Everyone deserves second chances but at this point this is Quackalopes third/fourth chance, so nah I don't think he deserves my view.

I get what you are saying, but Quack already has a history of "bad" behavior. Adding to that the essence of his responses is that he's just sorry for being caught. If he gets sponsors back it will just be a reaffirmation that he's doing it well because nobody really cares and he got more traffic because of the drama. If this space (designers/publishers) reward that behavior then there is something seriously wrong specially since he has also wronged other creators. If literally nobody in the space even defended him, while having worked with so many people, that says a lot.

My issue is that Quackalope seems unable to understand that he did something wrong.

I'm very impressed with you from this video. I'm impressed that A) you acknowledge your own mistakes and are learning from them and B) the willingness to give grace and offer a second chance. We're only human after all. In short I agree that people deserve second chances (in certain situations) there are situations where second chances are not warranted. But in this case I would say yes. Let's give them a second chance. Bravo sir.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you :) I think the only thing I'd add/clarify is to give people time. As you say, we're only human. I think often people desire/demand instant 180's from people but that's just not how things work in real life I find.

So many comments on this issue across the various vids spewing hatred towards the guy and a stream of "never liked him anyway" and "his content is crap"... Firstly I wish people would remember we are all human and there is no need to be personal and mean. Secondly, I have backed a few games after watching Quack content and no regrets, his rollplayer adventures vid sold me on that game which is one of my very favourites. I really do detest the cancel culture and the rudeness (viciousness) of people on the internet, I do worry for the future if this is the direction that society is moving.

Honestly, this was such an eye opener for me. I now realise that most , if not all, people on "reviews" or "comments" regarding the "quality" of games is subject to "paid" comments. The very first game I backed, and received, (Mythic games HEL will never appear), was Steamfall Genesis. There is very little game play videos on youtube and find it incredibly difficult to understand the gameplay. The rules are difficult to make the game play appreciably and sits, unplayed to this day. Yes I went all in. Having Jessie or quackalope, let me know that all comments are "paid" comments has really let me know that all comments are just BULLSHIT. Hence I will only enjoy your wonderful and honest options for sure. I would just like to take this opportunity to thank you for your honesty and quality. You truly are a quality opportunity to truly know what is, and what isn't in the world of Board Games. Without your honest and appreciated comments, I would be wasting much money. Please know that you are appreciated and respected. Your opinions are valid and valued. Love your work and truly, THANKS PS Rahdo thinks every game, regardless of quality, the sun shines out of the arse of everything. Am I wrong? Cheers and love your work. Don't stop. We need your honesty.

@vojkobaumanspoon

Жыл бұрын

Rahdo only reviews the games he likes before he makes a video about them

@isaacthimbleby8926

Жыл бұрын

Yeah - it’s not that Rahdo likes all games, it’s that his videos are only of the games he likes.

Jessie’s problem was they played the game wrong, then asked the publisher for money to reshoot. And when they didn’t pay they did the harshest review they could have done. The patriots paid for those videos so they probably should have just been exclusive to there since Jessie knew it was bad content, and then post one regular negative review. There would have been no issue and it would have been just 1 video of good content, instead of 6 bad videos and horrible press. He was a KZreadr looking for a subject not a gamer starting a KZread channel, so I think he needs to find a different subject if they want that to be a full time job. *edit* this is also the 3rd or 4th controversy with Jessie, so how many chances should he get?

Jesse will never be rehabilitated. He's too narcissistic and greedy to take any advice from anybody.

He is not growing from it. He still didn't apologize, repeating he did nothing wrong. Until he does, I see no hope for them

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Yeah we'll see over time. You are correct I don't think he has the best reaction yet, but I know I didn't either at the time of my own backlash. Perhaps, over time, things will improve. Or they won't. I'm willing to check back later though.

@Gtomer

Жыл бұрын

That's just your opinion. He apologized on the things that that are to apologize for. He cannot apologize for false accusations against him. You wouldn't either.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Sort of. I find myself, thanks to my casual speaking, often apologizing for misunderstandings. I don't deny what the person felt, I apologize for making them feel that way. My personal take on this is that this was just poor casual speaking in a business setting for Jesse. That's certainly something that can warrant a "Oh shoot so sorry you thought I meant it that way! I promise that was not the intent at all! I'll try and make things more clear going forward." That doesn't solve the video format issue mind, but that's probably the single most common thing I apologize for personally :D

@samhugo5870

Жыл бұрын

I think in the response Video, everyone could see, how hurt and maybee traumatized both of them are or were, with all the accusations and personal criticism they got, in this special time of their life. So I also would take KoA point, change needs time, most people couldn’t react perfectly going down, by being backstabbed. And in the end, that is what it must have felt like, for both of them, regardless of mistakes made, they didn’t expect that, they wouldn’t have released it at that point of time, if they had any clue. So they need to overcome this backstabbed, wrongfully misunderstood feeling and criticized as a Person or even as a couple feeling, this takes time and friends talking, to really be able to move on and see oneselfs contributions to the issue and then afterwards be able to learn from it and change.

The lack of self reflection in Q's latest video is outstanding. I was particularly impressed by how they mention that they like videos that cause controversy because they make good money without really accepting any responsibility for the fallout of the controversy. And no pledge to be more accurate in future reviews or to retire the Confirmation Bias format. It feels the same as the thief that is sorry for being caught but not sorry for stealing (not implying that Q did anything illegal here). Also didn't like the repeated mention of possibly suing (even if they mostly dismissed the possibility, it still sounds like a veiled threat). And I don't believe they would have any ground for suing: ITU was pretty factual with their description, it's other people who ran with the implications and alleged extortion. Also have you ever heard of a professional reviewer (like from a reputable newspaper) suing someone because they complained about the professionalism of their review? Finally I didn't like how they doubled down on the unreasonable criticism of the game: are you telling me that the "game fan", who likes the game enough to come over for multiple days to teach you the rules, didn't really like playing the game? Their take on ATO from the latest video seems even more biased than the one from the original coverage. Even NPI says that the game is very complex but "ok". And NPI is known for bashing campaign games. Not that NPI's review is without issues (unreasonable complaint about the publisher not hiring a cultural consultant for the depiction of a fictionalized civilization that fell 2k years ago, ignorant complaint about gender representation in art that is culturally appropriate for the time and culture being depicted).

@MikeSubs176

Жыл бұрын

I take it you back ATO All In? 😂

@matteoprosperi

Жыл бұрын

@@MikeSubs176 Yes, I own ATO. I love it, but it's far from a perfect game. I actually think that most of the pertinent opinions of the NPI review are pretty accurate, not sure why they had to go into that strange politically correct tangent. The game is not a good fit for most people (I don't think ITU ever tried claiming otherwise). It is best played solo, but it requires to handle 4 characters. The rules are well written but long and sometimes fiddly. Bookkeeping without the app is annoying (due to the need to frequently erase). On the other hand, it's unexpectedly quick to setup and teardown and it plays in reasonable sessions under 2 hours (I usually play either battle or exploration in a session, not both). I would say that the game is as flawed as Gloomhaven or ISS Vanguard. And the rules are more or less on the same level of complexity as those games or Arkham Horror TCG.

Will you also address and shed your light on the follow up statement from ITU? It is worth a serious read as well because it seems Q might not yet have learned enough from this mistake to warrant second chances if the same behavior persists.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

I did this morning (so after filming this) however I am concerned by the continued statements without evidence and I feel looking at hashtags for malicious intent is like trying to read the stars. If you want it to make a shape it will, but that doesn't really mean it was put there to be that shape.

@samhugo5870

Жыл бұрын

@ Sebastian: Where did you find a follow up Statement from ITU? Do you have a link to share, can’t find it?

A snake is always a snake, despite how you treat it. It will bite one day or another. Q is not different - his rotten behavior can't return potential backers for ATO who dropped their pledges due to his "opinion", company lost tons of money because of that (even though, they earned a lot because they are just great developers) and I see 0 arguments on why you can "forget and forgive" this until we see REAL steps on how he's improved. There are no excuses or direct will to communicate with ATO, and he didn't figure out how to "fix" things even though he already did a lot of harm and can't really fix it any longer. ITU did the right job to expose him. A great lesson for others to avoid doing business with such "reviewers".

Yep, NPI slightly bumped me over the edge to cancel SOH pledge. I wasn't convinced from the start but wanted to see the full value at the campaign end. Everything seemed fine-ish except the price. My initial 480$ pledge was waaay to much, but even the summer pledge alone + shipping + vat would be double the actual price they showed. So i decided to spend half of the money on coming translated Frosthaven + maybe additional figures in Oathsworn. If anyone is blaming Qack for the last day drop, it is nonsense since his video aired much earlier and obviously lots of people waited till the last moment (Npi).

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

oh agreed there for sure. I think it was a combo between NPI (lesser part) and ITU's own insane expansion/add-on bloat (larger part)

@mel_from_hell

Жыл бұрын

FYI if you are in EU you would not pay extra VAT, it was included. Unless you are in a different country so my comment is irrelevant

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

NPI might have been the deciding factor for some people, but i think that just a lot of people were unsure and only backed early due to the limited pledge structure from ITU. NPI just got them back to their senses. I don't think the quack situation Had any measurable effect. It will be interesting to see if people start regretting dropping out when soh arrives. Considering how much i paid for ATO and how much it costs now 😱

The adage "Play stupid games, win stupid prizes" applies to this situation. The fact that he takes 0 responsibility to his culpability to what lead to his current situation speaks volumes as far as his character. Just another rung in his ladder of controversy.

When other KZreadrs drew their line and stepped away from Quackalope, especially the people who co-filmed many videos with him, knows him in real life as a person. You alone defended him without actually meeting him face to face, taking in everything said in text and behind an internet mask, that takes courage.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

Still, i find it really damning that he only gets defended by people who don't know him well.

@sixthsacrifice4458

11 ай бұрын

That isn't a stunning defense of Quackalope, or even of KoA's position, though. "Everyone who actually worked with and knew him stepped away and distanced themselves, but you bravely stepped up to the hill!" It's a bad hill. KoA shouldn't be on it.

Interestingly NPI did a review on an ITU supplied copy which is possibly harsher than Jessie's

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Yep exactly. IMO a poor matchup as I don't feel NPI is really the target market for the game. But shows that A: what people say has impact, and B: if you say it in a better way people don't freak out and C: trying to do do deals and review critically is super messy.

@lmedved5000

Жыл бұрын

I found their review interesting because they praised Oathsworn pretty highly! I thought they might like it since they seemed similar, I’m completely blind to campaign games, I don’t play them but are ATO and Oathsworn pretty different games?

@cyberleish

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage I think they were quite surprised that ITU suggested they would like the game because of the strong messages, knowing NPI dont really go for the boobs and violence KDM style of content but ITU seemed to forget they launched ATO with the resin more or less naked nymphs (which i personally have no problem with but I do recogise that neither NPI nor SU&SD approve of what is essentially adult male titillation). They werent wrong on any of the critique though, only time I ever felt they went ott was in a verging on cruel review of Stars of Akarios (but then again I think that is a slightly flawed but brilliant game, and essentially a first time publish)

@cyberleish

Жыл бұрын

@@lmedved5000 Some would say Oathsworn is a simpler game, I would say it has been better engineered/streamlined. Doesn't have as huge a scope but is far easier to table and play. Don't get me wrong, I'm about to resume my ATO campaign tonight and love it, but it really is hard work in the way that Mage Knight can be. I am however reluctant to buy more into the franchise for two reasons, firstly they effectively used their position to destroy a content creator with little sign of remorse, secondly as NPI says near the end (and KoA has commented on I believe) the recent campaign was an absolute jumble of millions of things with huge expense and so much fomo.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

Imo NPI is a crap reviewer. And definitely a bad match up for ITU. But most ITU fans and ITU itself were fine with his review, unlike the Quackalope review.

I have noticed with board critics not all mind you, get a level of cockyness as if their opinions are the end all be all. Paid opinions are worthless because of bias. Quack deserves what he gets because he made it about himself and not the games.

I will say after watching Jesse’s live stream, I think their maturity and how they are presenting after such a devastating issue speaks volumes of their character. I hope Quakalope learns from this and creates better content. Wish them the best.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

I hope so too!

Adding Quack’s latest controversial issue (while there was poor judgment on both sides) to their past issues, I feel that for me, this is the final nail in the coffin. I didn’t feel this Q&A they did was really anything but him backpedaling his response video… they go back and forth between saying they made mistakes and they didn’t… I think Shira’s “curiousity” of seeking legal advice about compensation for loss of full-time positions, comes as slightly threatening… even though Jesse really chose his words carefully. This is the problem… Jesse & Shira don’t think about what they’re saying. Channels like Quack and BGco seem to put clicks, likes, and algorithm over audience perception. This eludes them the longer they go and bigger they get and ignorance also comes to the surface… I don’t agree with the personal attacks against them… that’s 100% wrong… but this wasn’t their first “mistake” and they have yet to grow and learn from the past ones… I’m glad you’re taking a more objective stance on this but as a person that has seen their missteps over the short time they’ve been around, this latest issue doesn’t shock me and is enough for me to stay away from most products they push or content creators/publishers they collab with. I do wish them well on their marriage and personal lives…

@Shun174

Жыл бұрын

I think thats not true for BGco. He distanced himself from Quack long ago over that type of content

@pallidmask3822

Жыл бұрын

@@Shun174 I had a convo with Alex when all of this blew up on BGG. While distancing himself from Quack was the correct move, it was clear from the convo that audience perception has eluded him as well… he’s a numbers guy and that’s where his mind lives. I don’t dislike BGco, I unsubbed because his format got played out for me and his employment at Gamefound was something that also didn’t work for me in terms of his reviews (wish him all the best tho). I do think that this concept has escaped some content creators. While Alex has not made really any mistakes that I’ve seen, his mindset (to me) was problematic. I can’t say any of that is 100% true… this is my opinion after watching many of both channels vids… Quack comes off as very disingenuous to me. Alex… well, like I said, it’s a lot of numbers and costs. I see the value in that for some people tho.

@iansutton7416

Жыл бұрын

@@pallidmask3822 Agreed, and similarly I used to very much enjoy Alex's 'coffee table' chat around hot topics, where he explored the differing views in a considered way. It was great to hear grown-up exploration of such topics, with a degree of even-handedness that was rare. In time he simply became too pro-industry for me, happy to take the freebies, paid gigs whilst being either shy about declaring them, or brazenly sticking two fingers up at any concerns about this with the engraved sword largesse. For me that had already started before the Gamefound job, but that probably did accelerate the transition. I suspect he's probably still a very interesting person to talk with 'off the record', but the channel has moved in a different direction to what I'd want to watch.

@pallidmask3822

Жыл бұрын

@@iansutton7416 100% especially on the sword subject!

This is one more example of why you’re my favorite content creator. Keep on doing the good work, my friend! 🙏🏼

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you very much!

I used to love Jesse but this wasn't a mistake; it was a culmination of deceptive behavior that finally blew up. The Quackalope channel is nothing more than a paid advertisement for Kickstarter campaigns and anybody watching should know that upfront.

No,no,no. Three strikes and you're out...

I ended up dropping my SOH pledge. Mostly due to deciding to just focus on ATO and KF. The content confusion crossed the line for me. Had to scale back. And also have about 10 other campaign games to play.

@jorgenantonioelgueta7842

Жыл бұрын

Same here. It had absolutely zero to do with Jessie & Co's review.

@TheTintinjb

Жыл бұрын

Same here. The campaign was all over the place. Very long commitment and they were going very heavy on the mini support. No clear explanation of the folder and aids for organizing, which were not in the all-in. for TSOH I was worried about the ongoing KF and then 4 seasons of TSOH. It seems they were planning of potential PC game, so that would be much less upkeep. I am starting to favor games that come with a good organizational/storage system

@cyberleish

Жыл бұрын

I haven't progressed my pledge yet for mainly that same reasons but also their interactions over this issue never felt like a professional company.

I have been one of your critics in the past, even unsubbed for a while. I appreciate everything you said here very much. Wasn't a Quakalope fan to begin with anyway so nothing has changed there for me, but I agree with the sentiment.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you for putting up with me back then :) Just sorry it took me so long to realize the position I'm in. I didn't do enough for you guys at the time.

The latest statement by ITU puts Q in quite a bad light. Now, obviously this is a he said she said situation and there's obviously room for interpretation, but it's not a nice thing. I don't think it's illegal, I just think it's bad style and taste and questions his credibility. Is he a bad person? I don't know, I don't know him. All I know is that this has been handled poorly and imho he should learn from this disaster, yet it sounds as if he tries to shift blame and change the narrative - again bad style. None of it justifies a vendetta though so people should leave his private life alone. It's between Q and ITU - if either of them feels the need to make a new statement, so be it. No need to get further involved for anyone else. It would probably best for everybody to let this fade away and learn from it.

@Brasijo

Жыл бұрын

100% agree. If i would have to choose sides i would say ITU made valid points backed up by facts, but in all honesty they should let it rest. Theres's nothing to gain from either side to take it further.

Hey I just wanted to say I have been a long time subscriber and I have seen you make mistakes. The difference is you learned from them and grew as a creator and person. I always saw your potential and I’m glad you are hitting it now. Keep up the good work king.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you very much, I greatly appreciate it! Sorry you had to bear with me as I fumbled in the past :)

@Solcoyote

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage Our past molds us and teaches us. Sometimes we drop our crowns. We just need to pick it back up.

Good luck on your own journey - it's clear there has been self-reflection and change. Time will tell if Jesse also reflects on the wider criticism of him being too tied to the industry income, whilst also trying to present himself as a reviewer. If he truly starts to understand the dangers of that, and learns to openly declare potential conflicts of interest / avoids the most troubling ones, then he may be able to rebuild his business.

Hey good for your daughter getting paid a bit of money from her dad to learn a good skill!

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Helps save me a bit of time, helps her learn work and realize she cannot save money lol. But does help her understand how much stuff costs :D

Really well spoken and balanced take on all of this. I’m continuing to enjoy the new KOA

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you Beorn! Thanks for sticking with me as I slowly got around to where I am now :) I've appreciated you!

@beornthebear9023

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage awwwww shucks

It was not just a mistake or bad wording. It was pay us or else we smear you during upcoming crowdfunding. I do not find any valid case in the video...

@paulhamrick3943

Жыл бұрын

No it wasn’t, it was “we tried to get assistance from you because the rules are so unclear, you never responded, and our footage is already recorded an edited now, if you can help us retry and re-review then we can do that but this is our full time job and we’d need commendation in order to justify another 50 hours of work.”

@elisabethcruz2424

Жыл бұрын

@@paulhamrick3943they didn’t read the rukebook. If you wanna play a game, this is the first thing you have to do. I don’t need $7500 in order to read a little bit

@nathanbellami3989

Жыл бұрын

@@elisabethcruz2424 they didn’t initially read it because somebody was coming down who already had and was gonna do a teach. I’ve never been to a board game night where they expected everyone to have already read the rules. And then when they started having issues they all dove into the rule book together, took turns reading it, and even split the rules into thirds so that each of them would hyperfocus on one section to get it all down. They said all of this in the negative half of the confirmation bias video set. But all anyone focuses on is that on the first go only the Patreon guest had read it and intended to do a teach, which again is a super common practice in the hobby

I think this is one of your best videos! I definitely sense a change in tone from your earlier aggressively, pro-consumer videos. While I enjoyed them at the time, I think we’ve had enough negativity and snark and bad news in the gaming industry recently and I really appreciate your thoughtful tone in this video. I’d sure like to see more videos like this that approach the gaming industry from a perspective of acknowledging that people are making games YT videos, not faceless companies. And, I agree: everyone deserves a second chance. Cheers!

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thanks man I appreciate it :) It took me a fair amount of time to get to this point because I'm overly stubborn it seems :D But happy to try and make real difference, instead of just yelling at everyone all the time :D

@echelon435

Жыл бұрын

What’s the opposite of pro-consumer, then?

Yeah, I don't think so. With what he did, I have no interest in giving somebody that slimy a second chance. People who deserve Second Chances Are people who make oversights, or mistakes if you will. What he did was pure greed.

@prototypep4

Жыл бұрын

🤣🤣🤣🤣 Tell me you have no financial skills without telling me. 4 people 5 videos around 40-50 hours worth of work. Tell me how much you think that should cost. Because that $7500 works out at about $35 an hour.

@anzac_exile3780

Жыл бұрын

@@prototypep4 In a free market it's worth what the buyers will pay.

Shouldn’t the channel be called “Quackage” not “Quackalope” since there was a Marriage, LOL, Congratulations you guy ! 🎉🥂

Just to apply the lesson to the world in general, experience is the greatest teacher. We have gotten away from respecting our elders and moderate discussions and viewpoints. It feels like what happened to Quackalope will happen to humanity if we also don’t learn from our mistakes.

Great video, I think everyone deserves second chances. I have no idea what it's like to be in his shoes, and it's clear he has worked very hard to make quality content.

Thank you for this video. I agree that it’s not about the points you are making but how you say and structure those said points. NPI, was constructive and to me at least feels genuine. Jesse feels he wants to stir things up to create controversial comments and that’s what he got. I absolutely believe in 2nd chances. Both his statement video and the livestream, I honestly feel he doesn’t feel he has done anything wrong. He keeps saying things could have been done better. He keeps his story that he is the victim, that others do this too but why is this happening to him narrative. Honestly, with so many other content creators out there, why should one continue to spend time on him?

Interesting stance. Generally, people making mistakes should be ok as we are all human. But of course it is up to each individual if you still support people who did.

I wish that more people on both sides of this were more like you in both looking at it from both sides and willing to give someone a second chance.. Heck, if I hadn't been given a second chance for a dumb mistake who knows where I'd be now. Thank you for providing a sensible and thoughtful take on this.

Well said.

Great video. Thanks!

Before this all happened I was uneasy at the fact alcohol seemed to be present in some of his presentations. I was also uneasy at how at least one major company seemed to give him 'exclusives' and he appeared to over-gush about these. For my part I have lost trust in Quackalope, and will not view any of his presentations going forward. I wish him all the best, but he and his style is 'not for me'.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

I have now seen similar comments multiple times, but i don't know what you are talking about. Did he drink in some of his videos or appeared he drunk? At least the videos i have seen from him, didn't feature any of that.

@BillySpenc

Жыл бұрын

@@joachim4889 just something he would have and talk about. That he's a rum guy but has started showing more videos of drinks being in them.

I was one of the viewers you lost during the time period you mentioned, but I've recently started watching your content again and have come to appreciate and respect it more. Thank you for providing a level-headed perspective and being an advocate for what is right even when it's not the most popular path.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you VERY much for giving me another chance. I'm just sorry it took so long for me to start taking things more seriously here. I'm glad to hear it has made a difference!

As you said. He the victim, spending 3000 in ATO. And what! I think you do it because you like it. If someone hire you that's different. So again he is the victim, spending and not get anything back. I spend a lot of $$$ on games, explaining to people how it plays and I do not get anything back. If someone pay me some for it, well, that's awesome! But I do not ask or worse treaten someone for it. Again hope he learns but for what you say, he has not.

Board game content is such an edge area. They are not million viewer looking for a new food recipe. Most viewers are right at the narrow end of the funnel. People ready to spend money on a specific expensive hobby thing. This makes all commentary "vaulable" to someone. The viewers aren't paying, so it will come from the publishers. But as viewers we need both transparency and better content. We also need sustainable business. Doing it as a hobby will long term deal to compromise or exit.

To give a more benign example of tone affecting how your ideas are expressed, I really recommend watching the Shut Up And Sit Down review of Frosthaven. They're the funny guys, it's a funny review and entertaining to watch. But man, it has some amazingly smart insights into board game design within in, there were at least three points made in it that properly made my brain do a loop and look at game design and Frosthaven in a very different way. I genuinely think it's the most insightful board game review I have ever seen. But no-one talks about that. We all instead comment about the jokes and the funny sketches in it. Because that's the tone.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

100% exactly, and why I tend to not care for skit reviews personally. It's focus is on entertainment, and the viewer and creator go into it with a mental agreement that the facts will be skewed to make jokes. Which is a fine thing to do, but it means no one is really going there for hard hitting facts that might very well be intermixed in there. That's fine mind, and what many people enjoy for sure. But yes I agree for sure that it can hurt the message. Example of my own: I watched their Batman game review from Monolith and they were doing a skit on how bad the rulebook is. It's true the rulebook is bad, but by making it into a joke and pushing it to that extreme the viewer is left with the knowledge that it's not as bad as they are making it out to be, which I think makes it almost seem better, at least more ambiguous than a more straight up video without the skits. Putting that here though, where the idea is to be as harsh as possible and you get into dangerous territory as we all saw. It's no longer just entertainment for some.

Another superb video with genuine humanity. I’ve commented on a number of your videos about your humility in these situations. It saddens me that people are so quick to judge and to judge people so finally, as if they’ve never said or done anything morally questionable. I’m disappointed Quackalope may be seen less on KZread - people are more intelligent than others give them credit for and can make a reasoned judgement without going to the extremes. Take care of your family. Much love from over the pond.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you kindly :)

Quackalope needs more Zombicide

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

haha it's like a snickers bar :D

I give Quack a year and then see were he's at with his channel. If he's more mature, how his video structure is, how the sponsorships vs reviews vs other content is and how transparent he is in all of this. Great video btw, you can tell that you have grown and understand both sides better.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

That's actually a really good take on it I feel. I certainly know I took my time to figure out what I was doing wasn't the best way to go about things, and at the start, I simply pushed against it. That may not happen here of course, time will tell.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

That being said, you had some controversial videos, but never to the point of the Quackalope scandals ( at least from my perspective) I don't think he will change, since he doesn't see his behavior as the problem. I hope he does, but I'm doubtful.

@PRC533

Жыл бұрын

@@joachim4889 that's really the key. Change requires a degree of introspection and the ability to see and acknowledge faults. I haven't seen anything that shows me he thinks he is anything but a victim here.

Many content creators are doing it to be seen and to profit... and that. By itself is okay so long as you make quality ethical content. However, when those are your prime incentives, they tend to make it easy to take your supporters and your position for granted. Quackalope took the situation for granted and, in many ways, showed a lack of ethics and a disregard for the supporters.

It's interesting that when ATO first launched their Hercules campaign I was all in. Then as new seasons were revealed I became less interested and dropped down to the core game. As the campaign went on I just became overwhelmed with the amount of content and dropped completely out. It was just too much stuff. It probably would have been more palatable if it was broken up into separate campaigns.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

I tend to have the same reaction to games with so much stuff. It saved me from Grim Dynasty even :)

I like the self awareness in this video. I was one if those that unsubbed as your videos are too critical (= negative). Resubbed now, let’s see how it goes!

@TheKingofAverage

7 ай бұрын

Thank you I appreciate the opportunity at a 2nd chance myself!

The major thing that bothers me is how almost all of the coverage has glossed over that ITU was willing to open them selves up to a defamation case because of their pride. As a publisher all be it a small publisher this really worries me, a case would likely result in backers not getting their games even if you win.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Which is exactly why he doesn't sue. If you win, people are upset at you and most still won't change their mind. If you lose, then it gets even worse. It's more of a lose/lose to them.

@Aroundthestumpgames

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage I know that, but there is a serious lesson for publishers in this that needs to be visible. If you feel someone does something wrong immediately take it to the authorities, don’t hold on to it and then make it public when your pride takes a blow. ITU was incredibly reckless in this

@nipzie

Жыл бұрын

Agreed. ITU looks like a fool and caused actual, measurable harm to another business without actual cause. They don't make anything that's for me, but if they did I'd avoid them after this. And I don't even like Quackalope since it's just too much hype when I have full shelves and I hate clickbait bs.

@PRC533

Жыл бұрын

Defamation cases are extremely rare because they are very hard to win. Plus, Quack doesn't have the resources to fight a protracted legal battle with low chance of winning. I also don't see anything defamatory about what ITU did since they very justifiably saw a perceived quid pro quo in the emails. This entire thing is just poor communication.

@manuelkooijman5757

Жыл бұрын

It shows what a cottage industry board gaming still is. I work in international business with companies exceeding 100,000 employees and this releasing of emails malarkey would never happen because that would result in an immediate lawsuit you always lose. Now in this case nobody will take steps as it is a lose-lose for both parties. If ITU do not let this go, they will run the risk of being viewed as bad actors and they might get shunned by especially the bigger channels on future projects which will certainly hurt them. Quack needs to let this go as well and learn and rebuild his channel. I think he will learn and he has my tentative support for that, but the road will be long. Industry needs to learn as well. There are too many channels where the ties between developers/publishers and content creators is too close for my comfort. Now that hobby board games go mainstream in Target, B&N, etc the publishers need to offer honest rewards for content creators doing play through videos and not just a free game. And if they send a review copy then they run the risk of getting a bad review even if that is solely because of a badly written rulebook. As for content creators only reviewing games they like, I get a bit tired of these. I get the drift, you don’t want to invest time in something you don’t like but if you never try you never know. If you want to be a complete channel you sometimes need to be the deliverer of bad news. One of the few doing this is the Dice Tower and I bet that if they give a game a bad review that it will affect sales. If as a content creator you are not happy to be in that situation as you do not want to wish ill will on a developer than you are in the wrong business. Not every game is good and sometimes you need to say this as otherwise I think you are disingenuous. As consumers we will also need to change our attitude. If we want content creators to be more professional then we need to accept that this can only happen if the content creators can live of this industry and not do it as a by the side hobby which it is for probably 90% of creators who all have a regular day job. That would be asking somebody who is a plumber all week to suit up for an NFL game every Sunday. That will mean content creators getting paid for play throughs, previews, demos at conventions, etc. If you look at what a make up influencer gets in comparison to a board game content creator than you realize the cottage industry scale of board gaming.

Awe poor buttquack has to go to work

I've gone from liking your content, to not liking your content, to loving your content. The common factor between all of those phases is that you always come across as completely sincere and forth-coming. Jesse lost that for me a long time ago. I had stopped watching any of his content. This ITU thing was just the last straw for me to actually unsubscribe.

@thebrewgeek

Жыл бұрын

Same here. 👍

@Sz4r1ej

Жыл бұрын

@@thebrewgeek me too on both accounts

Appreciate the video trying to bring some evenhanded perspective to the issue (which is hopefully closed and done). But I feel no need to have anything to do with the Quack pay-to-play hype train. Just not the formula for content I’m looking for.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you! And totally fine of course too. He has his audience, I have mine, others have other ones. Thankfully there's a lot of variety these days and options for people!

Just my silly opinion, but I've always believed that QL has no real interest in board games. To me, his passion comes off as disingenuous -- an overacted facade that does a poor job concealing his overriding desire to monetize/brand every aspect of his "interest" in the hobby. It's all gimmickry, lacking in soul and, apparently, ethics.

ITU made 3 million compared to 1 million. Hard to say they lost money. They did way more than alright.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

I think they certainly lost potential perhaps. It's *extremely* rare to lose money on the last day like that.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

I think it was more an effect from the overloaded and front loaded campaign and NPI review.

great vid, thanks

The world does not need more boardgame content creators. He did a pretty bad job and got caught fucking around and if his channel and "content creator" career is over that is fine.

Reading through the comments here is quite curious for me. I personally see mistakes have been made on both sides. Quackalope did evaluate wrongly the aedecuacy of "confirmation bias" videos and also should have checked the timing of a very negative review about a game and not published it during the ATO campaign. ITU should not have made the comments about their email exchange with quackalope, and should have accepted to have a call with jesse instead of emailing back and forth. If ITU and quackalope would have had a call, I think there wouldn't have been any controversy. I believe neither ITU nor Quackalope wanted to hurt each other, and regret this situation which was created because of a misunderstanding during an email exchange which left bad feelings on one side. Anybody whose job does rely on or heavily imply contact and interactions with other people will learn that written communication does lead a lot more to misunderstandings and that calls should be the preferred way. If you need to write, then first call to leave everything agreef on and only afterward you email.

Respect! Preach it brother!

think he will get a second chance if he can actually accept making mistakes and does the actions to correct them, he hasnt yet shown he can do that.

I'm one of those people that left and just recently came back. What was it that caused you to change?

As for ATO their were 3 issues. One was the two pledge deals were only being offered via kickstarter and not in the pledge manager latter. This resulted in two outcomes. One were everyone felt that sucked and didn't bother to get anything. Most people go All-In or nothing. Two, people like me that just got the bundle, but won't get any of the other stuff until the pledge manager. I realized that I could just get all the game play stuff, and then pick and choose the cosmetic add-ons later, which were confusing based on what I already had coming verses what was new. Lastly their was some confusion with stretch pay, based on comments many were hoping for stretch pay in the pledge manager, however stretch pay is for gamefound crowdfunding projects only. Lastly people were pissed about the last add-on choices. They had a choice between 3 primordial, and then 2 titans. They had people vote on 1 for each, but then the others would be gone forever. All 3 primordial and titans for these were better the ones in Autumn and Winter Core boxes lol. You just completely get rid of them like that, pissed people off. Most don't like voting, would rather the company choose one, and not know about the others they missed out on.

@goldsmeeth2771

Жыл бұрын

Yea, it's also my opinion that ITU should of separated the campaigns. I actually like the polls, but as a returning backers, I didn't like that they scrap the other choices. I think part of the reason was newcomers were all confused and overwhelmed, then asked for more limited scope, while returning backers wanted more. This wouldn't had happened if they just separated the campaign, so everybody got what they wanted, with less logistical and reopening PM after wave 1 nightmare later I like the polls because ITU is very responsive to feedbacks into making our dream game come true. I thought early inputs on the new developments is helpful. Things like voice over wasn't possible in the first campaign, but is possible now with more funding and people asking for it

@deano2099

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, there's a huge proportion of people who are "all in or nothing" - that's why companies keep adding more stuff in, as they know these people will give them more money to get everything... but sometimes they miss the flip side of that, is that if you push it too far, people will go for the "nothing" option. It's also a hell of a lot of money for a company that have only delivered half of one board game project. People point at Wave 1 of ATO as proof that they know what they're doing and can fulfil campaigns and... I mean, it shows they know *how* to which is something. But having delivered half of a project is a long way from having delivered a whole project. I mean, it's easy to deliver half a project, when you have the money for the whole project in the bank! You've got about twice as much money as you need for that, you've got cover for a whole load of overrun, so of course fulfilling the first wave was easy. It doesn't speak at all to how well they've managed the budget on that project. They could have spent 90% of what they got on that first KS on Wave 1 and be struggling to fulfil wave 2 and we wouldn't know. And to be clear: I don't think that's what is happening, I don't think they are, I just don't think "hey, they've delivered half a project, they're a sure bet" is anywhere near the level of "hey, they delivered all of their last project".

@samhugo5870

Жыл бұрын

@ Deaano: I strongly agree! For me, I even would go so far and say, if you have to make a second Campaign (for the same game or a different one) before you fully delivered the First, something tends to go in the wrong direction! And as Backer of expansive Games, you got to be careful at that point!

@TheTintinjb

Жыл бұрын

Very confusing and heavy on FOMO. Realized limited numbers of TSOH 4 season bundles, but then there were always new bundles. All-ins were only before the campaign closed. They indicated that after the campaign, they would increase the price. And I might be missing other things. I had also options paralysis

@CheddahSlammer

Жыл бұрын

@@deano2099 Yep was telling this guys that saw the All-In was 1000$ that all he needed was the core, and he wanted all of it or none of it, and didn't have enough money to spend 1000$ on the game.

Grifters deserve to be ejected from the culture. Quack is a grifter, and he's not even a particularly good one.

I don't know all that Quack has ton besides basically dumping Sarah as a friend to save face.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Which is exactly what companies are doing pulling back sponsorships from him now. Very common business move I think.

Unfortunately, his apology video does not really apologize at all. It seems that he thinks that he is clearly in the right and is only sorry that he was called out on it. I think that you are being a bit too generous, perhaps simply by being a content creator yourself. While I have always felt that creators like yourself, Liege and others make material simply because they love the hobby, one can see watching Jesse's content that it is about the money first and everything else second. There were patterns of behavior from far before this incident. I unsubbed from Quackalope prior to this incident and have seen nothing to encourage me to go back. I will be sticking with KoA (and a few others) that I have come to trust.

I realized that if Monopoly was released in this era it will never had seen the light of day! 😅

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

LOL truth!

Pretty nice one!! Well done, and surely it is a good reflection video and Quackalope is still a quite fine channel.

They lost a lot bcs of NPI Review which is not even accurate.

@cyberleish

Жыл бұрын

Oh its accurate alright

@iansutton7416

Жыл бұрын

That wouldn't surprise me, as NPI's videos are very much about Efka arguing why his opinion is correct, rather than trying to equip the viewer with the information / insight to make up their own minds. That's his style, and it's successful and liked by many, but it's very much not a channel I would seek out for accurate and balanced insight, as that's not the aim of the videos.

Gonna be That Guy and say I don't know who this is and I don't care. Here for gaming content. Love your stuff otherwise.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

No worries at all :) Plenty of that as you know!

Too bad people are so easy manipulated.....any developers, designers, people in the board game space that work with Quackalope are setting up to damage the space in the future.

there are some good things to learn for industry as a whole. it looks like it is a bit of a turn to a more positive direction. - extortion business tactics backfire --> healthier business environment - transparency helps to be successful (exposing private convos) --> hopefully people would be more mindful what they say - customers are able to overturn "influencer" agenda (commenting on other colleagues hard times is a no no in most businesses, customers are on heir own) --> hopefully influencers will be more attentive to their audience, rather than trying to "guide" them into buying what they are told - maybe minor influencers like various moderators won't consider themselves untouchable anymore --> more inclusive BGG, other platform groups for people moderators feel disdain for (#onlypositivevibes or you are deleted) - I am happy quack's career does not look like being over. it looks like he retained just enough clout to rebuild --> those interested in quack style are not losing him because entirely different part of consumers felt disgusted with him it is always nice when disorganized mass shows enough unity to overcome few who try to manipulate them. it is empowering for those with least personal power in their hobby.

I am definitely one of those that had no problems sh**ing on your channel for a variety of reasons both overall and specific video related. I just finished watching this video and you “changes to the channel” video You have not completely won me over… …but you’re starting to. Keep it up.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you Jeff for the comment! The fact that you are even willing to take a look at my more recent stuff means a lot. I'm sorry I didn't take what I was doing in this space seriously enough before, and I apologize for having to mature quite publicly. You guys gave me some wonderful feedback and other creators like Shelf Stories really helped me see things at a higher level about not just this industry, but people in general. Respect is hard earned and easily lost. I hope to continue and try and earn it from you guys once again.

Maybe CMON will approach you now instead of Quakalope! ;-))

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

hahahahahaha :D Thank you for that :D

I disagree, you can put it in any angle you like, it is what it is and its not good, I don't have a dog in the fight and it doesn't matter whose game it is, but the way the timeline and occurrences happened, as far as I am concerned quakalope were caught out red handed. I watched NPI's video, I own a copy of ATO and I believe his criticisms are valid, but the problem is a lot of the criticisms of the games are part of the territory with these kinds of game....sadly.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

That last part I feel is key. It's no different than Twilight imperium being super long. Could you state that as a negative in a review of it? Sure. Do the many people who really enjoy it have an issue with it? Somewhat at times, but not enough to not enjoy it. Personally I tend to enjoy these super chunky games like this. Part of what drew me into AT:O was the sheer scale of it all. Same with Warhammer 40K actually. But how you go about talking about it is super important, especially if you had a business proposition that fell through :)

@HarleyFirestorm

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage My friend and I play twice a month, we love a campaign game, yes they are fiddly, yes you will be putting a lot of stuff up and taking it down, but these campaign games the bigger they are the more complex they get, but they are something you can really get your teeth into as far as content goes. The part I dislike about these games is when they make it so you can only save and pack up at a certain point, like ISS Vangaurd, we often find ourselves clock watching, to get to that point, sometimes ending much later than we wanted to or ending it to early because we know we don't have another 3 hours to burn (work next day?). When it comes to talking about games in reviews, you should always consider not having a personal opinion on them, just review them in a way that allows the audience to make up their mind, never rip a game to pieces and if you don't like the theme don't review it or you take a look at a game sent to you by the creator and you feel its bad, then tell the creator and refuse to review it, unless they make changes (or not).

@samhugo5870

Жыл бұрын

@KOA: You got one point there. Being a Big Fanboy of TI4 myself, and really, really enjoying the length, the Event Charakter, to coordinate a whole Weekend with friends, just to settle down, plug yourself out from real life, just to play TI4 again, discuss, battle, expand the experience of playing TI4, is the best possible boardgame experience one could have, in my opinion. Cooking together discussing Rules and battle, going for a walk in between with the Dogs, talking about possible alliances or betrays, it’s just so much more then a boardgame!This year, at Easter Holidays, we wanted to take it beyond any limit, and managed to organize a whole TI4 week, can you imagine? We just wanted to play two Games in a row, with one day pause in between, find a cozy home in Bavarian Wood, every one managed to get Holidays and with seven friends and Family we just did it, it created life time memories for us all! I could never trust any review, which would criticize the length of TI4. I would immediately unsubscribe!😉 For sure!

I have always been interested in games like Aeon Trespass of KDM but they are all to sprawling for my tastes (and wallet). That is one reason by Studium: No Exit speaks to me so much. It seems to be a smaller more focused version of those games. It is also a god example of what you are talking about. The question the commentor asked may have been legit but it was asked in a very rude and accusatory manner and the company had a legit reason but due to the circumstances had an understandably emotional reaction. Now since your video they have lost a decent chunk of backers. I will probably stay in. While they are inexperienced every company has to start somewhere and they do seem very dedicated and have made alot of adjustments along with having Forteller so involved must mean they have already put effort and capital in since Forteller wouldn't be unless they got something already. Plus Mythic has shown a company with good PR doesn't really mean much.

@goldsmeeth2771

Жыл бұрын

Yes, but small company should start small. No stadium should just do 1 story, not 3 or 4. The scope is just too large and they don't have much to show for it, and now just seems overpromising. Foreteller is expensive. The quote for ATO core was quarter million so it was still unfeasible 3rd campaign around for ITU. So I don't see how no stadium will pull it off. I can't even back it at $1 for them to prove me wrong BTW, SoH is $130

@marvinp90

Жыл бұрын

@@goldsmeeth2771 I don't see how it is so large. It is one story investigate the Studium. While it has a decent number of minis its not nearly as large as many others. The big question about funding that KS numbers don't tell is existing capital. They clearly have some since they paid Forteller already. Not saying it's not a risk but I don't necessarily think it's as dire as some people say. Also no idea what SoH is.

@itsMARTIKAI

Жыл бұрын

​@@marvinp90Very true we don't know how much money they already have.

@joachim4889

Жыл бұрын

Studium really looks good, not as good as the ITU stuff i have coming, but it seems to be a nice simpler alternative. and the designer is interacting to a great extent with the Community (okay, the quote shown by koa was harsh, but after reading sone more stuff surrounding that, i think it wasn't that bad) However, i really have doubts that he can deliver. Especially after reading their statement that they could produce even with the base goal, which can't be true. I will mostly likely stay at a 1$ backer for now, if the pm stays open fir a long time and we see progressing a timely manner, i will late pledge it. I would probably more willing to blind Trust them, if they had a cheaper entry point or if i weren't currently burned by farside games. (Or to a lesser extent dragori)

@goldsmeeth2771

Жыл бұрын

@marvinp90 SoH is ATO twelve sins of herkeles, standalone game from ATO universe. A season standalone is $130

Sounds like the ducks are coming home to roost. I can't believe anything he says, and that was from before the ITU incident. Now it sounds like he is bringing out the violins. Its simply not a channel for for me with the constant goofing around, extreme reactions and click bait thumb nails (glad you changed yours a little). Also, maybe its just me, but i don't like drinking while doing videos (i used to follow a channel called board game brawl - he seemed to get on a bad downsilde, such a shame as he had a good honest channel), but amoungst other things his drinking got way out of control during the videos. I wish him and Quackalope the best, but as for Quackalope, he took me from a full on supporter in his early days to not even liking hearing about him ...

KoA: make games not campaigns. Me: make reviews not retrospectives

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Working on it! :) Until then you get one last quick capstone sentiment.

@goodsound4756

Жыл бұрын

@@TheKingofAverage didn‘t want to attack you, did it for the sarcasm 😉🕊️

The question is... If I make a mistake well not mistake but trying to get money from someone at my workplace... Do you think they will give me a second chance? ... Nope. I will need for another job. They can definitely try to build up and see what happen, the truth is he already has a bad history. So let see... Great you accept mistakes you and all of us have done, but he accepts mistakes or make guilty other parties and he the victim?... Time will tell and really wish he would learn from it, but I doubt it.

This was just all very silly from the very beginning. Quack doesn't seem like an bad guy at all.

I appreciate your thoughts but I’m just not a fan. It’s a bunch of stuff beyond the ATO issue. His click baiting style. His enthusiasm come across more like boorishness. He’s just too much about making money which to me makes me not trust his reviews

Seriously? Wtf man? He is a ***. After all this time, i'm outta here.

I might be willing to give him a second chance if his content was any good. Unfortunately...

My biggest issue with the Quackalope thing, is if he made his negative vid against a new company it definitely would have ended up hurting them, maybe even make them not fund. I don't think his intention was to hurt anyone or blackmail someone, but I do question if they even play many of the games they claim too.

@prototypep4

Жыл бұрын

Soooo you just missed the "9.3 out of 10. A masterpiece" video? It was a TWO PART series. 1 very positive video, 1 very negative.

@CheddahSlammer

Жыл бұрын

@@prototypep4 No I saw both, based on experience people tend to dwell more on the negative as opposed to the positive. So even if he did the double vid on a new company, it would have hurt them. You can even see this recently The king of Average had some negatives about Studium No exit, at the same time Board game Co and others made positive vids about the game. Game lost people backing the next day lol. People trust who they watch to give them the best info. Problem with Quacks vids is since people already played the game and loved it, they new both vids were a stretch on what they were talking about.

@prototypep4

Жыл бұрын

@@CheddahSlammer ok... Yet NPI basically said the same exact thing about the game and no one bats an eye at it.

@goldsmeeth2771

Жыл бұрын

​@@prototypep4​@prototypep4 I think there's a big difference between a game that's unplayable, basically no one should be bothered with it, versus a game that's very heavy or complicated. Many people can handle complicated games or even like complexity. NPI title is a bit clickbaity but not to the extent of Q. And in the video, most of what NPI said was fair or within realm of reason, whereas Q claim is not correct

@DemZane

Жыл бұрын

​ @CheddahSlammer So if you have an issue with Quackalope potentially hurting a new publisher with this bad choice of click-bait videos, you must have an equally big issue with ITU for actually causing 4 people to lose their jobs because of false accusations?

I am someone who has unsubscribed to your channel and have come back. I like your current approach to matters and the more evolved KoA

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

Thank you Jose for giving me another shot. I'm sorry it took so long for me to come around :)

Well said…I respect Quack simply for their work ethic and they deserve a 2nd chance.

Jesse may have a lawsuit, especially being in America. ITU claimed blackmail, but the communications don't show this. So ITU basically made false claims and destroyed Jesse's financial income. There is a former President who did the same thing and lost. Jesse should be talking to a lawyer.

@mro6743

Жыл бұрын

The problem with that idea is that the communications pretty much do show an attempt at blackmail. In the communication, Quackalope says that they have a negative video that they would get rid of if ITU paid for their coverage.

@TheKingofAverage

Жыл бұрын

That would just ruin his image even more I feel if won or if lost. Especially if lost though, so that's super high risk. Better to move on, try and learn what you can from it.

@deano2099

Жыл бұрын

A hell of a lot people online used the word "blackmail" or "extortion" for sure. But ITU never did. If you read both the original KS comment and the statement they made, they never say that. They're very careful to just list the actual facts and leave the audience to reach the conclusion "that sounds like blackmail"

@Gtomer

Жыл бұрын

Seems like many people offered that option to him but he refuses since he doesn't think it will help since people won't change their mind about him if he will win anyway, in fact they will be mad because a lawsuit will likely damage ITU and will hurt their backers. So, for now, he is not taking that route because he doesn't want more people to get hurt by this drama.

@diszect7134

Жыл бұрын

There is no law suit that’s winnable for either side on this one.