I'm surprised at how highly entertaining this was.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

I couldn't take Tour's screaming lies for more than 20 minutes.

@TheProdigalMeowMeowMeowReturns

4 жыл бұрын

What lies specifically? Be clear and detailed.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheProdigalMeowMeowMeowReturns He repeatedly lied about scientists being "clueless" about the origin of life. Over and over and over again. He knows very well that substantial research and advanced have been made in that field.

@randyphung

4 жыл бұрын

@@sqlblindman You're right. The more research they do, the more they know how clueless they are from explaining the origin of life. It's a moving target scientist realized how complex it is that is impossible without a guidance of an intelligent being. I'm an engineer who designs buildings. A building is much simpler than a cell, yet we spent so much time coordinating with different disciplines to get it working properly. It cannot be all random.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

@@randyphung "You're right. The more research they do, the more they know how clueless they are from explaining the origin of life." Wow. So you just...lie? That's the best you can do for an argument? That's pathetic. If you have to lie to defend your beliefs, it's time to get new beliefs.

At what point do they tell the public "we don't know", Joshua? At masters degree? PhD? Because I got a B.S in Evolutionary biology and every professor was pretty adamant they knew, brother. BTW folks, I'm not a scientist, but after5 years of this subject, 3 years of research, not one proper piece of evidence. I felt like we were busting out posterior studying abstract science. In the beginning God, or in the beginning nothing. Pick your miracle. As for me and my house, both of us students of biological sciences, we believe the Word of God.

@flamingswordapologetics

3 жыл бұрын

Nailed it, excellent!

@marcleysens7716

3 жыл бұрын

Well said. Pick your miracle. "A little bit more than zero." Like pigs can fly. Start talking actual science Josh. His impertinent little giggle is irritating. 🙄

@felitsaadinda2516

3 жыл бұрын

You can believe in god you dont have to believe in religion

@lrvogt1257

3 жыл бұрын

Tour's promoting the idea that it's more likely that life was created by an imaginary process we can't test over processes we can test. That is a terrible scientific argument. We know the fundamental quantum wave functions and particles and there is no known mechanism for the alleged supernatural, unrelated to the laws of physics, to affect the real world. Until there is, the likelihood of a supernatural creation is about nil.

@bungeebones

3 жыл бұрын

@@marcleysens7716 I think the odds that "pigs can fly" are better than those that life can come from sterilized pools and from random chance chemical reactions. Information NEVER comes out of randomness, only from an intelligence.

Dr. James Tour is such an awesome guy!

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

I really do like him!

@dragan176

4 жыл бұрын

He's witty, he's funny, but honestly, he's like if Kent Hovind knew a lot about chemistry

@LoveYourNeighbour.

4 жыл бұрын

@@dragan176 Great way of putting it!

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

Among screaming liars, he takes the lead.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

@@dragan176 He's more like if Eugene Levy was as dishonest as Kent Hovind.

Learned about James Tour from his testimony in One for Israel Ministry. He's very passionate about Jesus and it's infectious. Can't get enough of this man. Hopefully this is the first of many he'll be in the show.

@LoveYourNeighbour.

4 жыл бұрын

I discovered him a couple of years ago, and have been HOOKED since!

@ds525252

3 жыл бұрын

Love these guys!

@moriartythethird5709

3 жыл бұрын

A very powerful testimony. Though I haven't seen a testimony that didn't move me from that channel.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

Passionate to the point of repeating many lies, such "we know nothing about life origins", when we do. kzread.info/dash/bejne/hZ2s27xwdM65mqQ.html

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

@@moriartythethird5709 "A very powerful testimony." Lies are powerful. kzread.info/dash/bejne/hZ2s27xwdM65mqQ.html

I agree with Josh that I agree with Jim.

@LoveYourNeighbour.

4 жыл бұрын

I agree...

@ds525252

3 жыл бұрын

JT nails it!

@followhim1203

3 жыл бұрын

Amen

@famousace4652

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed

The passion & knowledge of Dr. Tour in his field is beautiful. I see why other scientists refuse to debate him.

@spatrk6634

Жыл бұрын

yes. for same reason they refuse to debate flat earthers.

@lookup7055

Жыл бұрын

@@spatrk6634 lol silly, don’t generalize Christians. You think 3 billion people believe the earth is flat? Crazy

@TrevoltIV

Жыл бұрын

@@spatrk6634 Flat earthers don't have PhD's, because they are just TikTok dwellers. Actual scientists are different, and likening Dr. Tour to some rando on the internet is just insane

@Thedisciplemike

9 ай бұрын

​@@spatrk6634he's not a flat earther

This is really hilarious, such fun and eye opening. Perfect learning model🤣

Another fantastic video, Cam. Thanks for the conversation! I really enjoyed this one - very entertaining with two charismatic figures. Great back and forth.

I love how James Tour is smiling. I recently watched three videos - an hour-some talk at a university, and a two-parter with a condensed case that he puts forward. I love how he's smiling, and not backing down from how WE DO NOT KNOW! I just love it.

@smitty121981

2 жыл бұрын

"not backing down from how WE DO NOT KNOW!" What a dumb thing to argue about. He is just drunk on pride and starting arguments for no reason, and it makes a mockery of Christ to outsiders.

@silversilk8438

2 жыл бұрын

@@smitty121981 Not really man. He has good arguments, and points out compellingly that you can't assume abiogenesis because it is not a feasible hypothesis. It's genius. It was a two part-er I don't have time to find. I'm sorry you're so sour. You should probably go have a nice lemonade to wind down :)

@tristimulus

2 жыл бұрын

@@silversilk8438 "you can't assume abiogenesis" So life did not have a beginning? You are claiming that life has eternally existed, in contradiction to both the Bible and science??? Cool story bro.

James Tour is a fire and brimstone creationist! wow Very entertaining and informative.

I can't believe I missed this gem until now. This is my new favorite Capturing Christianity video.

Sounds like it's time for Josh and Stephen Meyer to have a discussion about ID.

This is just great . James tour is amazing . The guy is passionate and full of heart .The mutual respect is freaking great . Love this .

I was so confused on why Dr. Tour was being so loud😭 but they homies

@dragan176

4 жыл бұрын

I think that's why creationists like him. He sounds like them

@cewoldt

4 жыл бұрын

You haven't lived in Nigeria. Two best friends having a discussion, Yorubas on the street in Lagos, sound like they are ready to come to blows. Nope. They are best friends enjoying the interchange.

@ds525252

3 жыл бұрын

dragan176 Uncertainty is shy, knowing is confident. Dr. Tour is not shy.

Great conversation, love listening to Tour.

13:27 - "Let me just finish, then you can agree with me." Love this.

This is the most down-to-earth, rubber-meets-the-road discussion I’ve heard to date on origins from a scientific/Christian point of view. I have wanted this for sooooooo long. Thank you, Cameron. This paradox is getting whittled down to the crux, and we are all getting to witness the greatest minds discuss those edges of contention that get us closer and closer to the point of truth.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

James's crux is a non-sequitur and gap-fallacy. His argument is based on a false premise that nature MUST work like humans (and the human way is the ONLY way), by planning, gathering materials, then assembling; i.e. anthropomorphic, like a human. *Nothing in nature works like that, and Tour knows it.* (Yes, I'm calling Tour a dishonest liar.) Tour's argument is like a nuclear engineer (a non-expert in stellar evolution) telling an astrophysicist (an expert) that their narrative of how stars form is impossible because the only way to make a reactor is the way engineers do it. By the way, we've known EXACTLY what causes nuclear *fusion* for 100 years, longer than we've known about DNA, yet no one has successfully built a self-sustaining, net-energy-positive fusion reactor, like nature has done some 10^24 times (when it made stars). We also know pretty much everything there is to know about how humans are reproduced and grown, including brains (something else nature has done 100 billion times), and we still haven't been able to "make a human in a lab", from scratch. This is the nonsense that is convincing hundreds of people watching this video, and it's very disturbing. I wonder, had you people lived in Nazi Germany, would you be on board with Hitler's plan if he used the same argument as Tour (and said it was God's will)?

@brandonmacey964

Жыл бұрын

@@ja31472 what a bunch of pearl clutching NONSENSE, " tour is a liar whaaa whaaaaa" grow up you big babies.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

​@@brandonmacey964 What's nonsense, that nature doesn't work like you? Because that's Tour's argument. He drones on about how engineers build stuff, but that has no bearing on how nature works. And yes, he's a liar. He knows that his flock will either not bother to fact-check what he says or or simply doesn't care. Look at the comments of his videos. It's nothing but sheep saying "praise jebus... hallelujah... fart... fart... we love you James Tour... fart ...fart, etc." He also says right here: kzread.info/dash/bejne/hZ2s27xwdM65mqQ.html "we don't know hot to build the four classes of molecules life needs" This is 100% false. Not only do we know exactly how to make them, we even have programmable machines that do it for us.

@brandonmacey964

Жыл бұрын

@@ja31472 no doofus, he says we don't know how to make the 4 classes of molecules in a "Pre-biotically relevant" manner. I don't think you even understand what is being discussed. He claims that when a yeast cell dies, scientists can't agree or characterize what was just lost during the "death" of that yeast cell. All of the molecules are in place and yet we can't resurrect the yeast cell. We can't define exactly what life is, let alone "make it" in the lab. You're just too dumb to keep up

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

@@brandonmacey964 "All of the molecules are in place" "Place", i.e. position, is only one small part of physical state. Of course it's not the same. Fall asleep in physics class did you? "let alone "make it" in the lab." Totally irrelevant. Nor can we make a star or hurricane "in the lab", for different reasons, and one of them is NOT not knowing how nature makes them, as is the case for origin of life. Either way, his argument is a non-sequitur. "Making in a lab" is irrelevant. In all observable cases, it's natural law that always does the "making" from previous physical states, be it life or non-life. ALL observable cases. NO exceptions. Creationism/ID gambles against ALL observation; it's 1 in 10^10^10^10^10. Your worldview is, by design, the minimum likely state of things. "in a "Pre-biotically relevant" manner." Except he doesn't say that all the time, i.e. he lies. And part of that is because a good chunk of the physical state is unknown. Once that is known you don't have to make anything or add any direct control; just set it up and let nature take its course. Obviously, intelligently setting up an experiment in no way proves intelligence is a requirement. "what was just lost during the "death" of that yeast cell." If you didn't match the momentum or all wave function states of each particle, then a lot was lost.

I love Dr. James Tour.

I wish I had a friend like Dr. James Tour with which I could yell at one another and leave still being great friends.

Great video! Thanks! James Tour is awesome

My wife must have gone to school with Dr. Tour. She is always telling me that I am clueless!!!! 😂😂😂 Fun discussion!

@comradeandrov567

3 жыл бұрын

@QQminusS He is a jewish convert to Christianity.

His passion is so hilarious - his personality is glowing!!

This is my favorite video on this channel

That smile Dr josh gave when Dr Tour says he loves Jesus. Brotherly love united in the love of Jesus.

This is one of my fantasy discussion, DR josh and DR Tour. I really want to hear deep discussion about evolution and etc.

This seems to be more of a friendly discussion between friends than a debate.

I love how Cameron just enjoyed being eased into into the background straight after the intro :D

I just love stuff like this.

Here's how I analyze the disagreement. I think Dr Swamidass and Dr Tour focus on a different proposition, thus making the argument very ambiguous for themselves, and for everyone else. The two propositions being debated by the two different individuals can be paraphrased: General Proposition 1) If Naturalistic-atheism is true, then there absolutely must be complete naturalistic explanation of the origin of life. (Pertaining to Theism being true, it is rather a moot point, because God can exist either way.) General Proposition 2) We understand almost everything there is to know about how life was formed, and it's easy to demonstrate that all the components for life to have formed de-novo, ex-materia were here on earth. We also understand that it's occurrence is a low probability on earth, but in respect to the universe as a whole, it is pretty unimpressive. -I think Dr Swamidass focuses on proposition 1 and Dr Tour on debunking 2. I think they both agree that for naturalistic-atheism to be true, there must be a naturalistic explanation for life. I think Dr Tour wants everybody to understand we have no idea how life formed, and the probability (based on our current understanding) is extremely remote. I think that's why in the study of debate they have a clearly defined debate proposition, that way we all know what's being debated :) Thanks to both of you for the wonderful conversation, and sharing some of your immense knowledge in your areas expertise.

@anitarexadams7527

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you for breaking it down for those of us who are new to these debates.

@shawnchristophermalig4339

2 жыл бұрын

I just finished it. And yes, this is the best breakdown explanation.

I love both of these accomplished scientists and hope to see more robust dialog from them. I do wish you both great success in furthering the Gospel to reach those in science as well as the general public, in spite of your varied approaches. God bless you as you carry on. And I am grateful for those who produced this - may it go viral.

Love these 2 guys!!

Wonderful, deep and honest discussion. Praise God!

It isn't hard becoming an instant fan of Dr. James Tour. Not only due to his unabashed love for Christ, but also, due to his love of science, resulting in his acquiring some 140 patents, and penning his name to over 600 peer reviewed articles in journals of his scientific expertise. Dr. Tour epitomizes the long standing tradition of Christian contributions to science. That being said, I understand Dr. Tour's position on Intelligent Design, although it seems he doesn't fully consider a couple of aspects of the ID approach. I agree that we can't directly attribute any supernatural intervention into physical phenomenon since observing such intervention would require the use of physical processes and methods. In other words, as Dr. Tour expresses, there is no way to measure the supernatural. If we could, that would actually be something which isn't supernatural. But, detecting the supernatural is different from detecting design. Within ID theories there are at least two trains of thought regarding design; information and irreducible complexity. In my view, Dr. Tour touches on this when he states, even if we have all the necessary components to make a cell, even if reproducible in a lab, there is no way to assemble those components in the correct order then have those components come to what we understand as "life". Tour uses the example that when a cell dies, with all those components and mechanisms intact, there is no way to revitilize and reanimate a cell into a fully functional cell. In my opinion a very astute observation. And, if we think about it, exactly how one would proceed if creating a living cell by purely natural processes is so easy. Just take a dead cell and bring it back to life, even if you have to replace and rebuild the entire thing. How does information get into life's processes from atoms to molecules to the four components, carbohydrates, lipids, proteins and nucleic acids, necessary for cellular functionality and the development of conscious agents able to contemplate their own existence as a result? What we know of information, only though deliberate intelligent agency. As far as "irreducible complexity" is concerned, there are aspects of nature which seem inconsistent with having developed through purely natural processes. Metamorphosis, spiders thread, a woodpeckers beak and shock absorbers, come to mind. Then there's consciousness itself which requires it's own distinct domain due to the physicality of the universe, having something, like consciousness, which isn't physical. God Bless Dr. Tour and Dr. Swamidass for a thought provoking exchange. At least to those of us paying attention.

@LoveYourNeighbour.

4 жыл бұрын

I really enjoyed reading your well articulated comment! Thanks!

@ronaldmorgan7632

4 жыл бұрын

Yes. Also, there are scientists now, and throughout history who have believed that God created the universe and continues to monkey with things occasionally. That doesn't/didn't stop them from doing science. When the odds of just one of the needed things for life happening are trillions and trillions to one, you have to start thinking about possible alternatives.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

"It isn't hard becoming an instant fan of Dr. James Tour. " ....if you have a fondness for screaming liars.

@utopiabuster

4 жыл бұрын

@@sqlblindman , So erudite and specific. I'm convinced. Thanks for playing. With a partial deck.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

@@utopiabuster I don't need to bring a full deck to beat you fools.

Best so far.. never thought they were fighting at all, could see see they were friends.

Thank you very much for this one. I found it very beneficial. God bless.

Wow. This was really wholesome! God bless both Dr. Joshua and Dr. Jim! As well as you, Mr. Cameron! I couldn't help but smile at the part where Dr. Jim and Dr. Joshua were describing their friendship!

Dr. James Tour has so much energy, confidence, intellect, humility and faith. Great combination.

@smitty121981

2 жыл бұрын

It's called pride, not confidence. Big difference. James Tour is making a mockery of Christ to outsiders

@fyrerayne8882

2 жыл бұрын

@@smitty121981 why do you think that?

@smitty121981

2 жыл бұрын

@@fyrerayne8882 Just go watch how mad "Professor" Dave gets about him. atch?v=SixyZ7DkSjA And don't give me the old "they hate you because they hated me first" ABUSE of Scripture. Sometimes people hate you because you are a liar and a pest, not because you are embodying Christ. Tour falls squarely in the former on this topic. Note that Dave defines abiogenesis as "the emergence of life".... which is PERFECTLY COMPATIBLE WITH GOD!! Dave is made because Tour is just making a big fuss about nothing. He's not contributing anything worthwhile to the conversation but is being very public about his opposition to the professional scientists working the field. Abiogenesis is literally the study of God's creation. When Tour rants and raves about how "impossible" it is, he is LITERALLY ARGUING AGAINST GOD'S CREATIVE POWER!!

@fyrerayne8882

2 жыл бұрын

@@smitty121981 you don’t think Dr. Tour brings up some good points though? I mean, I can see where he’s coming from. I think his arguments are valid ones. He might not be right 100% of the time, but that doesn’t completely invalidate him. What did he lie about? It just seems like he’s expressing his opinion, and that’s not equivalent to lying.

@smitty121981

2 жыл бұрын

@@fyrerayne8882 No I don't think he's brought up any good points at all. The proper Christian attitude for someone with his level of understanding is to take the science and show how the science points to and glorifies God. Instead, Tour is pridefully fighting against science, and in the process he is literally claiming that creation is "impossible"....and I can't possibly fathom why any Christian would support that other than they are dazzled by his big words. And yet Paul teaches "My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit’s power." When Tour is acting like a pest to professional scientists, and is dishonestly misleading lay people. that is NOT demonstrating the power of the Holy Spirit. In fact, such behavior is demonstrating to people like Prof Dave the exact opposite - Dave has often made the observation that Tour is lying. And we know that the devil is the father of lies. James Tour is seen as a "liar for Jesus" and as such, he is doing a great disservice to the faith. Colossians 4:5 cautions us to "Be wise in the way you act toward outsiders" "What did he lie about? " Great question! Most people just deny it without asking for clarification. I appreciate the openness. He lies by misusing the truth, as liars often do. He is using the true fact that the science of abiogenesis is a mystery to DISHONESTLY act as if such an observation supports the conclusion that it somehow never happened. Even though life exists, so abiogenesis is required to have happened. Like I've said many times now, he is completely blinded by pride and is ultimately arguing against God Himself!

Short answer, "Not even close!".

@silversilk8438

4 жыл бұрын

Yes! Hahaha, reminds me of what was said here, whether you agree or not, I love it when the case is put forward, and this Dr. Grady says "not even close" and I laugh. kzread.info/dash/bejne/p357w8urmNW2d8Y.html

@deeveevideos

3 жыл бұрын

Not one iota of evidence

Interesting discussion indeed

ok I LOVED this

Atheists on the evidence for theism, Jesus, and the Resurrection: No evidence and I am not convinced Atheists on evidence of life from non-life: I'll take those odds

@MartialNico

4 жыл бұрын

This progression has been the case for: stormy weather, floods, earthquakes, diseases, anatomy, natural phenomena (like rainbows), evolution, and a whole slew of others. Why would it be different this time?

@MartialNico

4 жыл бұрын

@Papa Smurf That may surely be an "easy" answer, but it doesn't cover anything. Why would "things that are already here" follow natural processes, but "things that aren't" do not?

@Apanblod

4 жыл бұрын

This is quite a strange comparison. Life from non-life MUST have happened, unless everything we know about earth's history is completely wrong and you suggest that life somehow always existed even when there was no earth. How it happened is another story, we don't know, and perhaps the best we'll ever get close to is how it could have happened hypothetically. If there is no good answer, then there is no good answer, it certainly doesn't warrant that we invent a completely new realm of existence or an entity magnitudes more complex than what we're trying to explain to solve the issue, unless there's a very good reason to do so. At least the hypotheses proposed so far from scientists who are active in the field try to work with what we have some level of understanding of (chemistry) and there has been at least some progress in recreating what could be considered parts of rudimentary building blocks of life, even if it's far far from anything conclusive. Every conclusion should be considered speculative at this point, granted. However, saying that it's more plausible that something that's not part of our existence is responsible for life starting is virtually a suggestion we can dismiss out of hand if all it's based on is that we don't know how it happened. And to compare life beginning to a flimsy claim that a man who lived 2000 years ago had powers beyond what we know to be possible, based on textual evidence alone, and somehow fault people for thinking one seems more reasonable to believe than the other, I don't see how that's intellectually honest.

@Apanblod

4 жыл бұрын

@Papa Smurf Yes, I should have been more clear, what I assume we're talking about is the starting point of life as we know it on earth. By definition, that life had to come from non-life at some point, no matter the explanation. I'm not saying it couldn't have been designed in some way, but even then, at some point it didn't exist and at some point it existed. That's my only point really regarding that phrasing. I'm honestly not really sure what you mean by scientists examining something that already exists. If by your analogy you mean what I think you mean, then there are scientists who try to replicate the production of hard-drives, or pieces of them, not just analysing data about the already existing hard-drive.

@gabrielmoses8505

4 жыл бұрын

Science can not explain everything......?????!!

Most scientists agree that they don't know... But still it's taught in school as fact.

@livewireOrourke

4 жыл бұрын

Sad but true.

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

What is taught in school is what can be supported with evidence, child. Most theists claim to know without any evidence.....but still it's taught in church as fact.

@remainhumble6432

4 жыл бұрын

@@sqlblindman if you understood what evidence actually is, you would realise that Christianity is based on the historical fact of the death and resurrection of Jesus. There are no facts on the origin of life. Your comment is as nonsensical as the concept of the self-forming primordial soup which is taught at school and yet is pure unproven fiction. If only you were not so blind...

@sqlblindman

4 жыл бұрын

@@remainhumble6432 If you understood what evidence is you would know that not even the life of Jesus is a historical fact, let alone his death and resurrection. You've been fed a load of crap and you swallowed it willingly. Your comment is as naive as the concept of a magic sky wizard which is taught in churches yet is pure mythology. If only you were not so willfully ignorant...

@remainhumble6432

4 жыл бұрын

@@sqlblindman Wow... You can study the origin of life as much as you want and you will never find primordial soup. The evidence that Jesus existed and did the things he did is based on historical documents and eyewitness accounts whether you like it or not. You may be blind yourself and choosing to be, so this may not be for you. For anybody else reading this, it's for you. Just a little taste of how a little common sense can help one find truth... kzread.info/dash/bejne/n2l5zKNmerHPhs4.html

Dr. Tour, may you consider creating something to reach teenage students to help them to think critically about what they are taught in public school?

@derhafi

3 жыл бұрын

More lies? A pamphlet on "how to toss your scientific integrety out of the window as soon as science contradicts one feelings" ?

Thanks cam..

LOVE James Tour! So glad you had him on

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

He loves you for not fact-checking his lies. Tour knows his target audience: mindless, sheep that either don't have the will or skill to verify any of his claims.

Hands down, the best spirited exchange I have seen in the channel to date. And I love the clarifying aura Dr. Toure brought about the Origin of Life research. I didn't know that we didn't know to this level. Thank Cameron and thanks Dr. Tour! It was about time we hear something different from the usual evolutionary model talking point often on repeat on the internet! Very refreshing and intellectually stimulating!

Awesome!

Good point Josh, our faith should impact our science, with - truth, humility, and hard work

First time hearing Dr. James Tour. He seems like a very bright guy. Both in intellect and personality.

@LoveYourNeighbour.

4 жыл бұрын

I highly recommend him. His knowledge is PHENOMENAL! I first discovered him a couple years ago, and have been HOOKED since!

@ramezaziz2336

4 жыл бұрын

He is awesome. You must look him up!

@samuelikechukwu3891

4 жыл бұрын

He is.

@averexventurusestdominus5310

3 жыл бұрын

Yes. He was voted top 50 chemist in the world. Scientist of the year. 2 time professor of the year at Rice university. 600 research publications. 160 patents in nanotechnology.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

@@averexventurusestdominus5310 "600 research publications." None of which are remotely related to origin of life. Tour talking about OOL is like a nuclear engineer pretending to know about stellar origins and evolution. An astrophysicist would laugh. That's why Tour preaches on youtube, he has no say or experience in the actual science of life origins. kzread.info/dash/bejne/hZ2s27xwdM65mqQ.html

i love how he screams and smiles xD

When working from a premise they both "agree" neither of them knows much about, James just seems to be confident in what it isn't, where Josh is simply open to something other than what it isn't. They are both fight different, yet important battles and so perhaps "talking past one another a bit". Yet this is a great example of how important friendships are for disagreement. They have something more fundamental for by which to move forward together, and so their "truth tracking" is magnified.

@pound4pound380

Жыл бұрын

I don't understand stand how a scientist knowing what James Tour knows from a chemical level could ever even think it's a 0.0001% chance of life forming from chemical reactions under normal conditions. The more and more I listen to Tour talk and listen to other scientist engage in this I'm confident to that if anyone thinks a living cell formed on it's is an idiot

I thoroughly enjoyed this discussion. I learned and laughed. 😀

Wow!!! thank you Cameron for such an amazing conversation between two great scientists. 👌🏻

God bless Dr. James Tour, he's amazing!

Wow❤❤❤❤❤ God bless both of these men

excellent!

Both guests are very fiery & passionate. There should be more to come & learn from them ... I already watched 2 KZread videos of James & 1 for Josh. Here's an additional person to think about: *MATTI LEISOLA: ONE OF THE MOST ASTOUNDING MODERN-DAY SCIENTISTS THAT COULD CHANGE THE LANDSCAPE OF ABIOGENESIS?* _Here's a bite-size info about him, and the more you read articles about Matti & his "enzymatic" discoveries, what you may have known about abiogenesis hypothesis may change dramatically ..._ Matti Leisola isn’t supposed to exist. According to the standard pattern from evolutionists, there is no controversy about evolution in the scientific community, nor any need for serious consideration of the theory of intelligent design. That’s because no legitimate scientist doubts modern evolutionary theory; and even if there may be a handful of such doubters in the U.S., there certainly are none to speak of in enlightened Western Europe. A new book by and about distinguished Finnish bioengineer Matti Leisola authoritiatively brushes aside these Darwinist talking points. The book is Heretic: One Scientist’s Journey from Darwin to Design, co-written with Discovery Institute’s Jonathan Witt, a Senior Fellow with the Center for Science & Culture. Dr. Leisola is the former dean of Chemistry and Material Sciences at Helsinki University of Technology, and the author of 140 peer-reviewed science publications on enzymes and rare sugars. Among other distinctions, he is a winner of the Latsis Prize of the ETH Zürich. The book has already garnered impressive endorsements from other scientists. One is from Dr. Erick J. Vandamme, Emeritus Professor of Bioscience Engineering, Centre for Biotechnology and Synthetic Biology, Ghent University, Belgium. Another is by Zombie Science author and biologist Jonathan Wells. More on those later. Here we’ll only quote an especially colorful passage from German geneticist Wolf-Ekkehard Lönning’s endorsement. Heretic, he writes, is “the exciting story of almost the entire spectrum of aberrant motives, absurd fears, and unreasonable reactions to intelligent design (ID) by evolutionary scientists, clergymen, and church institutions alike.” Heretic is also a story of fellow Darwin doubters discovered, and new supporters for ID won, in the most unexpected places. evolutionnews.org/2018/02/the-scientist-who-shouldnt-exist-new-book-by-matti-leisola-jonathan-witt/ _Here's an additional article about Matti Leisola's work_ Why Darwinism Can’t Accomplish Innovation or Explain Origins Ann Gauger February 13, 2018, 11:34 AM When one wants to modify an enzyme for a new function, as Matti Leisola explains in Chapter 10 of his new book Heretic, there are two ways to go about it. First, one can use what is called directed evolution. The term is a bit misleading - it’s similar to evolution, in that it involves generating millions of random mutations in the gene being studied (not a single gene, but millions of copies of that gene), and then selecting for the desired function by putting the mutated genes into bacteria and asking the resulting proteins to perform the new function. But it’s not at all like real Darwinian evolution, in that the experimenter determines what the overall goal is (EVOLUTION HAS NO GOAL) and makes a plan for how to achieve it. The experimenter determines the rate of mutation, and causes all those mutations to take place in one population of bacteria, all at once, and the screening is designed by the experimenter as well, to sort through all those millions of mutations for the desired, designed change. Second, one can use rational design, which as the name suggests is an attempt to shift the protein’s function by studying how it works, and making modifications to the protein’s sequence. The investigator hopes these changes will make the desired functional change. Discerning which changes will work takes a great deal of knowledge about that particular enzyme’s chemistry, as well as its three-dimensional structure. But even with all that knowledge, there is no guarantee that a particular change will work as planned. MUCH TRIAL AND ERROR IS INVOLVED, BECAUSE ENZYME STRUCTURE and FUNCTION ARE QUITE COMPLEX. I have used both these techniques in the lab, but I am not in Matti’s league. He is a master at modifying enzymes. And one thing he knows: GETTING NEW ENZYMATIC FUNCTION WON’T HAPPEN BY RANDOM MUTATION and NATURAL SELECTION. He has spent decades working in the lab to engineer enzymes and knows the challenges quite well. In Chapter 10, he lays out the evidence for WHY RANDOM VARIATION and NATURAL SELECTION, or GENE DUPLICATION and NEUTRAL EVOLUTION to put it in other terms, WON’T WORK. First, folded functional proteins are extremely rare in sequence space. This has been shown by several labs, by measuring the mutational sensitivity of different enzymes, and using that to estimate what fraction of all possible sequences might be able to carry out each enzyme’s function. Second, there is evidence that shows that getting a completely new protein from an existing one “is unlikely to occur by evolution through a route of folded intermediate sequences.” Further, even an enzyme with similar structure but no shared chemistry with another enzyme cannot be converted to carry out the function of that seemingly related enzyme. Part of the problem is that the COMBINATORIAL PROBLEM IS SO GREAT. Matti describes attending a PhD defense for a student who had been unable to accomplish a particular protein re-engineering problem using either directed evolution or rational design. Matti asked him if he had calculated the odds of finding the right combination of mutations when only two or three specific changes were required. Since the student had not, Matti suggested that the odds exceeded twenty million to one. Put another way, Marci Reeves, Doug Axe and I have calculated that GETTING FOUR MUTATIONS WOULD TAKE 10^15 years for E. coli, using generous estimates for population size, mutation rate, doubling time, etc. [ note: 10^15 years = 1 quadrillion years or more ] It is true that in the lab, protein engineers can improve thermal stability, change pH stability, improve side reactions and increase enzyme activity by random walks. But all of this involves a great deal of investigator involvement. And there are limitations. There can be no leaps where three or more mutations must happen at once. There must be a selectable path the whole way. And one must be able to create enough mutants and screen them quickly to have a hope of finding the very rare ones that work. It is possible to engineer a new pathway into organisms, that is if one chooses an organism that can tolerate the changes introduced. The metabolism as a whole can be thrown out of balance if a new activity is introduced without the proper care. Matti describes how his lab successfully created a strain of yeast that was able to produce xylitol, for which they received a patent. But it required two new enzymes to be introduced, and much labor and planning on the part of the scientists. EVOLUTION DOES NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO PLAN. IT HAS NO FORESIGHT. [ note: emphasis mine ] for more interesting details, click link below: evolutionnews.org/2018/02/why-darwinism-cant-accomplish-innovation-or-explain-origins/ evolutionnews.org/2018/02/bioengineer-asks-what-do-darwinists-hide/

Really love Dr Tour and his heart for the gospel . So inspiring ❤️

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

He loves you for not fact-checking his lies. Tour knows his target audience well: Mindless, sheep that either don't have the skill or the will to verify any of his claims.

When you stop and think about it life sends us a message - that it is possible to exist and impossible to not exist.

10 minutes in and it's already awesome haha

I absolutely love James Tour! I heard him speak at a seminar at Biola University 3 years ago. He’s such an awesome guy!! The fact that he first started the discussion with “I love Jesus Christ! He is the Son oh God!” Was absolutely rich! Truly unique for a scholar to say in this channel. 👏🏽

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

He loves you for not fact-checking his lies. Tour knows his target audience: mindless, sheep that either don't have the skill or the will to verify any of his claims.

Cam, I love these two but it would’ve been nice to have intervened a bit more to allow Joshua to expound on his points without being interrupted so often. Thanks for the great content

@stephenrice2063

4 жыл бұрын

What's vaguely amusing is that in the discussion between Swamidass and Craig, Swamidass kept running over Craig, but here he has met his match.

@toddconnell8324

4 жыл бұрын

Yeh i agree. Cameron, youre really good at clarifying points and making sure people have their say, and i think josh needed a but more time to finish his points.

@stephenrice2063

4 жыл бұрын

@Excuse me, but In secular fora, yes. We're supposed to do the whole "preferring one another" thing.

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

@@stephenrice2063 Or maybe I just took all your advice from last time :). Btw, posting another interview with WLC soon...

@stephenrice2063

4 жыл бұрын

@@PeacefulscienceOrg You weren't malicious in any of these cases--I probably should have acknowledged that. It was just enthusiasm. That's also what was motivating Dr. Tour, I think.

19.50 - love The Office reference!

My biological father ( as my parents divorced when I was three) and I use to get into debates about the Bible, God and Jesus. He had earned a degree in theology when he was younger and changed his mind about God and became an atheist. He placed all of his faith in science. I believe that it takes more faith to believe in evolution then in the Bible. He could never prove to me that everything came from nothing without intelligent design. I have many examples of miracles in my life. Science cannot explain that. Just before he passed away, I told him I hoped he would change his mind, so we could spend more time together. I believe he did.

I'm very confused on Joshua's position if he talks about Jesus who I'm sure he understands is God...but somehow is confused on the origin of life.... And also... If Intellectual Savage was a word James Tours picture would be there

I want to see an Origin of Life debate between James Tour and Bill Nye

@derhafi

3 жыл бұрын

Is that because this is the only scientific literate person you can come up with? Why not a scientist who actually works in this field instead of an engineer?

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

@@derhafi Tour would never agree to that. He knows the basis for his "molecules to man" claim is a 50 year old middle school level picture book, not any of the thousands of scientific papers done recently. That's why he's vocal about life origins, he knows there is science that proves his worldview false, and it's out there for people to find right now.

@BernaskaneyTheLangobard

5 ай бұрын

​@@ja31472I would like you to direct me to this proof of naturalistic origin of life and evolution. Something that could be observed.

This was a really good one cameron 😬

I loved this discussion!! The honesty of Dr Tour about science being clueless about the origin of life, and moving Dr Swamidass to concede that point as well was awesome for the following reason: 98% of laypeople like me would not have thought that the consensus of scientists would admit in PRIVATE that they are clueless about the origin of life AND they are not even close to being able to make the most simple bacterium or yeast cell in their labs!

@derhafi

3 жыл бұрын

Science has, in fact a lot to say about the origin of life, Tour just ignores everything that is in odds with his belief and is therefore by no means up to date with the current work on this subject. The fact that he is a good chemist, makes it even worse that he shows no trace of scientific integers as soon as science is in odds with his religious feelings. Tour is suggesting an alternative to a naturalistic origin of life, which is indistinguishable from magic. His so called “intelligence” has no, absolutely no, demonstrable correlation with reality. This is nothing but deeply unscientific, creationists, nonsense. The simple fact that we do not know something or cannot recreate something in the lab, does not add credibility to a magical entity.

I totally agree that "WE DON'T KNOW!!! how the first living cell arose from chemistry." Nobody knows!!! Ok, but I was wondering if anyone here could explain to me the mechanism behind how God uses supernatural guidance to create life from chemistry. Please explain the mechanism of how God uses his supernatural powers to create a living cell from chemicals. Thank you.

@janwaska521

4 жыл бұрын

That’s a good question you should ask God directly. Only He knows the answer.

@MadScientist72

4 жыл бұрын

@@janwaska521 Well...the point is that we understand the mechanisms for how everything happens in the natural world. Scientists are expected to write peer-reviewed papers when it comes to explaining natural causes, but nobody has ever been able to explain the mechanism behind a supernatural cause. Seems kinda fishy to me. ???

@MadScientist72

4 жыл бұрын

@@TheMp44drophyd Ok, but we should still be able to identify a supernatural event, even if we can't explain it. Let's first focus on identifying the supernatural origin of life, and then work on explaining it

@MadScientist72

3 жыл бұрын

@James Buck Yeah, but the only thing is...we have documented in scientific papers ONLY naturalistic causes for things. Never once has a supernatural cause been identified and explained. We have a pretty good understanding of the naturalistic mechanism by which tornadoes form, for example. However, we have NO understanding of how a supernatural mechanism works. Because nobody can investigate and verify anything supernatural....for me that is a "red flag" which tells me that the supernatural is probably just imaginary and based on confirmation bias.

@MadScientist72

3 жыл бұрын

@James Buck That just moves the problem back a step. It doesn't answer the question of HOW life arose. Saying "aliens did it" .......ok, but HOW did they do it???

James Tour is one of the nicest and most sincere and inspiring men I've ever had the pleasure and honor of speaking with.

@bosco008

2 жыл бұрын

He has no idea what he’s talking about.

@nordscan9043

2 жыл бұрын

Triggered.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

He's not sincere at all. He's an engineer, not a scientist contributing to life origins research, which, contrary to his claims, is thriving. Literally thousands of peer-reviewed papers (that he's never seen) contradict his claim that "we know nothing about life origins".

@cd1857

Жыл бұрын

@@ja31472 Tour never said OOL research wasn’t being conducted, only that it is becoming less and less fruitful in terms of determining how life originated. In that assertion he has been proven right at every turn

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

@@cd1857 No he hasn't, and he doesn't know what research is being conducted because Tour is not in OOL research. He's only read a tiny fraction of it, is between 50 and 200 years behind, depending on the specific topic, and bases most of his arguments on a middle-school level picture book, depicting molecules-to-man written for students having zero knowledge of biochemistry, hence the gap. kzread.info/dash/bejne/hZ2s27xwdM65mqQ.html

I enjoyed the interaction between these two distinguished believers. I see them as Paul and Barnabas and should go on the road together spreading the Good News of Yeshua. G-d bless you brothers!

Dr Tour is correct regarding how Miller/Urey is taught in schools. I should know, I had to teach it as part of the syllabus. Students were expected to leave the classroom thinking that this solved the initial questions of where life came from. There was no question poised. I had to provide these myself, but tell the students that for exam purposes they had to stick with the textbook. Lots of these things cropped up. Some clearly wrong but less controversial. Most obvious example was that farmers spread slaked lime, calcium hydroxide on their fields. It has been copied from textbook to textbook. I had to tell students that they must use this answer even though it is nonsensical. A far cheaper and safer option is of course calcium carbonate in the form of ground limestone. Farmers use this to correct soil acidity all the time. Most scary was that we had to teach that anamolous results should be discounted. Yikes, scientific cheating. A whole generation taught to fudge their results.

The frustration I think James is voicing is that whole swaths of the population build their worldview on assumptions about the certainty of science's level of understanding of the origin of life that are, in actuality, wholly unsubstantiated, frequently misrepresented and entirely hostile to any serious debate on the issues. That's what's his frustration is about.

@wilsontexas

3 жыл бұрын

Similar with vaccines in 2021.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

Tour is not just misrepresenting but outright lying about science's level of understanding of the origin of life. He's not an OOL researcher and hasn't published a single paper on the subject, yet he preaches on it like a god.

One of the live chats: "​This is like watching Rocky v Clubber. Love it!!!!" What does that mean? Which one of us was Rocky and which one was Clubber? Was this the one where Rocky wins or loses? :)

This is a true blessing to watch these brothers in Christ standing and walking in the light of the LORD in their world they are in Now I Paul myself beseech you by the meekness and gentleness of Christ, who in presence am base among you, but being absent am bold toward you: but I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh. For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (for the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;) casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ; 2 Corinthians 10:1‭-‬5 KJV

This was super intresting and funny at the same time lol hahah. Gotta love them guys

So if you can provide physical proof that there is a non-zero probability of life forming through natural processes and you can't provide any proof for god existing, which one is a more probable explanation for origin of life?

@malvokaquila6768

4 жыл бұрын

You belive in miracles either way.

@20july1944

4 жыл бұрын

Alex: since the universe hasn't existed forever, how do you explain it's beginning?

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

The correct answer is "indeterminate" from this evidence an analysis, and likely surprising either way.

@alexp8924

4 жыл бұрын

20july1944 depends on what you mean by universe. Universe can be self-causing.

@20july1944

4 жыл бұрын

@@alexp8924 Really? Explain how the universe could be self-causing.

That last statement from James was powerful... Wow

I'm loving it 'I agree with that...' awesome.. I'm in love with James Tour

I would like to suggest that "mysteriousness" is the breath of life from God and that is why we will never be able to replicate life.

I would marry Dr Tour

James Tour is so passionate lol

@adamclark1972uk

3 жыл бұрын

Hahahahaha lol

Dr. James is enthusiastic about getting fascinated by the chemistry of a cell.

Im ready boy this is great time to change the biology high school books what a debate of science in that class really should i get my friend to make a high school bio book

That was entertaining as hell. Also, I’m questioning my scientific education.

@michaethomas4025

3 жыл бұрын

Great! I came here and felt the same. God will lead everyone back to him if they truthfully seek, which I am finally convinced of.

@chimpanzeethat3802

3 жыл бұрын

The subject of abiogenesis isn't really touched on until students go to college, and even then it's only something included in organic chemistry. So I wouldn't feel too bad about it if I were you.

@ccookRomans

3 жыл бұрын

@@chimpanzeethat3802 Abiogenesis doesn't explain the origin

@chimpanzeethat3802

3 жыл бұрын

Abiogenesis is the science of the origins of life. So yes, it does explain it. Or attempt to at least. It's still just a hypothesis. It hasn't been elevated from a hypothesis to a theory yet because it hasn't been effectively demonstrated yet.

@ccookRomans

3 жыл бұрын

@@chimpanzeethat3802 "Or attempt to at least. It's still just a hypothesis." I agree

If it were to be assumed that a god created the cosmos, and concocted some method that life could come into existence, what do you do with that assumption in any kind of religious sense? How do you rationally apply that assumption to the world we live in given that holy books appear to be man-made?

@Cloud-wl8lp

4 жыл бұрын

man-made in what way?

@ambassador_in_training

4 жыл бұрын

I've read your questions several times and I don't know how to answer them. If appreciate if you could clarify what you mean it elaborate more on what exactly you're asking. Thank you.

@lotus9865

4 жыл бұрын

That makes no sense bud, re phrase it please

@timjansen7694

4 жыл бұрын

@@lotus9865 I actually do not know how to make it any clearer. Let me change the notion around. Let's say there was a scientific decree that a powerful entity was required to create both the cosmos, and the process that allowed life to begin, what religious determination can you draw from that decree? As far as I can tell, none. The entity may not even exist anymore and if it does, how do you determine anything about it?

@timjansen7694

4 жыл бұрын

@@ambassador_in_training The common notions are that it required a god to make the process that created life. The same thing as been said about the creation of the cosmos. Even if true, how do you determine anything about the god based on those two possibilities?

Jim is amazing

Loved this so much. Honest debate but the work of Jesus on the cross central.

It is true. I had a biology degree with focus on molecular biology and biochemistry, and in all our years the way profs and textbooks presented the idea with miller experiment snd first rise of cells from some slime was pretty much presented as the main theory but nothing opposed to it or no weaknesses in it were described. In a short chapter they go past that topic and experiment then quickly move on to differences in beak sizes and make this enormous leap. So for us as students, who are at that time trying to pass 5 tests and exams and labs per month, most students read and assume it subconsciously it is howbit happened and move to real science chapters where we learn actual biology. To this day my bio degree friends assume yes, that's EXACTLY how life arose and maybe there were some minor variations. No one thinks or talks about scientific critique of the evidence or theory like we did in 4th yr current practical science research and critiqued the journal articles for assignments. None of the assignments were given to critique origin of life questions. My non science friends are all 100% convinced that scientists have proven this already. Just your friends with low science iq. They all think it's a fact. So the situation on the street is different

@markd6202

3 жыл бұрын

I agree. In some ways this particular conversation is a bit of a strange one because actually the main thrust of what James Tour is saying is that the”general public” accept, because the popular narrative says it, that life on earth arose from a primordial soup mixture which was exposed to lightning etc and over a period of time...... millions of years, by random chance, the first living organisms were formed. As James Tour put it the argument if you like is in the general populations perception of the science evidence. The ignorant masses, of which I am one, have been fed a theory as a fact by the media and very few serious scientists have stood out afrom the crowd and said .....hold on a minute where is the scientific evidence for this. Here in the UK the great media champions of natural science such as David Attenborough simply portray it as a given that life evolved from a primordial soup millions of years ago and I am yet to see a programme commissioned for general viewing that questions this so called “fact”. I imagine this to be the case throughout the worlds popular media.

@ja31472

Жыл бұрын

"It is true." No it isn't, Tour lies about the state of life origins research. Thousands of peer-reviewed papers prove him wrong. "In a short chapter" What book, a middle school textbook? Do you know what an advanced electrodynamics textbook says about mechanics? Lest than a short chapter or nothing, because they are different areas. You need to look in the right place. "To this day my bio degree friends assume yes, that's EXACTLY how life arose" No they don't, or your friends are idiots. If you want details on a specific subject you have to look in the right place. If that subject is on the boundary of science, like life origins is, you have to do graduate research. "My non science friends are all 100% convinced that scientists have proven this already." Billions of people are convinced in things that aren't proven at all and have no scientific evidence, just because a charismatic preacher said it.

Because things devolve,and God designed, how COULD you put parameters on God's design. Remember this claim and I will see you in heaven bruh.. .

2:05 J. Swamidass always keeps the focus on Yeshua! My man!

@jamesr.g.2320

2 жыл бұрын

You can say Jesus, you’re speaking English

Dr. Tour is great... most people don't get him cause the way he explained things are a bit forward straight to the point

This is a very energetic discussion, but far more heat than light. Dr. Tour doesn't make a coherent or well-organized case: he just explodes in response to everything Dr. Swamidass says.

@20july1944

4 жыл бұрын

I agree -- I find Tour hard to follow as to what his position is. He makes essentially an ID argument but had previously been quoted poo-poohing ID but today he sounds rather pro-ID. As educated as he is on a REALLY key topic (origin of life), I'm disappointed that he doesn't really integrate that (an ID argument) with his Christianity. His testimony is a glassy-eyed expression of his love for Jesus, which is great but not distinguishable from what any uneducated person might say.

@Seretar

4 жыл бұрын

The more the discussion continues the more insufferable Dr. Tour becomes. The discussants haven't even set out their stalls, so we don't know what they are even trying to defend, and Tour yells, interrupts, and takes enormous pleasure in hearing Dr. Swamidass say "I agree with you." It goes from charming to obnoxious very quickly.

@Ryan-nv3dz

4 жыл бұрын

Doesn’t make a coherent case? Swamidass had no response to any thing and agreed with pretty much everything he said. All Swamidass responded with was “it’s over 0” . Swamidass was unable to give an answer to any problem that tour brought up.

@Seretar

4 жыл бұрын

That is mostly because he hardly had any time to speak. Sometimes Tour interrupted him before he had finished a single sentence after Tour had himself spoken for several minutes. Astonishingly impolite.

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

Ironically, some were annoyed that I interrupted WLC too much. It is hard to throttle on zoom, and Dr. Tour is passionate about all this. Verbal exchanges are really important but usually it is in the written exchanges that the details get hashed out. I have not had a written exchange with Tour yet, but I'd be open to it. I expect that is where more intellectual progress might be made. What do you think? As far as Tour argument, here are two articles: inference-review.com/article/time-out inference-review.com/article/animadversions-of-a-synthetic-chemist I've responded to this shortly here: "Another exception is James Tour’s chapter on the Origin of Life. Ironically, his parable about a “dream team” of scientists clarifies that life is not like any human design, and in this sense does not appear designed (p. 190). It is, nonetheless, widely accepted that we do not know how the first life arose. Many theistic evolutionists think that God directly created the first cell. As a leading chemist, Tour is confronted with what science can and cannot tell us. In light of science’s limits, Tour does not argue for ID." www.thegospelcoalition.org/themelios/review/theistic-evolution-a-scientific-philosophical-and-theological-critique-2/

So Cameron. When are you going to have someone from the ID movement on? Like Dr. Doug Axe?

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

Maybe we will invite Steven Meyer next. :) . James Tour orbits the ID movement, so doesn't he count?

@Ryan-nv3dz

4 жыл бұрын

I would like that. The older I get evolution just seems more unreasonable to me. I grew up catholic and they pushed Evolution hard so I have no theological problem with it. I’m fine with Genesis being a parable. But if you want me to believe that something as complicated as a cell built itself in a mud puddle you better be able to explain it. And it needs to more than the magic word “chance”

@Ryan-nv3dz

4 жыл бұрын

I think Dr Doug Axe would be a good choice. He did cell biology at Cambridge for many years. He also has a degree in engineering so he comes at this from both sides. His book undeniable was so important to me because he made the case that I just don’t have follow what lab coats say. I can make my own decision based on common sense and what sounds reasonable.

@chrisb6137

4 жыл бұрын

I think Swamidass, Axe is already happening on another channel next month. That’s why I think Meyer Might be the choice I imagine

@PeacefulscienceOrg

4 жыл бұрын

@@chrisb6137 That's right. That conversation is happening with Sean McDowell.

Mark my words: we will *never* break the sound barrier

Janes Tour is the MAN!

You should interview Nathaniel Jeanson about his research.

@UnOrigionalOne

4 жыл бұрын

After his new book comes out though.

@ArgothaWizardWars

4 жыл бұрын

@@UnOrigionalOne why wait? he has a lot of evidence already

@rastaboogie

4 жыл бұрын

Yes!!! I love listening to Nathaniel Jeanson. Love his research.

Life is definitely made by God

@lllULTIMATEMASTERlll

4 жыл бұрын

How do you know?

@chrismassey7563

4 жыл бұрын

@@lllULTIMATEMASTERlll Because the author of life is telling us.

@lllULTIMATEMASTERlll

4 жыл бұрын

Chris Massey Can you show me how you know this?

@Edward-bm7vw

3 жыл бұрын

There's no proof.

@chrismassey7563

3 жыл бұрын

@@Edward-bm7vw There's no proof of life?

I was once told that there is some things we are just not meant to know,once we know how to create something from nothing that knowledge will be abused by mankind

where did the basic chemicals come from? where did the lightening come from? Where did the pond come from?