your case i suspect that over the past few days you have had the patio open and exposed to the elements, allowing water and hailstone to collect in the slide channel and when sufficient quantities accumulate this then finds its way through the weep hole downwards. Normally, there would be a 150mm cill underneath the uPVC to protect against this. I am struggling to see the cill in your video hence I suspect the runoff is finding its way onto the DPM and running inwards as it looks sealed on the outside with expanding foam. If this patio door will become internal then this problem will disappear, however if external then this will need correcting.

@aashirkhan5650

3 жыл бұрын

A possible least impact solution would be to get the fitters back to put a lead tray underneath the patio which is folded upwards on the inside and allows the weeping rain water to run outwards.

Door should have a cill under it even if it's a stub cill, there should be drainage hole in the inside the pfile of the frame that allow any water that may run down the sash to then drain through on to cill and run out.

The frame on the Smarts Aluminium patio doors normally drain through the bottom of the frame. You can see these when you slide the doors open cheers Tim Miell Glass and Windows

There’s no sill and fixed through the bottom rail not just the sides so looks like its going through the screws...

Those doors should have weep holes on the front, I would always expect there to be dpm along the base like you have, however I would expect it to be installed like a cavity tray, so turned up at the sides and the inside so basically forcing any water away from the inside. I would try doing this by putting a batten along the inside, and also make sure to cover anywhere the door might be collecting water, then maybe remove the batter in a few days and see if the tray is damp, but fit it back anyway for belt and braces. Fitting a door on expanding foam is pretty standard so wouldn’t like to say if it’s an installer issue or not. 🤷🏼‍♂️

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea is to have a level threshold inside, and a slight step outside, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

Expanding foam does rot away very quickly when exposed to water I personally would have had a sill fitted to the doors they all have a drip groove in them foam will do nothing only draft proof if not water proofed its a tricky one know the doors are fitted I would defiantly get the foam out and get some good quality silicone in there its a shame you carnt fit a sill in

I'd say the foam is blocking the drainage holes for the water to pass, should be sat on a cill really and also I have known water to pass down the fixings too.

Is there a drain somewhere thats possibly blocked and water running back? Funny how the lefthand side is dry. Good luck getting it sorted.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

There are weep holes on the outside...I'll check them for blockages. Thanks

Have you noticed water building up internally even when the doors have been closed ?? I would personally be questioning why the fitters have screwed through the exterior track as there is obviously no cover from the elements once the doors are fully closed. If you can keep the doors closed during your next downpour and prove water is still penetrating i would be taking photographs and writing a shitty email to the installation company. I would also seriously consider cutting back the plastic, dpm and expanding foam and applying a weatherproof mastic around the whole frame just to cover your arse and be 100% sure its not due to lack of weatherproofing. I can personally recommend sikaflex EBT comes in match up colours and should be available in any screwfix. It wouldn't hurt to contact the installation company and make them aware of your concerns and see what they can suggest before holding them solely to blame. Hope this helps Sam

Watched that video again. Is there any drainage holes anywhere on the base or the doors to run the water collected in the door channel outside

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

I haven't fully inspected, but I was told there are draining/weep holes on the outside front of the track, which is how we could get away with not having a cill, but if it's weeping down onto the DPM and then getting sucked back in by capillary action then it doesn't really work!

@trevoradams3148

3 жыл бұрын

No ideal but if you can get nothing else done cut off the foam on the outside and seal them well up from the inside. At least then the water that gets in can only run out. I have near seen any door or window packed up at the bottom with expanding foam. It should only be used around the top and sides. Then again what do I know I am only a Bus driver builder😀

I think that the base of the frame should have a draining channel to let water drain out so possibly the channel is blocked with the expanding foam and cannot escape. atb Andy.

Did you solve this? Thanks i have wood frame with aluminium doors that are doing same thing albeit mine is an old door. I removed the conservatory and started to get this problem.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

Жыл бұрын

Yes I did solve it in the end - check out a later video that shows what we did...we had to ensure there was no way for water to track in/down to the sub-floor

@almaghrabee

Жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder I cant find it. Any chance you could post the link. Much appreciated. Thanks

You may have blocked up the drainage holes with the expanding foam. You need to have an aluminium pressing underneath the outer frame. Tim Miell Glass and Windows

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea was to have a level threshold inside, and a slight step outside, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

@chriskane9230

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder You could try Get an aluminium tray made up same colour as doors that sits underneath it, They can be 5 mm thick, something that sits inside 15mm high then goes under door and over external brick work, If your door was installed by a company I would be phoning them up and claiming the warranty, Your door should of been 35mm smaller and had a cill on it.

Is that’s part where you have put a double DPM and the water is tracking back between the two ?

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

That may well be a part of it, good observation!

Did the issue ever go away? I have an aluminium sill that was also letting water in and under the laminate on the inside. All of the silicone in the world wasn’t making a difference

@OfficeBoyBuilder

Жыл бұрын

That's bad, sorry to hear mate! The main issue for us was caused by the screws in the frame, which were exposed to the elements. The rain would get sucked down the screw thread by capillary action, and then pool inside the house. We packed the screw hole and screw head full of silicone and it stopped.

@pea_sea

Жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder cheers for your quick reply. That’s not a bad idea with the silicone, I can see the screw heads in my bifold track, so I might seal those off. In our track we have holes that are supposed to help drainage, but as a little experiment, I put water into the track to see if it would come out of the bottom of the sill at the front…but it didn’t. I assume that the water was still going under the floorboards. Very frustrating!

don't want to point out the obvious but where's the window sill do deflect the water away from the door?

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

Yes good point there isn't a cill...we were told we didn't need one, and I didn't want to have to raise up the floor height too much to achieve the flush finish I'm after.

Could you tell me how you solved this please? I can't see another video or explaination ? I have the same issue in my property.🙄 Thank you!

@OfficeBoyBuilder

Жыл бұрын

Hey, I did do a follow up, but can't remember what it's called! They came and ensured the weep/drainage holes were clear and open, and then also put tons of silicone in/on/around the screws at the bottom of the frame, to ensure water couldn't get pulled down into the sub frame.

Is the water coming from under the cill? Defo looks like water is coming in. I’d call fitters back

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

There isn't actually a cill under it, just the frame...I think I'll call them back

@b21playa

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder that’s the best call mate 👍 keep up the excellent work

Doors and frame out in dry weather and reinstall, better to find out now is the small upside of this.

If I had a company fit a door or window on a bed of foam (on what I’m assuming is a perfectly level subframe) I’d be calling them back without a shadow of a doubt! Don’t add more! Because foam is only water resistant if it skins over and is then left, as soon as you cut off e excess it’s then in no way shape or form going to stop water tracking back in. Should never be fitted without an external sill. Their job to to take any water that tracks down and direct it outside. Without one it’s inevitable that the water will track inside.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea was to have a level threshold inside, and a slight step outside, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

theres no cill to drain the water, the screws are not sealed (not that you should have screws there anyway) there shouldnt be or need any foam under that unit, get the fitters back to fit them properley, you wouldnt fit a window like that and it will only get worse

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea is to have a level threshold, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

If you’re looking for a level threshold which by your video it looks like you’re having should’ve really had a sheet metal profile underneath the bottom track which would carry the water from the weep holes out past the edge of the block work and onto the floor, also screwing through that bottom track is completely wrong for this system of sliding door 😑

To be honest the best thing to do is clean everything off and wait for a clear day outside and check for where the water is actually coming in

Cut the foam and Dpm and silicone up

Cut the expanding foam out so the water can drain and escape

No point not having a cill unless you are having a level thresholds then its a different detail.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea is to have a level threshold, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

@andrewpalij4691

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder Should be fine as long as the exterior detail is correct ,not sure how it works with timber framing as we always have a cavity tray or C section in brickwork either side of the doors.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah I get that, although it is brick (cement block) under the aluminium track/frame...I'll clean it all out and check for blockages

@markedwards8139

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder hi Tom, not had a chance to see all your recent videos so unsure if you covered this since, but are you able to give an update on how this issue got resolved

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

Hey mate, check out this one - kzread.info/dash/bejne/f22g1K6LpcfOpaQ.html 3 months later, and there has been no more leak/ingress of water after the changes they made 👍👍

It might be of interest to you (if you haven't already) to watch the latest video released by 'Scott Brown Carpentry' , around 5min 30 sec in he explains their system (in NZ) for resolving this type of issue.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

I love that bloke, will definitely take a look 👍

i’d put more foam under the seal and then cut it back and seal it with the same colour silicone as the sliding doors👍🏻

@catabaticanabatic3800

3 жыл бұрын

You can deform a frame with too much expanding foam.

@ittsjaake9055

3 жыл бұрын

@@catabaticanabatic3800 yeah true i just didn’t know how much expanding foam they had put in but yes you’re right👊🏻

The door should sit on a cill, not dpm. Get them to reinstall.

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

The idea was to have a level threshold inside, and a slight step outside, which is what I specified when we were buying and detailing the door. I was told by the supplier that this was possible, hence my query now. I think I'll be calling them back!

@ColinDH12345

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder I think if you go back positively asking questions they will be OK. Don't go steaming back. Foam and silicone are not long terms solutions. Water works with gravity and capillary action and that should form the long term solution. A cill doesn't have to be deep by the way. We did one at a village hall and the 'cill' was only 15mm.

@ColinDH12345

3 жыл бұрын

@@OfficeBoyBuilder Just an example... www.shiredoors.com/bifold-doors-weathered-threshold-options-is-it-important/

@OfficeBoyBuilder

3 жыл бұрын

Completely agree - diplomacy and tact will get this sorted...the fact is it's going to cost us both time and money, so I'm sharing his pain!

You wasted almost all of this video thanking people and talking about your problem and not getting to the solution. 🤦