For folks who wonder why Glorieta is called the Gettysburg of the West, focusing on the number of casualties misses the point entirely. Like Lee's campaign that ended at Gettysburg, Sibley's campaign was intended to invade Union-held territory. Because it failed, the Confederacy was unable to press its case for independence. In Lee's case, he hoped to sufficiently threaten Washington so that Lincoln would sue for peace and then leave the Confederacy alone. In Sibley's case, the Confederacy wanted/needed Pacific ports in California to be a viable player in global economics. Gettysburg stopped Lee's plan. Glorieta stopped Sibley's plan. So it's not the number of casualties but the impact on the war that makes Glorieta the Gettysburg of the West.

@scotttyson7970

5 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing.I learned a lot on this.All I knew about the West in the Civil War was in The Good,theBad,and the Ugly.

Chivington's grave is a few yards from my Grandfathers and Grandmothers. I was just there about a week ago in my old neighborhood. I grew up near there. When I was a kid we used to sneak into the cemetery at night, go visit Grandpa and take a whiz on Chivington. Ya he was the hero of Glorieta, but goes down in history as the villain of Sandcreek.

This series is excellent: just the facts, no tendentious BS.

@johnblue8907

3 жыл бұрын

I agree. What's poor about movies depicting the civil war is all the bs rousing music. I want the cold facts, not a hollywood version of events.

John Chivington earned high praise for his successes at Apache Canyon and Glorieta Pass. But, a captured Confederate Chaplain accused him of threatening to kill his prisoners. Chivington's military career was condemned, by a court-martial in 1865, after his men massacred more than 150 Cheyenne men, women and children, at Sand Creek in November, 1864, especially because the entire settlement was not at war, and peaceful.

@ronaldshank7589

Жыл бұрын

This is yet another reason why I never would've fought for the Blue Coats (Union). You see, I'm pert Native American, and I totally resent the very fact, that Native Americans, left and right, were done wrong by the very ones that they made treaties with, time after time after time after time!

@Thisandthat8908

Жыл бұрын

@@ronaldshank7589 The south would have treated them the same way. That doesn't make it any better of course. But they would not have anything to gain by fighting for either side. The same was true in the revolution.

@zirconencrustedtweezers

Жыл бұрын

​@@ronaldshank7589 many tribes were allies and fought alongside the CSA. Cherokee, Choctaw, Creek etc. They both had a hatred for the US and practiced slavery.

@T.K...

Жыл бұрын

@@zirconencrustedtweezers The pin Cherokees allied with the Feds. Only the the slave owning side of the Cherokee nation allied with the Confederacy.

@ArmenianBishop

11 ай бұрын

​@@Thisandthat8908 The Royal Proclamation of 1763 took measures to stop Colonial expansion West of the Appalachian Mountains. But, Westward Expansion into Indian Territories continued, despite the empire's endeavor to restrain it.

Edward Canby eventually was promoted to Major General. After the American Civil War, Canby continued to pursue his military career. In 1873, Major General Edward Canby was shot and killed, during failed treaty negotiations with the Modoc Tribes near Tule Lake, California.

Lincoln sent Kit Carson to raise an army of New Mexicans who were mostly of Spanish decent. It was the New Mexican volunteers who were at the center of the Battle at Valverde and retreated in organized fashion as the battle went to the Rebels. The New Mexican volunteers played major parts in holding back and defeating the Texans. At Pigeon Ranch there used to be reenactments. BTW, Mesilla is pronounced Me-see-ya. I stopped by Ft Union last February - they have a cool gift shop.

@Big_Glizzy.

5 ай бұрын

National park service has a roster of them posted online

As a new mexican nat. Guard cit/soldier / War historian I cannot express how greatful I am for these detailed battle videos. Thank you and keep up the good work brotha.

US Army Maj Chivington based on that destruction of the CSA supplies got a command that he led on attacks and massacre of several friendly, peaceful and allied (to the USA) Indian Tribes. For which we barely received a knuckle wrap.

@1bridge11

3 жыл бұрын

he, not we

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

@@1bridge11 all US citizens are guilty for the genocide of millions and millions of the Native people

Dude, this was great! The moving battle maps showing the left and right flanks at each end of the pass was the crowning detail. actually, all the maps here were great.

I seem to remember a movie about all of this... let’s see... oh, yeah! That’s it! The greatest movie ever made! The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly! Watch for Sibley and his bodyguard, the Santa Fe Gamblers. And, most intriguing, could the Union officer arresting Tuco and Blondie be Captain James Paddy Graydon? Wow! And that desert scene, Journada del Muerte?

This is a nut. Great channel, keep it up my dude.

Mesilla is pronounced Meh-see-ya. The double l ("ll") in Spanish is pronounced as "y". Otherwise, a pretty good presentation of that battle.

@wesleyhay3881

3 жыл бұрын

Well he's a gringo. What do you expect? Like you say, otherwise a pretty good presentation.

@chuckgrigsby9664

3 жыл бұрын

@@wesleyhay3881 Yo soy un gringo, tambien, pero puedo decir "Mesilla" correctamente.

@wesleyhay3881

3 жыл бұрын

@@chuckgrigsby9664 Okay. Sorry. My apologies.

@fearlessfosdick160

3 жыл бұрын

@@chuckgrigsby9664 Soy Tejano asi que puedo hablar Espanol tambien. Muchos gringos Tejanos aprenden como hablar Espanol como idioma segunda porque es la primera idioma de tantas personas aqui.

@lawsonj39

2 жыл бұрын

That's this narrator's main problem: he frequently mispronounces words that a professional narrator would get right. Well written and researched scripts, though.

This is a solid narrative account . Excellent work.

Great video. I learned a lot from this. Looking forward to more.

How do you only have 600 subscribers? Your channel goes really in-depth!

Superb episode, Saris! Delighted to see that you were able to salvage the "Tappan Affair" and make that segment most historically-accurate. Good luck on Shiloh Part 1, though I don't doubt that you shall be able to handle it.

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Jesse! It wasnt a big problem as some expected. I cant wait to get started on Shiloh, honestly one of my favorite battles in the Civil War!

Wonderful show - always wondered what it was all about out there - now I know.

@fett333

3 жыл бұрын

“And knowing is half the battle.” 😉

New to the channel. Great stuff. I listen to this content while painting miniatures.

My grandfather fought with the 5th NM volunteers. He was among the Spanish whom knew the land and helped end the campaign by destroying confederate supplies. He fought protecting mcraes battery at valverde where his unit lost 75% of its men. He answered the call and fought the Texan aggression.

@elcoyote9410

3 жыл бұрын

My great great grandfather probably fought along side your grandfather. Shit we're probably related! Encinias and Chavez family

@TheMontoya09

3 жыл бұрын

@@elcoyote9410 there is a book written by jerry D Thompson that has historial records and the names of the soldiers and what units they served im pretty sure he may have.

@brianglass7933

2 жыл бұрын

Hey now, that was "Confederate aggression"... ;-)

Very informative, many thanks, Roland UK

Thank you for this in depth video.

The fight wasn't the Gettysburg of the West;it was the Union troops from Colorado on the verge of defeat and somehow they stumble on the baggage train and they put it all to the torch. I understand one man made it back to Texas where they had started. Chivington was a big hero and even had a hall named after him at C.U., but he was a killer of women and children and his name was sandblasted into infamy.

Great Work!!

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks lollo!

Outstanding presentation, sir. Bravo!

What a great video! Thanks for what you do.

@WarhawkYT

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks Michael! Glad to hear that!

Didn't mention the rebel retreat through the desert without supplies, which left the force a shattered wreck.

@andrewholdaway813

3 жыл бұрын

Hinted at. But this site is all about the battles, hence calling this a tactical victory for the confederacy when with the loss of its entire supply train it was hardly even that.

@purplefood1

3 жыл бұрын

@@andrewholdaway813 Even without the loss of the supply train the difference in casualties is close to negligible.

@SteveTheFazeman

3 жыл бұрын

Canby knew the desert well enough that he wouldn't pursue Sibley into it.

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

@@purplefood1 OK you have no clue what the definition of a tactical victory is

Unfortunately Chivington will gain infamy in 1864 with the massacre of peaceful Cheyenne at Sand Creek.

@Ranger215able

3 жыл бұрын

And Kit Carson will gain a notorious reputation when he begins a scorch earth method against the Navajo. Being of the tribe myself, I can say he is not not well liked, in fact he is hated by the tribe. Reports said the Navajo did follow the rules the Union set, but ended up being rounded up thanks to a few young dimwits.

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

@@Ranger215able cry me a colorado

Found this video while visiting Santa Fe -- what a terrific and helpful contribution to our education!

love your vids. Keep this going, always fun and interesting to find about new things in the Civil war, spec these smaller battle you make

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Alexander, I enjoy making them!

@alurask

3 жыл бұрын

I shared your work in 2 Acw groups. One here in sweden, other in Eu. So I hope you get more views, you earned them

TY for putting this together. BUT, the "Gettysburg of the West" was Franklin TN n November 1864 (in 1850-60s states west of Appalachian Mountains were considered the western theatre of civil war military operations).

@peytonthomas4338

2 жыл бұрын

Actually, Franklin is considered the "Pickett's Charge of the West" because the battle resembled something like Pickett's Charge at Gettysburg.

Loveeee this channel and content

Great video of little known campaign!!!!!!

Great video. I have had the opportunity to visit the Glorietta Pass battlefield. Overgrown with trees, the area looks nothing like the battlefield did in 1862. However, the park has done a good job with markers and information. Be prepared for a bit of a hike though.

This looks great.

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Bavarian!

This entire series of Civil War videos by Warhawk is just phenomenal. Extraordinarily well researched and presented, plus put forth in an entertaining way. All of the videos so far are just exceptional, and why I subscribed. I hope he’s able to do the Overland campaign- The Wilderness; Spotsylvania; North Anna & Cold Harbor.

Make sure you like and subscribe to see more animated Civil War battles!

Interesting video. My great great grandfather fought at the Battle of Glorieta for the Union. My family was given a land grant near Puerto De Luna New Mexico as part of his Union benefits. Great victory, unfortunately Chivington and the 1st Colorado volunteers would go on to sully their name by massacreing Cheyenne and Arapahoe women and children at Sand Creek

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

you should give your occupied land back to the rightful owners, the natives, and pay compensation for the crimes of your disgusting great grandfather-butcher

@joedirtjr5375

2 жыл бұрын

I live in Texas now but same here, had family from the Taos area that volunteered at Apache and Glorietta. I can remember when my dad returned from Vietnam and discharged at Ft. Bliss, we moved to Taos for a while and I remember playing in the attic of my grandfather's house one day and coming across a sabre, pistol w/ holster and belt a small military type saddle and old boots with spurs. I didn't think much of it then, but when I learned about the American civil war I remember this battle was never in the history books. When I would tell the teachers about it they thought I was making it up.

i love your work, and your videos.

@WarhawkYT

Жыл бұрын

Thanks so much!

It’s nice to know New Mexico had battles here. While I could find only so much on the regiments here (Mainly the 2nd New Mexico Volunteer Regiment), I always wondered how different they were compared to more legendary units like the 20th Maine, or the 54th Massachusetts.

Kit Carson played an important role of raising a mostly Hispanic regiments of volunteers. The battle of Glorieta pass shows what happens when any army has issues with their supply chain in a desert country. The arid country meant a shoestring supply line and living off the land for the Confederates. These types of campaigns seldom work very well because the Union commanders only needed to hold on either through a seige of forts or through a stalemated military campaign. The Confederates would run out of supplies forcing them to go back to Texas. The history books are grim for the Confederates with the battle of Glorieta Pass, the "Gettysburg of the West." The long retreat to Texas was a death march for most of the Confederates. Union commanders kept the fighting to a minimum knowing full well after the Confederate supply train was destroyed they would have to retreat across a desert with little food or supplies. It was almost a virtual death sentence for the Confederates with far higher losses from starvation/exposure with a high death count for both animals and men with much loss of equipment. It was a small Confederate force that survived the long march back to El Paso, Texas. Union patrols found lots of bone dried skeletons of mules, horses and human remains picked clean by scavengers baking in the desert sun a year after the Confederate's disastrous retreat. The Colorado volunteers also played an important role in this battle with Colorado getting somewhat settled with a permanent population in the 1859 Gold Rush. The man named Chivington was also to battle Indians in Colorado later on. This massacre of mostly peaceful Indian tribes was disgusting but Chivington got good press for it. It seems unlikely that such a far off theater would see action during the Civil War but this early 1862 campaign leading up to the battle of Glorietta Pass and the Indian campaigns show this was an active theater of war during the Civil War despite its relative remoteness.

Can't wait

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Same here!

Thank You! I don't really think a lot about the war in the west. How do you make animated maps?

Awesome video. You should do one on the Red River campaign in Louisiana.

@WarhawkYT

10 ай бұрын

we will we when get there in our timeline

Great video 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻. Can you produce more videos Southwest United State Civil War actions.

FYI Mesilla is pronounce as Meh-seeya. It's where I live.

@blackmoor40k

3 жыл бұрын

Sometimes I wonder if it is a computer program, and not a person with the way he mispronounces common words like Los Angeles, and Ulysses (as in Grant)

@cobeeble

3 жыл бұрын

@@blackmoor40k It is a computer.

@markthervguy

3 жыл бұрын

@@blackmoor40k Yeah that sounds likely...no pun intended. I just wanted to point it out as I do live in Mesilla and it is a quaint old Spanish village. Compete with a plaza surrounded by old southwest shops and a Basilica Church. It is where the Gadsden Purchase transfer of flags ceremony took place. Nice place to visit.

@paulreoch1189

3 жыл бұрын

That’s what he said

great you have done trans Mississippi. Not as many big figured armies and famous campaigns but the West and Trans Mississippi campaigns and securing the border states were huge for the North. The Anaconda strategy divided and squeezed and the South was out numbered out gunned and in a bad way in every industry and Navy game was a joke of a difference. Amazing they in the East anyways were in the game and in good shape to at the minimum keep Richmond safe. When Grant with near 2-1 odds everywhere advanced in every sector it was to much. There was one ANV and commander of there commanding officer. He and Jackson before his death were tying down huge numbers of Union forces. They seemed to see it as they needed a game changing victory in the North where they may be in the spot to make the Northern pop. war weary which they were at times in 1862-1863. I think top Southern minds knew that they needed to win a quick war or get a peace where they may be recognized by one or more of the European powers. North just had to many resources in the time game.

Enjoyed your presentation. Just wanted to ask if you will do a presentation of Albert Sidney Johnston's "escape" from Los Angeles and the formation of the Los Angeles Mounted Rifles? An interesting story even if Johnston died at Shiloh. Thanks for teaching people about the Civil War.

@talamioros

3 жыл бұрын

chill mate, he has enough work to do if he's gonna go all the way to Appomattox battle by battle without covering stuff before Bull Run too xD

@user-tp1bi6of3v

3 жыл бұрын

@@talamioros That's fine with me. He's doing a fantastic work as it is. Enjoy every thing and appreciate what he does!

Very cool video, what software do you use to create these? Thanks!

These are all great, thank you. But I pity you if you try to bite off the big guys like Shiloh, Antietam, and Gettysburg. Especially Gettysburg. Those Gettysburg guys need to lighten up.

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

We’re headed to Shiloh now :)

@paulbryant3239

3 жыл бұрын

I think he did an EXCELLENT JOB on the Battle of Shiloh video!!!

lesson 1, protect your supply lines

@jamesdriscoll_tmp1515

3 жыл бұрын

#2 Use local scouts

well done

I haven't read any books devoted to this campaign, but Shelby Foote's Civil War: A Narrative (vol. 1) has the best short written narrative of this battle that I've ever read. This video is an excellent supplement. I happily recommend both.

@T.K...

Жыл бұрын

Blood and Treasure by Frazier is a much better read if you're interested

Can you do Battle of Gettysburg next please? And please include the 1st Minnesota's Charge as they often get overlooked. (82% Casualty Rate)

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

We are doing the battles of the Civil War in chronological order, we will get there when its up.

@tyrian_baal

3 жыл бұрын

1st Texas had a higher casualty rate of 82.3% during Antietam, they deserve more of a mention

Are you going to do the battle of shiloh?

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

in the process of it

You comment on the 2nd Colorado Infantry companies at Valverde is wrong. They stop the charge of the Lancers and retreated to Fort Craig.

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

where is this in the video?

Im pretty sure this battle was the one in The Good, The Bad and the Ugly.

@ricardoaguirre6126

3 жыл бұрын

It's mentioned but we only see the aftermath when Sibleys troops are retreating.

My English Comp class in college had the "Milagro Beanfield War" to read and do a report. I chose this battle because of the area was similar to the book, sort a history. My teacher found it interesting because I did not enjoy the book and wanted to write about something I had an interest. The movie is even worse.

so classic that the war in New Mexico campaign was decided by the high 🏜 desert’s austere natural elements and paucity of natural resources, as all dramas in New Mexico ultimately are.

Guess it depends on historians but growing up I was taught The Battle of Westport, sometimes referred to as the Gettysburg of the West. They also have plack in Kansas city says that

You are wrong in your assessment . There were different phases of the battle . Tho the Texans forced coloradoans back in the pass , the phase concerning the Texan supply train was a complete Colorado victory . Even tho most consider the battle a tactical draw , the strategic factor of ending the confederate campaign must be considered a union victory .

Although I am a Texan and it pained me to do so I pushed the light button that being said when you’re an enemy territory gentlemen you had better protect your supplies I should you not!

Subtitled... "How to Win Every Battle and Still Lose". I guess Rommel was out sick when they covered this in class.

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

cry me a Casserine

Domo arigato, Warhawk-sensei.

How do you make such good maps?

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

i use photoshop and make my own makes based off either historical maps or like CivilWarTrust's maps

@CivilWarWeekByWeek

3 жыл бұрын

@@WarhawkYT cool, I’m very impressed

What Sibley and the Confederates failed to appreciate is that the Mexican population (not Spanish!) of New Mexico loathed slavery! The New Mexico Volunteers (Mexicans!) proved loyal to Lincoln and Bento Juarez...nice video.

As the battle raged two strangers a tall blonde and a Mexican blew up a bridge near sand hill cemetery ,

@tomingvaldsen3939

3 жыл бұрын

Yea,....they had never seen so many men wasted so badly

The Confederates should have contacted the Native American tribes, especially Apache and made a deal with them if they would throw their support in and helped win the war.

Damn fine representation

Numbers are interesting.. Slough has 1300 men, an amount that would barely be noticed in on Eastern battlefield..at Gettysburg fx.

The only thing this entire campaign accomplished was giving Sergio Leone a fantastic setting for one of his westerns. (The Good, the Bad, and the Ugly, obviously.)

| Johnny Reb should have gave some rifles to the Apache and Navajo. A war party alone tips any battle in night raids and small unit harassment.

@ianthomas7863

3 жыл бұрын

Sorry, but Johnny Reb only gave to WHITE Folks!!!

@SKINWALKER

3 жыл бұрын

@@ianthomas7863 | A terrible mistake that costed them dearly.

@skindianu

3 жыл бұрын

@@SKINWALKER sometimes, stupidity is a wonderful thing

@redneckjay5517

3 жыл бұрын

@@ianthomas7863 not true sir guess you never heard of the Cherokee braves or Choctaw who fought with the Confederacy in Oklahoma last confederate general surrender was native American. Native American tribes also have Representatives in the confederate government

Huge lands to cross. Supplies stretched.

Actually, that fight in Pennsylvania was the Glorieta Pass of the East. ;-)

My grandfather who lived to 100. Whould tell of talking to civil war veterans who lived around town when he was a young man. They would sit around at the bar or store and rehash tales and argue about how this general or that was better or worse.

I don't mean to be a nay sayer, but at that time there's no way they could have gone up the river like that. The thick bosque and marsh traps of the untamed river would have forced them to travel on the Jornada del Muerto, which ends at San Antonio and Socorro.

Wow, the confederates were unimaginably ambitious to think they could take California

Pretty sure they lost around 500 men in the campaign, and around 1200 death or desertion as they chose to retreat across the desert im which case Canby was content to see the desert reduce them. Then disbanded upon returning to texas

Texas won a minor battle conflict but lost the campaign . Colorado kicked azz !!

@johnwood8441

3 жыл бұрын

Our Colorado bois

@collin8175

2 жыл бұрын

Texas would whip you in today’s time.

@collin8175

2 жыл бұрын

The Texans were the most feared troops in the civil war.

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

@@collin8175 time to try again

Mesilla is pronounced meseeya - it's a spanish word. . . . A New Mexico resident who lived on Meseeya street in Albuquerque. Otherwise an outstanding piece of work. I've been to the battleground and you can still find the lead ball bullets on the ground.

@donandresdeulloa4638

3 жыл бұрын

yea but hes speaking english, not spanish... if we dont expect him to pronounce güero correctly, than how is Mesilla any different?

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

@@donandresdeulloa4638 at least one sane person here

Cush (Greek - Ethiopia), means sun-burnt Persia means Lord of the Aryans now renamed IRAN Chiraq once known as Chicago Issac's Sons / Saxons / Anglo-Saxons / Europe / Australia / New Zealand / North America / First World

I always looked at this as just another of those irrational, vainglorious military adventures that happened from time to time in the 19th century. I had also forgotten that Chivington was involved in this battle because it is greatly overshadowed by the crime he committed by leading the Sand Creek Massacre. Although he should have been, he was never prosecuted for it, but it at least put an end to his political aspirations.

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

lot's of US soldiers aren't prosecuted for their war crimes

@allen480

Жыл бұрын

@@zurgesmiecal BS. GFY

@zurgesmiecal

Жыл бұрын

@@allen480 war criminal detected

I like how the "Department of New Mexico" comes with a larger force then the "Army of New Mexico" ^^

Is this the same Chivington of the infamous Native American massacre at Sand Creek ?

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

yes

at12:43 you state that a Colorado company was destroyed, by Texas lancers then seconds later you say the erroneous report that they were destroyed spurred Co. intro action... ????

This battle is in fact nothing at all like Gettysburg.

2 seconds ago- Unsubscribed Now- Subscribed Great video lad.

@WarhawkYT

3 жыл бұрын

Welcome, Cheese!

Chivington was commander at Sand Creek massacre

We lost this because a fool didn't guard the most important factor they had, supplies. How damn dumb was that? Plus, what makes the worse, we beat the Union in all the battles, unbelievable.

My ancestor Major John Shropshire of the 5th Texas Mounted Rifles was shot and killed during the battle. Believed to be shot in the head by the union soldier George Pierce.

How typical - as in other occasions, it turns out the Confederates cannot even afford to win.

"Mesilla" is pronounced Me-siya: the Spanish double L takes a YA or L-YA depending on the accent of the speaker.

When did Clint Eastwood blow up that big bridge, like they showed in "The Good, The Bad, And The Ugly"? Jk Lol

@pinkmail6841

3 жыл бұрын

nice reference

@michaelmccabe3079

3 жыл бұрын

Considering that the movie took place around many of the locations here (Santa Fe, Apache Canyon, etc.), one wonders if the show writers did their homework...

@nicholasmuro1742

3 жыл бұрын

@@michaelmccabe3079 The director, Sergio Leone, from what I've read did extensive historical research prior to making the film. The bridge battle was fictional but they show Sibley retreating through the town after Glorieta Pass. Even mention him by name. Canby too I believe. Fictional story in a factual setting

7:58 So the Confederates were actually trying to get shoes at this Gettysburg

I love this considering the far west gets little attention by society

You mean Indian. "Native American" is what what people are.

Do Gettysburg

I thought Franklin was “The Gettysburg of the West”

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

why would a filthy commie care about Gettysburg?

Securing southern California would've solved the blockade problem of the south, and open trade to the chinese and japanese.

@WarhawkYT

Жыл бұрын

It might have opened a new port for the Confederacy to trade but I dont know how long it wouldve last until the Union came and blockaded those ports as well.

@rexvictorhardrada

Жыл бұрын

@@WarhawkYT that large navy was perhaps the most aggravating nuisance the csa couldn't physically deal with. Its been a staple of the American military ever since. Us ship production has been dominant for a long time. And then again, it would inevitably have to go past the Mississippi. At the very least the western armies would benefit from it for a time.

Gettysburg of the West, or "Battle of the Bulge, Civil War edition". Sibleys strategy sounds alot like Hitler's, push through enemy territory, sustaining the assault on captured supplies, with the end goal of pushing and taking a port.....

@zurgesmiecal

2 жыл бұрын

too bad evil fools prevented it

Ma-See-ah not Ma-sill-ah............Mesilla, NM.