I one of the cassette adaptors people used in cars back in the day with mine. works like a charm without the need for modding.

@budandbean1

4 жыл бұрын

What a great idea... 👍🏼

@blakecasimir

4 жыл бұрын

I’ve had mixed luck with those. I remember trying one in a few different transports just to test it out. I had one auto-reverse deck that kept “auto reversing” at random, and in a car stereo it would do the same. Not recommended.

@VinylIsForever

4 жыл бұрын

BlakeCasimir the cpc doesn't have auto-reverse tho. Never had a problem, I used it for years

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, that's a good idea. I might still have one of those adapters somewhere and want to try it but I didn't find it yet.

@marcianzero_yt

4 жыл бұрын

I also did this, before recording actual tape. Need to squeeze the wire a bit. Works perfectly then, costs nearly nothing, and can be done by everyone. But it is a little bit un-retro imho. :)

Lots of nostalgia for the CPC464. Those tape sounds - they are burned into my brain for life. Good times, great video Jan. Also your shortcut of holding CTRL and little ENTER can go one step further. Do as you do but press the . next to little ENTER at the same time and hold for a second. Don't know why I remembered that really haha.

That load sound brings back memories of my childhood.

That sounds brings so many childhood memory of my dad's amstrad cpc.. Great Vid Jan..

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks! Yeah, I love the good old tape loading sounds, too. :)

Love the cpc-464. It was our first homecomputer. I hope to get one back one day, since our schneider unit long been sold. I do have the gx4000 with a c4cpc cartridge. That works also with the cpc-464.

Great mod Jan, i just learned something new, thanks😁👍🏻

Tks for the weekend entertainment, Jan! Another great video, as always! Have a great weekend

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks Boca! :)

Love it! Can't wait to mod mine. Thanks for posting.

The Schneider CPC 464 was my first own Computer, we spend a lot of money for upgrades like 2 disk drives a printer and the 512K memory expansion. The only downside was that I only had the green monitor. But I loved the machine and had it sitting next to my Amiga even for a year or two.

You know, it's weird but I love this sound.

OMG, that drill!!! I thought I was going to have to create another GIF meme.🤣 Great video again. The audio in jack looks perfect.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Lol, I can't always break something. :D Don't know if you have seen those, but some others still made some hilarious new #JanBetaWasHere GIFs on Twitter after this. :)

@MindFlareRetro

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta No, I haven't seen the news ones. I'll do a search.

Thankfully it’s way more straightforward on my Acorn machines, cassette cable straight to my phone, and a website called 8bitkick ! Very informative for the CPC though :)

By inserting a mono jack to to the stereo output of the amp, you effectively short one channel to ground. For the best compatibility you should have leave the right channel (inner ring) unconnected, at the computer side. You should also use a switching mini-jack socket, and cut the signal from head amp when jack is inserted. ...and please - use a heat-shrink tubing on socket terminals.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, true that. Should cut the connection between the channels.

Was taking apart my wireless keyboard while watching this & I ripped the membrane beyond repair, hope I haven't caught the Beta curse! ;-)

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Whoops, I don't want to spread the curse. ;)

@ColdRFusion

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta It gives me an excuse to upgrade to a wireless mechanical keyboard, just ordered it :-)

I bought a Schneider variant of this a couple of months ago. Just for the sake of the feeling I then bought a small stereo with tape drive (10 € used). It was quite some fun to record on that. If I remember well, some games stop the tape and start later on again to load some next level et, where I was wondering how to do that in a construction like yours. :)

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

There is lines for the tape control that could be hooked up if the software supports that. No idea how to implement that with this setup though. But I guess you can manually stop playback and try to get the timing right for it to work.

@marcianzero_yt

4 жыл бұрын

:) Not with the simple Audio Connection. For the very simple solution I also used fake tape that has a 3.5 mm headphone jack on one side. That’s if you just want it to work, no beauty. For my real tape I have interleaved A and B sides on a 60 minutes Audio tape. Of course I had to document the tape counter for the different loads. But this depends on a working tape counter, which seems to be not the normal case for these old devices any more. But as I am a 16 Bit kid (Amiga) my CPC Setup has gone into storage after some initial playing (including new belts for everything). :/

I'd look at the connector from the tape deck to see which pins are for ground and signal, solder the wire directly to that. That way, you avoid the wire interfering with the deck. Also see if there is a connector for the control of the deck(when you press play). If so put a switch on the case that holds in position, then you can turn it on and off without pressing play every time.

hallo Jan :D Welcome in the CPC world ! the tapes are all mono. However, you must know that the CPC is the only 8 bits computer wired in stereo for the game sound. get the right cable, and forget the small speaker, put it on your Bheringer MS40 speakers directly, you'll see the sound is amazing :) PS : CPC-power website is your friend, and use csw2cdt for tape reversion to wav ;) cheers !

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, I tried hooking up the speaker after shooting the video. The sound is really good indeed! The CPC is a fascinating machine so far, I'm definitely going to do more exploration soon. :)

@dlfrsilver

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta yes fascinating. There are many legend titles on it, :D

I've got a Bluetooth Cassette adaptor, that I use in my car (it too, is "retro" like me and my computers!) but definitely doing this mod! Use TapDancer with my C64C and an MP32C64 and it's great!

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, tapDancer definitely is a great way to do it. Got my Android tablet working again fortunately in the meantime. :)

@bugbloke1975

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta Well done with the tablet!! 🙂👍

I closed my eyes when you were going to drill the hole Jan🙈 But Congratulations this time!😂

@hansu-nihon

4 жыл бұрын

​@@Okurka. My God! You noticed well. He still has to work on his motor skills. But we are already seeing improvement.😉 (Take no offence Jan, we are joking, you create interesting movies)

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Lol, didn't even notice I touched that case before drilling. Well spotted!

@marcianzero_yt

4 жыл бұрын

I was wondering whether it would be better to use a wood drill. I use this type when going at plastic, because they don‘t „float“ so easy. I see that the tape helps. , I guess KZread has probably enough people who can explain why that using the wood type is a bad idea. I am really interested. :)

Ach nein! Der Bohrer!, na I was sure you would be ok with that. I wish I knew more about these to be at least somewhat helpful but alas I do not. I guess this mod is pretty good to bypass the tape deck completely, you already answered my question if this worked for all versions and if it also had the volume issue (too quiet or too loud not working and such) or odd platform issue (PC doesn't work and a Phone is better or vice versa). I should look into this sort of thing more since it seems to be a thing these days, to find an alternative to using actual tapes with the various issues cassettes can have over time, sad that they don't last. Good to see more of the CPC anyway Keep it up, Jan.......also TOTORO!

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Thanks! I'm still in the process of figuring out the CPC, too. Wonderful machine so far. The tape loading is not very reliable still but at least I got my tablet working again in the meantime which makes things a bit more convenient.

So it seems a line level signal is likely not hot enough for the mod to work. I would suppose that TapDancer on a phone or tablet will work more reliably because those devices have headphone outputs which are, of course, amplified well above line level. I’m not surprised using the headphone out of those speakers worked because they’ll put out the same kind of amplified signal. Another great video, Jan. I was a CPC464 owner in the 80s. I’m no purist, I’d do this mod also as it ends up looking very clean. Nice job.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Usually the line level signal should be the same or even hotter than a phones signal (because it's usually driving higher impedance inputs). Might just have been the better volume control or something. Still figuring out things. Got my tablet working again in the meantime and that's the most convenient way to do it I found so far.

In order to play all games you need to add a rem (remote) socket too so it replicates the pausing of the tape. This is a form of copy protection

schönes Teil, der CPC...

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Ja, definitiv ein interessantes Design. Wobei ich diesen bunten Amstrad lieber mag als den langweiligeren Schneider. ;)

Been there, done that, Works partially, but not with all CDT files. In the end I bought a DDI5 from Zaxon on sellmyretro.com. Quite expensive, but 512K RAM plus HxC floppy emulator. Great device, now my Schneider CPC464 is capable of loading disc images and run 128k games too. I highly recommend that.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, I'll probably end up buying one of the DDi devices, too. They seem to be the most versatile option at present.

You can get audio into the tape deck non destructively by just using a car cassette adaptor and run the cable out the back of the expansion port. You can even do it using a Bluetooth version if you wish.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, good point. Might even have one of those somewhere in the basement. :)

Jan, You have the same big Bosch Drill like I use... Has also a hammer setting for concrete :-)

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Lol, not for use with ancient computers I guess. ;)

To combine L and R together at the jack you should really use a simple resistor mixer, e.g. 2 x 1k resistors, so that output amplifiers aren't shorted together if they happen to drive different polarities.

@Hagledesperado

4 жыл бұрын

Yes. I found a guide. It's probably not strictly necessary to use 5 kOhm resistors though. Even 200 Ohm resistors would be infinitely better than nothing, but I guess it's safest to stay at 1 kOhm or higher. www.epanorama.net/circuits/linesum.html

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Oh, thanks, I will look into that!

@WxAxNxDxExRxExR

7 ай бұрын

Wouldn't this mean that those output amplifiers would be shorted together if they connected to a genuine Mono socket? If so, quite a stupid design on their part, and not something people should even care about, really...

Driller Killer!

For my Commodore 64 I use a Tape/car CD player adapter and load direct of my PC, or I copy to tape for the multi loaders.. The software I use on PC is TapWave or AudioTap and with most C64 Tap files you need the volume low "about 15-20%" with the correct settings in AudioTap or TapWave.. some C64 software works at 100% volume but with different settings in the TAP program.. I have tried TapDancer on two tablets but can never get the Audio to work. All that I mentioned can be used for the Amstrad CPC, Atari 8 bit, Spectrum, MSX etc.. I got a new 8 bit computer the other week for free, cleaned it up and fixed what needed fixing.. I got a Atari 65XE, oh and a SEGA Saturn..

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, the volume settings are really difficult to get right. I think it depends a lot on the audio source and the quality/gain of the amp that uses. I got some pretty good results with tapDancer and my Nexus 7 tablet on the ZX spectrum previously but results vary a lot with different hardware I guess.

@bit-ishbulldog2089

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta Try TapWav and AudioTAP PC software..

@dlfrsilver

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta Jan if you need hints & tricks for tape loading, i'm your man. I've preserved around 1200 commercial tape games :) I know well the CPC hardware ;)

Oh no he's pulling out the drill. OMG he did it!!! lol

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Haha, at least it went reasonably well this time. ;)

Looking at the cassette deck schematic, it is very similar to how the Amstrad Spectrums with built in tapedecks work. The raw signal from the tape head (which is at a very low level, and amplified by transistor Q301) is coupled into a pair of opamps. The opamps are configured as Schmitt triggers, so the audio signal from the tape ends up as a nice clean square wave. I think the right way to do it would be to connect the audio to pin 6 of the opamp, but via a DC blocking capacitor, say 100nF. You may like to watch this video, about modifying a Spectrum +2 to allow both internal cassette deck and external audio sources to work. The circuit of the tape deck is very similar, and so the info should apply equally well to the CPC: watch?v=qUIv-A_DOc0?t=731

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Oh, I will look into that. Thanks!

PCB Waaaaaaay!

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yay!

der Tocotronic Sticker

Did that on my first 464. Found him next to a trashcan 20 years ago but I repaired him 6-7 years now. Though to make this mod as the tape was like a compressed soda can, completely destroyed. Well I did it in the hard way from the schematic, later I discovered there was already a mod on the net :-/ If you drag a CDT over CDT2WAV it will make a WAV file in the same folder so you can use it without it.

I made a similar audio-in by C64. I soldered signal wire to only one chanel. Than you can use stereo cable. Conecting 2 chanels you getting noise. When you have the same source signal on both chanels, signal output can be shiftet in time (diffrent delay on amp chanels and so..). I have conected signal on third op-amp stage through 100k resistor, but on CPC signal level can be diffrent.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Oh, yes, that makes sense. Maybe I should try adding a resistor, too. But I guess that depends on which impedance the audio source used is designed for.

@mophus6461

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta Yes, but not to signal output. My sugestion is to feed the signal to op-amp. Here is the schematic. I don`t know if its the same by you. www.cpcwiki.eu/forum/amstrad-cpc-hardware/464-mod/?action=dlattach;attach=4733;image You can try pin 5 or pin 10 (first or second stage). Try 100k resistor at first. You can see the signal on osciloscope. Ground connect to ground. And Use audio cable where only one channel is connected

Great video! There is a cat on your background... Black Cat with like hippo ears? What is it called? You should consider using lock tight on your audio jack nut so that you don't have to worry about it undoing over time.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

The cat is Totoro: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/My_Neighbor_Totoro I found that with these audio jacks you usually just have to tighten the nut and it will hold forever. Also built guitar effects pedals with similar jacks without any problems. No need for locktite I think.

you should check one of those cone shaped drill bits (step bits) so that you can do measured holes easier

@lordmuaddib

4 жыл бұрын

@Mr T. Guru with those you're sure not to crack delicate plastic, and by enlarging slowly you can do a tight fit without the need to clean the borders of the hole. there's nothing lazy about it buddy.. cheers

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

I have one of those but didn't see the need to use it for this job. I usually use that for larger holes when I don't have a matching drill bit.

@lordmuaddib

4 жыл бұрын

@Mr T. Guru i mean, that's the whole point, not everyone has got that much experience to use something like that on delicate surfaces, but it's not like i don't get you're saying.

Great Job Jan! I was wondering... What if you put a tape inside the deck and press REC&PLAY (with proper SAVE command)? Maybe you could test SAVE and LOAD commands directly from the tape... Let me know please, thanks and congrats! :)

@JoeMcLutz

4 жыл бұрын

(of course I mean SAVING to tape from the external source - tablet, smartphone... etc.)

@fabiosemino2214

4 жыл бұрын

I tested this some time ago on my CPC+ on real tape and there is no problem, just saved some basic programs that I wrote for fun

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Interesting idea, I guess you should be able to do that.

I made same mod some years ago. Spend many hours to get Nebulus running. I bought DDi3 unit cos messing with audio level and load errors was pain in ass. Cassette adapter didn't help either.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

I think I might end up getting one of the DDi devices, too. They seem to be the most convenient and versatile option at the moment.

Could toss in a Bluetooth Adapter into the System to transfer the "Tape Data" to the CPC via Bluetooth. Remove the Right Channel from the Audio jack you added, Even if you use a Mono cable it still puts the Right Channel to ground and can harm the Source such as the Sound Card or Audio Amplifier.

Hmmm... I would expect that there is some kind of automatic gain control circuit in the tape drive to adjust to the right volume on the tape?

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

There's probably some Schmitt trigger circuitry similar to the C64 I would guess but I haven't really looked into the schematics yet.

A significant feature you lose compared to the external tape input in a CPC 6128 for example, is motor control for multi load games. Of course, it's not like that would be of any use if you're feeding digital audio files or anything not involving an actual old "datacorder", though.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

I think you could hook up the motor control pins, too, and add a switch or a relay. Technically possible, no idea how feasible it is though. ;)

i there do you know if the 464 can have a separate tape cassette player connecter to play tape games from? as I know there were some tape players designed to load games connected to these old computers but im not sure if you can with the normal 464 or not? my tape counter is knackered and so is the reset button which isn't a issue playing games, just a pain when its a compilation tape and I want to play the last game and I have to load each game first to get to it

Make sure that jack is not a shorting jack with no jack inserted. Also some sound cards don’t like there outputs shorting together

wow that was a bit of a bodge it job Jan, i would have placed that better and routed the wires around the outside

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

I was going for the shortest cable length to avoid interference. But your are right, I could have done a way cleaner job on this.

Cool video! I'm a little surprised that the cassette drive allows you to press play without a physical cassette inserted. A lot of cassette decks have a mechanism that either prevents pressing play without a cassette inserted or immediately releases it automatically once it senses that there's no physical tape inside.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

It's quite a cheap mechanism I think. In retrospect, I don't know if it's even necessary to press play when trying to load tape images though. Might work without it.

@WxAxNxDxExRxExR

7 ай бұрын

@@JanBeta Actually the cassette player motor generates so much noise that you're less likely to load a game with Play pressed...

At 5:49 looks like there's a broken spring in the tape mechanism, just under the PCB. Is that supposed to look like that? 🤔

@megaglowz8540

4 жыл бұрын

He covered that in the restore video. kzread.info/dash/bejne/Yqub0KWCj6y5j6g.html 23.. : ..54 mark.

@Crashedfiesta

4 жыл бұрын

@@megaglowz8540 cheers! Missed that video somehow... :)

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yup, the tape mechanism needs some serious TLC. ;)

do you have to press play when loading a game? would be nice to avoid using the motor in the tape deck?

1:46 I should get this is far more reliable than the ribbon cable. It's not like it won't break, but issues will most like arise with individual cables/pins and you fix/replace only what concerns a given faulty line, instead of the whole connector/ribbon cable.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, it's definitely easier to troubleshoot and repair.

could you put a bluetooth module in the cpc. and then send the files to it over bluetooth? maybe using parts of a bluetooth headset

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, that would probably work. You just have to get the audio levels right and it should be no problem.

Unfortunately I lost my chance on ebay and now I don't find one at a decent price. What do you use to view the video output of the consoles on your PC? I would thus avoid having another monitor on the work bench!

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

I use the OSSC upscaler, an Elgato capturing thingy and OBS studio software. If you just get an upscaler, you can connect your old hardware to any monitor with HDMI input.

If you do not have a tape for testing write a simple basic program and save it, if it loads back up all is good, right?

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, but the tape drive mechanism is not working currently and needs some serious repair until I can try a real tape.

@davidrockefella

4 жыл бұрын

@@JanBeta I just remember in the video you saying the deck cannot be tested becouse of no software and yes the tape deck has seen better days. Not to worry you always make quality uploads that i give a like.

Interested to know where I can buy some of that German drill proof cardboard.....

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Got it from a store that specializes in wifi cables. ;)

No need to mod anything. Just go to eBay and search for "casette adapter". I used that back in the '90s with Amstrad, Spectrum, Commmodore and old car stereo.

What was that software you were using to display the Amstrad screen on Windows?

@blakecasimir

4 жыл бұрын

OBS?

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, OSSC upscaler -> Elgato capturing thingy -> OBS Studio.

Jan, i could not understand what happened between 16:11 and 16:12 so well. Can you please also describe that? I will be very appreciate! ty

@JanBeta

Жыл бұрын

Oh, I reverted the wiring to the first points I tried (on the chip) and then adjusted the volume until I got a suitable signal (by trial and error mostly) so the CPC was able to interpret it.

Ahh case damage! Bad!

Are there any SD drive mods for the CPC ?

@SheepOnMintSauce

4 жыл бұрын

www.cpcwiki.eu/index.php/M4_Board

@SheepOnMintSauce

4 жыл бұрын

Not really a mod, but a great bit of kit. I bought one about a year ago for my CPC.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

There's a couple of disk drive emulators using the Gotek electronics I think. Currently looking for the best one to purchase. I think the DDi3/DDi5 are a good option for loading software from USB devices.

Shorting left and right channels on stereo socket is a bad idea, imagine what this does to the audio source. You should either use a) only the right channel in stereo socket or b) mono socket with mono cable and mono source.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, you are right. I should cut that connection.

The right audio channel is going to shorted to ground by a mono jack, so connecting the left and right together inside the CPC will create a very weak signal. Easiest thing to do is to desolder the right channel ring and leave it unconnected. Also, do have a look here at a way to double the level using an inverted signal on the right stereo channel. You would need to wire your red wire to the tip and the back to the ring and ignore the actual ground in for that to work though. retrocomputing.stackexchange.com/questions/773/loading-zx-spectrum-tape-audio-in-a-post-cassette-world#answer-774

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Yes, you are right about the audio channel. Should cut the connection on the socket.

@WxAxNxDxExRxExR

7 ай бұрын

No, it's not. The tip is GND in both Stereo and Mono wiring, the rest are the two channels for audio, and potentially MIC.

Man könnte auch einfach so einen Kassetten Adapter benutzen, dann muss man keine Löcher ins Gehäuse bohren.

Why not just dub audio from mp3 to another regular cassette deck?

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Because it's an extra step.

Oh no, not the drill!?!

Why are you not using a simple tape adaptor to 3,5 mm ? No hole-drilling required.. frei nach der Werbung, "er hat gar nicht gebohrt..?" 😁

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

In diesem Fall ganz einfach, weil ich nicht weiß, ob/wo ich einen habe. Aber ich hörte, dass die Kassettenadapter sehr gut funktionieren im CPC.

@holleholl3057

4 жыл бұрын

Diese Dinger kosten nur etwa 3 Euro als China-Import. Egal, der Mod ist trotzdem gut geworden und er funktioniert ja auch.Ich muss mal meinen "damals" von einem guten Freund gegen meinen Zweit-C64 getauschten Schneider CPC vom Dachboden holen und wieder fit machen - irgendwo muss der doch sein ? ;)

Just use a cassette adapter, you made things hard for yourself

I've managed to load file from tape to C+4 just by lying headphone on datasette head.

@retrogamer33

4 жыл бұрын

Hmmmm.........No!

@toronado455

4 жыл бұрын

now THAT'S what I call a HACK

Erste!

The CPC464 was not meant for having an external audio input.

@JanBeta

Жыл бұрын

You don't say! That would explain why I had to hack one in! ;) (Seriously though, I am aware of that and an easier way to get tape signals in from an external source would probably be using one of those adapter cassettes for mp3 players that are still readily available).

Why did you not find a tape game and try the tape deck??? Or even fix it??? The whole nostalgic point of these CPC's are the tape loads!... Why butcher a CPC and not fix the deck? Modern hacks are not always the best way forward. I liked your cleaning video, but this vid is really disappointing. I thought you were going to restore this CPC.... Shame.

@JanBeta

4 жыл бұрын

Sorry if that's not your kind of thing. I find it a lot more convenient to be able to just download games and "quickly" check them out. I'm still going to have a go at fixing the tape drive but it has some severe issues so I have no idea if I can make it work again.