It's amazing how well that old Keith design has stood the test of time. He was the true pioneer of the sport. Thanks for the great video. 👍

Read his book. hell, I was there. Great read. 429421 double cavity is my go to for 44 cal loads.

Prior to relocating to Florida from St. Louis, Mo., some decades ago, I was big into reloading and bullet casting. I still have my molds but got rid of the plumbers furnace that I had years ago. I managed to acquire a considerable amount of linotype metal via my former father in law , which is very hard since it was used in an earlier era and contained a considerable amount of antimony. I used to cast the bullets and immediately drop them into a bucket of water with a towel at the bottom which served to quench the bullets. I would use a 50/50 mixture of clean linotype metal and wheel weights as well. By doing all of this the end result was that I got a bullet that was ultra hard and could barely be scratched with a fingernail. Using 2500 powder, per Elmer Keith's suggestion and in a S&W 29 revolver, I could get good results and the end result was that there was nominal bullet deformation, no leading in the barrel and good accuracy.

I've been shooting this bullet in my 44 for a good 50 years. They penetrate into next week, cut a hole for two blood trails, and are very accurate. Size them 431, no less than 430. BTW, "casted" is NOT a word. 😉

Keiths 240 Gr 44 Mag Bullets his favorite loading was with WW 2400 Powder I am sure, 22 Grs was the Max like you said here in the Video etc.

I love to hear stories about Elmer Kieth. I'm a big fan.

In my opinion the Kieth bullet is the best all around bullet for the .44 magnum. It is accurate, hits hard, penetrates deeply in muscle and bone and leaves a big hole. It may not be the best in every category but it does everything well.

@ammoiscurrency5706

5 ай бұрын

Jack of all master of none

Ihave a Bullet RCBS Lube Resizer that I still use to lub my cast Bullets, Some of my loads I fill the cases with Dacron Pillow stuffing to take up the empty spaces in the loaded Brass really helps the accuracy of the loads, Found this Tip years ago from another Hand Loader etc.

I appreciate you convincing me to buy a 1894 had talked myself out of buying it until I watched you video on the 1894 so I gave in an purchased it. Merry Christmas to myself... Lol ... Great videos I enjoy your content.

I use to have a lot of free Linotype Lead given to me from old style Printing Shops, I Casted a lot of Keiths Bullets with it & made a lot of Salt Water Fishing Sinkers out of them also, Sad those type of Printing shops are non existing any more, Glad I got the Lead when I did back in the 70's etc.

MP Molds and Arsenal Molds make authentic exact replica Elmer Keith molds. I have some for .38 SPL/.357 Mag and .44 SPL/.44 Mag from both. They aren't terribly expensive either considering what you are getting.

@chaecoco2

Жыл бұрын

Arsenal make great molds. I don't have any MP molds, but they sure look enticing. Might try one.

That bullet over 7.5 grains of Unique in a .44 Special case is my favorite all around load.

@hanc37

3 жыл бұрын

Mine is 14.5 gr. 2400, or 8.0 gr. Unique.

@u.p.woodtick3296

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks I’ll try em

@JamesWoods-zb5kb

21 күн бұрын

That was Skeeter Skeltons favorite 44 sp load published in a book about1982

@JamesWoods-zb5kb

Күн бұрын

This was Skeeters favorite all around load

Can you Please show the type of Lead Pot That your using to cast your Bullets with also Thanks for sharing great info video etc.

LBT and NOE both advertise that their Keith bullets are authentic. However, M-P molds carry true Keith designs in several calibers, including HP versions. I bought the M-P 431-245-K-HP and it's a very versatile mold at a very reasonable price. M-P's HP molds usually come with core pins for flat point and two or more depth/shape of HP. The Cramer type automatic core pins are a rebirth of an ingenious design that works wonderfully.

i know this video is 7 yrs old . but i have to comment on it . this happened to me with the true keith load . it was about 26 yrs ago . i worked up my load . was a great load . worked it up in a cold michigan winter .and used it for yrs . when i lived in michigan . then i moved to tennessee . lived here a yr . and then i went to go target shooting after i got everything set up to reload again . i loaded up 100 of my keith load . this was on a hot tennessee summer day . 98* outside . same bullets , even the same jug of 2400 powder . shot 6 rounds . and they kicked more then i remembered ! went to reload my sw 29 , and every case had to be beat out of the chamber with a wooden dowel ! to make this short i had to back off the charge by 6 grains ! to get the same load i had worked up in michigan . was it the temperature ? the altitude ? or a change in the powder ? i still dont know . new jugs of powder are still at the 'new' charge weight . be safe , and careful .

Steve, excellent content...I am not in the needle pusher club either.

@FortuneCookie45LC

6 жыл бұрын

Abdullah Mikail - Always great hearing from the Abdullah Mikail...!! Best to ya, FC Steve

I would love to load some of those

What are the dimensions on these Keith bullets from the nose (top) of the bullet to the first band?

So after coating with ballistol, do you chemically remove it or burn it off while heating up the mold ?

I found a true Keith swc .359, 178gr Hardcast. Matt's bullets online sells em and Big Fish Sports sells a 173grain equivalent. Long, steep forward nose, meplat almost as wide as WFN or LBT, but sharper edges, including at the driving ogive. Square base, full bore, no bevel except for the crimp groove. A rifleman's wadcutter. Sierra's matchkings accuracy is owed to their Keith cylinder shaped cores more than the jackets they enclose them in. Elmer bullets track straight like brenneke slugs because of the weight forward, tail drag balance. He's recorded to have once hit an antelope at 600yds using his 44 design.

@FortuneCookie45LC

6 жыл бұрын

virgosintellect - Matt's has made a real good niche for themselves with those .359" bullets - wisely as we really like those for doing our .001" bigger than cylinder throats. They wouldn't sell many of those to the shooters who concept the "bullets drop right through the cylinders" ideas that allow gas blow by and barrel leading from using small bullets. The argument is that the bullets will "slug up" to fill the throats. But the gas blow by happens before the bullets slug up (especially with hard cast bullets). Having the bullets .001" bigger than the throats doesn't require any slugging up - they just fill at the get go. Otherwise, why aren't we all using 9mm bullets for our 38/357s? Glad you brought up this significant point. Best to ya, FC Steve

Hello sir. Like alway, an awsome video! Where should I crimp a keith bullet? In the beggining or the end of the recessed part? A fan reloader from Brazil.

Thanks. They are heavy, but casting sessions do not have to be marathons. What helps is to use a Lee mold along with Lyman and alternate them - keeps molds (esp Lyman) from getting too hot. If the Lyman gets too hot, bullets will require tapping on hinge pin to get bullets to drop. Sponge works well to cool Lyman mold. No need to worry about water - it will turn to steam without casting danger if you give it a few seconds. If kept at right temp - bullets shake out. See new vid loading now.

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

I don't like casting from mismatched molds. For instance an RCBS 2CAV & a LYMAN 2CAV. The molds are differant heights, so you get a longer lead stream for the "shorter" mold. You get more rejects from the "shorter" mold. I tried to cast from a LYMAN 4CAV & a Lee 6CAV. I had more rejects from the shorter lee mold that from the "Taller" LYMAN mold. Also ELMER KEITH used a blend of 16/1, lead to tin. He never used wheelweights or any kind of alloy with antimony. And he NEVER WATER QUENCHED.

@navigator1383

6 жыл бұрын

Ever tried Franklin mold bullet drop spray?

Fortune what rcbs mold would you recommend for a 44 caliber for a 444 marlin a Henry big boy 44 mag and a ruger super redhawk 44 mag. I have a rcbs .44-200-fn but I think I need a little more weight for the 444. It could be a lyman also. Even have a gas check. Thanks in advance

I am curious about Ly2 429352 bullet, 245 grain full wadcutter. Will it dump more energy in soft tissue than 429421?

do you have any good sources/load data for the lee 310 grain boolits? looking for load data for unique or power pistol.

@FortuneCookie45LC

7 жыл бұрын

Richard Colsen - Google did not post your comment in my inbox to see so I missed replying to you until I just stumbled onto it now...No doubt you have found all the data you need by now...Sorry to have missed replying. Best to ya, FC

@edbecka233

2 жыл бұрын

You would think that the Lee book would AT LEAST have a couple of loads in each applicable caliber with THEIR OWN cast bullets, right? Apparently, that didn't occur to them. I'm deeply disappointed in that manual. Hopefully you've found the data you sought.

Thanks for the info. Had never heard of Elmer Keith until today when reloading. Attempted to reload Keith style SWC bullets for my Henry. Not good, did not know about extra bullet length outside of case when seating bullet to crimp groove. OAL past SAAMI specs. Had trouble cycling.

@FortuneCookie45LC

7 жыл бұрын

larry munninghoff - This problem is even more acute with the 357 loaded with Keith bullets - those are really long and can stick out the front of some revolver cylinders. Keith bullets were really made for revolvers first and foremost. The best bullets for lever guns is the RNFP or TCs. Have a great day, FC

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

Try crimping any KEITH bullet over the front driving band. That way they will feed in lever guns, reduce max load by 10%.

@navigator1383

6 жыл бұрын

However will push into the case which is a PITA. I've found that I need a really tight crimp into a crimp groove on lever guns, unless you want to load the singly, or pack them over black powder.

@edbecka233

2 жыл бұрын

When I started reloading in 1975 (!) I was casting the Keith 44 for a Super Blackhawk, an M29 and a Charter Bulldog. Then I got a B92 and found that it would only feed the (gag) Lee SWCs. There are two ways to beat this problem: use shorter cases like 44 SPL or shortened Magnum cases, or modify the lifter so that it accepts longer-than-normal LOAs. I cut the stop surface on the 92's lifter back to allow the Keith loads to clear the back of the magazine tube, and the rifle works fine - EXCEPT the loss of that steel also shortened the HEIGHT of the stop where it contacts the bottom of the bolt to cam the lifter back down into its pickup position. I (sort of) solved the problem by reducing all the friction points I could find in the movement of the lifter, and operating the lever BRISKLY. I will eventually resolve the whole thing by either silver-soldering a slab of steel to the lifter to regain the original height, or by installing a new lifter and undercutting the stop to accept the longer rounds without losing the contact with the bolt.

Hi , I need your advise : I've a S&W 44 Model 29 , 8"3/8 . I'like to by a mould (Keith design) My cylinder throat is .431 but the barrel is .429 ! So , what bullet diameter have to choose ? Thanks you .

@FortuneCookie45LC

7 жыл бұрын

Ragot Philippe H - Great question, and I'm glad you asked it. First of all, your gun is setup properly. You do want bigger going to smaller to maintain the obturation factors important for all bullets. Colt Pythons even go one better by the barrel tapering down .001" to the muzzle. The rule is A) For Cast Bullets: 1) autopistols and rifles = .001" bigger than groove diameter of barrel 2) revolvers = .001" bigger than the cylinder throats ; B) For Jacketed Bullets - use 'em as you buy 'em. For A)2) above, reason is your .001" will assure obturation of the cylinder throat so gases will not blow by the bullet and gas cut the bullet as it is exiting the cylinder - deposition of lead will be in the forcing cone or first 1 1/2" of barrel. If gas cutting is severe, even powder coated bullets can lead the barrel just not as bad. I do have full videos under the Let's Prevent Barrel Leading playlist. Good reloadin' to ya, FC

I got several 100 rounds of those reloads, same powder and grains, from 1986, been shooting them out of my new 1894 marlin 44 mag, an they don’t group that well for me, but the same load with a Speer bullet hollowpoint, groups good, great video

Hello FC, I have been watching many of your videos on casting bullets, and powder coating. I have been in the process of aquiring the components to begin bullet casting. I just ordered the Lyman Mag 25 furnace, and for my 44 Super Blackhawk, I'm looking at purchasing the Lyman 429421 mold. Now I have measured the throat diameter of my revolver's cylinders, and all 6 measure .4315. Will I need to do any special alloy mixing to be able drop bullets large enough? Thank you for all of the great information from your videos.

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

nealhoward51 - Your cylinder throats are on the big side (my M29-2 and Virginian Dragoon also have large throats). As you know, .429" jacketed bullets will work fine as they will not lead. But if you buy commercial cast bullets, they are invariably .429 or .430 - either will lead your barrel and accuracy will degrade as leading builds up. You are in luck, because whatever your bullets cast at, you can simply powder coat your bullets adding 002" - you will wind up with bullets measuring .432" easy. You won't find any sizing dies at .4325 or even .433 so best is for you to PC the bullets and shoot them as is - should shoot mighty fine. Have no fear, your big bullets will load and function just fine. Good reloadin' to ya, FC

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

nealhoward51 - Forgot to mention that if you start with Lee molds, the non TL ones tend to drop bigger bullets than the TL. Also, the harder your bullet alloy, the less shrinkage you get on cooling so the bullets drop slightly bigger (perhaps up to .001"). Before, we relied on dropping bigger bullets and sizing them down to our needs. With PC, we can also PC 'em bigger. Best to ya, FC

@nealhoward51

8 жыл бұрын

Thank you for the great information. I believe I have all the elements for the PC process, so that will be the way I go.

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

nealhoward51 - Good castin' and PCin' to ya..!! FC

@stuckcase7775

2 жыл бұрын

The forcing cone will also dictate accuracy If your cylinder throat is oversized but your forcing cone is good-you may be in luck May cause some leading but also may not depending on your mold diameter

I love the idea of making my own loads especially since I'm probably going to buy a big bore revolver for the woods, but realistically won't spend the time necessary to clean the brass, mold the bullets, reload, etc. Kinda interesting video, though, thanks.

@FortuneCookie45LC

10 жыл бұрын

alex fresel- Thank you for your interest in big bores revolvers. The only problem with them (they have many qualities as you know) is that there is no cheap factory ammo - all expensive. Reloading opens up all the vistas to big bore magnum shooters. But for non-reloaders, big bore guns break the bankroll. I always encourage non-reloading shooters to consider the 357 magnum and it's extreme versatility including the shooting of lower cost factory 38s. Appreciate the good word - this was one of my earlier videos and it had technical problems. Best Regards...

@alexfresel6198

10 жыл бұрын

FortuneCookie45LC oh yeah, I definitely hear ya on the price question. However, mom's family is upper peninsula of MI, visited cousins out in MT and from what I've read, even for Black Bears, the 357 is more the minimum. Just bought _Sixguns_ and Keith was really down on the 357 as a defensive cartridge for medium to large animals. It is a shame that big bore ammo is so expensive but I figure I'll pay the $200 more per 1000. Maybe I'll shoot 40 per month, so the math should work out. I'll keep on trying to find reloaders and make them deals. Who knows, maybe I'll even break down and start reloading. I did buy some components out in South Dakota but I'll probably just sell them. Have a Glock 20 and 29 but the grips are too big for my hand and the Smith 29 fits. Presently I'm selling my Glocks. What the hell, I'll probably buy the Lew Horton, it's really pretty and only about $150 more than the cheapest Smith 29.

@FortuneCookie45LC

10 жыл бұрын

alex fresel Can't find any negative towards the 29 Smith. You've already done your homework as I suspected. If you inspect a full house 44 loaded with the hard cast Lee 310 grain WFN GC bullet (casts more like 322 grains) - it's an impressive beastie. Best Regards to ya…and you might just find yourself reloading at some point anyway…the 44 has a tendency to do that to ya...

Hey Steve how hard do cast for full power .44 loads?

@williampollock1274

3 жыл бұрын

@Bill Bob yeah that's what it says in Lee's modern reloading. I have been able to go as low as 10-11 bhn with zero leading with full power .44 magnum loads. I think fit is more important than hardness. I was just wondering how hard Steve usally casts for his .44.

Would these work well in a desert eagle? Or is it FMJ only for the desert eagle?

FC....I don't cast my own but where can I purchase this exact bullet in bulk possibly with a Gas check so I can load them pretty warm? Thanks man

@JohnDoeEagle1

3 жыл бұрын

MP Molds and Arsenal Molds make authentic exact replica Elmer Keith molds. I have some for .38 SPL/.357 Mag and .44 SPL/.44 Mag from both. They aren't terribly expensive either considering what you are getting.

@larrystephaniebridges7896

9 ай бұрын

the keith is not a gas check design its flat base

Where can I find this shell to buy?

@Mark-cm3up

3 жыл бұрын

Starline Brass

Does any body no if these will cycle in a new marlin 1894 if they are crimped in the crimping groove?

Hi FC, I was given some real deal Elmer Keith 240 gr. SWC boo-lets. I sacrificed one to see if the groove was square and sure enough it is. I believe that they run about 18 on the hardness scale. They came from a friend of mine whose father was really big into reloading and was alive when Elmer was alive. I know that harder lead needs to be pushed harder to avoid leading the barrel and to seal the base of the bullet in the barrel to prevent blow by. This is the main cause of leading as I understand it. I have used Oregon Trail Lasercast with very good success and it of course is at 22 Burnell. DO you know where I can find data for reloading these particular rounds? Both in Magnum and Special? I plan on shooting just a few and stashing the 250 or so that I will have left for posterity. Thanks for your help. I do like your videos by the way. Very thoughtful and informative.

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

Catholic Seymour - No doubt you know this stuff already, but for the benefit of viewers who are new casters and shooters - You have the Keith design Keith bullets - square grooves, Elmer wanted lots of grease in there (trend of the times when shooters thought grease was really important). But note that Keith did a lot of his shooting with 1 to 16 tin-lead alloy - that is pretty soft considering that antimony is what really hardens bullets, not tin - tin just helps castability while adding 1/3 the hardening that same amount of antimony gives. Keith reported that he did not lead his gun barrels with that soft alloy. Turns out that bullet fit to the gun is the most important factor in cast bullet performance = accuracy and no leading. Bullet hardness is a rather distant 2nd place in importance and bullet lube is another rather distant 3rd place (there was a test done where good fitting cast bullets were shot without lube at all = no leading). Plus, many of today's recovered bullets show lube still in the grooves and with the high temp lubes, the lube is practically undisturbed after firing - so much for what bullet lubes do. But we still use them except for our powder coated bullets = no lubes needed at all (unless shooters want to put that in). The Lee manual gives reloading data for heavy cast bullets in the magnum pistol calibers. If you give me the bullet weights, I'll video the manual for you unless you have access to one of your own. Best to ya, FC

@catholicseymour292

8 жыл бұрын

FortuneCookie45LC Thanks for your reply Cookie... What lead me to believe that these are Kieth boolets is the age of them. They are over 20 years old and the man that they came from was a big Keith fan. I pulled one of his 44 special rounds and was very surprised at the powder weight. Glad I never shot one in my Charter Arms Bulldog! I also got some Hercules 2400 from his son and I am guessing that is what was in the loads. I looked into the Lee manual 2nd Edition and did not find any specific info for hard cast boolets. I searched the web and used the Lyman manual and came up with 18.5 to 20.6 grain load. I used 19.4 grains that should give me about 1170 fps. I also went to the Alliant site and used the data for 2400 The weight is 240 grains and I am guessing from experience as a machinist that the hardness of the round is about 15 on the burnell scale. Now I need to come up with a load for the 44 Special... Perhaps a video would be in order. I would like to use the powder that I have on hand if possible. Thanks for your time. Don

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

Catholic Seymour -- The classic 44 mag load is 22 grains of 2400 and the 245 Keith, magnum primers. Apparently, that is over the max according to the Lyman book. But that load has been shot by many for a lot of years. The 44 Special was not a round to be stoked in the beginning. Keith did that later. But the original loads in the neighborhood of 6.5 grains of Unique and the Keith bullet (regular primers) should make a fine 44 SPL load that won''t beat your Bulldog to pieces. Best to ya, FC

@edbecka233

2 жыл бұрын

@@catholicseymour292 I've loaded Keiths in .44SPL/MAG since '75, in Super Blackhawks, an M29, an M624, and 3" and 4" Bulldogs, as well as a Handi-Rifle, a Deerstalker, a B92 and a 788. The Bulldogs have always been hard to find a good heavy-bullet load for, because apparently their light weight leads to a good bit of muzzle flip and past a certain velocity they will start keyholing. The Lee 208 WC and 210 SWC were the most forgiving while the Keiths and the Lee 255 SWC were problematic re flipping. I have not played with the Bulldogs for some time, and in the meantime I've acquired several M-P moulds that will probably work fine in them due to their lighter weight - the 432-214-HBWC, the 432-180-SWCHP, the 432-235-SWCHP and their version of the Keith, the 432-255-KSWCHP. I include the 255 because with the big HP core pins and what I've learned about alloys, quenching, powder coating etc, it will perform better at the lower Bulldog-friendly velocities than my old-school hard Keiths. M-P's offerings are well worth a look.

at what velocity do the 44 keiths need a gas check in a lever gun?

@FortuneCookie45LC

9 жыл бұрын

jdhdale The true 44 Keiths do not do well in lever guns as they tend not to cycle. And if you load the rounds shorter, cycling is still not smooth, plus you lose the advantages of the Keith design. So the question is mostly moot. However, other SWC designs with shorter noses can be used in lever guns. Lyman and Lee make GC design SWC for 44. You will need to use the gas checks when you break 1650 fps for a conservative recommendation. And with Marlin MicroGroove lever guns, you will need the bullets to be larger by and extra .001-.002" (.431 -.432") as well. Cut rifling can have cast bullets .430" to start load testing. Best Regards to ya...

@navigator1383

6 жыл бұрын

Or load these singly into lever gun if you want to use for hunting. Agreed you need the rounded bullet profile to go against the feed ramp of the lever gun.

Use only new brass because heat from being fired weekens the brass causing it to loose its temper and strength, so don't blow up the gun, only use new brass, they sell it also, Try midsouth shooters supply,

Love the KEITH bullets, grew up casting/shooting them, light to heavy loads and everything in between.

@FortuneCookie45LC

6 жыл бұрын

Walks Fletcher - Funny thing is that I have casted heaps of 44 and 38 Keiths, but never the 45 (Lyman 452424) - I just bought those. Yes, really like those Keith bullets. Favorite load in 44 was 10 Unique and 22 2400. With the 38, 12 grains 2400 and the 173 Keith in 38 cases. Continued good shootin' to ya, FC Steve

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

You are missing out, that #454424 is the most accurate bullet I've ever shot in all my .45Colts. Only problem is when LYMAN reduced the DIAMETER back in the 1970's from #454424 to #452424 the nose grew, STILL WEIGHED 255GRS. So they can be a bit too long in italian clones. RUGER'S & S&W'S swallow them perfectly. You should also try the #454423 that KEITH designed for the .45 AUTO RIM, it weighs 240grs.

@FortuneCookie45LC

6 жыл бұрын

Walks Fletcher - Might get that Keith 45 finally after all these years...they are made by NOE and Arsenal also and I've got a hankering to try the Arsenal molds... Best to ya, FC Steve

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

I think if I was going to buy a .45 Keith bullet today, I would go for the #452423. The one designed for .45acp. I think it would do everything you needed in .45cal loads. If ya really need heavier bullet, I would go with the RCBS 45-270-SAA.

@davidfw190

6 жыл бұрын

This is my favorite bullet for my 45 blackhawks. Used it for over 30 years now

I wonder how the 45 Keith bullet would work in a 45 autorim revolver like the smith 625. I have a 3 inch model of 1989. My first revolver. The round would probably be too long. I have never shot anything over 230 gn. I use a 155 for target shooting. My elbow and hand are not what it used to be. Happy shooting.

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

Elmer Keith designed a bullet for the .45 Auto Rim, the LYMAN #454423. A perfect clone of this bullet is made today by N.O.E. It's cataloged by them as the #453-238-SWC 453238. Available in 2,3,4,5 cavity molds that take LEE 6cav handles. They come in brass or aluminum.

@biggerbehindthetrigger2814

6 жыл бұрын

Walks Fletcher thank you I will look it up.

@navigator1383

6 жыл бұрын

They work great in my Smith model 25, even the RCBS long 270 grain works great. Not sure I would "hotrod" the Smith like you can a Ruger.

@edbecka233

3 жыл бұрын

My 625 is the heavy barreled JM model. Most likely the same cylinder length as yours. The .45 Auto rim cases work just great as a "45 Colt Short" in it. I use the AR cases for everything from 155 gr SWCs in poofter loads to45LC level loads with the heavy SWCs and RFs. I like the AR brass because you can treat it like a "real revolver" load with a roll crimp. As far as ACP brass in it, my main use for that is as an overpriced bullet puller when one of my low-recoil ACP experiments won't run my 1911. I'd just rather shoot 'em up than fool around pulling them, so they go into moon clips and get banged away in the 625.

After I put them through my resizer with lub on them I dust them with some MOTA MICA which helps the lub process also.

@MyREDTAIL

5 жыл бұрын

@@FortuneCookie45LC " Works for me."

I have used his loads , never his TRUE bullets . The Mass produced basic SWC are OK , I think the bev base is a flaw & too hard . Cow Boy match have worked well as far as accuracy & have a slight rounded base . LBT is my first choice in lead bullets I can buy at the gun shop .

The bullets in the first part of the video are not true Keith. Elmers SWC had 3 equal width driving bands and a square deep grease groove.

You can not shoot lead bullets at any inside California shooting range. Also I can get Hi-tek polymer coated .44 mag bullets about 30% cheaper then your Keith bullets and they're range friendly.

Those are not true Keith Style bullets. The true Keith Style bullet has a flat bottom grease groove, and the front driving band is supposed to be the same width as the rear two. Per Keith and Frixell.

No those are not Keith bullet. That is not his design that is just a semi wadcutter. The Elmer Keith design has three drive bands all equal in width and one lube groove equal to the drive bands. The Keith design uses a flat bottom lube groove with no taper to the sides. He was very upset when Lyman changed his design.

@larrystephaniebridges7896

9 ай бұрын

i have a 4 cav lyman 429421 that have the right KEITH SPCS IT IS ABOUT 5 YRS OLD i just cast 500 yesterday

I hate to break it to you but that bullet your casting isn't the ORIGINAL Keith ... Keith designed the bullet and Ideal/Lyman produced it to his specks.... But Lyman changes the shoulders of the grooves and took the last band at the base and made it thicker... Keith was furious with this ... the main reason he designed the grooves that way was becase the square grooves held the lube better ... and the bottom groove being a lot wider allowed a lot more lube in it thus making less leading at a higher bullet speed... Lyman changes the angle just because it releases from the mold easier... they thickened the base band for ? Because it was handling the 45 magnum as is ...already... Look up Keith Bullet and you'll see the changes.. Also making it too hard can allow gasses to escape around the base which actually CAUSES leading... so it you aren't running max loads do not cast it past Brinnel 13 or 14 ... because it won't seal the bore..

@larrystephaniebridges7896

9 ай бұрын

that is correct

That's not a Keith bullet. Keith bullets have a square(ish) lube channel not a round one.

@FortuneCookie45LC

8 жыл бұрын

+Gary Barbatelli -- Thanks for your comment. Right you are...and Elmer didn't like the rounded off grease grooves although he understood the manufacturing was easier with the rounded. The 429421 is still recognized as his bullet, but Lyman is doing the rounded today. Elmer wanted a lot of grease in there...but today, we know that even with the rounded grooves, we have more lube present than is needed. Recovered bullets show that, unless we are talking the soft lubes, most of the lube is still in the grooves of our cast bullets after firing. There are a lot of SWCs out there being referred to as Keith - style bullets, but they aren't even close. The advantages of rounded grooves is a slightly heavier bullet and stronger driving bands. There really are no negatives to rounded and the basic precepts of the Keith design are intact. Have a great day, FC

@walksfletcher

6 жыл бұрын

Gary, Elmer Keith cast almost exclusively from single cavity molds. Those sharp cornered grease grooves do NOT WANT TO RELEASE from a mold when opened. You really have to beat on a 2cav mold with square grease grooves. We had an old IDEAL 2cav when I was a kid. Great bullets, but you had to whack that hinge-pin about 10 times to get the bullets to drop out.

@navigator1383

6 жыл бұрын

Sounds like there was a mechanical burr or scratch on the mold preventing bullet drop. Would take that mold and examine carefully with a loupe and then polish the inside with jewelers rouge.

@edbecka233

2 жыл бұрын

@@walksfletcher The tweaks that Elmer got Ideal to incorporate were a slight draft to the top & bottom surfaces of the grease groove. What he wanted was a flat BOTTOMED groove, not "square cut". One company, ICIR, tweaked it further with micro fillets at the corners of the drafts and the bottom, all in pursuit of a worthwhile groove that would still release easily. My Lyman 429421 DC drops bullets effortlessly, but it's probably 1970s mfgr when Lyman still cared about their products.

@larrystephaniebridges7896

9 ай бұрын

IF YOU POWDER COAT IT DOES NOT MAKE A DIFFERENCE IF IT HAS A ROUNDED GREASE GROOVE OR NOT

That is not a true Keith bullet His designs called for three equal driving bands and square lube grooves