Will the real David Bently Hart please stand up !!!! Lol😊 But really, this is very listenable and thanks guys.... The young man who came in and said something about the forgiving of his enemies was the fruitage of this so called Universalism. When i first tried this thing on for size i immediately saw that i now had compassion for my "enemies" and loving them was no longer a LAW.... Wonderful, just wonderful.... So now the living spirit is acting on our hearts.... I see the celebating and celebrating by church members of certain wicked ones being sent to hell by the God of the traditional church, as the fruit of wicked doctrine. Also, unisalve naturally cures us of selfrighteous, in that the poor souls living in tents under bridges are now really our brothers again and theres no more looking down our noses.... If interpretation of scripture doesnt cure.... then its wrong.... All the best guys with brotherly love....

Wonderful discussion! While listening, I couldn’t help thinking of an episode of The Twilight Zone, in which a couple received a box. If they pressed the button, they would come into a huge sum of money, but somewhere, someone would die, and the box would go to new people - who may, or may not, press that button to secure their well-being at someone else’s death. It seems much like the salvation game in which the number of people allowed on the lifeboat must be limited so there is room for the elect, who would appear to be OK to press the button and secure their salvation at the price of the damnation of others.

@normaodenthal8009

Жыл бұрын

@Truthoverimagination A loving God would not secure my salvation and the cost of an act of violence.

i can't believe anyone would try to claim universalism came from gnosticism, that's wild.

@bman5257

5 ай бұрын

What Calvinism does to a mf

I'm fascinated by Dr. Hart's claim that universalism (explicit or implicit) was the norm in Orthodoxy prior to an influx of Protestant converts. Not at all saying he's lying, but I'd love to see some documentation for that. Clearly there's a wide variety of opinion within Orthodoxy, and I'm no expert, but other than the Cappadocians I'm not aware of any major Fathers hinting at universalism until the 19th century. Thank you for posting these videos, they've been very thought-provoking!

@epektasis_shunyata

Жыл бұрын

St. Isaac the Syrian who is like the single greatest cornerstone of Orthodox monasticism.

@epektasis_shunyata

Жыл бұрын

Just listened to that part and he said the larger intellectual circles of Orthodoxy when he joined. He's mentioned before meyendorff and schmemann. Also Olivier clement and evdokimov as well as Andrew Louth. Kallistos ware. John Behr. Once upon a time hilarion alfeyev. As well as many people who prefer to keep it private and he won't out them.

@TheBillyDWilliams

Жыл бұрын

@@epektasis_shunyata Isaac the Syrian is a good call! So pre-19th century we’ve got the Cappadocians and Isaac?

@TheBillyDWilliams

Жыл бұрын

@@epektasis_shunyata btw not trying to be antagonistic, this is a fascinating subject for me and I’m trying to reconcile the recent popularity of the view with the historical record and the Orthodox conception of Holy Tradition. Thanks!

@epektasis_shunyata

Жыл бұрын

It's no problem. For someone like me, whether or not there has been a break in that tradition doesn't really matter just the truth of it. There are other reasons why a true tradition would lose continuity, such as despotic control of the narrative which I think we have positive proof of, what with burning heretics and all that. But at any rate there has always been a tradition throughout the ages. There's Solomon of bosra in the 13th century. Maximus the confessor probably was one in the 6th and 7th. Illaria Ramelli has a massive book on the continuity of the universalist tradition, which to be clear has been the minority since the 5th century but was the majority before that. It also happens to be true.

😓 'Promo sm'

The saving work of Christ is a huge failure if its true that there are people forever in hell.

Why are people still talking and arguing about myth and fantasy?

@bman5257

5 ай бұрын

They aren’t. If you want Fantasy read Daniel Dennett. 😂

@countryboyred

29 күн бұрын

Why would you even bother to comment on videos like these?

@jps0117

28 күн бұрын

@@countryboyred Good question.