Now the blame game begins..

Any beach front property especially in Florida is a disaster waiting to happen

@The_Christ_Angel

3 жыл бұрын

They said a 40 year recertification. Loans are 15 and 30 year typically. SMH. Fishy business.

@esterbaque7757

3 жыл бұрын

Why is this the only building ?????????

@Denise-Ann

3 жыл бұрын

Reclaimed wetlands. 3000 psi concrete.

@MeiteiManipuri

3 жыл бұрын

I agree...palm beach residents just announced...that palm beach doesn't have recertification ordinance for all its high rise buildings...

@you2angel1

3 жыл бұрын

Still doesn't make it right.

Every structural engineer in that area just increased their hourly rate by 100x

Before you blame the HOA board: I read another article where the residents didn't want to pay for the repairs, and the HOA only had $700,000 in the repair fund, but the estimate to do all the repairs was $16 million. If there were 100 condos in the building, that's $160,000 per condo and perhaps why residents were reluctant to pay for repairs. I have a friend who served on a HOA board for a condominium complex. The board had an engineer inspect the condos and he recommended repairs and if they deferred the repairs there would be serious structural damage and significantly higher costs to repair. This was explained in detail and the HOA board strongly recommended to do the repairs. However, the homeowners voted to defer the repairs.

That condo association did a really poor job of maintaining the property.

@PlayshotKalo

3 жыл бұрын

The original engineer did a really poor job of not building the pool deck with proper drainage in the first place. Good luck trying to “maintain” something that was faulty by design from the beginning

first thing that I would like to know is what firm constructed this building, this way I could look at all other buildings that were built by that firm.

@erikpienk

3 жыл бұрын

lol it's a 40y old building..... it's way past the builder's warranty.....

@nickodemusjohnson

3 жыл бұрын

It's dosen't matter what firm constructed this building, The building lasted for 40yrs, and buildings are to be kept maintenance and restored (even if it has to cost thousands or millions).

As expected, the construction, engineering and maintenance deficiencies brought the building down. A 40-year old building that is designed and built properly and is then properly maintained does not collapse out of the blue. Find the guilty parties and hold them accountable.

@PlayshotKalo

3 жыл бұрын

The building wasn’t designed or built properly, the pool deck slab wasn’t built on a slope to allow for drainage. It was faulty from the beginning

I THINK ALL INVOLVED KNOWING THE CONDITION OF THE BUILDING AND DIDNT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT SHOULD GO TO JAIL FOR ALL THE PEOPLE THAT DIED

@sofiawils3829

3 жыл бұрын

I guess You probably don't know many things because you suggest putting rich criminals in jail. There are very luxurious prisons almost a five star hotel for wealthy citizens in USA . .. it will be free for them

It's too late to fix it, but it's not to late to check its sister building.

much of that condo board is dead.

spoke to a guy at my job who worked on things in the building a few times. he said the penthouse alone had 2inch thick marble plates around every wall and the upper areas were heavy enough to collapse and everyone knew. the best part is, the building has a sister building built exactly the same two buildings over, so it's just gonna happen again.

Every condo owner being forced to pay over 300,000 toward repairs is absurd.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

I'm not sure what the situation is here but condo owners pay monthly or annual maintenance which should cover most of the cost.

@Denise-Ann

3 жыл бұрын

@@Bitchslapper316 I have a condo maintenance fee and it doesn’t cover large items. They call it special assessments where everyone in the building pays a share of a major repair.

Sue them to the point where they can’t hire an attorney for court before they serve multiple life sentences for this crap

I hope everyone who knew and did nothing get the pants sued off of them!

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Their probably dead in the rubble.

@Digger-Nick

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronnierabell1 The owner of the building died in the collapse?

@wakanda6754

3 жыл бұрын

@@Digger-Nick there is no one owner... condos were all owned individually, and whoever owned those collapsed condos could be dead.

@Official2Shitty

3 жыл бұрын

Sued? They should be incarcerated

@H3LLS4NG3L

3 жыл бұрын

@@Official2Shitty They should be sued and incarcerated for gross negligence.

We live in a world where human lives is worth nothing

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Everyone dies brother, might be worth something to someone but everybody dies at the end of the day

@toomanymarys7355

3 жыл бұрын

The people who owned the condos made the decisions that led to this.

The pool seemed to still be in good shape.

Just because a board member is a volunteer it does not mean they should not be held to accountability. The reports from an engineering firm plainly state the issues that should have taken first place in priority. A volunteer job is not a joke. It is a responsibility and a service to the community.

@govcalif

3 жыл бұрын

lotsa dead board members i imagine.

this attorney is one that wants to pass the blame my opinion everyone that knew about this situation are to blame because know one did a thing about the situation and this is the outcome

This confuses me. In my city these reports are required to be filed with the city and the city would force the condo to fix the problem or slap them with heavy fines and close the building. It appears the city had a copy of the reports so why didn't they force the building management to correct them?

@nickodemusjohnson

3 жыл бұрын

I mean...... it's politics. Just like Texas with its power grid. Just like California with its homeless population crisis. Etc.

Wait wait so you saying an volunteer HOA group, which I can bet none of them know about construction, make decisions about the structure of a building?

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Yup

@ammoseeker1976

3 жыл бұрын

Especially when it’s their money

@H3LLS4NG3L

3 жыл бұрын

@@acbulgin2 Subsidence was listed in one of the many structural defects reports. Unfortunately there is no oversight for these people making life-altering decisions. I believe there should be some sort of city board which reviews engineer's reports for these buildings and makes sure the appropriate actions are taken to remedy the situations. Unfortunately, the greed of the few will affect the many.

@H3LLS4NG3L

3 жыл бұрын

@@acbulgin2 Yeah, I was actually thinking about that as I wrote my reply. Unfortunately we just saw what happens when there is no regulations and government oversight behind how these boards can act. There's absolutely no way that these people have any insight into the repercussions their decisions have when overlooking building maintenance. One other option would be to force HOAs to hire experts who can override their decision making in these matters. I already hear the cries of "but muh freedom." Your freedom ends where another's begins.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

@@H3LLS4NG3L That's how it works in big cities like Chicago and NYC. This report would have immediately flagged the building with city agencies, the city would have fined them, ordered the repairs and closed the building down if they didn't complete them. Then they would have to have a follow up inspection and a follow up engineers report confirming the repairs were made. It's different in every city but I always imagined it would at least be similar. We also may not be getting the whole story.

The deterioration of the pool deck slab probably has nothing to do with the rest of the building collapsing

The rent will go up on the condos that have a ocean view now.

Yes but the question is did the residents know of the problems

@FriedChairs

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, they were warned in 2018 and were starting to act on the warnings…too late though.

Someone should be held criminally responsible. At a minimum, this is gross negligence in failing to uphold the basic responsibilities of landlord and shows reckless disregard for human life

@FriedChairs

3 жыл бұрын

It’s a condo, not an apartment. The building was owned by the condo owners which are mostly all dead now.

This gets worse and worse. I bet no one goes to prison for this.

The sister buildings were well maintained and are structurally sound. They actually remedied the design flaw in the pool deck, unlike their collapsed sister.

This is criminal negligence.

Here comes the finger pointing!!!!

Greed is the root of all evil. Suck every dollar never reinvesting into the maintenance of those buildings. People need to go to prison for this!

Am I understanding this correctly? In 2018, professionals gave a definitive list of problems that needed repair. In the 3 years since few if any repairs were made, by choice of an H.O.A. (??!!??!!). And they KNEW a 40 year recert was coming? I much prefer the 1850's house I am writing this from.

@sorenman1

3 жыл бұрын

yup

@brad25000

3 жыл бұрын

1850's home? Hey is it haunted by any chance?

@curiousandcreativewithwand8515

3 жыл бұрын

@@brad25000 I guess that depends what you believe, but I know people who won't step foot in the house. I've known this house most my life and lived here 2 years now. Sure things like keys, small items or important papers disappear, only to turn up in odd places (usually after asking for it back). The car keys in the found in the tub after hearing a clank - that was startling. We don't really mind. In the past, the original part was a 1 room school house, then it was a family home; later a military short stay house (I think WW1 era), then a family home since. Sure things are heard without a decent explanation and stuff moves, scents appear and quickly disappear ..... but really the spooky thing that gets me is the neighbors' peacock screaming like a baby in dire straights. At 4 am. Ugh. Why?!?! Life and death is all perspective.. :)

As soon as lawyers are involved, things will get messy. Finger pointing!

As laypeople getting educated about spalling, concrete cancer, rebar rust from the news, building issues will get extra attention, hopefully force timely repairs. Hoping this tragedy will encourage concerned citizens to speak at city council, town board, planning commission, county commission about building safety, maybe even run for office.

My apartment building is just two years old. I'm thankful for that.

@TristanVash38

3 жыл бұрын

Scary how new apartment buildings and houses are being built so cheap because of how expensive wood is. Just watched a video earlier of a project housing unit being built with non-pressure treated particle board! Cutting corners is the new norm!

@toxicavenger8680

3 жыл бұрын

@@TristanVash38 This building is concrete & steel.

what about that offshore explosion off the coast of florida last week? nobody is talking about that.

And this is why we regulate construction for all you libertarians

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

And democrats too.... Those idiots

@Official2Shitty

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronnierabell1 Democrats are definitely the main pushers for construction regulation but ok

Unbelievable!!! Such a tragedy which was totally avoidable.

The condos’ association board should be held responsible. Why? In 2018 there were given a 15 page, yes page report detailing the structural issues. I believe this was the sole reason why the maintenance supervisor left. It’s obvious the board didn’t want to accept the truth and believed they could out live the issues. This is stupidity and arrogance at its highest degree.

now，you are telling me this!

HOA members from 2018 probably sold their units and left the report at the pool side.

This reporter doesn’t even know what rebar is

Who will the Governor use as the Sacrificial lamb.

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

You

Is there a way for someone in Colorado can access this station for regular news?

That's the fault of the pool, and no-one else's.

Just another example of paying off the building inspector. Happens all the time!

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️🤦🏻‍♂️ boy are you stupid. The hoa members that also live in that building didnt address the problem after the structural engineer warned them. No pay off. Just incompetent people, like your self.

@wakanda6754

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronnierabell1 xcept one lady owner who addressed it and sued them in 2015, she settled out of court . I'd be curious to know if she sold her unit after court case, or is she in the rubble.

@toomanymarys7355

3 жыл бұрын

The homeowners, represented by their HOA, refused to fix it. It would have cost them all a fortune.

They need to investigate the condo board and find out why these issues were not addressed.

@zesolodar

3 жыл бұрын

simple you have a board with a large check they have to write

@toomanymarys7355

3 жыл бұрын

Because they were the homeowners and didn't want to pay for it.

The engineers should have had the city order the property evacuated and condemned. I don't see the blame of an unprecedented catastrophe like this being put solely on laymen running a HOA.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

This seems like it is more on the city, at least from what I hear on the video. According to this video the report was filed with the city. In my city a report like this would be flagged as needs repairs or hazardous and the city would issue a fine and order the building management to fix the defects immediately or be closed down. A follow up inspection and engineers report would also be required. The fact that this building was still open after 3 years of nothing tells me it's an enforcement issue. There could be a lot more info we don't have but at the surface that what it looks like to me.

such a tragedy, so many innocent lives taken away

Why is this the only building in F.l. ???

***FIRST RESPONDERS IN NEED OF FOOD*** ***FIREFIGHTERS PLEA FOR FOOD ASSISTANCE***

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Really 🤦🏻‍♂️ im pretty sure miami beach fire departments pay their guys about 75k to 125k a year. Food is not gonna do a damn thing

Lucy, you got some splainin to do…

Too cheap to relocate residents. They probably reduced price to get residents. Shameful.

There is no one reason for this building collapse The soil The humidity The concrete deterioration Not enough iron chains Inadequate kind of construction for a beach building Go to Chile and learn from real experts in building construction The calculist ingeniers in Chile are the best in the world , the earthquake experience is the clue Miami and beachfront cities has to learn from the best to avoid this terrible situation again

Well,… you eventually pay for ignoring warnings! You should have fixed them. Now it cost more than just money,… it cost lives.

@PlayshotKalo

3 жыл бұрын

Or maybe you know, the original engineers should have built it right so these problems wouldn’t need to be “fixed” in the first place?

I don't really understand why there's not like a hundred men digging and throwing building parts off the pile. Saving as many as possible fast. Sure it might finish killing some by moving the stuff but getting as many out as fast as possible is the other option. Seems like there's not many men looking. Re asians e.g. dozens on things like this and move tons of debris in short order. Probably too man damn safety rules in place?

@Denise-Ann

3 жыл бұрын

Where are more cranes and conveyor belts to move debris? At this rate, it will be months before they find even half the victims.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

@@Denise-Ann Honestly this is just another thing that shows the utter incompetence of this city. This report was filed three years ago, the city should have ordered them to fix the defects and closed the building if they didn't. That is how it works in major cities like Chicago and NYC. They also seemed to have no plan to deal with the disaster.

@WyomingMtnMan

3 жыл бұрын

There's not a 100 people looking because every rescuer on or in that pile is at great risk from more of the building collapsing or the pile of debris shifting. Would you want to be on a pile of debris with a 100 rescuers and multiple cranes pulling off 100 ton blocks Jenga style? The rescuers had listening devices and there were no more signs of life.

@Denise-Ann

3 жыл бұрын

@@Bitchslapper316 We have annual building inspections that are required, lots of palms were getting greased on this. Recently, the mayor of Surfside told people that were complaining that the building was safe. For a city that gets wiped out by hurricanes, it’s’ astounding they have no ability to get victims out. We are on day 5 and 11 souls recovered. Shame on all involved.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

@@Denise-Ann Yeah, fair enough. I'm not just talking inspections, building inspectors can only check so much and usually do not have the tools to properly check the structural integrity of a building. I'll give you an example of what I mean. If a report like like was filed for a building in NYC it would have been issued a violation and a fine and the building would have been forced to fix it or be shut down. The only way to remove the violation would have been an inspection + a new engineers report showing the defects have been corrected. Without a new engineers report the inspector wouldn't have been able to remove anything. I'm guessing in a city like that the inspector has a lot more power and can just clear the building if he gets paid.

Is this a building process issue, foundation issue, or a structural design issue? Just from the photos alone, the problem seems to be deeper than insufficient "waterproofing" that may have caused the concrete slab to deteriorate over time.

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Salt water on the beach ate away at the rebar. Rebar gets corrosion and expanse causing the concrete to crack off. The post tension cables up top must have got damage from the rebar corrosion and concrete spawllin. So now the pt cables gets exposed and fails. Each pt cable are stretch to 5500 psi and they have a head at both ends, one at the sheer wall and then other ends at the outer edge of the slab and never on balconies. How do it know this? Because I build them for my career

@zesolodar

3 жыл бұрын

combo of all i heard one design issue and maybe ronnie can confirm or deny this but apparently when they built something under the pool the thing they built was suppose to be slanted to create runoff so the water didnt settle on a flat surface causing damage over time. its amazing what water especially salt water water will do over time. i work in residential real estate flipping houses and even though i dont do work i have learned alot from my contractors the amount of damage ive seen water do over a short time not 40 years like this can be pretty devastating

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronnierabell1 i hope you didn't build this one.

@yo2trader539

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you all for wonderful insight. Perhaps building codes are (or will be) updated now regarding corrosion resistance.

Where is the CCTV footage from the building? There were no cameras in the garage area, communal areas, near the elevators? Also where is the eyewitness testimony? Two witnesses reported hearing an explosion. Why has this not been followed up on?

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

There the only video fron the building next door. And no explosions. Stop with the conspiracy theories because its ridiculous. If you want to learn more on how to build a tower and how they can fail then work as a high rise carpenter for 20 to 25 bucks an hour or a carpenter helper for 17 to 19 bucks at ceco concrete or backer construction. There you will learn how to build 50+ buildings and it weak spots. But please stop it with the bomb nonsense

@TheTalkWatcher

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronnierabell1 If the CIA can blow up Russian apartment buildings, the GRU can blow up American apartment buildings. It's called payback. The foreign adventures of the US ruling class have consequences. With that out of the way, Lets see the video from the parking garage and other parts of the building. Put ALL OF THE VIDEO on KZread. And how did you conclude no explosion? The video released had no sound.

guessing ppl will be moving out soon?

And yet they still raised the rent.

Beach front properties are often owned by slumlords who charge the highest price they can get away with and conduct the minimum amount of maintenance. Greed killed these people.

@Bitchslapper316

3 жыл бұрын

These are condos, they're owned by the people who live in them.

@madarchermoto4955

3 жыл бұрын

@@Bitchslapper316 … I was under the impression they were rented out

I need to start seeing some arrests

Somebody’s getting sued

Ya that's why they had no comment the past week.

LAWYER TRYING TO PASS THE BLAME .

Passing the blame looks like the common theme here. You did a piece poor job!

I wanna know who was on the board when that 2018 report was out and sold their condo after that?????? If they did, they knew what was up with this place....and why can't they do thermo imaging like the military did when they took out bin laden ...they used satelite technology to know exactly where each person was so when they went in they could find them and take them out...they even knew if they were kids and woman....Anyone remember seeing that video of them attacking his house and they knew exactly who was in each room of that compound, Why cant they do this to the rubble and search for any survivors??? or have they already and don't wanna tell us that everyone is really dead.....

Stop destroying open spaces and stop building all these buildings. The world is much nicer when there are open spaces instead of tall ugly buildings with so many people. I sincerely hope people get some common sense and respect the environment and stop the mindset of building,building,building and building forever. Let us not have population growth and development. give the environment a break.

Kinda like our government a building waiting to crash.

Collapse from 💥 boom ! garage is standing

You see alot of these stuff in tampa

Negligence. Failure to perform. Dereliction of duties. By many people. No amount of money can ever compensate for the really gruesome, unnecessary loss of life, the trauma and grief suffered by the friends and families of those killed and the destroyed families in this situation. This is a tragedy that people will not easily come to terms with or reconcile. The trauma and anger from such an enormous event, one that could have and should have been prevented, will be hard to overcome. I can't imagine what it would be like to lose a loved one in this way, imagining their last moments and probably never recovering a body so that they can be laid to rest properly with the dignity they deserve. I bet they will raze the whole building and turn the property into a park/memorial. That's the only thing to do at that location really. Something I read sUd that it's owned by the City. I don't know if they meant the property and structure or just the underlying property. If the City does own it that would be an interesting piece of the puzzle.

Start looking into the finances of the building inspectors.

The people who sat on this information need to go to prison for a long, long time. And when this is over everything that used to belong to those people should belong to the families of the victims. Criminally negligent homicide.

@FriedChairs

3 жыл бұрын

The people who “sat on” the info are the HOA members in the building which are now dead. This is a condo, not an apartment building.

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

@@FriedChairs yeah chris, dont tell these dummies because they didnt listen to the part that all hoa members lived in the building

Probably used imported material

Television theater entertainment

JAIL.

I knew this from day one and I’m not a building inspector. Captain obvious here

Those building came down to perfect it’s as if it was pland devices so sad my heart goes out

You should see the Russian building There much horrible condition but they’re staying over 100 yearsb

And this my republican friends is why government is necessary! People who have the money and the power can’t be trusted to police themselves!

They go after low income home owners and not scumlords

This is horrifying. I pray that Jesus Christ was in the lives of everybody that passed away. You never know when it's your time to go. All you can do is live everyday with Jesus Christ as if it's the last. Pray and repent Everyday People. Everyday. This life is very short compared to Eternity. Nobody wants to spend eternity burning in flames. So live with the light in the truth of Jesus Christ so that you can reside in the Kingdom of Heaven. Give yourself to the Lord. Put hundred percent faith and trust in him and him only. God bless

@nickodemusjohnson

3 жыл бұрын

Please spare us with the religious bs. Get to the realization that humans need to work on being less neglectful.

Learn how to spell before trying to quote something. It's "pouring" & not "poring".

Demolition

can you imagine, surviving the virus and then this happens...

@ImJiom

3 жыл бұрын

oh you mean the virus that 99.9% of people survived? I can imagine what that must be like....like every single day of the year

Jet fuel.🤔😳😏

Collapse only from boom 💥

So is the building owner in prison?

@FriedChairs

3 жыл бұрын

It’s basically owned by the HOA members which are probably all dead.

@toomanymarys7355

3 жыл бұрын

It's owned by the people who live in it.

Man this reeks of "Passing the Buck."

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah it dose. Hoa seemed to hold back on repairs but to be honest I doubt they could have really repair it. Most of those slabs was pitting pretty badly. Salt water+humidity+concrete+rebar=headache+millions of $$$$

Look into the financials of the building inspectors. They are incredibly crooked in south Florida. This is going to be their downfall, their reckoning.

@toomanymarys7355

3 жыл бұрын

The engineers did their job. The homeowners didn't repair it.

Sinkhole

Hate how slowly this info is coming to light. How deep are they in the pockets of city officials… 🤢🤮

@900stx7

3 жыл бұрын

How slowly ! Their still looking for bodies in the rubble, and you expect a full report.

let me guess, trump's fault?

Then is the engineer fault bcs it was also he's responsibility ,but money money and money buy staring for the inspector and engineer to that person who receive the report to the Mayor ,to the governor ext innocent people , family's children's pay the price of corruption

This is what Republican fervor for deregulation gets you.

@ronnierabell1

3 жыл бұрын

Excuse me you leftis idiot? Go live in one of those far left countries like cuba and soviet Russia and you will see building collapsing all the time. Dont make it nothing political because you will lose on that on that one

Jesus Christ saves from sin. Romans 3: 23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God; Hebrews 9: 27 And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment: Isaiah 64: 6 But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away. Revelation 21: 8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death. Romans 5: 8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. John 3: 16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. John 14: 6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me. Romans 10: 9-10. That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. Jesus said John 5: 24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. 1John 5: 10-13 He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. He that hath the Son hath life; and he that hath not the Son of God hath not life. These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that ye have eternal life, and that ye may believe on the name of the Son of God. Ephesians 2: 8-9 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: Not of works, lest any man should boast. Romans 8: 1 There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 1 Corinthians 15: 3-4 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures; And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures: 2 Corinthians 5: 21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. .......................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................