Notes: *They do have a weld certification program and train welders. *Over 600+ welders in this one facility *RV manufacturers pick the specs and GVWR

@waltermatney6090

4 ай бұрын

What is the certification program? And why do the welds still look so bad? Open up any fifth wheel and look at the welds most of them are bad.

@allenfitzpatrick8485

3 ай бұрын

Certification of your own welders is not the same as a full apprenticeship.

@joblow5490

2 ай бұрын

Down hand weld with GMAW is less than ideal.

I worked at a military aviation depot for 36 years and during my time I helped set up the powder coat shop and created processes for powder coating. What I noticed was they aren’t applying a powder primer what we experience was after several years of testing that we would start seeing corrosion and rust without primer and with primer during the same testing period there was 75% less .

@EBKRV412

5 ай бұрын

Most likely why most lippert frames today that are only 1 year old look 20 yrs older than my 2013 unit today's frames are full of rust even when new

@nicclark9791

3 ай бұрын

Maybe they are as scummy as the RV companies and only worried about there bottom line as well, bad business knowing that there coating only last a year or so and you told them why. SO LIPERT WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT THAT???

Nice effort to show what they do in a tightly controlled environment ( controlled by lippert) I also saw no inspection stations. I also heard loud and clear lippert pushing all the blame on others.

Appreciate the Lippert videos. As a mechanical engineer, I can appreciate what they do. That said, as the owner of a 2024 Lippert chassis, they are still poorly protected from rust. Very poor. I don't know exactly what kind of powder coating they use, but it's too thin and not robust enough. I've touched up the already-rusting spots on my new frame, and Rustoleum in a spray can does a much better job. If curb appeal is important, they need to step up their powder coating game as it's one of the first things that makes you grimace on a new RV. Again, thanks for doing these videos.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

I agree with this. They could use a better protective coating.

@shaungarrett3938

5 ай бұрын

I agree. My 2 year old frame has rust spots on every weld I have to touch up and did from the lot.

@merlinsmith2431

5 ай бұрын

It’s my understanding that powder coating is cheaper not necessarily better but companies imply that it’s better because its cheaper lol. Epoxy or another etching product is needed on the bare metal to have real rust/corrosion protection.

@kingair350

5 ай бұрын

@@shaungarrett3938they need to dip them like an automobile frame

@kingair350

5 ай бұрын

The guys in the booths were not liking being videotaped

I would pay extra for a frame that could carry the load up front without relying on cabin walls for stiffening, even if it meant the RV was 1,000lbs heavier.

@charleswesley9907

Ай бұрын

It would be worth it for them to use chrome molly where all the breaks occur instead of the lesser grade metal they use . Steel has various strengths of steel .

I find it timely that you have a Lippert video after all of the frame flex videos. I guess sponsors control the content.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Only if they sponsored me right? Brother, you didn't catch that these videos are because of the Frame Flex issue? Lol. No conspiracy here. It's all been disclosed

@mattwarner6599

5 ай бұрын

@BigTruckBigRV just testing you. Great resonse and thanks for the clarification.

Guy with the sledgehammer was like “ stop filming me, I need to beat the crap out of this outrigger” 😅

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

He's "tuning" them.

@BigTruckBigRV - I love these 'how they are made' videos. I am glad you have a good relationship with these folks and RV manufacturers that allow you to come in and take video of how they work.

Numerous places in this video welders are mig welding vehicle and upside down. I worked at a major farm equipment manufacturer in the past and upside down mig welding was never down and vehicle ws done on about a 45 deg angle. Jigs and fixtures were used to position the steel pieces before be welded. If needed the jigs and fixtures were able to rotate so the welding could be done horizontal. The appearance of the weld is not necessarily an indication of a strong weld. After there failures in the field especially of the weld holding the hub to the sprocket, the welder had to have a first piece inspection before being allowed to continue. This first piece inspection involved cutting the part in two and etching with acid to see the amount of weld penetration. This whole series showed me the chassis is not strong enough! To expect the aluminum & fiberglass walls to support more than the weight of what is above them is ridiculous! I do believe it is the RV's manufacturer responsible to insure the chassis is strong enough, this series sure sounded to me like a sales pitch from Lippert!

As a certified weldor myself, I'm thoroughly impressed by the manufacturing process you documented in these videos. I had never even heard of Lippert until I started watching/reading about the frame issues certain manufacturers, and one in particular, who I won't name, are having. Lippert certainly looks to have a first class fabrication operation. I can't comment about the powder coat, but their manufacturing is among the best I've seen. Good job on the questions you asked. It was very thorough and quite frankly I'm surprised they were as candid and provided as much behind the scene as they did. They certainly don't look like they're trying to hide anything and are trying to be completely transparent, which is nice to see. Before watching the first video I was expecting a PR person and staff attorney to be following you around and getting involved with the questions. This didn't appear to be the case, which is nice to see.

@Derwoody

5 ай бұрын

Look at the videos of what Lippert is pushing out of their factories. I was going to go with Grand Design, not anymore, JD knows trailers but obviously not the proper way to build them.

Shackle hanger reinforcements should be a 100 percent must....there is virtually zero cost involded in adding them while the frame is being built and absolutely zero excuse not to have them

I would love to see a video at the manufacturer plant showing how they put the superstructures on and together.

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

Seems like a given follow up project. Atleast we can hope.

JD I definitely appreciate your efforts, however unless I've missed something can we talk about a very important step in manufacturing, QC. how many frames are being inspected before shipped to manufacturer thx

@jaimeriveras

4 ай бұрын

I had the same question. I worked at the production facility of an electronics manufacturer. Circuits were sampled for quality at almost every step of the process.

Thanks for the videos. This is an awesome eye-opener and thank Lippert for allowing it.

I'm impressed with their operation. If they built trailers that no one could damage no one could afford them. I've got thousands of miles on some heavily traveled roads. I am truly amazed how many campers now travel our roads, especially come Friday. Sad part is too many are driving like idiots. Speeding way over posted speed limits. Loaded up to the gills. Always in a hurry..

@shaungarrett3938

5 ай бұрын

Good point.

I am extremely impressed with this set of videos and the factory making the frames. I am surprised at the number of comments criticizing the video because you didn't challenge their answers or ask the questions about frame flex/failure. It is a video of "here is what we do". Personally, I would have liked to have seen an assembled 5th wheel upper deck tested like the single beam was in the first building. But then even that is not the same as testing the complete final product, but that would be at the manufacturer. The problem is with the final manufacturer of the trailer/5th wheel. That is who you have a warranty with when you buy the RV. That who specs the frame. That is who makes sure they are using the frame correctly. They easily could make the upper deck of the frame a little beefier, and while it would add some weight, it would not be as much as some people believe. However, as long as customers make buying decisions that include cargo capacity, manufacturers will try to get as close to minimum RV dry weight as possible.

Hand down one of the best videos I have seen on this channel. Excellent work JD.

Thank you for the Lippert videos. Kind of like being there.

In my career as a structural Ironworker/welder I worked with many other certified welders, some were very good and some were horible and made me wonder how they ever passed their certification tests. Another factor is how well they read blue prints to know the size and length of the specified weld and also to make sure that all areas that are designed to be welded actually are. This also requires proper weld inspection. Lippert appears to have a first class manufacturing facility and it looks more and more like the Brand of RV has more liability than they assume.

@kentrumm1385

5 ай бұрын

I agree with this. I would be curious if they perform any NDE (non destructive examination) like penetrant testing or mag particle testing on the critical welds. Just because sometimes welders have a bad day, or it’s Friday(end of shift)

If I ever start manufacturing RV frames, the powder coating process will REQUIRE the use of a primer on EVERY frame we even THINK about making. Not only that, but we'll pick one type of frame within the RV industry and stick to only making those. When you focus on only doing one thing, you become outstanding at doing it.

@chip9177

4 ай бұрын

Full jigs & robot welders.

@ColtonRMagby

4 ай бұрын

@@chip9177 Robot welders can break in a way you need a tech wiz to fix.

@chip9177

4 ай бұрын

@@ColtonRMagby Doing one thing over & over robots are the only way to go. We had a robot welder back in the 80's welding Harley upper & lower gas tank mounting brkts.....never missed a beat, all welds perfect & identical. One guy to load & unload the jigs.

@ColtonRMagby

4 ай бұрын

@@chip9177 True, but the welds will all look the same.

I've owned 4 trailers and I have crawled underneath all of them and sprayed a rust inhibitor on the frames. I do it every 2 years.

Very informative. Enjoying the tour 👍

We bought a 2019 Grand Design travel trailer. The first time I crawled under it and looked at the welds, was very disappointed. We use it for local trips only and it is presently for sale. The only way I would trust it for long distance would be to spend time reinforcing the frame and suspension.

This series has been very educational for me. Thank you !!

My older rv’s utilized thicker I beams, now they are c Channel and thinner material.😳 cross members are very important mine are sheet metal at best if any. Boxed steel frames are best with thicker , boxed frames is money well spent. Pot holes, speed bump, train track crossing and bridges are offset so let’s build the rv for the real world!!!!

Very impressive! Thank you for the tour

The roving vets show a closeup of their grand design frame welds if anyone is interested.

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

Poor choice for a video to mention, since they had no broken welds and everything around the pinbox was fine.

Should have showed a closeup of the welds.

Love the videos. I took mechanical engineering in college. The need to put some braces from. The two risers to the frame. To stop the flexing of the frame and the raised part.

Another great video. I really enjoyed this

Thank you! You have educated those who think they know what’s wrong with their RV. I am curious as to how they strengthen the shackle hangers? Thanks again 🇺🇸

Very kool thx for clearing this confusion up

JD I enjoy your videos. Learning a lot about frames of RVs. Looks like Lippert frames are built good because quarry control and welding. I still believe what you said about frame flex and believe something has come undone, or water or people use atchments that not approved by Lippert. It seems a lot people always blame others when something goes wrong with things. People got to think when you built mass frames sometimes things pass through but that's rearly happens.

Wow what a great video thanks

I've watched all these videos. You know what hasn't been shown? An actual customer who was a broke frame that was accepted as a fail by Lippert. Or where Lippert has actually fixed a broken frame. Basically these videos are ads for Lippert. And there has been absolutely no help for customers. Get out the shovels. Waist deep and growing.

I have enjoyed the Videos! Thanks. And I must say I was impressed by the noise canceling of your mic!

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

That was all the software my friend. Otherwise there was a super high frequency sound that would have drove everyone nuts....not talking about my voice:)

Great video! Very informative

At the end of the day, the manufacturer is telling them to built it as cheap as possible while still maintaining the specifications. If more is added the price increases. I love how must people that comment don’t know welding procedures. I was surprised how good the near white blast was done before painting, yes it could always be better but that’s what there asked to give. Overall they do good work. All this in MY opinion.

Great job! Thanks for sharing this with us.

Should have done a hardness test on these frames! I put a floor jack under the main I-beam and it bent. I was trying to block it up to take the weight off the hydraulic jacks which is recommended in the owners manual! It all metal is equal.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Doesn't that get demonstrated at the end of the video?

These are good videos but the people with issues are not going to buy any of this. They are angry and have a right to be maybe. My idea would be put the frame engineers together with the manufacture of the rv. Maybe the frame builders can come up with a better way for the manufacture to do things because no matter how strong the frame is if the box on top is done wrong it’s a failure

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

That's not a bad idea, however if you KZread search frame flex on Gooseneck trailers, you'll see they are SUPER heavy and SUPER Heavy duty and they are still designed to flex. With really long structures like this you have to either make a structure so large and heavy and braced everywhere that it would never work for the RV industries weight requirements or would tear itself apart from not being able to flex. Plus, the cost would be huge. It's all about trade offs is what I'm realizing.

Thanks for the well-produced video - the cooperation from Lippert was impressive. The only thing not shown was the engineering analysis of the basic designs. I would expect to see finite element analysis to verify defections under load, vibration sensitivity, strength at temperature, shock loading (crash resistance) and sensitivity to user loading. Does Lippert use 3-D modelling when designing each chassis and is this used to estimate weight, and material quantities? Is each chassis marked for future traceability with serial number or bar codes? Does the factory have material inspection and test capabilities? Could more of the welding be automated to avoid production variations/weaknesses?

In the video when looking at the upper deck attachment points a see MANY butt joints with no gusseting. That’s a problem. At about the 4 minute mark where it shows the upper deck it clearly shows possible failure points.

No question this is an impressive facility. I’m still looking for the engineering space which is studying frame failure. Where is it?

Instead of gussets only being on the sides of the frame where the overhang of the fifth wheel box is, they need gussets that go front to back to support that overhang. All your weight is pushing down on that overhang causing stress. Put more reinforcements/gussets to keep from frame stress!

Your video helps to understand what really happens in the build of Lippert Frame. Hopefully this will educate those that create so many rumors that float around on the web. It's unfortunate folks have problems with their frames and I hope solutions result from all your hard work in this series of videos. Finger pointing needs to stop and consumers, manufacturers and dealers need to start working together to solve problems. Sadly consumers get ignored & dealers and manufacturers don't respond to issues. Hopefully this Frame Flex issue results in better built units moving forward (fingers crossed)

Lippert is clearly freaking out about this and trying to get out ahead of it. That tells me it’s a huge problem and they are anticipating lawsuits (if there aren’t any active already). I suspect we will be hearing about this for years to come and frames will continue to fail as recreational users slowly put miles on their units.

@GymKatt

5 ай бұрын

Exactly the reason for this series.

I heard they comment the the frames are designed and built with an engineered safety factor (SF). JD Was that SF ever shared? Based on all the RV manufactures having input on material strength used in their frames I suspect the SF varies across them. Most likely they will not share, but it would point your viewers to the better built RV frames if they did.

Another great, informative video. It highlights the importance of understanding not just what the factory does, but what the brand insists on. These engineers are more than happy to beef up frames and may even suggest it, but it sounds like some brands would rather save a buck.

Check out the welds on the tong assembly art time 17:46 I am very sure that is not a filet. It is a cold weld with puddled wire. As these are in the next stage of assembly there is no quality inspection. What do you think?

@tomwalker3553

4 ай бұрын

Sorry the time stamp is 5:52

Excellent content /videos. So the RV manufacturers are ultimately responsible for the chassis because they tell Lippert how they want the chassis built from watching your videos.

What are they doing at Lippert to the rv frames in questioned to fix or strengthen it?

I wonder how long the employee meeting was before the “ guests “ arrived.

Good stuff - learn lists from your vids

I appreciate you making these videos. I really do. And I am certainly NOT an engineer. But I cannot understand how a wall made up of aluminum studs, Azdel and fiberglass could ever withstand frame flex that is beyond specifications. If the steel tubular frame flexes too far, the wall would never have the strength to stop it.

It was good that Lippert people clarified their role as welder/fabricator supplier according to customer specifications and drawings. End of story!

Well I am in the market for a new 5th wheel specifically a GD 381 I’m definitely holding off I feel as if not all parties are being very forthcoming. I think this going to turn into a firestone ford wear they just point the fingers at each other

It is amazing to see how large the facilities are and how many units they can produce each day. What is the life span of powder coating versus galvanized frame? Most RV users only use them during summer months but I RV year around and in snow country. How can I minimize the impact of ice melt on my RV frame?

One question or lippert welders certified I know I used to work for Xcel Energy and we had certified welders because they work on natural gas piping

This has been a very good series. Some thoughts on this one. The one engineer made a comment about how it’s up to the manufacturer to decide how they attach the house to the frame. That strikes me as very interesting with what has been engineered to be a monocoque chassis and thus depends on the house for proper structural rigidity. That potential disconnect could be a problem area. Given the focus on speed of production I wonder about their ability to consistently deliver high quality welds across the entire frame. Poor quality welds could certainly cause the frame failure issues. Another KZreadr recently stated that the reason he dissolved his relationship with Lippert was because of stories he was getting from Lippert employees about things like poor quality welds.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Which KZreadr was this? I've honestly not received any emails or contact BEFORE this trip from anyone at Lippert saying theres issues.

@jetdriver

5 ай бұрын

@@BigTruckBigRV wandering weekends. It was in a comment thread.

Did you know Lippert has a KZread channel ✌️

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

They do, you should check it out.

The content and effort of the videos is good but still there is shinnanigans going on so let’s see what good ol grand design says. I certainly see what the frame company is doing tho.

There shouldn’t be any delaminating occurring as many of the reps for the walls and insulation along with rv sales people explain the wall will not delaminate by showing a sample in water. So I believe you had that wrong. Also you appeared to blame the owners for overloading there RVs without any proof, especially given how many owners are complaining about this issue not all of them have lithium batteries and $20K in solar. The frame should be so robust that it can’t ever have these problems imo I could be wrong. Overloading shouldn’t cause your frame to rust nor should a washer dryer etc.. Manufacturers and dealers offer numerous upgrades that are going to add weight clearly,apparently that’s not taken into consideration. Btw a lot of RVs can be ordered with massive solar packages, custom paint heavy duty axles suspensions brakes etc. If the rv can’t handle it then these options shouldn’t be offered or at the very least the dealer should have had the rv weighed and gotten approval from the manufacturer before adding more weight not the consumer. I certainly appreciate you trying to broach this subject but I completely lost it when appeared to blame the owner for overloading with washers and dryers and solar packages.

Great to see welders and workers. Not all Robots...( yet, I guess )

@charleswesley9907

8 күн бұрын

Have you noticed everything is 1/8th thick and I believe knife metal which is brittle .

4:43 is your problem. One hole every couple of feet to attach the wall? Plus he said they use glue. OMG..I looked how my semi trailer is build and there are 4 rivets every foot attaching the wall. So on 40ft 5th wheel you should have 160 rivets attaching the wall to the frame.....

I was expecting a full view of the straight frame and drop deck uprights. That's where the problems start.

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

Not in many cases.

@georgeholmes3411

5 ай бұрын

@@Itsa_Mea where do the problems start?

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

Theres no define answer and is case by case. But many do not notice a problem until they are hooking up or unhooking and see the pinbox mount moving independently of the structure (coach). Loose lag bolts for the coach to frame on the upperdeck, broken sidewall welds near the upperdeck slideout​, are contributing factors to the failures. Some units will have one or both indicators along with popped screw heads on the trim of the upper deck ect. The frame issues I've seen on the portion you referred to were caused from wore out leaf springs, use of Sumo bump stops, & overall overweight. The upperdeck issues are far more substantialand costly to repair. @@georgeholmes3411

Afterthought; In doing a cursory search for frame flex videos it seems that there is mainly one RV manufacturer that is having these problems. Am I missing something here?

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

I think there have been many RVers with different brands over the years who believe their units have had this issue. GD is the the main brand everyone is concerned about now, primarily with ToyHaulers.

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

The reason you're seeing so many Grand Design videos is because the company gained a huge following and popularity based on the quality and function (back then) so many KZreadrs that began filming their adventures jumped on the bandwagon and made the purchase. Some used, some new, but most have many miles of being fully/overloaded and now experience problems. Also during this time the company changed hands and corners began being cut. Now, here we are.

I know this series is of the present time, but the failures I've seen are on units PRIOR to the practices filmed. For example, the failures are the old style pinbox mounting, not the new Rhinobox Space Saver Frame. Also the powder coating seems newer also. My 2024 has it but my older 5er was flakey paint. I believe the development of the RhinoBox frame system is Lipperts answer to the breaking pinbox frames of previous years. So to me that shows they are doing "something".

And again at the 15 minute mark the finger is pointed away from Lippert . And pointed directly at the Rv manufacture .

I’m surprised they don’t have hoods over welding areas to suck out fumes.

What is their safety factor?

@mikeg1593

5 ай бұрын

Good question. And what load do they proof load that prototype to?🇺🇸

Is it the same gauge steel on a 40 ft.plus 5th wheel vs a 30 ft.?

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

No, frames are specifically designed to meet a gross vehicle weight rating and length requirements through their engineered plans. According to them

An okay video. I'm sure time constraints and proprietary limitations keep from actually focusing on step by step build process of a single trailer. Anyhow. Now let's see what QC is doing with the trailers. How are the trailers inspected from tip to tail.

Do the x-ray the welds an audit to make sure they’re right

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Not sure, didn't ask them. Sorry

@markyeater2247

5 ай бұрын

It would seem to me like for quality purposes they can x-ray those welds on one of the frames that they build a week or day. Please let me know.

Wow, i actually thought it was paint on the rv chassis. My boat has powder coat frame on trailer looks so much different than my rv frame.

@Itsa_Mea

5 ай бұрын

Depends on the year. They did NOT always powder coat. This is something more recent.

I always found JD’s review informative, but this time I don’t understand why he his doing a Lippert infomercial!

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

It's not, these are for informational purposes only. Not intended to be a blame game. BUT you'll be surprised what Lippert's going to do because of them.... Coming soon I hope

The spring hangers on my 2024 BAL frame are 10x the strength and size of those. I feel like this is an apologist series. Sorry, I normally like your videos. I also tow with an F450 and I've enjoyed your 450 videos.

I don't know how to do this job, but i do feel that this video came out at this time a little interesting. This seemed scripted, which i get it, you need to tell your side of the story or what i like to call, CYA! Cover your ass. So my question is, how or where does the problem come from, in terms of this whole frame flexing issue start? I don't own an RV yet, but I am looking into buying one soon, so I'm doing my research. Should i look at frames when i go to buy? And what should i look for in a frame? Meaning is one frame design better then another? Hope everyone can come together and solve this with Dignity and respect to both the buyer and the builder.

I wonder what the percentage ratio of the safety factory is talking about, 5% or 10%?

Lippert should do more than suggest how a frame should be manufactured. It’s their name on it, they need to have much better minimum standards to their frames. Make it so when you are shopping for an RV you want it to have a Lippert frame.

Looks like a legal question of who is responsible for the frames failing. What we do know is some frames on fifth wheel and bumper pull RV trailers fail. What we don't know is what is common , if anything to the failures that have occurred. It has been reported that the failed frames are all manufactured by Lippert for the OEM RV manufacturer but that needs to be confirmed. The next question is how were the RV's that have the problems loaded, to what extent were the trailers that sustained damage over or under loaded by the owners. Road hazards also impact how an RV frame is damaged is used under normal or abnormal rated limits. There have been videos by certain RV OEM's that Lippert makes the frames to their specifications. Did the specifications include the steel to be used , welds used, and other attachments to any automotive spec? The wind up is we need as customers disclosure and accountability fast before everyone's reputation is blemished and as a Certified RV tech. I need parameters of what to inspect when I work on an RV to perhaps give a customer a heads up before someone hets killed or injured.

If Lippert gave a crap about their reputation, they would demand the manufacturer give them the weight of weight bearing areas and test that the frame can handle that. That way they would have proof that they care about the product they build, and if the builder deviated from the basic specs received, then they should at the very least drop them as a customer. As far as engineers go, their recommendations mean crap without testing and it seems you have been invited to see ALL AREAS of the plant so if they had a testing facility, I gather they would of at least shown you some if not all of it.

Should have showed a closeup of all the welds, and not the ones done when you were there, the ones already painted and about to go to manufacturers.I'd like to see some welds tested via perhaps a Magnetic Particle Test This inspection method or physical weld testing method is employed on welds and articles made of magnetic alloy steels. This test is used only for ferromagnetic materials where deposited material is also ferromagnetic. A robust magnetic field is created in the test piece by means of high-amperage electric currents.

I see they are using Miller equipment which is excellent welding equipment. I would like to see what size wire they are using, wire speed, and voltage. I have always liked your videos they have been very informative however this looked scripted and I never saw a quality control tech inspecting anything.

Shocked Lippert allowed those “welders” to be on video.

Lippert claimed their welders are certified to Lippert standards. To what standard are Lippert weld procedures and processes certified to, AWS, ASME Sec IX? Are the welding and destructive test needed to qualify weld procedures witnessed and certified by an independent body or third party? I noticed that QA/QC didn’t have a representative present. Does Lippert employ Certified Weld Inspectors (CWI) ? Is Lippert ISO certified? They claim to build per “specifications”. What specifications? If so does Lippert contract qualified independent third party inspection and certification personnel to verify compliance to these “specifications and standards”? 1,000 units per day, reeks of questionable quality.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Well, call them and find out

@TheTrinityguy

5 ай бұрын

They have to meet literally no guidelines but their own. These are very crude mass produced basic frames. Nothing high tech like SEMA welding happening here...lol

I am not a welder but I do understand pressures and stresses in lumber and framing. I would never want a pinbox designed and produced like this one. It is engineered to fail. Produce these like a horse trailer or car trailer pin box and design the floor plan from that. Sad that they did not say this is what were adding to correct the issues as stated

And if Lippert has an expectation that their frame needs wall support for rigidity, than I would think they would have to forward those requirements to the RV manufacturer

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

I could probably guarantee you that the manufacturers know this. After over decades of building fifth wheels.

Who are the people in the videos?

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

Welders, engineers, marketing, and managers

@kingair350

5 ай бұрын

I’m talking about the people that are walking around with you you never introduced them

ALL VERY NICE, but I saw the broken cracked frames and the damage that resulted. All we want to know is how they are going to fix the problem and the mess. A HAPPY LITTLE VIDEO DOES NOTHING!!!!!

My favorite part was the dude waiting for you to move on so he could beat some stuff up with that 8# sledgehammer...also welding thru rust and mill scale , vertical down welds, I wonder if they are using er-70s6 wire and c25 or dual shield, short circuit doesn't like dirt rust and mill scale

Semi truck frames are assembled with huck bolts and rivets for a reason...strength for long life. Look at any semi truck frame, you won't see any factory welds on flanges. All truck frames use bolted in place suspension hangers and cross members. I saw they were welding on the top flange of those 5th wheel frames. That isn't good for strength. Their transition from the upper to the lower "deck" sucks. Not enough strength. That transition area takes a lot of stress when moving on the highway. Look at any over the road semi trailer with a drop frame design...that area is heavily reinforced. Their frames look to be a little better than a Home Depot 5x8 utility trailer.

Another popular KZread RV channel, spoke about how a manufacture tried to bully and buy her off from publishing a video about broken frames. They offered to fly her out, pick up all expenses, give her a RV and make her an "ambassador" of their product. She rejected the offer and published it anyway... earning the respect of many including myself. Were you offered any money or perks to do these videos? I ask because the interview and its timing felt packaged with preprepared answers.

Most of your interview is you making statements and asking the Lippert people to agree with you. This is less an interview and more you leading the interviewee to the narrative you want. This should be much less you talking and more lippert talking.

I think the blame isn't all on the frame manufacturer. First the rv manufacturer are wanting to make to big of an rv and they don't want to let the frame company put a stronger frame under there rv . Next putting the cargo in one spot.. then the trucks that are pulling the rv .if they use a 4500 or 5500 Ford f450 f550 either have an air ride pin box and or full air ride on the rear of the truck. The frame manufacturer should have a frame that you could put an air ride pin box on . On our 39 foot outside length gulf stream fifth wheel trailer I put an air pin box on it and had no problem. This trailer had a gvwr of 16000 lbs and 3 5200 lb axles. When going to these high tonage trailers the rv manufacturer needs to put more axles under the frame. I don't blame the frame manufacturer there hands are tied by the rv manufacturer plans. When I used diamond c trailer manufacturer what I was getting at is use a stronger and lighter metals not build a frame like a equipment trailers.

Lippert is damage control mode with their shitty frames. I don't care how many youtubers they pay to promote them. I'll never buy an RV with their frame.

@BigTruckBigRV

5 ай бұрын

They certainly didn't pay me anything to make these videos.

@AZFoxes

5 ай бұрын

@@BigTruckBigRV That’s great to hear you aren’t sponsored by LCI and they didn’t cover your travel expenses or time for these videos. 👍

It would be interesting to identify where most of the cracked welds are being reported and what their comment is

I think we all know Lippert can look at certain failure areas and improve their frames easily but that in turn would add more cost per unit and add to the durability, but the BIG question would the cheap manufacturers purchase them? You should know that the manufactures are not pushing Lippert for their best possible quality. They are begging them for the bare minimum cost frame each design can get away with and they are finding that failure point now that more people are buying the max size rigs and going fulltime with full weight and pushing their minimalistic designs and quality to their breaking points. Problems like this are all based on corporate GREED and not on building the strongest or best quality product. The workers can weld everything perfectly but if the overall design is engineered too lightweight there will be failures. The beam processing facility was the only area that was actually impressive to me.

So, let's see, you use a 1/4" weld to a base metal of maybe 1/8". Is that what you just said? Now I understand why we are seeing frame failure out there. .

Because I bought a toy hauler with lippert frame after 3 years my cross member welds are starting to break.