If a casino refuses to pay legitimate winnings, the state should force them to pay double the winnings

@tarrantwolf

2 күн бұрын

Double? 10x. They'll stop if they have to pay out millions everytime they pull a stunt like this.

@countbenjamin1442

2 күн бұрын

As well as all legal fees and should have to put giant posters all around the casino saying " We tried to scam this person.". Bet they really quickly just pay out what they should

@Pokey-xp9gn

2 күн бұрын

At minimum

@beholdr87

2 күн бұрын

Treble damages - Certain statutes require that after the jury has determined the amount of the plaintiff's actual damages, the court must award three times that amount

@Chief_5

2 күн бұрын

They should have to pay 100 times the winnings, that’ll get them to stop cheating winners.

Had she lost 127K, I seriously doubt the casino would have given her the money back and said "oh, we can't take your money. You're trespassing."

@catberts6499

2 күн бұрын

Exactly, they should of not taken any money at the beginning, since they did, they have no case

@the_inquisitive_inquisitor

2 күн бұрын

​@@catberts6499 they're the _defendant_ though... She's the one who needs to bring the case

@frotoe9289

2 күн бұрын

Yeah... this. If you accept the wager, you should be on the hook for paying the win. Letting someone gamble and lose and only when they win big swooping in with the "haha" Simpsons response is not ok.

@StevenMRA

2 күн бұрын

You beat me to it - I was going to respond exactly the same thing.

@lamplighter5545

2 күн бұрын

She should sue them for all the money she lost over the years, since she shouldn't have been allowed to play at all.

$127,000 winnings, plus $1,000,000 compensation for stress and anxiety caused by MGM's attempts to fraudulently rip her off.. That would be a fair settlement.

@economath8164

12 сағат бұрын

Non-economic damages like stress and anxiety (i.e., no physical injury) are typically capped. No way in Michigan she gets more than $500k over the $127k she won.

@MrJeffcoley1

10 сағат бұрын

I believe the term is “estoppel.” Because the casino failed to enforce their ban against her for 8 years the ban is null and void. They can’t decide to let her slide for 8 years until she wins a big EDIT: I wrote this before Steve got to it. I’m pleased to remember the business law course I took 30 years ago

@uberfine

7 сағат бұрын

...in your opinion, and you are not involved. Are you planning on moving there in hopes of being selected as a juror on this case, should it go to court, so you can force your opinion on the victim? Com'on, David. You can do better.

@cobracommander9138

5 сағат бұрын

@@uberfine You just posted one of the dumbest comments I have read on here.

@VolguusZildrohar

3 сағат бұрын

​@@uberfine🤦‍♂️🤦‍♀️

I hope she is awarded $1M in punitive damages plus $127K.

@nighthawk0077

10 сағат бұрын

Most would be fine with that.

@DeusExAstra

5 сағат бұрын

I agree that there should be punitive damages. It's cases like this, where the offending party is clearly just doing this to screw over the other person, where you want to make it clear that if you do this, you will have serious consequences. If they just force them to pay the winning amount, there's basically not much incentive. Even if they have to pay legal fees... that's still worth it for these people to keep acting like this because a lot of victims wont have the means to take legal action and will just accept that they got screwed over.

8 years of implied consent from the casino seems like this lady is in the right.

@Subangelis

2 күн бұрын

Correct

@ohar7237

2 күн бұрын

The very, very slight reasoning I could see behind this claim is that if this was the very first time she'd ever produced an ID for the casino, it could *potentially* be reasonable that this was the first time she'd been flagged since the time she was ejected. And that's about all the benefit I can give the devil on that one. The obvious counter being "Did they ask for her ID when they ejected her?" Also, as Steve mentions, "Did they tell her she was BANNED FOREVER?" All in all, it's completely ridiculous. You'd think they'd not do this just to avoid the negative PR.

@adotintheshark4848

Күн бұрын

and all settlements voided!

@benwagner5089

Күн бұрын

@@ohar7237 I'd presume they'd have to check her ID when exchanging her money for chips upon arrival and then any small winnings she made at the end of the night.

@happygimly6061

Күн бұрын

Yes. I believe it's called estopple. When you waive a right you don't get it back just because it's convenient. The casino has a right to ban anyone from their premises for any reason for any length of time but they cannot say that because someone was banned 9 years ago, who was subsequently allowed on the property multiple times over a course of years they when it's convenient for them they can just assert that she was banned.

Well, if the casino took her money ... then that qualifies her to receive her winnings.

@Spawny500

2 күн бұрын

exactly!

@RipliWitani

2 күн бұрын

Or a refund

@AlWorth9738

2 күн бұрын

@@RipliWitani of every dollar she gave them since 2015

@SeanBZA

2 күн бұрын

@@RipliWitani Yes, they would, seeing as she has a casino loyalty card, know exactly when she visited, and exactly how much she spent. Almost no casino works on cash, they all work on cards now, because that means they know you will overspend, and the only thing with chips and tokens are the roulette tables, which are still holding out, though there is also being made digital. They know exactly how much she has spent since then, and also probably also have all the video of the intervening time as well stored on some sort of system "just in case". One casino about to lose their money, and a whole lot of reputation as well, which is the bigger hit, as the only thing they have to get people in is that they are not crooked, because it is rare to only have one casino in any area.

@catberts6499

2 күн бұрын

Yep, sounds like they grandfathered her back in, if they took her money, that's a nonverbal acceptance

If she’s trespassing, they should be required to return every cent she spent there in between.

@othertoken1349

9 сағат бұрын

And if she’s averaging as little as $250 per visit weekly for those 8 years, that’s $100,000 right off the bat.

If I was on the jury, I’d not only award her the $127k, but extensive punitive damages.

@B_Bodziak

5 сағат бұрын

This has to be big news and MGM is going to lose business because of this. I think the one highlight her attorney should stress is if she'd lost 127k, they wouldn't refuse her money.

@ImGettinWeird

4 сағат бұрын

​@@B_Bodziakthat's not a highlight. If you're not allowed in, but enter anyways and lose money, you did wrong and can't get a refund. But if you're still banned and go in anyways why would they pay you out on a jackpot ?

A dishonest Casino? My word! Who would have thought!

@MasterMalrubius

2 күн бұрын

I’m shocked! Shocked to find dishonesty in this casino!

@joewatts2940

2 күн бұрын

Dishonesty is the American way.

@JimmyJoeBob

2 күн бұрын

And in Detroit no less! A city know for honesty and integrity.

@AndSaveAsManyAsYouCan

2 күн бұрын

​@@joewatts2940Not just the American way. Many humans way, whether they want to admit it or not.

@jeffme6891

2 күн бұрын

That may be so in her jurisdiction; but if the GCB in Nevada tells a licensee to do something, and they don't..........they can (and most likely will) lose their multi million dollar valued gaming license!

The casino isn't going to want this to go to a jury. Juries HATE when someone gets cheated.

@SmallSpoonBrigade

2 күн бұрын

That sounds about right, plus I don't know how they explain somebody being allegedly permanently trespassed being allowed to gamble openly for years when they magically discover the ban right after winning a 6 figure jackpot. Just the failure of the casino to enforce their rights for so many years over a single incident where there isn't even anybody complaining right after she wins that kind of money is probably not something that jurors are going to be OK with.

@NickSteffen

2 күн бұрын

Since the casino is being sued they get to pick whether it’s decided by a jury or judge though. So they can just decide not to have a jury trial.

@RecoveryTurtle

2 күн бұрын

If you get one casino goer who dreams of hitting it big on that jury….Jackpot!

@jimmybutler1379

2 күн бұрын

THE RULING COULD COST THEM MUCH MORE !...

@Hierarchangel

2 күн бұрын

Yep. Put me on that jury and see what happens. The old lady is going to own that casino.

When casinos pull this kind of crap, they should lose their license and be forced to close their doors.

With a jury trial, this should be a slam-dunk. I hope she gets the $127K plus expenses plus a lot more.

@joannaa.5101

Күн бұрын

Pay her lawyers fees.

@henlohenlo689

13 сағат бұрын

in normal court? yes in tribal court? no. she probably wont get a fair trial.

@Ryn2890

8 сағат бұрын

This is an easy case either way it goes. You can find records of trespass orders. If MGM never trespassed her, she probably wins. If it turns out MGM did alert authorities and had her formally trespassed, well then the lady was trespassing. Easy case either way

Man, casinos will do ANYTHING to keep from paying winnings. Disgusting.

@SeanBZA

2 күн бұрын

They are happy to pay small winnings, on the bet that you will spend it again, and then more, at the casino immediately.

@Serai3

2 күн бұрын

@@SeanBZA I'll bet (pun intended) that if you take that money and leave immediately, and then do that every time, they'll ban you. "Winnings" are only allowed in order to take the money back.

@SeanBZA

2 күн бұрын

@@Serai3 Small amounts they do not care, so long as you win less than the average punter spend they will not worry at all.

@mflong100

2 күн бұрын

The Vegas Strip wasn’t built on people winning.

@peterfitzpatrick7032

2 күн бұрын

They're worse than insurance companies ! 🙄😂

Trespassing only after her money was gone and they owed her $127K.

@A_Bvgzi

Күн бұрын

Yup. Never gamble there again

@nancygodsey8312

Күн бұрын

She's right. It's b.s.

If they won’t give her her winnings, can they refund all her losses from the previous several years.

I work for a casino as a security officer. Panhandling is a 24-hour temporary trespass. then I usually a 30-day trespass, then a 90-day, then a permanent trespass. They do not go directly to permanent.

@cobracommander9138

5 сағат бұрын

All she has to do show that rule to the jury. Put a security guard on the stand and ask them how a panhandling trespass is applied. And even if it was a permanent ban the Casino revoked it when they kept letting her in and taking her money.

If Wal-Mart asset protection can pick out people that are trespassed on the cameras, the casino has no excuse.

@trumpetbob15

2 күн бұрын

Don''t casinos have the book of banned gamblers? They can figure those folks out so if they really felt she was a problem, she'd be in the book!

@AlWorth9738

2 күн бұрын

@@trumpetbob15 If you are a repeat guest, they know exactly who you are... your habits (how much you gamble, how much you spend on food or other things, how long your visit lasts, etc... they knew exactly who she was every time she visited since 2015.

@muddobber6863

2 күн бұрын

Casinos do it too for card counters.

@PandorasFolly

2 күн бұрын

Absolutely. My friend was a card counter and would win enough at black jack that he gradually got put on the black lists at casinos. He was put the list at one of the national chains. Years later that chain buys a local casino. He goes there about a month after the purchase and he is walked out within 20 minutes.

@TheresaHall-vl1bm

2 күн бұрын

Yeah if they believed she was trepass why didn't they do anything until she won. Walmart once thought they had one guy who turned out to be someone else in a trespassing case causing the idiot cop who took them at their word and didn't bother to look at ID before arresting the guy. Last I heard he was suing them over it

If they did not escort her out for trespassing when she was losing, they cannot say she is trespassing when she wins. And asking family members for money is NOT panhandling, no matter what a casino wants to say.

@liquidfiretibby

2 күн бұрын

Also panhandling is a 1st amendment protected activity

@TheBoogerJames

2 күн бұрын

​@@liquidfiretibby Casinos are private businesses. 1st Amendment doesn't apply.

@patrickbrinkmeier1858

2 күн бұрын

​@@TheBoogerJames...Absolutely right ... Asking other people for money in a casino is NOT protected under the Constitution. Also, all we have is her claim that it was her cousin she asked money from. I've seen people get arrested at my local casino for being there after they were trespassed of if they put themselves on the exclusion list.

@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine

2 күн бұрын

If you are told to leave, and don't, then you are trespassing. No escort required.

@nodak81

2 күн бұрын

@@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine Yeah, but she wasn't told to leave. Instead they took her money...

If they say she's was trespassing and refused to pay her after she's won, then they need to return all of her money that she's lost over the last 8 years because she was supposedly trespassing and they're not entitled to keep her money. So the logic can go both ways.

she would probably be also able to make the argument that even if she was tresspassed , the casino has waived their right to assert that tresspass after multiple faliures to enforce the tresspass

Legally speaking being asked to leave and being formally trespassed are drastically different things.

@gwcrispi

2 күн бұрын

This is the key. When you are "trespassed", police are called, forms are filled out, and you're escorted out.

@zazuch

2 күн бұрын

exactly what I was thinking. If she was truly trespassed there should be a police record of the official trespassed. We all know it wasnt an official one or a permeant one. They just saw she won and are trying any reason possible to not pay her.

@Brad90977

2 күн бұрын

Exactly. If she was not served a trespass notice and escorted off the property, she was not trespassing when she won the jackpot.

@NickSteffen

2 күн бұрын

Technically if you are in a location without the permission of the owner, you are trespassing, you don’t need all the formalities of having the police called. Just being told you are not allowed to return is enough. That said it really depends on whether she was told that by casino when she was kicked out. If they just told her to leave that’s not saying she doesn’t have permission to come back. it really depends on the casinos policies / agreements with its patrons and Michigan’s gambling laws after that point.

@zazuch

2 күн бұрын

@@NickSteffen no its quite literally not enough legally speaking. With exception or only if other laws have been broken cops wont arrest you for trespassing unless you have been formally warned prior. They will write a report, and tell you if you return you will then be arrested. Just telling someone to leave and not formally trespassing them you cant then have them arrested for trespassing if they show up again. Other wise it would be abused to just arrest anyone and get them charged with a crime. At least in the US which is where this happened so that is all that matters. There polices etc dont really matter to much. The fact they continued to take her money for years after shows she clearly wasnt still under a trespass warning any longer. They have no leg to stand on and just hoped she wouldnt sue when they denied her the winnings.

If my wife divorces me, she was actually trespassing and marriage should be annulled

@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine

2 күн бұрын

🙄She probably owns half of the house. Even if she doesn't, she is a legal tenant, and has the right to be there. If a divorce is granted, then there is an explicit acknowledgement that the marriage occurred, and an annulment is impossible. You can only get one or the other - not both.

@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine

2 күн бұрын

"One can’t receive a legal annulment for the same marriage if that marriage has already been terminated by divorce." - Ken Dunham, attorney

@gwenwilliams3673

2 күн бұрын

From the replies I think people don't realize you were kidding.

2 күн бұрын

​@@gwenwilliams3673Right! Lol

@mwduck

2 күн бұрын

@@ThereIsNoOtherHandleLikeMine Could a member of the Roman Catholic church not get a civil divorce and an annulment from the church relating to the same failed marriage?

Casinos, car insurance, life insurance, government, they all take your money and leave you screwed. 🤣

@maxsteel32

11 сағат бұрын

At least with the government you get some roads, parks, a court system, and military protection.

Trespass is forfeit even when declared permanent if afterward they persist in allowing the person to access the property.

If her bet was accepted, then she wasn't trespassing.

@diamondjim7560

2 күн бұрын

Sort of like an unwritten contractual agreement, right?

@heazilla

Күн бұрын

the two are unrelated. you expect the person taking bets to know if she had been trespassed? she admits to being trespassed.

@GRice999

Күн бұрын

@@heazilla If she had been using a players card, then they knew she was there and they were probably giving her comps (plus they were probably mailing her offers to play there). At best, one hand didn't know what the other hand was doing. But you're right. The two are unrelated. If they accepted her bet, they have to pay even if she was legally trespassing. The casino doesn't get to freeroll off a trespasser. Pay her and have her arrested if they must. But they have to pay.

The state needs to shut down these casinos who refuse to pay legitimate winnings.

@randyisaksson3301

2 күн бұрын

Its NOT really a legitimate WIN if you are illegally on their property though.

@NotYourBusiness-bp2qn

2 күн бұрын

@@randyisaksson3301 Yes it is. As soon as they took her money they waved any claim of trespassing.

@kwcbomb6969

2 күн бұрын

@@randyisaksson3301 Did they stop her from giving them money and tell her to leave? No, they took her money and only when they lost did they claim she was trespassing... What's to stop casinos from making this claim about everyone who wins?

@theyaden

2 күн бұрын

@@randyisaksson3301 When the claim that you are trespassed only comes up after you win it's rather suspicious especially when they are regulars for several years.

@glennwatson3313

2 күн бұрын

@@randyisaksson3301 Well then its not a legitimate loss when you lose.

Casinos use extensive automated security measures, including facial recognition. There is no possibility they can "remember" everyone who is caught cheating or violating rules and laws. They rely on automation. So, if she was "permanently" trespassed they would know. Obviously they are simply trying to deny the payout.

So for 9 years, while she was losing money, the casino didn't seem to mind her trespassing, now they have a problem.

Casinos have been known to not pay out jackpots to under-age gamblers. But “not notice” them as long as they’re losing.

@lq7777

2 күн бұрын

When I was underage once,I played the slots on a trip. No one said anything until I tried to cash out. Amazing, how they didn’t care when they were taking my money, but cared once it came time to give me money.

@Kurgosh1

2 күн бұрын

I'm totally shocked that gambling operations are run by scumbags. It's almost as surprising as finding authoritarian thugs in police uniforms.

@LuckyBaldwin777

2 күн бұрын

I was underage playing slots once and hit a jackpot just as the security guard came up to me. He asked for id and I told him I was underage. I took a big handful of quarters that came out of the machine and went to hand them to him. He told me "Go ahead and keep them just don't come back until you're 21.

@adotintheshark4848

Күн бұрын

in the case of under-age gamblers losing, they asked for it.

@user-zu5do6ri6r

Күн бұрын

It's not legally gambling if you cannot possibly win.

If she wasn't allowed to be there those 8 years then they should give her back all the money she lost over that time.

@davebigdog

2 күн бұрын

Exactly She will win this case though

@timdowney6721

2 күн бұрын

@@davebigdog Except it won’t get to trial for five years, minimum. And then collecting will take another five, minimum. People are corporate serfs who are deluded when thinking they’re free.

@randomstuff-qu7sh

Күн бұрын

If she was repeatedly trespassing there for 8 years, totally undetected, then what else is their security missing? It would make more sense to pay up than to functionally argue that their security is incompetent.

@sophocles1198

Күн бұрын

@@timdowney6721 I don't know how long it will take to get to trial. But once there is a judgment I think payment will be quick as casino does not want some lawyer seizing their assets. If casino wants to appeal judgment they will probably have to put up a bond.

It's a progressive jackpot which means it's a jackpot that has already been prepaid by people who lost a dollar on it previously. It's not even a loss for MGM. Horrible.

If she was banned permanently since 2015, then she deserves all the money back she lost there over the years.

8 years is implied consent to be there

@SmallSpoonBrigade

2 күн бұрын

8 years of letting her gamble probably represent some sort of forfeiture of their right to claim she's there without their permission. They seemed to figure it out pretty quickly when she won, they didn't ever run her license or check up on who she was for that many years? A good chunk of the population would have forgotten about that incident entirely over that many years.

@user-gz2gq2jq9z

Күн бұрын

She will definitely win the case but she will likely take 10 years to receive anything.

IF you were asked to leave ONE time, that's not a trespass according to the courts. There needs to be a documented trespass served to her to be valid. Also, even if that HAD happened (which it did not), the courts have ruled that the trespass is invalidated if the business then chooses to do commerce with the person. Just another excuse to steal from people.

@darleneeddy1136

Күн бұрын

Did she have a casino member comp card? If she did and was using it over the years, then she wasn't trespassing. Most casinos you have to replace or update the card yearly.

i hope the courts take this and screw the casino for more than 127k just to push the point to not screw around.

PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE let me be on the jury for that trial!!!

Why would anyone go to a casino knowing these stories?

2 күн бұрын

A hundred million Americans believe in the magical thinking of getting rich through lottery long-shots that have an expectation less than 0. Casinos seem more immediate.

@johnholmes2808

2 күн бұрын

It’s an addiction that is as bad as drugs and alcohol.

@dn88s

2 күн бұрын

Nothing in my post suggests that I consider the lottery as an alternative. Besides at least the lottery pays out.

@dn88s

2 күн бұрын

@@johnholmes2808 well no one gets addicted to a habit they don't start.

@terryjohnson3479

2 күн бұрын

I used to buy scratch off tickets to reward the teenage appointment setters in a phone room I managed. There were a few small winners and then a young man working to make money for college hit for 10K ( in 1981 dollars). He called his dad to come get the ticket to be safe and kept working. He did have a nice car when he left for college.

My argument is security was so quick to say she was a panhandler, they’d recognize her after 8 YEARS of coming back.

@bn880

2 күн бұрын

haha, exactly

@dewaynehowse231

Күн бұрын

​@bn880 And to further that point it was her cousin she panhandled from.

@jessicaolson490

Күн бұрын

Heck maybe they do this to as many people as possible, trespassing people for a day, (since she wasn't actually panhandling). Just so that it reduces the number of jackpots they have to pay out. 😂

If she did not sign a trespass paper, then they CANNOT prove she was trespassing.

"The MGM Grand. We don't pay!"

A long time ago on my 24th birthday, I stayed at a casino in Atlantic City. During the afternoon, I spent about 10 minutes at a slot machine and a security guard came out of seemingly nowhere and tapped me on the shoulder. He called me by my full name and said "happy birthday, and enjoy your stay," then handed me a pack of playing cards. I never had a player's card so there was no way the machine identified me. They absolutely know who is there and where they are at all times.

@curtisrutter4009

2 күн бұрын

China is supposed to have facial recognition software that is accurate at identifying people, even when they are wearing a mask.

@FoulNews

2 күн бұрын

@@curtisrutter4009 Yup, and that's all coming here. I've played around with an ESP32 AI Cam module and for a $10 device, it does facial recognition pretty well. The Casino cams are definitely significantly more advanced and would have no issue spotting anyone wherever they are.

@ShaggyRogers1

2 күн бұрын

There is a reason why they use scanners to check IDs at casinos. They 100% keep track of every single person that walks in the door, regardless if the person signs up for the loyalty card or not.

@TheCheshireMadcat

2 күн бұрын

@@ShaggyRogers1 Yeah, there is one near my sister that we go to when I visit. The machines don't take money anymore. You HAVE to get a card that you put into the machines. You have to give them valid ID, and go through a few things before you can play anything. They knew she was there, they were fine as long as she spent money.

@ThePhalanx2006

2 күн бұрын

They have dossiers on everyone who has ever walked through their doors

If the casino can take her losses, it’s only fair they pay her wins. She wasn’t stopped, didn’t enter covertly, and the integrity of the game isn’t in question. The casino has motive to passively allow known trespassers. Since they can take her money, while knowing they don’t have to pay if she wins.

@terryjohnson3479

2 күн бұрын

I recently had someone trespassed and the deputy filled out a written trespass warning so they had a record of it. He explained that most law enforcement won't arrest someone for trespsss unless the trespass had been documented. Even though there in no law backing the written warning it's how they confirm a trespass in court.

@TheresaHall-vl1bm

2 күн бұрын

​@@terryjohnson3479 indeed considering usually most businesses can't just deny entry to the public without reason

@jbmcb

2 күн бұрын

@@terryjohnson3479 This is a good point. Casinos are tightly regulated. If there is a provision saying they don't have to pay out to trespassers in the regulations, there *must* be paperwork of some kind. If she was never served with formal trespassing paperwork, then the casino doesn't have much of a leg to stand on, again, assuming they are allowed by regulation to deny payouts to tresspassers.

@loginregional

2 күн бұрын

@@terryjohnson3479 You should watch more 1a and 2a audits. Tresspass is a procedure. It must be declared and documented, it must be INFORMED and NOTICE given. If the eyes were crossed and the tees dotted, fine. If not, there is NO trespass FORMALLY and therefore just an order to get lost. Once they ALLOW her in, there is no more trespass.

@futurethinking

2 күн бұрын

@@loginregional Even if she was trespassed and she was issued the casino loyalty card or used the loyalty card and was not escorted out of the building, that nullifies the trespass. As Steve said, they cannot trespass her and take her money while she was losing and then refuse the pay. Either she was trespassed or not, if she was, they shouldn't have let her into casino again.

There’s a “player’s card”, a magnetic or chipped credit sized credit card used to play on machines and given when playing at a table. That card record proves all the times she was there.

I think the key thing here is going to be if there is a legal difference between "Please leave" and "Don't come back."

CRIMINAL FRAUD!!!!! Not only should they be forced to pay at least treble damages, they should be facing charges for criminal fraud!

@Rastaferrari829

21 сағат бұрын

Businesses hardly ever face criminal charges

@uberfine

7 сағат бұрын

@Rastaferrari829 your point? Are you implying/inferring she shouldn't go after justice anyway to hold them accountable? "Oh no! Some random keyboard warrior posting on YT said businesses hardly ever face criminal charges! I'll just go beat up grass then." smh

She was a customer as she paid and played for years without being told she is tresspassing.

The message they are sending is, "Don't gamble at this casino! "

Who'd be stupid enough to go to a casino?

Casinos will happily spend $400K in legal fees to avoid paying a $127K prize. Casinos should go into the insurance business.

@neils5539

2 күн бұрын

The attorney is already on the payroll, they're paying nothing extra for it.

@johnpublic6582

2 күн бұрын

Casinos should be banned. At best they are a parasite, in practice they are criminal organizations.

@arribaficationwineho32

2 күн бұрын

Pay the lady. It keeps hopes high

@NickSteffen

2 күн бұрын

Sure but if people stop coming because you have a reputation as a cheat then it will cost them millions. There are other casinos in Detroit after all. What if they start running ads about how they actually pay out their winnings unlike some of their competitors.

@danwells9525

2 күн бұрын

@@NickSteffen That's great marketing: "Come to Harrah's! We'll pay you when you win!"; "Wynn Resorts: More winnings, fewer lawsuits".

I would award her 10 times more than she is asking for .

@magapatriot2943

2 күн бұрын

8x for the 8 years they took her money !!!

@krishanpaul2

2 күн бұрын

@@magapatriot2943 i like that solution.

@rm19660

Күн бұрын

Realistically she should be awarded treble....3x

$127,000 actual damages + $500,000 punitive damages = Justice

That is Mafia-BS! Maybe the licence for the casino should be intensely reviewed... Pay the woman, gangsters!

If she had won anything in the time between the 2015 event and this the judge should just say 'well, you paid her for these smaller wins... pay her for this one'.

@logankrastel9609

2 күн бұрын

My thoughts exactly. Theres gotta be one point where she cashed out at leasr a coup[le bucks durjng thatt time

@catberts6499

2 күн бұрын

Precedent set!

@grimreaper4801

2 күн бұрын

most likely for small pay out. They don't ask for ID or personal information but for big pay out they need to check ID i am guessing

@markquintonii

2 күн бұрын

If she won anything over 1200 I would agree anything less than jackpot would not have required an id. Jackpots require two copies of identification. If she is a banned/ excluded player, the casino is going to have record of it. Cheating is not remotely the most common type of easy to get banned. Ticket stealing and self bans are the most reasons for a player to be banned.

@avi8r66

2 күн бұрын

@@markquintonii If a banned player, a card cheat of some kind, walks in they would have them identified and removed within a very few minutes. She was supposedly trespassed, so they have the tech to identify her, and block her from playing, but because she isn't winning often they let her play so they can take her money. This isn't about trespass, or ID, this is about them refusing to pay out.

Casinos have KYC. Know Your Customer. If she had a player card they CLEARLY knew who she was and that she was gaming.

@AlWorth9738

2 күн бұрын

And if a player doesn't have or use a card, they still know the TYPE of person they are - they know your habits: how much you gamble, the type of games you play, how long a visit usually last, other things you spend money on (such as restaurants, buffets, bars)... they "KNOW" everyone who comes back.

@CerebralAilment

2 күн бұрын

They card you through the door around here

@Jujubean9795

2 күн бұрын

In California, the casinos use face recognition software under the guise of taking your temperature🙄. Everyone that passes through the door is captured. What’s funny is that the temperature readers don’t even give an accurate temperature😂.

@Civ5forlife-td7hy

2 күн бұрын

She was a consistent heavy loser so they let her keep playing

@CytoplasmicGoo

2 күн бұрын

Every habitual player I know has a player's card. The card is how the casino keeps track of what type of player you are using a tier point system, they give you gifts and comps based on points earned and level of tier to entice you to be loyal and play at that casino. When you use that card, the casino knows you're there.

She would of known if she was 86, she should be paid the jackpot.

If the casino wishes to stand on this principle they should be forced to pay 10x that in taxes. If barring this woman is really so important to them (it's not) then they'll be willing to pay the state.

The fact that she was told when asked how long was she kicked out for, and was told a day or two, means it wasn't a permanent ban, and thus they are just being crooks, and I hope they lose all their business if they don't make this right.

@SmallSpoonBrigade

2 күн бұрын

Even without that, the fact that they hadn't taken any steps to enforce a ban in all those years is something. Most businesses won't enforce a permanent ban just because of how much of a hassle that can be, especially given that if they haven't seen the person in a year or two, they may not be recognizable and there may not be any witnesses available if they need a witness to testify to the records in case of further issues.

@ritanelson8879

2 күн бұрын

And that's a matter of he said-she said.

@arribaficationwineho32

2 күн бұрын

@@ritanelson8879but no one believes casinos or their employees

@DonariaRegia

2 күн бұрын

This reminds me of the story about Norm McDonald, a notorious gambling addict. On one occasion he won $20k, went to the beach and tossed it into the ocean, realizing the casino would just take it all back eventually anyway.

Pharmaceutical companies....... insurance companies......casinos......biggest unhanged criminals ever.

@paulosullivan3472

2 күн бұрын

Politicians top the list

@dangeary2134

2 күн бұрын

Outside of government….

@Eidolon1andOnly

2 күн бұрын

COAs/HOAs are up there too.

@scottkraft1062

2 күн бұрын

Politicians are at the top of the list

@jeffmiesen

2 күн бұрын

Timeshare companies, biggest fraudsters on the planet.

Casinos are corrupt...card counting just means you are observant 🙄

They didn't ask her to leave while she was losing.

Shouldnt they at least give her all the money she spent up to the point she was "Trespassed"?

@robertewalt7789

2 күн бұрын

And all her spending since?

@alphagt62

2 күн бұрын

She was perfectly welcome as long as she was losing

@PopcornPopper

2 күн бұрын

​@@alphagt62 we all are 😂

@solandri69

2 күн бұрын

Usually casinos would love to do that. Since the price is generated from losses by multiple patrons, the prize usually far exceeds the amount any one patron has lost while gambling. A guy talks to a farmer about buying a horse. Says he's going to use it as a prize in a raffle. They agree on a price, and the guy says he'll pick up the horse after the raffle. Few days later the guy comes back. The farmer says he's sorry, but the horse died. The guy says ok, lemme see what I can work out. Later the farmer meets the guy at a bar and asks how the horse raffle situation turned out. The guy says everything is good, and he doesn't need the horse. The winner complained about not receiving the horse he'd won. So he refunded the money for his raffle ticket.

@margretrosenberg420

2 күн бұрын

And how is anyone going to know how much that was? Did she write it down every time she visited? I'm not a gambler, but my late aunts used to go to nearby casinos fairly frequently, to play the slots. I'm sure they kept track of whether they were ahead or behind, but I strongly suspect that they didn't write it down anywhere, and that they simply figured it on a per visit basis, not adding it up over years of play. If you've been making money gambling you have to declare it on your tax returns, but there's no requirement to declare your losses (though you can, I believe, deduct them from your winnings); why else would you keep track of your losses?

F U MGM Grand. That's unforgivable. And I live 20 minutes from there. I'll never be back!

This is ridiculous!!! Pay the lady!

The split second that she put money into a machine after she was trespassed negates that they took money from somebody that they said you can’t be here ever, but they didn’t do anything to stop her from putting money into their machines, they didn’t stop her at the door. They didn’t stop her when she was walking up to a machine. They didn’t stop her when she took the money out of her purse to put into the machine and then she lost that money. And when she lost again, they took that money and when she lost again, they took that money, so your honor they’re in the business of taking peoples money but when they lose oh my God, you’ve been trespassed you shouldn’t be here. How is that fair ladies and gentlemen of the jury, how is that fair, they took this money from this woman, knowing that she shouldn’t be here, but they still took it and they would continue to take it time and time again forever… But then she hit and then they said you’ve been trespassed. You should not be here we are not going to pay you. Ladies and Gentleman of the jury, was she cheating or was she just a woman trying her luck basically given them money time and time again until that one second that she won and then I’m sorry ma’am you have been trespassed before therefore we’re not going to pay you any money at all you must leave the premises… where were they 25 minutes ago when she was putting money in the system they weren’t there. They were watching her who she was but as long as she was putting money in and losing, everything was great…. For them, oh my God, I’m drunk. I’m sorry go on. We know how this is going to end they’re gonna have pay her… if you take the money after somebody has been trash, then you have to pay the money… I’m sorry sometimes I think I trial lawyer…. When I’m a plumber

They had years to tell her to leave but only told her after she wins? They need to pay her.

The gamblers of the area can end this quickly. Boycott.

@kenyattaclay7666

2 күн бұрын

The’er too addicted & to superstitious to do that. I’ve seen news stories about a bomb being put in a casino and authorities having to literally physically force people to stop playing the slots & leave. I’m not saying it wouldn’t work but I am saying it won’t happen.

@CubeInspector

2 күн бұрын

Addicts don't boycott their plug

@SmallSpoonBrigade

2 күн бұрын

@@CubeInspector I'm wondering how many other casinos are in the area. There are a few small casinos around here that are more or less just card rooms, there's only a couple tribal casinos within any sort of reasonable distance of me. It could potentially lead to people switching casinos, but gamblers can be very, very picky about which casinos are lucky and which ones aren't.

@timdowney6721

2 күн бұрын

@@SmallSpoonBrigade You mean very picky in their delusions. 😒

@matthewschocke4094

2 күн бұрын

He mentions at least one other Casino in the story . They should run a full page ad about this story claiming you won't need a lawyer to get your winnings from us!

Casinos will do whatever it takes and make whatever excuse they have to to avoid paying out. We’ve seen this time and time again. And since so many people are in their pockets, they get away with it.

7:30 I used to work in Security and Surveillance at a local Indiana Casino. If we trespassed somebody for Panhandling, they would be detained, sat in an interview room, given a form to sign, and had a photo taken of them. They would be told how long they were banned for. And, we would log the video & audio of the interview room as evidence.

If you won't pay for her win because she was trespassing, *you also can't keep the money from her losses.* Either they owe her the prize OR a refund for every penny she lost.

@arbiter1

2 күн бұрын

Every penny since day she was banned.

@wcoleman99

Күн бұрын

Plus the interest they made off her losses

@TheDuke2086

Күн бұрын

I say they owe her the prize *_AND_* a refund. But I might just be a little greedy right now.

Give her the money and allow her to come back. She will just lose it all again so the casino will get all of their money back. Everyone will be happy that way.

Thanks Steve, please keep us up to date as to the progress and outcome of this matter.

My dad told me never gamble at a casino, the house always wins!

@nodak81

2 күн бұрын

I only went to a casino once in my life. I allowed myself a max of $40 because it's all I could spare at the time. I played a bit of video black jack and I walked out with $1,100.

@Civ5forlife-td7hy

2 күн бұрын

Cool story bro

@timdowney6721

2 күн бұрын

Your Dad was 100% on-point.

@vernwallen4246

2 күн бұрын

@@nodak81 I burned thru a roll of nickles at the Plaza Vegas and didn't get nuttin'.Crooked as a dog's hind leg.

@timdowney6721

2 күн бұрын

@@nodak81 Last time I was in a casino was because of a business conference in Reno circa 1990. I bought a roll of nickels for the half-hour I had to kill before going to the airport. I walked around putting a nickel in here and there…..basically paying to watch people ruin their lives. 😟

This is a creative new way to deny payment.

I read that people are saying "the state should close the casino down" NO - their customers should close the place down and go elsewhere. Major bad publicity for the casino involved.

There was similar case of man that was arrested for trespassing in a Walmart. The security guard had confused him with another man. But once they found out the mistake instead of just dropping the trespass charges they looked to see if he had ever been trespassed from Walmart before and it turned out he was trespassed from Walmart about 5 years before. But for the past 4 years he had been going to Walmart and shopping there. The guy ended up wining his case against Walmart and the police.

I went to a casino once in my life, it was for a job interview. The interview went badly but I had some coins and decided to try a slot.. my first and only time I won a car… the security came to me and asked me to leave or they would sue me. To this day I have no idea what security was talkin about. I assumed the my were cheating, these stories prove I was right. Never been back.

@bluedistortions

2 күн бұрын

You should have sued.

@Nords555

2 күн бұрын

That never happened

What the hell is 127 thousand dollars to MGM its literally pocket change. I hope she takes them out in court.

@arbiter1

2 күн бұрын

Yea from time she won to the time they came back and told her she was trespassing they probably made 2x that from people losing.

@LatitudeSky

Күн бұрын

That is the problem, though. The casino can fight this in court for years. They have lawyers sitting around already paid to be there. They can appeal forever, effectively. But the lady only has her lawyer who actually will need to be paid. The entire winnings could be gobbled up by legal fees, not to mention the 50% tax she probably owes on the winnings if she collects. Her only hopes are huge damages, which again, the casino can appeal forever, or a quick settlement of some sort.

@cheeto225

Күн бұрын

@@LatitudeSky the casino will also have to pay her legal fees.

If they do argue that she was tresspassing since 2015 successfully, they should be told - Ok, you don't owe her the 127k, but you DO owe her every penny that's she's ever lost since 2015. Plus, all the money that she's spent on drinks or anything else while being on your property.

If they won't pay her because she was trespassing, they need to go back and give her every single dime she lost during the times she was there "trespassing". They can't do this one way.

I think that Detroit MGM is going to regret not paying out the win. When this case hits the jury, the jury is likely to award the plaintiff big damages....

@SeanBZA

2 күн бұрын

Especially as it is likely at least half the jury pool has at some point or the other lost money in a casino.

@nsnopper

2 күн бұрын

They’d settle before it came to that. I don’t understand why the Casino is doing this over $127k. It seems more trouble than it’s worth. The casino must earn that back in a matter of . . . what? . . . hours?

@Nope_handlesaretrash

2 күн бұрын

​@@nsnoppernot only that, Lawyers are way more expensive before this is over even if they won

@Jujubean9795

2 күн бұрын

Vegas casinos wound never. They rack in millions every few days😂. This is truly stupid of them.

@janispayne5570

2 күн бұрын

If I was on that jury, I’d be putting myself in her seat at that table, thinking wow! I finally got lucky and won! Then casino says no payout? Heck no! I would recommend the casino have to pay WAY more for trying to cheat her out of that win. And I have sat at Blackjack table at that casino. Maybe it’s time to gamble elsewhere!

Another reason I will not go to a casino.

Over the past eight years, it’s crucial to consider if she ever cashed out an amount significant enough to require documentation. If she did visit the cage to cash out her chips, she would have been eligible to receive the money. However, if she had her cousin handle the cashing out instead, it would explain why she isn’t able to claim the jackpot now. It appears she might have never cashed out by herself. She wasn’t self-excluded, so the trespass order applied solely to her. It’s also worth noting that a trespass notice can sometimes be just a verbal warning. Given that she appeared to be over 32 years old, she likely wasn’t ID’d at the door. This means no one might have recognized her until she had to provide identification to claim the jackpot. Consequently, it seems she won’t be able to receive the jackpot money due to these circumstances.

Question: If this goes to court, can she ask for more than $127K in order to cover her attorney's fees?

@2nickles647

2 күн бұрын

Attorney fees, And pain and suffering.

@sunchips5

2 күн бұрын

I'm not an attorney. With that said, it appears that the casino didn't act in good faith. Hence, the request for attorney's fees is a legitimate and winnable part of the lawsuit, and punitive damages could also be awarded.

@CubeInspector

2 күн бұрын

Not likely. Most civil cases don't allow recovery of attorney fees unless you act in bad faith during the course of the lawsuit. If you stonewall the discovery process for example you pay the fees of the other person for the handling of that stonewalling. This cuts both ways, if youre offered a settlement and turn it down and go to trial and get less than the offer you owe attorney fees from the offer refusal. This other dude replying here got "bad faith" right, he just doesn't understand the bad faith is specifically for the course of the litigation not the act itself.

@coldlakealta4043

2 күн бұрын

lawyers are always the winners - whether they win or lose the case they get paid

@MrRobertX70

2 күн бұрын

@@CubeInspector Are you serious? If you turn down a settlement and end up winning less than what was offered to you, your lawyer is entitled to his/her portion of the original settlement?

Casino's where more honest when they where run by the mafia.

@bonek350

2 күн бұрын

Wear did you here that?

@josefmazzeo6628

2 күн бұрын

It seems like that - most of these cases are recent.

@robertgallagher7734

Күн бұрын

Mafia wanted to avoid unwanted government attention. At least with dealing with the public they had too much to lose if they don't pay. In LV a 2% return pays for all those fancy casinos.

If she has been giving the casino say $300 a week for eight years that comes to $124,800. That being said did she really win? 🤔☮️🇺🇸

The Casino had no problem accepting her wages while she was losing for eight years. If she had left without winning, would they have refunded her losing wages?

Be great to see them end up paying treble damages PLUS attorneys fees.

Here’s the thing, if they don’t have some type of proof that she was trespassed, then she wasn’t trespassed. And considering they have cameras everywhere, they would’ve known the moment she walked in and would’ve told her that she was not allowed. I’m being told to leave one time but not being told you’re not allowed back otherwise you’re trespassing, doesn’t constitute trespass.

Casino should be laughed out of court on this one. They literally have no case if anything she's saying is true.

So they remembered her face from 8 years ago when she won, but never once in 8 years she was there every week did they recognized her when she lost?

Casinos will use any excuse to not pay out winnings. But they'll take your money all day no problem. She should sue for the winnings plus damages.

@prs44

2 күн бұрын

hmmm....sounds like insurance companies. casinos and insurance companies....the two biggest legalized scams.

@cajunncanada3913

2 күн бұрын

Sounds like the criminal enterprise known as the insurance industry.

@hyzmarca2737

2 күн бұрын

Most casinos are happy to pay out large winnings, because of the law of averages. 1 person wins a million dollars, the casino lose a million dollars. 1 million people lose 100 dollars, the casino makes 100 million dollars. Large jackpot winners get advertised, because they encourage other people to gamble in the hope of winning. And most people will lose because the odds favor the casino. Most casinos won't kick you out unless they believe you're cheating. And even then, they'll pay your winnings unless they can prove that you were cheating.

With all the money she spent over the years there wouldn't the courts find that consent was given to her to be there as a customer? As well if she won at the very least $600 they would have to work in her personal information for tax purposes? Which would mean they are aware of her presences.

I hit six small jackpots from Cincinnati casino yesterday and i had no issues collecting my prizes

My client was part of a 3 man team who traveled the country a few years ago installing facial recognition systems in casinos. Homeland security required it in every casino to combat money laundering of organized crime. If anyone stepped foot in any casino, someone knew you were there. The right people? I can’t answer that. But the hardware was there along with the software.

Casino didn't have any issue taking money from her all the time while they were "trespassing".....

The casino are nuts. All this bad publicity because they are trying to pull a fast oine when if instead they paid her, they'd get loads of good publicity?

If she was actually trespassed with evidence. Wouldn't the doctrine that if a business who trespassed you in the past, but then allows you business multiple times without objections; that should "negate" the "activity " of the trespass ban?

They’ve been allowing her to play for 8 years, but NOW she’s trespassing? Absolutely not.

Thank you for wearing a "Battleship Texas" tee. Sales of those tees go to the restoration of the old gal as well as the building of the new museum.

@tatkkyo9911

2 күн бұрын

That's kinda kool. I love museums

This is honestly the easiest case ever. If she had a player's card and has used it in any capacity they have to pay her.