Just recently I was in my local gun shop and was able to score one of the Remington Police Magnum 870 from a turn in from one of the local police departments here. Pretty cool it still has the car number on the stock to which it was issued. Got it for 249.00. Very happy with it.

@CovenantElite1117

4 жыл бұрын

Same. I work at a gunshop and my boss had a remington 870 wingmaster, it is marked Longmont, Colorado police. And has a rack number of 20 under the grip. He sold me it for 300$. Super nice quality

@TheBootyWrangler

4 жыл бұрын

Hey, where is that number? I picked up an original 870 wingmaster the other day however I believe it was a police gun from the 60s. Back then they didn’t have the “police magnum” instead the police used shortened and simplified wingmasters similar to the top the one in this video. Mine still has the original barrel with the welded on metal bead site. Mine also has a number etched into the stock. If you could help me know that would be great

@guaporeturns9472

Жыл бұрын

@@TheBootyWrangler There are probably Remington 870 collectors websites with forums where you could talk to someone who knows all the stuff you are asking… just a suggestion

@woodchuckcider1

Жыл бұрын

Fast forward 2023 you aren't going to find one at that price anymore

@345Weeehrs

11 ай бұрын

​@@woodchuckcider1I did

I have many shotguns but i am in love with a Remington wingmaster since 2017. I bought it 1000 Euro brand new here in Greece. High quality shotgun.

@bldontmatter5319

Жыл бұрын

1000 euro... Holy smokes. You euros have it rough

Thanks for the trip down the 870 memory lane. I love my 870's and can't imagine being without them.

Bluing is damaged by overhandling of the gun finish. It's best to touch the metal parts as least as possible. My father used to yell at me when I handled his old 870 Wingmaster to much.

Very high quality content Extremely educational Mishaco knows is stuff

I have older ones and newer ones. All work great. Great video. Thanks.

@mozilla2576

2 жыл бұрын

I agree with this. I have a Wingmaster from 1974 and an Express from 1994....both have performed flawlessly.

The Express was not originally released with a plastic trigger guard/trigger pack. I have a 1990 production Express with a metal trigger guard, as well as a much nicer finish than what is currently being peddled.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

I'm sure you are right, but I do know by 2000-2001, the trigger guard was already polymer. So the changeover was in the '90s, and thus long before Freedom Group.

Hey bud I’ve been following for a minute, I am really impressed with your level of knowledge and clearly your non objective opinion, only enhanced by your ability to point out the difference of info available today, compared to years past,great channel, keep up the great work, your analysis is seemingly always very forthright and accurate 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸

Thank you so much! I just purchased a Remington 870 Marine Magnum and love it!!!! This clears up some of the misinformation I kept reading online!!

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Just sold a 870 Police Marine Magnum last month. Expensive but still quality IMO.

Another great and informative video! In 1977 I bought a used 1957 Wingmaster 870 12 gauge with three barrels, 18" and I think 22" and 26". Nice shotgun even today. Doesn't accept 3" magnum shells but that hasn't been a problem for me. Guess I'll hang on to it.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Wouldn't be for me either. I rarely need or shoot 3". If i do, i have my Benelli or 590A1.

The Police has heavyweight springs/internal components.

Well done. Very comprehensive explanation of the differences between the models

Nice comparison! Was very educational and you brought up some good points. Particularly when you mentioned that older guns have been around longer and any issues have been ironed out by now, so comparing it to a new gun is unfair (especially if it's a lemon).

This guy makes a living selling current production Remington 870s, not so much old ones, so naturally he's going to argue that there's no real difference.

Nice informative video. My 870P is a model #5028 and looks like the top two you show. 20" deer/slug, IC barrel with adjustable sights, 1" recoil pad, high gloss wood stocks with corncob forend, twin action bars, shoots 2.75" shells only. Got mine in 1982 at Karnival Sports on Ave P in Brooklyn for $240. I traded barrels for a 28" vent rib, modified. And in the 1990's had the barrel cut ($20) to 19+" , added a sling cap/swivel and elastic shell holder. Don't really "get" why plastic stocks are on a 12ga gun. Any extra weight is helpful with recoil. I did try a Pachmayr pistol grip in the 80's but recoil was freakin' brutal with slugs or buck. A sweet scattergun if ever I saw one. Early 1980's most guns had only single action bars and created torque problems and jams. Not the 870's. It cost me almost $100 more than the single action bar Mossbergs at that time, but I figured in a life or death situation I was worth the extra dough. It's a swell gun, fuhgeddaboudit.

Bought a police traded made in 09 police magnum for $250. Came with adjustable stock with police number inside of grip. From the odd wear on barrel I think it spent most its days leaning inside a gun rack at a police gun range. Only wear was rub marks on top of barrel. Insides are like brand new. I think I got a lot for $250.

My Wingmaster is ‘63 vintage. Glossy stock and vent rib barrel. Its a keeper.

Howdy. Does the Remington 870 Police Magnum 12 Gauge Police w/ 18 in. Barrel, have a rifled barrel, as well as "rifle sights" or is it smooth bore with rifle sights. Thnx

We alwas. Love your stuff

How do I look at the police Magnum on the Remington website?

My 1977 manufactured 870 PM is a hammer. It just runs and runs with zero issue. Some ware on the outside, but inside looks like it was hardly fired while in PD service.

Thanks for making this video. I just bought a police trade in. Mine has two rivet holes on the left side of the receiver for the ejector. Most I’ve seen look like they don’t. Anyone know if older models were designed this way? It was manufactured in March 07

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

My new express has rivets, they are just color matched from factory to they point you have to be 5 inches from the gun to see them. If it was a police gun it probably had it’s extractor replaced with new unmatched rivets.

Very helpful! Thanks man!

Remington made the 870 right back in the day. I have at least 5 Blued steel/Walnut 870’s. They’re damn good guns.

@jeffreyelliott622

2 жыл бұрын

I wouldn't own any guns of Remington past 1995 and that's just me !!!!

thank you for that much information. verry good video - again

Your assement was very fair and balanced and your opinions were very helpful and valid thank you

This is Lunch box Joes favorite AR14

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

I think you mean AK14 ;p

@Weptek911

4 жыл бұрын

Nah, senile Joe prefers double barrel shotguns. Does any USA company make a double barrel anymore?

@justsomeasshole7388

4 жыл бұрын

@@Weptek911 stoeger

Can someone give me a bit of knowledge on my 870? I dont know much about them but maybe someone can help. It is parkerized or dull black. The barrel is a cyl 18.5 with the ab stamp. Extended mag tube. No dimples. Does have the detent. It only says remington 870. Plastic trigger gaurd so i figured an express 870. But wasnt sure if expresses came with no dimple mag tubes with a detent. I also wasnt sure if the express came in 18.5 barrel. The ab on the barrel matches the reciever. Odd gun. The og stocks where replced with tacstar pistol grips. Ohhhh the barrel is 2 3/4 or 3"

Seems like those complaining about a decline in quality under freedom group are actually critical of *finish* of the Express models.

@OptimisticAsparagus96

3 жыл бұрын

Generally, yes, but there's also the concern of rough chambers and failure to cycle and extract. A risk of malfunction or unreliability is a legitimate concern. The situation is unclear, which leads to exaggerated speculation by self-appointed "experts," in the forums and videos that talk about it. Personally, I'd argue that an experienced engineer or gunsmith should do a study on it.

@thedewdster

Жыл бұрын

Yea I'd bet as the years went on and prices went up most people opted to just buy express models over wingmasters. Many people prolly didn't realize the express was a cheaper model too. Just guessing here lol

I didn't know they've use aluminum trigger groups. That's just asking for problems with the steel parts.

I bought a brand new 870 Police model about 5 years ago. It is an extremely well built gun and has digested several thousand rounds many of them full power buck and slugs. 0 issues and extremely smooth. I trust it with my life.

Also, mishaco. Got any more wingmasters or police magnums or even a Special purpose for sale?

@jeffreyelliott622

2 жыл бұрын

I got an early 90's 870 Magnum Special Purpose in Realtree Greenleaf camo 21 inch barrel I bought brand new when Dupont owned Remington and I won't take nothing for that pump shotgun and I just added a Carlson's 8 round total extension tube all black to give it a good color contrast with the camo and I keep the modified choke tube in it and it came with its own carry sling which I have on it as well !!!

Just got NEW 870 p Love it 👍🏼

I have four wingmasters. 1951, 1982, 1983, 2016. My freedom group 2016 wingmaster is great. No issues at all. Same with my freedom group marlin 336.

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

Is the bolt carrier different between the 2016 and the classic?

i bought an 870 wingmaster deluxe at a walmart one time, and man that was a very nice gun, nice wood, deep dark bluing, double bead vert rib, 4 screw in chokes. And like a dumb ass i traded it off a few years later

Love the channel and vids Mishacooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo(repeat until out of breath)

not gunna talk about MiM extractors?

Thanks man

Do you have any with old LEO folding stocks, just curious.

I have Remington M870 Police Magnum MAX

Good vid brother!

The police magnum sounds like a beast of a shotgun.

The thing is I've owned 870s literally my entire life lol given one pretty much at birth lol I have wing masters and Express's new and old one Express from 1989 has the older style mag tube spring stopper and have multiple express's from pre freedom group from around 1999-2002 and they have the plastic mag tube spring stopper and so do my newest 870 post freedom group 2010-2018 the plastic stopper wasnt a freedom group idea just saying the police magnums would have had heavier springs because it was technically a gun meant to used probably 3 times as much as a standard wingmaster or Express along with the possibility of being used as a club in an incident as far a s mag tube spring police magnum spends more time loaded then not makes ends to put a heavier spring in there but as far as comparing the 870 police to the 870 tactical the tactical is just a tacticool gun which is pretty much where you went with it but if it were truly milsoec it would be a different animal and far as trigger pull on the wing wingmasters and Express it should be around 6lbs you wouldn't want it any higher in a hunting situation which it what they were ment for just my 2 cents hopefully this gets read lol I live and breath Remington firearms lol

I have a 1991 870 Magnum w/ metal trigger guard. Does this pre-date the Police Magnum? I will never sell this shotgun.

My last two reminton shot guns all had issues they was remington expresses

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Not surprised. I try and screne those few i allow in the shop, usually catching & fixing noticible issues. Some though are just hopeless. To be fair, plenty of others are gtg right out of the box though.

Ive been wanting a Remington model 12 in 16 gauge for awhile now, because Im weird like that. An autoloader model 11 or 11-48 would be cool too. Just been focusing on ARs and never got around to getting a shotgun.

@martyjewell5683

3 жыл бұрын

I used to have a Rem. 1100 in 12ga and it was a beauty.

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

I have a 1187 and the thing works like a dream, simple to repair too. Although it it a bit more of a pain to clean due to the buffer being in the stock

why is the quality of these great guns going down? like I would pay more for the way they use to be? who wouldn't ?

Only complaint on my newer 870s is the finish. They aren’t called “rustington” for no reason 😂

From my experience I've used a 1974 wingmaster and a early 2000's express and the wingmaster is much better action is smoother much better finish and the express had extraction problems and the magazine tube cap would come loose while shooting.

Have a pre Texas move Mossberg 500 Tac Persuader shotgun I'll never get rid of.

I've got a 68 wingmaster TB that has locked up a couple times during a trap shoot. Other than those times the action locking up a lil bit and having to shuck really hard, it's been a beaut. I just can't believe how hard it is to find an 870 barrel. I'd like to buy an 18-24" cyl bore or modified barrel. If anybody has one hit me up....

@robertboreman7672

2 жыл бұрын

look on ebay. They are rare , but come up now and then. Mostly 1100 's and 1187 's

what ever happened with SpeedFeed stocks, are they still being made ?

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

While Remington has used the Speedfeed IV stock on several guns, it really has put the shell storage SF stock on a tiny handful of 870s. Mossberg seems more into that style of stock for some reason?

@smartacus88

4 жыл бұрын

Picked up an Armscor M5 (copy of the old High Standard Flite king) that has it.

I have a 2016 870 and a 2022 870 no issues with either

Great video! thanks for the input, I am considering to purchase one for wilderness camping. It was very informative. There are always people who would twist facts for various hostile intents. KZread is filled up with those people, particularly people who want to bring down what America has. And there are lots of idiots who are simple minded to believe it or go along with it. Keep posting!

@guaporeturns9472

Жыл бұрын

🤦‍♂️

Go in the LGS anytime I’m over that way & have a few minutes to burn. Like checking the used Cases for whatever revolver with a few years on it, or whatever else might have come in. That’s about it lately. In & out for the most part. Anyhow..Noticed a short shot gun w extended tube & inquired. Stamped REMINGTON 870 EXPRESS MAGNUM.Someone from the sheriffs department had dropped off 6 used & picked up 6 new the day before .last one so got it. Only pump shotgun I’ve ever owned,so nothing to compare it to. simple bead on the front,not tapped,no pistol grip.Noticed the firing pin sounds like it’s hitting quite a bit harder compared to other shotguns I have. Noticed that before looking at this video. Finnish looks good. A few rub marks where it rode in a rack I guess.?.no bare metal or rust or any thing.seems solid all the way around. $299.99999 .seemed fair. Always is fair there. . Shot about 1/2 of a small cooler full of low aluminum & black plastic target looking shells marked Remington that I found in a shed years ago helping someone move. 10-12 boxes stacked on a shelf. Piece of paper here & there where the boxes had been. Looked likemice or squirrels or something had chewed them off. The shells were still stacked in the shape of the boxes though. 1 box of high brass smooth red plastic 3” maybe 3 1/2 “ shells marked #1 or something.?,put it to the side. Didn’t shoot any of that until I figured out what everything is. All the corroded rusty crusty looking target shells shot & ejected fine.like it. Have 1 other Remington.fairly certain it’s prefreedom ..?.Dk about all that stuff. Overheard something about it a while back.1/2 ass listened. Other Remington is a roller block.?.old gun that my uncle had hanging on the wall.took it when we cleared his stuff out when he died. Good looking gun. Has some paperwork with it in a leather document pouch looking thing. Old school. Thx for the info.

My express has never been a reliable shotgun. I bought it years ago on the 870 dependability/reliability reputation but have been extremely disappointed and several times wished I just went with a mossberg 500. In fairness to Remington I haven’t giving them the opportunity to repair the firearm. It works pretty good with brass but anything else not so much.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Honestly, i think Remington's quality dipped the most between the late '90s and mid 2000s. I honestly think Freedom Group's support (read money/investment) might have actually helped improve things. At least somewhat.

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

Mine also has ejection problems, but typically it requires me to slam the pump back to get a good ejection. I heard lots of problems are solved by upgrading the extractors to proper wing master extractors.

Excellent presentation as usual. 👍🇱🇷☕

There's definitely hollow polymer stocks put out by Remington. I have a few, but still seem plenty durable.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

To be clear, i was only talking about the poly stocks made by Speedfeed for the 870 Police series. If you go to the Express/Tactical, those often do not have SF brand stocks and are hollow.

@Mini-Hakkero

4 жыл бұрын

@@misha5670 Oh ok, gotcha.

You should do this with Winchester pre '64s compared to now...throw in the FN Winchesters as well somehow too.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Have you actually met Winchester people? They'd mob me in 5 minutes lol.

once a guy told me you can hold the trigger on an 670 and pump it and it will fire each time. I said no i dont think so. But he was very sure of himself

@Spike-13

4 жыл бұрын

Doubt it. Only really old shotguns did that

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Lol, just lol. Very easy to test, very easy to disproove.

@codegang9202

4 жыл бұрын

Broken Trigger Disconnect?

Remington Wingmaster are much much better I had an express and it had a lot of issues It was very hard to cycle The springs and follower where visually a lot cheaper To quote a few differences

If you want a good 870, do not settle for anything less then a wingmaster. Older wingmasters and non civilian models also have all machined metal parts. No plastic, no M.I.M, no rough chambers, and no dumbass dimples you have to drill out and void warranty.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Personally, i learned my lesson real good about the Express way back in 2000-2001.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Bet ya' it does. They are quite small and on the top & bottom of the tube, towards the front. They are usually covered by the barrel and forearm. Pull your barrel off and cock the pump back to check.

@SWIGGITYSWAGWIGGITYWAG

4 жыл бұрын

@Jones 2009

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

I don’t mind the plastic mag tube follower, it makes it 1000 times easier to take apart

@Gieszkanne

2 жыл бұрын

They dont have to be drilled. You can punch them out with a socket.

The new ones are only de burred half the time my friend has three that cuts your fingers everytime you clean them

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

That's the Kalashnikov school of manufacturing there for you.

Interesting comparison. I have a 20 gauge 870 express tactical, 18.5" barrel, full length mag tube fixed polymer stock and really enjoy it. It's like someone shrunk a 870 12 gauge down in every way. Kind of reminds me of the Browning 1911s in 22lr that they just scaled down but kept the proportions. Normally I prefer Mossberg but it feel much more svelte than the Mossberg 20 gauge models I've handled. Very light and fast in hand, and at home defense distances I doubt any intruders will know the difference of getting hit with 20 gauge vs 12 gauge. I'm surprised the 20 gauge models aren't more popular. I actually prefer it to a full size 12 gauge version and I have no problem shooting 12 gauge by the way. I think it's because of our societal trait to consider 12 gauge the only "manly" option unfortunately.

@tonym2513

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, lady boi.

@Gieszkanne

2 жыл бұрын

Yes have once seen a picture of those 20g 870. They look great, also they are 1.5 pounds lighter than the 12g version. Mossberg just take the 12g receiver for their 20g what looks kind of goofy with these thinner barrels. Also many 20g Mossbergs almost weight the same as the 12g version. I think 12 gauge is an overkill for close range home defense. 20g is more than enough.

I had a post-freedom group express that was a piece of shit. Rust and pitting and feeding/ejecting issues. Not to mention those stupid dimples.

i just... finally had some extra money that wasnt going into car parts.... completely unaware of the shortage... i can't wait til people get rid of their shotoguns that they never will shoot ever. so i can go have fun in the desert...

I hope you are planning on donating your brain to the GOA. After your done with it, of course!

@lir5048

3 жыл бұрын

LoL

I like big pumps and I cannot lie

Finish on 870 is utter shit I've watched them rust from mere overnight exposure to humidity in the air

@shockwave6416

3 жыл бұрын

For sure. Rusty Remingtons. Lol

Let's see a mossberg vs Remington pump gun showdown

@teotwawki00

4 жыл бұрын

I'd love that too.😎👍

@jeramyw

4 жыл бұрын

@KZread User you mean the ejector

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Really? do you really want us to shit talk the 870 for 30 minutes? lol...joking, but not really

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Oh it can be done....it requires a lot of booze to build up one's tolerance to annoyance though

The laser engraving serial number looks like crap

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

I don’t mind the serial numbers but that damn box is fugly as hell

Not exactly the same the wingmaster has a nickel Chrome carrier for anti-corrosion

"If you compare an express to a police magnum..."???? Why not directly compare a pre v post express and pre v post police magnum/wingmaster. This entire video fails to meet what it claims to do in its title. Hell there is even an admission within the video that it fails to do what it claims to do. DO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME ON THIS - there is no additional insight. A Freedom Group Wingmaster is vastly sub-standard to a pre-Freedom Wingmaster, you get a press checkered, lower material quality firearm that has had the old Mega-Lo Corp treatment. The fit and finish is noticeable to even a novice. However, if you're wanting just an Express then its basically 6 in one hand 1/2 dozen in the other-BUT keep in mind Freedom Group is not a gun manufacturer they ARE a subsidiary of a private equity firm that acquires entities that are experiencing financial or operational distress and then guts the staff (often pensions included) and vastly reduces the operating costs to bring the target company back in the black. This will keep the target company (Remington in this case) from folding but I cannot think of a single time that financial austerity measures directly resulted in a quality increase or maintenance of the status quo. TLDR: Video answers no questions but the facts are simple. Freedom Group bought an economically distressed Remington and cut costs to keep it afloat. A new wingmaster is meh compared to an old wingmaster and a new express is basically the same but still will be made up of more cost effective (read lower quality) components.

@TheTruth-sd8ey

Жыл бұрын

What about newer production (2018-2020) 870 police marine magnum? They seem build sturdy.

I like how you say alu-min-ee-um. The "correct" Britsh English way. I just can't make myself say it like that.

@MrCarGuy

4 жыл бұрын

British English and American English are two separate standards so I don't understand anyone who goes out of their way to pronounce differently. It's like an American switching their speedo to km/h instead of mph.

@toki89666

4 жыл бұрын

@@MrCarGuy funny you say that, I have a JDM gauge cluster in my '95 Civic. 😂 I also have a JDM RHD front clip already disassembled, spot welds drilled out and firewall ready to go, just gotta get around to getting a new daily driver to begin the teardown on my car.

@MrCarGuy

4 жыл бұрын

@@toki89666 At that point you might as well just import a nice 25 y/o example from Japan to have a complete JDM car.

@johnsmert3361

4 жыл бұрын

That's How I say it with a Texas accent lol

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Topic has come up before. My TTS is British, been using it since 1995 or so. That many years of hearing the same voice, day in/out, it rubs off on you after awhile. Its just pronounciation; not right or wrong.

Recently got a remington 870 from walmart for $300, it's been a hell of a beauty of a gun and it worked just fine.

@cantucando1593

3 жыл бұрын

What ammo do you use? I've had a couple of extraction issues. Guessing you have the express model?

@luckyshot5135

3 жыл бұрын

@@cantucando1593 just standard fosters slugs

@cantucando1593

3 жыл бұрын

@@luckyshot5135 I used the Remington and federal bird shot. Both had issues being extracted.

@luckyshot5135

3 жыл бұрын

@@cantucando1593 really gotta rack the pump.

@T34theAmericanheavy

3 жыл бұрын

@@cantucando1593 try getting a wing master extractor, I personally haven’t had many issues with extraction when used in field recently and I have at most only 120 shells through the gun

look at all of that wasted magazine capacity.

@googlepissoff5776

4 жыл бұрын

Handles way better though

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

If it makes you feel better, i did stick a +3 on that Police Magnum before putting it out for sale lol.

Most of the newer firearms I see on the shelves are nowhere near the same quality as the older ones. Seems they would rather sell you three instead of one good one that will last a lifetime.

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Except that many people would rather by cheaper guns rather than save up and buy something built like a tank. Wingmasters are still available, but many pick the Express.

Dammit!! You Tube UN-SUBBED me from you!

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

Those bastards! lol

Not sure if they ruined the 870 but they destroyed Marlin. Glad that part is in Ruger's hands now

From what I gather All Police models can't really be judged the same as all the other standard consumer Remington models. Seeing as how the Police models are all made in a separate facility not the regular Remington factory. All Police models are done by hand, checked over with a detailed check list and made with beefed up internal parts. All this so they wont have a defective gun going out to law enforcement and military. They make sure law/military get top quality. For so many years that was kind of the standard saying among people when talking about firearms. Was always 'Make sure to get a police of law enforcement model"

People who spam remshit have never actually paid for a Remington shotgun in their life.

That's so dumb the point of polymer is to be lighter. Sell a weight kit for people who are scared of recoil if your so concerned.

Does anyone give a *%@# what Towsend Whelen said back in 1957?

@toki89666

4 жыл бұрын

Are you talking about that "only accurate rifles are interesting" Midway USA commercial?

@misha5670

4 жыл бұрын

All of my rifles are very accurate. They all hit 'something' very well, everytime =)