I fitted the Cadance runner data. Got the Metaspeed Edge plus. Got foot slapping and a boring shoe. Nothing like a Supershoe feel. Kept it as a Tempo trainer.. Got the Metaspeed Sky Plus. First fit is wider in the Sky Plus 👍🏻. Now the feel is like a real Supershoe. I run so well and enjoy it so much... I love the extreme front rocker in the Sky Plus.. Love the energy return.. Had non of those in the Edge Plus.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Almost every runner I've talked to about this, who has tried both shoes, says the same thing. I was labeled a "cadence" runner from the Asics event I went too but never liked the Edge/Edge+ though for a while I thought I had to run in it. The magic Speed 3 opened my eyes and the Sky+ has been remarkable for me. I would never of tried the Sky+ just listening to Asics marketing. 🤷🏼‍♂️

@i.p2088

11 ай бұрын

@@SagasuRunning Very interesting that you don't like the Edge plus but like the MagicSpeed 3..

@DillonJan

11 ай бұрын

I had both the nike vaporfly next % 2 and the asics metaspeed edge+. Preferred the ride of the edge+ in comparison to the vaporfly next % 2, more stable on the foot, less wobbly on the heel at corners or when slowing down. The stiffness of the edge+ for me is anything below 10k kind of a run.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

@@i.p2088 It’s the foam. Squishy FFBlast+ makes the difference. That Vaporfly, plate low to the ground in the forefoot configuration, needs a softer squashier foam… FFTurbo is just too firm for it.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

@@DillonJan The way you think of the use case for the Edge+ makes so much more sense than the way Asics tries to describe it. I also like the Magic Speed 3 for shorter road distances, especially in training, over the Vaporfly 3… Asics stiffer plate has more pop. Just not with FFTurbo in that configuration.

Absolutely Brilliant!!! Very very well done. I hope people really take all of this knowledge in. Great job. Evidence based information is King!

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

I appreciate the support. Was less trying to show evidence and walk through the methodology many product teams work with when creating and marketing products. I bet Asics has sales numbers to validate much of this, true evidence.

Great video.. finally Sagasu answered 🤙🏻

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

🙌🏻

I’ve tried Sky+ and Edge+, I prefer the Edge+ because I don’t have a huge booming stride. The foam on the Edge+ seems to be more evenly distributed compared to the Sky+. However the ride is a bit harsher on the the Edge+ because the drop of carbon fiber plate is steeper. For my stride it is perfect especially in the later stages of the race when fatigue sets in, it keeps my cadence up. I also find it more stable. The Sky+ is great as well. Definitely less harsh. It seems like the foam is a bit more in the midfoot and less on the heel area which makes it a little more unstable. It’s definitely made for more forefoot and midfoot striking and a bigger stride. Since the carbon plate drop is not as steep, it’ll take a more effort later in the race to keep the cadence up. Also if there are hills on the course, I think the Edge+ has the advantage because of the drop. It keeps your cadence up as you power through those hills. Other than that, both are great. It just depends on what you are looking for. These shoes are tools. I think the Edge+ has an advantage on courses that have steeper hills. The Sky+ has an advantage on more flat courses. If I had the money, I would get both. 😂 I can use the these tools for the right job.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Love the shoe are tools reference. Touché 🙌🏻 The Edge+ is a harsher ride because of the positioning of the plate closer to the ground in the forefoot and the overall stiffness of the plates Asics use. That midfoot dip in the plate is key, but not the one Asics uses. The Vaporfly has the real magic (that Asics can’t go near due to patents)… my “plates vs rods” video goes into this at length, as does my more recent “marathon training episode 01” specifically to the Edge. That plate configuration needs a softer foam to work optimally, which FFTurbo is not. In the Sky+ the plate is very close to the foot, has a subtle S curve to it and that allows you to load and use the firmness and lower resiliency of FFTurbo optimally. That being said… I do like the Edge+ plate… in the Magic Speed 3. The stiffer carbon and more aggressive toe spring Asics uses (over Nike) really has a ton of pop and we’ll pair with the squish of FFBlast+ softening it out just enough… it feels great. Im also naturally a cadence runner but actively working on lengthening my stride… which I also talk about in the “marathon training episode 1” video… which is why I’m enjoying the Sky+ at the moment.

I'm loving my Asics Magic Speed 3 and if I ever buy an even faster shoes from them, it would be the newest Edge model. The drop( -7-8mm) seems good enoughn for me. And I believe to be a cadance runner for sure. I'm not a fast runner but I move my legs so fast when only running around 5:00 per Km (max speed for 5km) that seems that other runners passing me are moving their legs in slow motion ! 😅

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

I’m also naturally a cadence runner, at threshold my cadence can get above 220spm easily… which given I have short legs looks ridiculous and can be a big limitation if I allow it… so I focus alot on form and am working on lengthening my stride right now… so the Sky+ is a great tool. That being said…. The Vaporfly will always win for over the Edge… but the Magic Speed 3 is a great shoe! A surprising shoe.

Thanks!

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Thank you for the support. It is much appreciated! 🙌🏻🤙🏻

I have the bright orange Edge. Because it was 50% off and because I needed fast shoe that has more room in the toe area. I race up to 10K. It's fast, it's airy, it's stable, has good grip in dry and wet conditions. I can admit that I'm not that deep in the shoe technologies and I haven't tried that many different brands/models, but I'm happy with the pair. And it's actually a rare thing for me, I have kinda bad luck with shoes, it's always something little wrong with the shoes that I buy for some reason.. hah I maybe lucked out with these.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Sounds like you did luck out. The Edge isn't a bad shoe. if it works for you, it works. Its more that the Sky+ is the better use of Asics tech. The outsoles Asics uses on the Metaspeeds and Magic Speed are outstanding, some of the best out there. For sure!

I think you are right that ASICS is going to most likely quietly drop the whole Sky and Edge distinction. Definitely a marketing misstep.

@SagasuRunning

10 ай бұрын

Agree... complexity for little actual user benefit.

ASICS has definitely been a very innovative company the last three years or so (though they have been innovative throughout their history). I actually think they are underrated. They don't get enough credit for how innovative they have actually been. Especially when it comes to something like the Superblast

@SagasuRunning

10 ай бұрын

Completely agree. Asics has really shown the ability and desire to experiment with new ideas, that have value. They really have been making excellent product over the past 3 years especially.

When it comes to the average runner/consumer I see at least 90% of people choose Nike over any other brand. This is mostly down to how established Nike is as a sports brand than how other brands trying to compete against them. They either go to the Nike store to order a pair of Nike shoes or they go to a local shoe outlet to buy one from there without even considering what other brands offering. I must say Asics are doing a great job designing their shoes visually because someone I know was just about to order a pair of Nike running shoes until I told them about the Asics and when he saw the shoes he changed his mind and he wanted to order nimbus 25 instead even though Nike option was more budget friendly. That explains why I'm seeing asics running shoes on casual consumers who mostly use their shoes for apparel purposes than running. Also shoe marketing dynamics differ from region to region. In my country you won't be able to get any Saucony running shoes here unless you order one from overseas which costs a lot more. Hoka and New Balance barely exist in the market and brands like Nike, Adidas, Puma and Reebok thrive in this region due to less competition from other brands. Even though Asics launch their new model faster than any brand in this area they struggle to sell the shoes unless they discount them heavily.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Nike's brand impression is very high. Brand awareness and brand recall for Nike is off the charts. In fact they defined the chart when it was created for the running (athletic) market. Asics has been doing a great job lately. Their 2023 design language is fresh and modern and has none of the clunky old school stuff that has always plagued Asics. On the other side of that, in the fashion/casual space, the clunky/retro thing Asics is known for is is big for Gen Z. So Asics is having a moment across the board. Here in Taiwan...Adidas is the king for running, then New Balance. Nike is around, but Nike is more basketball/"baller" here, though Alphaflys are popular here for runners. Mizuno is more popular over Asics here as well. Puma and Hoka are around but much more niche. There are a few Taiwan specific shoes people run in here as well. When I'm in Japan it's a totally different story. I do find the regional differences in the running shoe space very interesting and given I travel alot I always make note of them.

The best Sky is v1. If the Sky+ haves the first plate of Sky v1 really shines more and more.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

You may want to check out the Asics S4 model… that’s basically what you get, in a little wider shoe. Currently it’s a Japan only release but there are rumors that it will be getting an international release soon.

@isidrotormogarcia4879

11 ай бұрын

@@SagasuRunning ohhhh great news. Thank you so much😊

Nike marketing very good with their “fluff” in marketing but more so with aesthetics. They make great looking shoes. ASICS probably tried to be more specific with cadence vs stride because serious runners are specific and looking for any way to assist them to be efficient. But like you said, most are just average runners who just want to run. Where I live, smaller suburban town south of Cleveland,OH, brooks is king…every one has ghosts, glycerins, etc etc. even racing in them so it shows me that most want a simple dependable shoe. I have the original sky and love it. I am a forefoot runner at 6’2 so my stride tends to be longer anyways. The appearance of more foam in the forefoot made me choose that shoe but I have many shoes cuz I’m a shoe tech nerd lol 🤓

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Nike are the masters of anything marketing. Apple is the company most refer to now-a-days as the masters… but Steve Jobs always referred too (and models Apple marketing) off of Nike. Nike also has the top engineering and R&D in the industry, which isn’t a slight on other brands, it’s just Nike throws away more R&D ideas than anyone else. Also, Asics is, always has been, the “serious runner’s” brand. I respect the brand deeply for that. So of course they are going to try things that are niche and technical. But average runners are who buy most of the running shoes out there. Brooks dominates most local areas due to how they focus in on running stores and they (generally) make non flashy and solid shoes… that look and feel like what many people think a running shoe should be. Simple and dependable… and not overly expensive too boot. Sounds like we both enjoy the Sky for the same reasons… though I’m only 5’8” and have short legs as well… but a “long” stride is relative! 🙌🏻

I raced a 10k in the Edge+ and it was brutal - made my Takumi Sen 8 races feel easy breezy!

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

That’s saying something. Wow… because the only shoe I’ve ever run in that I can think is as brutal as the Edge is the Takumi Sen 8/9!

It seems to me that Asics designed the Metaspeed Edge+ for runners who extend their leg well behind the hip at toe-off. Nearly every elite runner does this, and the data shows that the elites get less benefit from the carbon plated shoes so far compared to slower or heavier runners. The Metaspeed Sky+ builds up the foam in front of the forefoot, which should help runners who don't extend far behind the hip or simply run slower with shorter strides. Since it seems every other carbon plated shoe is a compromise between the two, Asics might be the first to carbon plate 2.0.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

Yes, the other way of explaining stride vs cadence is hip vs ankle strategy… that does exactly what you described. I have only seen studies that state the exact opposite of what you described elites vs normal runners and responding plated shoes. I’d love a link or two to the studies you have read! No doubt that there are a bunch of elites that want non plated Superfoam race shoes. I covered this in my last video about the Superblast. I do think Asics will possibly get to the “next gen” super shoe first… in fact I think they are almost there (see my last video about the Superblast). But I think Nike is playing in thet area too. Adidas though seems to be playing catch-up (which I’ll cover in a video soon). Great comment! I love this dialog. 🙌🏻

My non running friends that want to get into running: so cant decide what shoe to buy what do you run in? Me : ( runs in the adizero line) uhh dont buy what I use get a gt1000 or a cheap new balance shoe. Blank stare.

@SagasuRunning

11 ай бұрын

As a new runner the Adidas Adizero SL is going to be your best Adidas option. if you want to try Asics go for the Asics Novablast 3. Have fun out there.