Hey All! This Project was Fan Funded! Thanks so much for the support. You can actually fund your own projects and have them come up first! Consider becoming a Patreon or going to LoreReloaded.com!

@christenorio9555

4 жыл бұрын

Watch the TV show Chuck!

@leejohnstone3051

4 жыл бұрын

A person who is a murderer, torturer, back stabber etc. Oh your not talking about the Master? Na Garek is a amateur compared to the Master! Has Garek destroyed a entire star system? Has he butcher millions of people just to take over the universe? Nope!

@Ami-vh7sr

4 жыл бұрын

I would like to state you don't seem to understand Garak as a Character.....and if you don't understand the Character why are you doing an Analysis of him?

@Bitchslapper316

4 жыл бұрын

I still think Garak was a section 31 operative. There is quite a bit of indirect evidence.

@Ami-vh7sr

4 жыл бұрын

@@Bitchslapper316 That would never happen, and the reasoning is easily sound. Garak was a Cardassian through and through, as such when Garak speaks about the Enigma Tales of how the 'Cardassian's entire purpose is to live for the State living a selfless life to it'. Also when asked why he let a group of Political dissidents go he stated 'Because I love Cardassia'. Section 31 doesn't give a shit about anyone but the Federation, as in they don't care if Cardassia prospers or falls because to them it doesn't matter so long as their threat to the Federation is contained.

"You'd shoot a man in the back?" "Well, it's the safest way." Logical

@vic5015

4 жыл бұрын

The Romulans would probably approve

@ASTheOneAndOnly

4 жыл бұрын

“What you would do that? Shoot a man in the back” “It’s just a pity he is awake, now gloop him!” - Dave Lister and Arnold Rimmer, Red Dwarf, Series 4, ‘The Justice Zone’

@tomgriffiths2622

4 жыл бұрын

ColecoKid RIGHT

@leonrobinson8180

4 жыл бұрын

Was I the only one who read that in Spock's voice?

@tomgriffiths2622

4 жыл бұрын

Leon Robinson the logical part YES with a raised eyebrow and ever so slight nod✊

poor Garak, hes just a humble tailor..... you cant prove anything else

@peterq1978

4 жыл бұрын

lol, always

@michaeldriggers7681

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly my thoughts! I can't believe Lore would spread these slanderous rumors and hearsay, especially against a humble tailor!

@peterq1978

4 жыл бұрын

Garak will sue!

@EmperorSteele

4 жыл бұрын

And you know what the real tragedy is? He's an awfully GOOD tailor.

@tomgriffiths2622

4 жыл бұрын

Peter Quinn ☝️plain and simple

Bashir: Assuming you're not a spy... Garak: Assuming. Bashir: Then maybe you're an outcast. Garak: Or maybe I'm an outcast spy. Bashir: How could you be both? Garak: I never said I was either.

@adamelliott4257

3 жыл бұрын

The elegance of that quote is *chef's kiss*

@paulmd2010

3 жыл бұрын

Deep space nine had Breaking Bad level writing at times.

@robertnett9793

Жыл бұрын

@@adamelliott4257 To be fair - that's nearly every other line Garak has.

@KuariThunderclaw

Жыл бұрын

What I love about Garak... almost everything he says in grounded in some fragment of truth to varying degrees. It's just always put in such a way that you rarely can be 100% sure.

@UNLebanon

Жыл бұрын

The fact that he IS both, but Bashir finds that to be the less plausible answer is what makes this exchange so delicious.

Bashir: "I never know which of your stories are true and which aren't." Garak: "But my dear doctor, they're all true." Bashir: "Even the lies?" Garak: "Especially the lies."

@slevinchannel7589

4 жыл бұрын

DS9, full of crazy Criminals. I would attack DS9, therefore. Who's with me? C'mon people, get some Phaser and follow me! Let's attack the Station and take all the Latinum for ourselfes!!!

@johnpesich2600

3 жыл бұрын

Sounds like the UFP to me...

@WobblesandBean

3 жыл бұрын

I miss Garak.

@chironOwlglass

3 жыл бұрын

A lie might be a false representation of the specific content it contains, but it's an accurate answer to another question that isn't being asked.

@julesparker461

2 жыл бұрын

A good lie is based in the truth

In my opinion, one of the most well developed and interesting characters in all of Star Trek. Brilliantly portrayed by Andrew Robinson.

@dballs52

4 жыл бұрын

I agree, along with commander shran from enterprise.

@arnehilmann1705

3 жыл бұрын

You are absolutely right, dear Sir!

@MacHamish

3 жыл бұрын

I totally agree, as well as Weioon (sp?).

@Jubilian3000

3 жыл бұрын

Totally agree!

@Tayvin4042

3 жыл бұрын

In all of Star Trek? More like in all of Science Fiction.

Garak is the perfect example of how you can make a Player Character who's "technically" not a Good Alignment, and still make them aligned with the party.

@Corbomite_Meatballs

4 жыл бұрын

And how you can have a great support character in a series if you write them well.

@CarrowMind

4 жыл бұрын

Garak is also the only example of a True Neutral character that I can think of that perfectly fits the description of what True Neutral means.

@CarrowMind

4 жыл бұрын

@Natasel Quark is Chaotic Neutral as he is both greedy and duplicitous as well as kind and generous at the same time, he also makes bold, rash decisions quickly, a trait all CN's share.

@nealebrowning4686

4 жыл бұрын

I designed a psion with 54 bluff lv.3 based on this idea.

@slevinchannel7589

4 жыл бұрын

DS9, full of crazy Criminals. I would attack DS9, therefore. Who's with me? C'mon people, get some Phaser and follow me! Let's attack the Station and take all the Latinum for ourselfes!!!

Everything he said was true Especially the lies

@craigh5236

4 жыл бұрын

"Pattern buzzes" Lies

@RemingtonDean

4 жыл бұрын

@@craigh5236 Garak would make an awesome Lightweaver!

@slevinchannel7589

4 жыл бұрын

DS9, full of crazy Criminals. I would attack DS9, therefore. Who's with me? C'mon people, get some Phaser and follow me! Let's attack the Station and take all the Latinum for ourselfes!!!

@slevinchannel7589

3 жыл бұрын

@C_137 Sanchez ?

@slevinchannel7589

3 жыл бұрын

@C_137 Sanchez Fascinating. Then maybe; just maybe; i can get you to do something that i (sadly) dont get many people to do: Help with a lil project of mine. You could call it a good-cause project to make KZread less of a Mess... cause we all know wha a Mess it is, dont we? It gets a lot of criticism; especially the CEO: Susan.

He's a well loved character because he's an excellent character. He's not a "good person" by most peoples standards but he is a person. Despite his past and his probably sociopathy he's also undoubtedly brave intelligent and charismatic, traits which are well respected by just about everyone. The Obsidian order probably just didn't know about his phobia as he would have known to keep it well hidden, perhaps it was even held in check after he got his implant since it would have been designed to inhibit his ability to feel fear/panic as part of its function. I doubt his exile was part of a plan, but I can easily believe that his father pulled some strings to have him exiled rather than killed the Obsidian Order as a whole understood the potential value in keeping him alive, willing to watch and spy with the potential of one day being allowed to come home if he did a good enough job keeping him loyal.

@theodorebricker7492

4 жыл бұрын

The sheer amount of hedged bets involved in this possibility make me think its right, or at less would be the best explanation long term that doesn't sound contrived.

@theodorebricker7492

4 жыл бұрын

@wowalinbie I mean no exaggeration when I say this, but that would be like saying a former Gestapo officer is a good man. I mean no Godwin's Law thing here. The Cardassian occupation of Bajor is pretty much their version of the Holocaust. By analogy, that makes Garak Waffen-SS or Gestapo. From that, he's not a good man by any stretch. Does he do good for his people? Sure. He even does a lot or even most of it in mostly moral ways. But he is always willing to do whatever it takes to see through his plans, no matter how black. I love Garak as a character for all his complexity. Meeting someone like him, knowing what we do, should scare anyone shitless.

@barrymoon7418

4 жыл бұрын

Garak is a good person just depends on what side you sit on

@theodorebricker7492

4 жыл бұрын

@wowalinbie Except that interpretation is complicated by the fact that Garak never expresses anything but pride and loyalty toward the Cardassia her served. That it threw him out was his problem, not his nation. While he may at points disagree with the brutality of the Cardassian way, overall he supports it. The reason he seeks to overthrow the Cardassia government later is because he feels that Dukat and the Dominion don't have Cardassia's interests at heart.

@skryptre

4 жыл бұрын

I would think if the obsidian order knew his phobia they would use it to their advantage one way or another. They like control, and such a weakness is a great liability to an individual were they to act against the interests of OO. The OO would simply try to use him in operations where his weakness wouldn't likely weaken the OO. we've to remember they didn't have lots of resources so it would be foolish to waste his potential based on one weakness.

I love Garak. One of the best characters in DS9. He's complex, multi-layered, well-written and well-acted. We never saw him being evil, though we are led to suspect some horrific things done for the Obsedian Order. His conversations with Quark are some of the best dialogue written for DS9. It would have been great if he had more story arcs based around him.

@michaeldriggers7681

4 жыл бұрын

We watched him torture Odo.

@thoughtfortheday7811

4 жыл бұрын

@@michaeldriggers7681 good point, but wasn't there a higher purpose for that?

@michaeldriggers7681

4 жыл бұрын

@@thoughtfortheday7811 he tortured Odo to convince his father he deserved his old position within the Obsidian Order back. There was a purpose but not a "higher purpose", it was Garak's lowest point in the show imo.

@thoughtfortheday7811

4 жыл бұрын

@@michaeldriggers7681 I'd forgotten all about the details. Thanks for the refresh.

@michaeldriggers7681

4 жыл бұрын

@@thoughtfortheday7811 of course! I will say it was a moment of growth for Garak because I think for the first time in Garak's life he was conflicted about it.

A video about Garak in 2020 ? There is still hope for mankind.

Loved Garak, lost count how many times Sisko said “Mr Garak is right”

For my Latinum, he was the best written character of 90s Trek

@magnusprime962

2 жыл бұрын

So he’s the best written character in Trek then.

@brandonclark435

2 жыл бұрын

@@magnusprime962 He was.

@bennruda11

Ай бұрын

Til they killed his sexual scenes n moments with bashir

I love Garek: he's a Machiavellian sphynx wrapped in an enigma. His thoughts and motives are to him what physical shapeshifting is to Odo.

@richardjames5147

Жыл бұрын

Brilliant description.

I never saw him as a villain, I always saw him as a troubled person who is struggling with Good and evil, he was taught one thing his entire life but now it is surrounded by people who would do the opposite. Yeah sure sometimes he was a little mischievious, and played both sides, but deep down I don't think he wanted either Cardassia or the federation to "win" or "loose". I just think he wanted someone who was a good person to change the future so nobody would have to go through the struggles he did, that he just wanted a better future for Cardassia.

@azeez8399

3 жыл бұрын

💯%

@recoil53

Жыл бұрын

He's confirmed to have tortured. He'll do multiple murders as steps in a plan. He is an anti-villain. He achieves "good" goals with bad methods.

@themonsterunderyourbed9408

5 ай бұрын

Project much?

His exile is real. Even exiled, Garak cared for Cardasia above all.

@bluehavencd

2 жыл бұрын

Cardassia never turned his back on him, it was the self serving assholes and abusers of power that did.

At the end I felt he was closer to a patriot and freedom fighter for cardassia. He was truly distraught about having to kill his country men while decoding the messages

Among a cast of idealists and in a world of optimism Garak is a breath of reality and pragmatism. That is something that a audience can relate to.

Garak would be pleased to see that the audience is so split on the issue of him being good or bad. That and his eloquent charm are what make him such a beloved DS9 character.

By FAR my favourite character in Star Trek

@LoreReloaded

4 жыл бұрын

Hes an exceptional well written and acted character

@dmgill83

4 жыл бұрын

Same.

@Corbomite_Meatballs

4 жыл бұрын

@@LoreReloaded You can tell this if you watch the DS9 documentary...Andrew Robinson *is* Garak; the makeup & wardrobe just helps sell the character that much more.

@yobogoya4367

4 жыл бұрын

Andrew Robinson is a criminally underused actor. Garak and DS9 remain my favorites of all of Star Trek to this day. By far the most compelling character in all of Space Sci-Fi.

@fumarc4501

4 жыл бұрын

Right after Quark.

"There is no accurate account of why Garak was exiled..." Sorry, but this is just plain wrong. He literally confessed to Sisko to being a tax dodger.

@deceptiwave2936

3 жыл бұрын

There are so, so many accounts of why Garak was exiled, tax dodging being just one of them. Garak suggested they are all partly true yet all false at the same time.

@bigolboomerbelly4348

3 жыл бұрын

@@deceptiwave2936 once he confessed all teary eyed that his crime was mercy, he allowed some slaves to escape. absolutely unforgivable to cardassians.

@MrRocketbum

2 жыл бұрын

Read between the lines. He did not destroy a shuttle full of members of the civilian Detapa council, who were on a fact finding mission to Bajor. By allowing them to return unharmed, despite his orders from Enabran Tain, they returned and said the occupation of Bajor is no longer in Cardassia’s interest. The Detapa council then voted to withdraw, which infuriated the Central Command, and basically ruined Tain’s career as head of the Obsidian order. Before he retired, he exiled Garak on the pain of death. Had he destroyed the shuttle, and attributed it to the Bajoran resistance, the occupation probably would have gone on forever, until Bajor was fully integrated into the Cardassian Union. However, his patriotism meant he could not knowingly kill members of the civilian government of Cardassia, which also made him a traitor.

@Danilium

2 жыл бұрын

@@MrRocketbum and also killing Ghemor's daughter in the same mission

@rowlandbuck2703

2 жыл бұрын

I thought it was because he let a group of bajoran children go instead of interrogating them because he was tired and hungry. Not sure of the episode, but that’s what Garak said in a meltdown.

I think the chat between Quark and Garak over rootbeer says a lot about both Garak and Quark.

@ouknow1446

Күн бұрын

Said a lot about The Federation.

Garak was exiled by Tain (I think it was Tain anyway) because Tain knew that Garak was a patriot and living with dishonor would be worse than death. Or perhaps that was just Tain justifying his inability to order his son's execution. As for the stories, here's my interpretation. I believe Garak's objective in that situation was to get Bashir to let him die (maybe even mercy kill him). So at first, he tells the story of, "I did something bad. See how awful I am?". When this fails to move Bashir, he changes the story to, "I did something good, *and regretted it* See how bad I am?" When *that* fails, he changes the story again to say, "I tried to do something bad and only failed because I was beaten to the punch. I'm getting what I deserve." But you can also see some of the truth behind these stories. He did a lot of bad things during the occupation. He also let certain things slide with the Bajorans and felt guilty about it, ultimately resulting in him betraying his own ideals and getting *himself* in trouble over it. In particular it's worth noting, that in the final story he essentially *frames himself* which seems to be backed up by his later comment to Tain. "I never betrayed you!" followed by Tain's skeptical look. He then immediately pivots to, "At least not in my heart" I think it's safe to say that whatever Garak was exiled for, he didn't actually *do* but he put himself into the position where he looked *really guilty* and there was no way to prove his innocence.

@Skull1Hunter

4 жыл бұрын

It that last point is true, it doesn't help that according to Cardassian justice, basically, if you're accused of being guilty of something, you are guilty. There's no defense. No counter argument.

@michaelspence2508

4 жыл бұрын

@@Skull1Hunter that makes me wonder if the Bajoran accusations against the Cardassians were harder to dismiss for them than we thought. Sure, in Cardassian criminal justice, if someone is politically connected more so than their accuser, than they'll get away with it but Cardassians might still believe every accusation. I wonder to what degree that applies to the Occupation.

@michaelspence2508

3 жыл бұрын

@Amber Hoke Yeah maybe. But people are complicated. And we know not every Cardassian was okay with the Occupation. Hell not even every Cardassian on Bajor at the time was all gung-ho about it. Just look at Aamin Marritza.

While we are talking about Garak, how about a tip of the hat to Andrew Robinson's daughter Rachel? She played Melanie, the young woman who goes to see Old Jake in The Visitor. That was a great episode and had one of the best ending scenes of any episode. If it were up to me, Tony Todd wins a Nebula (I think that's the one) for his incredible performance as Old Jake. Last lines: Jake: "Are you ok, dad?" Sisko: "I am now,"

@riftvallance2087

4 жыл бұрын

Old man Jake was cool but I much preferred Tony Todd as Worfs brother, really wish his character stuck around longer.

@doomi8210

3 жыл бұрын

He does stick around longer during the video game "star trek online" Reclaims his role as general Rodek and terrorizes the living shit out of the tzenkethi

I think this George Orwell quote sums up Garak "People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Garak is one of those necessary evils that all countries depend on whether or not they admit it or not. They do the dirtiest jobs their countries need whether moral or not. If it has to be done so that Cardassia comes out ahead then he will do it even if it costs him his soul. Garak is the darker side of ALL civilizations personified. Be they Tal Shiar, Section 31, The CIA, KGB, whatever intel agency the Dominion might have. You name it. With stakes that high you sometimes need men that can do what must be done. Garak is that man.

@DeathScepter

4 жыл бұрын

that is why he is my hero.

@CalebS1330

4 жыл бұрын

The Founders probably did most of their own intel work considering how perfectly adapted to it they are.

@necrofuryan5899

3 жыл бұрын

Was that Orwell? Sounds more like something Heinlein would say.

@purplefood1

Жыл бұрын

The problem with the idea of a sineater is they often start to see every problem as only solvable through their means or worse they develop their own agenda. I don't mean to say Section 31 was not something that's necessary but they did often seem rather eager to further their own particular agenda than the security of the Federation much like the Tal Shiar and the Obsidian Order.

Great character and brilliantly portrayed by Andrew Robinson. He did what needed to be done. Never saw him as evil at all. He was one of the most intelligent and cunning characters on that show, kudos to the writers who made this character.

For a moment I thought that another DS9 actor had died.

@LoreReloaded

4 жыл бұрын

Haha i thought of that too.. last two analysis had been done in honor havent they?

@vic5015

4 жыл бұрын

@@LoreReloaded Odo and Nog? Aron *did* play Nog, right?

@Ozzy_2014

4 жыл бұрын

@@vic5015 yes

@vic5015

4 жыл бұрын

@@Ozzy_2014 R.I.P.

@medexamtoolsdotcom

4 жыл бұрын

They're going to start dropping like flies pretty soon. A lot of them are pushing 80 now. Alas the sands of time. If you really want to see something depressing, look up the cast of Babylon 5 and see how many of THEM are dead. G'Kar is dead, Dr. Franklin is dead, not Londo but Vir is dead (who would have expected Londo to outlive him), Zathrus is dead, Captain Sheridan is dead, so many of the extras are dead.

I think the reason he's so beloved is because he's a redemption story and that is so Roddenberry. He's like Kodos if his arc was extended to 7 seasons rather than a single episode.

@djackson4657

4 жыл бұрын

Ian Warner DS9 is Berman not Roddenberry

@DarthAzabrush

4 жыл бұрын

@@djackson4657 Yes but redemption arcs are very much in keeping with Roddenberry's style is what I'm saying

@overgrownkudzu

3 жыл бұрын

he didn't really, though. he wanted to free cardassia, in order to do that he had to fight it and the dominion, the federation was trying that at the time so he helped them. but he did it for cardassia, nothing else

@DarthAzabrush

3 жыл бұрын

@@overgrownkudzu And doing the right thing for the wrong reason is another Roddenberry cliché in both heroes and villains.

@Qba86

2 жыл бұрын

@@djackson4657 Fortunately Berman was mostly focused on Voyager since 1995, leaving DS9 largely to Ira Behr. Don't get me wrong, he still meddled on some occasions (resulting with, among others, Terry Farrell leaving the show).

Villain or hero... it is only matter of point of view

@northerntoe

4 жыл бұрын

Vítězslav Zpěvak Laughs in Dukat

@scaper8

4 жыл бұрын

From my point of view the Jedi are…. Wait. Shit, wrong franchise. Nevermind. Carry on.

@medexamtoolsdotcom

4 жыл бұрын

That's not entirely true. I'd say it would be hard to call him a villain. Even among the Bajorans. See there is a distinguishing characteristic between good and evil, and that is, I don't know if it is possible to be evil if one's actions are all of the following A: done selflessly and for the greater good and B: not made under cultlike delusions about what constitutes the greater good, and C: not needless in causing suffering. If A, B and C are satisfied, it can't be evil. So for instance the 9/11 hijackers may pass A but fail B hard, while the nazis pass A but fail C hard and fail B somewhat.

He is loved because we can can relate to him because he's deeply broken like most of us. He is as deep as an ocean whereas a lot of star trek characters as puddles.

I actually really love the idea that Garak started as just being on the station to keep tabs on things. And then over time began to change, maybe in ways so subtle even he didn't notice, thanks to exposure to Starfleet and the Federation. That is sort of a running theme at times throughout Star Trek. He ended up drinking the Kool-Aid. Or...the Root Beer, as the case may be.

I got the impression, and would like to believe, that Garak slowly changed after living on Deep Space 9. That he grew fond of the people there and of the Federation over time. I am of the opinion that he did not see the Federation as a threat to him, and as stated quite the opposite he had found refuge and protection with them, and this is very important, it did not want anything of him, it allowed him to be. But it was more than that, I think he felt safe, or safer, there, and that in a strange way some of the Crew of Deep Space 9 became family in a away. But that's not to say that he did not see that ultimately his wellbeing was best preserved by helping the Federation, even though that was great risk, a risk he really did not have to take and could have avoided by leaving or refraining from helping the Federation. He is a complicated, flawed, and mysterious character and that is why we are fascinated by him.

@thesilvershining

3 жыл бұрын

He did change, but I love that it was more than just giving up being a killer spy. He’d always had the typical misplaced Cardassian pride + superiority complex, often showing thinly veiled confusion and even malice to anyone that really challenged those beliefs. He took personal offense to any prejudice or open resentment of Cardassians, like Amaro and to a lesser extent O’Brien in the “Empok Nor” episode. O’Brien has good reasons to resent Cardassians, but still wouldn’t kill Garak in cold blood even when given the chance, even after he and Nog were actively pursued. Garak saw Cardassia through rose colored glasses; he focused only on the beauty of the planet he was forever banned from and the vast intellectual aspects of their society-the music, literature, and the brilliant Cardassian minds, while glossing over the messier, problematic, violent, less appealing parts of Cardassian history. Then came the Dominion war aftermath and, to his horror, he realized he couldn’t do that anymore. He couldn’t justify anything. The glasses were gone. As whole cities lay decimated and the body counts came in, he finally admitted Cardassia’s arrogant aggression was damning. They were paying for their sins and at the mercy of a galaxy who (rightfully) hated them. Getting the Dominion off Cardassia had depended on the compassion of the Federation, who he’d always thought weaker, lesser, and openly mocked. That look of horror in his final scene after his bitter admission of guilt is hauntingly poetic, Andrew Robinson nailed it perfectly. Garak’s difficult epiphany would have never happened if he were never exiled. His time on DS9 had its ups and downs, but his relationships there were necessary for his growth and atonement arc post-exile. I really like Garak’s whole arc and I’m glad they didn’t sugarcoat him with a happily ever after or make him another lazy case of redemption-in-death. It’s much more satisfying (for me, anyway) to watch a complex character change and then commit to that change and do the hard work to continue learning to be better.

@beefsuprem0241

3 жыл бұрын

It's the root beer that turned him😉

@travisfoster1071

Жыл бұрын

​@@beefsuprem0241 "It's insidious "...

I remember when DS9 began, Garak only appeared briefly in one episode in the first season, but I waited with baited breath for him to appear again. He just lept off of the screen.

Why, oh why didn't Garak and Sloan have an entire episode or two-parter having a game of cat and cat? I can only imagine the brilliant banter between the two.

@mel-burnes

Жыл бұрын

because the writers tried to distance garak from bashir's storylines (cos the actors queered them up and the writers disliked that)

@DANRYX

Жыл бұрын

@@mel-burnes the writers are the one's who hinted at it with their very first lines of dialog between the two. Not Bashir's dialog, but definitely Garak's. The actor who played Garak wanted the script to continue that vibe but far more openly and have Bashir reciprocate when the whole humorous point of their first encounter dealt with how uncomfortable Bashir was when Garak made his advance on him and placed his hands on his shoulder after inviting him to "Stop by his shop". The writer's chose wisely to not pursuit his request and slowly leaned away from Garak's original flamboyant persona. You are partially correct not many people know of this situation behind the scenes and you nearly nailed it.

@mel-burnes

Жыл бұрын

@@DANRYX but i don't believe the writers were in on this and the undertones of attraction are purely the actors choice/improvisation? andy robinson had said in many interviews that playing that angle was his decision with the writers being none the wiser

@DANRYX

Жыл бұрын

@@mel-burnes Andy Robinson did carry it out as often as he could and claimed the writer's didnt know which would make sense. The specific scene I was referring to is where Garak invited him to his shop while making it very clear that it had nothing to do with sizing him up for new clothing and he seductively put his hands on Bashir before parting ways. Now if this was the writer's choice with the sole intent to have Garak do this on purpose as only a psychological game (given his characters shadowy past, I find this possibility more feasible and humurous) and nothing more, its possible and when Andy Robinson wanted this to be his actual orientation, they had no intent to carry this out as a real thing. It is very difficult to confirm it either way for it is his words alone in the documentary, and what we can derive from watching the series. It does appear that this vibe of "sexual tension" was dropped almost entirely after his first appearance.

Besides Rom, Garak is my favourite character. He was the best written character in the entire series, he makes a better section 31 agent than any of the section 31 arcs in trek. Garak totally looks both ways at the same time, I think he does care to degree but knows he has to do very dark things to get the best outcome.

I always saw Garak as an example of what happens to a monster when forced to meet his inner demons. He very purposeful avoidance of the Tears of the Prophets is subtle and I'm wondering if an Orb experience might have shaken him to his core. An Orb experience would also make him a more acceptable Cardassian to the Bajoran Priesthood, like Kai Opaka. Opaka was very selective as to who was allowed to be in the presence of an Orb and was just as quiet to everyone except the person that had that experience. I can see the Prophets tell her that he was necessary for the future of Bajor and Cardassia.

Fun fact, Andrew Robinson (Garak's actor) is actually claustrophobic in real life. So when you see his claustrophobia on screen, it's actually real.

Garak is one of the best written characters in fiction, period.

Ah, Elim Garak.

@Mark-xh8md

4 жыл бұрын

"The immoral monster everybody adores" - Enough about Benjamin Sisko now

@Corbomite_Meatballs

4 жыл бұрын

Depends on where you meet someone like him in RL - "rough men stand ready" and all that, what what.

@Dominik189

4 жыл бұрын

@@Corbomite_Meatballs nah, trust me. You don't meet guys like Elim in the military, and you REALLY don't want to meet them, there especially. Generally if you meet someone like that in the military you're either on the other side of an interrogation table, or you're dealing with fucking off the books shit that makes your stomach churn just at the thought.

@Mark-xh8md

4 жыл бұрын

We seem to be forgetting that Garak pretty much saved the Alpha Quadrant by killing that Romulan senator

@riftvallance2087

4 жыл бұрын

@@Mark-xh8md Ya sisko is pretty crazy. Not really that much different then garak when you think about it. He just pays lip service to the federation brass about ideals and rules and compassion and then goes and just does what ever he wants consequences be damned.

Garak is a critical analysis of Star Trek and the complexity of human (Cardassian) nature. He is for Star Trek what Kreia is for Star Wars.

@Bluesonofman

4 жыл бұрын

The Force must die

@thechosenone8808

4 жыл бұрын

based KOTOR player

Garak also is the main actor in all Star Trek episodes: In the pale Moonlight. Not only great but fantastic.

Serving as a gardener on Romulas...that's dedication!

His father knew his son Garak would excel, as he would also teach him personally. However he shut him in a dark cupboard to foster a fear of confined dark spaces, so if ever he turned against him he had a method to break his grown, trained son, thus he had a ingrained weapon.

Garak is not a good man or is a bad man, he is a man who has the stomach to do what needs to be done.

@DeathScepter

4 жыл бұрын

well he is an anti hero because he is willing to get his hands dirty and still cares for his people.

He is one of my favorite character. I strive to channel his persona in my classroom.

Garak and Gul Ducat are two INCREDIBLE characters gifted to us via Ronald D Moore and DS9

I feel that Gareck's half lies and deception of himself was his way of protecting those around him whome he cared about.

One of the reasons ds9 was soooo dam special

One thing that you might wish to factor into your theory about Garak's time on the station as a tailor being a charade is that intelligence communities are loathe to throw assets away. Even if Garak were "on the outs" as you say, there is still the chance that he might one day be useful again - even as a disposable patsy - in exchange for the promise of being allowed back in the fold, which did actually come to pass when Tain welcomed him back. So long as Garak was not actively harming Cardassia's interests, it's reasonable to believe the Obsidian Order was content to leave him inactive, particularly given his presence on DS9. Garak knew this, and so he kept his nose (largely) clean.

The thing with Garak is that his character is frankly honest to his job. He doubtlessly really did work as a gardener... because the cover story needs to _not_ be a lie, it really does need to be the truth. His status as an operative dictated that the job needed to have traits that a gardener was a good fit for, but Garak would ultimately have been a gardener because being a gardener _fit Garak,_ and that was the greatest reason _why_ it fit the needs of the Obsidian Order. Garak became a tailor _because_ it fit both _him, and_ whatever other purposes he was conforming himself to. And he was the Obsidian Order's choice to spy on Deep Space 9... because the exile wasn't false at all, he really was exiled, in need of protection from the Cardassians, because he really had roused their ire. And the Obsidian Order knew that, just as they knew that he was loyal to the Cardassian people. So they gave a suggestion, being very clear in their subtextual manner that it was so he'd be in a position to send them info that _he_ thought they needed... and otherwise didn't seek any special ties. Because Garak was Garak, and thus eould act like himself. A little push, with a simplistic reasoning behind it, and the _acceptance_ that it might _never_ bear fruit, and everything was done that they needed to do. Because at the end of the day, Garak was driven by his loyalties, even when they pushed him to consider _himself_ a villain, and both Garak and the Obsidian Order knew that the Order gave him whatever suggestion that they gave him _just_ because of that. He honestly probably wasn't counted by the Obsidian Order as one of their members by that point, just as a possible informant. It's the same logic that underpinned the early staffing of the CIA.

Garak was the inspiration for Burn Notice.

You published the biography of my favorite character on my birthday- that deserves a like, comment and subscribe!

I would love it if he somehow showed up in Picard. It would be hilarious if Picard just unknowingly walks past him and Julian sitting at a table in some bar still debating lol

@RobertSela

3 жыл бұрын

Please no. Picard is not Star Trek and doesnt need to ruin any more characters than it already did.

@overgrownkudzu

3 жыл бұрын

honestly, no. they already have Riker, Troi, Seven, Data, and of course Picard. Unless they really just have him sit somewhere observing and grinning in the background, i don't want them to "fix" him.

Oh hell, you scared the hell out of me. I thought Andrew Robinson died. DON'T DO THIS TO ME!!!

Garak is one of my absolutely favorite characters and wish we had more episodes with him

I can see the pain to pleasure rewiring totally backfiring. "Tell me what I want to know, or I will stop hurting you."

I always seen Garak as one of those "Ends justifies the means, no matter how horrible the means" kind of characters. I think Garak always made it clear that at his core he knew right from wrong, it's just that his morality was flexible enough to be able to do a lot of wrong for what he perceived to be the greater good. Of course his perception of the greater good also evolved as he evolved as a person. He was deeply shaped by his environment and considering his upbringing and choice of profession it was a miracle he didn't end up being a vicious psychopath.

Garak was the most REAL to me of the characters and the actor made him beloved.

I think all three stories are true, but Garak never actually fell out of favor with the Obsidian Order. They were just sins he'd had to bear, and this 'exile' was part of a deeper spy program to watch the end of the Bajoran occupation. Cardassia held many worlds, with many races, Bajor was just the one a select branch cared about as a former colony, like Britain post-colonial age. Garak's been one of their deepest agents, send under the guise of exile. The Level Black stuff he used to talk out of the blockade in the third season isn't just an old code, it's his real designation, for the Obsidian Order agent he is. And when the Dominion started growing into Alpha Quadrant affairs after the Order was defeated in the Gamma Quadrant, he took the side he took to liberate Cardassia and rebuild the order back into the shadows, keeping in contact with the scattered players, ready to rebuild the agency in secret again. All for Cardassia, whatever the cost. Edit: and of course he basically says that when I continue the video. I gotta stop making comments halfway through.

As the antithesis of everything Roddenberry believed, that was why he was so refreshing.

The fact that Garak broke while torturing Odo implies to me that he genuinely had some sort of conventional moral compass. I think that he is every bit the monster he is implied to be, with the exception of torturing people he knows for a fact are innocent. This allows him to be a true Cardassian patriot who believes in the righteousness of what he does, but also to believe that it’s wrong to brutalise people who don’t deserve it. He believed that true enemies of Cardassia deserved what he dealt them, but he couldn’t just accept that tormenting obviously innocent people who had done nothing to Cardassia was acceptable.

Well I have been rewatching Burn Notice lately and I think Garak and Michel Westen's situations are somewhat similar. "When you're burned you have nothing, no cash or job history and you're stuck in whatever city they decide to dump you in." Garak's exile might have been part of someone's spy game but was smashed to pieces by such events as the Dominion War or even the Federation Cardasain boarder war.

@Justin_WithThreeDots

4 жыл бұрын

you have good taste in tv shows

I first of all want to say thank you very much for this posting and commentary on one of the most interesting characters in Star Trek current and past history. From what I've watched over the years, Mr Garak has distinct qualities that defined him throughout the series. He does have a personal code of ethics despite his training and nature. He doesn't do anything without weighing both sides of the coin. He's seen both the beauty and ugliness of his people policies. He is a patriot at heart for his homeland. His exile and time on the station expanded his perspective on other races, despite his cynical views. I do recommend the Star Trek novel A Stitch in Time written by Andrew Robinson himself who played the character so brilliantly. Once red you have a definitely a greater understanding of his beginnings and his possible future.

Ah Elim Garak, the antithesis of Roddenberry’s vision and my favorite character in all Star Trek!

Garak is probably my favorite character from DS9. He's so fucking quotable, he's also an insanely deep character that explores what people will do for loyalty.

Garak is NOT a psychopath. A narcissist/psychopath only cares for themselves. While Garak does operate with Machiavellian disregard for life on numerous occasions, he was willing to sacrifice himself to destroy the founders homeworld and end the dominion war. This is a selfless act of an extreme patriot and moral utilitarian. Starfleet is overflowing with Kantian ethics. Garak highlights the systems weaknesses, and his contrast to it makes him seem evil; but if worf hadn't stopped him, far more lives would've been saved. Speaking of Worf, remember when he saved his wife and let an important mission in the war fail? There's an argument to be made that Garak is a more moral person than Worf.

I think Garak was told he wouldn't be killed if he stayed on the station. It was a punishment to stay among people who hate him, but also the Obsidian Order knew he would continue gathering information which he would want to trade to end his banishment. This made him basically a free operative.

Garak single handedly saved the Alpha Quadrant.

If you want to know more of the backstory might I suggest the novel: 'A Stitch In Time?' It was written by Andrew Robinson and provides a lot of detail about Garak's early years.

@SoulsJourney

4 жыл бұрын

I've just started reading that. He totally captured Garak's voice in it. Wonderful.

@frankberry9642

4 жыл бұрын

@@SoulsJourney He hooked me with the phrase: it's the dust." I felt I heard Robinson say it aloud.

@Jeremias1111

4 жыл бұрын

I'd love to have it as an audiobook read by Andrew Robinson.

@frankberry9642

4 жыл бұрын

@@Jeremias1111 That would be cool.

@SoulsJourney

4 жыл бұрын

@@Jeremias1111 That would be awesome!

Garak was likely the most complex character in DS9 or at least the most mysterious but one thing is for certain, the actor who played the character gave a great performance that far out classes many performances in today's TV shows.

Basically I like to look to the scene between Garak and Quark when Quark is describing the Federation with Root beer.Which leads me to the thought that Garak, Quark and, several others actually became assimilated by the Federation into basically becoming more....well....Human or rather humain.

My favorite Trek character. Has problems but is there to help, what you could say would become his friends and family, survive and do what needed to be done.

It‘s a shame to my mind, that Garak and Sloan never had some sort of stand off. Maybe with both of them revealing things about the other. Section 31 must have known more about Garak. If he was a hazard, they would at least have tipped off starfleet intelligence one way or another. Also, Garak would have been a formidable adversary for Sloan, assisting in interrogation or capture.

@firebirdone03

4 жыл бұрын

Funny how they both had interest in Bashir

@oneproudbrowncoat

Жыл бұрын

Thing is, it wouldn't be much of a standoff. Neither would commit to any action unless the outcome was a certainty; neither would reveal anything to the other. "Doctor, ignoring your Cardassian friend puts him on notice that we consider him a threat. He knows full well that we couldn't fail to notice him, and denying him any direct contact shows that we're not going to reveal anything to him. He knows that, too." "Ah, my dear Doctor, surely you understand that if I make any inquiries or even attempt any observations, then Section 31 will of course be aware of it. Since you can usually understand someone's intentions and motives from what they want to know, it gives them nothing to work with, if I don't ask any questions of anyone. The man with no questions is to be feared, Doctor... Because you can't ever be sure of how much he really knows."

Is Garak a "villain"? Garak is an example of a ~basically~ good person that is born into a ~basically~ evil society. It took a while to be molded properly, and were he not the son of a powerful Cardassian official he would not have been successful, but he managed to get by, most of the time - until he was told to do something that was completely evil, for basically no purpose: interrogate and kill children that he knew had no information. He may have even been put up to it by Taine to prove his loyalty - to show that he wouldn't let his weakness get in the way of his work - and however it happened, he failed, and so was exiled, most importantly for failing Taine. His exile at the start of DS9 may be, in a sense, "probation" - Taine using his influence to keep him from being killed, there's nothing more important to a Cardassian than family after all, and when Garak proves that he can do what he needs to, maybe he can someday be welcomed back. However, the longer he stays on DS9 around the Federation, the more he begins to see that they're more like he would prefer his homeworld to be - Garak loves Cardassia, and would never defect, but seeing how readily his "friends" are willing to trust him despite knowing about his past seems to make an impact. Garak is indeed capable of many "evil" acts - no one who has lived in the kind of society Cardassia was for all of their lives and worked within its black heart, the Obsidian Order, to preserve its way of life, would be able to get by without being able to doing many dark deeds. But a villain? I think that's a bit far.

Garak after after attending a Bajoran conference " less posturing and more debate"..even more relevant now than ever ,what amazing writing and characters.

I don't think I can ever say why, but Garak is among the best done characters I've ever seen. It doesn't matter that he's the anti of Roddenberry. He's a Cardassian, not a human, and Roddenberry's vision is more keyed toward humanity within the show. (Where's Generation Tech/films and their "Humanity First" when we need them?) All the aspect, all of his quirks, it's all just expertly done. They manage to make him sympathetic, yet not really trust worth. What's the old axiom? "Trust, but verify." Fits Garak to a tee.

He was by far my favorite person in DS9, I would love to see him get his own show or be in the next Star Trek tv show.

He was the most realistic character in all of Trek. I think identify with him the most.

@johnwinters2815

4 жыл бұрын

I personally think that Deep Space 9 as a whole is the most realistic of all the shows in the franchise.

Love the way he takes it as a compliment when people don't trust him.

As far as the torture goes, I don’t think Garack enjoyed it or was indifferent about it. He had to torture Odo and he plainly upset about it.

Cardassians are like onions. He's such a great character because he is complex and perhaps hyper-pragmatic. I would agree with the assertion that Garak is the antithesis of Roddenberry's vision, but his vision was very simple to the point of boring.

Garrak deserved more focus. One of the best characters in all of trek.

"Enebran, all I ask is that for this moment...let me be your son."

Garak is my absolute favorite character in all of trek. Yes he did bad things but he is multifaceted. So many layers and I still can’t believe he was only in 35 episodes!

I'm just a humble tailor, not some Cardassian anti-hero.

Lore reloaded "I'm not sure if garak was ever good at heart or did he just pretend everything" There's hope for you yet Lore

I think he was genuinely exiled for whatever reason and was still an asset of the order. His father seemed genuinely angry with him but still loved him. Garak is my favorite character because he's more believable than all of the goody goody federation and slapstick of the feringi. Same goes for most of the cardassians. They are all more human than the actual humans.

It's amazing how characters like Garak, Dukat, heck, even Boba Fett, all became something different from what the creators/writers intended & far more complex, due to the love of the fans! That's the true power of the fandom!

I think there is at least some "soft spot" in Garak. After all we know that there was at least one person that he was sincerely willing to risk his life for... Enabran Tain. Terrible as both Enabran and Garak might be, they had at least some sentiment for each other, but existed in a world where that was a real weakness and had to be kept in check.

Gene roddenberries starfleet and the federation have very much forgotten the lessons they learned getting them to where they are which makes them Holier then though in many occasions Always believe that they have the moral high ground Downright arrogant They learn slowly from mistakes because “the federation and myself by extension dont make mistakes” Garrick is a man born and bred to be evil but through great effort fights for the right cause because no matter how low he went he still loved his people regardless of their flaws and in many ways that love was more pure more right then many starfleet officers or citizens proffesssing their love for the federation.

@overgrownkudzu

3 жыл бұрын

that's honestly why i would never want to be a part of starfleet. they spout grandiose stuff about being peaceful and good people and whatever, but really they aren't that much different in how they operate than the others. they aren't the aggressors usually, and they don't kill each other over petty bullshit like the klingons. but then they let people die for political reasons, section 31 arguably isn't better than the tal shiar or obsidian order, just better hidden, probably assassinate romulan government officials that are inconvenient and are generally a military organisation, which is weird considering how they're on "a mission of peace and exploration" usually. and apart from ds9 civilians usually aren't really even part of the story beyond annoying bystanders or plot devices. i think that's why i like DS9, the high and mighty starfleet officers have to deal with the actual reality of the lives of different people and not just decide over their fate, then leave and forget them again. They're not so perfect, in TNG everyone was perfect basically, except for Pulaski when she came and she was torn apart for it, and i get it, it's utopian, but it's just unrealistic.

Anybody who wants to know all about Garak's back story including the real reason he was exiled should read "A Stitch in Time". It was written by Andrew Robinson himself and is my all time favorite ST novel.

@NCC1701D

8 ай бұрын

They just released the audiobook and it's read by Andrew J Robinson himself, makes it infinitely better in my opinion.

Garrak may have also been falling to one of the greatest dangers facing long term undercover operatives. He was beginning to sympathize with those he was supposed to be spying on. Some of his more confusing actions seem to be those of a man acting on ever more conflicted loyalties, especially as the federation began treating him better than his own government

the Garak character helped make DS9 the Great show it is ⁉👍😆✴

A stich in time is a great book ☝️probably all 3 are TRUE

I think Garak was able to force himself to function in claustrophobic situations. He really reall really hates them but was able to muscle through them by sheer will.

Garak is a monster, because that's what his people needed him to be. If there is one thing that can be said, undoubtedly without question to be absolutely true about Garak, it is that he loves his homeworld and his people. He loves Cardassia more than his own life and would do absolutely anything to serve and protect it. If that means lying, manipulating, torturing and killing, he'll do it without a second thought, because it is what his people need him to be.

For me the truth of his story about what happened on bajor is the three stories. I think he did try and help the children but a high ranking officer had the children killed and Garak killed that officer. Truth in the lies so all three are true. Hope i wrote that right. Which may also explain why he was permitted stay with in bajor. Some high up resistance dude knew what really happened and lobbied in his defense to stay on d station.

if he wasnt a character someone came up with, i would say you just couldnt come up with a charakter like him.

He was pretty much my favorite character in all of Trek.

My take on Garak's three stories about his (possibly alleged) fall has been that they're slight bends on a 3-act play: - The "children" in the one story are the "terrorists" in the other two; a group of teens in the Bajoran resistance. - The "escape" was entirely his doing, done under his in such a way to make it look like he was being framed. - The "accidental killing" of the "VIP's daughter" was actually an assassination, using the resistance operatives he freed as a plausible cover.