I always loved the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" vibe the Checker A11 had; would love to own one someday. And I think you're right, if Checker had developed the first minivan they would still be building them today.

@privateprivate1865

Жыл бұрын

Same. I wish toyota still offered its 20r engine pickups. Those were so reliable. Same with chevy 327 v8 models.

@davidharper7618

Жыл бұрын

True, he found something that worked and stuck with it!

@jkeelsnc

Жыл бұрын

@@privateprivate1865 Can you imagine if Checker made a simple but robust minivan powered by a 20r or 22R engine? The cabbies would have loved them.

@privateprivate1865

Жыл бұрын

@@jkeelsnc i think they would have too. Great engines.

@tjroelsma

Жыл бұрын

The "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" strategy has its pros and cons. Pros: - holding on to a certain design assures customers that that design will keep on being supported for a long time - the quality will pretty much stay the same - the cars are instantly recognisable Cons: - as the design gets more and more out of date, it becomes harder to upgrade it to modern standards - the design gets really outdated - you create a very defined but relatively small customer base and pretty much can forget about expanding that customer base (Harley Davidson anyone?)

I worked at Willow Run on the X car. The Checker deal might have saved the plant. We had highly skilled body men some of which went back to the days of Kaiser-Frazer. We ended up building the Caprice some of which were checker yellow. Closed in 1993.

@bandccoresohio

Жыл бұрын

Is that in Michigan?

@Franklin-pc3xd

3 ай бұрын

Yes - and the Caprice was an inferior product for use as a taxicab. Inferior from the passenger's standpoint. Inferior from the drivers' standpoint, and ultimately inferior from the standpoint of the taxi company ownership.

WOW, this cracks me up! My dad owned two new citations which he purchased the first and second years they were sold. They both had way too many build design and quality issues. There is no way that an original, let alone an extended citation would have held up as NYC cabs!

Another reason was because as the automotive industry consolidated, smaller companies found it more difficult to compete and stay afloat. Prior to WWII, there were many smaller car companies out there. But by the 60s, it was just primarily the Big 3, plus AMC, which eventually merged into Chrysler in the 80s.

@maxpayne2574

6 ай бұрын

No Checker was different because they had always been a low volume builder specializing in cabs.

A local police department had a testing program with GM for a Citation police cruiser. The cars were actually very practical, but failed because they weren't built for constant heavy duty use. If they had been beefed up for fleet use, they probably would have worked out very well.

@pcno2832

7 ай бұрын

I read a story back in the 1990s about all the tortures they inflict on a new model to verify its suitability for police use: things like jumping curbs and idling for 10 hours at a time. It's no surprise that only a few models in each decade ever make a dent in that market. A cop once told me that they drove around in Fairmonts for a few years, but they tended to get destroyed, so they went back to Caprices and Crown Vics. Come to think of it, I wouldn't want to try to fit a suspect into the back of a standard-length Fairmont with his hands cuffed behind his back; sound like a law suit waiting to happen.

@Colorado_Native

7 ай бұрын

Montrose, CO bought several Novas for city police use in the early 70s. They didn't last long. I worked at the body shop and my job was to install the spotlights.

I appreciate your calm demeanor. Too many loud obnoxious hosts on the net these days. Subscribed.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks, I appreciate the feedback and sub!

@skaldlouiscyphre2453

Жыл бұрын

You've gotta sound like Gilbert Gottfried or no one will care. Voice of an angel that man had.

@privateprivate1865

Жыл бұрын

@@skaldlouiscyphre2453 lol

@privateprivate1865

Жыл бұрын

@@skaldlouiscyphre2453 i know huh. Gilbert was cool.. but i didn't like his persona voice Im just getting old and have low tolerance for obnoxious noise

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

@@privateprivate1865 I couldn't imitate his voice if I wanted too...

In 1964, my grandfather, who lived in Boulder City, NV, bought a checker for his personal car, even traveling to Kalamazoo, MI to pick it up directly from the assembly plant. As a kid from a small rural IL town, I thought the back seat space was so huge.

@k.b.tidwell

Жыл бұрын

It wasn't just because you were a little fellow. It really was huge. 😄

2:55 When Ed Cole, the father of the Corvair and the Vega, VW's disastrous Westmorland plant, and Oldsmobile's famous diesel, are all combined into one story, you just know it's not going to end well.

@kevinobrien9271

6 ай бұрын

😅

I remember riding around in those old Checkers as a kid in the 70s. Those things were huge. Leg room for days.

I can imagine how well the X body platform would be - total failure in like 4 years lol.

SPOT-ON! You nailed the story, you are perhaps the first Auto Journalist to get the story correct on all four points. You also nailed the leadership angle correctly. David Markin, the founders son and new CEO was a Finance guy, not really a Car Guy. Management decisions would be based on dollars and cents and less on Automotive vision.

Great history of Checker! A couple of points: 1. It's pronounced Po-TAM-Kin, he owned a ton of dealerships. 2. The VW Westmoreland Plant was in Western PA nearer to Pittsburgh rather than Philadelphia.

@athleticguy15

Жыл бұрын

You beat me to the punch, lol, well said!!

@markrossow6303

Жыл бұрын

when we bought a 106-y.o. house in 1999, we bought a 1983 U.S. assembled Rabbit Diesel pickup -- 45-mpg and handled great -- heel-toe downshift at the start of a curve and the front tucks right in, and you can floor it at the apex -- used to leave BMWs behind on interstate on-ramps ;-)

Thoroughly enjoyed this and your "part one" video as well. Thank you for answering any questions I had on Checker. (And there were many, believe me!) I remember having to drive my dad's cab home from the hospital he went to, due to an emergency. That was 1983, so his was one of the newest 1982 models. That Chevrolet 14" diameter steering wheel felt good in my hands and the car drove velvety smooth on I-290. Neither my dad nor I would ever drive another Checker again after that day. Checker stopped building them, he was forced into retirement and well, I never wanted to drive a taxi. I just wished I could have owned one as my own car! 🚖!

i think checker got caught by a number of things, like you said. they also got caught in madison avenue's blitzkrieg, which demanded "newness" and "stylishness " just for the sake of glitzy change. checker had a wonderful machine that outclassed other automakers except for change for its own sake. the advent of fuel crises also hurt them; the inherent quality of their product to some extent limited their ability to make sweeping changes that would have put them in the same routine of planned obsolescence that the other automakers actually depend on to keep their sales turning over. the purpose of a taxi-cab is to comfortably and consistently transport its passengers and its cargo. the purpose of your average consumer's car is to keep up with the joneses by replacing it every two or three years to demonstrate the owner's apparent affluence. the minivan could have been the answer but look how the public reacts to them today - a vehicle for soccer moms and folks with too many kids!

In London, they also sticked to the Old Black cabs, only updated their lights and putting in a Nissan Diesel.

This was an interesting history lesson. Seeing a picture of Chevy’s x body (Citation) gave me chills. I got a ‘80 citation and the POS started falling apart, literally, within the first year. It was was essentially a disposable car. I kept it alive until ‘88 and then it ended up in the junk pile since nobody wanted to buy it.

@davestewart2067

Жыл бұрын

That X body (80-85) was the beginning of the descent into FWD, and cheapening. Had been a customer then, would have bought the Malibu, no ifs or buts.

@the_kombinator

Жыл бұрын

I actually saw one at a wreckers here a few months ago. I was surprised. I'm going to the same wreckers in a couple days, if it's still there, I'm gonna grab the Citation emblem - I used to collect them as a kid lol.

I just discovered your channel a couple days ago and I love it. I appreciate the straight-to-the-point approach without the need for hyperbole or silly long intros, etc. Your presentation style is excellent.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Awesome, thank you!

@DinoLondis

Жыл бұрын

I agree

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

@@DinoLondis Thank you!

@JTA1961

Жыл бұрын

Amen to that

One Nit Pick. Westmoreland County is 35 miles southwest of Pittsburgh PA! Them Philly people are Way over on the other side of the State! Fun Fact! THE Movie " Gung Ho staring Micheal Keaton" was filmed At the plant before Sony Bought it for Television production! Thank you for What might have been!!

As a midwesterner, i recall seeing many, many Citations, including my own :-) fold in the middle as the years went by. I loved my Citation by the way. They sure dodged a bullet on that one 👍

This is a really interesting history Jon, thank you for putting it together. I didn’t know a lot about these, never really lived in the kind of urban center where cabs are commonplace.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Nor have I (lived in the country a bit)... but like I mentioned at the beginning of the History of video, we've all seen them in the 70s and 80's TV shows and movies (heck, there was one called "Taxi"!). But like you I knew almost nothing about them, and found the story fascinating! Really appreciate you being here! Thanks!

@robertdragoff6909

Жыл бұрын

There was also the movie “Taxi Driver”

@daninva6458

Жыл бұрын

@@robertdragoff6909 I believe I have seen Taxi Driver once, but being in my mid thirties, I didn’t grow up on a lot of TV/ movies from that era.

@eric_d

Жыл бұрын

@@AllCarswithJon Lucky for you guys who grew up where there weren't that many taxis. I grew up to have a deep, and well justified hatred toward all taxi drivers and companies (including all rideshare companies and their drivers), but Taxi is one of my all time favorite TV shows, and I _LOVE_ the Checker cab. I used to know somebody that owned one and I was so jealous. The thing was about the same size as my Suburban!

In the 90's when I was hauling gm freight, I used to deliver and pickup at the former checker plant in Kalamazoo MI. By this time was a GM Stamping Plant. One time I was there a supervisor took me into the old office building in there was a 2 dr checker station wagon, reminded me of a nomad and a 6 door checker limo, 2 doors on the drivers side 4 doors on the passenger. These were never mass produced vehicle they were hand made prototypes. Still cool anyway!

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing.... I mean, in what world would a taxi-building company think a 2-dr station wagon was worth making??

Wow! The stories you put together on the Checkers are really interesting and insightful! Nice work, sir! There are some great lessons for entrepreneurs in decision making and being responsive to your product’s market in light of the dynamics of that market. #1 Lesson: The world keeps spinning with or without you! Opportunities come and go whether you act on them is up to you!

@AllCarswithJon

6 ай бұрын

Many thanks!

Keep them coming. Love your content bro 🔥 I usually Detail my cars in the garage and watch your videos on my tv out there.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Appreciate it!!

Interesting that Checker, at 4:42, even had plans to modify the VW Type 2 (a.k.a. "Microbus") and use it as a cab....given that the Type 1 (the original Beetle) was used as a taxi cab in Mexico until the Mexican Federal government outlawed two-door cabs in the mid-2000s.

Beautiful video on a forgotten classic....

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Many thanks!

This was very interesting. Thank you for posting all this information!

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

The checker marathon was superior as a cab having ridden in One because the body sat on the frame so there's no foot wells You sit high up you don't have to lift your legs to get out It was a relic from the 50s before lower longer wider era

@MisterMikeTexas

Жыл бұрын

I was born in late autumn 1963. First car of my memory was Dad's blue-green 64 Ford Country Sedan. I was accustomed to "stepping down" and transmission tunnels from the git-go.

@captainamericaamerica8090

Жыл бұрын

THE MARATHON WASN'T THE CAB MODEL. IT WAS THE CIVILIAN , FAMILY SEDAN. THE CAB MODEL HAD A HEAVIER DUTY CAB PACKAGE.

@chrisdavidson911

Жыл бұрын

@@captainamericaamerica8090 NOBODY CARES. IT'S WHAT EVERYONE CALLS THEM. VOLKSWAGEN DIDN'T CALL THEIR CAR THE BEETLE BUT IT'S STILL WHAT PEOPLE SAY.

@skaldlouiscyphre2453

Жыл бұрын

@@chrisdavidson911 Der Käfer?

@derpinguin7003

Жыл бұрын

@@captainamericaamerica8090WHY ARE YOU SCREAMING?

Excellent, well researched and thoughtful presentation. Made me subscribe to your channel. Looking forward to watching more.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thank you very much!

I remember reading an article in the 1970s when I was still in school. It described one of Checker's proposed prototypes. The article claimed that the doors were diagonally-interchangeable and that apart from the lighting, the front and rear clips were almost identical. ISTR it sounded like a project AMC had been working on during the same time period. I never heard anything for decades after that. Before the internet, it could be hard to find out what happened to a company that fell by the wayside, and I never learned anything new until I read an article that said Checker had been supplying body parts but then it was (more-or-less) dissolved. Thanks for filling in the blanks.👍

@seed_drill7135

Жыл бұрын

The final Studebaker prototype had the diagonally interchangeable doors.

@61rampy65

Жыл бұрын

@@seed_drill7135 Geez, you beat me to it by 22 hours. I think Brooks Stevens had designed that car.

@mpetersen6

Жыл бұрын

AMC messed around with the idea in the late 60s. There was a concept car (Cavalier iirc) that made the rounds. I'm pretty sure that it only used two fenders and two doors. The trunk and hood might have been the same too. They did use certain body parts on Hornets and Pacers that were the same front and back. Bumpers for sure.

I guess you could say George Costanza had more motivation than Checker's management in the end.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Lol

@jaex9617

Жыл бұрын

He did a lot with the Penske file. And look how they ended up.

Thanks for another great video, Jon, as well as your astute observations. You sure did a lot of research on a relatively obscure topic. I knew a bit of this stuff, but never saw the pictures and drawings you found. You are so right about the minivan - it sure made a perfect taxi. If Checker had been first, they would probably still be filling the streets.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it. the disadvantage of reading about 'car stuff' is you stumble across something relatively obscure (Checker made cars?) and the next thing you know days have passed, you've written a rought 'script' and you're filming a video! :) :) :)

@davidhollenshead4892

Жыл бұрын

@@AllCarswithJon Sorry to point out that you got a number of things wrong. a) Checker, like all small automakers, knew that they couldn't pass the regulation planned for the future in terms of emissions, fuel economy, crash safety. b) Checker had developed a very bad reputation for rust damage to the frame and the body, with most of their sales being in the rust belt, [ The competition switched to galvanized steel, and other rust protection while Checker didn't even bother to pain the inside of their frames and interior body cavities so they rusted out quickly and catastrophically ] c) There also was a prototype body for a postal delivery truck that used the rabbit / golf drive-train, and there were engines that were powerful enough to make a taxi as this engine was used on the South Africa Kombi Taxis [ r-4 & I-5 cylinder Vanagons ] d) The return for their investment as a parts supplier was much higher than that of their taxis, e) The process of making Duraplast panels had been worked out years before in the DDR for the Trabont, f} Checker was competing with used Police Cars in their market. Taxi Companies were able to purchase better cars with heavy duty: suspension, brakes, steering, automatic transmissions, alternators, etc. They also got preferred sales of these used Police Cars by guaranteeing that all the Police Hardware would be Removed and Destroyed... [ while the Police Interceptor Engines had a high fuel consumption, they would be replaced with a V6 or small V8 when the first engine rebuild was needed...] If any of these designs made sense, they would have continued to make taxis, but they didn't. The last two years of Checker Cabs were Propane Powered, with the dangerous jump seats removed, knowing that they would have to stop production. As they couldn't compete with used Police Cars that had 50 k miles and cost $2000 or less and still outlasted a new Checker Cab....

Beyond informative, this documentary is "the FULL ride!"

My dad and mom had a Oldsmobile station wagon that was a diesel and when my dad sold it he sold it to a local taxi cab company at that time.

absolutley fascinating mate

I enjoyed watching your very interesting content. Keep up the good work.👍👍

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thank you 👍

I just loved the nostalgia of them if they started making them again i would buy it just for that i don't care about all the issues i just loved them

Drove a Checker Cab in Boston late 70s. 😊

We didn't have to wait for the Saturns to show up in 1989 to get plastic body panels. The Pontiac Fiero had them in 1984. 😁 I remember tripping and falling against a door and feeling it rebound. No damage!

The idea of replacing the VW engine with an Olds diesel was pure genius. Stripping out an extremely reliable power plant and replacing it with something prone to blowing apart at random would have been epic. Just use the rabbit diesel engine. After VW increased the size of the head bolts the engines were brute tough and the pickups could take almost anything you could fit in the bed and survive. We probably had loads of over a ton in the back on some trips, and the little beast just kept plugging away.

@k.b.tidwell

Жыл бұрын

I know two individuals in my community who each have one of the Rabbit diesel pickups. I knew of a third man in a neighboring town with one, but he died several years ago. The two I know of are still going and going and going.

Rabbits were manufactured in Mt. Pleasant Pennsylvania. In the old Chrysler Plant that was never used after it was built. I worked there assembling the bottom half of the back seat.

@blentz226

Жыл бұрын

Was just about to say same thing!!

@fk4515

Жыл бұрын

I thought it was a TV plant that got re-purposed?

Agree. Thank you for the history.

The A1 was by far the best taxi ever made!

Great video. Just FYI, since you mentioned hoping to pronounce it correctly, Potamkin is pronounced "Po-TAM-Kin". They were a huge network of dealerships in the NYC area.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

My bad. Trust me, I've had many many people correct me. :)

@davidcarroll8735

Жыл бұрын

There was definite status to owning a Cadillac from Potamkin, especially the location around Rt 46 in Little Falls / Totowa NJ ;-)

I wondered why... thanks for all the details!

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Happy to help!

My Dad, an ill-tempered (not quite 'mad') scientist traveled to South Bend where all the taxis were Studebaker Lark Economilers. Ha said that some had Studebaker frames bolted to racks on the roof as an ad for the Studebaker body-on-frame construction as compared to competing unit construction compacts.

How cool would it been if Checker teamed up with IH and used the Scout as a taxi? Maybe both companies could have been saved. Thanks for the video, interesting company history.

@5610winston

Жыл бұрын

Remember the Travelall?

@chrisdavidson911

Жыл бұрын

@@5610winston the Mark 1 Travelall was probably the perfect body style for a universal do-everything taxi, it's like a small school bus

@skaldlouiscyphre2453

Жыл бұрын

@@chrisdavidson911 Austin FX4 has entered the chat

@fk4515

Жыл бұрын

I would of thought they should of teamed up with Studebaker-Packard and used a version of the Checker as the Packard and morphed into the professional car, police, ambulance and handicapped transport markets. one of the hallmarks of the Checker taxi was room booth in the back seat and the trunk. Cops and paramedics tend to carry a lot of gear a Checker/Packard/Studebaker would of given them the room, performance and durability. The other alternative would of been AMC which may of given them similar market access and at least a rudimentary dealer network.

@kennethsouthard6042

Жыл бұрын

Not exactly sure how a gas guzzling vehicle, like an International Scout would have been necessary in a city environment, especially during the 1980s. Even if they did there is just not enough volume for purpose built taxi vehicles to sustain the economies of scale for profitability.

Great historical info. Perhaps you can also do a story on the mid 90s GM APV vans.

A very fasinating and insightful look at a company at a crossroad. I agree with you, sir, that had they taken the chance with the last attempt they may have struck gold. But, as you mentioned, the kind of leadership requuired for such a bold commitment just wasn't there. I can understand the logic of playing it safe, but with the world at large really begininng to speed up by the late 70's/early 80's in many cases companies that didn't innovate or change would be left in the dust. It feels like they did realize this (at least some of the company) but were, perhaps, afraid to go "all in" with the confidence, enthusiasm and complete belief in what they proposed as the business plan for their future. One can only speculate, but I think they had found the gold, they just had to commit to "digging it out". Another swell show! Thanks!

I bet if they would have teamed up with Chrysler with the K platform as with the K platform had stretched limos. Lee Iaccoca probably would have worked with Checker to make the K platform Checker FWD.

@dand3975

Жыл бұрын

I am not a Chrysler, Dodge or Plymouth fan but a checker taxi cab based on the "K" car body with a Rear Wheel Drive chasis would have been a very dependable taxi, and the front nose would have looked very distinguished.

I remember reading about the VW based Checker in the Kalamazoo paper. But you added lots of info I didnt know.

Nothing will ever replace the Checker Marathon. It was PERFECT!!!

3:30 as a huge VW rabbit fan, thank you for this, I never knew.

Just discovered your channe today and I hope more do the same. Great work on this video. It is very reminiscent of the articles I used to read in Collectible Automobile magazine with good combination of information about the car, the business, and the personalities involved.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Awesome, thank you!

I’m a Londoner and I like the new redesign for the London cab, but I can’t understand why The London Taxi Company sold out to Chinese automaker Geely, manufacturing the London cabs in China but assembling them in the U.K. When you consider we still design and engineer them in the U.K., but it’s funded by Chinese money and cheap Labour costs. But I would love to see the iconic checker cab redesigned again, and back on the streets of Chicago and NY. Perhaps, London’s new electric cab, if it was modified could be the new checker cab? It’s a nice design.

Well, living near Rochester, NY, I see parallels between Kodak, Polaroid, Xerox and other formerly huge companies that didn't change with the world.

@jkeelsnc

Жыл бұрын

And Xerox had all of the early versions of computing technology we take for granted now. They could have owned the entire personal computer market for decades but the stodgy fools at HQ didn't understand what they had at the PARC lab in California and didn't seem to care or have the vision to see the possibility of the technology they owned.

Great video. Subscribed!👍

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Welcome to the community!

Face-to-face rear seating like the classic British taxi.

From a passenger perspective.. The best cab i was ever in was the classic Black London Taxi. HUGE room inside, amazing turning radius. Better isolation for the driver.., protection from robbery etc. It always amazed me how small the back seat was in a Crown vic.. Great car.. durable, etc. But terrible room in back for a big car. I think the Checker was actually roomier inside, more like the London Taxi.

A blast from my three Checkers-owned past. I did not know the Mogul name was from that far back. I named my taxi corporation Mogul Service Incorporated, because Mogul sounded very Big Business Leader-ish, and the Service part came from Noo Yawk, the big league of the taxi trade. I saw former New York retired Checkers come off the truck in Brookline, Massachusetts at the Checker Motors dealership. We knew them as bombers! The frames on some visibly sagged from NYC's pothole-riddled streets. In Brookline they were rejuvenated a bit, then sent into their final innings in Boston. I owned a late 60's A10, I think, a private customer car with possibly a Continental L6, maybe a GM L6, but definitely a non-GM transmission. I also owned two A11s for my taxi business. Both had two small jump seats. The best thing was my swapping a springy A10 front seat with a CollapsoFoam A11 front seat. Later I experimented with a Recaro bucket seat in my A11. Gotta keep driving... I heard Checker had a Japanese American engineer towards the end of vehicle production. I wondered about his experiences! Thank you, very very much for your Checker archeology.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing! I have to admit, I now wish the idea of using the phrase "A Checkered Past" had occurred to me about a week ago... :(

Checker Motors Kalamazoo MI! right out of high school ( mid 90s) i worked with Harry as a security guard he was my supervisor he retired out of checker when they closed up shop (I forget what year mid 80s I think) he said last thing he made at checker was S10 Tailgates

Very interesting!! I always liked the look and ease of repair and the heavy duty aspect of these cars. I actually know a guy who has two 70’s Marathons that run and drive sitting in a warehouse in Detroit along with other cars. Another interesting taxi car to do a series on would be the iconic London taxi👍

@captainamericaamerica8090

Жыл бұрын

MARATHONS WEREN'T THE CAB MODELS. THEY WERE THE FAMILY SEDANS.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

I've had the London Taxi suggested and added it to the list. Great recommendation!

I would say the main reason that Checker never got around to making a new model was that they had no need to do so until it was too late for them to ever be remotely competitive to do so. They had no real competition until the late 70's as most major cities such as NYC had laws that only allowed purpose built cars to serve as taxis. After production cars were allowed, the big 3 could easily beat their pricing in fleet sales no matter what new design they might come up with. It's hard to go from one of two companies selling taxis to the more expensive of half a dozen.

@Sashazur

6 ай бұрын

And the taxi companies knew that customers would ride in almost any model taxi if the alternative was no taxi!

I’ve always loved the icawnic Checker cores…especially the later models using GM ports.

Cool video I always wondered about these iconic cars growing up in California I have absolutely no clue about the history of the checker cab co.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it

Thanks for not calling the Ghia Centurian a prototype. Built on a 1966 Checker limo chassis

I remember the mini van type design proposal by Guigaro(?) and others before Dodge. What a missed opportunity but Checker was a small company with a complex product.

3:10 Poe-tem-kin. A man famous for having one of the most successful Cadillac dealerships, in Manhattan no less, and for having his wife (Luba) appear in all their TV commercials touting how cheap their Caddies were and doing a lil disco dance. "If your car doesn't have this nameplate on the back of it, you probably paid more than you should have!" The Potamkins are legend among us Malaisians.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment, several have already corrected my pronounciation. :) Growing up and living in the south, I've never heard of him until I did the video. Sorry I got the name wrong. :)

@vwestlife

Жыл бұрын

@@AllCarswithJon Here's one of Potamkin's ads, so you can hear Luba pronounce it: kzread.info/dash/bejne/m4hpvJppcaeWipc.html

@christophermatthews6972

Жыл бұрын

There was also a battleship.

Swell video. The dealers name is pronounced proTAMkin...... he was very active in the industry during my years in the business.... Was a big player in the mid-Atlantic states.... Thanks, sir.

There was a more recent iteration of this with the "Lego" -looking "standard taxi" car' initiated by checker back in early 2000's/late 90's that eventually became the AM-General, disability vehicle' the MV-1. Quite similar in layout to a London cab, unfortunately never made it to taxi service in general, but it did receive approval from New Yorks taxi/limousine commission as a NY taxicab. With a panther platform frame and V8+rear wheel drive it was old school, but had a built-in load ramp that was ADA compliant. MV-1's did make it to production for a few years, but have since been cancelled, as of 2016. Presumably due to low sales. Bonus points for anyone who's seen them in the wild. I've personally seen 2-3 on the road.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Interesting, i've never heard of that. Thanks!

@jkeelsnc

Жыл бұрын

I have, in fact, seen the MV-1 in my area. Perhaps twice.

@fk4515

Жыл бұрын

I've seen MV-1s, a local Ambu-cab had one until recently I thought what killed them was Ford stopping Panther Production, no more Crown Vic frames.

@chada75

Жыл бұрын

Used to be one in Winston-Salem a few year back.

@fk4515

Жыл бұрын

@@chada75 heck we had one in Britt Iowa, you've probably never heard of Britt Iowa unless you're really into Hobos, Draft horses or radial arm and panel saws.

When I was stationed in Germany, I would ride in a Mercedes Taxi 🚕. It was great 👍.

@Sashazur

6 ай бұрын

I’ve heard that in Germany and Europe, Mercedes doesn’t have the luxury status they do in the US. It makes sense since in Europe they offer a full range of vehicles including trucks and compacts, whereas in the US it’s only luxury cars and SUVs.

Great vid but was distracted that you had unopened notifications on your Alexa 😂😂

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

🤭

“Pleasantly Profitable” is a brilliant phrase and probably the state of many companies that slide down to oblivion.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks. I admit that phrase was unscripted and I'm quite proud of it. :) LOL

*Do you think you and Chong will get back together for like a last ride comedy tour? Sister Mary Elephant, Sgt Stadanko, Pedro and the man, Earache My Eye, Born in East LA, etc., that was some crazy fun times back in the day. We love ya Cheech, god bless you dude!*

Madison heights?.... I thought that was a indoor play area i used to visit many many years ago as a child. Also one of those designs reminds me of a Chevrolet Front welded to the rear of an Austin Princess.

In my opinion, the VPG MV-1 would be the ideal replacement vehicle for the Checker Marathon sedan. Lots of rear seat room and a high roof.

@AllCarswithJon

7 ай бұрын

Ah yes. I had to google that but instantly recognized it!

Very very interesting 🤔

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thank you!

When I was a little boy I thought It always looked like a '55 Chevy

@johneckert1365

Жыл бұрын

Me too!

@jamesmooney8933

Жыл бұрын

Me to, the '55 Chevy was the best design of the 50"s

The x body reminds me of the English Austin Wedge Shaped Princess from the 70’s

With the X-body attempt, I wonder why they didn't pivot to the A-body after Fisher said no to providing bodies? GM made A-bodies through 1996, and the A was an evolution of the X anyway. Also, as you were describing Checker's plans with the GALVA and GALVA II to include a high roof version, I wondered why Checker didn't look at doing something with either the Chevy G van or Suburban? Lots of roads not taken, I guess. Thanks for a fascinating video!

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment. Yeah, as I look at Checker's plans to take another car and build it to be a taxi.... I just can't get over the fact they looked at the Rabbit ans X-cars.... like... there wasn't anything else that would provide room?

@peterdarr383

Жыл бұрын

@@AllCarswithJon The "X" chassis was a true 6 seater and when lengthened it would be a 9 seater, I would assume the added length and weight would sort out the tendency of the car spinning under hard braking. They could also have converted and modified all the un-wanted used Citations for many years after about 1984 or so.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

@@peterdarr383 Good points. Definitely the 'glass half full' look at it!

@jkeelsnc

Жыл бұрын

@@peterdarr383 Imagine if they had made these stretched X body cars with a buick 3800 engine? I'll bet those could survive in NYC.

@peterdarr383

Жыл бұрын

@@jkeelsnc The weak part would be the transmission - it wasn't very "big". The car would be at least 600 pounds heavier and need to haul at least 800 pounds more than it's "gross" when filled with 9 people and luggage. Springs, obviously, but also a brake up-grade and stronger CV joints.

If you think about it, after checker, most cab companies started using decommissioned cop cars, and those like the iconic checker cab were big and heavy.. if checker kept their original vision and didnt try to bend the knee to the fuel crisis and try to stretch vw rabbits and chevy citations they probably wouldve gone on to exist much longer, and like mentioned here if later they got into minivan building they may still exist today

The GM idea was a good idea but on the wrong car. If Checker could have held off until the A body was released, they'd have had a near perfect platform for a long-lived taxi. it was more rugged than the X car, FAR more comfortable and accommodating, easier to work on and nearly as economical to operate (more if you factor in dependability).

The "Westmoreland" plant was not in Philadelphia. It was not even on that side of Pennsylvania. It was an old Chrysler plant in New Stanton, PA in Westmoreland County. After VW ceased production the plant was eventually bought by Sony to make TVs.

I only know of Checkers because in the 90s Surge had a contest to win a Checker Cab in Surge colors.

remember seeing so many checker cabs in manhattan, n.y..mind you, in the 1960's they were beautiful..and EXTREMELY SPACIOUS..

Since they were mostly used in cities, in traffic, aerodynamics shouldn't have been a huge issue for the body design. I think if they could've found a more economical way to build them & more fuel efficient while keeping them robust they probably would've kept going much longer than they already did.

I had saved up and was going to buy a "civilian" Checker the year they closed.

6:43 I find it interesting that nobody thought to move to the new FWD A-Body, which did have a long shelf life (the Buick Centuries and Olds Cieras lasting until 1996)... and honestly, there's considerable evidence that the Celebrity/6000/Ciera/Century was, in fact, just a revised X-body (with the same wheelbase, for example), taking advantage of all the technology but none of the bad publicity. Perhaps GM didn't want anybody knowing this at the time, not even Checker... or, GM was still sure the X's would be a hit in 1980, not counting on the severe build quality issues of the earlier cars.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

That thought crossed my mind too, but they stopped car production in '82 which was the same year the A-bodies debuted. And since their decision was based on making more money making parts for other manufacturers rather than their own cars, it just doesn't seem to have mattered there was a new, larger, and more robust platform coming.

@vwestlife

Жыл бұрын

Also GM sold over 800,000 Chevy Citations in 1980 -- they had factories running 24 hours a day to keep up with the demand, and maybe they simply didn't have enough production capacity to spare to provide Checker with X-Cars. Of course, sales dropped off rapidly after the X-Car's many problems became evident, but by then the deal with Checker had already been cancelled. Also you have to consider how the customer base -- cab drivers -- would've reacted. Considering how long taxi drivers stuck with the rear-wheel-drive, body-on-frame Ford Crown Vic, even decades after unibody FWD cars became mainstream, I'm sure back in the early '80s it would've been an even tougher sell to convince them to make such a radical change.

Never heard a mention, either in this video or the previous, of the Checker Little Giant model from the 50s. I think there was a Popular Science artivle about it back then, and it might have had ideas as would have been more feasible in later years.

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

If you have any sources please let me know! I've never heard such a thing, haven't seen it on any of the Checker fan sites, and a quick google search just now turned up zero. You've got me curious.

Hello There Great video Correction. The Volkswagen Rabbit factory was in New Stanton, Pennsylvania near Pittsburgh

@AllCarswithJon

Жыл бұрын

I know, I know.... just can't correct it now the video's out. :)

@McPilot_W3DDS

Жыл бұрын

@@AllCarswithJon I really enjoy the videos and appreciate the work in doing the research

I think part of the reason checker failed is people say those checker cabs didnt ride comfortably and didnt drive well either also those things were gas guzzlers by the 80's fuel efficient vehicles were here to stay We also have understand that some cab companies lease the car to the driver So fuel efficiency would be a big issue with drivers who were leasing cars also the cab companies that own theyre vehicles still make theyre drivers pay for there on fuel so again fuel efficeny is paramount In the 90's and as as late as 2012 ish i saw a little cab company in macon ga. Using some 4 cylinder front wheel drive cars for taxi service maximizing profit i guess without raising customer cost

Every time I get into a taxi here in New York, and as a tall person feel as though I'm being "squished," I terribly miss the classic Checkers which I grew up with...

Potamkin (pronounced po--TAM-kin) was a big time dealership operator in Miami in the 1950s and thereafter. Potamkin Chevrolet was probably the biggest dealership in Miami in the 1950s.

No questions but the Westmoreland VW plant is over 300 miles from Philadelphia. It is actually close to Pittsburgh

Remember it was Edsel ford who incouraged Henery to change. Maybe if Checker had an Edsel they might had survived.

7:13 a K-car minivan

thanks for the Checker history..as a kid my sister and I and Mom would visit Mr Markin..in Kalamazoo ..He would get my sister and me,, up early and the three of us would be in the kitchen making silver dollar pancakes,, new to us.. He was great fun... My Dad was president of General Fire and Causality ...owned by Checker.... My mom feared that we might be obligated to have a checker cab for the family car when the marathon came out, I guess they sold the insurance company to Greyhound,, Ackerman was the president? and my dad was out...of course I was just a kid,, but one of the things I thought was interesting ,, say 50s 60s was that Markin was jewish and the cab companies in NYC mostly jewish,, Sidney Nat Levine ,, yellow cab ,,, and General Fire was mostly Irish and Italian catholic.. the executives wold go to a neighborhood church together...they were at 1790 Broadway NYC.just south of Central Park ,,,. which used to be "Auto Row"on Broadway,,, now the building has a historic designation. My Dad started in Chicago and then they set up an office in New York ....

@k.b.tidwell

Жыл бұрын

Very interesting story from your youth there! I love it when the participants of these historic times show up and add details. Thank you! Soooo....I guess you never got that Marathon family car, huh?

@loulechner

Жыл бұрын

@@k.b.tidwell no there was no divorce.....

@k.b.tidwell

Жыл бұрын

@@loulechner HAHAHAAAAAA!!!

I had a 1980 VW diesel rabbit from PA. Was only a fair quality car. The engine blew at 95K. Assembly was crude.

I tried to buy an old Marathon from an old guy in Kansas a 1968 with a column shifted 3 spd.... didn't run and in awful shape but the guy wanted 5 grand for it so i walked away....a month later i found a 73 Ford Maverick for $3500 bucks

@5610winston

Жыл бұрын

I remember seeing Maverick/Comet sedan taxis, but the most dramatic all-new fleet of taxis I can remember was a company called London Taxi in Atlanta. All brand-new 1977-1978 Chevy Impalas, all light silver-blue, all carrying a Union Jack placard. As I recall, that company went bust and the assets came down to a bunch of leases on very used cars. Nothing to the company but the name.

in Seattle, the owner of Yellow Cab ordered a private sedan, when news about the assembly line shutdown came out in the early 1990s I saw it in the parking garage of a medical-dental building (Madison St at Boren Ave) and the owner came along while I was showing it to the wife he said it had started down the line as a cab; had the dome light wiring in the ceiling the factory switched it to his order, and gave it a beautiful navy blue interior and gloss exterior, with chrome then in 2010 we switched churches from Trinity on 1st Hill to Epiphany in Madrona -- and there was the car -- his daughter still drives it ( private Checkers were fairly popular in Seattle -- along with slant-6 Dodge Darts and AMCs, they were low maintenance + long-lived, and so suited our Scandihoovian population )

Potamkin......."poe-TAM-kin." Was a wealthy GM franchisee with several prosperous sales floors in and around New York City, including their two flagship Cadillac showrooms in midtown Manhattan, "the worlds largest Cadillac dealer." Their tv commercials were very extravagant.