Full podcast episode: kzread.info/dash/bejne/iJl8mdOEitWWh6w.html Lex Fridman podcast channel: kzread.info Guest bio: Balaji Srinivasan is an angel investor, tech founder, philosopher, and author of The Network State: How to Start a New Country. He was formerly the CTO of Coinbase and General Partner at Andreessen Horowitz.

Unless some “Ship of Theseus” process is used, Cloning, either physically or digitally, would only be the continuation of an individual’s general aesthetic and wouldn’t constitute that individual living forever.

@123456crapface

Жыл бұрын

Lol ok dude

@optionvice8926

Жыл бұрын

Right wouldn't be you unless you can actually pull out that Same consciousness and move it.

@obscurelines

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This is something Derek Parfitt called Relation R.

@rickybloss8537

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Sure it would the ship of Theseus shows that we are not the material we're made of. We are defined by our structure. If you copy the structure you've copied the essence of what you are.

@deadhardy

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@@rickybloss8537 the Ship of Theseus thought experiment doesn't have a consensus conclusion for whether it's the same ship lol

In Frank Herbert’s Dune universe, major characters are often genomicaly reincarnated and their predecessors memories are reawakened with traumatic events. It’s a fun idea but works on the theory of cellular memory, which has been disproven in a few different ways.

the clone will not be you.

@bruhdon4748

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Unless they figure out in the far future how to transfer consciousness into a new body.

@bruhdon4748

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But I do agree with your comment

@_Alpha

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Clone yourself, but transfer the brain

@tracerpt2rire

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@@_Alpha Then the big question is at what age do you kill ( erase his brain ) your clone to take his body ...

@bsjeffrey

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@T S lol

Your Clone lives forever and Not you

I like lex's interview location.

A clone is not the original person. The brain synapsis of the original are unique. The clone is based off a blank piece of paper using the base DNA. A true clone would have memories and human experiences transferred.

@bendmind790

Жыл бұрын

We want Altered carbon then?

Long ass story to sell some crypto’s

This is how the wealthy elites in Neuromancer become “immortal”

This was really interesting, and Balaji Srinivasan seems knowledgeable on the topics he talks about. However, I wish there was a greater emphasis on clones being essentially told who you are. The philosophical discussion if that would even be you, would obviously lean into psychology. For example Gestalt's theory, a whole is more than a sum of its parts. Having a snapshot of your life isn't really you experiencing it and learning it firsthand. In my opinion a child that grows up into a man/woman would be more shaped by you then a clone of you telling it how to live. Which could be argued that you live eternally through your bloodline already.

“Who wants to live forever” Queen

I can see a time where digital clones are sold or traded. I can also see a time where clones are hacked for slavery, torture, and subjecting them to stress to see how "you" would react.

@martinlutherkingjr.5582

Жыл бұрын

They already are in china, it’s just they’re cloning products instead of humans

What if I don’t want my body? Can i be downloaded into the Rock’s body? Can you Jumanji into something good?

The longevity movement is really taking off. Could still use all the help we can get!

Look at the visual ques you give yourself when you look in the mirror, have a nice thought playing in the background of your head when you do this. Use unrelated expressions and subtle gestures to make this excel use more challenging. When you are better at noticing, experiment with this concept in society

@rileykatipa7474

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Excercise *

@leob9675

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@@rileykatipa7474 what’s this called, where can I read more

If we were able to upload our consciousness into a clone or cybernetic organism or even into a computer program,we could live forever

@iQafa

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I wouldn't say FOREVER. But probably a long time relative to current human lifespans.

@rykehuss3435

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No we couldnt in the true sense of the word. Once the original version of you dies, you die too. Lights out forever.

@iQafa

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@@rykehuss3435 we don't know that. What if we could build a perfect replica of you? If the universe is "materialistic", if the "self" is the product of biochemical reactions happening in the brain, and if there is no "soul", shouldn't it literally be another you if it is built exactly the same way?

@rykehuss3435

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@@iQafa We do know it. There's only one you, and unless your brain is literally transferred intact, there's no staying immortal with cloning or consciousness uploads or stuff like that. Copying yourself is just that, a copy. That starts becoming distinct from the original the millisecond its consciousness starts observing the world from its own eyes (or equivalent). Thus its not the original you. And if the original you, that is you right now speaking with me, dies, then you are permanently dead. Your personality and memories will live on with the copy, but YOU will be dead for eternity. You will not live through the eyes of the clone. The clone will.

@iQafa

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@@rykehuss3435 But what truly constitutes "me"? Am "I" something beyond my biology? It's something we DON'T really know. And if the universe is truly materialstic in nature, why wouldn't the same brain produce the same consciousness? I don't think that my consciousness is something beyond the biochemistry of my brain. And I don't think I will ever be "immortal", I'm not important enough to be made immortal even if such a thing were feasible. Also, true immortality is most probably impossible to begin with, because eventually, literally everything will "die".

Idk about the idea of genomic reincarnation. It sounds worse than just having kids because you’re not increasing genetic diversity. I guess you could try gene editing to optimise your clones. Now if we’re talking about atomic reconstruction, where all of your atoms data are stored and then perfectly recreated when you die would that be you? What about if it happens while you’re alive.

Im surprised Lex didnt ask a philosophical question about the ethics of this

Unless you could transfer the Central Nervous System and Brain from 1 body to another... You're dying and a new life begins.

@mindripperful

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and like any code if you copy it enough times mutations happen From Binary computer code to DNA codes there is a degradation of information

@maziusclavo8021

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Make a clone extract his brain and put yours, what would happen?

@JaysSavvy

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@@maziusclavo8021 Grow a clone without a brain to begin with. Just ag hallow cavit waiting to accept the transfer. It'd have to be of a reasonable adult age to accommodate the size, probably varies by person, and make an AI performed Laser Surgery to remove and transplant the brain. Otherwise... I, as a person, am dying and no computer code can ever change that.

@maziusclavo8021

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@@JaysSavvy Brain transfer to clone+anti-ageing therapy to just that brain for immortality better i think because aging seems impossible to reverse on whole body but after brain transfer brain will need to re-adapt

it is literally impossible to know whether non invasive medicine has ever worked. i love listening to doctors just cast wizard spells on dummies.

Balaji so based he mentions the unabomber and anarchoprimitivism in a serious manner ... and he still took the transhumanist view!! Balaji is a neo liberal post accelerationist!! knew it

quick death = sudden death

HOMEOSTASIS is the best way to go about biological longevity. We are biological beings, so there is only so much you can tweak artificially before we create new cellular aberrations. Homeostasis is where time and money should be invested. Organic chemistry should be exhausted before inorganic artificial compounds would be utilized. The finite time that we have as individuals is what makes this whole experience an extremely valuable miracle; after all natural selection processed human evolution regardless of your spiritual inclinations.🤓

@maziusclavo8021

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Bul!sh×* life is too short, and if you have trauma by the time you resolve the problems will be late. But its true that most people dont deserve to be immortal, those that say "life is to enjoy"

Was hoping for some more chess discussions!

Immortalize your consciousness by getting laid: everybody wins.

Lotta holes to jump through for this one. Mitochondria is your first problem. Cloning isn't mathematically perfect, that's your second. You can't live in that body for at least 18 years while it grows due to neural chemistry, that's four. You'll need to run an AI on the body while it grows, that's five. Installation of the AI will require nano tech, that's six. The nano tech will likely have to be biological and self replicating, that's seven and eight. Self-replicating biotech will require the DNA puzzle to be solved, that's nine. You will need to map the nervous system so your brain can be removed, that's ten. Your brain might carry a one way virus or bacteria that could kill the body, that's eleven. Your new body needs an immune system, that's twelve. Your brain may be too small to fit in the cavity, that's thirteen.

We already live forever, in reoccurrence of same atoms as another body..if it takes rocket to blast out of ozone indicates to me.reoccurence ?

Take a shot for everytime he says right

Balaji is oozing narcissism. The idea that he's somehow among the first people to be against ageing and death is completely nuts. Countless researchers have been studying the mechanisms of ageing for a century or more.

@obscurelines

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He is an example of someone with great knowledge but somehow lacks something. Theres an emptiness in his philosophy.

@DailyJuggle

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when did he claim he’s the first one? i actually found him very down to earth. i actually find Lex to be the one who’s a tad narcissistic

@alexshaykevich509

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@@DailyJuggle i literally said "AMONG the first", not the first... so i'm not sure why you're straw manning me if you want to hear examples, simply listen to what he's saying: - "WE actually want significant life extension... similar to the rejection of Fiat currency..." - "medicine says a little death is good" - "crypto medicine says let's extend life" He's clearly claiming thinking about ageing and extending life is something new that people like him have suddenly come up with.

@asmosisyup2557

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@@alexshaykevich509 he's referring to humanity, not some niche group he's somehow leading.

@alexshaykevich509

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@@asmosisyup2557 The video literally starts with him saying "what does crypto medicine look like..." He's pretty much inventing the term. That's not a term that "humanity" at large are using.

Don't live forever. This curse must end!

@jujenshrestha7584

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drinkin' on it!

Real caring about life. The Creators?🧐

Bitcoin medicine...nice

Wow! This guy is a Genius.

Why anyone would want to live in this world forever is sad. I feel in my heart there is a much better dimension.

@optionvice8926

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I agree.. Live longer perhaps, but forever :o

@slouischarlesYT

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Because some people are happy here and don't know what happens or where you go when you die.

@Strawman333

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@@slouischarlesYT Fair enough.

@asmosisyup2557

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@@slouischarlesYT nobody does, but that doesnt stop people taking bets on it.