You are so honest with your audience (showing that shot that didn't work). That's the great thing about you - you don't pretend to be some of nimrod zen archer, your just a guy who loves archery. Cool dude!

Thank you Armin, this really helped!

Thanks! Very well explained - will try thumb release for the first time now:)

Hi Armin, thanks very much for this very useful video guide, I followed video and benefitted, God bless you.

@Armin Hirmer. Many thanks for your videos. I subscribed so I can learn more about shooting the traditional horse bows.

I have been working on this very thing during the past week. This was a very good description to help develop a clean release. Thank you for the great lesson.

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

thank you for watching

that was awesomely thorough

Than you Armin for you instructional videos, they are very relaxing and easy to practice with understanding. I am 73 years old and have shot bows since About 7 yrs. old. The first time I saw one of your vidieo's, of you shooting an asian/turkish bow I was hooked on your style of shooting. That was about 5 yrs ago. I bought a Magyar bow from Turkey and shoot it much more often than I have ever shot any of my many other western style bows. Asian style bows and thumb release are just a joy to shoot. I also hunt large and small game year round. Thanks again for sharing your skill and knowledge with us. From Iowa, USA.

@ArminHirmer

6 ай бұрын

enjoy Bill

Yet again a big thank you! 👍

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

welcome, thank you for watching and giving a comment

Thank you!!

A must-watch video !! Thank you

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

thank you for watching!

Thank you Armin - The push and pull is genius, balance of muscle tension and spinal alignment - much love

@namirxia3308

2 жыл бұрын

yea i was trying it while watching the video, it worked very well, masha Allah

Thanks again Armin. There isn't a lot of point-by-point instruction on how to do thumb draw, so your videos are a game changer. I'm having a blast with my turkish bow and shooting better thanks to you buddy.

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

thanks for watching

The explanation and demonstration Excellent.

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

thank you very much!

Yin and Yang in equal proportions so that they cancel the effort and there is Zero shake! Very clear, thanks!

Nice video, very interesting! I do kyudo so I only shoot with yumi, using a glove (kake), but the technique still sounds very similar to what you describe. I think maybe it is a little easier to get a clean release when using a glove (at least a kyudo glove) because the finger lock is more "passive", by which I mean it is the tension of the draw and induced friction in the material that maintains the lock, so you do not need to use any hand muscles at all to maintain it. The lock releases "automatically" simply as part of the expansion when you are at full draw. At least in theory, according to hanshi :), it is quite hard to achieve a perfectly automatic release like this. They have all sorts of metaphors, e.g. the release is like a water droplet forming on the tip of a leaf, which just naturally falls off when it reaches a critical point.

Awsome videos!

5:26mins. Thank you so much! That helped me find my mistake, and also my thumb was bending too far around the string, which gave me a rough release. The result was, my arrows would be hitting the target at a 30-45' degree angle instead of going in straight.

Youre the best teacher i ever had,,, regardless the topic

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

thank you

Good tutorial Armin, it's easy to follow and spelled out in plain English. I use a lot of the same elements when I teach beginners thumb draw, such as back tension, a firm but not overbearing thumb lock and follow through... like letting the bow spin 90-110 degrees to the left after loosing an arrow, relaxing the thumb and letting the string push said digit out of the way. Good ways of avoiding paradox every one. Anyhow how, keep up the good work and enjoy the rest of your day ^_^

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

hehe yes. next video will go more into "khatra" style

Veru interesting those techniques seems great

Learned from you a lot. Thank you.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

welcome and thanks for watching

Great video again! Vielen Dank!

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

gern geschehen :)

love your videos

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

thank you Eric

Thank you for this lesson. I`ve shoot metiranian for some years, and have now order my first " horsebow" / Hungarian style bow. I really look forward to try these bows, they've always appealed to me, and it`s your videos that made me buy one. So thank you for making these videos.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

i thank you for watching and taking time to comment :) have fun with your new bow

@mattfedrachen8245

6 жыл бұрын

*Armin Hirmer* It's alright if you reply late seeing as I'm 6 months late on this comment. My questions are: Does it matter which way the middle feather is? (Against/away from bow) Also where do you get your arrows? It looks like country flags, I saw another video where you had Black Red and Yellow feathers, it looks awesome.

I need to try that

ty very much

I started to record myself shooting with my phone at 240 fps, then slow it down to 0.25x. With this tool, I can see if my release is clean and if my arrow is wobbly or yawing without having to bother to use any expendables or buying more things or making things.

Bravo pour cette démonstration de tir au pouce. Cela fait trois ans que je tir au pouce et je ne peu plus tirer en tir méditerranéen. Patick

I try my best to learn it and the struggle ie real. After return and restart countless times (last time I were follow the Turkish school). No I can have some clean shots with my 25# Drake fiberglass toybow escept that doesn't have the momentum for move on it's own to anywhere. The pain in my thumb by my 50# laminated bow is tremendous by a ring on or without anyways. That bow goes where ever it wants and I can not effect that by my wrist what so ever. I am on tha passenger seat. On the other hand by 3 finger under and arrow on the left I hit anything I was dreaming about (man size target, 60*60 standard polifoam and Turkis puta) between 180-240 meters by the big boy and I can do puta shooting out to 70-90 meters by a 25# low quality fiberglass bow by arrows that meant to use by beginners and their youth bows. Tha happines I experience is beyond description! Thanks for your help! Maybe one day I gonna get there!

Good God, this helped me

Great video! I started with a horsebow last year, and use mediteranean style. My horse is not ready yet, so I have time to practice on the ground. After seeing your video I started practicing thumb release, and now I like to practice both :) .. I love to find out the pro’s and cons of both techniques when you are actually on a horse. Since you really cannot use an anchor point when shooting from a moving horse, I practice shooting instinctively. I would love to see a video if you are able to hold arrows in your bow hand so you do not have to get them one by one from a quiver. Do You have any tips for that for both techniques? I find it easier to hold 2 extra arrows or so in the bow hand with turkish style. With mediteranean style I find it hard to hold extra arrows in the bow hand. Any tips for that? I think my fingers are to short. :)

Hi Armin! thanks for this good educative video. I appreciate your effort to explain and answer to doubts we have about small tricks like this. I have a question thought about "your thumb lock" technique as you describe as locking gently and not too much. do you think this gentle lock can have a disadvantage on horse back as the arrow can fell heasily on movement ? cause if I understood well the advantage of thumb release is that it stabilize the arrow and fix it on the bow, hence the arrow wont fell or move on the string

I think it's time for me to start

Hey man, I love your videos:) So I'm a fairly well versed recurve and longbow guy. Can you offer a suggestion regarding smoothly loading an arrow shooting an asiatic bow? I'm a new guy but it just seems to make more sense to me. Thanks for the videos!

Thanks for all your videos, learned a hell of a lot, when the Corona Virus panic ends , a visit to Malta might be in order.

@kristenwilliams9123

4 жыл бұрын

i was literally just thinking the same thing

@patwalsh7841

4 жыл бұрын

Thinking of that myself.

Great job! I noticed you mentioned Gao Yin'gs work which I have been studying recently, in his book Gao Ying mentioned that when you use double-hook draw, while releasing ' the middle finger should tuck in tightly, whereas the thumb and index finger should open up straight and relaxed', much like doing a finger snap. Gao Ying claims by using this technique you should get a much crisper and cleaner release and avoid the typical sluggishness of double-hook draw. I don't know if this would be helpful but maybe you can put it into a test on your next video?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

exactly. there will be another video and I will try and include that too :) thanks for watching

@nucleotide010

7 жыл бұрын

Thanks for your kind reply Armin!

Armin I am trying to teach myself how to shoot instinctively. I am very impressed by your ability to pick up any type of bow and get tight groups using different release styles. Do you have a vlog on how to do this or is it simply a matter of endless practice until the body "gets it"? I have watched "the Push-a Traditional Archery Film" and his details about the various methods of aiming: gap shooting, string crawl etc. He comments that these methods will improve ones instinctive shooting. I would value your suggestions or comments about how to improve.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

Hi. i never watched this movie. Simply imagine you will throw a stone. Do you look at the stone or where you want to throw it? same with instinctive archer, look where you want the arrow to go - simply point in this direction, anchor and release :)

What you could improve on your release is using a second anchor point, i.e., moving your draw hand backwards upon release along an imaginary line extending from your arrow backwards, always tight to your cheek. In your release you can be seen moving your hand away from your check, which you transfer to the string. May I suggest you just relax thumb and index finger while pulling your hand backwards to the second anchor point, so the strong can move forward unimpeded. Attempts to consciously open your hand upon the release will almost always introduce undesired upward, downward or sideway movement.

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

Anchor points are overrated :)

I found that lumenoks are also very usefull to practice a clear release.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

good idea

Hi Armin!! I really love they way you demonstrate and explain about the technique based on your preference. I just started in traditional archery and my question is with this thumb release is it normal to feel pain and numbness after shooting or is it because of my technique is off? Hope to get from you soon!!

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

Hi. Thats normal, simply don't overdo it and use a light draw weight bow :) enjoy shooting

@herrlaban86

4 жыл бұрын

@@ArminHirmer thanks for the prompt response and yeah will follow your advice! 😊

Thank you for the excellent video, with greetings from Taiwan. I shoot with a leather thumb guard, and still get a sore thumb. What is your thumb made of?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

practice :)

Hi Armin, As a new mounted archer I am finding your videos very helpful. Question, I use only one finger to lock my thumb but my 2nd finger's 1st knuckle is sore. Holding too tightly? I see your 1st finger goes down and crosses the string. I keep my fingers all on one side. Form problem? I should probably send a video. Thanks!

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

Hi Barbara. Hmmmm.... a photo would be helpful or a video, yes. You can send it to my email if you like maltaarchery@gmail.com. Thank you

Cool video! Even if the thumb isn't pointed back at all, does that draw hurt the joint connecting the parts of the thumb or cause more severe callouses compared to the Mediterranean draw?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

in the beginning a bit as your thumb has to get used to. And of course it is worse than 3 finger draw, as all force is applied on one finger hehe

Hi, is there a video where you discuss spine, weight, length

Great video! What's the manufacturer of the turkish-style bow?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

alibowshop.com

I've am so interested in starting this technique. I have making my own arrows using things from the hardware stores. I was wondering if arrow spine is something that matters in thumb release since the khatra doesn't let the arrow oscillate around the grip. Do you shoot a random assortment of arrows, if so, how do you ensure accuracy?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

Only make sure, that the wood dowels are stiff enough (sometimes they are quite soft). Usually I shoot one set of same spend and weighted arrows and then accuracy is no big problem. I don't shot a selection of different arrows

I just realised that you have to basically grip with both pinkies. And the rest of the fingers are less and less tense on both hands.

Seems I apply too much pressur with my index. Still parcticing!

In my opinion, to have a clear release, you cannot just talk about the thumb technique alone. It will need a combination of thumb technique with either bow-arrow spine match or torque technique (khatra). These are important or you will get a side tear like you did there. The side tear you get there, in my opinion is not a result of a not-clean thumb release. If you are shooting without any khatra, this is likely cause by the arrow spine not match with bow weight. Happen all the time if you shooting a western center-cut recurve bow without correct spine arrow. But in this case, I think your khatra is a bit off. That's what cause that side tear. The advantage of shooting with thumb release is you can use khatra to compensate for the arrow spine. You can pretty much shoot arrow of any spine out of your bow with appropriate khatra technique and it will fly straight. In my own experience, If you have a left tear (arrow head left of the fetching hole) your khatra tension is too much, you need to relax your grip tension a little (bottom 3 fingers grip tension if you shoot korean/chinese style, top 3 fingers grip tension if you shoot Turkish style). Vice versa, if you have right tear, you need more tension on your grip. It really depends on your bow weight and arrow spine.

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

step by step. that one was for beginners. next video will contain khatra

@Thachsanh

7 жыл бұрын

One thing to note is: depends on your style of shooting, the way you hook your thumb on the string may be different. The Korean hook the thumb pretty deep and make a fist. When release, they relax open the whole hand instead of just your index and thumb like the Chinese. I have seen people saying you have to keep your lower 3 fingers still and only relax your thumb and index finger for a clean release but that's not true, it really depends on your style of shooting. The Japanese while also using thumb release has an entirely different system as well.

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

you are right, thats why I only show what I do. This is not an overall comparison of all techniques.

Hello, thanks for your lessons. What I'm doing wrong if arrows hits the target with some angle, not straight but with some slant? Thanks in advance 😉

@ArminHirmer

Жыл бұрын

Many reasons. Spine of arrows, nocking point, release

@erikasjankevicius8560

Жыл бұрын

@@ArminHirmer , thank you 😉 means I should work with myself until find the reason why it happens 🤔

With the same bow, could I use the same spined arrows I use with mediterraneen draw for the thumb draw?

What is the name of the second bow you used? The blonde bow. It sounds like you said: oshkosh. Perhaps someone has already asked in the comments section, but I didn't find it. THANKS!

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

Akos Bow

Hi Armin, i'm from indonesia, your videos very helpfull,,, I want to ask some questions 1. How big is the metal frame size? 2. How long is the distance from archer to metal frame? Thank you,,,

@ArminHirmer

5 жыл бұрын

Hello. Roughly the size of two hands and two to three meters away from the archer

@setyowibowodijhee9876

5 жыл бұрын

Thank you,,,

what lb. bow do you use and would you suggest for a beginner to thumb release use but im a pretty strong guy so something not to weak??

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

i would not go higher then 30 max 35#, even if you are strong. thumb needs to get used to and your technique should be good first

top video - wie immer! :) wie heisst der türkische bogen am ende des videos?

@ArminHirmer

5 жыл бұрын

I think it was the Turkish bow by Alibow

at 3:22 what is the name of the bow/make please, cant quite make out the name. Brilliant video as usual!

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

I guess it was a Sipahi by Vegh

@drillerkiller3

4 жыл бұрын

@@ArminHirmer Hi Armin, I am after some advice please, looking to purchase my second horse bow, I have a Qinghai fiberglass bow from alibow and looking to get a laminated similar bow, I have been looking at Alibow again or Veghbow, which would you recommend out of those two and anyone else you could recommend at a similar price please. I also messaged you on FB but you havent accepted my friends request yet. Thanks Neil

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

@@drillerkiller3 Hi Neil. Both are good. With Alibow you can still use my voucher code Armin10 to get 10% off though :) I need to delete some friends first as I have 5000 and FB does not let me accept more...

@drillerkiller3

4 жыл бұрын

@@ArminHirmer Thank you, I wasnt having a dig at not accepting me, just you might not have seen my message was all. Out of the two is one better or you prefer in your opinion? Any other makes I could consider?

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

@@drillerkiller3 you need to define what your max draw length might be, according to this you should choose your bow. quality wise they are all good, be it Vegh, Alibow, Bogar

The bow you use in this video is so beautiful. Who makes it ?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

the dark one is from Alibow, I think it was the C1 which is replaced now by another bow. The bright one is a turkish bow from Akosbow

@crisloucks6805

6 жыл бұрын

Armin Hirmer thank you. I should have specified the light bow. I was so taken with it i forgot about the other one.

Hey, so I've been using thumb draw lately, but most of the time the string hit my index finger. I tried to put my index in my thumb nail, closer to the edge, but most of the arrow deflected. Any suggestion?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

had to say without seeing it. I guess if you would rotate your wrist a bit while you release and form with thumb and index and "L" - thumb goes down, index comes up. Might help

How to push when your arm is fully extended? What moew to push with?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

With your shoulder and your intention

Hey Armin Lately, I am having an issue with the arrow pulling away from the bow when at full draw. I use a single hook normally, but it has happened with a double hook, also. Just wondering if you have any insight into some small form error that might be occurring, as I'm generally very careful about correct finger positioning and at beginning of the draw my index has plenty of pressure on shaft. This happens with various anchors (jaw and Gao Ying), so that doesn't seem to be the cause. Thanks.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

as much as I like these kind of riddles, without seeing it - quite hard to tell. I guess that maybe your thumb and index are to close when you draw. I think they call it phoenix eye... make sure that the thumb knuckle is as far away from the index knuckle as possible.

@blake436

6 жыл бұрын

That actually makes sense. I think sometimes I "squeeze" and that is probably pushing base thumb knuckle up and in. Great tip, thanks. Also, when you anchor at your back jaw, which part(s) of your hand/thumb are making contact?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

depends which draw length I have on the bow, usually my index knuckle is at the jaw directly under the ear

@blake436

6 жыл бұрын

That is what feels comfortable to me, also. I find that the draw hand kind of settles into that nook there behind jaw and the arrow shaft comes into contact with my face, lining arrow up nicely. Thanks again.

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

welcome :)

Doesn't it hurt without a glove or ring?

Hello,is it possible to use thumb release while the arrow is on the left side? in case you shoot right hand style (with shelf in my case) thanks in advance!

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

possible, yes. but maybe not the best way. some mongolians do that and I did a video about it: kzread.info/dash/bejne/fKp2tspym8fKkqw.html

@Delphe

6 жыл бұрын

okay,thanks for the fast reply! i give it a shot. nice channel btw. best,dave

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

thanks and have fun

is there standard size of the rectangular size or ring diameter on the last practice?

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

use what you have, a ring a rectangular a square... size of two hands maybe...

since i have access only to the longbow, is it possibile to shoot thumb method with longbow

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

sure when the bow has no arrow rest and you can shoot from your hand

Saya kesulitan dalam melakukan kuncian thubdraw. Bisa di jelaskan lebih detail lagi. Husus untuk kuncian.

Where should my eyes be looking? I've been shooting with a long bow but recently I bought a horse bow and wanted to try the thumb draw. The arrow clearly goes to the right. should I be looking through the bow between the bow and the string?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

at the target :) there are many ways (at least a few) some look with both eyes on one side of the bow, some split and one eye right, one left. simply start very short distance and see what works for you

@cassidyphan8027

7 жыл бұрын

Thank you I tried last weekend and I'm really confused when the arrow is on the thumb. I used to shoot my long bow off my knuckle. I'll just keep trying what you said till i figure it out. I just didn't want to start building the wrong habits. Thanks again!

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

it is normal that the arrow goes a bit to the right. Simply check if you want to have (when you are right handed) want to have the right eye glancing down the arrow shaft to the tip and see where your left eye will be :) for me it depends which bow (draw length) I shoot... thats why I can't give you a definite answer

I am going to have to disagree with you about the deep hook on the string....it's a much cleaner release with a deep hook when shooting Mediterranean or Slavic as there is way less side to side oscillation of the string....slow motion capture shows this fact very well and video doesn't lie ....old G Fred Asbell taught me about this...he's a great old guy and a superb archer funny as hell too and a better hunter there is not

@ArminHirmer

2 жыл бұрын

Ok

Does it matter which side of the bow you are holding the arrow? I hold it on the knuckles of my fingers. I noticed you hold it above your thumb. Why? I am very new to archery

Hi, I'd like this paper test a lot. Could you please give an idea where could I find such a metar frame, what is it actually, it's trade article name. Thank you

@ArminHirmer

3 жыл бұрын

Old signs of a clothes shop

Terimakasih tuan, semoga mendapat hidayah

I am just starting to use the thumb ring but finds it quite painful after 2 or three shots with a 30lb draw weight. Should I use a lighter bow? If so, what draw weight would you recommend?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

We start here with 22# bows. The thumb needs to get used to.... takes a while :)

@JSharap

7 жыл бұрын

Dear Armir, thanks and your feedback is much appreciated! Cheers mate!

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

welcome

@KevinMsyah

7 жыл бұрын

i dont have 22lb bow can i use 10-15lb instead???

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

of course

Any tips for a left handed shooter?

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

Same just the other way around

Keep trying but everytime my arrow is going to the right :( (using a korean bow) not sure if that makes a difference

@ArminHirmer

4 жыл бұрын

no difference. tilt the bow a bit and start adjusting, because you shoot right off the bow. it is not a center shot bow. you will manage

Hi sir...how do I set my knocking point??

@ArminHirmer

6 жыл бұрын

I made a video about that a while ago, you can check

@mohdaffendi3635

6 жыл бұрын

Thanks sir...i'll look for it.

@mohdaffendi3635

6 жыл бұрын

Found it...my knocking point is a bit higher...I will try to lower it a bit and see how it goes...thanks again sir..

I've been interested in learning thumb release for a long time, but a friend of mine keeps telling me its inferior to 3 finger. Can you comment on this?

@ArminHirmer

7 жыл бұрын

hahaha then all asian countries must have been wrong since thousands of years. 3 finger is easier, but not better ;)

@yugandali

6 жыл бұрын

I know you're not asking me, but I used to shoot with three fingers. I think the thumb release is much more sensitive, gives you a better feeling of the arrow and string.

Just be a sharper-pointed tip for the paper test -

If you want to know how to do a real rotational draw on utube see {Nusensi / Archery, Linear and Angular draw }

@ArminHirmer

2 жыл бұрын

Sure :)

You shoot a lot. but why ,...you don't feel pain in the skin of your thumb..... But i.... 🙈

@ArminHirmer

5 жыл бұрын

practice