This guy deserves more subscribers. Very informative.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you that means a lot! I have been way behind on content lately, but I have lots of informative uploads coming as well as big project series. 😁

Happy Holidays. I love the insight on things like this.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Happy holidays! Great to hear I'm the same way.

A 802 Garage video for Christmas, 2020 is not ALL that bad. Nice to hear from you, my dude. :P

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Hahaha thank you! Hope you've had an ok year. More videos very soon.

oh wow thank you for the info just what I was looking for just picked up another subscriber.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

I knew some people would be searching for the information because I had searched for it a lot! Glad to help. Much appreciated.

Oooooooh I got excited when I saw this title, I’ve been wondering if they changed anything since I did the last report.

@MonkeyWrenching

3 жыл бұрын

N stands for “Nippon” aka Japan.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@MonkeyWrenching IS THAT why they used N? Despite knowing Japanese, that's not something I thought of, hahaha. Also yes I saw your video while searching how to title and tag this video! I believe you bought non N kit, right? They definitely use primarily Chinese bearings to this day and I believe a USA or otherwise made timing belt. Probably made by Dayco or something. Even the normal Gates belt is generally fine though.

@MonkeyWrenching

3 жыл бұрын

@802Garage I’d compared the “N” kit to the non, but I did the kits without the water pump included. Just timing kits. I also called NTN to ask them about the different tensioners, I did learn a bit about the non branded tensioners being still made by NTN as a house brand but due to legal reasons they weren’t allowed to brand it as they were under contract with Subaru to make the OE style. Unfortunately I think they found out I was recording the call and publishing it, they later refused any further divulging of information, for legal purposes I’m sure.

Merry Christmas Aaron.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Hey thanks, you too!

Hello Aaron. Happy Christmas

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Hello and same to you!

The main reason I believe the body of the tensioner is different is because of copyright issues or whatever, bearing on the tensioner is still NSK, I installed the one from the AISIN kit on my Impreza works fine. Also if you contact AISIN they will say that their tensioner is made all in japan and it comes in a NSK box with lettering made in Japan.

@802Garage

Жыл бұрын

Yeah they of course can't use the Subaru name for example. As far as I can tell, the tensioner in the Gates "N" kit is exactly the same as the AISIN, both tensioner and bearing which is NSK as you said. All of the casting marks and manufacturing looks identical. Would be very surprised if it wasn't the same. AISIN is still the better bet overall.

@user-sf7kl9uh7k

11 ай бұрын

You only need one component to take the whole belt out. Gates isn't what it used to be. Dayco started making rubbish ages ago.

I bought a Subaru that had a Gates kit put on about 30k ago. The water pump leaks quite fast from the weep hole. Replaced with an Aisin WP and life is good.I can't warranty the pump because I didn't own the car when installed. Personally I'd stay away from the Gates pumps after my experience.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

That's definitely frustrating. I think buying the kit without the water pump and buying a different pump separate would be best. I also don't like that the one idler is Chinese or unmarked, though in most cases I don't think it will have an issue within the interval. If the Aisin kit is within $20-50 it's almost definitely worth it. I just wanted to evaluate the option though, since the Gates N kits were supposed to go back to OEM quality. Especially for people who don't plan to keep a car for another full timing belt cycle, I understand wanting to save money.

Been a while since you have posted my man.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Haha yeah been that way lately been focusing on working on the big build behind the scenes and posting on TikTok. Steady growth was proving incredibly difficult on KZread, but I'll be back in full force. Meanwhile more evergreen videos like this help pay the bills.

@urielsalas9265

3 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage well I hope you come back soon and stronger than ever. Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@urielsalas9265 Thank you truly appreciate it! I always want the channel to be a mix of informative and fun, so when the V10 build gets uploaded it should be a lot of fun. :D

Different suppliers may get components with varying quality control grades from manufacturers? ie: Subaru,Aisin ,Gates might get Grade AA, Grade A, Grade B meaning more or less bad components per 1000. Is the forged impeller on the WP better than the stamped? Don't count on getting any kind of warranty response from Gates. I had a Gates NSK cogged idler go bad in 6 months, but saved the engine.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

That quality difference is of course possible depending on the component, manufacturer, buyer, etc. In this case I genuinely believe the Gates components in this kit are 100% identical to the Aisin kit for example, save the belt, the small idler, and the water pump and gaskets. As for the water pump, Subaru as well as almost all aftermarket suppliers have moved to the stamped impeller for replacement parts. In order to get the old cast impeller, which just to be clear isn't forged AFAIK, you have to buy specific part OE part numbers or old stock parts which are getting harder to find. The general belief from enthusiasts is that the cast impeller had less cavitation at high RPM, and is thus desirable for performance applications, but that for daily driving the difference was negligible. Strange that the NSK bearing would fail that fast, but it can always happen. Bearing part # is identical to OEM, which means the grade of manufacture should be as well. I hear you on all accounts though, impossible to account for every little difference. The car these were installed on has been problem free at least.

Aw yeah, an 802 Garage video! I've seen Mitsuboshi belts before, and my first thought was that they were a bootleg company trying to look like Mitsubishi, but the serpentine belt I looked at in person looked like a quality part. What's your experience with them?

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

They are the OEM for Subaru timing belts. Actually a very reputable company. The naming is just unfortunate coincidence. I believe they OEM belts for quite a few companies. Couldn't give you the list though, hah. Thanks man!

@MrSubaru1387

3 жыл бұрын

Mitsuboshi is legit.

@donaldlee6760

Жыл бұрын

​​@@802Garage - Mitsuboshi is OEM for my 2006 Toyota Highlander with 6 cylinder 3MZ- FE engine

Thanks. Some dildo left the o ring on the tensioner bolt when mounting to the engine and i was wondering where it came from when i found it on the floor after changing a new kit that did not have the o ring.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

To be fair, you are supposed to leave the O-ring on, though it doesn't do anything critical. Would definitely cause me consternation if I didn't know where it came from too!

Good video

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

Just curious and this might help others but why does the A/T cars not require the red spacer when installing the timing belt? Haven't been able to find out this info anywhere.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Automatic cars don't come with the small timing belt guard manual cars do. The manual cars need the guard because if the car is in gear and rolls backwards, it can roll the engine backwards, which can cause the timing belt to slip teeth over the crank gear. The small guard prevents this and it requires correct spacing. Automatic cars don't have this issue because the torque converter would absorb any movement and the parking pawls should also stop the car. Hope this explains it!

Did you see Emelia Hartford blew up a Honda motor in a Prius? She also blew up a motor in a c8 corvette too.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Bahahaha I did! Brent and the BoostedBoiz helped get her sorted fast though. I'm excited to see what Pronda can do.

In my experience the cogged pulley fails the most. Had several subarus in a row with that chucking the bearings out

@802Garage

Жыл бұрын

That seems to be the first to fail for me as well, though I hear the cars with the small idler, the single row versions at least, would fail first.

Hi ,is the tck328n without the waterpump same bearing as your review?planning to buy 1 at rockauto.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Yes as long as it has the N at the end of the part number it should be everything the same as in this video except for the water pump. Sorry for the delayed reply! If you do buy it and there is a difference please let me know.

I used this kit in my 1997 outback in 2019. Since then (now 2022) I've put 21k miles on the car and the belt broke without warning. The adjuster was soaked in oil also. Now I'm spending $4k on new valves and a new piston. I'm using Subaru parts from the dealership now

@802Garage

Жыл бұрын

Was it the Gates N kit or the normal Gates kit? I personally would not use the normal Gates kit. The belt snapping in 21K miles leads me to think there was something else wrong. I have seen even the cheapest timing belts on the market last 60K+ miles with no issues. This belt was actually quality and made in the USA. When you say the tensioner was soaked in oil, do you mean the piston itself or the pulley? There really shouldn't be enough oil in the tensioner to soak anything unless it explodes suddenly. I would think the belt grabbing and snapping actually caused the tensioner to be forced suddenly inward exploding the oil out of the piston. To me, it honestly sounds like something in your engine locked up, likely a cam, and that caused the belt to snap and ruin the tensioner. Even cheap Chinesium parts generally last longer than that. Sorry for your bad experience though and good to know!

@jamieelder7438

Жыл бұрын

The top half of the tensioner was coated in oil. Nothing else under the timing belt cover was wet. I think the tensioner went out and maybe the belt was bouncing or jerking?

@802Garage

Жыл бұрын

@@jamieelder7438 It's possible, but overall the symptoms definitely lead me to believe the belt caught on something or a cam gear stopped causing extreme pressure on the tensioner which caused the oil to come out. Purely a guess though. Still bizarre that happened at all.

Yall ever done the head gaskets on a 2.5l legacy? Been putting it off for sometime now and wanting to tackle it come summer time

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Definitely look at all the videos MrSubaru1387 has made on the topic. I believe he has a full step by step tutorial.

@EricRacine123

3 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage killer. I'm just outside the Rutland area and don't really want to take it to a shop here. Figured I'd take a week from work and do the gasket and clutch

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@EricRacine123 As long as you have an engine crane and a pretty general tool set you should be able to manage. Technically you should have the block and heads done proper at a machine shop, but there are a lot of varying opinions and videos on that as well. Just absolutely make sure you buy the updated MLS gaskets and not any off brand.

@DKSE123

2 жыл бұрын

I replaced head gaskets on 2.5 fozzy from 2001

Christmas came early this year.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Haha thank you! You were also first. :)

in this video, the letter N used = oe , what does A mean at the end of other product codes?

@802Garage

11 ай бұрын

I actually emailed Gates to ask the same question and this was the response. "The “A” at the end of the part number indicates Gates improved tensioner. The “N” indicates NTN bearings. The “RB” kit is our performance kit, the kit with out a letter is just our base kit." I asked in a follow up what was improved about the tensioner and where it was made, but never got a response. My guess is that the improved tensioner is sourced from a Gates factory rather than being what seemed like an Aisin identical tensioner in the N kit. Therefore I have no idea how good it will be, but hopefully better than the tensioner in the base kits. It should still have Japanese bearings if it is an N kit, but I can't recommend the AN kit without knowing where the tensioner is made or what has been changed. I'll try to email Gates again at some point. You can still source N kits without the A. If you let me know your model and year I could get you a link if you're interested. Otherwise Aisin is still a good bet.

Aaron, Did you know Sarah-n-Tuned"S friend who passed away a couple of videos ago? Did he have a you tube channel? lmk. That was heart breaking to watch.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

I did know. Very tragic. I don't believe he had a channel.

0:15 I don't know for certain, but my guess is the N stands for Nippon or Nihon. Nippon and Nihon are the Japanese word for Japan.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Great point! Why didn't I think of that? Only took Japanese for two years! My only other thought would be it stands for "NTN" since it includes the NTN tensioner bearing.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

P.S. Love your name haha.

The Chinese tensioner in the Gates kit is still getting negative feedback on Amazon. There are reports premature failures. Also the tensioner will allow belt slap, producing an engine knock.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Those reviews are for the non N kit. There are no reviews for the N kits on Amazon. The tensioner in this kit is different from the non N kit as far as I know and looks identical to the tensioner that comes in the AISIN kit. As far as I can tell the only Chinese components in this kit are the water pump and smallest idler. Obviously everyone should buy with their best discretion though and overall it may be more worth it to just go AISIN.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

FWIW this kit is still going strong in my niece's daily driven Forester.

Hey What's Up,I'm Looking Forward To Buy A Kit For My Wrx And Is This Kit Any Good?Im Currently Gonna Get A New Oil Pump So I Might As Well Get A New Timing Kit Too.What Do You Recommend? Thx

@802Garage

Жыл бұрын

Haha never seen someone type in all Title Case. What year is your WRX? There is nothing WRONG with this kit IMO, but the one Chinese idler is not ideal. I'd also recommend getting an Aisin or OEM water pump instead of the Gates. This one should honestly work fine though.

Just wanted to make sure before I order my kit for my 05 outback 2.5XT. It has 90k and want to plan ahead. The GATES N kit for my car is the TCKWP328N? Thanks for your time.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

That is correct. I see it at $207.79 on RockAuto. Don't forget to use a 5% discount code!

@mustangnotch

3 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage Thank you so much.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@mustangnotch You're welcome!

I installed a Gates kit on my Non-turbo SOHC motor 7 years ago, and I do believe all the stuff back then was Japanese made. I'm not trusting Gates for the next one. I went with ContiTech instead. NPW Japan made pump. 2 GMB Korean made bearings, Tensioner and lipless idler: NTN Japan. Belt: Germany. Cam seals: Made in Taiwan

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

The gates N kit seems good all except for that one unknown origin idler. The ContiTech kit sounds good though. Korean made is probably trustworthy, I too would probably go with OEM cam seals as they are pretty cheap. German belt is interesting, but I wouldn't doubt it will last just fine. Thanks for the info!

@user-sf7kl9uh7k

11 ай бұрын

Contitech don't have my vote, I'd go Aisin or INA. Gates isn't what it used to be

Just bought a Duralast kit for mine at Autozone and within 500 miles the tensioner was failing. Wish I had the time to wait for a name brand one to ship but I needed the kit now.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Ouch! I'm assuming it was a made in China tensioner? Did you do the bleeding process?

@mitchell9937

3 жыл бұрын

I assume the whole kit was made in China but I'm not sure. The belt was Mitsuboshi, which was nice. The tensioner sat upright for at least 10 hours before pulling the pin so there was no need to bleed it.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@mitchell9937 Nice the belt was correct at least, but that really sucks the tensioner was no good.

@josephcazzuto7198

2 жыл бұрын

I picked up a timing belt kit for a Honda at AutoZone and the water pump went out in less than 5 months. Now I only buy Aisin or Napa auto parts brand.

Been awhile on youtube, don’t have a tik tok account.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

You can watch stuff in browser without the app if you'd like, www.tiktok.com/@802garage but otherwise I will be uploading more here soon. :)

Has the gates tck304n hold up good???

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Zero issues after well over a year. I believe I installed it in September of 2020 and the car was daily driven. Many thousands of miles. I would anticipate no issues. The only potential worries are the water pump and the single Chinese idler. Even those should not be a problem. If you have any concerns OEM and AISIN are both great options, just a lot more expensive right now.

@ronniewavebio7112

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage I ordered a kit and all the idlers are japan made.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

@@ronniewavebio7112 Nice! The only one that wasn't in this kit was the small idler, but I think the non turbo cars don't even have that one.

@ronniewavebio7112

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage No, it doesn't come with the small idler. The only thing is that the belt is made in the USA.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

@@ronniewavebio7112 Hey made in USA is better than China, hopefully. Thanks for the info.

Just get the Aisin kits. Or Subaru oem.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Obviously do what you think is best for your vehicle! No problem with this kit yet. The only thing I really don't like is the single Chinese made bearing on the small idler. Everything else is OEM except water pump. If having all Japanese bearings is your priority and you don't mind the extra $60-70, AISIN is the way to go. The water pump is likely slightly better as well, though I doubt anyone will ever know the difference within timing belt intervals.

I'd pass if the water pump is made in China. I'd go with an Aisin Kit

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I do think for the best long term reliability, getting an Aisin or OEM water pump is the best bet. You can buy the kit without water pump to save money and choose your own pump separately.

Uh oh Mr. Subaru is gonna beef with you

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Nahhh he'll be chill. I still said the AISIN kit is better and I even recommended his video, hah. :)

@MrSubaru1387

3 жыл бұрын

Gates sux. Lol Japanese cars, Japanese parts. 😝

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@MrSubaru1387 Hahaha. If it wasn't for the one unknown origin idler. 😭 Gates gets so close and screws it up. 😜

@MrSubaru1387

3 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage tensioner is China 🇨🇳. Small idler is China 🇨🇳. Water pump, China 🇨🇳. Idk why they give Loctite. 100% not needed. 🤮 🤮 🤮

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@MrSubaru1387 My confusion with the tensioner is that it looks identical to the one that comes with Aisin.

Damn I wasn't first! 🤣😂🤣😂🤣

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Still very early! You were third. 🥰

Aisin beating Gates IMO

@802Garage

11 ай бұрын

I overall definitely agree, although in this case only because of the single Chinese idler bearing and the water pump. The difference is of course price!

@user-sf7kl9uh7k

11 ай бұрын

@@802Garage Yes, you're right. But you only need one party to break, and then that moment is the start of a very bad day.

@802Garage

11 ай бұрын

@@user-sf7kl9uh7k Absolutely. I think for a vehicle worth a lot of money, modified, or low miles, spending the bit extra makes sense. I think for a daily driver you aren't that invested in or you simply need to do the timing belt, but are low on funds, the Gates N kit is probably the second best option that can save $40-100+ and still be reliable. I know what it's like to be very broke hahaha. Obviously also matters if you are doing the work yourself or not.

Holy crap I’m early

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

Second even!

I'm just here for the Scotty Kilmer content. I heard anything other than Toyota is crap.

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

😂 Accurate. Why does Gates even make parts for non Toyota vehicles? All hail the Toyota king.

God dammit I got the wrong hit mine said China I was reluctant to put them on but I did now I’m regretting it

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

TBH as long as you installed them properly they should be fine. If it was me, I would just plan for a 60K mile change instead of 100K to be on the safe side.

@jamesonmoscatelli3710

3 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage the main one that went to the crank shaft said Japan on it which I think is the most important one

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

@@jamesonmoscatelli3710 Yeah the cogged pulley is the most common to fail apparently.

@indigoburst

2 жыл бұрын

I just realized the timing belt + water pump kit I installed in my 2010 STi 2 years ago is the kit without the "N". I had no idea Gates was being this shady when I replaced it, always thought Gates was good stuff. I've driven it about 25k miles now, daily driven, only have fun with it every now and then. Now I'm worried, should I replace it or wait another 40k?

Do not use that tensioner that’s how people get bent valves

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Well again, it looks identical to the tensioner in AISIN kits to me. So I have a hard time not recommending it. AISIN kits are also seemingly hard to get right now.

@anthonyr5869

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage you can get the tensioner for about 107 bucks from Subaru Parts Direct(dealer in Oregon) then the belt from them too for 64 bucks w/ free shipping. Then all 3 pulleys directly from the NSK store on Amazon for about 70 dollars.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

@@anthonyr5869 $107 is half the cost of this entire kit. Did you watch the video? Most components are OEM identical except the small tensioner pulley.

@anthonyr5869

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage I did, I just would rather buy oem. I had a rebuilt Subaru engine break a belt one of those Chinese tensioners. They are finicky cars I’m just not going to risk putting on Chinese cheap tensioners

@anthonyr5869

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage anyhow I am subbed great video

the chinese water pump seems to be machined with many sharp right angles. Corners are bad m'kay. Corners on metal objects that experience heat cycling are REALLY bad, m'kay?

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

Fortunately I don't think you're at any risk of cracking anything, but I don't doubt the Japanese made pumps are much superior quality. I always check the surfaces and the fins to make sure there are no glaring issues.

@MagnusFeirenbacher

2 жыл бұрын

@@802Garage Good man! Always thoroughly check every part! ya don't want to have to repeat a whole job again later.

@802Garage

2 жыл бұрын

@@MagnusFeirenbacher You'll never regret double checking, but I've def caught a few things I would have regretted not checking!

That’s 19 mins I won’t get back 🙄🙄🙄 just get the sodding thing in already !

@802Garage

3 жыл бұрын

LOL this video is not at all about the V10 and was filmed a few months ago. This kit was installed on the 2004 Forester XT I was working on. Sorry. 😬