How would you rate the Faction Focuses? I'd love to see you use our Tier system and rate ONE army per tier that fits that description for you!

Stormcast @4:05 Skaven @8:18 Gitz @12:14 Nighthaunt @16:40 Cities @19:11 KO @22:37 Tzeentch @26:36 Ogors @33:22 FEC @36:34 Fyreslayers @38:07 IDK @41:06 Nurgle @43:19 SOB @47:52 OBR @ 52:47 DOK @57:05 LRL @ 59:00 Slannesh @1:06:00 Kruelboysz @1:08:10 SBGL @1:10:24 Seraphon @1:13:30 S2D @1:18:36 Orruks @1:20:12 Sylvaneth @1:22:09 BOK @1:24:18 Wrap up @1:26:00

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Some heroes don't wear capes. I'll copy your post into the description once you've covered it all.

@anactualdino

9 күн бұрын

Thanks for this! Just curious, though, what army did they do at 41:06? Or do you not know?

@phacelessgod

9 күн бұрын

​@@anactualdino Idoneth Deepkin is commonly referred to as IDK.

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

Posting it in the description now. Thanks!

Guys, I've gotta say: as a newcomer to your channel, I'm incredibly impressed. I ended up watching every single one of these vids (and liking them, lol) just to keep up with your analysis and ideas that you were sharing. I'm incredibly optimistic for 4th ed. having started as a Stormcast player (fuck whoever took my sacrosanct away though, I will miss my catboys, though I'll proxy them as dracoths I guess.) then moved to OBR as I fell in love with their systems, gameplay, and aesthetics, then expanded to Slaves to Darkness. Honestly I am scared for StD as they may be too strong right out the gates, but that's premature. Now finding out you're a lumineth channel? Holy moly, that's perfect! I grabbed a huge lot of Lumineth and I'm extremely excited to try them out in 4th. I know there were a lot of concerns / comments here on them being more restrained / limited compared to 3rd, but from an outsider's perspective, I think it was the army with the "most to remember" in each phase. Maybe this is healthy? A long winded post, all of which to say, your content is outstanding, I really like your way of presenting the info, and I hope to see more in the future! Thanks so much for all you do!

@ryanburruss

9 күн бұрын

Yo man, really appreciate the positivity! Was a blast making these, so it’s always nice knowing someone out there had a blast along with us!

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Completely agree with Ryan. These are the kind of comments I live for. Thanks for the kind words. You're hyping me up!

Thank you boys, I have been watching as much as I can and have really enjoyed these videos. Will probably join the discord as well. Thank you for the content. Much appreciated, keep it up!

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Welcome aboard!

This is what I'm here for. Brilliant content guys

Nice to have a wrap up video! Great job to both of you and I'm looking forward to get extra insight through some of your future videos (especially for LRL or perhaps armies I don't play and don't know as well). It's a bit difficult for me to evaluate as good trait doesn't necessarily mean it's better than good warscrolls but to asnwer your question about our thoughts on some of the tiers (some of my reasoning below). If I really must pick only one, it's the first one I mentioned per tier: Top tier (S): It really looks to me like Khorne / FEC / Soulblight would be the clear top 3 at a first glance to me. Everything else that was put up there I think may be overrated or depend quite a bit on multiple factors. They are some of the top armies right now and don't seem to have lost much, in some cases they seem to have lost a few things but then got buffed on other things. 2nd tier: LRL / OBR. Looks solid but generally some nerfs and fewer options than before. 3rd tier (Mid tier): S2D (Maybe Nurgle, will depend how tanky they are and how easy it is to spread the diseases) 4th tier (Meh): Ironjawz Worst tier: Ogors / Slaanesh indeed looked bad with those faction focuses (I don't play them so it's not a grass is greener on the other side type of answer) but I think that Slaanesh might not turn out to be as bad as what it seems at first glance. Explainations: -OBR: I was the one with the long rant on the OBR video. Without repeating everything in another long text here, I think that it will no longer be possible to build an elite melee powerhouse army (back to castle with catapults) and that list building options will be very limited again (you may feel almost "forced" to take 2x catapults, 1x Ossifector, 3-6x Immortis Guards, Katakros or Arkhan, 20x Mortek Guards (too risky for OBR to take min size units because unlike Soulblight and FEC, once the unit is gone, they can't revive it). These things alone will probably already be around 2/3rd your army and you still don't have a mobile unit (deathriders+mounted hero), no harvester, etc. However, the main reason I wouldn't put it top tier is because I think it will be super Battleplan dependant. I think on 3 objectives battleplan, it may be top tier sitting on 2 objectives while on 4+ objectives, I think it'll be mid or maybe even low tier. We'll have to see Morghast warscrolls and points cost. -S2D: I am excited for the changes, don't get me wrong here. The warscrolls were great, it was my favorite faction focus out of my 7 armies. It's just that I think that it will look strong on paper but me mid or upper mid tier in practice. It loses the strong spellcasting and unbinding. It doesn't really have ranged options and loses allies. So it'll be a solid melee army that doesn't have a lot of tricks to outplay smart opponents. Outside of the Daemon Prince, you will only trigger the buffs if you kill a unit AND survive long enough after that to benefit from these stacking buffs. -LRL: I'm most excited for these, especially for kangaroos to run in, snipe heroes through wards/bodyguards and run out. I think the -1 to hit will be very good vs many armies. I'm just a bit concerned about the damage output (and maybe survivability outside of that -1 to hit) from the warscrolls. If I'm not mistaken, Nicolas who won the world championship with LRL some months ago said that he was now running lists revolving mostly around heroes as most of the units don't deal enough damage outside of maybe bladelords. The new warscrolls seemed even nerfed on dmg (Alarith dmg nerfed, Kangaroos maybe nerfed dmg, no more mortal wounds on shooting, only 1 unit gets the 5+ MWs, etc.). So I'm really hoping their damage won't be as bad as I think (also wish the units were hitting on 2s when I see so many random units hitting and wounding on 3s like Blightkings, basic Khorne daemons, Chaos warriors, etc.). So I think it'll have really cool tricks but am worried about the warscrolls. -Kruleboyz: I still think their new tricks look flashy but they're on dice rolls, will be unreliable and still a very squishy army. We'll have to see if the Sludgeraker is still a damage multiplier but I worry a bit that they'll still be glass but not as much canon as they are and that if they can't kill stuff before they get hit, they may die very fast. We'll have to see but they probably need more models. -Ironjawz: Hard to tell but I think the playstyle will change from Alpha Strike to a more similar playstyle to Fireslayers... but be worse than Fyreslayers at it. Brutes will hit hard but still not survive that well. No recursion. Low mobility, no ranged attacks. We'll have to see but I think they'll be mid tier at best if the other warscrolls are strong, maybe even low tier. -Slaanesh: The only reason why I think MAYBE it won't be as bad as what it looks like (still won't be great) is because it seemed like the warscrolls they showed had some strong debuffs (or buffs for Slaanesh) if you charge into them. So MAYBE charging Slaanesh won't always be what you really want to do but it's pure speculation, we'd have to see the full picture. The warscrolls looked nice though, especially the Demon hero that was shown looked very scary to face for heroes. -Ogors: We haven't seen the mount traits yet, maybe they'll still have strong warscrolls but the battle traits sure did not seem exciting (that and hiding around terrain pieces). I would have definitely been bummed out by that faction review if I was an Ogor player.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

I agree with most of what you wrote. I feel especially the same towards Lumineth and Ogors. Can't really say enough of OBR to rate them as you can, so you might end up being right! Thanks for all the comments throughout the series. Really enjoy reading your input. If you're in the discord, feel free to let me know your name there. I'd love to know who I'm chatting with there.

Cant wait for the indexes to see how much those and points move this tier list about..

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Yep! They're gonna shift around so much 😂

Another awesome video. Personally I play Fyreslayers and am really excited about 4ed. Awaiting what other army to pick up havent made up my mind entirely yet :)

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

How are you feeling about Fyreslayers so far?

@TheBaconShaman

5 күн бұрын

@@strategoi I got to play Fyreslayers in a spearhead demo last week and while I know spearhead is quite a bit paired down from what 4th will be, I can say that the dwarves are absolute lawnmowers. Fragile, high damage rat blenders.

I’ve got a bunch of gloomspite gitz on the painting table, getting em ready for 4th! Excited to see how they’ll play out😊

@moritzvogel376

9 күн бұрын

Me too! Love these guys!

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

For a second there I thought you meant 10th edition and felt that was a little too pessimistic haha. Love the enthusiasm.

Slannesh as a ranking😂 so good

@ryanburruss

9 сағат бұрын

Jonas and I chuckled when we made the tier as well, ha

Just started the video and almost spit my tea seeing Slaanesh as a tier hehehe

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Hehehe, we thought it was too good not to do it xD

I agree so much with some of your insight especially on Kharadron : their movment seems still ok but I'm really worried about their output and damage capabilities. Skywardens have been nerfed from 3 to 2 attacks (Mortal on 6's is not bad but i'm not sure it's far from enough) and they were already not played in V3. Shooting units aren't impressive at all (Thunderers for example). Brokk is the only good exception with a great warscroll imo.

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Yeah, Ryan really knows his stuff. I thought Brokk was a stand-out as well, but I doubt he can make up for the lack of power in the scrolls. As a LRL player who has always had to win with movement and controlling the board rather than dealing tons of damage, that might be where KO is headed for a while.

Both great: Blades of Khorne, 6" murderlust bubbles bloodthirster and skullcrushers. Good battle trait: Disciples of Tzeentch. Destiny dicev are great but they didn't show any staying power or damage projection. Good warscrolls: Gitz. Meh: slyvaneth. They just didn't show enough. Slaamesh: The one army that has stronger battle traits for your opponent than it does for you

@strategoi

7 күн бұрын

Love this tier list!

Damn slaneesh is that bad? Time to start a slaneesh army, being masochistic is literally what following slaneesh is. Give em pleasure receive pain, i am down to it

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Just to cover our *sses: slaanesh SEEMS that bad right now. Their battle traits are absolutely horrendous, but I really believe they'll be surprisingly powerful when the full index drops.

Gitz are a weird one because there are so many play styles in that army. And for most of them, it could be a rough adjustment. But if you break troggs out on their own, they would go top tier, since it looks like they are still identical to 3rd ed.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

I also thought the troggs looked good. Not sure I'm ready for that meta, but I definitely like the look of them 😁

I feel like it's much more important to have a good traits than a good warscroll in those focuses. First because you can have good warscoll for your armies that haven't been shown yet and you can't for traits and also GW is much more likely to change things on the warscolls with Battletomes and stuff than changing the battle traits. I guess having Armies of Renown can change that but they would be probably months from now.

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

We do as well, though certain warscrolls can be so amazingly strong that the traits really don't matter. But yeah, we're with you for the most part!

I’ve been playing and sucking with skaven too long, I’m probably too pessimistic to see what you boys saw At the end of the day the warscrolls are still poor enough, lots of shots is well and good but when even with rend half the enemies will have better saves than the rats can ever get means quantity won’t beat quality Was hoping the suicidal aspect would be toned down, other armies can buff up without killing half their army It stops being fun after a while

@strategoi

7 күн бұрын

It wouldn't be for me either, but then that's been the identity for skaven for such a long time. I hope you find a list you enjoy playing around with in 4e!

Khorne I think is gonna be a lot more fun to play against and with next edition. With murderlust and blood tithe being toned down as far as I can see and daemons seeing the changes we see in the ff the army is leaning towards being more tactical in the literal sense of you will need to use proper tactics to get the most out of it which is where the army is the most fun imo. Points could ruin it but those can be fixed a lot easier than the rules.

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

Wholeheartedly agree! The fact that the spell bounce is gone makes matchups less polarising.

Can someone explain to me how the Tzeenche burn works. Do all the enemies models that got hit by wyrdflame get to burn or just one of my choices

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

In short: when a model is allocated damage by a wyrdflame attack or spell, they become eligible to set them aflame in the shooting phase. Since the ability to set them aflame is once per turn army, you could light up ONE unit in your turn and then ONE in your opponent's with covering fire, for example. So yeah, not very impressive, though I expect there will be warscrolls that immediately light units up. 😊

I'm probably not right but right now it is the only thing giving me hope about Lumineth's infantry and that's the price of general units will go down to make up for how squishy everything will be so you can take more but it seems more that they are taking lumineth in the direction of being even more of a hero heavy army

@Strade8

9 күн бұрын

check the masterclass they did, you can see that, if that if is 2000 point game, the price of each unit went up.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Strade makes a fair point except for the fact that the battle report didn't include any vanari. They *must* be cheaper, surely, if they're all losing so much of their in-built value. But maybe that's too optimistic 🤷‍♂️

@toofilthy

9 күн бұрын

@strategoi im hoping that other heros have similar synergies like you see with severith perhaps the lord regent being able to still let you use power of hysh on multiple units still but i feel theres still a lack of information like is aetherquartz being replaced with something and what changes to the scinari cathallar absorb despair ability. Something feels missing that isnt being shared

Your list ended up being pretty close to my own thoughts on the faction focuses. I think the only real changes that I would make is moving Fyreslayers up to the top tier and moving Seraphon down to Good Scrolls. Or even just Meh. But maybe that is just personal taste. Overall, it seems like Death is turning out fantastic as a great alliance, while almost all of Destruction ended up being underwhelming. Order and Chaos on the other hand have enough factions and enough variety to cover (nearly) the entire spectrum.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Happy to read that we're in agreement on most of it. I think ironjawz and kruleboyz look pretty good, but the other destruction stuff looks meh indeed.

Surprisingly as a Kruelboyz player i am most excited to see Hobgrotz warscroll. Coz with current changes and Venom-Encrusted weapons being unlocked i mostly interested IF Hobgrots would have mortals on their weapon profiles and IF they would keep sustained hits in addition to mortals. Maybe best warscroll out of all of them or meh warscroll as it was in 3.0

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

That'd be amazing and surprising!

What could it be a good army to start? i am in between idoneth, kruleboyz, skaven and flesh eater courts but the fish elves and the cunning orruks i think look the coolest

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

All of those armies are fairly technical to start with. So it depends on your previous experiences with wargames. If you've come from a different wargame already, I'd take what army you like the look of. If it's your first steps into wargames and into age of Sigmar, I'd go with skaven or kruleboyz because they'll be the cheapest to collect if you buy second hand stuff or starter boxes.

@truenabooties252

8 күн бұрын

@@strategoi is idoneth a bad idea as a new army for someone with little to no knowledge?

For casual players, I think stormcast, skaven, flesheater courts, and kruleboyz are all going to be the strongest

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Right? And a lot of other armies also look fantastic so far.

@jonasandersson5838

9 күн бұрын

Doubt kryleboyz, the random tricks is a feel bad. It's a timmy army with way to much randomness

@Chance_25

9 күн бұрын

@@jonasandersson5838 "casual players"

@antoniojosebellomartinez2842

9 күн бұрын

Don’t play casual

@Chance_25

9 күн бұрын

@@antoniojosebellomartinez2842 unless it's a tournament setting, it's casual...I guarantee you play 80% of your games casually

I feel you are going to be wrong about tzeentch. It is an army of chaff, that was held up by summoning more chaff to replace it. Spell damage is likely out the window. DoT effects work for Nurgle because it is durable and can last long enough to capitalize which Tzeentch isnt. The pinks are going to be hugely cost inefficient because of the ceiling for their wound density. Every pink being a potential 6 wounds that rally for 2 points needs to be costed appropriately but realistically they are only 2 wounds chaff.

@strategoi

7 күн бұрын

I hope it still ends up doing well. While I never enjoyed playing against it, it finally seems in a pretty good place...

In your opinion, what is the most fun looking army to play ?

@capitanjulietti3436

10 күн бұрын

Ossiarchs

@dalisgalvin21

10 күн бұрын

@@capitanjulietti3436 I was thinking the Dino's with the Crit 2s could be cool. Build a very mobile hard hitting agro combat list

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

What style do you enjoy? I like complex armies, so LRL and Sylvaneth are kinda my jam. If you're a beginner in the warhammer world, I'd avoid any aelven armies for now though. Slaves to Darkness is an army I'd easily recommend to both starters and veterans! Easy to understand, but will probably have some complex builds too.

@dalisgalvin21

10 күн бұрын

@@strategoi yeah I'm a beginner when it comes to AOS. Played 40k a good few years back. Think something fairly simple and aggressive for now with room to grow. I'm getting the new box so obviously stormcast in on the horizon but I do think Ogors/Seraphon would be cool. I do quite like Fyreslayers too.

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

@@dalisgalvin21 Ogors look to be in a weird place. They might actually receive a book right after SCE and Skaven. At least that's a rumour. Seraphon is super cool, but used to be difficult to pilot. We'll see how that develops. Fyreslayers are pretty cool, but movement is key in AoS and with 4" on most of your models, it's not a very forgiving army for beginners. That being said, since you come from 40k (I did as well, back in the day), you'll pick AoS up in no time. So play whatever you like best. Stormcast is definitely a good starter army.

I think there's a lot of hand-wringing over all the 4+ stats in the game now, but i think it's good, along with the shorter ranges for shooting. It will be nice for the game not to be over at the middle of turn 2 like it almost always was in 3rd.

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

Fair! I hate failing one of my signature abilities like that, but I also concur that it probably makes for a more balanced game.

You guys are really on the edging train 😂 love y'all

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Haha, I'm not sure what that means. I hope it doesn't mean what I think it does... ;-)

@Kinhussar

10 күн бұрын

​@@strategoi You guys are so hyped about 4.0 that you even make a tier list out of previews.

Not sure my math is right but stoneguard buffed do 11,25 damage to a 4+ save.. is the highest I calculated so far. They basically have a 3+ save and can have a 5+ ward. They don't seam weak to me. The wind part of the army have some amazing mobility and Avalonor is a tank that can hurt if charged. Lumineth seams in a good position to me. The list we saw at the masterclass looks quite balanced and fun to play with. Nurgle in 4 are, as they were, very plain to play. Stand on objective, tank with infantry and punch back with monsters. Losing heal sucks (maybe the tree brings that back?) disease is good against recursion army, otherwise is just your enemy having to spend a command point for heal on unit he really cares about.The Bleghtkings and Plaguebearers serve the save purpose because one is daemon and the other human. Now you can a bit mix them, in 4 you will probably play one or the other. The crux of the army will be the prayer to decrease control ( i think it will show to be almost too strong) and the monster still doing good damage.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

I can definitely follow all your points about nurgle. The math on Stoneguard is not so bad, but they were alright in the previous book as well, but that was never enough for them to be a strong option. 4'' is just too slow in our army. That being said: I'm sure they'll be pretty tanky, for all the reasons that you mentioned. I just wonder whether that's enough. 😊

Gloomspite gitz are meh? :( just starting with aos and goin to go with them

@strategoi

5 күн бұрын

Very important side note: the faction focus was meh! So their army might not be. Chances are they'll be totally fine. So definitely go for them if you enjoy their look!

Going to say it, as a FEC player, kinda insane to put FEC in the top tier given that if you don't take Ushoran the army doesn't have any army abilities until turn 3 since they lost the heroic action to get deed points

@strategoi

4 күн бұрын

We'll probably be seeing combat take a turn to brutality a little sooner now, with counter-charge and smaller objectives. So I think you might generate your noble deed points sooner than you are doing now (excluding spells obviously). Good feedback though!

@ryanburruss

4 күн бұрын

FEC is also in the top because Death came out very strong with these focuses, especially considering they were already really tough matchups in the meta. Furthermore, FEC got one of the softest nerfs of all of the books, so yes, Ushoran brings the army back to where it was as a 3rd book, but tons of armies can’t even possibly reach where they used to be. And I don’t believe you need him to still be strong, only in comparison to what FEC players are currently used to.

@jamesguillette3878

4 күн бұрын

@@strategoi the issue isnt getting to combat, the issue is that putting a fec hero who isnt a monster into combat is throwing that hero away, and monsters who arent ushoran need to be in combat in multiple turns to actually get a full 6 since mount (now companion) attacks dont work towards it

So Death is going to dominate I guess.

@strategoi

Күн бұрын

Might end up being okay. I didn't feel like they were massively standing out, just real solid armies.

@ryanburruss

Күн бұрын

I however have a personal vendetta against Death armies in general (esp. Soulblight), so I would totally agree. But it’s also really too early to say!

Me as a cities player☠️☠️

@ryanburruss

9 сағат бұрын

I feel ya, man. Also having just seen the Hammerers leaked, I’m still not getting all that great of a vibe. But fingers crossed!

Slaanesh gets trophy for most underrated faction in a few weeks :)

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Them or Nurgle!

@starslayer2438

10 күн бұрын

Only if they get great warscrolls. Because their battle traits are trash tier. Worst battle traits of all armies. (Slaanesh)

@UberPwner09

10 күн бұрын

As mentioned in the video, my hope is Slaanesh gets future warscrolls that penalize the opponent for using temptation dice, because as it stands, Hedonites are actively encouraged to use their own battle traits as little as possible, because the opponent benefits far more from them. I mean, can you even call it "temptation" anymore if it's pure upside and zero downside for you?

@starslayer2438

9 күн бұрын

I doubt that we see any warscrolls that punish temptation dice or hand out the Euphoric keyword in meaningful ways. - Firstly, the faction focus neither showed nor mentioned any of those. - Secondly, using indivual warscrolls as a crutch like that to boost the terrible battle traits would make such units mandatory for every army list. Which would severely reduce variety in list building.

I'm super worried about the loonshrine just getting destroyed easily every game. Fyreslayers looked really good early, now I'm thinking about how fragile hgb are looking. Much more optimistic about IJ.

@strategoi

10 күн бұрын

Fyreslayers might still do well. They just need one warscroll that gives them some teleporting. That should be doable, right?

Agree with Gargants lol. There definitely needs to be either a sub-faction of mini Gargants or even gargant slave units or something. The army is hella boring.

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

Yeah... I understand the appeal of running only 4 dudes, but after a while it gets so boring. I've also never enjoyed playing them or seeing them on the table.

@markpandelidis2079

8 күн бұрын

@@strategoi agreed. And just for flexibility sake. Having more model choice is more fun

There is a bias you guys show that I want to address. You guys rate armies a lot in how much damage they can deal or take, but some armies like nurgle and gargants shine by doing neither and focusing on taking and holding objectives. I personally feel those armies DO bring some flavor the game because it means you have another facet of tactics to think about. You beat those armies by movement blocking and being conscious about what objectives you want to fight about. Not by lolclapping them off the board. If you bounce of Nurgle/gargants and feel it's a NPE it's because you played into their game instead of readjusting your own.

@ryanburruss

9 күн бұрын

Maybe I wasn’t clear, but this is precisely why I hesitated to put Nurgle low and why I admitted my bias about Gargants. Btw, I don’t believe big ‘ole Gargants should have to play a game tactically standing on objectives and trying not to die. Which is also why I said they need a range expansion with more options for roles. But yes, damage does factor heavily into my value system, but movement factors in even more. I’ve gone on record numerous times saying that a unit is fire because it has a built-in teleport. And for that matter, so does tankiness. Once again, as I said about Daughters, there’s no point in good battle traits if you don’t have any models left to use them. Gargants do have this problem as well (with respect to saves, not wounds, but once again I referenced the DPS check more than once here), and Nurgle is clearly fantastic with taking damage (like I said about an army-wide 5+ ward). Again, the “meh” category was more for not knowing where to put an army on the basis of its Faction Focus, not where we thought the armies would land in the real world.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Thanks for your comment, Boljarin! Gonna have to agree with Ryan. Definitely damage plays a big part in our rating of it, but we did talk about your points as well, I think? 🤔 Ryan definitely highlighted some of the things you mentioned. Good to know some of it could be more heavily highlighted though. 👍

Stalkers got nerfed so much it makes me sad

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

😔

i strongly dissagree about stormcast being so high. there traits once deployed do nothing anymore. finest hour being only done in your own turn is bad when you most want it as a defensive tool. once per game returning 2-3 models is a weaker version of most other factions with sameish trait. scroll wise they stil dont have ward saves, and there damage output on even there elite units ( reclusisians) is not enough to kill a 20man clan rat unit who keep returning models. spells are mood point with the removal of 95% of all wizzards sce had. the scrolls also show nothing of there supposed demigod like stats they should have with being just as slow as humans and only having 2 wounds on basic troops. mostly hiting and wounding on 3s is decent, but they lack attacks when in this edition it's very easy to have larger units with 3-4x the attacks all in combat range vs the small 3-5 unit model count units of sce. they also stil have zero interaction with there units. no traits etc interact with one another and its stil a 95% pure warscroll stat army. and again for immortal super soldiers, there scrolls are the same at best of many other scrolls we have seen so far. the ironjawz brutes have 1 move less, but oh boy do they hit twice as hard as our paladins, and to booth they have so many army buffs to buff there attacks/damage thats its no comparison at all.

@markpandelidis2079

9 күн бұрын

I agree SCE don't look good. Some of their scrolls look good and maybe there's ways of reusing the battle traits. It's possible they get a hero that can put units back in the celestial realm which would be awesome. Knight-arcanum doesn't look bad IMO. Very bad take on their part. I agree it doesn't feel like SCE are "the most elite warriors"

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

The challenge with stormcast has always been to match their lore with their warscrolls, sadly. They could never come close to what they're like in the lore because they would absolutely demolish most armies. So I think a lot of disappointment stems from that challenge. I have the same trouble with god models. I always feel bad when playing them because they're just not as godly as I want them to be. But then, if they were, Nagash would kill an entire army on his own without too much trouble.

squigs should never have been as good as they were. Having any rend at all with their attack count and 2 wounds is ridiculous. Herds and squig swarms should be weight of numbers, not super high quality attacks imo. them and their riders being as competent and powerful as, for example, chaos knights, is frankly hilarious.

@strategoi

3 күн бұрын

Yes! Completely agree. 👍

Scrolls look bad for tzeentch, having the Arcane Suggestion spell (which was taken by any mortal hero before) locked to Kairos is stupid, only scary thing about kairos is his battle tactic ability (useless for the majority of players who play narrative). kairos with 5+ save is gonna get melted, before it was scary to come close to him with the Infernal gateway spell but now everyone can charge him with the insane amounts of 3D6 charges this edition without punishment. Curseling has a melee buff spell wich is awesome , oh wait its only him. Why is he buffed for getting in fights when he hits like shit, whats the point, arcane suggestion was supposed to be on him and make Kairos more interesting than giving him an ability to cheat the game which will get nerfed or taken out cuz players will complain about it. Why does GW keep trying to make tzeentch a melee option without giving fking good melee options. The faction is ultra glasscannon and dies in combat before you can look at the damn warscroll. Pink horrors are horrible, absolutely bullshit, yes split and split again was bad but now its worse, becasue its useless. Gw gave the faction to be developed by an intern, I swear its so stupid. Dont get me started about wyrdflame, lame and uninspired for a CASTING ARMY! Maggotkin of Tzeentch probably going to be good for tournaments but for the rest of 90% is going to sit on the shelves for the next 3-4 years.

@markpandelidis2079

9 күн бұрын

Mostly agree, though I think Kairos is fine. Curseling is a complete 150% miss on the spell.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Curseling is such a weird scroll! I hope there's enough units in the book that want him to be in combat alongside them...

Skaven wizards are so bad now. Even Skreech is a 1 cast wizard in 4.0. As the strongest Skaven beeings after the Great Horned Rat i expected Verminlords at least to remain 2 casts wizards. So if Skreech doesn't have 2 casts, then i doubt any of the unrevealed casters have. Also it seems we lost the +1 prayer/casting bonus from the gnawhole. Unless either their spell lore is absolutely insane or the points cost on wizards drop significantly i don't think Skaven will be a top tier army.

@markpandelidis2079

9 күн бұрын

I agree the verminlords look meh. Screech is ok. He has big damage. But weaker than he was by alot. And Rat Ogors are also underwhelming.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

I'm not familiar enough with skaven to judge all of the input here, so just a question so we're on the same level: a lot of magic armies lost much of their magical dominance (reduced spell lores, fewer casting bonuses, units becoming non-wizards, ... Only OBR seem to have gotten away with a lot of powerful casters), so do you think skaven still lost more than other factions did in general?

@apokalyph7325

4 күн бұрын

@@strategoi I'm not 100% sure about all other armies, but it seems to me that they intended to nerfed infantry wizards to 1 cast (which is justified), while most armies with a magic focus retained dedicated larger/unique wizard models with 2 casts and god units with potentially even more casts. Skaven masterclan is obviously magic focused, so skreech and warpseer should absolutely be 2 casts in my opinion. Thanquol should 100% be 2 cast aswell, but i can't imagine he is more powerful than a verminlord from any clan, so it makes no sense to me. screaming bell is debatable. The magic potential of the whole army is basically halved and -1 for crucial spells like deathfrenzy. In my opinion a big part of what made skaven strong in the first place was the cheap 2 unbinds and casts grey seers provided

And there it is. The biased opinion that everything should just be powerful. Humans should be 2+/2+ 2R 2D everything right? I really want to see this kind of attitude leave the social consciousness of the game. 4+ is not bad. I REALLY hate that. Let's stop telling the community that 4th has made everything worse and let's start saying everything is rebalanced. Humans hit and wound on 4+ as a base. Get over it.

@strategoi

9 күн бұрын

Hm, while I agree with your sentiment, I also think you took a single statement out of an entire context. The 4+ to hit is rough - especially if the one warscroll we were talking about got so little in return. Just trying to put that back into context so we can continue the positive notes throughout these comments ❤️

@markpandelidis2079

9 күн бұрын

@@strategoi but it's something I'm hearing over and over again across all the KZreadrs. I get that it's going to take time for people to reframe their attitude from 3rd. 4+ to hit is not bad. I'll continue to say it until the community has accepted it.

You two are just babes! :)

@strategoi

8 күн бұрын

Haha, thanks! Even my girlfriend doesn't call me that ;-)

@MKDietz

8 күн бұрын

@@strategoi 😋🤩😍

@ryanburruss

8 күн бұрын

I only call Jonas that when we’re cuddling

@MKDietz

8 күн бұрын

@@ryanburruss I feel so left out 😋 Thanks again for the great content guys 😍