I was Involved with the planning and recovery as Brighton Depot Manager during the whole process which was very challenging. Once the process for recovery had been agreed the bank had to be secured by piles and as many items as possible were removed to reduce the weight prior to lifting the roof then the engine followed by the body and finally the bogies. Three weekend possessions were required along with a gas main close by having to be considered for safety implications. My team at Brighton did a tremendous amount of work during the weekdays removing components in a difficult environment. The use of airbags to upright the loco was provided by a specialist team. Watching this film brought back memories for me along with many photos I took during the recovery process.

@paulbaker916

4 жыл бұрын

Mushy Peas! Yep, you guys did a good job.

@60074Harvester

4 жыл бұрын

Jack Torrance It was an extremely interesting project with many discussions on the method of recovery or cutting up on site.

@kevinstaddon8517

4 жыл бұрын

First time I've seen air bags used in rail recovery, of course now the loco would be cut up on site.

@neilcrawford8303

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing, really interesting. Having seen all the prep and sheet piling it looked like a big task. Seeing that drop, it must have been quite a painful experience for the driver.

@kevinbaird7277

4 жыл бұрын

I would have preferred you to write "our team", not "my team".

Brilliant video, and Doncaster works repaired it quicker than it took to salvage it. Nice to see proper engineers at work

@johngoodsell6641

Жыл бұрын

I would imagine a lot of 'exchange' sub-assemblies already overhauld on stock were fitted, such as spare bogies, & spare powerunit, thus the quick turnaround. Then the rolled bogies & powerunit would have been gone through at normal pace & put back in to stock for the next 56 being 'shopped'

Being a retired BR nurse , These engineers and Track personnel are the salt of the earth I have the upmost respect for them all ., These gentlemen will work until the job is done , we should be very proud of there tenacity and endurance , I am proud to call them my men , RIP to the Driver and our thought go to his family every death on our railway , is one too many .

@beecee1286

4 жыл бұрын

I knew a guy who said he was the driver. He walked away uninjured. However, I don’t know if there was another crew member who succumbed to his injuries as you imply. My friend explained how it happened, but I don’t intend to make any comments here. Water under the bridge and all that.

@penninetrains1398

4 жыл бұрын

I was a guard at Brighton until about a year before that accident. I knew the driver and can confirm that both he and the guard were lucky enough to escape with minor injuries. It was a spectacular incident though and the engineers did an amazing job recovering the loco.

@22pcirish

4 жыл бұрын

No one died in this incident.

@RAFchurchlawford4469

4 жыл бұрын

Elizabethann Ferrario: Why are you following this new trend of isolating punctuation marks?

@penninetrains1398

4 жыл бұрын

@@RAFchurchlawford4469 Does it really matter? Her comment is perfectly understandable and language is constantly evolving anyway. Surely there are enough problems in the world already without having to resort to such pedantry?

I was there for the second phase of the loco recovery, when the body and then the bogies were lifted up onto the mainline. Wimbledon and Eastleigh breakdown cranes/gangs. A very interesting job. I wasn't aware that there was a film of it, so it's the first I've seen of the loco being righted and the Power Unit lifted out. It was explained to us that if there'd been proper road access, the loco would have been cut up on site. It cost way in excess of £1M to recover it.

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

And what's the cost of a new comparable loco ?

@highdownmartin

4 жыл бұрын

pmailkeey it still would have cost a fair bit just to scrap it on site, so you may as well get it out in “ one” piece

@justinobrien3593

2 жыл бұрын

Good video of a team of experts removing a 140 ton locomotive in a very awquid environment and where this accident happened it basically saved this grids life! I love these screaming beasts as they remind me of the screaming Valletta hst engines as they sound very simular to each other!!! 😎

Impressive civil engineering work to recover a locomotive, I really enjoyed it, thank you for sharing.

It's amazing how this engine survived the ordeal of rolling down the embankment, and how she was fished out, taken away to Doncaster repaired and put back into service, and how the crew escaped with minor injuries

Fascinating video and amazing work by all involved as it looked an incredibly difficult recovery.

I've only just discovered this footage. Absolutely awesome and a great record of how it's done.

Very interesting video. Am glad Train crew survived. Would have loved to go on a job like this. Most exciting thing we had was Point de-icing by hand. Lol. 179 gang Shrewsbury Pway. Dad was a driver. Thanks for sharing this. 👍😎

I knew the Brighton driver concerned. Second manned to him a few times. Awkward bugger. The rest of the depot joked that he should have been invited to the recommissioning ceremony at Donny. A few years later, when we were both on the Ardingly job,I met the guard who was in the back cab when it rolled down the bank. He never travelled in the back cab ever again!

@RebelRebelious

Жыл бұрын

His name has cropped up on a couple of railway forums in the past. Nobody had a good word for him. My experience of him was when he was driver at Redhill mid 70s. He was meant to pick me when working a set of empty DEMU from St Leonards to Redhill. He forgot and left me stranded at 04:30! Even many years before the Copyhold incident he had a reputation as a jinx Once even managed to get himself trapped in the engine compartment of a Tadpole set at Reading. No way would I ever have stepped into an aircraft with him at the controls either!

@highdownmartin

Жыл бұрын

@@RebelRebelious morning brother! Taffy Jones at Brighton called him a bearded pirate bastard P was going to do a fiddle or a shunt for jonesy and didn’t. Leaving Jonesy in the shite. I did a week second manning to him on the Lavant Drayton trips. Didn’t get a drive and he made is VERY clear that wasn’t going to happen. Hardly said a word to me all week. Then the roster changed I ended up on A shift so never had to go with him again. He moved to Plymouth and got a glowing reference from Brighton area management, very keen to see the back of him.

What an interesting video, not seen this before, well worth watching...Thanks for uploading..

Only just discovered this. Brilliant video. I had no idea.

Excellent video and glad she lived to see another day ... the old girl 👍👍👍👍🇬🇧🇬🇧🇬🇧

Thanks for sharing

Epic, I saw this as a lad, rememberthe smell of all the dieselthat poured out. We used to watch the stone train most weeks, this was a horrific happening , great to see its recovery

@mpyle7396

Жыл бұрын

Me too, but that's because I'm your brother.

A class 86 had the some situation at Watford in 1975. She was recovered by two road cranes and taken to Crewe on a low loader lorry

All that handball work under lifts that size gives me the willies.

Driver to Traction inspector. I cant open the door. Why not ? The loco is liying on it boss. 😂 Nice bit of Overtime for the local Pway lads 👍

What an engine! 🇬🇧

Briliant video - thx 👍

great video of heavy recovery, I noticed how the level of PPE increased through the video!! But why fuze the ARC logos on the hopper when its obvious who they belong to and its included in the description? Somewhere I have a photo of a similar incident at Fenny Compton Up Goods Loop, fortunately it remained upright just passed the catch points. I think it was also a class 56 with a train of MGR's. Need to find the photo ! And help to upload it !

@ILikeTransport

4 жыл бұрын

Doesn't ARC stand for Amey Roadstone Construction (?)

@benconway9010

3 жыл бұрын

@@ILikeTransport not anymore cos I think Amey Road Stone became Hanson??

@ianjones4116

2 жыл бұрын

I can remember a 47 going through the Catch points at Dorrington Shropshire. Signalman error !! He got 12hrs overtime. Wrong road working, points weren't clamped . Oops !! Dont think 47 was completely on its side. Most importantly nobody was injured. 👍

@beeble2003

Жыл бұрын

Are you sure the logos have been obscured? It just looks like low-quality old video, to me.

At 0:15 I have that loco in model form. Nice video.

The catch points or 'derail' (Australia) is clearly seen in the view looking along the tracks.

@ChangesOneTim

2 жыл бұрын

Over here, the correct term at goods line/ siding/ depot etc exits is trap points, which protect passenger lines against overrun. Catchpoints protect same against run-back moves such as on inclines or at some goods line entrances. Nearly all our catchpoints have gone; they were sprung in the trailing (normal) direction, right buggers to maintain and you always had to remember to clip them up before doing single line working.

I've seen many train derailed, but luckly I just pick them up and put 'em back on the tracks, however, , thanks for sharing this video. is it true the driver was killed?

@professorjamesmoriarty5191

3 жыл бұрын

No, nobody was killed.

In the 1950s they might have built a temporary rail track past the loco to recover it. Rerail it and pull it out. A track would have allowed the steam cranes to get there. I’ve seen pictures of two steam cranes totally lift a mainline diesel off the ground. However I don’t know all of the logistics in this incident.

@neilwilkinson8062

4 жыл бұрын

They look like a pair of 76 ton cranes, converted from steam to diesel. I’m old enough to remember one like them working in a Possession in the winter. Could get a warm, by standing next to the boiler ( can’t do that with a diesel)

@ianjones4116

2 жыл бұрын

@@neilwilkinson8062 you could always use your shovel to keep warm, though I did like my long black BR coat. Doubled up as a blanket. Not so many shovels these days, all mechanized nowadays. I'm old too. 😀👍

@skog4437

11 ай бұрын

late to the party, they're rated 76ton, but that gets smaller the further out it has to reach, and to swing a 60ft diesel between the pair would limit that rather alot i'd imagine, they could lift it vertically, but then not have anywhere to put it afterwards

Great that it was videoed - was it 'official' or just a lad with his camcorder...?

@stevoGTR

4 жыл бұрын

Belive it was a railway employee involved at the time for his own records.

@beeble2003

Жыл бұрын

Looks unofficial to me. If it was an official video, surely they'd have shown the full lift of the locomotive. The fact that, suddenly, the loco is way up in the air suggests quite strongly that the guy who was videoing had to stop filming to do his actual job.

I reckon if that 56 had feelings it would be trying to say “help me “

These days, they'd spend months talking about moving it, pay consultants millions of pounds to come up with a recommended recovery process.. Followed by spending further millions appointing a contractor to carry out the works, only to find the consultant recommended the wrong procedures. Another million spent on re-evaluation and corrective action.. Finally, the works would get approval and contractors start works months/years later.. etc,etc.. All in the name of progress.

80’s health and safety....like the PPE...non existent 🤕

@ianjones4116

2 жыл бұрын

But the job got done Safely and in half the time, with a lot less 'Office Wallahs' as my dad called them . No wonder I'm such a 'Millitant' ,,, as my manager calls me . Lol. Thanks Dad. 👍

I was watching a program about heavy haulage the other night. I swear that rail crane at 7:15 in the background was being taken to a museum If not that one, one just like it

@Dan23_7

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks for the heart Steve 👍🏻 I remember it was on Quest on freeview, a firm called Alleleys we're moving it. I'm sure they said it was built in the 1940's and could lift 50t

@wayneelliott8277

4 жыл бұрын

I'm pretty sure that was one of two stores at Horsham. And it was SWL 76 ton

@spark001uk

4 жыл бұрын

Funny enough I saw that too the other night, the prog was "Train Truckers" (can't remember which channel now), it was Cowans Sheldon 45 tonne ADRC96719. It was being taken from Crewe Heritage Centre to the Hornby museum in Margate (or should that be "visitor centre") by Allelys.

Was the Loco scrapped ! He was at fault ? The Driver ?

Mrs Richards: "I paid for a room with a view !" Basil: (pointing to the lovely view) "That is Torquay, Madam." Mrs Richards: "It's not good enough!" Basil: "May I ask what you were expecting to see out of a Torquay hotel bedroom window? Sydney Opera House, perhaps? the Hanging Gardens of Babylon? Herds of wildebeest sweeping majestically past?..." Mrs Richards: "Don't be silly! I expect to be able to see the sea!" Basil: "You can see the sea, it's over there between the land and the sky." Mrs Richards: "I'm not satisfied. But I shall stay. But I expect a reduction." Basil: "Why?! Because Krakatoa's not erupting at the moment?"

Imagine this happening nowadays. It would have taken for ever. No hard hats, no orange suits. It was a wonder no-one was killed.

@christofsmanlib1385

4 жыл бұрын

Simples!! They had common sense in those days!!

@prafter7

4 жыл бұрын

Don’t forget a load of method statements and health and safety chaps around making life difficult.

@vasili1207

4 жыл бұрын

We hate health and safety nazis.... they cause all projects to crawl along instead of a steady pace

@christofsmanlib1385

4 жыл бұрын

I myself work on two railways, with both places having the necessary H & S in place, and adheared to. At neither place can I remember us ever having to make a thing of it though ! To pinch a title from the classic Blackadder TV series, just "Sense and Sensibility" wins the day every time 👍😀

@exb.r.buckeyeman845

4 жыл бұрын

Warwick Tregurtha We used our eyes and ears in those days, and most people were risk savvy. It’s called competent.

There were probably some cheap spare parts for the rebuild knocking about in Romania somewhere

@markcf83

4 жыл бұрын

It was only the first 30 that were built in Romania. The rest were built in Doncaster or Crewe.

@ianjones4116

2 жыл бұрын

Lol, sadly that was one of the British 56s. The Romanians probably started a New Scrap business with the left overs. Then come here to start up as Self Employed. Lol

Is this junction north or south of HH station ? - and how far north or south?

@leelaters3437

4 жыл бұрын

North. About half a mile before the station heading to Brighton.

@brianmccully2041

4 жыл бұрын

Site and steel shuttering still there. Just south of HH golf club and close to public footpath. Kids have build a BMX track very close.

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

@@brianmccully2041 So at 51.017436, -0.105681 ? ( a little south of that at 51.016984, -0.105385 the is some unstraight 'fencing' - is that the incident sight ? What I don't understand is there appears to be continuation track (all the way to the station) unless it's just the marks on the ground where the sleepers were ? - and no sign of a footpath on Google maps. OS maps has the junction quite a bit further north - which is clearly incorrect.

@brianmccully2041

4 жыл бұрын

I think the location is around 51.016875, -0.105209 but the site looks very different with some dense woodland now. Think someone mentioned a gas main near the site which I think I have seen. I might of course be talking b*******. Public footpath runs 51.013193, -0.101555 to 51.019186, -0.102238 but you can walk in the field to the west.

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

@@brianmccully2041 Your first ref appears to be the accident site - the 'junction' is further north, possibly: 51.018706, -0.106166 yet the straight track continues south from there to just short of the derailment site - maybe ploughed through buffers there ?

amazing, I recall seeing the 56 with no engine in it, how much did this recovery cost

@stevoGTR

4 жыл бұрын

I did ask this question and the person quoted somewhere in region of £180,000 but this was back in 1988 and was repaired relativity quickly!

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

Chris Arnold comments 'way over a million to recover it'.

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

@@stevoGTR From Chris Arnold's comment >£1M

What happened to the driver both physically and in regard to his job?

@thebritishempire8754

2 жыл бұрын

He didn't die. I do not know what happened to his job, however.

How did it happen in the first place ?

@ChangesOneTim

2 жыл бұрын

The train overran the exit signal at danger (red), and then derailed on the trap point designed to protect trains on the main lines by deflecting the overrun away from them.

Wonder if the driver made 12?

tha's gonna need a bit of T-Cut eh?

@thebritishempire8754

2 жыл бұрын

Careful, might remove the decals 😆

What’s the reason for removing the engine first ?

@stevoGTR

4 жыл бұрын

Belive it was weight limits on crane

@09weenic

4 жыл бұрын

Steve Wallace I did think that- thanks 👍

@paulnolan1352

Жыл бұрын

It looks like the Engine and main Generator lifted out in a onesie.

@beeble2003

Жыл бұрын

@@paulnolan1352 Alternator, but yes.

Super sad video! as a professional train expert like myself, this could've been prevented if I was conducting this train!

@DaleDix

Жыл бұрын

Coulda shoulda woulda.

Surprise this wasn’t cut up on sight!

@professorjamesmoriarty5191

4 жыл бұрын

Why would they do that? The loco was repaired and put back into service, finally cut up in 2010.

@nigelkthomas9501

4 жыл бұрын

Professor James Moriarty It’s what usually happened to steam locomotives when they had mishaps! Wonder what numpty drove it through the catch points? Very careless!

@neiloflongbeck5705

4 жыл бұрын

@@nigelkthomas9501 not always. LNER K3 4009 was involved in a collision at Welwyn Garden City in 1937 when hauling a Leeds bound service. It was running at about 65mph when it ran into the back of an Express headed for Newcastle. 4009 was repaired and not with drawn from service until 3/3/1962.

@millomweb

4 жыл бұрын

Another commenter suggested due to inaccessibility.

@johnbailey5616

4 жыл бұрын

O

Poor 56..

@thebritishempire8754

2 жыл бұрын

She was repaired, apparently cut up in 2010, though. God I hate scrapping.

Crikey, when upright and on rail, these machines never looked so impressive as per size, but de-railed !!

Norwood driver who apparently learnt the route from the air so im told!

@PenzancePete

4 жыл бұрын

It was true. There were audible gasps when he mentioned it at the enquiry.

@benconway9010

3 жыл бұрын

Urm can you say that again? He learnt the route from the air??? What was he flying a plane or chopper or something at the time??.....or perhaps a balloon maybe?

@EM-yk1dw

3 жыл бұрын

@@benconway9010 I’m not sure but that is what a retired driver told me some time ago.

@benconway9010

3 жыл бұрын

@@EM-yk1dw well was he even a qualified driver? Cos it sounds like he just just slipped an Orange jacket on and said "hello I'm a train driver where's my train"

@EM-yk1dw

3 жыл бұрын

@@benconway9010 Yes he was a qualified driver. I will see if I can find out more as it’s a while since I was told about this.

Thanks special

I assume it was scrapped ?

@stevoGTR

4 жыл бұрын

I believe it was quickly fixed and back in service

@professorjamesmoriarty5191

4 жыл бұрын

Repaired surprisingly quickly and put back into service, it was finally cut up in 2010.

@thebritishempire8754

2 жыл бұрын

@@professorjamesmoriarty5191 well that's a bit of a shame.

OI you can't park that there!!

@thebritishempire8754

2 жыл бұрын

Give him a ticket!

Was this human error on the part of the driver? Did he face some form of disciplinary action?

@PenzancePete

4 жыл бұрын

Yes and yes.

@andrewtaylor5695

4 жыл бұрын

Why would you discipline someone for making an error? If there was evidence of gross negligence, then yes, but human error was highly predictable and I bet there were a bucket load of systemic contributory factors.

@msdes82

4 жыл бұрын

Andrew Taylor you’re not an ASLEF shop steward by any chance are you? If this was indeed purely down to driver error without any significant mitigating circumstances I think we’ll have to agree to differ on the responsibilities one takes for ones own errors and the personal sanction and accountability you are held up to at work as a result of your actions. If I made an error in my job that resulted in a clean up bill costing the equivalent of what this was reported to have cost in today’s money, not to mention the risk of multiple fatalities from a crash with a passenger train, I think I’d be expecting my p45 through the letterbox.

@andrewtaylor5695

4 жыл бұрын

@@msdes82 I'm not, no. May I suggest you read the fascinating book, 'Black Box Thinking' by Matthew Syed, which describes and evidences the benefits of a 'just culture'? What you're claiming I'm saying is that there should be a 'no blame' culture, which is as harmful to safety as the blame culture you're advocating. There is a difference between error, negligence and gross negligence. Blame cultures drive near miss reporting underground, which means opportunities to learn from operational experience are missed. All the best.

@ChangesOneTim

2 жыл бұрын

Human error, driver didn't control his train so as to stop at the red signal. How much of the 'blame' BR apportioned to him I don't know; the internal investigation would have determined that, but the disciplinary he received could vary between suspension pending retraining, restricted driving duties pending retraining, redeployment in a non-driving job etc. Dismissal would only have happened if he was found to have acted recklessly. Nowadays the industry has a 'fair culture investigation' policy, which shifts away from 'blame' to understanding whether or not it was a mistake and if so what type, any contributing causes (eg fatigue, rostering issues, infrastructure design factors etc) and lessons to be learned from it before deciding what disciplinary action needs to be taken.

The driver?

@beeble2003

Жыл бұрын

No serious injuries to him or the guard.

So where is the actual video of it coming of the tracks ?????

GUTS GALORE

Couple of kilos of body filler and a quick spray,good as new

@raymondo162

4 жыл бұрын

bit of T-Cut..................

@torstenbrunke4026

4 жыл бұрын

...and a hammer.

@gorillaau

4 жыл бұрын

Apply a little heat and the panels will just pop back into shape.

@graemekornicki6810

4 жыл бұрын

In april 1986 i photogtaphed this loco ex works at doncaster,even the more damaged 50041 was repared a tribute to all the staff employed at brel doncaster sadly all lost

Nice to see a non fannying about job

I do indeed love a good train mishap, the sight of cars strewn about the landscape is very calming to me

its seems the catch points cause more trouble than they solve.

@cooperised

4 жыл бұрын

Definitely not true. Catch points are a last resort and cause small problems to prevent bigger ones. This train passed a signal at danger and was heading for the Brighton main line - far better to roll a locomotive down a bank than to have it encounter a speeding train full of passengers.

@johndonaldson3619

4 жыл бұрын

If you don't know the purpose of catch points, don't be a clown buddy

@andrewwilson6240

4 жыл бұрын

I guess when the signalling design is performed there must be some consideration of the consequences of the derailment, and positioned to bring the loco to a halt whilst minimising subsequent damage. I must admit I have looked at some where I think "well that would take the footbridge etc out"! Thankfully they are seldom called upon to save the day!

@highdownmartin

4 жыл бұрын

They’re trap points not catch points

@cooperised

4 жыл бұрын

@@highdownmartin Technically true. For most purposes they might as well be the same thing - both exist as a last resort to derail trains making potentially dangerous unauthorised movements - but yes you are right.

should happen less now we have are brexit DONE.

In 1997 there was a similar case in Portugal The loco rested on where it derailed for 2 years until a technical recovery plan was put to work os-caminhos-de-ferro.blogspot.com/2012/05/acidente-linha-da-beira-baixa-pk-335-29.html