A lot of people watch you & you planted a seed in their mind today about Right to Repair. Thank you!

@23rashad24

2 жыл бұрын

This cross over > Love both of y’all!

There are auctions for farm equipment where older tractors are selling for more than new because they can be fixed on-the-spot.

@user-fy9qc6bj5h

3 жыл бұрын

Ya that's true

@tombob671

3 жыл бұрын

Maybe we otta do the same on cars and trucks....damn scammers, stealerships

@tombob671

3 жыл бұрын

And now you can go to autozone for a free scan

@screamindemon811

3 жыл бұрын

One of the biggest issues some farmers face are expense of repairs, some operation run on razor thin margins, and having a tractor or combine down can really hurt and it would be nice for the farmer or rancher or producer to be able to have a look and see what is wrong BEFORE they have to go to a dealer, sometimes a guy can fix things sometimes it has to go to the dealer but having the information and attainable to the owner is a must. The other thing is there are some operations where they are they are no where near a dealer... sometimes that dealer is hours away and if you have a machine that is down and it has to go to a dealer sometimes that in itself requires having a trucking company that specializes in moving equipment come out to move it and then if wheels or anything have to come off because it is oversize the money and time go out the window. There are times that happens and a guy has no choice but there is a lot of things that a guy can fix, but being able to access the codes and other information ought to be allowed. People pay some damn big money for their machines and then to be told yes you own it but you cant have access to this or this or that... but yet Deere sure does, do people honestly believe that the GPS units and the information they collect Deere doesnt use or access for their own means? Sure they do that info tells them a lot just like everything they clean from the computer when you bring into them and they hook it up Farm Equipment manufacturers aren't selling this stuff at a loss and they are not about to go broke because a guy wants to look up codes and see if he can do his own repairs to save some money. You cant just go down to your local auto wrecker or O'reillys to buy tractor major components, there still will be visits to a dealer for parts or another supply place for them and yes a need to take it to a dealer for work, but people should not be locked out of the equipment they own and the ability to work and diagnose them

@russdavis1960

3 жыл бұрын

@@tombob671 Hence the reason the newest car I drive is a 1993, the newest 'small' truck is a 1992, and the newest full size pickup is a 1985. Heck ALL of them even have manual windows .... LOL!!!

This is so true. My cousin farms & bought a brand new combine last fall. On day 2 of harvesting it quit! They run 24/7 during harvest. He called the help line & was told they'd send someone out NEXT WEEK!!! He told then no, you'll send someone to fix it in the next hour or they can come & pick up their junk & his lawyer will sue for loss. Then he went into town at 4am & bought another combine from a different manufacturer & he made the dealer pick up the broken combine & cancelled the sale. Farmers work against the weather. If the weather changes, in a natter of a few hours a seasons work can be lost. People don't understand this. Sometimes farmers make big money, & sometimes they lose big money. Their lively hood depends on equipment working properly all the time & their ability to repair it immediately on the spot.

@clxwncrxwn

3 жыл бұрын

Well part of the big money is used for maintenance and repair and to buy next years seed, or whatever they’re growing. etc

@joriskylie6857

3 жыл бұрын

The fact he went to town at 4am to buy another tractor alone tells you the seriousness of the farming business, especially during crop season. I watch 3 or 4 farm channels and a repair channel and it is a no nonsense stressful business. The good thing is, as a community they all support each other. The electronics they have today the farmer can tell instantly what the yield of their crop is and how much more or less they make, right on the spot.

@loloberry5932

3 жыл бұрын

This is fricking insane. Waiting a WEEK could bankrupt a farmer and cause a loss in the 6 or 7 digit range if crops are lost. Wtf happened to JD???!!!

@loloberry5932

3 жыл бұрын

Good thing about farmers is they know how to survive. If JD wants to screw around farmers react FAST and JD will be done. There are other manufacturers and farmers will leave JD immediately if this crap continues. JD quality is also making equipment unprofitable to run so I wouldn’t be surprised by a JD bankruptcy in the next decade. The company has had an investment banker as CEO and lost its soul.

@jimnaden5594

3 жыл бұрын

@@loloberry5932 You might want to bone up on your facts a little.. CEO and Chairman of the board of directors is John May who joined John Deere in 1997. Mr. May has worked his way up the ladder within Deere and Company. www.deere.com/en/our-company/leadership/may-john-c/

*Those "billions invested" by manufacturers was mostly spent on lobbyists trying to defeat Right to Repair bills.* *Nice kick in their gonads, Massachusetts.* 👍

@TheHouseOfWaffles

3 жыл бұрын

"Robust conversations" with legislatures.

@TimoRutanen

3 жыл бұрын

To be fair, there probably have been actual billions spent on engineering too.

This is just a way to prevent independent repairers from operating. It allows the manufacturers agents to charge exorbitant prices for parts and labour.

@Gizziiusa

3 жыл бұрын

let me also add that auto manufacturers jammed all the components together and/or made them very difficult to get to (such as "have to pull the engine out in order to change the fuel filter") to make it much more difficult for independents to repair them.

@bombero3368

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly...it restricts competition

@randallkelley3600

3 жыл бұрын

Years ago I took our Honda Odyssey to Midas for a timing belt change. The job required a special tool. Honda would not lend that tool to Midas, so the Midas guy had to put my engine back together and I had to go to Honda to get it done.

Automakers won't let others modify the software, and yet they won't commit to maintaining their software beyond 10 years.

@HustleMuscleGhias

3 жыл бұрын

The truth of the matter is that after 10 years the 99.9% of the bugs in the software will be knocked out. The other part of the equation is that manufacturers change designs, specs, and components overtime making the old software version redundant as it is unable to work with the newer components without extensive changes to the original source code. I work in the programming field and am familiar with the life cycle of how software interacts with hardware and the clowns who design it.

@paulmills6189

3 жыл бұрын

@@HustleMuscleGhias That may be true, but I suspect infotainment systems and many features could go unsupported and cease to function. Not really a bug issue, but more like having an app stop working on an older operating system.

@mr.robinson1982

3 жыл бұрын

Get an old ride, so anyone can work on it....I own & drive a '93 Ford Ranger, that has only 182,000 or so...why would I get rid of a cheap vehicle to maintain, insure & pay taxes on for having a new ride?

@eatdafat7101

3 жыл бұрын

Not necessarily true. Dodge had a memory leak issue for years that could be cleared by pulling the IOD fuse. It was documented as a problem back in 97 model years. I had an 05. The dealers solution is change the computer @ 2k+ a pop. Every few months or weeks when the issue comes up, pull the fuse and wait 15 seconds. Cost $0. It is a problem that didn’t show until shortly after the warranty expired, and someone who just listens to the dealers gets raped for a $2500 repair. That’s why independents need the ability to repair this stuff.

@loc4725

3 жыл бұрын

@@paulmills6189 Mercedes removing one of their infotainment systems via an OTA update even though it's still under warranty .

John Deere tractor company has been a big problem for farmers the last ten years to the point that some of the farmers have had to become hackers just to diagnose and fix their equipment.

@UncleKennysPlace

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, my tractor has high-pressure common-rail EFI, with catalyst. Ain't no paper clip fixes if it stops.

@otravis676

3 жыл бұрын

@@UncleKennysPlace I hear ya. A good friend of mine in tennessee whet to a diesel school that had a cat and John Deere program basically just to work on his own stuff and wound up working on all his neighbors equipment also

@oldbatwit5102

3 жыл бұрын

It won't be long before farmers get together and have the parts they need manufactured for them, probably from China. If John Deere can make it so could someone else.

@MrTIGERH1752

3 жыл бұрын

And we are watching their sales fall off dramatically !!! Way to go John Deer !!! Tim

@CheezyDee

3 жыл бұрын

@@oldbatwit5102 The parts aren't really the issue; it's whether the computer onboard the tractor will recognize a new part was added and allow it to function. Added a new implement? You need the dealer to enable it in the software. Pay thousands to flatbed your equipment 50 miles so the dealer can just plug in and turn on a virtual switch.

Being from Massachusetts and having voted for right to repair, I too will have my eye on this. Thanks Steve.

@carmelopappalardo8477

3 жыл бұрын

Good for you. Now it has to go down to cell phones and other electronics.

@robertlee9395

3 жыл бұрын

I saw that it passed there. Good news. Congratulations for your State!

@AddictedToJeepsCom

3 жыл бұрын

I’m from MA as well and also voted for Right for Repair and owners’ Right to Data!

@carmelopappalardo8477

3 жыл бұрын

@@AddictedToJeepsCom the people from the Commonwealth of Massachusetts are very independent.

All codes and diagnostics should be displayed on the nice 12" center stack screen so the end user can diagnose, repair, and reset the computer systems on their car

@just-a-waffle

3 жыл бұрын

My car displays any check engine codes right in the gauge cluster display

@michaelsmutnick

3 жыл бұрын

@@just-a-waffle In my 1999 SAAB 95 I had to pull my computer and send it out to a specialty shop to reflash it. Now it shows the check engine codes on the radio display and I can cycle through other readouts ie, RPM, O2 sensor voltage, etc.

@jimmyscott3597

3 жыл бұрын

@@michaelsmutnick I've got an 02 9-3 was thinking about having that done. How much did it run you if I may ask?

@michaelsmutnick

3 жыл бұрын

@@jimmyscott3597 it was like $100 at eeuropparts.com before they went downhill

@orppranator5230

Жыл бұрын

Or at the very least you should be able to plug in your phone or laptop and diagnose it there.

I’m sure VW would have wished their diesel emissions software had stayed proprietary.

@williamwells3026

3 жыл бұрын

VW made the software to cheat on emissions but they were caught

I'm probably going off on a tangent but I'm a used car dealer and Manheim Auctions, the world's largest auction chain, will not allow dealers to bring code readers for OBD II into the sale anymore. Granted, there are sophisticated scanners that can be used to alter engine parameters, mixtures, and functions, but 99% of dealers just want to see if there are any pending trouble codes and if the readiness has been reset--for emissions testing purposes. So many dealers and large sellers simply clear codes before the car goes into the sale and hope that they stay cleared long enough for the car to be sold and not arbitrated. Seemingly, Manheim is implementing this policy in order to reduce the number of cars being arbitrated where the auction makes no fee from the seller AND the buyer. In my opinion, Manheim is aiding and abetting fraud. Getting back on point, I have followed the story of 'Right to Repair' and I think that manufacturers not allowing owners to work on their own equipment is decidedly un-American. There is no other way to put it.

@ddyeo503

3 жыл бұрын

We vote with our money. Just don't buy from them,,,,,,,

@adamplummer2190

3 жыл бұрын

Issue is, many auction vehicles have had dead batteries. A dead battery will act the same as a code clear. I'm more worried about pending when evaluating a car as a mechanic. Any car I look at at work I always worn the potential customer if the seller is not present. If seller is present I ask if the cars sat for a while (if they say they drive it daily then it's a red flag) then I ask about jump starts. Can't at an auction obviously but it's good info to have. Issue is like john deere that won't share software. Was going to be no shop could fix anything. Now my work has the ability to access dealer level software for repairs. Right to repair isn't just about you fixing your car, it's also about independent shops being able to fix it for you. Now I've got to pay fees to use said software, but it's available and I agree with it- someone's got to pay for the development costs of updates and maintenance of servers that host the programming software. But it shouldn't be under lock and key lime john deere was doing. You couldn't replace an alternator without telling the pcm there's a new alternator and syncing them. There was no need for that.

@NQTOD

3 жыл бұрын

I will not buy a car unless the key has been cycled 5-6 times I got bit once years ago and won’t let it happen again

@Vaga-Bard

3 жыл бұрын

@@ddyeo503 you can not buy and the govt will give them your money anyway.

@ddyeo503

3 жыл бұрын

@@Vaga-Bard I drive and fix a 20 year old Honda Accord to not half to deal with the newer stuff. They can just keep it. I don't need to drive a $60,000 pickup so I can compete with the Jone'ss,,,,,,,,,,,,

Any company who opposes right to repair should be closed down immediately.

@addiumuppicus5738

3 жыл бұрын

Hmmmm, sounds like our government . . . Bill of Rights says We The People have the right to correct this . Yet people are so programmed ( Including our military ) the national guard is called in to protect the wrong doers and the high court sits on it's hands when there is documented proof of voter fraud and illegal political activity allowing or actually illegally making up law to allow it to be defrauded . I years ago took an oath to uphold the constitution against enemies both forgien and domestic . But back then we knew the constitution as we were taught it in school . Enumerations comes to mind or limits on the politicians preventing them from doing what they are doing now . Why because like law of precident , and the FBI investigating itself , the law has been made irrelevant . Or the meaning twisted cor perverted so they the politicians have made it useless for their own benefit . President Trump I voted for but wouldn't again as for all he did he let this nation be controlled by the enemy . IE the communist party . Which is on the fast track to making the US a province of China . 2024 ? There won't be a America by 2024 to say anything about getting a honest election . Congress has already made the move to remove state run elections and put the electorial power in control of Congress. Not that that's really nessisary as with the demise of the electoral coledges NY , California and one other will determine ALL elected officials . My opinion freely given but I've seen this happening since the Clinton cabal ran things in the awhite house . Both Bill ( answerable to China ) and Hillary ( who has been a card holding communist since before she met Bill ,) . NO, I hold President Trump accountable as he dropped the ball either by accident and unknowingly or he was a part of this overthrow/coup of America . But , he didn't use the powers of his office and solely power nobody from a lower court could block . No , what was it Mr. Trump ? Did you want to be known as a ' Nice guy ' ? Well you have some fooled but there are many who aren't . Drain the swamp obviously you couldn't flush a toilet . Sorry folks obviously I went on a rant . Again, my apologies .

The American public is nothing more than a powerless lobbying group nowadays. We are not represented by anyone. Senators and House of reps have very little motivation to help us in any regard. We have proven we are disorganized complainers. they laugh at us while using our tax dollars to provide for themselves and the corporations who REALLY make policy.

@UncleKennysPlace

3 жыл бұрын

So, um, buy some stock in one of those corporations.

@pansepot1490

3 жыл бұрын

Ban corporations for funding politicians. That’s just *legalized bribes* . Yeah, we vote for someone who is supposed to represent us, the citizens, then when the politician is in office he/she does the bidding of the big donors and corporations that funded his/her campaign. The system is rigged in favor of big money and there’s little or nothing to keep their greed in check.

@JudyHart1

3 жыл бұрын

Term limits will help with this.

@oliverheaviside2539

3 жыл бұрын

The real death knell was when political contribution laws were changed to recognize corporations as persons for campagn contributions, efectively removing all limitations on corporate contributions.

Steve. Yes cars have come a long way, but so have people. We have super computers on our hip capable of looking up any and all available materials on any possible subject. That's not even my issue. My issue is being able to fix my property how I choose. It's that simple. Corporate profits don't trump the right to personal property. Thanks for the content. This subject is important.

@holdemdang

3 жыл бұрын

@@M167A1 Please elaborate. If you're becoming owner you own. You might be more describing a warranty situation. If something is you're property there's not much of a gray line unless you're financing. But then it's not technically you're property yet.

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

At one point in the past it was believed to be so important that automobiles were such cherished property that the states created a system of "titling" to show absolute prove of ownership giving you total authority over it. We have been apathetic for to long.

@dough9512

3 жыл бұрын

@@bobr9605 But if we don't pay "rent" (taxes) on OUR property, we loose OUR property!!

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

@@dough9512 We have been divided and conquered. Just enough small pain on each issue to keep people from standing up. But I think we are getting there. Hopefully

I quit driving a truck for a living because of all the technology that is being installed on new trucks. Some of these systems are required by the government, and have not been thought out all the way and actually make the truck less safe.

@JasonW.

3 жыл бұрын

Run low on DEF? Watch the engine derate on power. Run out of DEF? Need to take it to dealer to reset computer so it runs correctly again.

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

So basically what Government is prohibited from doing to people (ie spying) they require companies to do in order to maintain a business license to operate. Just like requiring masks. When do people start to say enough?

@PatrikKron

3 жыл бұрын

Can you give an example of what is required, that makes it less safe?

Resting software to factory settings is only hard if the manufacturer wants it to be hard.

@snoopdogie187

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, look at all network equipment. Even home routers have a little button on the back, that in under a minute you can have everything back to factory settings. Everything else I've seen always takes longer. I will say that cable modems might be the first to go, you can't do anything except physically unplug them.

Everything is turning into an Apple product and it pisses me off.

@organiccold

3 жыл бұрын

Indeed.

@Vaga-Bard

3 жыл бұрын

And everyone claps and goes along.

@addiumuppicus5738

3 жыл бұрын

Used to be laws against monopolizing . . Oh that's right we used to have a Constitution too . My bad. But due to law of precident or ' popular' law . . .we now are a lawless society . Without law you have chaos ? Now where have I heard that before . . .

Cars have a lot of things today I don't want nor need.

@HH-ru4bj

3 жыл бұрын

Why don't you want a back up camera without depth perception because you have so many blind spots, and mirrors with no adjustment?

@mikemojc

3 жыл бұрын

I dont even get power windows or mirrors, because that's just ANOTHER expensive thing that can break.

@DT-kr1km

3 жыл бұрын

@@mikemojc - name ANY vehicle today that doesn't have those things standard? I haven't seen a single car in years without them.

@HustleMuscleGhias

3 жыл бұрын

@@DT-kr1km Last car I saw without those were my ex girlfriend's 2008 Chevy Cobalt has manual mirrors, manual windows, and no power locks. This was back in 2010.

@w0y4k15

3 жыл бұрын

_cough_ auto transmission _cough_ I mean, uh, yeah! HUD and all that other useless garbage that's becoming mandatory! Honestly, just a bunch of bureaucrats thinking they're "saving lives" by making shit mandatory. Truthfully, many of these features would become standard, and by then affordable, with a bit of time.

You are correct on the farming analogy. Tractors not as bad as Combines because some dealers can get a "loaner" tractor out to you quickly, but there are not many "loaner" combines since the combine is a dedicated harvest machine. Having a good dealer you can trust is key with the newer AG and construction equipment. Rebuilding and repowering older equipment is common now for farm and construction. Often you will see some older equipment on the farm or contractor lot which is not often used but they keep it around to have something dependable to fill in when the modern stuff breaks and they need to get work done. Lots of older tractors still in operating condition because of this problem. Lots of older skid steers, excavators, loaders, and dozers for the same reasons. The older stuff is often not as capable or efficient as the modern equipment, but the owners know they can keep it running when they need it.

Guess I’ll have to purchase my next tractor in Massachusetts.

@UncleKennysPlace

3 жыл бұрын

The real problem with tractor repairs is getting it to the dealership. I had a dealer two miles away; I could drive the tractor there! They closed, now it's sixty miles (and several hundred dollars for P/U) away.

the tractor warranty repair problem reminds me of the problems lehto has mentioned in the past about RV warranty repairs. - stand in line and take a number, we'll get to you when we get to you.

So basically they called Tim Cook up and asked how does Apple get away so easily with screwing their customers with 'no right to repair' my vastly overpriced product?

@springer-qb4dv

3 жыл бұрын

It's not Tim Cook. It's the stupid people who buy Apple products. Why buy Apple macbook with it's infamous un-repairability when you can buy similar pc laptops which are far more repairable at half the cost? Stupid people.

@olivertaylor4779

3 жыл бұрын

@@springer-qb4dv That's right, imo there are lots of dumb people who will buy anything just because it has an apple badge on it, I'm surprised they don't sell their 'waste' to make a few extra $$.

I would think that big companies like Napa, AutoZone and advanced auto would be lobbying against this. It would put all of them out of business.

@HustleMuscleGhias

3 жыл бұрын

Probably won't affect them much at first considering the large number of older cars on the road, for example, some people like myself own two vehicles made in 1988 that are still on the road.

@sethbarnes7608

3 жыл бұрын

@@HustleMuscleGhias I have a 67 Cadillac. I was shocked when I had to special order plug wires!😲😲

@boosteddaily1294

3 жыл бұрын

@@sethbarnes7608 Shocked? Why?

@Troy_Built

3 жыл бұрын

The dealers get a large portion of their stuff from those very companies. They aren't tying up a lift waiting for a delivery from their normal supply chain.

@MonkeyJedi99

3 жыл бұрын

I can't even get a replacement remote key fob on my Ford, because it is over 8 years old, and they don't keep the parts longer than that. Thank pasta that I still have key access to the car!

Like JinzoDefiler says, Louis Rossmann has a lot of deep knowledge on this. it's been a creeping reduction of the ability to fix your own equipment or have it fixed by the person you want. Even the ANSI people should be against proprietary tools and equipment that keeps someone out of his or her own products. But it's really becoming a _huge_ problem lately.

@HustleMuscleGhias

3 жыл бұрын

ASCII stupid question get a stupid ANSI.

@MrToddsCorner

3 жыл бұрын

What's really bad about Apple is that Louis has proven many times they force the customer to purchase a new computer when a 1/2 hours worth of work and a simple IC can be replaced to make the computer work good as new. Imagine if that happens with a car's computer - Sorry, we can't repair it, you have to fork out 40K if you wish to keep driving.

Hi Steve, great video & content. Just wish to pass on something I learned approx year 1969, just out of high school, Long Island, N.Y. working at a local autobody shop. That was run by a Man, who born and raised in the State of Tennessee, on a farm. His words: Farming is the only business that you purchase *RETAIL & SELL WHOLESALE.* Fast forward, 1978-79 Move to the State of Washington, living for the first time in my life, in a farming community. Boy did those words come to haunt me. Even today 2020, yes the farmer's can join a co-op to purchase say seed and some other small items, but basically still true for the farmer's.

Why would I want to take to dealer when aftermarket parts cost less and last longer in most cases I have found. My new car brakes wore out in 22000km, aftermarket have 65000km and still not worn out. Yes they also perform better.

Steve, That is why I have a 1970 Chevy Pick-up. If it won't run, there are only three things to check. It is not getting gas. It is not getting fire. The timing is off. Nice and simple. No sensors, No computers.

@TheBandit7613

3 жыл бұрын

You missed compression but I get the point.

@timothykeith1367

3 жыл бұрын

1970 C10s are very popular! I wish I had got one when they were just old trucks.

@HustleMuscleGhias

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheBandit7613 point or points?

I worked a few summers on a small farm. The farmer had one new-ish tractor that could handle the biggest machinery he had to hook up to it and the rest was all hooked up to old 1950s to 1980s tractors that he could keep alive himself. Since they were much cheaper he could have plenty of them which meant we could have a few of them going doing different tasks during harvest seasons and wouldn't have to switch machinery between tractors nearly as often.

If they can fix it remotely then they can also break it remotely.

I heard a long time ago that the reason they make things so difficult to repair is because an engineer came home to find his wife in bed with a mechanic.

@JasonW.

3 жыл бұрын

Then, the engineer and the mechanic found a common interest in music. Thus started Mike + the Mechanics.

@adamplummer2190

3 жыл бұрын

I'm sorry. She came on to me.

@jimmybuck834

3 жыл бұрын

Funny statement but I think you got it a little backwards. The mechanic was banging the wife but then she turned around and had her hubby the engineer to make things more difficult so her mechanic can make more for more hotel rooms.

3 months ago the neighbor lady ran away with a tractor salesman. The husband today got a john deere letter in the mail.

"Push auto repair fixes over the air" The 1980s me: "Flying cars! In 2020 we get flying cars! Gonna be the best year ever!"

@springer-qb4dv

3 жыл бұрын

Over the update reapairs is non sense pushed by Tesla fanboys. Why does Tesla owner need to wait months for simple bumper dent or broken windshield? You can't fix a car over the air. All you can do is push software patches and updates. Car is mechanical device first of all and even EVs need mechanical fixes for real car problems.

I'm not a PRO. mechanic, but have worked on everything from lawnmowers to heavy equipment, and I can tell you the complexity of everything is now over the top!! But I still work on everything I can and work around all the bullshit that cars and other machines are loaded with. We haven't bought a new car in 8 years, but brought the car back to the dealer for minor routine maintenance during the warranty period. Got decent deals on oil changes, brakes etc. But since the warranty expired, all bets are off, so I either do the work required myself or take it to an independent shop that doesn't charge dealer labor rates. So far, no computer problems, but that can be a nightmare if they act up. And if you lose your "smart key" or fob, that can cost hundreds of dollars to replace. Locksmiths charge less, but is still expensive!! If you're good with your hands there is still alot you can repair on your own car. If something trips you up on the electronic side of things, get a decent scan tool and check out a website called "alldata". Big help! And, if you get a "check engine" light but everything seems fine, could be something really minor like a loose gas cap. So check that first. Or just take it to an auto parts store like Autozone and they'll hook up a scan tool to tell you what the problem is. Then you take it from there. Everything today is a scam! Everything from working on your car to our elections are all rigged to screw the average person out of something, and force you to comply with some extreme or ridiculous rule, law or agenda. My philosophy is there is always a "work around", and if you're resourceful enough, you will find it. As for cars, the car maker that goes backward a bit and builds a simple, reliable, car that doesn't cost THOUSANDS of dollars that will last for years if you take care of it, and is repairable by the average guy, would be great!!! I don't need or want power windows, locks, seats, mirrors, back up cameras, navigation systems, self parking features, power trunk realeases, seat warmers, a turbo charged 500 horse power engine, electronic suspension adjustment, all wheel drive and ten on board computers to control all of it!!! Eventually even the cheapest cars will cost as much as a house. Some high end models today already do, and that's insane!!! But people like their luxury so there will always be a market for the rich. And that's fine. I don't live in that world. But a car is a labor saving device, much like a washing machine or a vacuum cleaner, when you get right down to it. It gets you from here to there, hauls people and things and is supposed to make life easier. But when the labor saving device that's supposed to make life better actually makes life more problematic, then the whole thing has to be re-thought. A car and the problems it creates shouldn't be first and foremost on anyone's mind. And farm equipment!! Don't get me started!

@machintelligence

3 жыл бұрын

A problem with trucks today is everyone questioned says that they want a simple work truck without all of the bells and whistles -- but no one buys them. Quite possibly the only folks with enough money to buy a new truck want the deluxe models and the working Joes always buy used vehicles.

@washingtonradio

3 жыл бұрын

I have had to pop into an Autozone while on the road to have the code retrieved. Fortunately it was a minor issue I could wait on until I got home. The importance is the information should be more user accessible and friendly but the automakers want it hidden and opaque so the owner is at their mercy.

@springer-qb4dv

3 жыл бұрын

No, there is no way around trying to fix complex custom electronics board with burned out chips where you have no supply of replacement chips. Just ask Louis Rossmann. That's why today's car overloaded with custom chips has very limited lifespan. Irv Gordon drove his trusty Volvo 3.2 million miles and over a lifetime, but that is impossible with today's cars.

For years John Deere used proprietary hydraulic fittings and a brand specific hydraulic fluid. Each available only from John Deere. Each substantially more expensive than the going market pricing. This was a contributing factor in our purchase of International Farmall tractors.

The real issue is the fact software companies can demand anything, the end user has no choice. There needs to be limitations and regulation on software companies to curb the greed and price gouging they are permitting to achieve.

Me and a friend have noticed and are amazed how much used construction equipment, tractors and other farm implements have risen in prices of the older machines without all the computerized crap on them. Apparently we are not the only ones buying them.

Appreciated your recent discussion with Rossman, Steve, you're a machine. Think you scared him a little, you're a consumer advocate, focused on making manufacturers doing right by the consumer. He's a repair guy focused on fixing things the consumers need fixed outside traditional channels ie: apple store (mostly, apple tries to screw everyone eventually, because of the closed distribution channel, consumers have no choice.) There used to be tv vcr hifi repair shops all over the country because the stuff louis wants available for a price, was available, for a price. Please reach out to him again, right to repair means different things to different people, he's a good guy, think you overwhelmed him, you ABSOLUTE legend.

I am a maintenance manager for a large corporation and what pisses me off more than anything is an OEM that takes a standard, off the shelf item and modifies is slightly to make it a proprietary spare part that you can only get from them at their price. For example, they will take a standard size bearing and alter it slightly. Like grinding the diameter down .005" and making the bearing pocket in the machine the same size so that you cannot fit the standard bearing into the machine. That $10 bearing from Grainger is now a custom OEM part that cost $145.

encrypting diagnostica data, had some fords that required odd sockets to remove some nuts/bolts that were not standard, had to buy 2 of the sockets from ford for nearly $90 each

@adamplummer2190

3 жыл бұрын

Not sure what should ckets you overpaid for from ford but I've never bought a ford socket and haven't yet. I sometimes have no choice and buy from an expensive company like snapon or mac tools or got to find it on eBay, but not dealers. The only time I need something like that is special adapters or installation brackets or jigs.

At work we had a Mercedes Sprinter which had a broken seatbelt (the short female side). We ordered the part, which was available from the dealer. The plan was to install it in our own facility (maintaining over 400 vehicles). The dealer explained that we could buy the part, however if we installed it, the vehicle would be rendered inoperable and would have needed a tow down to the dealership anyways.

Scary stuff. Because of the DMCA, manufacturers are putting chips into components that don't require them, just so they can use the DCMA to prevent you from working on it, or purchasing generic parts. I replaced an ABS control unit on my truck. Had to take it to the dealer for them to "program" it. I know one tech personally and was told they charged me just to hook it up to a machine a clear the trouble light. Although I have my own diagnostic equipment, if the component serial number doesn't match, it triggers a trouble light. After learning a bit more about how this particular code was stored, its a straight money maker for the dealership. Taking this to the extreme, how many people would buy shoes if when the laces broke or heels wore out, you had to send them in to be "serviced". Love your videos. Always something new.

You own the car, we own the technology that makes it run.

If my FIL had one of the newer John Deere tractors (his tractors are 1950-73), he would need to travel about 60 miles for service. While JD used to have three dealerships within 20 miles, they have all shut down or have converted to garden service. It is not practical to run to the dealership when there is a problem.

All my tractors are over 15 years old and I've gutted all the electronics and switched everything to mechanical gages and switches. Screw that nonsense with a simple diesel engine needing a computer.

not surprised. For many many years, dealers have been claiming that non-dealer oil changes would violate warranty, and such nonsense.

"You think cars are expensive? Price out farm equipment." Oh dear god, yes!!! I imagine the most basic farm tractor now runs about mid-six figures.

The aircraft industry has been this way for what nearly a 100yrs. I’m surprised the auto industry hasn’t regulated maintenance under the guise of safety years ago.

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

Hopefully the Boeing 737 Supermax with its issues will give us hope. But my guess is when the computer in your car causes death or injury the government will fine the company and tell the victim or family that justice was served by government getting money.

"Nothing Breaks Like a Deere!"

@pedrowhack-a-mole6786

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, the reason they are painted green has changed. Today that reason is the money it takes to repair them.

A lot of big tech names came to Nebraska in 2017 to scare us away from passing a similar law.

@A_Box

3 жыл бұрын

and how are things now?

We had a "Mag-Moss" class in our dealership chain, so that we'd not get into any trouble.

Electronics companies like Apple has been waging this war too. I hear this fight has also been going on in hospitals too.

@WhittyPics

3 жыл бұрын

This tech on cars is a direct result of the computer revolution

I’m waiting on right to repair our own wheelchairs I made an adjustment to a seat on my Pride mobility chair my warranty was denied for faulty electronics.

Last week, I did 3 repairs to my car. I diagnosed one problem by using a code scanner and a cellphone app. The dealership, one mile down the street is probably sad that I saved about $1000. Springfield, Massachusetts.

Please do keep an eye on this topic. It is more important than most people realize.

It's not just warranties at issue. It's accessibility of parts and information. I can go to a dozen places to buy an oil filter for my car from any of a dozen manufacturers. Well, I can for older cars. If an IC chip on my phone burns out, or there is a software glitch in my tractor, or something like, the manufacturers and sellers have been working HARD to make getting those parts, the information on how to repair, and the data to reset things software-based, is impossible to get legally. - I voted yes on that initiative, and I explained it to my friends who were exposed to the "Someone will get your information from your car and rape and murder you!" ads, and THEY voted yes on the initiative. - And why is there even all that supposedly "sensitive" data stored in the car? It doesn't need to be there, except for the auto makers to find ways to profit.

It strikes me that used car buyers never agreed to the terms the manufacturer imposed upon the original new car buyer. They need to be unbridled in this way. Not everyone is wealthy and able to afford the dealer repair prices which are almost universally agreed upon to be price inflated.

My father had a tractor in for service took them over 3 months to repair. He had to go buy another tractor or he would have missed the cutting season. A bit of financial hardship for him but when you have to work do then no choice.

Last week an Amish carriage pulled by a beautiful horse trotted by my house. Hearing these issues make me think they have the right idea about transportation!

The big issue right now is Alldata. You have to pay PER car for the in-depth info to fix the cars! It is some outrageous amount!

@davidtryon1205

3 жыл бұрын

Wow really, they've gotten really grimey. That's insane. So u pay a subscription for what? Does it show u like an oil change only now and u gotta pay each car for something u may actually need to use it for. That's just crazy. Money grabs everywhere.

Steve, I appreciate you covering right-to-repair work. It's been a while since I'd heard anything about it. I remember when my state of Nebraska was considering this in the unicameral and it was shot down. John Deere and associated groups flat-out said in the hearings that if we passed the law they would do no more business in Nebraska. The farmers came into the equation on their end because they can't have John Deere leave the state. It's like battered woman syndrome. We live about 40 miles from the nearest dealership. During harvest season you'll see the dealership's pickups out on the fields as if they were the farmers' overseers. Every time the slightest thing breaks the farmers have to sit there like they're playing a game of freeze-tag with the combine. They call the dealership and the dealership sends their pickup over from the neighbor's place to plug their computer in and find out what the problem is. If it's big enough, the farmers have to wait until someone else can drive the parts up from town. The same John Deere dealership owns just about every single location in the state. It's the "Plains Equipment Group" from here to Omaha. I live four hours from Omaha if you drive 80 miles an hour. You can't tell me this isn't just a perpetuation of the exact kind of monopoly the Clayton Antitrust Act was targeting. Don't get me wrong, I love big business-- it makes products cheaper for everyone, but when you have to rely on the business more than your own family just to get simple things fixed, it's time to do something about it. And so what if these statutes create cyber-security risks? The equipment doesn't have to be that complicated in the first place. Maybe these initiatives will give manufacturers more incentive to make products that are less complicated and expensive. It's the same problem with the fed's rules on semi trucks: the older ones are worth more money because they have less regulatory baggage tied to them.

Years ago, here in California, the state government started pushing for OBD II ( Onboarded Diagnostics Two ). As technicians, we didn't want the state being involved in anything. In point of fact, the head of standards, and training was a college classmate of mine. He was not trained as an engineer, but the state of California gave him the official title of engineer. He was in fact trained as a High School wood shop teacher, with zero background in anything related to automotive technology. The first conflict I had with him, was with the proprietary new connecter to be used with the purposed new OBDII system. I wanted a standard 28 pin connector, such as commonly used on computers to be used, as the last thing the world needs is another connector, when there are so many already in use. He absolutely refused, citing the need for more pins, and a connecter that couldn't be hacked !!! His proposed connecter, had fewer than 28 pins, and was immediately hacked. I followed him through our 3o plus years of career, and always challenged his every BS proposal, based upon his lack of technical expertise. I managed to defeat him several times, because he would always push Snap On tools diagnostic equipment, some of which was clearly inferior to other equipment on the market, and always overpriced. He quickly ended all public input meetings, to prevent me from cutting into his kick back scheme with Snap on tool company. I always loved facing off against him in public input meetings, because I always came prepared with diagnostic models, and was able to demonstrate, even to non technical folks that his proposed mandatory equipment requirements were un necessary, and that proper education, and training were what was needed, not more gadgetry !!! The whole of California's automotive emissions control laws are rife with fraud, and misinformation. Not just because of an incompetent wood shop teacher pretending to be an automotive engineer. One former head of the Bureau of Automotive repair, was trained as a Psychologist, and had spent his entire working career as a printer, while another former head repeatedly presented himself as an Attorney at Law, when he held no such credentials. When I brought this up in a public information meeting, he wouldn't answer, and became extremely up set. Apparently he knew in advance that I would challenge him, and he was so frightened that he had several members of the California Highway Patrol ( California State Marshals ) accompany him to the meeting here in Fresno. Shortly after my peaceful, and verbal only, confrontation he resigned to avoid further embarrassment. Northing proprietary is going to be any good for any consumer. Being able to innovate, and compete in a rising technological market place will serve to promote excellence, and reduce consumer costs through open competition. I remember when GM, Ford, and Chrysler thought they had the lock on the Automotive Market Place in the United States. We can clearly see what happened to them. Without government protections of their outdated technology, and sloppy engineering and technology, the Japanese, and others quickly eclipsed the automotive market with quality products at a reasonable price, not to mention better fuel efficiency, and lower maintenance costs. The Japanese, and others are already coming for the agricultural, and heavy equipment market. American Manufactures of all kinds need to wake up and smell the coffee. We are about to be beaten again, by our own ignorance, and arrogance !!! Tim

This makes me think of two things with the local dealer and my moms car. My mom lives on the coast and there is no dealer for her car close by so she has to take it inland to where I live for repair. It is a 2 hour drive. My father passed away in 2017 and my mom knows nothing about cars. She takes her car to the dealership for every service and follows the dealer warranty and service recommendations. Well two events have happened in the last year and both have her and I just mad as heck. 1. Her vehicle has a CVS transmission. She received a notice from the manufacturer that stated the warranty was extended on the transmission to 5 years. Now the original warranty was for 5 years, so she assumed this meant her warranty on the car was extended from date of purchase. The vehicle was purchased used from the dealer in 2017 just months before dad died. Anyway the CVS transmission failed and needed to be replaced. We took it in to be repaired and she thought it was still under warranty, but they said no because the warranty started when the car was manufactured and didn't apply to the date of purchase. She showed them the paper stating the warranty was extended for 5 years and they said that was from manufacturer date and that the 5 year warranty had expired 3 months ago. She was out the entire cost of a new transmission. I called the local transmission specialist to see what it would cost to repair and was told that they didn't work on CVS transmissions, nor could they rebuild them. They would have to buy it from the dealership and then install it. I got the same answer from my favorite mechanic in town. Ended up having the dealer do the work since it was already there and the price elsewhere was pretty much the same. The fact that the CVS transmission is not a piece of the car that anyone, including the dealership, can work on, and that the entire transmission had to be replaced 5 years after purchase, just screamed at me, this is a scam. 2. Same car, same dealer. Mom received a recall notice about a faulty airbag. She contacted the dealer who didn't have the parts. Months later she was told they could now repair the car, but she had to make the appointment right now before they ran out of parts again, so she made an appointment and brought the car in. Remember 2 hour drive. They had us bring it in and we waited in the showroom for a few hours for them to "fix" the airbag. Then went home. Now while driving back home she noticed that the airbag sensor light in the dash was on. She called the dealer about it and they told her to bring the car back in. So now she had to drive 2 hours back to have them check the sensor. They found that the plug under the seat was unplugged and charged her $170 to plug it back in. She asked if it could have been unplugged while they performed the airbag fix recall. They said no since that was in a different part of the car. They said she probably unplugged it herself shoving something under the seat. She never shoves stuff under her seat, but does have a small dog in the car. Anyway, they said, "No we didn't unplug the airbag while working on the airbag, wasn't us. Now pay us $170." Sound fishy to anyone?

Same thing happening with lawn tractors sold by the dealership. To preserve the warranty you MUST use their parts. And if there is a problem, the lawn tractor must be taken back to the dealer to unlock the computer preventing the tractor from starting and read the code that caused the computer to prevent the tractor from starting. Which ends up a simple sensor malfunctioning.

Auto makers are NOT winning this one. At least not in Massachusetts.

@workingshlub8861

3 жыл бұрын

@@LostInThe0zone true.....how many times in mass has the courts or legislators ignored will of the people and just did what they wanted....remember gay marriage was given the green light by the mass supreme court not the voters or even the legislator....i could care less who marries who but that is what happens all the time here in mass...

That's why I like my 59 Chevy truck so much. It's reliable, easy to maintain, and easy to repair when needed, and I can fix it myself without a computer or high dollar tools and equipment. I also don't have to worry about anyone wanting to steal it since very few people would know how to drive it, if they could figure out how to start it.

This is exactly why I bought a 1966 Chevy Belair for a daily driver. I kept having electrical failures on my vehicles that took forever to diagnose and repair myself. Keep in mind I’m trained on modern cars but the equipment to read a computer to the level one occasionally has to is still super cost prohibitive. A $34 scanner will read about all the codes but it won’t read what we call live data. In fact I spent 10 times that just to be able to read data on a 95 trans am I had because I couldn’t even go to a dealership or a regular shop to get codes read simply because it used what I call OBD1.5 obd2 took over in 96 and in 95 on that car they used elements of it and the same port as obd2 but the problem is it’s different enough that a normal scanner couldn’t read it properly. My 2007 Colorado was expensive to repair and my 04 envoy just about broke me. Before that I had a Honda Civic and same thing when something did break it was so expensive that it could take me two or 3 weeks to have enough money to fix it then there was still the time it took to actually do it. With this Belair it’s very different in a matter of hours I can have it back on the road with relative ease other than the wait on parts it doesn’t take any major time to do anything. I can have the engine in an out in a a day if I need to

My mid-80s Chevrolet had a big 32 pin connector beneath the steering column. I always paid extra money to get the real GM shop manual, so I could short pin 1 and pin 32 together with a jumper, and the check engine light would flash code. With the table in the shop manual, I was able to get the messages, almost all related to the Mass Airflow Sensor. I went to the parts desk at a dealer and asked for one. I was asked how I diagnosed the problem, and I simply said "I'm getting these codes" without mentioning HOW I got those codes. I was sold the part, installed it, and after a short drive, I had no more codes. I drove that car until I got hit from behind for the third time and my auto-body man said that repairing it again wouldn't result in a car strong enough to withstand a fourth collision.

I drive a 2016 Hyundai Azera. Front turn signal light burned out. It’s a dealer only part, $39.00 vs $.38c for most other turn signal lights bulbs. Ridiculous!

Another thing about the time-sensitivity of agriculture: Farmers don't just say, "Today is the day I wish to harvest my crops, and if I have to wait a week it will simply be inconvenient." No, they have to deal with critical time constraints outside of their control, like THE WEATHER. Some crops must be harvested only while the weather is dry, and some crops must SIT OUT AND DRY after being cut before it's collected or else they will quickly rot in storage. Sometimes the harvest needs to get done ahead of an approaching storm or the seasonal freeze which will DESTROY the crops. Plus, most large scale agriculture occurs VERY FAR from dealerships and "authorized repair shops," so that even if the repair shop isn't delayed with multiple repair jobs, it can take hours for a technician to be dispatched and arrive on site, or if the machine has to be hauled into town just getting to the shop can be an entire day wasted.

My Honda dealer has put on my work order that if I do not have their repairs done by them, they will not honor my warranty. The problem is nothing is wrong with my vehicle, just ways to get more money out of the owners. I feel sorry for citizens who trust their dealers and they are taken for possible not needed repairs. As a mechanic who as built many vehicle, I know when they are trying to blow smoke up my ---.

The manufactures freaked out that if someone tinkers with the car someone crashes and dies the lawyers sue the deep pockets auto manufacturers.

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

Agreed, but their available solution to lawsuit losses should not be the ability to wirelessly vandalize private property to generate revenue.

A big example of this was here in Michigan. Company in Auburn Hills was taking Fisker Cars (when they were out of business several years ago) and putting Corvette Engines in. Problem was, all the controls and emission programs associated with the engines were the property of GM. To gain access, first GM had to decide if they were worthy and then of course there was oversight and a charge.

every part for the product should be available at a cost of no more than 4 times the cost to the manufacturer. the manufacture buys it for $10, doubled the costs to $20 to the dealer, the dealer cannot do more than double that cost. that goes for cell phone batteries, screens, transmissions, harvest equipment, etc.

Also, on the tractor topic - if a farmer must send his/her tractor to the dealership, they need to trailer that tractor to the dealers location - which may cost over a $1,000 per round trip! Only to have that tractor sit at the dealership for a week or two until it is looked at! Versus having the diagnostic SW at the farm to determine the issue and resolve it at the farm’s location!

Thank You & Ms. Heather! Living in the SciFi future... Posting on Facebook...

Tractors now have all kinds of computer systems and gotten so complex that you usually have to call a specialty mechanic or haul it to a dealer for even routine maintenance service and nearly all moderate or major repairs. It's quite a hassle and very expensive, so that you have to figure those costs on top of the cost of the equipment.

Hey Steve, Substitute the word auto with iPhone, or iMac, or MacBook and you have the exact same argument. Also, further to what you stated about the tractors. Think a bit more. How far away is the dealership for these tractors from the farms? How much in pure logistical cost to the farmer to simply get the tractor to and from the dealerships? $6000 ? $8000 just to pickup and deliver round trip some of these tractors are MASSIVE. You are exactly right about many of them are looking at older products pre-locked down computers. You ever watch Goldrush? a year or 2 ago they had a new water pump, it kept tripping codes and shutting off. Think how much $$ it cost them in down time and potential lost gold recovery due to lack of proper water. It could not be fixed even after acquiring the very costly and complex software diagnostic program. Their solution in the end was to remove the computer control section all together thus passing the flaky sensors. After they did, it ran 100% without any further issues. The costs to the operation were if I recall, well over 2 if not close to 3 times the cost of the pump and software, and training course for the mobile mechanic that was on staff. Pioneer pumps I think is the brand. Great video. It's no wonder that Warren Buffet invested in JD around the time years ago that they started down this path of only the dealer can repair.... Follow the $$$ always!

Nebraska and Montana are also having "right to repair" laws working their way through their respective Legislatures.

One of the biggest issues for farmers is the nearest dealer maybe a several hours away and sending a huge combine or tractor to the dealer and shipping it back can add several thousand dollars to the repair just in shipping it.

'Future Steve' ha, love it. Man, younger Steve should be impressed that he became a self made man (not in the mafia sense). Darn it, if I had to bring back my previous Ford to the dealer to get it fixed every time it had a hissy fit I would have junked it 6 years ago. Its still running like a train apparently. Much more green to keep old cars running as long as possible. Yes there's a time to let them go, but much better to ring every last mile before they head for the "back roads in the sky". Also people need to be incentivized to want to keep things going for longer- disposable/planned obsolescence products (looking at you HP printers ...) cost a heap in terms of natural resources. Anyhoo ramble over, great show, thanks again.

What does one do when a garage refuses to work on your 30 + yr. old vehicle. Been working on my own cars for the past 55 yrs.

Work with a guy who bought a new car and the windshield wiper motor stopped working. Not covered by warranty and new design so no aftermarket part.

Wireless repairs (as you termed it) to a vehicle could only fix software based (rare) anomalies, and wireless security patches (since alot of vehicles broadcast wireless access). It does not repair a bad running engine. What limited access does do is, prevent 3rd party repair shops from ACCESS to and DIAGNOSES of operational data, which helps track down the source of a problem. Though there are plenty of repair shops that don't have the OEM test equipment but rely on experience and 3rd party help to get the job done. If we prevent vehicle repair shops from repairs or operational data, where does the scope of this idea stop? No longer can consumers or repair shops repair anything that wasn't manufactured or sold by them. Ridiculous.

Steve, I can think of one instance where you have to buy the OE oil filter to maintain the warranty: Our friend the Ford 6.0 Powerstroke diesel. Why? Ford patented the size / design of the OE filter, making it impossible for aftermarket filters to fit properly since they have to be a different size! The other problem Right to Repair addresses isn't simply maintaining the warranty of you vehicle / widget, it's that lack of service information and proprietary diagnostic software means the tools to do the job are held hostage by the manufacturer. Without the dealer scan tool, for example, I can't change the radio on my Cadillac with a used one from the junkyard. The radio gets locked to the VIN of the car, and if you swap it around, it deactivated.

@compu85

3 жыл бұрын

@@lookingbehind6335 Well, in 2003 nobody new what troubles were in store. We actually had an 03 F350 6.0, and it was fairly reliable.

Any mechanic here wrenching back in the 1980's can tell you every Chrysler engine with a knock in the overhead cam was due to cheap non factory oil filters with defective anti drain back valves. So there are problems with MM Act... Today, oil grades are required for various engines and putting the wrong oil in it can cause severe damage. The big issue I have besides the battle for repair data is anti theft methods that make key cutting and adding remotes a strictly an OEM thing. Or cost prohibitive aftermarket thing. Sometimes between same makes / models but different trim levels you may or may not require a visit to the dealer... Phone dongles/scanners may give you some insight but a professional level tool is usually required to really fix the car. A lot of these issues are being driven by gov regulation and emissions control requirements.

I see two sides here, yeah, somebody is messing with your car's brakes who doesn't know what he's doing, he 'fixes' it, and then you have an accident due to brake problems and some lawyer sues the car company for the brake problem. My take, you mess with it, you take responsibility. Other side, particularly farm equipment, when something breaks or doesn't work, you need to get it fixed pronto or maybe the whole factory or farm closes down until, furthermore and I've had this happen, "so you're on the highway and have a flat tire, yeah we got an opening next week to fix that, just get a tow truck and have them drop it here". A tow truck for a $250,000 farm combine is a flatbed trailer and if you live in Iowa the dealer might be 100 miles down the road so you're looking a a $500 bill each way just to get the damned thing to the dealer. Dealers are often rather pricey in repair costs and many make far more on repairing equipment than on selling it. The worst issue is serialization, each part has a number that is registered in the car's computer and let's say you have a fender bender and the body guy replaces it with an identical fender in perfect condition from a junked car and then tries to start the car and gets a computer message 'unauthorized fender attached, will not start', some computer makers are doing this now. I hereby nominate Louis Rossmann for the Nobel Prize in consumer protection.

My gut says they are going to be able to block the law. Then will this right to repair turn to antitrust litigation? It seems they are actively trying to shut everyone one for no legitimate reason.

I believe this is becoming an issue due to profit.... dealerships make very little respectively when selling a vehicle... they make a hefty sum on repairs and useless warranties

@bobr9605

3 жыл бұрын

Buying an extended warranty today is akin to the old days when thugs would suggest you pay them to protect your car from the implied vandalism they would do if you don't pay them. When GM decides they need more revenue and can decide that Bill Smith in Dubuque needs a transmission today because they have left him alone long enough, its a problem

The crazy thing is we already went through this in the mid 90’s with obd1 every manufacturer had their proprietary diagnostic tools and codes then the feds stepped in and said they all need to use a standardized set of codes and ports introducing obd2

In 1973 auto manufactures were banned from using whale oil in it’s paint. The first year of two the hood would start to rust. The factory rep said the owner should have kept the car waxed. The auto manufactures did eventually fix the problem a few years later but would no cover the affected cars under warranty. I was a service manager back then and took care of the painting myself.

Good topic, thanks.

Not to mention the cost of shipping a major piece of farm equipment to a dealership. Most cases a tractor trailer is needed.

It's a difficult Restoration 😨. Congratulations to you 👍👍👍

I was having some strange electrical problems with a Saturn VUE and my OBD reader didn't show any problem so I brought it to the dealer who's OBD reader also showed nothing wrong and even though the car was still in warranty I was charged 1/2 price for the few seconds it took for them to plug in their OBD reader and they didn't fix the car. I got home and in a few minutes determined that the problem was with the fuse and relay box as it wobbled a bit. The fuse box plugs into a socket in the engine compartment, I got out my socket set and found the retaining screws that hold the fuse and relay box in place were never tightened down. I got charged $50.00 and still had to fix the problem myself.

Hell Steve I remember when all you needed to work on a car was a timing light, dwell meater and a vacuum gauge. It seems to me when I buy a car I've bought the rites to the software . There is nothing in the contract saying that I am not buying those rites.

@dogsplantscarsneatstuff176

3 жыл бұрын

My Dad's 77 Chev. 3/4 ton pickup is that way since it has no points I don't need a dwell meter but I do check it with a timing light. My favorite modern idea is the fly by wire parking brake: electronic parking brake. They are going to replace a $40 cable with $600 of software modules and solenoids that introduce a much lesser reliability. Progress is so wonderful and logical.

@dogsplantscarsneatstuff176

3 жыл бұрын

@Obilwe wufuh Mubufu Oulou I will give you that they may send you in the right direction but not always. Yes it is wonderful that I can get an oxygen sensor error and look at that fast. You can get a EGR error and your exhaust manifold gasket could leak. I think now you need more experience as a diagnostician to work on modern cars. I would say wiring diagrams now a days are the most important part of car diagnosis since a car is multiple computers on wheels.

@misterdeplorable2088

3 жыл бұрын

And baling wire

@misterdeplorable2088

3 жыл бұрын

stuff I've already driven a 2020 with that so called "feature" and IT SUCKS ! No more drifting the front wheel drive car.....

@silaskuemmerle2505

3 жыл бұрын

@Obilwe wufuh Mubufu Oulou I highly doubt that a set of servomotors would be lighter than a simple steel cable, as someone who likes to repair my own car, I don’t care if it takes more parts if it’s more reliable.

I had a Ford minivan years ago that required the engine to be lifted to change the spark plugs. My husband always fixed our vehicles but couldn’t do this. $200 later on top of the cost of spark plugs we were off and running. That was a lot of money for us and it was a reduced rate because the mechanic had been married to my husband’s cousin.

Apollo 13, those guys invalidated the warranty!

This is why I refuse to belong to an HOA!

The manufactures are going to lose that lawsuit and here’s why. if my phone doesn’t work the worst I suffer is I can’t communicate with other people momentarily, but I can find away and my phone may only cost $50 if my car doesn’t work for a week ,I could lose my job, or house for missing work for a week and getting fired...furthering that if I can’t afford to repair my car because the dealership wants $1800 for repair that I can get done at a small shop for $400 they have affectively hamstrung me and prevented me from continuing to use the product that I own , I have an argument that the dealership, Is preventing me from life liberty and the pursuit of happiness ,vehicles delve into every part of our lives safety being only one of the pursuit of happiness, family , a job , (spending years to pay for that car)and they cost a lot of money to begin with. so comparing them to a phone , as you can buy less sophisticated phones , and I could get another phone for $50 that will suffice , moreover it is obvious to most people that are in the know , that car companies like Ford Mercedes-Benz and a few others are making their vehicles complicated not for improvement to the owner but so the owner cannot work on the vehicle, without the purchase of special tools affectively forcing you to choose either the tools which will cost you $400 that you’ll use only one time or taking it to a dealership to do that work and any engineer who understands that this over Application of parts and software is to that end, forcing you to use the dealership and they’ve done it for a long time in a few areas and everybody shrugged her shoulders and said well The little guy can’t fix everything got to give some back to the dealerships but now they like all big tech companies are vying for “complete control“ On recent Ford F150 of the carrier bearing a $30 part goes out you have to purchase the entire driveline and components which cost $1800 clearly this is done to gouge a customer, as there is zero argument ever be made that the product is superior because of its nature, especially when it fails at the same rate as the previous part Ford or fraud as I call them is trying their hardest to rid them selves of clients as fast as possible with all of the recent recalls and failures on so many different models it’s astonishing., and people have noticed two friends of mine who both had problems one with the Ford car and the other and F150 both less than five years old swore to never purchased another Ford product because of how they were treated and how little Ford cared about their wallets or as one friend put it that’s all they cared about was getting a hold of my my credit cards, and other patriot companies like Chrysler /dodge are picking them up at a fast rate... go Ford!

They go further. They put chips in parts that have absolutely no need for active electronics with the sole purpose of shutting down the vehicle if a part without that chip is installed. Then the dealer can charge a huge labor penalty for removing the unauthorized part and resetting the system. I hope more states follow suit and stop this crap from going on.