Hi All, So back in the shop again, with a look at the Trend MFT jig. Let me know what you think, and how about that price point.... Andy

That's a really informative video Andy! Got me inspired to getting back at making my workshop! Looking forward for more videos in the future!

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hey, welcome to the channel, you definitely need to get that workshop completed. Cheers Andy

Awesome content! Thank you. I recommend the Parf Guide system. Is infinity flexible, crazy accurate and precise, and able to do custom hole configurations - adding an exterior line of holes around the outside perimeter of the MFT for exterior dog placement for track guides, as an example.

Great video. Im going to try and cut our own this week and this has helped a lot, should be fun!

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Glad it helped, Let me know how you get on. Cheers Andy

Great honest review Andy. What ever system people use, it seems like a one trick pony, use it once or twice and then its redundant. But all that said, i agree with your other users, the Parf Guide system seems like the one to choose. Great to see you back in the workshop. Cheers Paul

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Paul, Always good to have your input, I think you have hit the nail in the head. How many times will you make an MFT top. I am probably extreme at the moment as I am re-building the shop. But even then, I will use it for two inserts on the bench, probably two portable units as part of the Kapex station and then.... that’s about it. Then its work is over. However, you need the accuracy you either build or buy. If you build you need a template - so what can you do... Cheers Andy

Very well put together demonstration, engaging throughout and fully explaining the merits and disadvantages of the Trend MFT Jig. Setting it against the competitor products was very helpful. I've been a Trend fan for twenty years and I own a couple of similar tools that do one thing only - but do it very well. Having said that, they're tools that get used time and again, rather than once - unless you happen to be in the MFT building business...... I wonder if we'll see E-Bay listings for "Trend MFT Jig - used once" ? Thanks for taking the time to make the video.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Wow, looking at your KZread name I assume you are in some sort of education, so thank you for the feedback. I like the jig - and it is a one time tool, but it does it well. Andy

Thanks Andy. Was considering this against the Parf guide.I’ll go with the Parf guide for the flexibility and fact this will be my first go at an MFT top of my making.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, Yes that is what I would do Next weekend I will be dropping in the router lift into the other panel. But there will still be some dog holes in strategic positions. It will be interesting to see if the Trend Jig can cope with that. Good luck Andy

Hello, I am a starting wood amateur from Belgium. Very interesting video, tx a lot!

Great just what I needed

First and foremost great to have you back missed you try woodpeckers no silver paper part guide brilliant

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Thomas, Good to be back, I am not familiar with the Woodpeckers system - just tried a Google but can’t see it. Will dig a bit deeper tomorrow. Cheers Andy

@tjskinny

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter Hi Andy, Great honest review! Here is the link for the woodpecker version. www.woodpeck.com/hole-boring-jig-2019.html

@ronh9384

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter I have the Woodpecks jig. Like any other make sure your guide bush is centered and fits the holes of the jig snugly and hone your router bit to the size of the dogs you are going to use on your bench.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronh9384 The Woopecks jig looks really good. As Ron says you would have a similar challenge, but as they supply the bush I assume that is a good fit. So just the router bit is the variable. Also that price point is awesome - couple that with Woodpecker reputation for quality and precision then what’s not to like. Cheers Andy

Thanks for the vid and review Andy, I would say the parf guide system does have its chances for inaccurate use but do think it is a lot more versatile in setups of layout types. I do think over £150 for a piece of laminate and a couple of dogs and pins. They could of included a bush at least. Good impartial review.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Kenny, Thank you for the feedback and taking time to comment. Yes it is a high price tag to swallow - but it does what it says on the tin. I checked that silver foil I put on the bush earlier on, and it has worn away - so looks like a finite number of uses before you need to find some other packing material. I would guess at that point the Trend bush makes sense. The trend 20mm bit and the 30mm bush will cost you another £30 on the price. Cheers Andy

Each of us have their own way of working and uses a MFT style top in different ways and to differing amounts. I had a local CNC shop make mine about 10 years ago at 1600 x 1000 to act as a workbench and an outfeed table. In my new workshop I don’t need it as primary workbench and also not as an outfeed table. But I still have an occasional need. Explanations; Even after that period of time, I haven’t used most of the holes. I’ve turned the top over but it is still in reasonable condition partly because I haven’t treated it as a sacrificial cutting board - when I cut, I slip a 3mm or 6mm MRMDF offcut under the cut line. My primary workbench now is a shop made bench 2200 x 800 solid ash bench with (soon to be fitted) wagon vice and leg vice. Some dog holes obviously but at 100mm thick, I can’t use the MFT compatible cramps. No loss as I’m making a vacuum system which I think will give me what I need in terms of holding pieces tight. I was able to find a used mains powered lift table. It has a 5T capacity - I can’t see myself needing more than 500kgs. It was a static piece but I made a torsion box with HD castors to go under. It’s now mobile and I only connect to power when I want to life or lower. I can now slide big slabs of timber out of

Great video Andy. That trend jig looks interesting, just the price though 😜. I remember buying their pocket hole jig years ago for around £80. But here in the UK, kreg jig wasn't available then (which was still cheaper). Need to have a look at that sauter shop website. I do remember that you mentioned about it in your last vlog video. Cheers 🍻

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, Thank you for your feedback, as somebody pointed out the price has dropped significantly (I quoted the retail price) the street price for the jig is now around £110. I have the Kreg PHJ - nice bit of kit, I have never used the Trend version but I assume they are pretty similar. Cheers Andy

Hey Andy, Another great vid 🙌🏻 I wanted to ask how your getting on with your Axminster Planer Thicknesser? I’ve had my AT310 in the workshop about 3 months now and the results have been getting worse. Now when joining boards I’m getting gaps at each end! Spent 2 days reconfiguring - the tables appear to be completely parallel apart front the infeed randomly in the middle which has an ever so subtle catch when running the straight edge front the out feed to infeed! Got to say I’ve never faffed so much with a machine🤦🏻‍♂️🤷🏻‍♂️

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you for the feedback, I did start to get some snipe about three months in, when I checked the outfoxed table alignment it had drifted so we no longer flush to the blade. After I re-calibrated it, it was as sweet as a nut. Great finish and zero snipe. It may be worth while checking that alignment ? Cheers Andy

Great video. Encountered unexpected problem - using trend router with recommended trend guide bush (gb 30/A) and the guide bush so tight it's hard to insert and lifts jig when trying to remove causing movement and inaccuracy! Waiting for trend direct to get back with advice. Wondered if anybody else encountered same problem?

I bought the woodpeck one and same problem after being very very careful. But wood peckers template guide is smaller and uses a 1/2 bit to cut holes. Too many things can go wrong making any tops over 12x 24 holes. Did you use a centering bit to make sure the template guide was perfectly centerer? Returning it and have a UJK parf guide system coming

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, The Trend cut pretty accurately in the end, about 0.1-degree error over the table. I corrected that with a small shim on my fence - so all good. I used a mandrel to ctr my router base to me router, then relied on the Trend supplied 30mm dogs to ctr in the holes. Cheers Andy

Hi Andy, I think this is the best video out there about this style of mft build, I have seen them all I believe, thanks for mentioning accuracy and what to do or avoid. Quick question, how do you find velcromat as mft top, how is the accuracy of the grid as you put more milage on it? Thank you.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, Thank you for feedback, The VM is good, I did find it chipped a little around the holes so would recommend a chamfer of some sort. It is one dusty productbtincut though... The grid is pretty much bang on, runs out by about 0.1 degrees over the surface. If I were to do it again I would focus on the back row of holes (where the fence goes) and the holes that the track goes into. So long as they are square then the rest if the grid is less important. Cheers Andy

@bluewanderer9903

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter thank you 👍

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

👍

I have a similar product made by dominofix, when making a larger mft it would run out, and I found the problem to be the of1400, the clip in 30mm guide bush wasnt really anywhere near centre, I had the same problem with the of2200 as well, after buying a new base plate which allowed for use of a centering mandrel for accuracy the problem was solved, just thought I'd share this, if your ever thinking of making a larger top. Cheers

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Neil, Thank you for sharing that, I didn’t think of that issue. Having said that I did ctr my router plate with a mandril some time ago. So I probably didn’t have that issue. But now you have mentioned it - it is pretty obvious that could cause problems. Great feedback. Andy

@ThekiBoran

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter How did you center it? I had to notch the guide bushing plate on mine and I removed the 2 tiny set pins. kzread.info/dash/bejne/hYipqtVpera3pLA.html

What material are you using, the "black stuff" ?

Hi there , what’s your verdict compared to the parf system ? Seeing the parf mk2 is around £200 Great vid 👍

I made my own jig very precisely the key is to make sure that the router or drill bit and any and all machines used are all facing the same direction for every hole so if there is error, all the holes will have the same error and the results will be that they are all still in perfect alignment of each other. at least it has been my experience everyone who makes their own jig will have their own issues to discover. although since my festool MFT holes are not all perfectly spaced I've basically decided I'm not depending on the holes and the dogs for perfect alignment because tolerances continue to vary depending on the dogs you use. The only tool I trust is my large PTR 18 square from TSO for setup. after seeing that little wiggle movement that you demonstrated I'm thinking yep there you go another imperfect jig that will eat away at you.

@TheWoodgrafter

Жыл бұрын

Yep, And that wiggle did indeed put some errors across the table. I used a couple of shims to square the fence up, and that solved the problem and gave me the accuracy I was after. BUT it still annoys me :-( I now have the a Benchdogs jig and will be re-making the board in the near future. Good tip on tool alignment, will be using that on the next attempt. Cheers Andy

Nice video. Looks like the trend jig produces some good results. What cutter are you using for your holes? I bought the titman edge MFT jig which is a bit cheaper but Im encountering issues with the holes being slightly too big for the supplied dogs even with a good fit on the guide bush.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, I am using the Trend 20mm bit - I love trend router bits. www.trenddirectuk.com/c030dx1-2tc-two-flute-cutter-20-0mm-diameter Cheers Andy

@harpalyke4659

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks, Andy. I was using a similar trend bit (C030CX1/2TC) but the one you linked seems to be recommended by them for MFT holes. The festool one actually showed up in the port this morning so I'll see how that works between a couple of different routers first. Thanks!

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

@@harpalyke4659 Can you let me know how you get on with the Festool bit, I have had mixed reviews. Cheers Andy

@harpalyke4659

3 жыл бұрын

​@@TheWoodgrafter Sure no problem. Will hopefully get a chance to give it a go over the weekend.

@harpalyke4659

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter - Did a quick check on a bit of scrap 18mm ply this evening with the festool cutter. Holes are again slightly too big. Holes are measuring about 20.08~20.1mm after the cut. Router was firmly clamped to the workpiece so it should be fairly spot on. My dogs from benchdogs.co.uk are measuring about 19.97mm and the guide dogs with jig are about 20.2mm so there is a bit of play in both. Might give the bit you mentioned a go and see how that works. I'm developing quite the collection of 20mm cutters though :-) How do you find the fit with that cutter, is it pretty snug with the bench dogs?

Hi Andy, have you tried to find a reason for the wobbling/movement (at 10:11)? Is it because the holes just drilled are too big? or are the 3 black dogs too small? My experience is that holes made with the Parf Guide System give very tight holes compared to holes made with the router and a 20mm bit. I have not tried the bit from Trend but holes made from a 20mm bit from Festool and others are simply too big. The dogs I use are all Parf Dogs. I think we're talking about tolerances between 19.98 and 20.02 (from snug to too wide)

@ronh9384

3 жыл бұрын

Peter Millard did a video that I think was recent and he talked about the Festool 20mm router bit was slightly over 20mm and he had a friend reduce the size to 20mm. I have 3 20mm bits and all three are slightly oversized. I did find one at the store that was spot on. I believe it was a Whiteside brand. One of the bits I have I was able to hone the carbide cutters with a diamond hone and got it down to 20mm.

@barrieheard9426

3 жыл бұрын

I got parf guide mk 11 my top is out of square. Takes a long time to make as well. When u drill its easy to drill out of square buy a hair so can throw things out. Parf guide need to be made for a router be quicker to do holes and be more square. But someone needs to make a proper size router bit. 10 minute workshop done best way so far. But u need festool router and accessories. What comes to a lot of money.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Barrie, interesting feedback on the Parf Guide system. I did hear similar feedback from others as well, in terms of router size, the trend bit I used is bang on google 20mm trend bit for MFT table. Cheers Andy

Excellent video. I was torn between buying this jug and the Parf Guide system. I suspect the Parf Guide will be my choice. With regards that black MDF insert. Where did you source the sheet? I'm struggling to find it.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you, The Trend jig does work well, quick and simple and accurate. The price is significantly lower than the RRP I quoted, just google for the street price. It has limitations in that you can’t create offset holes etc. And you are governed as to the starting point of the the grid. Limitations the Parf guide system overcomes. I have no regrets on the jig, but then again the Parf Guide is awesome. I don’t think you will make a wrong choice. The black insert is Valchromat, you can also google colour through MR MDF for other brands. I use a local supplier Atlantic Timber www.atlantictimber.co.uk/search/for/Valchromat/ I am not sure if they deliver nationwide, but other suppliers are around the UK. Cheers Andy

@lawman1965

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter Thanks, as it so happens I'm just on the Atlantic Timber site.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Delivery was slow, but it was in the middle of lockdown 1. Nice guys though, and super helpful. They also have an interesting stock of hard woods and live edge slabs, Cheers Andy

What material is the black worktop please? Great video and very informative. Thankyou for sharing

@TheWoodgrafter

Жыл бұрын

Hi Ian, It is a type of MDF, but very high quality. Know as Velchromat, check out here mdfdirect.co.uk/product/valchromat-mdf-full-board/?gclid=CjwKCAiAxP2eBhBiEiwA5puhNVOCkEk8eVJvHkqKUsxv0yU0N5gAGj7Der0wtNzmyjkxkB7gGowi0BoCLMAQAvD_BwE But sit down before you check out the price :-) Andy

@jezza42

Жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter thanks Andy, I’ll check that out 👍

very nice - which router bit did you use? or did it come with the Trend MFT jig?

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

Hi, Trend actually make a router bit specifically made for MFT holes. Google Trend 20mm MFT bit. They do make two 20mm bits - but it is the one for MFT you need. And sadly - no it doesn’t come with the kit :-( Cheers Andy

Hi, thanks for the review. Can I ask you which router bit you used for this. Many bits of this size are not able to bore a hole as the cutting edge is not across the whole diameter. I hope that makes sense !

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

Hi, yes the bit is very important. As well as the cutting head, not all 20mm cutters are 20mm enough for an MFT even the Festool one is not what it needs to be. The only one I have found that works for me, is the trend 20mm - but be careful they make 2 (just to add confusion). This is the link to the one that works. trenddirectuk.com/trend-c030dx1-2tc-two-flute-cutter-20-0mm-diameter.html Cheers Andy

@stephenwhite3343

2 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter Thank you. I thought getting a 20mm cutter for this would be easy, but as you imply, it's a bit of a mine field.

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

@@stephenwhite3343 yep, so many variables to get a clean cut that works with dogs etc. Good luck.

Just used the jig and had lots of slack! Used a Trend T7e with their 30mm bush and the fit was tight, no wiggle. But after cutting the holes with a brand new Trend 20mm bit, I’m left with lots of wiggle and 21mm holes. Any clues where I’ve gone wrong? Bench surface is birch ply based protector board. Thanks

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, It sounds like the tolerance of the bit, Trend make two router bits at a claimed 20mm. One however has the MFT/Table top designation in the description and the other doesn’t. I used this bit www.trenddirectuk.com/c030dx1-2tc-two-flute-cutter-20-0mm-diameter Is that different than the one you used ? Cheers Andy

@nickparris8150

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Andy Think you’re right, I used a standard bit with ¼ shank and probably over extended as only a 20mm plunge. Now ordered the correct bit, cheers.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Yes that sounds like the problem, I have had feedback that a number of the standard 20mm bits don’t actually work that well in an MFT. But I know the dedicated trend one works, Good luck Andy

Most important is not mentioned, align the router bit to the guidebush to perfection, that make or break your MFT project.

Nice video sir!!, you did another video on cutting long boards ( not sure if the video was called that exactly but its in the same ball park), have you got a link to it? ps the pic of the video had you standing next to your long mft .

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you for the feedback, not sure of the video you have in mind. I did one with parallel guides Was it this one? kzread.info/dash/bejne/f2GYqrpup9uYcso.html Regards Andy

@ChristopherClaudioSkierka

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter Hi there, no it was not that one, it relates to long boards. Seen it once , then cannot find it since.

Hi there, interesting but the foil is a bit of a put off and what happened about the movement when you put those black bench dogs in the holes? surely the 20mm holes are not in line? or did I miss something?

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, The foil allows for the variance in third party bushes, the black dogs are actually 30mm at the top and 20mm at the bottom. So once you get the first holes made (using the edge pins) then the black dogs hold it all square. Cheers Andy

@ChristopherClaudioSkierka

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafterThank you for the reply... Exactly, variant is possible even with the foil after a few holes are made with the foil moving out of place etc. The movement I was mentioning was the 'wobble' at 10.10 in the video when those black dogs were inserted then you moved it around, it should of been rigid. it looks like a bush/foil issue if those black dogs are a perfect fit which is very likely (you would of noticed it right away)? the end pins inserted after you the placed the black dogs into the holes just covered the issue not showed it was perfect. There should of not been any wobble at all . I am not knocking you, its good that you have shown this to us to make our own choices of which system to use. I like your work table by the way, good size, I am about to make one just slightly shorter but wider .

Where do you buy this in the US?

Do you need a specific bush guide for a specific router. Or is it universal.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, You do tend to get variances between router manufacturers and how the bushes fit to the base. You can find universal bushes that use a threaded nut to attach the bush to an adapter on the router plate - in that case you need to buy the appropriate universal plate for your router. What router do you have ? Cheers Andy

@Z-add

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter I have two, one is the makita RP2300FC which is 1/2" 2300W plunge router and a bosch palm router PR20EVS

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, So you can get a guide bush adapter like this one from Leigh www.axminstertools.com/leigh-guide-bush-adaptor-for-makita-3612c-721-210889 At that point you can then use threaded bush inserts like these www.axminstertools.com/ujk-technology-metric-threaded-guidebush-set-502571 You can also buy dedicated bushes such as this one for the Makita www.axminstertools.com/makita-guide-bushes-ax802404 But with multi brands in your shop, you may get more mileage with a couple of adapter plates and a universal bush kit. It all depends how much you use them, I know folks who have dedicated routers for specific jobs. But that is a bit extreme for most home shops. Cheers Andy

What size/type router bit are you using

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

Hi, It is the Trend 20mm router bit. They do two 20mm bits you need the one that is designed for the MFT table. Cheers Andy

Gonna have to try these jigs....although Trend are currently doing these for £87........the parf system is £140 and Parf2 is closer to £200........the jig is a no brainer

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Mark, The bottom line is it worked. And as you say the price point has come down considerably and at 87 pound it starts to make sense. I would also invest in the trend 20mm cutter - but be careful they make 2. You need the one that is designed for the MFT. Although I haven’t tried it, the trend 30mm bush should give tighter tolerance in the jig. Good luck. Andy

@markhollingsworth3097

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter I tried the Parf system but had to return it, think I had a poorly machined one that the pins jammed in the parf sticks.....shame really as it worked well. Will give the Trend version a try at the lower price.....cheers for the info on the 20mm cutter, will check them out 👍

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Always worth a try, I think you will be pleased with the results. Andy

I have been looking forward to your review since August! Comparing with the two Parf Guide systems, with this I think the initial holes have to be a fixed distance from the edge determined by the alignment pins whereas with the Parf Guides you can start anywhere. And you can go all isometric as well with the Parf Guide system. And some people may not have a router whilst most will have a drill. On pricing, I think you are harsh on Trend. D&M Tools have it at £110/€121. The Parf Guide systems are £140/€155 for the mark 1 and £200/€221 for the mark 2. Incidentally, I asked Peter about the recent £20 price rise on the mark 2 and he advised it now includes the dust extraction adapter which was formerly £24. On reflection, I think it would be Parf Guide as well for me. But many thanks for the review.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Julian, I agree you do have more limitation with the Trend in that the holes are fixed from edge. I guess you could find a way around that but it would bring risk into the accuracy - so you get pretty much what the jig dictates. I think the isometric feature in the Parf Guide system is an awesome feature. And now Peter has introduced the ability to extend the grid of holes without having to drill all the pilot holes at the outset further adds to the functionality. It's good to see that street price for the Trend has dropped to a more reasonable £110 (I used the recommended retail price) - but it is still an investment that has to be considered. AND if the Mk 1 system is round £140 then the same thought process applies - for the delta, what would you go for. The Mk2 system is steep at £200 - but I am with you, I would also go with the Parf Guide system due to the versatility of the system. This video wasn't really about comparing though (but it was only right to point out the alternatives) more about providing information on the Trend system that didn't seem to exist on KZread. I will use the top for a while, but I the not too distant future I will most likely purchase the Mk2 and recut the holes - I fancy a line of off ctr holes at the back of the bench to take the fence - giving more room on the top. Thank you for the considered response, and the additional input. Talk soon Andy

"Designed to take up the slack in your bush"......well I spat my coffee out :-) yeah at nearly 60 I am still a child. Could you use PTFE tape as well? Its currently about 80 to 100 pounds cheaper than the parfit system.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, Nice one, whenever you talk about bushes and routing I think Benny Hill starts to smile. They won’t forget Ernie - (that will test you). The PTFE tape would come lose, I noticed on the clean up the silver sticky tape had started to come away. The more I use the jig, the more I like it. Super quick and super accurate (so long as you are careful). Now that the street price has dropped I would buy the trend Bush as well - and get away from the tape completely. Cheers Andy

@RADCOMJ1

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter did he drive the fastest milk cart in the West lol

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

@@RADCOMJ1 We now have a generation of folks scratching their heads.....

Hi Andy :) You can make a MFT top with the Festool LR32 system. Though aligning the rails 90° can always give one trouble.That's why I understand why you use the Trend jig. Though: If you have a Benchdogs rail square (and the top is already squared up) do you think the LR32 system would deliver? Then the critical operation is just aligning where the holes crosses (on every row). What do you think? If one would only do a cutting station where the 90° is more important then grid pattern it sounds very possible. Of course given that you have squared up you top before :) Anyway just wanted to hear your thoughts, I was surprised that I did not consider it earlier.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, I had the same thought but just couldn’t get the LR32 to work. However, a wiser man than I, managed to work it out. Peter Millard take a step forward, check out this video. kzread.info/dash/bejne/dZN-j7KEorjVYbw.html Cheers Andy

@i679n5

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter thanks Andy 👍 already did. You can find the same conversation in that video's comment :)

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

LoL It was a very clever idea. Cheers Andy

I question Trend's price-point there, tbh. The PGS seems far superior to me, without trying the Trend, obviously. Geeat video Andy.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, looks like it now has a street price of around £110 - so huge discount from recommended retail price I quoted. Looks like the market has found the value. I think the Trend is quick and easy - but a one trick pony - the PGC gives more flexibility in the lay out and design of the top. Thank you for the comment. Cheers Andy

What bit did you use?

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Rodney, The Trend 20mm MFT bit. They make two 20mm bits, so check it is the one recommended for the MFT Cheers Andy

Too be honest I can’t believe how much they are charging for for something that can be batched out in huge numbers with a CNC router and lathe. Two machines almost every shop out there already has. At least the parf system comes with the drills and guides. For this system I still have to buy a good 20mm bit a good quality guide bushing.

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

Yes that is a good point, it is an expensive piece of kit - that has one use. The street price has come down considerably since this video but still over £100. And you are correct a well calibrated shop CNC can make something similar and you can buy 30/20 mm dogs off the shelf. So self build is an option. Cheers Andy

As others have commented, that’s a bit expensive compared to the Parf Guide. Is that Trend bit slightly undersized to ensure a snug fit for the dogs, as many seem to produce a sloppy fit. Peter Millard at 10Minute Workshop recently made an MFT top and had to get his router bit machined for an accurate fit.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, I know that Trend make a number of 20mm cutters, but they specifically call out this one for the MFT. www.trenddirectuk.com/c030dx1-2tc-two-flute-cutter-20-0mm-diameter Just popped into the shop and measured it, is seems to have a diameter of 20.02 mm so pretty tight tolerance. And the dogs are certainly a good fit - no slop what so ever. I have tried the quad dogs, the dance dogs, the table top protectors and the rail dogs and all fit very well. Cheers Andy

@idlersdream826

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafter Thanks Andy, that’s good to know and a reasonable price too, compared to the UJK 20mm cutter at £42.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

No probs

Trend MFT/JIG - Multi-Functional Table Routing Jig 100.00 Pounds eBay UK

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Phil, That is a good price, and the more I use the jig, then more I like it. Quick and accurate. At a 100 it is probably worth the investment. Cheers Andy

Where I can buy it

@TheWoodgrafter

6 ай бұрын

I think Amazon stock it

I have been looking for a good system to make a MFT top for my outfeed table off my table saw. This is not the system I would choose. Looks fidly, is more expensive than the parf mk2 as you need a 30mm template and 20mm router bit to purchase, and by your video the accuracy can be compromised if you are not careful. Dang, I like the trend stuff generally but this is one I’m not so sure on. Keep up the great videos.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Robert, The MK2 Parf is now around £200. I quoted the retail price for the Trend, but other comments have indicated you can get a street price of around £110. I use the Trend 20mm router bit that is designed for the MFT that comes in at around £30 and the Trend bush is about £10. So you will probably get all you need for around £150 ish. The accuracy is the issue, and you need to watch you step and check yourself. I actually measured the accuracy off camera with my digital angle finder. Four dogs making a right angle. In the starting corner I had an angle of 90.03 degrees, in the opposite corner (the final corner) I had a measurement of 90.01 degrees. So overall the results are pretty good. So it is still a good option, where the PGS wins is in versatility. You choose the starting position of the first hole and you can make offset holes if you need them. Cheers Andy

@robh.8214

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheWoodgrafterYes the above is true. I’m in Canada so there is shipping, duties, taxes and other fees I need to worry about. So £110 is $190 in CAD. Then the router bit is $60 here in Canada plus the cost of the 30mm bushing for the router, about $30-$50 depending on the type. I’m pretty much at the same price point as the local cost of the parf system mk2 with at minimum perceived better accuracy and proven better flexibility. Always good to see options though.

@markvincent1115

3 жыл бұрын

The Parf Guide Mk 1 is still available from Axminster at under £140 😊

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

@@markvincent1115 that is a good price point and has to be considered as a viable solution. Cheers Andy

i think I will stay with my Parf system

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi, If you have it, I wouldn’t change to the Trend. I just wanted to share a. Alternative approach. Cheers Andy

So frustrating that all these jigs and fixtures to make cheap "MFT" tops cost most than an MFT top. My Bora 2x4 foot top cost $50.00USD, I'll use it as a jig to produce more tops as required. If the Trend jig was $50 I'd buy it but it's a hard pass at three times that.

@TheWoodgrafter

Жыл бұрын

Yes the jig has come down in price since this video, but is still about twice the price of the Bora. There is a new jig on the market from Benchdogs - I will be looking at that in the near future - comes in under the 50 mark and is more versatile than the Trend. Can’t talk to accuracy or ease of use yet. Watch this space. And thank you for the comment. Andy

Woodpecker usa is also selling a similar product.

@TheWoodgrafter

2 жыл бұрын

Hi, Yes there are a few on the market, but all follow a similar technique. Andy

Tight Bush... 😂

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

🤭

Sorry, but wrapping that bushing in tape to take up the slack is one of the dinkiest set ups I have ever seen.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Jeff, It’s pretty normal for that type of jig. It’s due to the fact that not all 30mm bushes are created equally. The best way is to buy the Trend bush that is designed for the jig. Cheers Andy

What a ridiculous price, utterly unjustifiable.

Why didn’t you check this thing with a square? What about a standard 5-cut test? This video is utterly bogus marketing whank from Trend.

@TheWoodgrafter

3 жыл бұрын

Some people are so sceptical, you come across as very angry for some reason. Just to counter your accusation, Trend had no input to this video, like most of my videos I needed to make something, bought something with my money and shared the experience so others can gain from my successes and failures. I agree I should have tested the squareness in a more visual way, so poped back into the shop and measured the angle. Using four dogs to make a square I used my digital angle finder in the starting corner and had a reading of 90.03 degrees. I then repeated the exercise in the top right and had a reading of 90.01 degrees. So a 0.02 variance over the top and a tolerance that is well within usable limits. Cheers Andy