Back when my goal was a thermo-electric flue pipe insert, i experiment with different metals and metal oxides, and every time i would start to get interesting results, id realize, "MY GOD! I JUST MADE A THERMITE PIPE AND I WAS GONNA STICK IT ON THE STOVE!?!?" lol

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

lololol - yeah that could be an issue lol - laughing with you mate - laughing with you

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

Worry Not!! At least you Realised that Before you installed it!! 😎👍👍

@ericmieremet

Жыл бұрын

how about not letting the magnesium oxydize?

@railgap

Жыл бұрын

@@ericmieremet Got ideas on how to manage that? Try them out, let us know how you get on.

@ericmieremet

Жыл бұрын

@@railgap how about an powdercoating ceramic heat resistant "paint" applied with static attraction of the powder and fuse it in an oven (Standard procedure for some products) No time to practice it, I'm in it for the theoretical knowledge. Some build, I hint.

hi Robert...I work for a company (here in the UK)..that can make these.. magnesium silicide...we've carried out 5yrs of research and the biggest issue was working out the plating layer to get them to connect to the ceramic..and we work with ESA and NASA for the space industry....edit: we had devices working around 550-650 Deg Celsius..

@ps3camtheman

Жыл бұрын

Hi Richard, I’m in the US and working on a project for home heating. Is that something I can buy for my application?

@richardlyd7450

Жыл бұрын

@@ps3camtheman currently we've stopped production of this module but working on something better... antimonide modules..but still ironing out the process...it should withstand temperature around 400-500 Deg C....watch this space...

@JonnnyStorm

3 ай бұрын

@@richardlyd7450 any chance i could get the name of the company or a name to search to buy something like this

@josephlane5752

24 күн бұрын

@@richardlyd7450 Just following up a year later. Any developments?

Hey Robert, I’m a new viewer to your channel, I’m 16 years old and your channel’s content is exactly what I’ve been looking for! I love in depth looks at things like this, keep up the amazing work! -Joe

not sure when i started looking into this as a way to generate electrical power, but your video was one of them that i distinctly remember watching . since this winter has sucked in terms of solar pv, i started digging into this. in my tests i was able to produce about 5.1watts with a delta t of about 250f. a wood stove and a 20psi boiler should be enough to produce a significant amount of power and by that my goal is 1200 watts. everyday i get a slightly better test than the day before. i also found a source for cheap units that seem to be testing out much better than spec claims. i can see about 200 or 300 of these devices getting the job done with a mppt solar charge controller to charge my 45kwh batter on days we have no sun, using a wood stove or two. time will tell. i already have thirty or so and just ordered another 30, for 60 units x 5w each for 300 watts. another thing is, i am surprised no one has had the level of power creation i have achieved out of a single unit. most people are only to produce about 100mW, i was able to achieve 51 times that, so the economics work out for me

@dr_melski

Жыл бұрын

do you do videos on this? would love to see these diy projects

@harrymills2770

9 ай бұрын

Maybe you're just really good at engineering. TEGMO, in association with Kimberly stov es claimed theirs was putting out 10s of watts, which is 4 orders of magnitude more than the milliwatt laboratory prototypes for demo purposes. If I had endless water, or just a lot of water, I could keep a system operating at its best efficiency. The appeal of TEG is you can generate a small amount of electricity, without any moving parts Even the best of them are only using a tiny fraction of the power coming off a wood stove. If you really wanted power by burning stuff, just buy an electric generator powered by gasoline, or build a steam engine to turn a generator. There are other advantages. You can run the blower on your furnace for not much power. TEGs are good for blowers. I do think they're practical for charging electronics. They make a little camp stove that burns twigs that's about the size of a 1-pound coffee can. It runs a blower that forces air over the TEG to keep the cold side cold and it blows air on the fire to keep it hot and clean. It can charge a phone or a laptop, I think. Power LED lights. That sorrt of thing.

@harrymills2770

9 ай бұрын

Tegmo? TEG-Pro?

@jasonbrown467

9 ай бұрын

@@dr_melski no, there are no videos, well none that i published.

@jasonbrown467

9 ай бұрын

@@harrymills2770 i bought all the stuff to create maybe 1200 watts, if i remember right. i had bought boxes of the teg's, pumps, water blocks, many 4 channel thermocouple with data logging capability then i got a new job where i travel 6 out of 7 days a week. my goal was to use a wood stove for the hotside and outside temps for the cold side in the winter, where my solar produces almost nothing for weeks at a time. i also have all the gasoline powered generators, but just wanted to try something out. since taking the new job i hit the brakes on this project

Oh my gosh... 3x efficiency... So hold on ... Bismuth Telluride is at best below 10% efficient... Could we see an efficiency of say close to 30% or thereabouts? Gets mighty close to say a combustion engine... Amazing! All solid state...

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I agree mate - it is amazing

Hello Robert, as usual you are keeping us all on KZread in the know !!! Looking forward to see you get the Noble price for a super thermoelectric junction micro voltage device.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

lol - cheers mate and I should wish!

@Vibe77Guy

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Roof mount solar water heaters and geothermal coupled TEGs would not have the hot spot failure problems of silicon cells. Not to mention being also able to use the heat directly at the tap.

@Palmit_

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering ne meant NOBEL but NOBLE is appropriate too...

@ahmdabdallah5811

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering What Is Islam? Islam is not just another religion. It is the same message preached by Moses, Jesus and Abraham. Islam literally means ‘submission to God’ and it teaches us to have a direct relationship with God. It reminds us that since God created us, no one should be worshipped except God alone. It also teaches that God is nothing like a human being or like anything that we can imagine. The concept of God is summarized in the Quran as: { “Say, He is God, the One. God, the Absolute. He does not give birth, nor was He born, and there is nothing like Him.”} (Quran 112:1-4) Becoming a Muslim is not turning your back to Jesus. Rather it’s going back to the original teachings of Jesus and obeying him

@ObserverOfPakleds

2 жыл бұрын

@@ahmdabdallah5811 Sounds like it's just another religion.

I got a 160 mV with copper and aluminum over a candle last night and a 150 mV with copper and galvanized steel, but I'm not seeing consistency, when I try to replicate the tests with new wire. I though, at first that a longer, low conductivity metal (aluminum, galv. steel, oxidized iron) would work better at first, then I tried a longer high conductivity metal (copper) and that seems to improve results. It seems that when the copper is 3 times the length of the aluminum or galv. steel, the mV gets higher, but also that if the wires are too long, the energy is lost from the wire as heat, or burns/melts the wire at the join. I'm making some "ceramic" plates (joint compound) tonight and will try graphite dots for the highly conductive material paired with low conductivity materials. Lead free solder is mostly tin with about 5% antimony. Tin is low conductivity. Antimony is a pnictogen (meaning to choke + generator) in Group 15 of the periodic table, as are the elements nitrogen (N), phosphorus (P), arsenic (As), antimony (Sb), bismuth (Bi), and moscovium (Mc). Lead free solder is an antimony doped tin. Sounds promising.

@ignaciosuarez9265

Жыл бұрын

What happened?

@tersta1

Жыл бұрын

@@ignaciosuarez9265 If I recall, the copper-steel worked better than the copper-solder experiment. In either case, the energy harvest is low, so you would need a large array of plates tied to a battery bank.

@ignaciosuarez9265

Жыл бұрын

@tersta1 Im wondering if it's possible to build the same but using a little bit insulation on each layer to increase the temperature gradient but keep conductivity by connecting some points like a sandwich 🥪 do you think that will work?

@tersta1

Жыл бұрын

@@ignaciosuarez9265 I don't think it would. From what I understand, it's the temperature difference, between hot side and cool side, as well as between the conductivity of different metals that forces electrons to convert to electrical energy. I think the most economical way to increase the difference would be to paint the top side black and use the sun's heat. The bottoms of the plates would be in the shade, but if they were cooled, perhaps with evaporation, that would widen the temperature difference. Those are my observations, but I do encourage you to try out different designs. Test everything with a multimeter and then you will know which design yields the highest amount of energy. If you discover anything through experiment, I'd love to hear about it. Drop a reply, please. 💡

Love this channel, always something new to learn, thanks Rob

A huge leap forward for power generation, perhaps from solar heat bounced off a solar cell. I assume its a leap forward for cooling as well. Not sure where you find all this stuff but am grateful you do and that you share it. "Cast the seeds of knowledge to see what take root to bear undiscovered fruit."

Thanks for another thermo electric video Rob. I have wondered what the effect would be should someone encapsulate the junction in a highly insulation brick. Heated side on one end, cooled end on the me other. Running through the insulation.

@Barskor1

2 жыл бұрын

Like a thermal battery add on, neat idea.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I agree with Barskor - that is a neat idea - thanks for sharing mate

Thinking outside of the box is where every great new invention starts.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

absolutely mate!

@timothyjohnson1511

Жыл бұрын

​@@ThinkingandTinkering Question: What do you get when you match a Brillouin Energy Hydrogen fueled *fusion* heater to a thermoelectric generator? Answer: Potentially, enough energy to recover sufficient Hydrogen from the water vapor in the air to fuel the Brillouin Energy Hydrogen fueled *fusion* heater, with enough energy left over to power a useful load.

@FDroid01

Жыл бұрын

Except of course the box within a box :0

Thank you Robert, you are always an Inspiration and I am always delighted to see the notification that you have uploaded something to get the grey matter working!! Andrea and Critters. ...XxX....

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers Andrea

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

⛈️🕯️🤪.

@AndreaDingbatt

Жыл бұрын

@James Cunliffe Lmao!! Jasper is insulted by your comment!! since hes Much better looking,and far more intelligent than me as well. Ive been having my Birthday month,Lol!! August the 12th! Friday,Ive had a beer or two,,Hic!! XxX ;)

@AndreaDingbatt

Жыл бұрын

@James Cunliffe Happy belated Birthday 🎉🎈🎉🎆🎊💞🥰💞❤️💞🍻🥴🍺🎉🎈🎈🎉💓❤️🥰🥴🍻💜🥳😎🍾🥂 Lol 🎈 HIC!!°°••`°•√%😎👍 I'm sorry I didn't know that you were having a Birthday!! I am going to have a beer 🍺 on your behalf!!🍻🥳🍺🍺🍻I have had an unpleasant surprise,,, I found out that none of my family actually want to have anything to do with me.... Lmao 🤣💞 My Dad, who Was my hero,my sister and step mom, I already gave up with mother and ghastly,lanky, useless streak of P*** of a brother,,, who I've never seen in over 25yrs,approx.. so I am going Hard at the Celebrations!!🥳🍺🥂🍻🍺🍾🥴🎈😎🍺🍻😁💞 My eldest Sister's Dead so I guess that she can't disown me.. I just want to know ~WHY?!~🥺 and wtf have I done wrong?!🤷🤦🤷🤦 I used to hide mother's "secret" vodka so she'd be seeking it high and low,, only to find its in the place she hid it,,,or Out There on The Living Room Table, So as everyone else got to see, Lmao 🤣💞 Yes I Know I was a horrible child and teen... (Kept this going til the day she moved down south, Bwahahaha!) Damnit Man, why do you have to go out to get away from noise?!! The Heat is unforgiving so I think that you must be out in the woodlands quite a lot hon?!! 🥺 Are you doing Okay?!!!😎 Absolutely you have to contact me if you are not too good, even if it just a natter Here?!~Im getting that half can of beer out of the Freezer and I am going to be sending you some kind thoughts and vibes, may you have the strength to deal with life's challenges and the humour so you can laugh at the absurdity Too. Namaste 🙏 to both you and your Hoodie, from Peru!! Andrea and Impending hangover!!🥴🍻😁🥰💞🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗🤗💞🥴🎈❤️🎄🎊🎆.XxX....

Robert, I found your channel when I was researching graphene. You were trying to make it in your kitchen oven then. I still follow your work. best wishes, ~tjb~ "give it a try" - Robert Murray-Smith

@Barskor1

2 жыл бұрын

Give it a go :)

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

wow - cheers mate and thanks for letting me know

@G-ra-ha-m

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Graphene is very toxic, please be careful!

How would these thermo electric generators score against solar panels? If you had a thin layer of TEG about the same size as a solar panel, would it produce more or less under the sun's heat?

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

😎👍👍

@danielch6662

2 жыл бұрын

Solar would win. Solution: don't build thermo electric generators like you build a solar panel ! 😁 This is like asking _if we built airplanes in the shape of boats, would they float just as well_ ? Well, no, but you you're kinda missing the point. Don't build airplanes in the shape of boats. They wouldn't float as well, and they wouldn't fly that well either.

@ScarletFlames1

2 жыл бұрын

@@danielch6662 exactly, this stuff would work better in radiators, one side hotter than the other? Sounds to me like a TEG! Recycling waste heat from power plants becomes more efficient with better TEG's, many factories that use heat in their production recycle heat as well so they can benefit too. Lowering electricity consumption of those energy heavy industries will make for a greener planet. Also, if you have a good enough TEG tech you could create a heatpump based TEG to harvest ambient heat.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I would think less - to my understanding they work on temperature difference and putting one in the sun would shade the other - the temperature difference would therefor be a couple of degrees at most - they are different beasts mate - it's a bit like asking which is better - apples or flour - they are just used in different circumstances

@ScarletFlames1

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering I meant a heat pump, as in a compressor with the cold output exposed to airflow and the cold side of the TEG and its hot output insulated except the hot side of the TEG, thus it will harvest heat out of the air and only lose it through the insulation or through energy generated. In theory.

@Robert Murray-Smith - As you heated the capacitor-loaded junction I kept wondering what capacitor had been attached. Then I noticed the voltage kept climbing even after you removed the torch, and now I really must know... Was it pico Farads, nano Farads, micro Farads? Or larger?

@Wingnut353

Жыл бұрын

It kept climbing because heat is still transferring from one side to the other... so if a fan was attached it would not immediately stop if you removed the flame etc...

@YodaWhat

Жыл бұрын

@@Wingnut353 Obviously, but that was not the question.

References???

Iron and copper also works and was used in a product that would charge a phone from a cook stove.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

lots of things work mate - it's not a question of if they work but how well they work

@johnloydancheta730

Жыл бұрын

we struggled about our studies , can you help me because our study is same to your invention , we need to make a stove that can generate electricity, without using TEG module

Dumb question . Can you roll the copper around the magnesium and still make it work? As a way of keeping the air off the magnesium.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I dunno mate - I can't see why not

Is there a way to electrically connect the two dissimilar metals surface whilst preserving the effect? I would imagine using solder to connect them would disrupt the whole thing - is that correct?

@andrewkimbrel195

2 жыл бұрын

My understanding is that the voltage is created in the thermal gradient of the wire from the hot side to the cold side. Introducing a third metal at the junction shouldn't matter. So brazing or soldering should probably work if the metals in question can be joined that way. The typical way to do it though is to weld the wires together. They sell wire welders for making thermocouples, but you can also do it with capacitive discharge welding by charging a big bank of capacitors up to a controlled voltage and discharging it into the junction. This lets you control the amount of energy applied so that you don't vaporize the wires.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

you can just crimp them together mate

@El_Croc

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Is there a reason why you made a point-contact instead of say 2 plates pushed together for more surface area?

If it doesn't make noise it is a pretty good device in it's own right. What kind of radio or emf static do these things generate?

hey Robert Greatings from a DIY guy from across the pond. good show. i like your videos keep it up.

Hello Robert, I have seen your video on the thermal electric 🍩. I made one for some paperclips and a bit of wood to see if the tech works. It did but after I was thinking to myself which strings theory which I know very very little about could be applied to this, so I took a bit of aluminum wire for mock-up. Then I went to a video I saw a while back on a four dimensional Rubik's cube and followed their turnpaths with the wire is there a way I can send you pictures of this?

Hi Robert. Could a simple generator be made by simply filling a copper tube with magnesium fillings? If each end was sealed, excluding the air, presumably the magnesium would not be able to ignite?

@animehair05silently88

2 ай бұрын

I think the magnesium has to be one continuous electrically conductive piece, and only connected to the copper at an end

Great news! Very interesting. Thanks for sharing 🎉

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

no worries mate and all the best

How would this compare in a conventional TEG form factor? Easy way to work it out would be measuring the same amount of silicon material on that setup and then multiplying the magnesium one by the difference

Would using the copper cooling pipes for pc’s allow the magnesium to be used as a cooling fin on the end while you heat the other?

@markhathaway9456

Жыл бұрын

Perhaps combining some of how a heat sink works with the TEG would speed the flow of heat to increase the V output.

How about adding those thermal generators to a vehicle to take advantage of the heat products through inefficiencies. What would they produce for an output in the winter, when it would be easier to achieve a better temperature differential?

Time for a flame eater motor generator video. I am working on my house in Portugal and I will be doing your sand heat storage but using an indoor wood oven. It will heat the house and cook food. Bear this in mind we distribute heat around a house using water in a central heating system. Air is not very good too low a thermal capacity BUT if the air is something like at 500 to 800C the that's a lot more heat so I am going to try it blowing air round a pipe circuit round the house. Of course if a flame eater engine could 'inhale' from the wood oven I could have my electric free as well. All exiting stuff no bills sticking it to the man.

Thanks for sharing.

If you could tell us what was the capacity of the capacitor we could calculate charging current (estimation). As you know CU=q, so q(t)=CU(t), then just derivative and we get current, for constant capacitance.

@cymacymulacra2301

2 жыл бұрын

From Indonesian Journal of Electrical Engineering and Computer Science Modelling and simulation of magnesium antimonide based thermoelectric generator - they seem to be talking a little over 1W from freezing to boiling. Areal parameters are also given.

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

@@cymacymulacra2301 Thank You!! Much appreciated!!😎👍👍

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I was thinking of doing a separate vid on how to use capacitors in this situation - nice reminder to do that - cheers mate

@miszcz310

2 жыл бұрын

@@cymacymulacra2301 great but. First please give maybe doi number or at least full title of the paper. Second frezeeing and boiling of what? Water, table salt, aluminum? 1W is a measure of power, what does it mean in this context? 1w per square meter of such junction, with temperature difference of 100 kelvin? The information you are giving us are a bit useless. Lastly, these are simulations, so it might be a bit different for real device.

Do you have a link to the info? Really interested in the percentage of increase they've seen using magnesium over silicon

@Jason-ju7df

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

here is a general article scitechdaily.com/buzz-about-thermoelectric-generators-heats-up-with-promising-new-magnesium-based-materials/ but there is a ton of info if you go to google scholar and put magnesium thermoelectric generator as your search term

Thanks for the great content.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoy it!

Could magnesium powder in a sealed argon filled type arrangement? Could just shake for a new junction

This is awesome, I want to buy a TIG with those materials just for fun to charge a phone at home with a candle it might even work

Read something long ago about two dissimilar wires twisted on one end ,heating the junction produced a small voltage,is this the same type of process and could a usable voltage be produced by a bank of a few thousand of these twists say under a large lens?

God bless ya brother 👍

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you kindly sir

The key is in the valence. Using a magnesium silver ceramic alloy would yield very interesting results.

Respect and gratitude. Unlimited

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers mate

Hi, I‘m usually not really into physics so excuse my maybe very stupid question. I was wondering if this could be used to charge really small battery’s and, for the case it is possible, how efficient it would be. Again I’m sorry if this is a stupid question please.

I was thinking about putting a deep oven tray on top of my wood stove filling full of water and then floating another oven tray on top of that with those thermoelectric squares and then putting another pan on top of that and and drip water on that cool cool water on that which would basically be warmed up as it as it went across and dropped off that way you'd be assured that you would not burn out those thermoelectric squares any thoughts

FWIW: I think Silicon Carbide may hold some promise on better TEG performance. You might be able to do some simple experiments since SiC (Grit) isn't expensive. You can also turn some SiC (Grit) crystals into crude LEDs by applying a voltage across them. That said I don't think TEG will real be practical because TEG require big temperature differences and electrically conductive materials are also decent thermal conductors, thus making it difficult to maintain large temperature differences between the two junctions.

Perfect for a sand battery!

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

ahhh - yes - nice

@markhathaway9456

Жыл бұрын

Use an entire beach as your energy source? Hmmm, so I could work at the beach. I like it.

Hey Robert!!❤️ Got anything on heat engines based on Bimetallic strips?

Hi Rob when exactly is the deadline for the bike competition? Thanks

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

8th of august mate - there will be a reminder vid going up tomorrow

How about measuring the power output compared to the power in the torch flame?

You have to twist the 2 metals together and apply the heat to the twisted section.

Recent advancements in thermoelectric generators include improvements in thermoelectric materials, enhanced performance, and increased efficiency. Scientists are focusing on improving energy harvesting-based power generators, such as thermoelectric generators (TEGs), which can directly convert thermal energy into electrical energy through the Seebeck effect. These TEGs are environmentally friendly, operate silently without mechanical structures, and can be fabricated on various substrates like silicon, polymers, and ceramics. Additionally, there have been promising advances in thermoelectric materials, making TEGs a viable option for large-scale energy recovery and power generation.

I like the Thermionic Convertor more. It does not need a cold side. It "boils" electrons off the the emitter to the collector. Used in satellites & efficiency is about 15% for a long time but was improved with graphene recently.

@daveansell1970

2 жыл бұрын

That has a cold side, as it won't work if the electrode catching the electrons is the same temperature as the ones emitting them. It sounds cool though.

Thinking outside the box. Everyone should try it 😜

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

at least once lol

Love your work Robert. Quick question, why is this type of generation being considered for the mars rover? Do the atmospheric conditions on mars make solar or wind power less practical?

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

NASA have been using thermoelectric generation for years mate - though usually it is nuclear based - so I would think the decisions are more around experience in use, reliability and predictability more than anything

@clintonrobinson8070

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Thanks Robert I'd thought the rovers were mostly solar powered.

@Rhannmah

2 жыл бұрын

Mars's atmosphere is on average 600 pascals, compared to 101 000 pascals for Earth's atmosphere so wind power is not even considered. Solar is doable, but still hard because Mars being farther from the Sun, it receives about 600 watts per meter squared at best, compared to Earth's 1000 watts per meter squared at best. Also Mars has dust storms that can last weeks to even months blocking out the Sun, so solar energy is problematic to say the least. That's why NASA is interested in onboard energy production.

I love thermoelectric ideas

It seems the reason light v heavy metals seemed to work is neither holds onto outer electrons much (making them conductive metals) and the heavier metals held onto their outermost electrons least. At a given temperature, the higher the better, the heavier metal's electrons have a greater likelihood of getting into the lighter metal than the reverse, potentiating net electron flow. Some alloys of light and heavy metals are, as it were, uncomfortably tight for the heavy metal's outermost electrons, so they are held even more weakly than in the bulk material of that heavy metal -- and once temperature sets then wandering . . . RTGs exploit thermionic emission from a solid into a solid, is my understanding.

Hey there, would I be able to put these in parallel to produce way more power.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

yes

Just off the top if you’re charging a piece of metal as a battery would having a larger amount away from the heat working as the negative, produce more of a charge? Or if you use a different metal with less protons and more electrons encourage a larger energy flow.

I don't know why these are not built into Tesla car batteries. As you use the battery you can get a % back from the heat. b4 running it through a cooling system. The hot and cold are there, why not use these to get a little energy out of it.

The only commercially available TE modules are Bi2Te3 based. These consist of many PN unicouples to get a usable product. The difficulty is the interconnects and brazing alloy. Antimonides at elevated temperatures can lose antimony and also diffuse antimony into the interconnects causing module failure. Making the material alone is just the start of the work. Although, ball milling magnesium and antimony is an excellent way to make a TE material. That method introduces a lot of defects which decrease thermal conductivity and allow better energy harvesting. Just keep the air out during the ball milling.

@clintonrobinson8070

2 жыл бұрын

Is it milled in a vacuum or is an inert gas used?

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers mate

@richardblair3021

2 жыл бұрын

Milling under argon is the easiest. It’s the method of choice for preparing other TE materials in bulk.

@clintonrobinson8070

2 жыл бұрын

@@richardblair3021 Thanks.👍

Your channel is such a breath of fresh air! Always practical and at the bleeding edge of every topic!

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

wow - thank you mate

I heard aluminum to iron works well too and it is more resistant to high heat.

I bet making the alloy is pretty straight forward. Magnesium melts at 650c and antimony at 630c. get the right stoichiometric ratio, put it in an evacuated vial and put in a furnace at 650ish and that will probably do it.

@stevenelson886

2 жыл бұрын

I looked it up. Magnesium Antimonate has 5 oxygens. An evacuated tube is wrong. Here's what I found: "Magnesium antimonate can be prepared by firing MgO and antimony pentoxide in air at 1000°C for 18 h."

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

nice find mate - that's actually not that difficult to do - I can give that a go for sure - though I only;y have antimony trioxide so I will have to oxides that with nitric acid first

Any idea how efficient Nitinol would be?

@craigmcmeechan5899

2 жыл бұрын

Asked the question before getting to the end of the video :)

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

lol - no worries mate - you should try it though and share your results

Could you use a heat pipe to transfer the energy across a short distance in order to keep the magnesium out of direct flame? Or would the energy loss be too great?

@mathewcherrystone9479

2 жыл бұрын

Heatpipes will usually only work at "low" temperatures up to around 100°C afterwards they are very likely to pop.

You should use a big temperature difference like one side minus 200 degrees C and the other side at say 150 degrees C. Would that work well. If yes! Just pop to the Webb telescope where those conditions apply ! Space travel got easier ?

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

it works on temperature difference - is yes!

Bob, The radio wasnt powered directly from the lamp - the lamp charged a built in battery in the radio . When the battery was charged ( must have taken some time ! ) then they could listen to it.....

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

I'm not trying to be disrespectful, but I'm very sure that there were a number of different types of these, my mother was in Holland during the Nazi occupation.. And I was told about the many different ways that people had to be able to knock device's together with whatever was about.. It's a horrible and sad thing that it's sometimes wars that push the scientific work forwards.... Namaste 🙏 Andrea and Critters. ...XxX....

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I am sure that is exactly what was done mate

Very nice 👍

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you! Cheers!

Interesting. 👍🏽

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers mate

now to make one to run my old Lasonic trc-975 Gettoblaster Radio LOL that would take quit a few i presume .No really neat stuff ill bet one could hack something together that would do something cool potential is their

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I agree mate the potential is there - and any way I think I would just be scared to see you running your ghetto blaster from a flame lol

Hey Robert could you have a look at ZVS's please. If you put a transformer after it you can power huge resistive loads at the very least as an extremely efficient inverter, there is lots of work out there that looks as if you get more and was wondering on your thoughts on it.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

will do mate

@PelletJamie

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Thank you!

If use a “classified material “ in a specific use, you would do well to start with an alloy of magnesium and “thallium” although the latter is a nasty poison. As an added bit of knowledge from the old valve industry where I have/ had a patent! The election removal “work function” is improved by a thin film of Osmium which is deposited by either sputtering or my patented method . Electrons leaving a surface easily is interesting.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

it is and I am not sure about the thallium - for obvious reasons lol

@manolisgledsodakis873

2 жыл бұрын

"The election removal..." - Didn't they do that in the USA in 2020?

I have an interesting thought. This would work in Spring/Summer. Perhaps aluminum heat sinks or something pushed into the cool earth in the cool side. Outside temperature or sun heated on the other side, the hot side. You would not have to rely on solar. So it's a theory of earth is always cool and Summer air is warm. Even shade would be warmer than earth temp and theoretically useable. The problem with solar in my eyes is having to have tree cleared areas to work. The price of these things is maybe 3 bucks each here in The States.

Thank you.

Typo in the video name Great info as always

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers mate and fixed the typo

Make a thermoelectric lampion, with 8 generators on the side and one more on top.

Rob, I have seen you make all manner of contraptions - electrical generating devices - so many things. I want to ask, what if you took an actual generator, say a 3500 watt genny, and found a way to power it without petrol? Reason I'm asking- very serious here- it seems to me that there is a strong push from the GOV to move to green energy at the expense of the people. I don't want to get political, but it sure would be nice to be able to quietly power a freezer of food if the power is shut off. Many thanks for your consideration and I will continue supporting the channel as long as they let there be a channel... 🤔

@manolisgledsodakis873

2 жыл бұрын

You can power it using a wood-burning steam engine.

@undernetjack

2 жыл бұрын

True, but there must be a lot of ways to do it without a wood fire drawing attention. I imagined using magnets to heat metal with eddy currents - boiling water to make steam. Most power generation relies on making steam. Local coal fired plants all the way up to nuclear powered aircraft carriers. The main point was "quietly powering a freezer". I assume I would also use a battery storage system and a timer to turn it off and on most efficiently. Battery storage systems would be a good topic as well. Perhaps Rob could make it a topic for a video contest. Cheers and thanks for the suggestion.

@markhathaway9456

Жыл бұрын

@@undernetjack "Most power generation relies on making steam" to turn a turbine spin -- see Maxwell. The modern idea is to go from natural sources like sunlight and sun heat directly to electricity. Save on machinery, energy loss (perhaps), size of device, etc. Remember, entropy makes the world go around and we can't get off that merry-go-round. But maybe we can convert some of that energy from nature to electricity we can use.

Wow very fascinating information. Thankyou. I'm wondering what your thoughts on these new Diamond Nuclear batteries that are being developed, they use Beta-voltaic cells to produce power from nuclear wast products? I think the idea is great but there are some KZread;s (e.g. ThunderF00t & EEVblog) who are claiming it's bogus.

@pldaniels

2 жыл бұрын

The problem is the low output, profoundly lower than what you'll see the various VC-baiting documents are trying to infer. It's a bit like expecting those trintium -> beta -> electron -> phosphorous lights to illuminate a room like a 20W LED bulb; it's just not realistic.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I'll do a video mate

Are thermo-electric junctions symmetrical?

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

I am not sure I understand - the quick answer is no - the junction is formed of two dissimilar materials - so by definition can't be symmetric - but I am sure you know that - so to my mind you must be asking a question I don't understand - can you expand a little?

Dear Rob, I just hope you're alright. :( You are a light in so many dark places.

Could you use graphene instead of magnesium? I hear they've got a few different graphene 3d printers available now

could combinig salt water for the cold terminal add voltage with right metal

Antimony is toxic like other heavy metals but the alloy you're looking for could be fairly easily made by melting magnesium and antimony together in a crucible with a lid.

@AndreaDingbatt

2 жыл бұрын

Perhaps we should use a hood thingywassitsname, that is used for safety in laboratory work?! (Sorry I can't remember the name of it!!) It sounds like you may be onto something!! 🙂💞

@SolarSeeker45

2 жыл бұрын

@@AndreaDingbatt I know the doohickey you're talking about but I've never seen one with a metal smelting furnace inside.

@clintonrobinson8070

2 жыл бұрын

@@SolarSeeker45 You can get pretty small furnaces that'd fit inside a fume cupboard, the guys who do gold recycling from e waste here on yt use them.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

apparently not - it seems a good way is to heat antimony pentoxide and magnesium oxide to 1,000 C for 18 hours - though I like ball milling the metal powders - but then I am keen on mechanochemical synthesis

@Vaeldarg

2 жыл бұрын

@@AndreaDingbatt The name for this is a "fume hood" (as in it sucks up the fumes).

1:30 Robert, 2 or 300 degrees ? The solder used in these devices melts at much lower temperatures, like 90 degr C. How I know ? Guess 😊👍🏻🤝🏻🇳🇱

Thanks!

I'm gonna play with this

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

awesome - let me know how you get on

@scurvofpcp

2 жыл бұрын

@@ThinkingandTinkering Will do, right now I'm toying around with sheet metal and seeing how I can bond two layers of differing metal together while keeping oxidation down.

now add a step up capacitor.i know nothing about electronic stuff but found a bloke on you tube who use step ups too make deadly tasers.might be a idea..or not

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

what you are thinking about are Marx generators or Cockcroft Wheaton bridges mate - either will step a voltage up - but when a voltage goes up the amps go down

NASA used radio isotope thermoelectric generators. What to they use in the thermopile? It’s probably very expensive.

00:53 Those tables do not include the right numbers because they lack m³ Without it they are almost totally useless. We are missing the melting temperatures too, so we could calculate how much electricity we could get out of the material. 04:08 It looks like it was 154 000 mV if there is a comma we can't see it.

Very cool 😎 makes waste heat more useful as a source of electricity

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

absolutely mate

might give a small boost to the back of a solar P.V cell

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

it might well do mate

@markhathaway9456

Жыл бұрын

I believe there are already PV solar panels with heat collectors as well. Modify a bit with a TEG and away ya go.

where are you now sir? hope you are well and good. i miss to see you on tour video.

👍👍👍

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

cheers mate

I bet you could use a catalytic hand warmer to apply heat more efficiently to your thermoelectric generator

How would carbon felt work alongside nichrome wire for a Thermogenerator, as opposed to say carbon graphite or graphene?

So how much better are they predicting they will be vs the current ones and when do they thunk they will be avaliable

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

well it will be a few years - the issue now is getting them made

@james10739

2 жыл бұрын

How much more efficient do you or they think they will be if they are twice as good I think they would actually be useful in those coolers

What in the world is going on with electrical ideas? Wind, solar-cells, batteries are getting lots and lots of experimental money. So, where is the thermocouple big bucks for such a simple technology? Several thermoelectric articles are over 10 years old. Solid State TC arrays are easy to mass produce in the factories. 😎 Wonderful Thermoelectric video. Thank you. Thermocouples can handle outside sunlight temperatures to produce electricity. ☀

Just a question: How do we know, for certain, that this is not just some weak air battery?

@clintonrobinson8070

2 жыл бұрын

Generating power like this isn't uncommon, thermocouples used to measure high temperatures work in much the same way. Look them up, they're typically used in blast furnaces and other very high heat applications to measure temperature.

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

we don't know anything for certain mate - but it's a good guess that it is not a weak air battery as it doesn't wear out

@JustAnotherAlchemist

2 жыл бұрын

@@clintonrobinson8070 I'm aware of K, S, and C groups of thermocouples, to be sure.

@JustAnotherAlchemist

2 жыл бұрын

​@@ThinkingandTinkering I understand that things wouldn't ware if it was a thermocouple, but (with respect) try to really explore the alternative explanation. The specific energy of Magnesium is 24.7 MJ/kg. Assuming that we have 1g to play with, we're still at 24.7kJ... that's a fair amount of potential energy. (to put that in perspective, a AA battery weighs about 24g, and only has 8kJ.) So, allowing for this respectable source of chemical energy, and keeping in mind that 1 Watt is only 1J/s, it's easily plausible the change in geometry and mass could be imperceptible, especially at micro watt discharge rates. Probably barely a change in the surface color. Now, please work with me on this. Is the Magnesium making positive or negative potential with respect to the other electrode? How much did you touch it with your hands before running your set up? Try boiling it in a few baths of distilled water and see if the situation changes. Try treating the strip with something to tarnish the surface, clearing just the contact points, then running again.

Any plumbers in this group

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

why do you want a plumber mate?

Since 15 years, I have been dealing with angular energy electricity generation systems (R&D). My positive designs about angular continue. In this regard, my own financial means are insufficient, I had meetings with many businessmen, they accepted the financing of the project, but they gave up when it came to signing a protocol, that is, when it came to formalisation. If there is an entrepreneur who will take firm steps with me on this path, who is idealistic, has financial means and wants to make an official protocol, I would like to meet. 98% of the published videos are wrong and do not work. I know the mistake they all make.

@tommyboi0

2 ай бұрын

You certainly have my attention.

@SINANOZYOLDAS

2 ай бұрын

​@@tommyboi0I want to create a clean energy system for a cleaner world. No mechanical wheel system whose angle does not change can produce energy. No system will work against the laws of physics. You can promote this project in your country. I want to realise this project and get a worldwide patent. Of course, I need a solid and idealistic investor to realise these works. I convert angular energy into mechanical and electrical energy. I am an inventor. I am ready to realise this project in any country that will support me.

@tommyboi0

2 ай бұрын

@@SINANOZYOLDAS how to I communicate with you privately?

@SINANOZYOLDAS

2 ай бұрын

​@@tommyboi0We can discuss in more detail. You can easily find me on other platforms. Many articles are not published here. Thank you very much.

wait... if silicon has a seebeck coefficient of 440, and its melting point is at 1410*C why arent we just using that?

Sooo with the technology we have these days, a person could create body chargers. Something you wear on or Inside you. That powers I don't know a heart monitor, medication dispensing device or a communication device implant?

@danielplumley379

2 жыл бұрын

Probably not enough thermal energy there. Also, nice name lmao!

@ThinkingandTinkering

2 жыл бұрын

for sure mate but thermoelectric isn't the best choice - TENG is good I think

Is energy generated or manifest. Form follows function.

I have a Question regarding your Carbon heater video. I don't have much money and don't want to purchase a whole amount of carbon as I can't afford it. My question is, Can you Get cloth carbon? like a blanket size in which I could hang up on 2 poles at either side then connect my wind turbine to it to heat it up. If I could get a carbon blanket I could then move it to any room in my house and heat it with the turbine for free heat. I live around 1500 above sea level and gets very windy here so I could have 2 or 3 heating up my house for no cost. If You can get Carbon Blankets does anyone have a link as I cant find any, that's why I ask. Thanks in advance