*Hey* Sorry for the late upload. This project ended up being way bigger than anticipated, but anyways, here's a quick note: -So apparently, after revisiting one of my sources, Advent Children didn't seem to have proper directing until around halfway through production (or at least Nomura didn't step in until then), and that may have impacted the overall quality of the film. Also, in case you didn't see my sources in the description, I'll place them here. Pretty much all of them are interviews, but it's the best that I could really find. www.gamespot.com/articles/kingdom-hearts-iis-tetsuya-nomura-q-and-a/1100-6076646/ www.khinsider.com/forums/index.php?threads/reviewing-kh-interviews-nomuras-interviews-from-2004-since-now.99573/ www.videogamesblogger.com/2006/08/11/kingdom-hearts-ii-tetsuya-nomura-interview.htm kh-ultimania.livejournal.com/2479.html thelifestream.net/advent-children/3n-interview/ www.ign.com/articles/2005/08/25/shadow-the-interview venturebeat.com/2019/02/26/from-guilty-gear-to-dragon-ball-the-30-year-history-of-arc-system-works/view-all/ www.siliconera.com/arc-system-works-now-owns-the-rights-to-guilty-gear/ vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/blazblue/images/9/92/Centralfiction_%28Story_mode_illustration%2C_75%29.png/revision/latest?cb=20161015084830 www.animenewsnetwork.com/interview/2017-01-17/tales-of-berseria-yasuhiro-fukaya/.108179 www.thathashtagshow.com/2018/10/04/venom-tom-hardy-on-venoms-psychology/ Characters In-Depth's video: kzread.info/dash/bejne/aWir1cmveJrLops.html Nerdstalgic's video: kzread.info/dash/bejne/d6iXy5ZufcbRfrw.html And remember, NO MOSS WILL SLOW ME DOWN!

"Edgy" is a trait, not a flaw.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

That's what I'm sayin', yo!

@mariatukoroma3900

9 ай бұрын

Fax,wish more people understood that.

To me, Ragna always felt like a chuunibyou, as if he is trying to come across as this dark, menacing and scary guy but there are people like Jubei and Tao that can see right through that mask or people like Noel and Celica that make him willing to drop the facade. Calling Ragna a one dimensional edgelord because that's what he pretends to be is like calling Hazama a nice and friendly gentleman because that's what he pretends to be.

@spiritpyros

Жыл бұрын

I dont even think he is trying to be a chunnibyou i just think he is trying to be a straight man in a world of madmen its only going to work for but so long

@GabrielMichaelDels

Жыл бұрын

@@spiritpyros yeah... being the Only Sane Man in a Crapsack World full of cast members with some really f'ed issues can only get you so far.

A lot of these "edgy" characters usually have been through and are going through a lot of crap. Usually any anger or gruffness or indifference they show towards others is because people have caused them a lot of trouble, and continue to be an irritant, or that they are focused on their tasks to the point of detriment to social grace (looking at you velvet).

1:44- 1:50 It's clear your problem with this criticism isn't the same as mine. The way I understood it, characters like Shadow, Zuko, Sasuke Uchiha, and Ryuko Matoi are called "edgy" because of their lack of a personality. From where I'm sitting people hate these characters because they're always, stoic, brooding and moody, or in some cases "whiny." My problem with this criticism is that these characters are very expressive, as in the cases of Shadow, Zuko, and Ryuko, they do open up over time as they accept the kindness of others, but their critics miss that because they're stuck with that dang first impression.

To me personally, edgy can be good and can be bad, it depends mostly on how it's made or presented. If a character have a backbone to prove why are they like that, have good story, reason, get character arc, etc., or can prove why they are the hype without being a complete shit or mary sue, then to me they are good kind of edgy, and can be the reason for me why i like 'em.

Edgy is a trait, I think it becomes annoying with characters that are also chunni and are closer to the idea of a mary sue, specially that amount of male protagonists in anime that act emotionless and "so cool" and every beat in the story goes like they want to, leaving every other character as incompent, becoming either a bland male friend or another female for a harem. Cid Kagenou/Shadow I think is the only one that has a redemption of this, because everything is a play for him and he is just so commited to his role, the story becomes a parody of itself.

This is probably my personal favorite video from yours for how relatable it is. I can't tell you how many people I met that write off Ragna as a "generic edgy anime sword guy" without even giving the series, story, or character a change because in the end of the day, he was never edgy.... at all... same goes to the other characters you listed which is ironic since all of the characters that were focused in this video (besides Cloud since I didn't get too attached to the FF series until recently) are characters that I have some connection to but also met people that are probably not fans of the, or just write them off as "edgy" or some different variation.

An observation on the Cloud and Sephiroth in KH: I'm pretty sure the intent is that they're the respective Heartless and Nobody of Zach, the guy who fought Hercules, who somehow got split off and both formed full human bodies. This might be me missing something, but by that interpretation, they were never intended to be the canon versions, instead being characters with the same face and name, but with a wildly different backstory that makes them both just kinda edgy to be edgy. Not a defense of it per se insomuch as a reasoning for it.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Somehow that doesn't surprise me.

@theendersmirk5851

Жыл бұрын

It explains why, in the second game specifically when Nomura invented Nobodies and then promptly had the allegories for depression get told by everyone to kill themselves so the other person they came from can be stronger (seriously, say what you will about some of his better stuff, he screwed up about the Nobodies, hard, thematically. Either that or he thinks the only cure to depression is suicide, one of the two. Or to add a third, he genuinely missed the most obvious allegory in history) he had Sephiroth and Cloud actually have drawn out encounters where Sephiroth started blathering about how he was all of Cloud's Darkness, blah blah blah. The real question is if he meant it literally, or as a metaphor, and Cloud is the Heartless, since honestly, it is really poorly explored after that.

@fightingmedialounge519

Жыл бұрын

That's a very generous interpretation ender.

I know I haven't really delved into the JoJo fandom, but I found it funny that people apparently called Jotaro edgy.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

It's mostly from people who aren't huge fans of Jojo, but Jojo fans say that part 3 Jotaro doesn't have a personality, which I disagree with.

Velvet is best Waifu , but honestly , after having people close to me die , I understand her rage. But venom is all over the place hes a joke character one moment and end boss the next

GOD BLESS YOU. Ragna is one of my favorite characters in fiction, it’s nice to see blazblue get the love it deserves!

All in all, I say the main take away from this is to never judge a book by its cover. Even if its unconventional, maybe you'll end up liking it.

I can’t believe I hadn’t found your channel earlier. Definitely underrated. Loved the intro.

I love it when my boy Ragna gets love in a video

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Me too. :)

A lot of what you said about ragnas backstory is part of being edgy, based on that being a label for characters made to be tragic and dark often complained about when its done without proper thought of how to use that trait much like how tropes are often used without understanding their function in a story (which is why they are frequently bad)

Wow dude, how do you have so few subs when your stuff it's incredibly well made!

I thought Jotaro was a closeted homosexual with a love for dolphins.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Closeted asexual actually. :)))

@Barakon

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan …do you have a video on this matter at least?

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

@@Barakon I wish. :/

This channel is a hidden gem. Love your work.

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

Awwwww thanks. :)

I clicked on this video for one reason and one reason only? Who TF are saying that Jotaro Kujo and Venom are "edgy?" Did I miss something?

Ah "BlazBlue Central Fiction", a game that is arguably just as complex as "Guilty Gear XRD Revelator," with the game like Revelator having legacy skill, meaning if you haven't stuck with the game since the original back in 2008 you have a MASSIVE hill to climb in learning frame data for each character's normals, gatlings, and overall mobility options that can be used on offense and neutral. Then there are the game's plentiful system mechanics, such as having a half a dozen options on defense that you need to master such as having four ways to block based on specific scenarios for example, and the game having a multitude of wake up options with each having a specific use, and that's not even going into the Drive mechanic, which is a unique action for each character, which there are OVER 35 of, which MOST of the cast plays VASTLY DIFFERENT from each other. Mainline BlazBlue games were HUGE in japan, with it being popular in many Japanese arcades, and as Obama stated in a podcast with Blasted Salami that the series had at one point been up there even with the almighty Tekken in terms of popularity. With many veterans like Dogura ( who is one of the best players in Guilty Gear who uses Slayer) and Fenrich ( who is arguably the best BB player, and currently one the best in DBFZ) representing the series for a long time . Sadly, The series just never took off over here in the west. However, the lack of popularity nationwide doesn't equate to the game's quality.The fact that is arguably the most unique AND complex 2D fighter on the market, but isn't talked about hardly at all in the west was always baffling to me. Especially when I read comments, and watch videos of people in the FGC complaining about how boring fighting games have gotten recently, or how easy it has become and yet will REFUSE to give the game a try. Thankfully, that seems to be changing, for instance Lord Knight, a tournament player who plays a variety of different fighting games recently made a fighting game tier list and put "BlazBlue Central Fiction" near the top, as well as popular Guilty Gear content creators like Obama saying on blasted salami's podcast that "BlazBlue Central Fiction" is arguably just as hard as Guilty Gear Xrd, finally, there's Kizzie Kay, who is a pro Sin player in GGXRD who says BlazBlue is his favorite fighting game series. For those who want to see high level game play in order to get a grasp of how hype this game can potentially be for you, I'd recommend a video titled "BlazBlue: Chrono Phantasma Grand Finals - Evo 2014" on youtube, and while the game represented there is not Central Fiction, I think it works, since Central Fiction is more of an evolution of Chrono Phantasma any way. Other channel's include "Burst Recap" and "Jourdal" for more high level Japanese play. Finally, BB TAG and mainline BlazBlue games are two SEPARATE things all together, with BBTAG having it's own set of rules with the system mechanics, and SIMPLIFYING ALL of the characters. It's for these reasons that you can't approach "BlazBlue Central Fiction" in the same way that you would BBTAG.

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

But in terms of lore, ysee there's these heros that kill a beast that intoxicated the entire ground so people live in sky cities and now these heros kill the beast but there's also this girl that gets born from a sword but she's a robot but she's also not but she's also saya which is ragna's sister who dies and became god but she also isn't saya and now we go to ragna who lives in a church with ragna jin and saya and jin gets a cool sword and kills saya and she becomes god but also not god so then ragna tries to blow up libraries because a cat tells him too and also cause of revenge because jin killed saya so he tries to blow them up but then he also encounters a tsundere vampire girl who's also a god but also technically isn't and she basically turns him into a vampire so he tries to blow up the cauldron but then nu 13 shows up who's also saya but not saya but she's a robot but also not a robot and she starts a time loop by stabbing ragna but then noel which is a girl that jin met in school who's saya but also not saya pulls him out of the cauldron to stop the time loop not to mention he also encounters hakumen who's jin from the past but also technically jin from the future so after all this a guy that has a rank in the library kidnaps noel and the game ends and yeah thats the first game

@lapis3965

2 жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan Sounds like fans of Guilty Gear and especially Kingdom Hearts lore will feel right at home with this story lol. Since both have also have convoluted plots, with tons of made up jargon, time travel, and multiple clones of a particular character.

the algorithm led me to this nice video also the Ragna video is out of sync around the shadow part

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

What Ragna video and what Shadow part? Could you please leave a timestamp?

@eddycatboy

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan well its now working somehow the part of ragna was being played early while you were still talking about shadow at the end of his section

i love this video and discussing the idea of edgy characters is soo interesting

underrated channel, really good video!!!

You're off on the appearance of Cloud in Advent Children, but that's due to a lack of knowledge on the material (I fucking envy you). I won't dump the details onto you, unless you want me to in a DM, don't wanna spoil the masses after all... but I'll point you into the direction of On The Way to a Smile, a good reading that bridges the gap between FF7 and Advent Children, and explains the struggle that Cloud and others are going though. Also I dunno if you were talking about Advent Children, or Advent Children Complete.

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure I watched AC Complete.

THe only problem I've seen in this video is that you haven't really addressed what Edgyness really is and how even if these characters were actually edgy it still wouldn't be the same as calling them bad. Yes, Edgy is a valid thing, it was never a word that relates to something bad when it comes to character stories. There are way more good edgy characters than there are bad. That said, youtube finally did something right, Definitely subscribing to the channel now.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, that's fair. My point was supposed to be that using it as a criticism is bad, but my argument probably would've been stronger if I had my own definition of edgy in mind.

I’m supriesd you didn’t talk and Jak from the Jak and Daxter series.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Don't know too much about Jak sadly. :/

@Kingbeat1

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan you should get the games they are fun but Jak 1 is really easy and the reason for the tone shift is because of gta 3 so if you ever play jak 2 just know it happened because of gta 3 kzread.info/dash/bejne/ZHya25iboNfemaw.html

don't worry, as someone who's finished the original FFVII as many times as it's number within the Franchise, you're entirely correct, Cloud is NOT an edgy character, he's a bit of an emo at times but that's that. Vincent would be the closest to be the edgy character of the game, and even he is not really that much of an edgy character. Final Fantasy 7 is overrated though. If if you think it is not be prepared to show evidence because I have actual reasons to call it overrated.

@jonahboris6681

Жыл бұрын

I'd actually say Sephiroth is the edgiest character in the game! After all, he loves giving people DIS PEAR! 🍐🍐🍐

Im so glad original dante isnt like dmc reboot dante

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

Same

Do you want shadow I’m smash I do not as a echo fighter

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

I want Shadow as a real fighter not an echo fighter. I refuse to have the next Sonic rep be another character with two spin dashes for special moves.

@Kingbeat1

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan finally someone else that finally doesn’t disrespect shadow by wanting him as as a echo fighter of a character that has a terrible moveset

Bad games can be funny which is why when people talks about glitchy bad games I usually go out to get them you sound like exactly schaffrillas productions 💀

For me shadow's best depiction comes from the comics Ian flynn did it perfectly with it very well established in the sonic universe series run

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Never read a single Sonic comic but I do know about the goated Ian Flynn. Excited to see how he'll help with the story in Sonic Frontiers.

Just take a look at Vergil

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Which Vergil? There's Vergil, there's Not Vergil, and there's *X F A C T O R V E R G I L*

@omgodification

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan im obviously talking about vergil, that one vergil. not any of the ones you mentioned. I mean Vergil. You know the one. The vergil. You gotta step up your vergilology, my friend.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

@@omgodification You right, I never majored in Vergilology. I considered it, but the credits were just too much and I had to drop the major. That was my mistake.

@omgodification

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan common mistake, vergilology is such a specific and underrated subject. We could use more great minds for our endeavors.

nice intro

SHADOW MY BELOVED HIEI MY BRLOVEFD

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Now I kinda wish that I got to talk about Hiei.

Very nice and detailed video as always, but I did want to bring up the gripes that _I_ have with Velvet's outfit as a whole (not just the strip of cloth lightly covering a quarter of her breasts) cause she's the only character besides Venom that I'm familiar with out of these folks: the outfit just doesn't make sense for the character. I will also contrast that with an oversexualised design that _does_ make sense for a character, viz., Magilou's. Velvet spent 3 years wrestling demons and eating them in a cold dank pit, working out and fostering her revenge plan. She is hell-bent on her revenge and as such would focus hard on using whatever helps her achieve her goals. I.e., she is supposed to be practical, especially in combat. Her outfit is anything but practical: it's got heavy metal plating on the feet, which would slow her down, but exposes the loins, which would leave her with even less of a leg if someone were to land a blow with a sword there, and leaves the abdomen wide open, which Rokurou even called out at the beginning of the game! Basically, this outfit makes no sense for someone who's thinking about decimating anyone who stands in their way, as it has too many flaws to be practical, not to mention how much attention it draws in public, which would be one thing if she used that cape to cover herself up, but she doesn't do even that! Now it could be argued that she is doing that intentionally in order to distract her mostly male foes, and yes, that would be a logically consistent justification for that, but TBH Velvet doesn't strike me as that kind of person. She prefers to do things plainly and simply, but that is indeed up for debate. On top of that, when you brought up how she was designed by a woman you also undermine this very point because it says plainly "asked her to make it *as attractive as possible".* Now, different artists have different stances on these things, but I believe that if that's the kind of pitch that they had, then they had this exact sort of thing in mind, and would go to a designer who does this kind of oversexualised warrior woman in skimpy clothes-type of deal. And if that kind of artist heard that kind of pitch, they'd do their job and go for a design that specifically caters to a male demographic. To be fair she did do a great job and I'd be a hypocrite if I didn't admit to the fact that character designs were the thing that piqued my interest in the game initially, but I still don't like the design :P Contrast all of that with Magilou: her outfit makes total sense for her, as we can see from her backstory and motivation, her combat style and her profession. who got abused and betrayed by her parental figures _twice._ When she left Grim she wanted to craft a new identity for herself, one that would lack the weaknesses that she used to have, and that's why the Magilou that we know is so eccentric, bold, overbearing, sassy, resilient, and socially inappropriate (e.g. the book-lifting scene): she is trying to reinstate her sense of agency and dominance by going to extremes and flaunting societal norms. A character like that would totally have a revealing outfit to telegraph a sort of "F*** you, society, I'm sexy and I ain't afraid to show it" attitude. Add to that the fact that she uses magic, meaning that bulky protection wouldn't do much for her, and the lighter the outfit, the easier it is for her to run away. Finally, she still considers herself a performer and a circus performer _has_ to be flashy, to catch the eyes of all that pass by, and her outfit succeeds in that by being flashy, colourful, asymmetric, having weird features (the book-skirt), and also by having a giant effin' hat that you can see from a mile away and also by being revealing. I rest my case. Sorry for rambling on an entirely different topic but I did feel like leaving it here since you've brought it up, and I needed to get this off my chest (ba-dun'ts), it's not every day I get to vent about Berseria!

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

I appreciate these points, but a couple of things: Velvet has greaves and gauntlets because they are meant to prevent her shoe blades from damaging her skin. Remember that Velvet doesn't just use a sword and claw, but she also has blades on her boots, as well, and given how elaborate some of her kick attacks can get (moves like defiant conviction and other moves where she does flips and cartwheels), those blades could damage her skin. Also remember that Velvet for most of the game doesn't care about her appearance. She literally finds her apparel in a chest on Titania, so she had to work with what she got. There are even a couple of skits that confirm this (one of which is Eleanor asking similar questions that you're asking lol), though I do agree that she could've at least tried to fix it up around the third act where she essentially was able to look past her actions, keep moving forward, and start coming across as a better person, but at the same time, the game also wanted to go for how Velvet owns her title as Lord of Calamity. Plus the anime scene before Mt. Killaraus also implies that she still feels self-conscious, so keeping the outfit as it likely represents both of these. Still think that something like the outfit repair mod on the Steam version would've been nice to see at this point. As for the artist comment, "attractive" doesn't have to mean sexy. Mutsumi Inomata has been in charge of character designs for the Tales series since Tales of Destiny, and tons of her previous female designs still look attractive without being sexualized (heck, I think that Nanaly, QQ, Milla, and Velvet are the only female character designs from her that have sexy designs (and she wasn't the character designer of Symphonia or Vesperia, so Sheena and Judith ). Most of her female character designs have very modest dresses and even some casual clothing here and there, so she's definitely not a designer known for designing skimpy women. Obviously, I'm not a woman nor a character designer myself, but I brought up that article because it's a similar situation to Bayonetta's character design: if the character was designed by a woman, and the design in question was primarily from the designer's choices and/or expression, is it that big of an issue? And given how her character development is the focus of her character, wouldn't the outfit come across as empowering rather than sexualizing? Especially since it's she's still designed by a female character designer? We could go more in-depth in this conversation when I'm more responsible to do so, and I might've given the impression that people who dislike a design like Velvet's for personal reasons aren't valid opinions (which I shouldn't have done and I'm sorry about that), but I do think this question should be brought up before making objective criticisms that attempt to explain more than just personal opinions (which again, I don't want to downplay). Magilou's design is peak though, I'll give you that, but keep in mind that it's from the same character designer as Velvet.

@Yan_Alkovic

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan Yup, your opinions are totes valid, too. TBH I didn't know any of this behind-the-scenes stuff cause Berseria is literally THE ONLY Tales game I know (OK I _have_ seen reviews of Zestiria but still), so I didn't know that Inomata is a mainstay designer and she doesn't always do skimpy outfits. And yeah, the fact that in-universe Velvet cobbled together the outfit from junk in that one chest does sort of make me less annoyed at how little sense the outfit makes, but like you said, would've been better if she added some stuff to it overtime. Though of course from the gameplay standpoint that would be pretty pointless since most people would run goofy outfits for the lolz anyway, and the artists who made the sprites wouldn't want to make separate versions for the different stages of her outfit.

1:03 The word you're thinking of is "edgelord"

So are you under the impression that a character can't be edgy if they have depth and a charcter arc? If so, that's not what edgy means, at least not originally. Characters were called edgy when their given edge, or undesirable traits and situations, in part for mass appeal.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Something tells me you didn't exactly finish watching the video before making this comment because that's kind of a shallow interpretation of this video. I'll give you the mass appeal point, though, as that's something that I probably could've mentioned.

@fightingmedialounge519

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan no, kind had to watch the entire video in order to mention depth, as oppose to just saying you think edgy characters don't have goofy quirks and moments . It also odd your getting this defensive when my comment only talked about the initial definition of the word edgy. So it doesn't really make sense to assume how much of the video I watched when I didn't actually give an opinion on the video, just a single term.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

@@fightingmedialounge519 The reason I assumed that was because I did cover more aspects than just having depth and a character arc (I also said that Jotaro doesn't really have much of an arc). I was focusing on why it doesn't work as a criticism rather than these characters aren't edgy, which granted I did also try and prove that, as well. Sorry I came across as defensive, though.

@fightingmedialounge519

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan yeah, which is why I said both having arcs or layers to them, and why I phrased it as a question, to indicate that there is more you talked about, but I'm not going over all of it because this isn't suppose a breakdown of your video. Granted I could have been more clear in that department. Again, my comment was only meant to address how you defined edgy, not give my take on any other part of the video.

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

@@fightingmedialounge519 That's fair.

It’s reached to the point where now it’s cool to hate on 6 for being overrated cause ff6 fanboys are that bad

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

As a ff6 fan I totally feel you.

say hello to my algorithm.

@JonathanFrostathan

2 жыл бұрын

Hello, my algorithm

Lol shadow the edgehog 💀

Edgy

@JonathanFrostathan

Жыл бұрын

Edgy

@spidyboi9097

Жыл бұрын

@@JonathanFrostathan also cool editing and fair points for all those "edgy" characters , even if I'm not familiar with half of them. Keep up the good work!

Shadow the Hedgehog did not ruined the character of Shadow the Hedgehog. Horrible mistranslation and localization is what ruined Shadow the Hedgehog. I'm sorry, but i'mma need you to replay the entire game all over again with the Japanese dub that has the properly translated sub. Japanese is always the go-to when playing a sonic game. In fact, i'mma need you to replay other sonic games in the context of Japanese. (Except Sonic Frontiers)

Edge blonde anime boy